>> Announcer: MAJOR FUNDING FOR "REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE" WITH DAVID CRUZ IS PROVIDED BY NEW JERSEY REALTORS, THE VOICE FOR REAL ESTATE IN NEW JERSEY.

MORE INFORMATION IS ONLINE AT NJREALTOR.COM.

RWJBARNABAS HEALTH.

LET'S BE HEALTHY TOGETHER.

AND BY NJM INSURANCE GROUP, SERVING THE INSURANCE NEEDS OF NEW JERSEY RESIDENTS AND BUSINESSES FOR MORE THAN 100 YEARS.

PROMOTIONAL SUPPORT IS PROVIDED BY "NEW JERSEY BUSINESS MAGAZINE," THE MAGAZINE OF THE NEW JERSEY BUSINESS AND INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION, REPORTING TO EXECUTIVE AND LEGISLATIVE LEADERS IN ALL 21 COUNTIES OF THE GARDEN STATE SINCE 1954.

♪ >>> HI, EVERYBODY, IT'S "REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE."

I'M DAVID CRUZ.

WELL, AS WE PREPARE FOR CLOSING ARGUMENTS IN THE DEREK CHAUVIN TRIAL, WE'RE BOMBARDED AGAIN WITH MORE SCENES OF VIOLENCE PERPETRATED BY THOSE SWORN TO UPHOLD THE LAW.

DAUNTE WRIGHT KILLED BY AN OFFICER WHO SAYS SHE MISTOOK HER GUN FOR A TASER.

DAMN ADAM TOLEDO, UNARMED, SHOT AND KILLED BY AN OFFICER.

NAZARIO, A LIEUTENANT IN THE U.S. MILITARY PULLED OVER BY POLICE, PEPPER SPRAYED, DRAGGED FROM HIS CAR AND HANDCUFFED ON THE GROUND AND WHO KNOWS HOW MANY OTHERS THAT WERE NOT CAUGHT ON TAPE.

IS THE AMERICAN SYSTEM OF POLICING BROKEN?

THAT IS SADLY WHERE WE HAVE TO BEGIN TODAY WITH OUR GUEST, THE FORMER NEW JERSEY ATTORNEY GENERAL AND CURRENT FEDERAL MONITOR OVERSEEING THE NEWARK POLICE DIVISION'S COMPLIANCE WITH THE FEDERAL CONSENT DECREE, PETER HARVEY.

GENERAL, WELCOME.

>> THANK YOU.

THANK YOU, DAVID.

THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> SO, YOU KNOW AS A FATHER, WATCHING THIS VIDEO OF A 13-YEAR-OLD UNARMED BOY SHOT AND KILLED BY POLICE WITH HIS HANDS IN THE AIR, IT IS HARD FOR ME TO KEEP IT TOGETHER.

CAN YOU TELL OUR VIEWERS THAT THE SYSTEM IS NOT BROKEN?

>> WELL, I THINK IT IS SEVERELY IMPAIRED IN CERTAIN J JURISDICTIONS.

THERE ARE SOME JURISDICTIONS THAT ARE DOING POLICING MUCH BETTER THAN OTHERS BUT IN SOME JURISDICTIONS THERE IS AN INSTITUTIONAL PROBLEM THAT HAS BEEN LONG STANDING OVER MANY DECADES THAT IS AN OUTGROWTH OF A LOT OF FACTORS THAT ARE UNIQUE TO AMERICA, NOT THE LEAST OF WHICH IS LEGALIZED SEGREGATION THAT WE HAD FOR OVER 100 YEARS COMING IN THE AFTERMATH OF RECONSTRUCTION.

SO, INFUSED IN SOME OF THESE POLICE DEPARTMENTS IS A CULTURE THAT HAS NEVER BEEN CHALLENGED AND MUST BE CHANGED.

NOW, SOME OF THE POLICE DEPARTMENTS ARE INFECTED WITH THIS PROBLEM, NOT ALL.

SOME POLICE DEPARTMENTS ARE LED BY POLICE LEADERSHIP THAT SIMPLY WON'T PUT UP WITH IT.

AND WITH CITY GOVERNMENTS THAT WON'T PUT UP WITH IT, BECAUSE REMEMBER, CITIES WRITE THE CHECKS FOR THESE SETTLEMENTS.

INDIVIDUAL OFFICERS GENERALLY DO NOT WRITE THE CHECKS.

IT'S CITIES.

SO, YOU HAVE CITY COUNCILS, AND YOU HAVE MAYORS, AND POLICE LEADERS, CHIEFS, POLICE DIRECTORS, AND IN THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY, WHO SAY, WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE THIS IN OUR TOWN, BECAUSE ULTIMATELY, IT IMPACTS YOUR BUSINESSES.

THERE ARE BUSINESSES THAT WILL MAKE DECISIONS NOT TO COME TO A PARTICULAR CITY OR TOWN OR COUNTY BECAUSE THEY SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT?

