Roadfood
Phoenix, AZ: Frybread
Episode 111 | 26m 46sVideo has Closed Captions
Frybread is a dish with a complicated and controversial past.
For many Indigenous people, frybread is a dish with a complicated and controversial past: it is a symbol of perseverance and pain, but also a part of their culinary story. Now, some tribal members in Arizona are finding that looking back is the best way forward -- reconnecting with the foods, traditions and ceremonies that tie them to their ancestors and help their communities thrive.
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Roadfood is presented by your local public television station.
Distributed nationally by American Public Television
Roadfood
Phoenix, AZ: Frybread
Episode 111 | 26m 46sVideo has Closed Captions
For many Indigenous people, frybread is a dish with a complicated and controversial past: it is a symbol of perseverance and pain, but also a part of their culinary story. Now, some tribal members in Arizona are finding that looking back is the best way forward -- reconnecting with the foods, traditions and ceremonies that tie them to their ancestors and help their communities thrive.
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>> MISHA COLLINS: I'm in Arizona for an episode of Road Food where we will be meeting with members of different Indigenous tribes to discuss their food and culture and this otherworldly place.
♪ ♪ This is a stunning desert landscape.
The saguaro cactuses are... Oh no, do we say cactus?
Cactuses-- cacti, right?
It's cacti.
Everyone... Everyone who's finished fourth grade knows that.
♪ ♪ The cacti are as tall as tall trees in some places out here.
♪ ♪ We're going to be meeting with people who are carrying on the culinary traditions from many generations back and I'm excited to be tasting food in a world that I have never set foot in.
♪ ♪ In the 1970s, a young couple set out on the most epic road trip of all time.
Jane and Michael Stern were on a mission to discover every regional dish in America, and over four decades, they burned through 38 cars and published ten editions of their iconic guide, Road Food.
♪ ♪ Now I'm picking up where they left off, exploring what makes America's communities unique and what binds us all together.
And it's delicious.
>> Major funding for this program was provided by: ♪ ♪ >> Yours is a front-yard family.
Because out front... >> How you doing?
>> ...is where all the neighborhood is.
And your neighbors know you well.
>> Mario, what's up?
>> They've seen your robe, your run, even your bathing suit.
>> (laughing) >> They also know your home turf stays open to the whole street.
So you stay out front.
We'll stay real-brewed.
And the world just might get a little golder.
Gold Peak real-brewed tea.
♪ ♪ (shade rustles) (doorbell rings) ♪ ♪ >> (softly): Yes!
♪ ♪ >> Staying in?
Quick!
Bounty-- the Quicker Picker Upper.
♪ ♪ Going out?
Quick!
Bounty-- the Quicker Picker Upper.
♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: The sun is just peeking above the mountains there.
I've been driving through Canyonlands this morning, heading out to the San Carlos Apache Reservation.
♪ ♪ I'm about to meet Twila Cassadore and Bob Stevens.
Both are Apache, both are foragers, and both are preservationists.
♪ ♪ Hi.
>> Hi.
>> Good morning.
>> Very nice to meet you.
>> COLLINS: Nice to meet you, too.
Driving out here and seeing how dry the landscape is, I don't immediately think that there's readily available food in the wild here.
>> Yeah, they're very deceiving.
(laughs) Once you get to learn the land, and you start seeing what's out there.
You get to see what's dormant.
You get to see what's living.
>> COLLINS: So you, you grew up foraging?
>> We grew up on the other side of the mesas and my father was a hunter.
>> COLLINS: Uh-huh.
>> And we planted a lot of the food that we ate.
We barely went to the stores.
I think Bob grew up the same way, yeah, Bob?
>> Yeah.
>> So you'll see like these, these are in season right now.
You can taste it.
What does it taste like to you?
It's like a miniature tomato.
>> COLLINS: Oh, my goodness.
>> They're very high in Vitamin C. >> COLLINS: That really does taste like a cherry tomato, but it's a little bit smaller than we're used to.
>> So what we're looking for is this right here, it's a beautiful, beautiful barrel cactus.
>> COLLINS: Those look like little pineapples.
>> They do exactly.
And so, you know when they're ready when... see how it just barely... Watch out for the... And see how loose they are?
>> COLLINS: Yeah.
>> That's when they're ready.
(crunches loudly) ♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: It tastes like, um like a tomatillo... >> Mm-hmm!
>> COLLINS: ...almost.
♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: Why have you devoted yourself to preserving these techniques?
>> We're seed carriers for our people.
We carry language, songs, ceremony, prayer and traditional food ways.
We all carry some type of knowledge.
Myself, I carry food.
