>> Cathy: AS WE'VE VOTED NOTE THE THROUGHOUT THE SHOW TONIGHT IT'S BEEN A BUSY WEEK AT THE CAPITOL.

DEMOCRATS UP FIRST, ABU AMARA, FORMER LEGISLATIVE STAFFER AND RENOWNED FOREIGN.

JEFF HAYDEN IS FORMER STATE SENATOR.

AMY KOCH AND ROUNDING OUT THE GROUP TONIGHT WE WELCOME KALEY TAIF, LOBBYIST REPUBLICAN ACTIVIST AND FORMER LEGISLATIVE STAFFER.

KAYLIE, WELCOME, NICE TO HAVE YOU HERE.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> Cathy: SENATOR HAYDEN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE SHOULD TALK ABOUT HERE TONIGHT.

[ LAUGHTER ] SENATOR MURPHY DID SAY HAT HUMAN BEINGS MAKE MISTAKES.

GOVERNOR SAYS ELECTED FFICIALS SHOULD ADHERE TO A HIGHER STANDARD THAN MOST FOLKS BUT WHAT DOES THAT MEAN NOWADAYS?

>> WELL, I THINK THAT -- I THINK THAT THEY'RE DEEPLY TRYING TO FIGURE THAT OUT.

YOU KNOW, I WAS THINKING ABOUT SENATOR MITCHELL AND WHAT SHE HAS TO GO THROUGH, SHE HAS TO GO THROUGH HER DUE PROCESS AND FIGURE IT OUT.

BUT WE ALSO HAVE A FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES IN THE PRESUMPTIVE REPUBLICAN NOMINEE THAT'S SPENDING A LOT OF TIME IN COURT AS WELL.

SO I THINK WE ARE REDEFINING WHAT THAT MEANS FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE.

>> SENATOR MITCHELL, SENATOR KOCH, HAVE TO GO?

>> SO I'M ONE THAT HAS GONE THROUGH A LOT, RIGHT, IN MY PERSONAL LIFE WAS DRAGGED OUT IN FRONT OF EVERYONE.

AND SO I'M SENSITIVE TO THAT.

AND AT THE SAME TIME MY MOTHER DIED OF BREAST CANCER AND MY FATHER STARTED A TEN-YEAR FIGHT WITH ALZHEIMER'S.

SO WE WOULD -- SO SENATOR MITCHELL WOULD HAVE US BELIEVE THAT THIS IS A FAMILY TRAGEDY OR, AND SHE WAS JUST COLLECTING SOME MEMENTOS OR IT WAS A CONFUSED RELATIVE.

BUT THE FACTS OF THE CASE THAT WE KNOW FROM HE POLICE REPORT ARE THAT SHE PUT ON BLACK, SHE CLIMBED THROUGH A WINDOW, SHE STOLE LAPTOPS THAT SHE HAD PUT IN HER BACKPACK AND LIED ABOUT THEM.

SHE HAD A FLASHLIGHT COVERED IN A SOCK.

WE KNOW FROM THE 911 CALL THAT HER STEPMOTHER TRIPPED OVER HER BECAUSE SHE WAS LYING BESIDE HER BED.

I AN'T IMAGINE THE TERROR SHE MUST HAVE FELT.

AND SO WHILE SHE WOULD US BELIEVE THAT SHE'S SORT OF A VICTIM IN THIS, THERE ARE VICTIMS IN THIS, CAROL MITCHELL'S A VICTIM, HER CHILDREN ARE VICTIMS, FRANKLY, THE DETROIT LAKES P.D.

ARE VICTIMS BECAUSE EVERY STATEMENT SHE'S PUT OUT SINCE THEN HAS HAD US BELIEVE THAT THEY ARE NOT TELLING THE TRUTH IN THE REPORT OR THEY WERE JUST SO INCOMPETENT THAT THEY DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THEY HAD A WOMAN THAT WAS CONFUSED AND THEY HAULED HER OFF TO JAIL ERRONEOUSLY AND I THINK SHE HAS TO ANSWER QUESTIONS FOR THAT AND I THINK MOST MINNESOTANS THINK SHE NEEDS O ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS.

>> Eric: YOU THINK SHE SHOULD RESIGN?

>> I THINK IF I WERE HER, I WOULD.

BY THE WAY, WHEN MY STUFF WENT DOWN I STEPPED DOWN BECAUSE SOMETIMES YOU'RE JUST NOT EQUIPPED TO HANDLE THINGS.

>> ABU.

