GARY: Next on Start Up, we head to Grand Rapids, Michigan, to meet up with Dre Wallace, the CEO of Opnr, a national entertainment marketplace for booking talent for live performances.

All of this and more is next on Start Up.

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♪ GARY: My name is Gary Bredow.

I'm a documentary filmmaker and an entrepreneur.

As the country continues to recover from extraordinary challenges, small business owners are showing us why they are the backbone of the American economy.

We've set out for our 11th consecutive season, talking with a wide range of diverse business owners to better understand how they've learned, to adapt, innovate, and even completely reinvent themselves.

♪ This is Start Up.

♪ The talent booking industry in the US involves the process of booking artists and performers for live events such as concerts, festivals, and corporate events.

Talent booking agents and agencies work as intermediaries between artists and event organizers.

They negotiate contracts, fees, and logistics.

The industry is highly competitive, with a few large agencies dominating the market, and the industry has undergone significant changes in recent years due to advances in technology and changes in consumer behavior, leading to the rise of new platforms and business models that offer alternative ways for artists to book gigs and connect with fans.

The music talent booking industry plays a vital role in the live-music scene in the US, bringing together artists and audiences and facilitating the creation of memorable live music experiences.

Today, I'm heading to Grand Rapids, Michigan, to meet up with Dre Wallace, the CEO of Opnr, a national entertainment marketplace for booking talent for live performances.

As a musician myself, I'm incredibly interested to see how Opnr is making it easier for both artists and venues to bring quality entertainment to fans.

I can't wait to learn more, and maybe even set up my own Opnr profile.

♪ What is Opnr?

DRE: It's an all-in-one data-powered entertainment marketplace that basically is helping to remove all of the annoyance, time and friction away from the talent discovery and talent booking process.

But also, while doing that, helps these organizers to be able to close the gap in ticket sales by using data that we already know about the musician's fan base.

GARY: Have you always been interested in music?

Are you a musician yourself?

DRE: I have been playing music since I was like four years old.

(laughs) My mom is a really good classical pianist.

She did a lot to teach both my brother and I when we were young, so- and I just really latched onto it.

Like I loved, loved, loved music, and I also played in college as well.

I knew I was going to do something with music, but to be honest, I really didn't know what, and I wasn't sure if it was gonna be like a career thing or if it was always gonna be a on the side kind of for fun.

Now I'm doing this, so it- GARY: Yeah.

DRE: It really did kind of come full circle, but not- not totally in the way I was expecting, but in a cool way.

GARY: What was your degree?

DRE: Business major, advertising and PR minors, studied music and stuff there for a bit, too.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: When I was done, I ended up getting a job at this software development agency.

I picked up basically how to code on the job 'cause I had to do a lot of reverse engineering of stuff, like just QA work and project management work and stuff like that, so I started kind of doing some things on the side just myself.

And that was kind of running parallel to me also having this burgeoning DJ career because prior to this point, I was just sort of at home making music.

I ended up teaching myself how to DJ.

I bought these DVDs, How to DJ 101.

GARY: Nice!

DRE: And then I kind of went through the same thing as every musician goes through.

I was like, okay, I should probably, like, go play somewhere now, but what am I supposed to do?

GARY: Right.

DRE: How do I do that?

Slowly but surely, started to kind of get added to lineups with other people until I got a big one.

GARY: What was the big one?

DRE: There is a venue in Grand Rapids called The Intersection, which I hung out at a lot.

There was an artist that was coming through Grand Rapids at the time, Bassnectar, and I really wanted to open for this show.

I'm like, I know I'm gonna be perfect for opening for this show.

GARY: Yep.

DRE: I got to open for the show.

And as I was coming down off the stage afterwards, I was talking to the artists and management and stuff, and they're like, "That was awesome.

"You know, we really want "you to be on this next tour "that we're gonna be on in about a month."

GARY: What?

DRE: I literally ended up on a tour with them like a couple months later, which turned into maybe seven or eight more, specifically with them.

Then I got signed to a booking agency and a management agency and all this stuff started to happen.

So it's like, I really understand, probably maybe more than most, what is necessary to sort of get to that next phase and how important it is to be able to get some of these opportunities, but also fully knowing that it's not easy to get them, and how traditionally, in the past, it's been very much based on who you know... GARY: Yeah.

