- Crime in Providence is down, reaching historic lows last year.

But a different kind of violence has shaken Rhode Island, two mass shootings since December.

One person at the center of confronting this paradox is Colonel Oscar Perez, Chief of the Providence Police.

So what can be done to prevent the next mass shooting?

What motivated the Brown University shooter and is Perez concerned about ICE damaging the perception of others in law enforcement?

I'm Ian Donnis, and that's just some of what we talked about in this in-depth conversation.

Colonel Oscar Perez, Chief of the Providence Police.

Welcome to "One on One."

- Thank you, Ian.

Thank you for having me here, thank you very much.

- Colonel, Rhode Island has been rocked by two mass shootings since December.

What do you tell people when they ask what can be done about this?

- Yeah, definitely.

It was a very horrific incident that happened at Brown.

Obviously shocked the city.

It shocked the conscience of many individuals in our city as well as our police department and the victims.

I'll tell you that I tell the community that obviously I was very proud of the work that everyone did and the apprehension, obviously, we were able to find out who was responsible.

But yeah, it was horrific and it was very, very traumatic for many individuals and for the city as well.

- What are the main lessons learned from for the Providence Police Department, from the Brown University shooting?

- I think some of the lessons we learned is the importance of collaboration.

Collaboration with our different agencies as federal agencies to make sure that we continue with the proper training for our officers to ensure that we have the proper personnel in place.

And something that I personally learned is that as a young chief, obviously it's almost been now three years as police chief when I first got the call.

And you know, I've been able to build relationships in the last 32 years with different federal agencies.

And I was getting phone calls as far as like, how can we help?

And at first I really wasn't sure, how can they help?

Now I do know that there's so many things that you need for such an incident, you know, incidents like that, some police departments will never go through.

Some police chiefs will never ever experience something like that.

But I do now learn that you have to know that you need personnel.

You need to have the right people with the right skillset, and you need to have patience.

And that's something that I feel that is something that we as a department learned, we were able to collaborate.

There was some tense moments.

I mean, one day is too much.

Two days without an apprehension is too much.

Three days was too much.

And then on the fifth day, obviously, the fourth day and getting that break was important, but it took that whole work and that collaboration, that whole process.

So I think what we learned, or I learned and the department learned is the importance of collaboration.

This is not about ego.

This is not about who's due, who's gonna handle the case.

This is about making an apprehension and bringing some sort of peace and calm to the city and bringing justice to the victims.

- The Brown University shooter, Carlos Neves Valente killed a former rival who was a professor at MIT.

The motive there seemed pretty clear, but the shooting at Brown University seemed much more random.

He had some animus against Brown University and he went into an engineering building.

But has your department identified a clear motive for that shooting?

- We haven't, no.

And we've been in conversations with the FBI obviously, as soon as he was found at the warehouse, obviously the FBI continued to retrieve evidence and did some forensic analysis of some of the evidence that was found there just to see if we could come up with a motive.

But they haven't been able to.

And so it is unfortunate.

But you're right, it was like a random incident that we did learn that he actually went to Brown.

From what we know, this individual obviously has some mental issues, but he also had a lot of hate, a lot of hate for Brown, a lot of hate for almost like it felt like he felt like there was some injustice that was done to him and he blamed all this for it.

- It sounds like you're saying that the FBI is the lead agency in determining a motive for the Brown University shooting.

If this is a Providence case, why would the FBI be the lead agency for that?

- Yeah, he left our jurisdiction once the person left the state and obviously was found in another state.

And so they have the tools, like I told you at the beginning of this interview, is that collaboration is important.

It's not about an ego, it's about being able to find the answers and they have the tools and resources to do that to the point that they, they even, you know, flew out to Portugal.

They have agents all over the world.

And so we are just trying to find out if there was a reason for the motive, but there really hasn't been anything specific that could identify that motive.

After this incident, I've been able to make some relationships with the new SAC in Boston, been able to meet with the special agent in charge, and made some good relationships and he's been able to tell me if there's anything, but there really hasn't been anything at all.

- Sure, I wanna ask about how your officers are doing.

It's hard to imagine a more traumatic scene to respond to than one in which two young people were killed and other people were injured.