>> LOOK, I THINK IT'S A QUESTION OF WHEN RATHER THAN IF.

YOU KNOW, LOOK, SHE'S HOLDING A PRESTIGIOUS POSITION IN OUR GOVERNMENT AND SO YOU'RE GOING TO BE HELD TO THE HIGHEST STANDARDS AND I THINK WE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT.

I ALSO THINK WE HAVE TO PAY ATTENTION TO THE FACT THAT THE PEOPLE OF WOODBURY DESERVE TO HAVE REPRESENTATION TOWARDS THE END OF LEGISLATIVE SESSION.

HOW DO WE BALANCE THESE TWO THINGS?

IS MAKING SURE A PERSON IS ACCOUNTABLE AND MAKING SURE WOODBURY HAS REPRESENTATION.

I THINK IT HAPPENS IN THE SUMMER OR EARLY FALL.

>> I'LL HAPPY TO SEE THEY HAD AN ETHICS HEARING COMING UP WITHIN THOSE 30 DAYS.

BUT IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO - SEE IF SHE'S ALLOWED TO VOTE BECAUSE SHE IS A DECIDING FACTOR.

>> Eric: IS THERE ANY CHANCE -- >> LET'S BE CAREFUL HERE.

SHE CAN VOTE.

SHE'S STILL SITTING THERE, SHE'S A SENATOR, SHE CAN VOTE.

IS IT DISRUPTIVE OR NOT?

NO ONE CAN ALLOW OR NOT ALLOW HER -- >> I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT IS THERE QUESTIONS OF JUDGMENT, RIGHT?

WE HAVE QUESTIONS OF CONTRADICTIONS WITH POLICE.

>> I HAVE QUESTIONS -- EVERY SINGLE DAY.

>> -- PUBLIC AFETY THAT WAS AFFECT ALL OF MINNESOTA.

>> Eric: HERE'S WHAT I WONDER.

>> BECAUSE SHE'S THE DECIDING VOTE.

>> Eric: KAY.

>> I THINK WE SHOULD TAKE A STEP BACK A LITTLE BIT.

THERE IS DUE PROCESS.

WE HAVE PERSONAL FEELINGS ABOUT IT, WE ALL HAVE BEEN THROUGH SOME THINGS AND CERTAINLY AMY AND I HAVE BEEN THROUGH SOME THINGS, SHE DOES HAVE A RIGHT TO GO THROUGH ALL THE ADJUDICATION PROCESSES THAT THERE ARE AND THERE'S ONE IN THE SENATE THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH.

>> Eric: SENATE'S NOT UP FOR REELECTION, HOUSE IS.

I WONDER IF SPEAKER HORTMAN IS THINKING THIS IS THE KIND OF STUFF CAN ONLY HURT US POLITICALLY, IF WE ADJOURN SINE DIE EARLY WE DON'T GIVE REPUBLICANS THIS PLATFORM TO BEAT S UP EVERY DAY, WOULD IT MAKE SENSE FOR HER TO ADJOURN THE SESSION MAYBE NEXT WEEK?

>> I DISAGREE, I DON'T THINK THE PEOPLE OF MINNESOTA ARE GOING TO GET CAUGHT UP IN THE SQUABBLE, THIS IS IMPORTANT AND IT HAS TO BE DEALT WITH BUT PEOPLE CARE MOST ABOUT WHAT ARE YOU DOING FOR THEM AND THAT'S WHAT THE DEMOCRATS WILL BE TALKING ABOUT AND WHEN THE SESSION IS OVER THERE WILL BE AMPLE TIME TO MAKE SURE SHE'S HELD ACCOUNTABLE.

>> Eric: IS THERE POLITICAL SLOP HELD OVER FOR 2024?

>> YEAH, I THINK A LOT OF THE NEW CANDIDATES ON THE HOUSE SIDE ARE FORMER POLICE OFFICERS SO THEY'LL BE ABLE TO SPEAK TO THAT AND WE'LL SEE THE PUBLIC REACTS.

>> I THINK OBVIOUSLY THERE'S POLITICAL -- EVERY YEAR SOMEBODY DOES SOMETHING, THEY VOTE A WRONG WAY, TALK ABOUT THINGS THEY SHOULDN'T, GET THEMSELVES IN TROUBLE, AND THEN YOU SEE THAT OUT IN THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL.

OFTEN YOU SEE THINGS ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL THAT AREN'T EVEN TRUE.

SO POLITICS ARE GOING TO BE POLITICS ON THIS ISSUE.