DRE: And how you can kind of leverage contacts and relationships, which, frankly, just isn't fair sometimes.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: So, yeah.

GARY: Seeing behind the curtain gives you a really incredible advantage, though, for a company like this.

DRE: Yeah.

GARY: Was that, essentially, the transition point when you decided to start Opnr, to demystify that a little bit?

DRE: I was more focused on the artist experience because what I started to see and realize was all this stuff is happening.

Money is flying everywhere.

It becomes really difficult to keep track of stuff.

Like, what's happening.

Like, it became very apparent to me.

I saw how so many artists get messed up, you know?

Or lose money, or get in situations with people stealing money and stuff like that.

GARY: Come off tour in debt.

DRE: Yeah, there's so much going on that you have no idea half the time what's happening and you're just trying to hold it together to perform every night, let alone reviewing spreadsheets and stuff like that.

And there's just a lot that you need to be on top of.

And so, this is where the business degree absolutely helped... GARY: Yeah.

DRE: For me and some of those software engineering skills that I had built was like, I started to put together dashboards of stuff purely just so I could stay sane, like to keep track of things.

So once I had done that, some of my friends started to see it and they're like, "Oh, shoot, can you make me one of those?"

And I'm like, I wonder if people like this.

Around like 2018 is when I had this idea.

I formed this company called Fourtifeye that was basically around data aggregation for musicians and how to make sense of whatever it is that they're looking at.

GARY: Awesome DRE: I was purely focused on improving the artist experience because I felt like if you could give artists those tools and if they understood what was happening, it would be a lot less likely that they would be taken advantage of... GARY: Yeah.

DRE: By somebody else on their team or not on their team.

I had a great team.

I'm very fortunate that I did.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: Very lucky in a lot of ways because I've seen that absolutely not be the case for so many other musicians GARY: Oh yeah.

DRE: That I know so- GARY: There's a lot of horror stories out there like that.

DRE: A lot.

GARY: So did Fourtifeye work?

Is it still going?

What happened with that company?

DRE: Yeah, so it's a great story how this all ties together.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: At the same time there was, unbeknownst to me, we had not met yet, there was another founder in the Detroit area.

His name was Waref Hawasli, who was working on this platform that was really focused on live experiences and making connections between musicians and venues and promoters and all of that.

He had launched this platform called Opnr.

And so, I remember I heard of it.

I even had signed up for an account.

I ran into a friend of mine from Midwest House.

His name is Ted Velie.

Happened to run into him at my coworking space, Start Garden, and he tapped on the window like, "Hey."

He's like, "I need to talk to you."

He's like, "There's this founder that you have to meet."

He's like, "He's stepping "away from this business piece "that he's built because he's "got other businesses going on, but he doesn't want this thing to die on the vine."

He's like, "I think you guys need to meet.

"I feel like you have what he's missing and kind of vice versa."

So I was like, you know, okay, sure, whatever, you know?

After a couple of months, some lawyers and paperwork and all that stuff, we actually decided to smash these two companies together.

GARY: So a merger?

DRE: Yeah, underneath the Opnr umbrella.

♪ ♪ I wanna ball ♪ ♪ Money with designer frames ♪ ♪ All the finest things ♪ ♪ I promise, man ♪ ♪ I'ma kill the game, I wanna ball ♪ ♪ A big crib for Mama, more fetty, less drama ♪ ♪ Bank account with multiple commas ♪ GARY: What's the biggest challenge that you face as an artist?

SPEEDY: Standing out is probably the hardest thing to do because there's so much content out here.

GARY: Got it.

SPEEDY: And everybody's doing a lot.

Everybody and they mom try to rap, you know?

Everybody wanna rap, so getting people to believe in you, staying consistent and everything, that was the hardest part.

Getting people to take me serious.

GARY: Tell me about the first time you learned about Opnr.

SPEEDY: First time was a couple years ago.

I knew it was about providing opportunities.

So that's when I'm taking advantage of anything that gives me opportunities, especially when I saw that it provide opportunities for musicians to open up for big concerts and stuff.

Like, yeah, free to sign up and, like, yeah, that's a no brainer.

♪ GARY: As a musician, how do I utilize your platform?

DRE: It is super, super easy right now.

It takes at most about five minutes to create an account.

Then what you can do is connect social media platforms.

You can also connect distribution platforms.