OUR WORKERS DON'T WANT TO FACE THAT KIND OF ABUSIVE POLICE BEHAVIOR, SO WE'RE GOING TO TAKE OUR BUSINESS ELSEWHERE TO A PLACE WHERE THERE'S A MORE INTERACTIVE AND POSITIVE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE GOVERNMENT AND PARTICULARLY WITH THE POLICE.

>> DO YOU EVER THINK SOMETIMES, YOU KNOW, I'M A FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL, PARTNER IN A BIG LAW FIRM, FEDERAL MONITOR, BUT ON ANY GIVEN NIGHT ON A RANDOM HIGHWAY POLICE STOP, THAT COULD BE ME?

>> IT HAS OCCURRED TO ME.

AND IT HAS OCCURRED -- I GREW UP IN TUSKEGEE, ALABAMA, AND I GREW UP IN THE '60s AND THE '70s AT A TIME WHEN YOU COULD BE KILLED ON THE ROADS OF ALABAMA AND THERE WOULD BE NO INVESTIGATION.

THERE WOULD BE NOTHING DONE ABOUT IT.

WHATEVER THE POLICE NARRATIVE WAS, THAT'S THE WAY IT STOOD.

AND YOU NEED ONLY LOOK AT THE EDMUND PETTUS BRIDGE AND WHAT THE GREAT JOHN LEWIS EXPERIENCED COMING ACROSS THAT BRIDGE AND HOW AGGRESSIVE THE STATE POLICE IN ALABAMA WERE TO TELL YOU ABOUT THE ERA IN WHICH I GREW UP.

I WORRY ABOUT IT FOR ALL OF OUR CHILDREN, BECAUSE WE NEED POLICE, AND WE NEED POLICE TO BE GOOD.

WHAT WE DON'T WANT AND DON'T NEED IS ABUSIVE POLICE, AND THAT REQUIRES SYSTEMATIC, INSTITUTIONAL PROTECTIONS, CONTROLS, AS WELL AS A PROCESS BY WHICH YOU HIRE PEOPLE WHO REALLY RESPECT OTHER HUMAN BEINGS AND HAVE A GREAT DEAL OF RESPECT FOR ALL COMMUNITIES THAT THEY PATROL.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE DELIVERY OF POLICE SERVICES.

WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT A POLICE FORCE THAT IS AN OCCUPYING FORCE IN A CITY.

THE DELIVERY OF POLICE SERVICES.

AND THAT REQUIRES A LOT OF ATTENTION.

WITH RESPECT TO YOUR HIRING, WITH RESPECT TO YOUR INTERNAL AFFAIRS, YOUR COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT, WITH RESPECT TO YOUR USE OF FORCE, YOUR DE-ESCALATION TRAINING, AND OTHER KINDS OF MECHANISMS, AND YOUR DATA SYSTEMS.

SO, IT REQUIRES A LOT OF WORK AND MONEY.

>> WHAT DO YOU SEE WHEN YOU LOOK AT THESE VIDEOS?

AND I WANT TO JUST WARN OUR VIEWERS THAT THESE ARE GRAPHIC IN NATURE.

GENERAL, WHEN YOU SEE THESE VIDEOS, IS IT -- WHAT DO YOU SEE?

IS IT RACIST POLICING?

IS IT POORLY TRAINED OFFICERS?

OR JUST A FEW BAD APPLES?

WHAT DO YOU SEE HERE?

>> WELL, DEPENDS UPON THE FORCE, IT'S A COMBINATION OF ALL OF THE ABOVE.

WHAT I SEE IS THERE ARE NO ANTI-BIAS POLICIES.

I BET YOU MOST OF THESE POLICE DEPARTMENTS DO NOT HAVE A FORMAL POLICY AS WE DO IN NEWARK THAT PROHIBITS BIASED-BASED POLICING.

SO THERE IS NO ANTI-BIAS POLICY.

THERE IS NO ANTI-BIAS TRAINING.

THERE'S ALSO A FEAR FACTOR HERE.

NOW, IT SHOWS A POLICE OFFICER ACTING IN A VERY AGGRESSIVE WAY TOWARDS ONE OF OUR MILITARY VETERANS.

THERE IS NO REASON FOR THAT BEHAVIOR.

THERE IS NOTHING THREATENING ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON THERE.

BUT IT ALSO TELLS ME THAT THE TRAINING THAT THESE OFFICERS ARE RECEIVING IN ADDITION TO THE POLICIES NOT BEING THERE, THE TRAINING IS TO BE AGGRESSIVE AND NOT TO DE-ESCALATE, AND IT ALSO TELLS ME THAT POLICE MANAGEMENT IS NOT STRONG IN THAT PARTICULAR DEPARTMENT.

SO, FOR EXAMPLE, IF AN OFFICER ACTED THIS AGGRESSIVELY WITH MOST MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY, PARTICULARLY WHITE MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY, THAT OFFICER WOULD BE PLACED ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE.

THAT OFFICER WOULD BE SUSPENDED.