So for myself, it's in order for that seed to continue to grow, I have to teach it to the next generation-- so teaching to my children, teaching to people in the community.
And it feels good knowing that I'm planting a seed that I know is going to grow.
♪ ♪ No one ever taught you about being happy.
>> COLLINS: Mm-hmm.
>> Everybody thinks it's about, "I can make this much K. I can do this."
Nothing about being happy and nothing about... let's just stand here and enjoy the moment.
Let's just breathe this air.
Everyone else is like... (snapping fingers) Their mind is ticking.
It's really going forward on this money thing and it's not about just being happy.
>> COLLINS: Yeah, I think you're right.
I think we're losing touch with that.
(sighs) Well...
I'm happy to be here.
>> Good!
See?
(laughter) >> COLLINS: A step in the right direction?
>> Yeah, yeah, you're in the right direction.
♪ ♪ >> In our hearts, in our minds, in our spirits, we are Apache because of the information that we have, that we retain and the way we used to live our lives and try to live our lives today.
I've made it my lifetime goal to pass on all this information about Apache history, the culture, our traditions.
Actually, I'm not taking a step backwards, but I'm reaching back and pulling forward, what we used to have.
The hardest thing for us to do was to make that adjustment from being a free people to a confined people to a struggling modern-day version of what we used to be.
So it's a struggle that goes on within me every single day.
♪ ♪ >> This is just the regular fry bread, one of the traditional breads that we eat here.
>> COLLINS: Is this the acorns, too?
>> Yeah.
And then we have some of the acorn here that we put in that's ground to mix into the soup.
>> COLLINS: How much do you put in, all of it?
>> I'll put in the whole thing.
(laughter) >> COLLINS: Okay, if you put in the whole thing, I'll put in the whole thing.
♪ ♪ It's very simple.
It's not like a bunch of overpowering flavors and the acorn itself is a completely unique flavor.
It's got this bitter quality of-- I don't think I've ever tasted anything quite like it.
Do you like the acorn flavor?
>> Yeah.
>> COLLINS: Yeah.
>> I'll sit there and I'll eat it just by itself, like seeds.
>> COLLINS: How did fry bread originally get introduced as a food?
>> Once the Apaches were imprisoned in these camps, they weren't allowed to go out and collect their traditional foods that we harvested out in the wild.
So the Army had to find a way to supplement the people because they couldn't just let them starve and die.
So they would give out rations-- flour, coffee, sugar, salt.
You know, the main staples.
And when they gave flour, the Apaches found a way to mix it with water.
>> COLLINS: Mm-hmm.
>> And then cook it over a fire in some hot grease.
And at first it was not by choice.
But now it is.
>> COLLINS: Mm-hmm.
>> And has become somewhat of a delicacy now, especially to those around us who never had it before.
♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: So how do you separate the husks from the... >> Wind.
>> COLLINS: Wind?
>> It's a lot easier when it's, like, really windy because these dry, these... they blow out.
(rattling) >> COLLINS: Oh, I wish it was windy.
>> Yeah.
>> COLLINS: Do you have like a window fan that we could put on it and make it... >> Do you have a fan, she means.
Do you have a fan right now that we just can just plug it outside and pretend?
>> COLLINS: We can simulate the wind.
>> We'll... we'll create wind!
♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: Look, look.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah, you did it!
>> You did it.
(laughter) >> Woo-hoo!
>> You got to keep doing that until it's just acorn.
It's a long process to get that.
Call it Apache gold.
(laughs) (acorns rattling) >> Are you going to do the whole bowl?
>> COLLINS: Yeah, now I'm determined.
(laughter) >> So with this, I was able to make a flour and a mix of different things, I'm going to bring those out.
>> COLLINS: Okay.
♪ ♪ >> This is a desert agave stalk.
and it's seasonal, only grows in the early summer.
>> COLLINS: How did you cook that?
>> You roast it.
>> COLLINS: It tastes almost smoked.
>> Mm-hmm.
>> COLLINS: It's really delicious.
And then this is the... >> Prickly pear syrup.
>> COLLINS: Prickly pear.
>> And it's a prickly pear syrup that's reduced.
>> COLLINS: Wow, that is... >> And this is the... >> COLLINS: These are flavors... >> Mm-hmm.
>> COLLINS: ...I've never had before.
>> And this is our dry prickly pear fruit.
>> COLLINS: That is... >> And that's just sliced desert fruit.
>> COLLINS: ...totally awesome.
(laughs) >> And this is naturally sweet food that grows in our desert; you would not think... >> COLLINS: That is amazing.
>> ...when you look out there, you would not think there's anything sweet out there.