So what it does is it pulls all of this information into one view, so that way, when an organizer is looking for certain things, they don't have to chase them down... GARY: Yeah.

DRE: Like via email and they're also able to listen to your music 'cause it can pull in right there from Spotify, from Apple Music, from SoundCloud, Bandcamp.

But basically, it helps them get to this point where they're speaking the same language.

So the info that the organizer wants to see is right there in the profile.

They don't have to go running for it.

GARY: On the organizer, the event side, it seems like this is just gonna simplify all the information that I wanna see right there.

DRE: Yep, but there's some extra features that organizers get access to, and the most important one is this ability to use our opportunity module.

It gives you the ability to set criteria for what you're looking for, so that way, when you click post, an alert automatically goes out to all of the musicians, but only the ones that fit the criteria for what you're looking for.

So as you're getting submissions back, there's submissions that are relevant, and then also, once those musicians submit to that particular opportunity, what they can do is they can also bring their fans to the platform.

So as you're reviewing everybody who submitted, you can also see how much fan support that they have, which ultimately, we can use some features to help you close the gap in ticket sales, too, which is what everybody really wants.

GARY: Right, as an artist, I'm able to be active, and essentially sort of campaign for specific gigs that I see pop up.

DRE: Absolutely, and even in that profile, and when you submit for an opportunity, artists are actually allowed to write a quick short pitch, too.

They can also state the case like why they are a good fit for the show.

♪ BRIE: I can't emphasize enough how difficult it is to really break in as an artist right now.

And I'm not sure that people GARY: Yeah.

BRIE: Really understand that, either.

That, you know, we make 0.003 cents on the dollar per stream.

So it's really in touring that we are able to make some money back and also build our fan base.

GARY: Yep.

BRIE: And, as you know, COVID put a huge stop on that, and then after COVID, a lot of venues got a little jumpy, so they're only wanting to book these guaranteed situations.

GARY: Yep.

BRIE: Again, making it that much more difficult as a new indie artist to break through, to have a chance to be heard.

GARY: How much does your social media presence and your power on those platforms play into your visibility to give you a chance to get booked?

BRIE: I feel like the music industry, much like book publishing, much like other industries, are now wanting to sign artists who have it all together already.

GARY: Already, yep.

BRIE: The platform, the fame.

What Opnr provides for us as artists is a way in.

GARY: Okay.

BRIE: It's actually a break in the system.

It's an avenue through which we can get a backstage pass, and that's huge, because otherwise... GARY: Yeah.

BRIE: You can just be pushing and doing all the right things, and either the algorithms on social media aren't supporting you, or for whatever reason, you're not able to build that fan base and that swell that you really need to get the attention of a booking agent.

But by having an opportunity like Opnr, you're given a chance to actually perform in front of audiences that can open other doors for you.

South by Southwest, for instance, was an alert that went out to everybody who was a part of the Opnr community, and you had an opportunity as an artist to submit yourself for the chance to play at the Midwest House at South by Southwest, GARY: Wow.

Okay.

So, did you submit?

BRIE: Which is what I did.

GARY: You submit, and you got it.

BRIE: Yeah.

GARY: How did it feel to actually perform at South by?

BRIE: It was a total dream.

I've been wanting to play South by Southwest since I was a teenager, since... GARY: That's huge.

BRIE: I picked up my dad's guitar.

I mean... GARY: Yeah.

BRIE: You know, since I was 14, so- GARY: Mm-hmm.

BRIE: The whole thing, start to finish, was a complete dream, from the soundcheck to getting up on stage to the performance itself, GARY: Yeah.

BRIE: It couldn't have gone better.

GARY: Are you independent with this?

Is the other founder actually still on board?

DRE: Yeah.

GARY: Like, what's the structure of this as we sit?

DRE: Yeah, so, he's still not involved in the day to day.

GARY: Okay.

DRE: That's pretty much, I'm running the show day to day, but definitely still like around.

GARY: How were you able to acquire funding for this?

DRE: Yeah, so.

(Dre chuckles) For me, I really just kind of had to like, it was like sweat equity, truthfully, like me building my own thing, and then where we could get cash, like getting it.

So there were a couple startup pitch contests that I've won.

You kind of do these things GARY: Yeah.

DRE: All along the way to sort of get a little bit here, a little bit there to kind of keep going until you're ready to really raise money for real, which is what we're focused on right now.