THAT OFFICER WOULD FACE DEPARTMENTAL CHARGES.

AND THERE SEEMS TO BE A DIFFERENT KIND OF TREATMENT IN SOME COMMUNITIES WHEN IT COMES TO AFRICAN-AMERICANS.

AT SOME POINT, KIDS GO FROM BEING CUTE KIDS TO BEING A THREAT TO LAW ENFORCEMENT, AND IT'S UNCLEAR TO MANY OF THESE DEPARTMENTS HOW THAT TRANSFORMATION TAKES PLACE, AND I SUBMIT IT'S BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE MODERN POLICIES.

THEY DON'T HAVE MODERN TRAINING.

THEY DON'T HAVE CONSCIENTIOUS SUPERVISORS AND THEY DON'T HAVE GOOD DATA SYSTEMS THAT CAN BEGIN TO TRACK OFFICERS WHO ARE ENGAGING IN THIS BEHAVIOR.

AND THEY PROBABLY DON'T HAVE TECHNOLOGY SUCH AS BODY CAMERAS AND CAR CAMERAS THAT CAN REALLY PUT THE SPOTLIGHT ON WHAT ACTUALLY AN OFFICER DID ON A PARTICULAR OCCASION.

>> WE HEAR ABOUT, YOU KNOW, DEFUND THE POLICE, AND THAT'S A DISCUSSION, I GUESS, MORE ABOUT TERMINOLOGY THAN ANYTHING, BUT IS IT TIME TO REIMAGINE WHAT POLICE DO?

I MEAN, DO POLICE NEED TO GO TO BE CALLED TO ROUST EVERY HOMELESS PERSON WHO IS ON SOMEBODY'S STOOP THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO SEE?

OR DO THEY HAVE TO INTERVENE IN EVERY TRAFFIC STOP?

I MEAN, IS IT TIME TO REIMAGINE THE POLICEWORK?

>> WELL, IT'S A VERY GOOD QUESTION.

AND I AGREE WITH YOU, DEFUND THE POLICE, I DON'T LIKE THE TERMINOLOGY.

I DON'T THINK IT CAPTURES WHAT MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC ARE TRYING TO ACHIEVE.

I THINK WHAT WE HAVE TO BEGIN TO DO IS DESCRIBE WHAT SERVICES WE WANT POLICE TO DELIVER TO THE COMMUNITY, AND THAT SHOULD BE A CONVERSATION WITH THE COMMUNITY ABOUT WHAT SERVICES ARE THE MOST ESSENTIAL.

SECONDLY, IF WE'RE GOING TO SHIFT SERVICES TO OTHER AGENCIES, HERE'S WHAT WE NEED.

WE HAVE TO BE SURE THESE AGENCIES ARE OPEN 24 HOURS A DAY, 7 DAYS A WEEK, LIKE THE POLICE, LIKE THE FIRE, LIKE THE EMERGENCY MEDICAL TECHNICIANS.

WE ALSO HAVE TO BE SURE THAT THOSE AGENCIES HAVE TRAINING SO THAT THEY CAN DEAL WITH IT.

SO IF YOU WANT AGENCIES TO DO WELLNESS CHECKS ON THE ELDERLY, THAT'S FINE.

OTHER AGENCIES CAN DO THAT.

IF YOU WANT AGENCIES, SOMETHING OTHER THAN THE POLICE, TO DEAL WITH TRAFFIC STOPS, THAT'S FINE.

YOU HAVE TO JUST IMAGINE, OKAY, SO, WHAT HAPPENS IF THAT TRAFFIC STOP YIELDS SOMEBODY WHO IS HEAVILY ARMED AND THEY'RE ABOUT TO GO DO SOMETHING IN THAT CITY THAT WE DON'T WANT DONE, LIKE PLACE BOMBS OR ENGAGE IN A SHOOTOUT WITH SOMEONE?

SO, YOU -- YOU HAVE TO DETERMINE WHAT ARE THE SERVICES WE WANT THE POLICE TO DELIVER VERSUS OTHER AGENCIES, AND THEN SECONDLY, HOW DO WE CRAFT THOSE SERVICES?

NOW, THE SECOND THING WE HAVE TO DO IS WE HAVE TO BEGIN TO THINK ABOUT HOW WE ON-BOARD POLICE.

WHOM DO WE WANT TO SERVE AS POLICE OFFICERS?

THIS IS NOT A JOB FOR EVERYONE.

YOU KNOW, YOU NEED TO BE PATIENT.

YOU NEED TO BE SMART.

FRANKLY, IF I HAD MY DRUTHERS, YOU COULDN'T BE A POLICE OFFICER IN ANY TOWN WITHOUT TWO YEARS OF COLLEGE.

I WOULDN'T SAY FOUR YEARS OF COLLEGE BECAUSE A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE ECONOMICALLY CHALLENGED AND CAN'T GET THROUGH FOUR YEARS OF COLLEGE, BUT TWO YEARS OF COLLEGE, I WOULD PUT YOU ON A PROBATIONARY TERM FOR THREE YEARS SO THAT YOU CAN'T HAVE TENURE.