>> BUT THIS IS SO BEYOND THOSE EXTRAORDINARY THINGS ND WHAT I WOULD JUST SAY IS WE JUST HEARD FROM THE GOVERNOR THAT HIS TOP PRIORITIES ARE BONDING BILL AND FRANKLY WE TALKED ABOUT UBER LYFT, RIGHT?

BOTH OF THOSE FIXES ARE GOING TO REQUIRE REPUBLICAN VOTES NO MATTER WHAT.

SO I WOULD JUST SAY CUT A DEAL WITH THE REPUBLICANS, GET YOUR PRIORITIES, GET THINGS DONE FOR THE STATE OF MINNESOTA AND THEN -- >> THAT'S WHAT THEY DO ANYWAYS.

>> ANOTHER WAY, AMY, WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS.

>> I'M SAYING YOU COULD ESTILL GET WORK DONE AND STILL DEAL WITH THE QUESTIONS AND ETHICS INQUIRY AND STILL LIKE SERVE THE PEOPLE OF MINNESOTA BECAUSE I THINK THERE ARE SERIOUS QUESTIONS OF JUDGMENT.

EVERYBODY'S ACTING LIKE THIS IS JUST RUN OF THE MILL.

THIS STORY IS SHOCKING, THAT'S WHY MINNESOTANS ARE TALKING ABOUT IT.

>> Cathy: AND T'S SO FAR STOPPED LEGISLATION ON THE FLOOR.

>> COMPLETELY HELD UP THE MINNESOTA SENATE.

>> -- EVERYTHING IS FINE, THE FINANCE COMMITTEE MET, HOUSE MET, THEY ERE PASSING PAPER THERE TODAY.

THIS IS A LITTLE BIT OF HYPERBOLE HERE THAT I'M A LITTLE BIT SURPRISED HERE.

>> AMY'S POINT ESSENTIALLY IS THE PEOPLE OF MINNESOTA CAN'T GET WHAT THEY ARE ENTITLED TO FROM THE REPRESENTATIVES BECAUSE ONE STATE SENATOR MAYBE COMMITTED A CRIME.

>> THERE'S A ONE-VOTE MARGIN IN THE SENATE, FOLKS, YOU'RE PRETENDING LIKE THAT DOESN'T EXIST.

WE'RE PRETENDING HER JUDGMENT IS NOT IMPAIRED?

LIKE THIS IS A NORMAL THING?

I'M STATING THE POLICE FACTS.

>> I WAS GOING TO SAY I AGREE WITH AMY AND I THINK THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR DEMOCRATS TO SHOW THEY CAN WORK WITH REPUBLICANS ON SOME OF THESE KEY MAJOR ISSUES THE REST OF SESSION AND SHOW INNESOTANS -- >> MIND BLOWING YOU'RE CALLING FOR PEOPLE TO RESIGN WHEN YOUR NOMINEE FOR PRESIDENT HAS A CRIMINAL TRIAL AS WE SPEAK.

>> FOLKS.

>> EVERYBODY KNOWS WHERE I STAND WITH DONALD TRUMP ND I'VE NOT BEEN A FAN OF DONALD TRUMP.

I'M BEING CONSISTENT, OTHER FOLKS PERHAPS -- >> Eric: ET'S FLIP THE COIN.

SHANNON WATSON, MAJORITY IN THE MIDDLE PERSON WHO WANTS BIPARTISAN.

SHE RAISED THE ISSUE THIS WEEK THAT SENATORS MURPHY AND JOHNSON SIGN UP A LIST OF BILLS 33-33 OR 34-33 AND ACTUALLY WORK TOGETHER AND USE THIS AS COME TOGETHER MOMENT FOR THE GOOD OF MINNESOTA.

>> I MEAN, LISTEN, -- AND WE ALL KIND OF WISH THAT GOVERNMENT ACTUALLY WORKED THAT WAY BUT IT DOESN'T SO WE HAVE TO BE -- >> WE HAVE TO BE REALLY CLEAR THAT'S TO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

THE LEGISLATURE'S GOING TO MOVE FORWARD.

PEOPLE ARE GOING TO GO AFTER, QUESTION SENATOR MITCHELL, THEY'RE BRINGING UP EVERYBODY ELSE'S AST, THAT'S JUST THE WAY IN WHICH THIS WORKS.

THEY'LL GOD HO THROUGH THE PROCESS, IF THERE IS GOING TO BE POLITICAL FALLOUT WE'LL SEE IN THE FALL.