I imagine cell phones were probably blowing up from the loved ones of these people trying to reach them after hearing word of the shooting.

How are your officers doing who were part of the initial response?

- Yeah, this job, I'll tell you when, and I tell you in 32 years you see so much.

But what those officers went through is definitely that's going to stay with them for a long time.

And so we have a great peer support group, the unit in the department that have been able to assist those officers, as well we've been able to meet with the request of some of the victims, we've been able to meet with them and the officers met with them.

And there's a dialogue and conversations that have have occurred.

And I think it has been extremely helpful for the wellness of our officers.

You don't realize how much something like that would affect an officer.

They take that home with them but I also know that they were very proud of what they did and to be able to be recognized by the victims as far as thanking them for saving their life.

It's something that I personally never experienced.

I was able to see it because of the interaction, but yeah, no, they're doing well and we'll continue to provide them the resources they need.

And as well, we were extremely lucky to have the right training in place, as you saw in some of the other media outlets as far as Lieutenant Potter who was on scene, he was a commanding officer.

He did a phenomenal job.

He responded within minutes and he also was able to provide that support for those younger officers.

We got a very young department, and so, but yeah, we'll continue to give them the resources that they need.

- The police chief at Brown University was put on leave after the shooting.

And Brown University has brought in your predecessor as Providence Police Chief Hugh Clements to help with its response.

How do you assess the response by Brown University Police immediately after the shooting?

- Yeah, I'm not here to point fingers on anybody.

I think this was a unprecedented incident.

Obviously, like I told you, there's many departments would never go through it.

I just know that immediately after it occurred, both departments responded and we work with what we were provided.

Our detectives were on scene within minutes.

Brown Police was there actually inside the building with our officers assisting victims.

And so I think that the response was great.

I just think that unfortunately, you know, there was a lot going on and so the collaboration was key.

And immediately, making the right choices and decisions, calling the right people, utilizing the right resources and logistically setting up what was about to occur for the next few days was important.

And so I think that we worked as a team and I think it worked out pretty well in order for us to conduct a thorough investigation and end up with the results that we did.

- Colonel Perez, you were out of town when the shooting happened.

Can you take me through what went through your mind when you heard about the shooting and what the process was as you made your way back to Rhode Island?

- Yeah, I was actually in a vehicle heading to the airport with my wife already on the way to come home.

And when I got the call from the deputy chief, even my wife, who knows the deputy chief very well told me that, you know, she sensed that that something really bad had happened, obviously we realized it.

And so I just couldn't wait to get back home.

And so I was getting phone calls as I'm getting to the airport, at the airport, I'm getting phone calls.

I'm speaking with different agents that are providing resources.

And so, and I'm also speaking to obviously officers in my department, the deputy chief, the lieutenant in charge of the shift, and just getting actually the intel that I needed to get.

As soon as I got on the plane, obviously there was no access to internet on the plane, so I couldn't really text or anything.

And so as soon as I landed, one of the sergeants and detectives picked me up at the airport and I rushed to the firehouse where the first press conference occurred.

But I was pretty much brought up the speed.

And at that point, it was just all hands on deck.

I think I got home at like two in the morning and I was back in the police station at like five in the morning or four in the morning.

Actually, I took a ride down to Covent Creek because we took someone into custody that we thought was responsible.

But yeah, it was very hectic from the moment I received the first phone call till the last date that this person was found.

- As you said earlier, it took investigators four days to track down the shooter pretty quick.

But there was a lot of impatience on the part of some people.

There was criticism in the national media, Providence was in the national media spotlight.

You were a focal point for that.

You were also subject to some racist attacks.

What was it like being at the center of that?

- Yeah, no, I've always looked at it as just noise.

I think at the end of the day, when you are either the CEO of a company or you're the chief of police for a department that is going through this, you gotta stay focused and you have to stay focused on the mission.

I don't think I even looked at any social media.

I wasn't watching the news.

I was so busy worrying about all the things, more important things.

And one of the critical things was to make sure that wasn't releasing anything to the media that could be twisted or even more dangerously that this guy was watching and knew exactly where we were at with the investigation.

And to that point, actually before he took his own life, he made comments that he was actually watching the news to the point that he even made a comment about what the president made the comment about him.