YOU CAN'T BE A PROTECTED OFFICER UNTIL AFTER YOU'VE COMPLETED THE JOB FOR THREE YEARS.

THIS IS THE -- THIS IS REALLY TOUGH WORK.

AND WE HAVE TO BE SURE YOU'RE EMOTIONALLY STABLE.

WE HAVE TO SEE EVIDENCE THAT YOU CARE ABOUT ALL THE PEOPLE IN THIS CITY, NOT JUST CERTAIN COMMUNITIES.

AND WE HAVE TO BE SURE THAT YOU'RE SMART, BECAUSE THIS IS A JOB THAT REQUIRES BRAINS, NOT JUST BRAWN, SO IT'S NOT ENOUGH THAT YOU WERE A GREAT FOOTBALL PLAYER.

IT'S NOT ENOUGH THAT YOUR UNCLE OR YOUR DAD SERVED AS A POLICE OFFICER.

WE HAVE TO FIND OUT WHAT YOUR PSYCHOLOGICAL MAKE-UP IS, WHAT YOUR CAPABILITIES ARE, AND HOW MUCH OF A STUDENT OF THE CRAFT OF POLICING YOU ARE.

BECAUSE THIS IS A JOB ABOUT SERVICE.

IT'S SERVICE TO THE COMMUNITY.

TO PROTECT AND TO SERVE.

>> YOU ARE THE FEDERAL MONITOR IN NEWARK.

CAN YOU TELL US WHAT THE SITUATION IS THERE?

WHAT IS THE STATUS OF YOUR TENURE THERE, AND HOW IS THE DEPARTMENT DOING ON REFORMS?

>> THE SHORT ANSWER IS, THE DEPARTMENT IS DOING QUITE WELL, MAKING TREMENDOUS PROGRESS, BECAUSE THE DEPARTMENT WANTS TO.

THE DEPARTMENT HAS DECIDED IT WANTS TO DELIVER POLICING SERVICES DIFFERENTLY, SO IT IS ENGAGING IN COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT, PRECINCT BY PRECINCT, BY TALKING TO THE PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY TO FIND OUT WHAT ARE THE SERVICES THE COMMUNITY WANTS?

IT'S ALSO STUDYING ITS USE OF FORCE POLICY, REWRITTEN IT.

IT'S STUDIED ITS COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT POLICY.

IT HAS ADOPTED ONE.

IT HAS AN ANTI-BIAS POLICY.

IT HAS A FIRST AMENDMENT POLICY THAT TALKS ABOUT WHAT OFFICERS CAN AND CANNOT DO WHEN PEOPLE ARE RECORDING THEIR ACTIVITIES.

IT HAS AN LGBTQI POLICY WHICH WAS NOT REQUIRED BY THE CONSENT DECREE.

NEITHER WAS THE FIRST AMENDMENT POLICY REQUIRED BY THE CONSENT DECREE.

AND THE BEST EVIDENCE OF HOW MUCH BETTER NEWARK IS, IS AFTER THE GEORGE FLOYD KILLING, THERE WAS NO VIOLENCE IN NEWARK.

POLICE OFFICERS MARCHED INDEED WITH COMMUNITY MEMBERS, AND THEY STOPPED PEOPLE -- COMMUNITY MEMBERS STOPPED PEOPLE FROM ENGAGING IN VIOLENCE.

IF YOU NOTICE IN 2020, THERE WERE NO POLICE SHOOTINGS OF CIVILIANS.

AND PART OF THAT COMES ABOUT AS A PART OF A PROCESS IN WHICH YOU TALK TO THE COMMUNITY, YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS, YOU HAVE A CONSISTENT CONVERSATION WITH THE COMMUNITY.

THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE CIRCUMSTANCES WHERE PEOPLE BREAK THE LAW AND IT ESCALATES.

BUT YOUR DEFAULT IS DE-ESCALATION.

YOUR FIRST MOVE IS NOT FOR THE GUN TO STICK IT IN SOMEBODY'S FACE, STANDING AT THE READY TO USE IT.

IT IS TO USE A SERIES OF TOOLS TO DE-ESCALATE THE SITUATION, AND NEWARK HAS HAD SITUATIONS WHERE THEY HAVE RESOLVED HOSTAGE SITUATIONS WITH HEAVILY ARMED PERSONS WITH NO VIOLENCE.

AND THAT IS THE WAY IT CAN BE DONE AROUND THE COUNTRY.

BUT YOU HAVE TO BE SURE YOU HAVE THE POLICIES IN PLACE, THE TRAINING IN PLACE, AND THE SUPERVISION IN PLACE TO MAKE SURE OFFICERS KNOW, WE ARE NOT GOING TO TOLERATE THAT IN THIS ORGANIZATION.

>> ALL RIGHT.

FRUSTRATINGLY FAR TO GO.

FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL PETER HARVEY, GOOD TO SEE YOU, GENERAL.