>> COLLINS: You're going to be very sought after when the apocalypse comes.
(laughter) ♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: So Twila recommended that we talk to Tony and Violet Duncan.
♪ ♪ (knocking) They know I'm coming because there's already a camera inside.
>> Hello!
>> COLLINS: How are you?
>> Hi, welcome.
>> Hi, how are you?
>> COLLINS: Hi-- Misha.
>> How are you?
>> COLLINS: Nice to meet you.
>> Nice to meet you, I'm Violet.
>> COLLINS: Nice to meet you.
Thank you for inviting us into your home.
>> Thank you so much, come on in.
>> COLLINS: Okay.
♪ ♪ >> Stop it-- okay!
>> COLLINS: Hi, hi!
He needs to sniff you and then... (dog snorts) Everyone... ♪ ♪ this is my mom, Rosa.
>> Hi.
>> COLLINS: Hi, I'm, I'm Misha.
>> And my father, Melvin.
>> Hey, hi, Misha.
>> COLLINS: Hi, nice to meet you.
>> Good to see you.
>> COLLINS: And what's your name?
The littlest one.
>> My name is Mia.
>> COLLINS: Hi, Mia.
Are you all hoop dancers?
>> Yes.
>> Yeah, we're all hoop dancers.
>> COLLINS: Is is something that's fun or does it feel like a chore that your parents make you do?
>> It's very, very fun.
>> Really fun.
>> COLLINS: Is it?
>> It's really fun to do.
>> They love it.
They love to be entertainers.
I think when you come with knowledge and understanding, it's so much easier to perform because you already have the words to use.
>> COLLINS: And what is it about the dance that captured you?
Why is it so important to you?
>> I think for me, actually just seeing a hoop, you want to pick it up and you want to spin it and you want to see what you-- can jump through it, even just as a child.
It's something that's really alluring.
And then as I got older, I started to learn that it's not just all about that movement and all about that fun ways, but the hoop represents a symbol for all life, how we're all connected.
And as I seem to go through each part of that phase of life, something new about the hoop opens up to me-- a new lesson.
It just never ends, what you learn from hoop dancing.
>> I actually call it the Storytelling Dance when I introduce it.
So a lot of people will call it Hoop Dance, Circle of Life Dance, and then I call it Storytelling Dance.
>> COLLINS: You have a virtual event that you're preparing for this morning, right?
>> Yes.
With the energy company, there's a Native division within it and they're like, "We want to celebrate Native Heritage Month."
And normally we would go in, but because of the pandemic, we are now doing it virtually.
>> Like that?
>> Perfect.
(laughter) That's exactly how to do it.
(drumming, singing) >> Our stories have been around for thousands of years and they survived a dark history where it was illegal.
We were not allowed to be sharing songs, dances, stories.
But our elders thought these stories and songs, ceremonies, were so important, so vital that they'll risk their lives to continue telling them.
(drumming, singing continues) >> COLLINS: The fact that it was illegal to speak an Indigenous tongue, the storytelling of traditional Indigenous stories was illegal, which I didn't know, by the way.
That is something that you're still pushing up against, right?
You're still fighting to bounce back from... >> Mm-hmm.
>> COLLINS: ...or to heal from.
>> Mm.
>> Yeah.
(drumming stops, vocalizing) >> The stories that the old people tell, the stories that the children remember being torn away from their family, was very very difficult.
They would round up the children and they would take them in big busses.
Some of them were very young.
My husband was not that small, he wasn't three, but many of them were three, four, five, you know.
They also didn't know the language.
So when they would go to the school, they would be beaten for trying to speak their traditional language.
And it worked.
The children gave up their traditions and their cultures so they couldn't even communicate with their own parents or grandparents.
So that was the cut.
And that cut was very efficient because when you cannot project to your children the culture, the language, that's where people start to forget.
And, unfortunately, many, many people forgot.
(flute-like instrument playing) >> As Native people, the spiritual part of dancing is just ingrained and as I'm teaching-- as I'm making my hoops for my children, I think, hopefully, they'll pass this down to their children and their children and their children.
And it's how we keep our hoop strong, is by keeping in mind that, you know, we're not just dancing and not just teaching for this time being, but for the next seven generations to come.
(music continues) ♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: Hi.
>> Hi!
>> COLLINS: I'm Misha.
>> Misha, hi, I'm Alyssa.
>> COLLINS: Hi Alyssa, nice to meet you.
>> Nice to meet you too-- how are you?
>> COLLINS: Thank you for having me to lunch here.
>> Yes!
>> COLLINS: You ordered for me >> Yes!
In front of you there is posole.