>> DO YOU THINK THERE'S GOING TO BEEA RECALL EFFORT AGAINST THE SENATOR?

>> THAT WILL HAVE TO COME FROM WOODBURY POTENTIALLY.

>> BUT EVEN IF THAT DOES THAT HAS TO BE CERTIFIED ULTIMATELY BY THE SUPREME COURT.

MECHANICALLY WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE TIMELINE HERE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT POST-SESSION ANYWAY AND PRACTICALLY IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER.

>> Eric: ROLE OF THE NEWS MEDIA, IF THE MEDIA PURSUES THIS HARD IS THAT DIFFERENT THAN IT IF IT KIND OF JUST ONLY REPORT WHEN AN EVENT HAPPENS?

WHAT'S THE ROLE OF A NEWS MEDIA HERE, IF ANY?

>> FIRST OF ALL, I MEAN, I THINK THIS IS A STORY THAT PEOPLE WANT TO HEAR ABOUT SO WHAT THAT DOES IS THAT MEANS CLICKS, THAT MEANS PEOPLE TUNE IN.

AND SO CERTAINLY THE MEDIA HAS A ROLE.

AND I THINK THAT THEY'RE LOOKING AT HER PUBLIC STATEMENTS, COMPARED TO WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT FROM THE POLICE AND FROM THE 911 TRANSCRIPT, I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF QUESTIONS TO BE ANSWERED HERE.

>> AND THAT'S WHAT THE MEDIA DOES IS THEY HELP US ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS.

THIS IDEA, AND I'M A LITTLE KIND OF TAKEN ABACK THAT IDEA THAT SOMEHOW WHEN THE COPS SAY SOMETHING, THAT'S IT.

THAT'S IT, THERE'S NO, WE HAVE DEFENSE ATTORNEY SITTING IN OUR MIDST HERE, THERE IS ANOTHER SIDE, THERE IS THE SCALES OF JUSTICE AND WE NEED TO GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS REGARDLESS TO WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE ON ITS FACE.

ONCE AGAIN WE HAVE A PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE, PRESUMPTIVE NOMINEE THAT'S GOING THROUGH A PROCESS THAT HE SAYS THAT THEY'RE OVERWHELMING SAYING HE DID A TON OF THINGS, HE'S SAYING E DIDN'T AND WE WATCH HIM GO THROUGH THE PROCESS.

>> JEFF, WE HAVE THE 911 TRANSCRIPT OF A MINNESOTA WOMAN WHO WAS REALLY TERRIFIED AND NO DOUBT SHE WOKE UP WITH SOMEONE BESIDE HER BED SHE TRIPPED HER AND INSTEAD OF COMFORTING HER STEPMODE BY SAYING, MOM, IT'S ME, IT'S ME, SHE RAN TO THE BASEMENT AND APPARENTLY TRIED TO CRAWL OUT THE WINDOW.

>> WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STORY IS.

IT CLEARLY IS TRIGGERING TO YOU, BUT WHEN THE OTHER PERSON GETS A CHANCE TO TELL THE STORY, WHEN I READ IS I REALLY, REALLY THINK ABOUT THIS AND WONDER WHAT WAS SENATOR MITCHELL DOING, I WANT TO HEAR WHAT SHE HAS TO SAY.

>> KAYLIE.

>> I WAS SAY THE DISCREPANCIES FROM WHAT SHE HAS SAID IN THE BEGINNING TO WHAT SHE HAS SAID NOW ARE VERY DIFFERENT.

AND I WOULD SAY IF IT IS WHAT SHE'S SAYING IS TRUE THAT SHE WAS ON THERE ON A WELFARE CHECK BECAUSE SHE'S GOT PARANOIA I CAN ASSURE YOU IF I HAD PARANOIA THE LEST WELFARE I WOULD WANT IS SOMEONE BREAKING INTO MY HOME DRESSED IN ALL BLACK LAYING NEXT TO MY BED AND RUNNING AWAY WITH WHEN I WAKE UP.

>> WE JUST DON'T CONVICT PEOPLE OR REMOVE THEM BASED ON ACCUSATIONS, WE HAVE A PROCESS TO TEST WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE AND ULTIMATELY GET TO THE TRUTH.

>> AND THE SENATE HAS A PROCESS AND THAT'S THE ETHICS COMMITTEE AND THEY ARE GOING THROUGH IT AND THAT'S GOOD.

SENATOR MITCHELL, HELP US