THANKS FOR TAKING A FEW MINUTES WITH US.

>> THANK YOU, DAVID.

STAY WELL.

>> THANK YOU.

ALL RIGHT, LET'S BRING OUR PANEL IN HERE.

COLLEEN O'DAY IS SENIOR WRITER FOR NJ SPOTLIGHT NEWS.

MATT ARCO IS THE POLITICS REPORTER FOR NJ ADVANCE MEDIA.

AND JOE HERNANDEZ IS NEW JERSEY REPORTER FOR WHYY AND WBGO.

PANEL, GOOD MORNING.

WELCOME.

LET'S PICK UP WHERE WE LEFT OFF WITH PETER HARVEY, THE KIND OF ENCOUNTERS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ARE NOT UNIQUE TO ILLINOIS, MINNESOTA, OR VIRGINIA.

WE HAVE OUR SHARE HERE IN NEW JERSEY.

COLLEEN, THE ATTORNEY GENERAL TALKED ABOUT THIS IN FRONT OF THE BUDGET COMMITTEE THIS WEEK.

YOU HAD A PIECE ON THAT.

TELL US WHAT HE SAID.

>> HE WAS ASKED ABOUT WHAT KIND OF POLICIES WE HAVE IN PLACE, VERY SPECIFICALLY, BECAUSE OF ALL THESE INCIDENTS AND YOU KNOW, WHAT HE TALKED ABOUT SOUNDS LIKE, YOU KNOW, PRETTY GOOD BUNCH OF SOLUTIONS HERE.

WE HAVE A NEW USE IN FORCE POLICY THAT SAYS FORCE CAN ONLY BE USED AS A VERY LAST RESORT AND ONLY AFTER YOU HAVE ATTEMPTED DE-ESCALATION.

WE ALSO HAVE A NEW TRAINING THAT IS UNDERGOING, HOPEFULLY EVERY OFFICER IN NEW JERSEY WILL BE TRAINED BY THE END OF THE YEAR, IT'S TWO-PART TRAINING.

ONE IS, IN FACT, ON DE-ESCALATION AND HOW TO DO THAT.

AND THE OTHER PART IS ON ACTIVE BYSTANDERSHIP IS WHAT IT'S CALLED AND IT ESSENTIALLY IS GOING TO TRY TO TRAIN OFFICERS TO STOP ANOTHER OFFICER IF THEY ARE GOING OVERBOARD ON USE OF FORCE.

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL SPECIFICALLY SAID, WE DON'T WANT WHAT HAPPENED IN MINNESOTA WHERE, YOU KNOW, THREE OFFICERS STOOD BY AND WATCHED A FOURTH OFFICER KILL A MAN.

WE DON'T WANT THAT TO HAPPEN HERE SO WE'VE GOT THAT GOING ON.

AND NOW WE HAVE THE USE OF FORCE DATABASE THAT IS -- WAS BROUGHT ONLINE RECENTLY EARLIER THIS MONTH WHERE PEOPLE CAN ACTUALLY LOOK AND SEE HOW OFFICERS, HOW HAVE DEPARTMENTS FARED IN THIS MANNER IN TERMS OF USING TOO MUCH FORCE?

>> AND SO, ON THE VERY SAME DAY THAT THE GOVERNOR ANNOUNCES MORE GUN REGULATIONS HERE, ANOTHER MASS SHOOTING, THIS UP WITH IN INDIANAPOLIS.

NEW JERSEY DOESN'T SEE A LOT OF THIS, THANKFULLY, BUT IN PLACES LIKE PATTERSON AND TRENTON, GUN VIOLENCE WAS ACTUALLY UP STATISTICALLY IN 2020.

MATT, SOME OF THESE REFORMS FROM THE GOVERNOR HAVE BEEN IN THE LEGISLATURE BEFORE, RIGHT?

>> YEAH.

I MEAN, ONE THAT JUMPS OUT IS THE GOVERNOR WANTS TO BAN THE SALE OF.50 CALIBER WEAPONS.

IF YOU REMEMBER GOING BACK A FEW YE YEARS, THAT'S SOMETHING CHRIS CHRISTIE GOT BEHIND BEFORE HE VETOED A BILL THAT WOULD HAVE DONE THAT WHEN HE WAS GOVERNOR AND THEN THERE'S OTHER PIECES OF LEGISLATION ABOUT MANDATORY -- MAKING MANDATORY SAFETY CLASSES A THING, STAMPING AMMUNITION SO THEY CAN BETTER TRACK, YOU KNOW, SHOOTINGS, AND THEN ALSO RAISING THE AGE TO PURCHASE A WEAPON FROM 18 TO 21.