>> COLLINS: Okay.
>> So, The Fry Bread House is known for their posole.
Corn, the hominy, your protein, the meat, the pork.
>> COLLINS: Mmm, that is good.
>> It's really good.
>> COLLINS: That is spicy.
>> Mm-hmm, we love our chilies.
>> COLLINS: You know how I like spicy.
>> We love our chilies here.
And then in here is one of, like, the kid's favorite in the communities of fry bread.
It's just bean and cheese and some lettuce on there.
>> COLLINS: This is like opening a Christmas present.
>> So this is the green chili, which is really, really good.
>> COLLINS: You're a food sovereignty specialist, activist, yes?
>> Some people, yes, call me that.
(laughs) >> COLLINS: And so what is the work that you're doing now?
>> So the work that I'm doing is, on our community in Gila River, we don't have a lot of options for healthier food.
So what I wanted to do is I wanted to give the community a healthier choice, while using traditional foods and an alternative to fry bread.
>> COLLINS: When we were talking about this episode and talking about what foods we wanted to incorporate into it, fry bread came up as, like, maybe we shouldn't even talk about fry bread because it has such a complicated history.
>> It does have a complicated history, but it is a part of who we are.
It is a part of showing how resilient we are as Native people.
>> COLLINS: Uh-huh.
>> We found a way to survive.
It was survival food.
And it really is something that may be bad for us, but also it has a lot of meaning to us, to families in the communities.
"So-and-so's grandma always makes the best," you know.
"Oh no, my grandma makes the best."
So it's that thing of taking pride in that they're able to eat and cook and make something from scratch.
>> COLLINS: Hi there.
>> Hi.
>> COLLINS: Are you Kris?
>> Yes.
>> COLLINS: Hi, I'm Misha.
>> Hi, nice to meet you.
>> COLLINS: How long have you been chef here?
>> I've been working here for 14 years, going on 15.
>> COLLINS: Oh, my goodness!
Since you were a child.
Um, what do you cook at home?
>> Pretty much the same things... >> COLLINS: Really?
>> ...I cook here, yeah, pretty much.
It's comfort food.
You know, it makes people feel at home.
It makes you feel like you're with your family, sitting at your grandma's house.
And that's how I expect customers that come from other tribes and reservations that are in the city and can't go back home, that they can come here and feel like they're at home.
So I guess that's how I would describe it.
>> COLLINS: I think that's a great description.
>> (laughs) >> COLLINS: Thank you, yeah.
>> You're welcome.
♪ ♪ >> Hello.
>> COLLINS: Hi.
>> So... >> COLLINS: Ooh!
That smells so yummy.
And healthy.
>> Yes, it is.
(laughter) So here I have a couple of things that I would like for you to try.
>> COLLINS: Okay.
>> So this is one of our traditional...
I tried to keep it as traditional as possible.
There's no seasoning.
It's just straight water, beans, wheat berries.
♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: Mmm.
>> How's that?
>> COLLINS: It's actually quite yummy.
>> Yes.
This is one of the things I like to make for my family during the wintertime.
>> COLLINS: What other treats have you got?
This is pico de gallo with cholla buds from the cholla cactus.
>> COLLINS: Is that cactus?
>> Yes.
>> COLLINS: Well that's just delicious.
>> I do this in my community to know that if our food is still here, we are still here.
I am Akimel O'odham.
I come from the River People, and so this is what we survived off of.
This is our ancestral food.
So we can make sure that we're honoring them and then we're honoring ourselves at the same time.
And then, last but not least, we have a ginger mesquite cookie.
♪ ♪ (laughs) >> COLLINS: Totally awesome.
I love that.
>> Mm-hmm.
>> People think there's no food in the desert, but there is.
>> COLLINS: Ironic that you are talking about food deserts... >> Mm-hmm.
>> COLLINS: But then going out into the desert and getting food.
>> Mm-hmm, yes.
♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: Hey there, Jaren.
>> Hey, how's it going?
>> COLLINS: Good.
I'm Misha.
>> Nice to meet you, Misha.
>> COLLINS: We are at an undisclosed location.
>> This is where we go when we get all of our watercress.
>> COLLINS: Oh, there's a mother lode of watercress.
>> Yes, and there's also some spearmint and some of this as well.
♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: What are you making now?
>> Just some grits Growing up on a the Navajo reservation, we always had it as blue corn mush.
So it was done with blue cornmeal and it was just typically served just like this with a little bit of veg on top.
>> COLLINS: That looks so beautiful.
>> That's all the stuff that we found down in that little creek area.
>> COLLINS: Ah, it smells so good.
♪ ♪ >> Simple, right?