And so I already knew on the back of my knowledge, and that came with experience that, that you have to make sure that you have some respect for the investigation, but also know that a criminal may be watching or waiting for you to say something.

And so I was very careful, but to me, that was just noise.

At the end of the day, we had a job to do and that's all I cared about.

- You have to have a thick skin to be in the job.

- You have to have a very thick skin to be on this job.

And that comes with experience, in 32 years, this job has transformed.

And so I just know, I think when you're confident about your skillset and the department that you work with, it's important.

I mean, I remember coming into the building and seeing detectives coming in prior to me coming into the building early in the morning.

And so I knew that I was part of a good team.

So it's all that mattered.

- There was a lot of disinformation and misinformation in the time before the shooter was found.

One thing that your department did, you put your watermark on some of the information that was shared as the public, so it could be confirmed as coming from an official source of the Providence Police Department, but what are other ways in which your department is changing your approach in the aftermath of that?

- Yeah, so it was very challenging during those times because obviously there was other social media that was throwing certain messages out there to our community.

And so the department took a stand and that was one of the things that, I made it a point every time I got in front of the cameras to ensure that I educated the public to ensure that if they needed to get any specific or official information, that they got it from the right source.

And the right source was either the Providence Police Department website our ourselves or the mayor or whoever was in front of the camera explaining to them what we have, what we had so far.

And so that's what we've been using, obviously.

And I think that that's important for us to ensure that we're transparent with our community, that we're providing the right info immediately so that it doesn't get twisted out there by other social media outlets or individuals that just want to get attention and for the wrong reasons.

So I think that's one of the things that the department is really focused on and makes it a priority to ensure that we provide the right info immediately and being as transparent as we can so that the city and our community understands that, so.

- Your department last fall put out a message pointing to how violent crime in Providence had fallen to a historic low.

At the same time, there are these terrible episodes of mass shootings like the one we saw at Brown University and in Pawtucket.

How do you reconcile that?

How on one hand there's a lot less crime in the past, but there's seemingly an inability to prevent these kind of mass shooting episodes?

- Yeah, I mean, we plan and we are proactively strategizing how to minimize violence in our city.

And some of the tactics and strategies that we used have been very positive.

As you know, the numbers has been going down and trending down from violent crime, violent crime with a firearm.

Robberies are trending down, different quality of life issues, license from the auto, that's all trending down.

But more importantly, obviously homicides are trending down.

We had four homicides last year, two unfortunately from the Brown incident.

And so it's violence and I think that-- - And that's a really dramatic reduction.

I mean, I remember about 20 years ago, there were probably about 25 homicides per year in Providence.

- Correct.

We used to average about 25, 30 when I first came on the job in the early 90s, that's the number.

And then we're trending down.

I think since 2010, the average has been 15.

So that's definitely a number that the city has never seen.

And I think it's to commend the work of the men and women of the Providence Police Department.

But I'm also not blind, especially what's going around our nation and how incidents could occur at the spur of the moment.

And so we train for that and it's something that the only thing we can do is minimize and be alert and be proactively alert.

And there's no way that any police department in the world or in the nation can stop violence.

I think we need the assistance of our community members, and that's something that I always call out for our members to be fully aware, especially when they're in large venues, when there's different events going on, might even be protest or certain activities that are going on in the city.

I think it's important for us to work as a team regardless of our different opinions and is to make sure that we're all safe because I'm realistic that anything can happen.

We strategize to minimize problems and to minimize violence.

But, you know, it's tough to control someone coming from another country, Portugal, that has hate and has a plan and thought out a crime, is very difficult.

But we can try and minimize it if we're alert and conscious and we work as a team that's not just the Providence Police Department, but the city of Providence as a community as well with the Providence Police, I think we can definitely minimize and potentially even eliminate something to happen like that again.

- Do you see any specific steps that you would recommend to try and reduce the likelihood of that kind of mass shooting?

- Again, I think we need to work as a team, and that involves the community being alert, something that looks suspicious to you, you need to notify us, keep an eye on something that didn't look right.

I think that, you know, 90% of the city, the population that lives in the city as well as those that entertain themselves in the city, that come to the city, we mean well, I think it's that 10% that would give us those problems.