YOU KNOW, ONE QUICK THING THAT I JUST WANTED TO CIRCLE BACK ON WITH THAT USE OF FORCE REPORT THAT IS HAPPENING IN NEW JERSEY, I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY OTHER STATE THAT HAS SUCH A DATABASE LIKE WE HAVE HERE IN NEW JERSEY, AND ONE IMPORTANT THING ABOUT THAT, THAT THE GENERAL SPOKE ABOUT, IS POLICE ACCOUNTABILITY AND YOU KNOW, NOT ONLY CAN I LOOK UP AND SEE WHAT THE -- HOW MANY COPS IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD -- HOW MANY TIMES THERE WAS THAT USE OF FORCE, BUT CHIEFS, POLICE CHIEFS CAN LOOK AT THIS INFORMATION AND SAY, HEY, YOU KNOW, WE MIGHT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THIS PERSON, AND BECAUSE OF QUALIFIED IMMUNITY, POLICE OFFICERS AREN'T HELD CIVILLY ACCOUNTABLE FOR ANY ACTIONS.

IT'S TOWNS AS THE GENERAL POINTED OUT AND THE POLICE CHIEF MAY WANT TO LOOK AT A PARTICULAR OFFICER AND SAY, HEY, THAT'S A LITTLE BIT TOO MUCH AND MAYBE THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE CAN ADDRESS.

SO, THAT WAS JUST AN INTERESTING THING THAT THE GENERAL MENTIONED THAT I THOUGHT WAS WORTH BRINGING UP.

>> YEAH.

>> AND ACTUALLY, THE ATTORNEY GENERAL ALSO SAID THAT SUPERVISORS ARE REQUIRED TO LOOK AT THESE THINGS, AND DOCUMENTS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE LOOKING AT THEM.

SO, JUST AS MATT SAID, IT SHOULD BE USED AS A WAY TO GAUGE YOUR DEPARTMENT.

>> AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, AS THE GENERAL SAID, THESE CIVILIANS CONTROL THE PURSE STRINGS, SO MAYBE THAT'S A WAY TO GET SOME REFORMS BY MOVING SOME BUDGET DOLLARS AROUND.

SO, ALL RIGHT, LET'S GET OFF GUNS, PLEASE, AND MOVE ON TO CANNABIS.

IT WAS A BIG DEAL EARLY THIS WEEK WHEN THE CANNABIS REGULATORY COMMISSION FINALLY HELD ITS FIRST MEETING.

JOE, FOR SUCH A LONG-AWAITED EVENT, IT WAS PRETTY ANTICLIMACTIC, BUT IT STARTED THE JOINT ROLLING, NO?

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

IT DID START THE JOINT ROLLING.

IT WAS REMOTE, LIKE ALL MEETINGS ARE, MOSTLY, THESE DAYS, BUT THE FIVE COMMISSIONERS SPOKE.

THEY APPROVED A NEW LOGO FOR THE CANNABIS COMMISSION, WHICH DOES NOT HAVE A POT LEAF ON IT BUT IS BLUE AND YELLOW AND HAS THE WORDS, I THINK, EQUITY AND SAFETY.

BUT THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE CANNABIS COMMISSION, JEFF BROWN, ALSO SPOKE A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE PROGRESS THAT THE STATE IS MAKING IN SETTING UP THE NEW MARKET AND HE DID NOTE TWO THINGS.

ONE WAS THESE MUNICIPAL BANS THAT ARE OCCURRING, SO CITIES AND TOWNS ARE PASSING THESE PROHIBITIONS ON THE SALE OF CANNABIS AND SAYING, WE DON'T WANT THAT HERE AND HE WAS SORT OF ASKING THOSE TOWNS TO RECONSIDER AND WAIT UNTIL THE REGULATIONS WERE IN PLACE TO DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT TO BAN THE DRUG.

AND THEN THE OTHER THING WAS THAT OFFICIALS HAD BEEN SAYING THAT THE MARKET COULD GET UP AND RUNNING A LITTLE BIT MORE QUICKLY IF THE CURRENT MEDICAL MARIJUANA INDUSTRY GOT IN ON THE RECREATIONAL SIDE OF THINGS, BUT HE WAS SAYING SOME OF THOSE BUSINESSES ARE MOVING FASTER THAN OTHERS, AND THAT COULD IMPACT HOW QUICKLY PEOPLE ARE ABLE TO WALK INTO A DISPENSARY AND BUY THE DRUG FOR PERSONAL USE.

>> ALL RIGHT, SO, THEY'RE GOING TO BE MEETING ONCE A MONTH AND LICENSING AND ALL KIND OF RULES ARE COMING UP IN THE MONTHS AHEAD.

BAD WEEK FOR JOHNSON & JOHNSON.

THE CDC AND THE FDA CALLED FOR A PAUSE ON THE J&J JABS, WHICH WAS PART OF THE STRATEGY TO GET MORE PEOPLE INOCULATED.

MATT, YOU'RE FORCED TO SIT THROUGH THE GOVERNOR'S BRIEFINGS.

WHAT'S HE SAYING ABOUT THIS AND WHAT'S GOING TO BE THE IMPACT OF THIS PAUSE?

>> LOOK, WE'RE GOING TO FIND OUT.