>> COLLINS: Yummy >> Earthy-- yup.
>> COLLINS: Healthy.
>> Mm-hmm.
>> COLLINS: That is delicious and so earthy.
It feels like you can taste the place.
>> Yeah.
>> COLLINS: You said this is not wild?
>> Not wild.
It is the oldest domestic chili pepper, as far as I know.
>> COLLINS: How hot is it?
Am I going to regret this?
>> Yeah.
Eating the whole thing, yeah, you will.
>> COLLINS: I will regret it?
>> Yeah.
>> COLLINS: That's okay.
A little regret is okay.
>> They have a nice little kick.
♪ ♪ >> How's the regret?
>> COLLINS: Wow!
(laughter) My regret is... at a high level.
Pablo?
(laughs) >> Give me a little one.
>> COLLINS: Oh yeah, this is the smallest one, I promise.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Okay.
>> COLLINS: (laughs) This is our tradition.
(laughter) >> It's hot.
♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: Well, that was a yummy feast on your tailgate.
>> Thank you.
>> COLLINS: Thank you.
It was really nice to meet you.
>> Nice to meet you, too.
>> COLLINS: Thanks for having us out here.
>> Oh, man, it's awesome.
♪ ♪ >> When you move around, when you're walking, driving, the world learns about you.
When you're still, you learn about the world.
>> COLLINS: I think that's a great teaching, it's a great teaching for me.
♪ ♪ >> I'll give you a small example of what I teach.
If we could step right over here.
♪ ♪ Okay, now turn around and face this way.
You look around and you see modern technology.
You see cameras, you see cell phones, you see vehicles.
>> COLLINS: Mm-hmm.
>> You see a road and think of the machinery it took to build that road.
Now, look at all of that, take it all in.
Close your eyes and turn around, face that way.
♪ ♪ Now open your eyes.
You look out here, you see absolutely nothing that is man-made.
Plants are all evenly spaced, rocks are evenly spaced.
Each plant is strategically growing exactly where it should be.
If you can be this close to technology, but yet just do the simple act of turning around and facing 100% nature and understand that difference, to be able to block out what's behind you and only take in what's in front of you, even if they make noise.
To be able to do that, you've reconnected with what's out here.
♪ ♪ But if you cannot do it, if you're still thinking about people, you're still thinking about the road, it's a process.
It doesn't happen overnight.
And it took me my whole lifetime to realize that ♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: We were talking about happiness and materialism and how it doesn't really bring happiness, which I think everyone knows in their heart.
>> It's like the ants.
I always tell people about the ants.
You see the little ants, they are working hard all season.
They collect and put away and the world don't worry about them.
But they're still working hard because they're going to feed their families.
♪ ♪ I'm going to share a story.
>> COLLINS: Okay.
>> This is just about me.
I grew up with this.
I would carry this with me to school because I love eating this.
And we came to a generation where people make fun of you.
"Oh, you're so poor.
Your mom couldn't buy you other snacks," you know.
(inhales) I'm like, "I like this.
But they make fun of me."
So I put it away and I didn't take it to school anymore.
(inhales) I used to think, "We're so poor.
I never knew that we weren't poor, we weren't poor.
(inhales) But people put in my mind that I was poor, when I never was.
People said, "Oh, you're so poor "you have to plant those things.
"Oh, you're so poor, your dad has to butcher a cow.
You're so poor, you can't even buy these things."
But we're so rich and in a very natural way of life.
♪ ♪ We're here for a reason.
We're here to have a purpose in this life.
And we're here to help other people.
Let's say how you say, we're here to help each other still, and our work isn't done.
♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> COLLINS: If you want to see extended footage of these conversations, or of me spilling food on my shirt, or if you want to know more about the restaurants and recipes from this episode, go to roadfood.com.
>> Major funding for this program was provided by: ♪ ♪ >> Yours is a front-yard family.
Because out front... >> How you doing?
>> ...is where all the neighborhood is.
And your neighbors know you well.
>> Mario, what's up?
>> They've seen your robe, your run, even your bathing suit.
>> (laughing) >> They also know your home turf stays open to the whole street.
So you stay out front.
We'll stay real-brewed.
And the world just might get a little golder.
Gold Peak real-brewed tea.
♪ ♪ (shade rustles) (doorbell rings) ♪ ♪ >> (softly): Yes!
♪ ♪ >> Staying in?
Quick!
Bounty-- the Quicker Picker Upper.
♪ ♪ Going out?
Quick!
Bounty-- the Quicker Picker Upper.
♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
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Roadfood is presented by your local public television station.
Distributed nationally by American Public Television