And so that 90% needs to be alert and work closely with the police department.

Again, regardless of whatever opinions we have of anything.

And the reason for that is so that we can try and avoid something like that.

And if, God forbid, something like that was to happen, at least we have, we may have information that would be critical for us to follow up on.

And I think that that was one of the reasons we were so successful with the Brown.

It took a little while because of the patience that I told you, we were waiting for that break, but I think the assistance of our community members was critical.

I mean, we went door to door asking for video in a certain geographical area of our city, and we were asking residents to look at their cameras, hours of video footage looking for something that it was smaller than someone taking a breath.

And so, and that's what came to help, that was that good old fashioned policing that I mentioned that sometimes you have to rely on, but it was the community's assistance as well as our police department and detectives and obviously the FBI and everyone else that was on board.

- Colonel Perez, I'd like to switch gears and talk a little bit about immigration.

You came to Rhode Island with your family from Columbia when you were 13.

You've had a distinguished career in the Providence Police Department.

You were named the chief about three years ago.

How do you feel about the stepped up ICE raids that have been happening around the country and also in Rhode Island?

- Yeah, I tell you, I can only speak for obviously the work that we do as a police department and we are very, it's a difficult situation to navigate for our police officers.

Many times the perception of the public is that we're assisting obviously ICE, and that's not the case.

We have a policy that's pretty strong.

We have a training that is pretty strong among the department.

And what I do make sure that our offices understand is, is our responsibilities.

And that's to minimize violence.

That's to ensure that there's no civil unrest, that's to protect lives.

And so we've had incidents where ICE has had responded into the city, and that that's my focus, is to ensure that our officers keep our community members safe.

I definitely don't want a Minneapolis to happen in the city of Providence.

And that takes us to intervene in incidents where we potentially could escalate to other more violent acts.

And that's where we focus as deescalation.

It's a very difficult topic.

I think that, as you stated, as an immigrant, I obviously, I came here with the goals of doing something for myself and for this country, and I done so.

But I think that also there's a lot of families that have came to this country and didn't have the same opportunity like I did to come legally, but they're doing the right thing.

And so I think that it's important to respect everyone's rights.

But at the end of the day, we're a police department and we're a police department that's neutral.

We are a police department that is here to keep everyone safe.

And we are a police department that needs to stay focused on our policies, the executive orders that are assigned by our mayor to ensure that our community members know that we care and we're concerned about 'em regardless of their legal status.

And again, I think my focus as a police chief is to ensure that we don't have a Minneapolis, like, like they're going through, which is very unfortunate.

- Do these ICE raids make it harder for your officers to do their job?

- At the end of the day, they're doing their job, they have their own federal guidelines, but as far as us, we know what our mission is and we know what our duties are.

And that is not to assist ICE, it's to deescalate and to make sure that we protect everyone regardless of their legal status.

But that takes intelligence.

That takes a lot to navigate because you know, you got a very small margin where people may perceive something else.

And at the end of the day, again, our main priority is to ensure that we deescalate so that we don't have those incidents that have occurred in other parts of this country.

And so when you say it makes our job harder, it does, but again, it's the training, it's the policies that are in place, it's the executive orders that are in place and it's the culture of our department.

Our department is extremely diverse.

We have 162 officers that come from all backgrounds.

A lot of them are immigrants themselves that became citizens.

And so we truly understand and we're culturally competent on how to police the city and I'm proud of that.

- How is the department doing in resembling the racial and ethnic makeup of the city as a whole?

- Yeah, I mean, compared to when I came on the job, it's a lot different.

I think that our numbers speak for themselves.

We're an extremely diverse department.

I got about 116 officers that speak another language.

And we, at one point, we had about 190 obviously officers retired.

We speak a lot of different languages and I think that that reflects the community that we serve.

And that comes, and I've always mentioned that when you have officers that are culturally competent, it's important for any department to have that.

And that doesn't speak about race.

You can be Caucasian, you can be Hispanic, you can be Black, Asian, it doesn't matter when you're culturally competent and you grew up in a neighborhood understanding social challenges, it makes you a way better officer.