WHAT THE GOVERNOR'S BEEN SAYING IS THAT HE'S STILL CONFIDENT THAT BY THE END OF JUNE, HE'LL MEET HIS EARLIER GOAL OF VACCINATING 70% OF ELIGIBLE ADULTS, THAT'S SOME 4.7 MILLION PEOPLE.

HE STILL THINKS THAT WITH THE AMOUNT OR THE INCREASED AMOUNT OF PFIZER AND MODERNA THAT'S BEEN RAMPING UP OVER THE PAST COUPLE OF WEEKS AND WHAT WILL COME INTO THE STATE FROM THE FEDS THAT HE COULD STILL MEET THAT BENCHMARK.

WHAT WILL BE REALLY INTERESTING TO SEE IS THAT DWBEGINNING ON MONDAY, ESSENTIALLY EVERYBODY IN THE STATE IS ELIGIBLE, EVERYBODY 16 AND OLDER IS ELIGIBLE TO MAKE AN APPOINTMENT AND GET THE VACCINE.

AND I WOULD SAY THAT ANECDOTALLY, WHAT I HAVE BEEN SEEING THIS PAST WEEK, WEEK AND A HALF, IS WE HAVE SOME MEGA SITES THAT HAVE BASICALLY PUT OUT PRESS RELEASES SAYING, HEY, FOLKS, WE HAVE VACCINES, WE HAVE AVAILABILITY.

PLEASE COME AND GET THEM.

IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE IF MONDAY, WHEN ELIGIBILITY IS FOR THE ENTIRE STATE, WHETHER PEOPLE SNAP UP THOSE APPOINTMENTS AND THERE'S A RUSH TO GET THESE VACCINES OR IN, YOU KNOW, TWO WEEKS, WE MIGHT KNOW WHETHER OR NOT WE'VE SORT OF HIT THIS KIND OF LULL WHERE THAT SUPPLY-DEMAND IMBALANCE IS IN -- ISN'T AS MUCH OUT OF BALANCE AS IT HAS BEEN FOR MONTHS.

>> I KEEP HEARING ABOUT THESE MEGA SITES AND THE FACT THAT, U.N., THE SITE IS MEGA, BUT THE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY ARE SHOWING UP THERE, NOT SO MUCH.

IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE HEARING, ANECDOTALLY?

>> YES AND NO.

ALSO BY VIRTUE OF THE FACT THAT SO MANY OF THESE SITES ARE PUTTING OUT PRESS RELEASES, ADVERTISING WHAT THEY HAVE.

I'VE BEEN LOGGING ON TO SITES PERIODICALLY, JUST TO SEE WHAT THEIR AVAILABILITY IS, AND IT'S WIDE OPEN AND IT'S NOT LIKE, YOU KNOW, WIDE OPEN FOR, YOU CAN GET YOUR SHOT IN TWO WEEKS.

IT'S, COME IN LATER TODAY OR TOMORROW.

>> YEAH.

COLLEEN, THESE COVID BRIEFINGS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE INFORMATIVE.

I KNOW YOU GET A CHANCE TO GO TO SOME OF THOSE.

BUT MOST OF THE INFO COULD BE RELEASED IN A WEB POST.

I GUESS THERE'S SOME BENEFIT TO THE OFF-TOPIC QUESTIONS, BUT IS THE ADMINISTRATION GETTING ANY BETTER AT THE TRANSPARENCY SIDE OF THINGS?

>> IT DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT COVID, IN GENERAL, CERTAINLY THESE BRIEFINGS HAVE BEEN REALLY HELPFUL FOR NOT ONLY REPORTERS BUT ALSO FOR THE PUBLIC BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF PEOPLE, THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE ARE STILL TUNING IN TO WATCH ON YOUTUBE AS THEY'RE HAPPENING.

AND YEAH, I MEAN, IT'S GREAT FOR US, YOU KNOW, THIS IS A GOVERNOR WHO STARTED OFF REALLY NOT HAVING PRESS BRIEFINGS.

WE HAD GOTTEN USED TO CHRIS CHRISTIE, WHO WOULD KIND OF GET UP EVERY SO OFTEN AND HAVE SOMETIMES VERY LENGTHY BRIEFINGS, MAYBE A LITTLE BIT LONGER THAN WE WOULD HAVE EVEN WANTED, BUT YOU KNOW, IT CAN BE HARD.

IT CAN BE -- BEFORE THESE COVID BRIEFINGS, IT COULD BE REALLY HARD TO GET THE GOVERNOR TO SPEAK ABOUT THINGS.

YOU'D GET MAYBE THREE QUESTIONS DURING, YOU KNOW, ANY KIND OF A -- AN ACTION THAT HE DID.

IN TERMS OF OTHER TRANSPARENCY, HOWEVER, I MEAN, EVERY NEWS OUTLET, I THINK, IS STRUGGLING WITH TRYING TO GET PUBLIC RECORDS REQUESTS FULFILLED.

I KNOW THAT WE ARE.

I'VE GOT SOME THAT ARE DATING BACK TO SEPTEMBER.