GARY: Have you gotten into the actual fundraising or Series A or anything like that?

DRE: Yep, just started.

So we're raising our pre-seed round.

It's an interesting process to say the least.

GARY: How's it going so far?

DRE: It's going actually pretty decent so far.

It's a brutal, brutal process that is full of rejection that you have to be very much mentally prepared for and not take it personally.

GARY: The rounds of funding, what will that do for the business in terms of growth DRE: Yeah.

GARY: And expansion?

DRE: Yeah, so right now, on our musician side, which is soon to be called talent side, 'cause we're gonna do some expansion over there.

It won't just be musicians.

That side, we've got close to 9,000 musicians on the platform.. GARY: Oh, wow!

DRE: All across the country.

All 50 states represented.

So that side, growing like gangbusters.

The other side, our organizer side, we've got about 550 organizers.

This is all with, like, zero money spent on marketing, so.

GARY: They just found it?

DRE: Because we don't have any money to spend on marketing yet.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: So basically it's hustle, frankly.

It's like boots on the ground, GARY: Yeah.

DRE: Like just talking to people.

GARY: The important question, how do you make money with this business?

(Dre laughs) DRE: Yep, so we have a subscription model.

Umm, yep.

GARY: Okay, On both sides?

DRE: Nope, so only on one side.

So we actually made a philosophical decision pretty early on not to charge musicians to be on the platform for performance opportunities for a lot of reasons.

Being a musician myself, I have been the victim many times of these platforms that say they're gonna do all this awesome stuff for you and they promise you the moon and you pay a bunch of money and nothing happens.

GARY: Yep.

DRE: So we decided early on, we're like, you know what?

For performance opportunities, we're never charging musicians to be on the platform for that.

For us, it's more important for them to be there... GARY: Yep.

BRIE: Than it is for us to be extracting value out of them.

All of that business model takes place on the organizer side.

There is the ability to pay for an annual subscription, which gets you full access to all of the talent discovery, the booking, and more importantly, the fan claim piece, which is actually what's helping them save tickets... GARY: Yeah.

DRE: With the click of a button.

That's really where the- where the subscription model takes place.

For the annual fee, is $1,100 for the whole year, or it is a hundred dollars a month.

♪ GARY: What is Midwest House?

TED: Midwest House is a platform for innovative and creative organizations in the Midwest to sort of connect with each other and the world.

We do that through event-based activations, most notably at South by Southwest.

GARY: Do you remember the- Brie Stoner's performance at South by?

And what was it that made you choose her through Opnr?

TED: It was great.

It was great.

We had a great crowd that night.

It was a beautiful night.

She really crushed it.

I just love when somebody comes from the Midwest down there and just sort of owns the stage.

GARY: Yeah.

TED: And a bunch of people, new people, you can see them sort of discovering this new artist.

So we were excited to get to be a part of that journey for her.

GARY: What do you say to other venue owners out there or people hosting events such as yourself that may not be working with Opnr at this point?

TED: To me, it's like, why aren't you?

'Cause it's so easy.

GARY: Get on board.

TED: It's an easy thing to do.

It's an easy way to learn about new artists.

For us, it's really easy to go through, listen to music, listen, find out who they are, see how many followers they have and all of that, and make some decisions from there.

So if we had to build that all out ourselves, that would take a ton of time.

GARY: You're a visionary.

You obviously see things kind of the way that you want them to be.

Five years into the future, just met you.

Tell me about Opnr.

DRE: Oh, man.

Yeah, more than I said earlier.

(Dre laughs) GARY: Yeah.

DRE: We're planning using artificial intelligence to help with the tour planning and tour routing.

Musician tools.

Fan tools.

GARY: You work with labels.

DRE: Yeah, working with large talent agencies.

Yeah, it's- it's a lot more than what it is today.

GARY: Obviously, when you're starting something new, rejection is something that's very common.

Talk a little bit about some of the things that you've heard and how you personally have handled rejection.

DRE: Oh, yeah, I've literally heard every negative thing that you could possibly think of.

It's too hard for you to do being married.

It's too hard for- GARY: What?

DRE: Oh, I've literally heard it all.

GARY: That's personal.

DRE: Yeah, I've heard it, for some reason, I feel like a lot of times when it's women, people have no problem commenting on the personal aspects of your life as it pertains to work.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: It's crazy.

There's always something.