I grew up with Caucasian offices, and I mentioned that before that dance salsa better than I do.

And they eat different ethnic meals and foods because they experience that.

And so I've always mentioned that when we encounter situations where you understand what's going on in the household, especially in an urban core, you are going to deal with that a lot easier than someone that grew up in another environment, maybe suburban environment, and doesn't understand, and that has nothing to do with race.

That just has to do with being culturally competent with the way you police in an urban city core.

- Speaking of changes in the department over time, you started in 1994 when Buddy Cianci was still riding high.

- Correct.

- There was some issues in the department when he was mayor, there was an exam testing scandal, there were morale issues.

What was your sense of how he impacted the police department?

- Yeah, I mean, at that time I was a young detective.

I mean, I was in patrol for 1994, came to patrol community policing.

So I really didn't get involved with the mayor at the time.

But I do remember seeing him at different events.

And I do remember that the police department was different back then.

I think there was a lot more, I think the mentality of the department, there was an A team and a B team.

It was almost like, depending how movement were, it was a lot more, you know, whether you were liked or what the reasons were.

I really never played that game.

I think that I was really focused on doing the job and that's some of the stuff that I speak critique to my new recruits in the academy.

That is important for you to stand out in the sense that you gotta be confident about the work that you do, your skillset and your talent, and the way you deal with our community members and the way you do your policing.

It's important because everybody else is watching.

And so I think that that's what brought me to the next level.

I think that even though they might've been a mentality or culture of an A team or B team, I think it's very difficult to pass someone when they doing good work and the community's noticing that good work and also internally, the men and women of the department are noticing that good work, whether you like that person or not.

I think that's what comes into play.

It's what you've done for yourself so others can watch and help you move.

So I guess to answer your question is back then, it was more of like, you know, just a different type of environment, talking about the 90s, and there was moves that were made politically, from what I heard, not nothing that I experienced myself.

I mean, those are the old times.

This department is very professional.

We really care about the men and women of the department.

We have a good testing process.

And for me personally as the chief and for the commanders, we look to ensure that our officers are well trained to take the next step, but we also provide them professional development so that they can continue on.

- Colonel Perez, you are known to be a big soccer fan, so it probably has not escaped your notice that the World Cup is coming to the region this year.

Providence is not exactly technically a host city, but there will be a lot of people coming to the area because of the World Cup.

What does that mean for your department?

- Yeah, it means a lot.

We gotta logistically start planning and we have, we're in conversations with Boston Police, Mass State Police, we're part of a committee with FIFA where we constantly interact.

They present scenarios and we give our own sort of plans and things that we're doing here in the city.

I have a commander, and obviously a commander and captains that are assigned to some of these committees.

And so, yeah, it's gonna be a lot of work.

We're gonna have people coming from all over the world with different cultures.

Again, soccer is big worldwide and so we are gonna make sure, obviously we're not, as you stated, we're not a fan venue as Boston is, but we're gonna be a watch venue and we're so close to Foxborough that people are gonna stay in the city of Providence.

And so we gotta use every resource that we can.

We're probably gonna be utilizing other municipalities to assist us.

If it gets to that level, I think it's gonna be great for the city.

And I also think it's gonna be great for our community.

You're right, when I came to this country, I was playing for Central High School.

I was a JV varsity team my ninth grade, and I immediately was placed in varsity.

I played for a team on Atwells Avenue called Italy 90 back then.

And it was, yeah, soccer is big.

I'm a big fan.

I played all my life and yeah, I can't wait.

I think it'll be great for the city, it'll be great for the community, but the police department is gonna have their hands full, that's for sure.

- I've gotta ask you, Colonel, who are you gonna be rooting for in the World Cup?

Will it be Columbia?

- Actually, the USA, obviously, I'll definitely be rooting for them.

I hope that they come to actually Foxborough, but without a doubt, Columbia as well.

I think if they play against each other, it's gonna be tough, but at that point, I'll just let the best team win.

- Colonel Oscar Perez, Chief of the Providence Police, thank you very much for joining us.

- Thank you.

Thank you very much.

- Thanks for watching "One on One" with me, Ian Donnis.

You can find all of our past interviews on the YouTube channel for Ocean State Media.

We'll see you next week.

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