AND I CAN'T GET ANY KIND OF ANSWER AT ALL.

AND THAT'S JUST -- I MEAN, I THINK IT'S UNACCEPTABLE.

>> YEAH.

ALL RIGHT.

POLITICS NOW.

MURPHY ELIMINATED HIS PRIMARY COMPETITION AND I USED COMPETITION GENEROUSLY, BUT ISN'T HE KIND OF PUNCHING DOWN, JOE?

I MEAN, LISA McCORMICK'S NOT GOING TO HURT ANYBODY.

>> WELL, I GUESS WE HAVE TO THINK BACK TO THE RE-ELECTION CAMPAIGN OF SENATOR BOB MENENDEZ WHEN SHE GOT A DECENT CHUNK OF THE VOTE, ALTHOUGH I THINK MATT FRIEDMAN WROTE IN THE POLITICO NEWSLETTER THOSE MAY HAVE BEEN PROTEST VOTES AGAINST MENENDEZ, WHO HAD JUST WRAPPED UP HIS CORRUPTION TRIAL THAT ENDED IN A MISTRIAL.

BUT I THINK THE POINT YOU MAKE IS FAIR.

MURPHY IS MUCH MORE WELL FUNDED.

HE'S GOT THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY BEHIND HIM.

AND NOW HE, YOU KNOW, WILL HAVE NO COMPETITION IN THE PRIMARY ELECTION.

>> SPEAKING OF COMPETITION, MATT, IS JACK CIATTARELLI GOING TO SEE ANY COMPETITION FROM PASTOR RIZZO?

>> ABOUT LISA McCORMICK, WHAT HER CAMPAIGN IS ACCUSED OF DOING IS WAY OVER THE TOP, AND I WOULD NOT GIVE TEAM MURPHY ANY CRITICISM FOR PUNCHING DOWN, BECAUSE WHAT SHE DID OR IS ACCUSED OF DOING IS JUST ABSURD.

NOW, HAVING SAID THAT IN THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY, YEAH, IT'S ACTUALLY GOING TO BE INTERESTING.

THERE'S BEEN A CHARACTER THAT'S RUN FOUR FAILED CAMPAIGNS, BUT NOW HE'S MADE THE PRIMARY.

SO, JACK CIATTARELLI REALLY HAS TO HAVE TWO DEBATES, EXCUSE ME, HE DIDN'T MAKE THE PRIMARY.

HE BECAME ELIGIBLE FOR THE DEBATES.

SO NOW JACK HAS TO HAVE TWO DEBATES WITH HIM.

THAT'S SOMETHING THAT HE OBVIOUSLY DIDN'T WANT TO DO BECAUSE HIS CAMPAIGN IS RIGHT NOW ALREADY GEARED TOWARDS ATTACKING MURPHY.

BUT THERE'S THIS THIRD CHALLENGER WHO'S BEEN ALSO ABLE TO RAISE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS, AND THAT'S GOING TO FURTHER COMPLICATE IT.

SO, FOR JACK, WHO'S COMING IN AS THE WAY UNDERDOG IN THIS RACE, YOU KNOW, FOR HIM TO HAVE TO NOW FOCUS AGAINST TWO OTHER REPUBLICANS, YOU KNOW, THAT'S JUST REALLY GOING TO TAKE AWAY A LOT.

>> ALL RIGHT, SO, MAYBE THERE WILL BE SOME FUN THIS PRIMARY SEASON.

THAT IS "ROUNDTABLE" FOR TODAY.

THANKS TO OUR GUEST, PETER HARVEY AND TO OUR PANEL, GOOD TO SEE YOU ALL.

YOU CAN FOLLOW ME ON TWITTER AT @DAVIDCRUZNJ AND BE SURE TO SUBSCRIBE TO THE YOUTUBE CHANNEL FOR MORE GREAT CONTENT, INCLUDING "CHAT BOX," AND NJ SPOTLIGHT NEWS.

FOR THE ENTIRE CREW OVER HERE, I'M DAVID CRUZ.

THANKS FOR WATCHING.

WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

>> Announcer: MAJOR FUNDING FOR "REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE" WITH DAVID CRUZ IS PROVIDED BY NEW JERSEY REALTORS, THE VOICE FOR REAL ESTATE IN NEW JERSEY.

MORE INFORMATION IS ONLINE AT NJREALTOR.COM.

RWJBARNABAS HEALTH.

LET'S BE HEALTHY TOGETHER.

AND BY NJM INSURANCE GROUP, SERVING THE INSURANCE NEEDS OF NEW JERSEY RESIDENTS AND BUSINESSES FOR MORE THAN 100 YEARS.

PROMOTIONAL SUPPORT IS PROVIDED BY "NEW JERSEY BUSINESS MAGAZINE," THE MAGAZINE OF THE NEW JERSEY BUSINESS AND INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION, REPORTING TO EXECUTIVE AND LEGISLATIVE LEADERS IN ALL 21 COUNTIES OF THE GARDEN STATE SINCE 1954.

♪