I've learned that, in a lot of ways, there's two kinds of people in the world.

People who believe things can happen and can change, and people who just don't and don't feel like that.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: So I fit into this category and I really just try to just focus on that.

GARY: You have to have a thick skin in this industry, DRE: Very.

GARY: Otherwise it can lead to self-doubt, and I think there's a fine line between naivety and self-confidence and belief in yourself.

DRE: Yeah, very much so.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: And I think being a musician and being an entrepreneur are like one and the same.

You kind of have to be insane to do it because the odds are terrible.

GARY: They're terrible!

DRE: On either end, they really are.

The odds are terrible.

So it does require a lot of belief, but it's also like a little bit of insanity.

You're gonna get rejected.

People are gonna tell you you suck.

GARY: Yep.

DRE: Somebody's gonna just, it's gonna happen, and it's sometimes it can happen at scale.

GARY: Gotta be a little crazy.

DRE: Yeah, and it's like I said, it's the same thing with raising capital.

GARY: Mm-hmm.

DRE: You get a hundred nos before you ever hear a yes.

GARY: Yeah.

DRE: And so, you have to be so resolute, I think, in what you're doing, a little bit nuts, but very focused, but also, you need to believe in yourself and believe in the thing and the idea.

And a lot of times, that belief is what attracts other true believers, which helps you to move forward.

GARY: Being a career musician today is incredibly challenging.

The internet has practically devalued music as a product with file sharing and streaming services offering minimal to no artist compensation.

And even though vinyl records have made a comeback in recent years, independent artists struggle with the high cost of pressing short runs of vinyl, leaving touring and merchandise sales of items like t-shirts and posters as their main source of income.

And even then, booking gigs and selling merch is difficult without an established following.

Traditional recording studios have been largely replaced by software, flooding out the market with subpar music, and making it harder for serious artists to stand out.

And to top it all off, an artist's social media presence and YouTube views often overshadow even the music itself.

So now musicians have to become full-time marketing professionals and content creators.

However, the desire for new, original music remains, and good art will always find a way.

Dre and Opnr are working to change the music industry, providing opportunities for new artists to perform and reach a receptive audience.

They're making things easier for artists, for venues, and for fans to have new experiences.

Music is a vital art form that adds depth to our lives.

It's the soundtrack to some of the most impactful and memorable moments of our existence.

I personally cannot imagine an hour, let alone a lifetime, without good music.

So it's crucial to support local artists, attend live performances, and encourage the creation of new, good music.

Opnr represents the beginning of a new era in the industry.

I'm excited to witness what the future holds for this remarkable business.

For more information, please visit our website and search episodes for Opnr.

Next time on Start Up, we head to Jacksonville, Florida, to meet up with Brian Payne, the founder of CritterPro, a company on a mission to help people with wildlife- related issues that may be impacting their home.

Be sure to join us next time on Start Up.

Would you like to learn more about the show or maybe nominate a business?

Visit our website at startup-usa.com and connect with us on social media.

GARY: (gasps) What happened?

PASCAL: I put the bird strikes on.

GARY: Oh!

WOMAN: Yay.

(laughs) GARY: Thank you so much.

WOMAN 2: You're welcome.

WOMAN 3: Next on Start Up.

(laughs) WOMAN 4: Gary Bredow.

Superstar.

Okay.

GARY: With no nose.

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Providing connectivity for small businesses with internet, phone and mobile solutions available.

Information available at Spectrum dot com slash business.

ANNOUNCER: Small businesses are at the heart of Michigan's downtowns and neighborhood business districts.

The Michigan Economic Development Corporation offers programs to both new and existing businesses.

With an abundant workforce and access to statewide resources, Michigan welcomes businesses from around the world.

AMANDA: I call myself, like a feel-good beauty company.

After 20 years, I'm still doing this because I love what I do.

ANNOUNCER: More than 60% of sales in Amazon's store come from independent sellers like Amanda at Mojo Spa.

Amazon, a proud supporter of Start Up.

ANNOUNCER: Wearing a lot of hats can bog you down.

Thryv, the all-in-one small business management software can help you manage every aspect of your business, from a single screen with one log in and one dashboard.

Thryv is a proud supporter of Start Up.

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MAN: We just got an order from Dinosaur, Colorado.

ANNOUNCER: Build a website to help reach more customers.

WOMAN: Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, one more.

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