- Just ahead on "Black Issues Forum," from Biden's policies to a Trump resurgence and North Carolina's gubernatorial transition, we take a look at post-election developments, House and Senate majorities, and North Carolina leaders and what's on the horizon.

What will these political shifts mean for communities across the state?

And how will these changes impact our pockets?

We'll talk all about it coming up next.

Stay with us.

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[soft tense music] ♪ - Welcome to "Black Issues Forum."

I'm Kenia Thompson.

It's been weeks since the election results, but the shock waves are still being felt across the country.

Uncertainties around abortion, immigration, education, and so much more are sparking questions that many don't have clear answers to.

To help us explore some of those uncertainties, we invite our guests.

With us here today, we have the director of North Carolina Black Alliance, Marcus Bass, and next to him on the couch, we have political analyst and our show regular, Steve Rao.

Welcome to the show.

- Good morning.

Pleasure to be here.

- Of course.

So we're here, weeks later, and, you know, some people are still asking the question, how did we get here?

I wanna share this Google data research that's showing that November 5th, around 7:00 am, and then again on November 6th and 7th, people were Googling, "How do I change my vote?"

Right, we well know that we cannot change our votes after they've been submitted.

But this to me kind of raised a flag and asking the question, are people regretting their decisions in this past election?

Marcus, start with you.

- I think that's a perfect place to start.

First of all, I think a lot of people make decisions on impulse, right?

I think there's a lot of buying patterns and habits to show us the decisions that folks make.

And this election was such a high stake election.

The anxiety, the attention behind the candidates, the real questions around what was answered and what wasn't answered and how will my life be.

But I think there is some buyer's remorse.

Immediately after this election, we're seeing individuals calling for mass deportations.

We're seeing individuals scared about what further repeals and cuts to diversity, equity, and inclusion look like.

And I think we are seeing individuals that were toying between the ideology of what they thought they wanted and the horrors of what may actually be behind that.

And so, I don't think it is, by any fault at all, that folks are feeling a little apprehensive about their decisions because a lot of their decisions were made around pieces of social media content, quick messaging points, - Emotional pulls, yeah.

- emotional responses, and not really what's at stake and what will my prospects look like after I make this decision.

- Yeah, I see.

- Yeah, and I agree with Marcus.

I mean, elections have consequences.

We kept hearing that.

And I think people cast their vote out of emotion, and now, within just a week or two weeks from the election, we're seeing, you know, Robert F. Kennedy Jr., RFK being the secretary of Health and Human Services, and, you know, has been preaching conspiracy theories about vaccinations, which is never good.

That's not gonna be good for public health.

What if we have another pandemic?

Secretary of defense, you know, I think he has good experience serving the country, but never really run the Pentagon.

Matt Gaetz, the attorney general, who now can do whatever Trump wants.

And deportation, which is gonna cost $80 billion and it's gonna hurt our economy.

And we're gonna talk about the differences eventually, but, you know, I think the Trump policies of protectionism with tariffs, I think that could lead to inflationary, higher prices.

So this is all happening so fast and I think that people are really looking at, this is the presidency of the United States.

And the thing that bothers me as an American citizen is that I think the president should be representing all the people, even the people who didn't vote for you.

The campaign is over.

So I was actually hopeful when Trump met Biden and, you know, in the White House, that maybe they would come together and identify the things that we could work on.

But it's now the complete opposite.

They're basically just providing new positions to people that were loyal, and it's just a divided nation.

So he's representing the people that voted for him, but not the people that not voted for him.

And I think people are very scared out there and concerned as Americans.

- I'd agree.

I think a lot of people are also asking, what are the clear next steps?

What is this going to look like?

We know that the Biden administration have some unfinished business.

Are those things gonna be wrapped up before they step out of office?

And I mean, likely the answer is no.

And then what is that Trump takeover going to look like?

What are some of the differences between the two administrations?

- I think it's plain and simple, that this campaign and the results of the election was around what people don't like, what people don't want to see.

But governing is about what you do like, what you do want to see.

And I think there is a lot to be said around what wasn't discussed, around what we want our country to be, what wasn't discussed around what we want our education system to look like, what wasn't discussed around how we want government to help support the needs of everyday citizens.

I think there was a huge discussion around the differences being made and around where our country was going, or the wrong direction in some regards.

But what are the steps that we really need to go into the right direction?

And I think in a very real way, Republicans, individuals that voted for Donald Trump, have yet to answer that question.

Because I don't believe that they really thought that this election was gonna go in their favor in this degree.

I think that there could have been a conversation two or three weeks before similar to this where I think the outcome would've been completely different if folks would've realized how close the Republicans actually were to winning.

And so it's easy to run on this opposition campaign, but to actually govern and to have a campaign of governance is gonna be something different.

And we've seen what happens in a four years of a Trump administration.

It doesn't translate into the real wins that translate into keeping that power.

- And what's shocking, you know, to segue into what I was gonna say.

I mean, I think when you look at President Joe Biden, you know, up until his presidency, most federal investments were tax cuts, you know, Bush, Reagan.

And this was the largest investment in our country in infrastructure since the 1950s, roads and bridges, manufacturing, sustainability, clean energy.

Even in North Carolina, $41 billion of investment coming in, companies like Forge Battery in Morrisville, VinFast, Wolfspeed semiconductors, 280 billion from the CHIPS Act, creating jobs, getting unemployment down to 3 1/2%.

Inflation is lower than it's been in four years.

And let's not forget that President Biden, we had a half a million Americans dead from Covid.

He vaccinated hundreds of millions of Americans, $1.9 trillion Covid package.

So the economy was doing better.

What Trump 2 is gonna look like is, we already talked about it, deportation, which is gonna hurt the economy; isolationist foreign policy, unlike Joe Biden, where we're gonna support dictators like Putin, we're gonna pull money from Ukraine.

And at the end of the day, tariffs and protectionism, which will drive up costs for American consumers, possibly leading to more inflation.

- Are we saying that Americans just didn't realize that this is what a Republican vote meant?

- I think the problem, Kenia, is that the messaging might've been a little bit off for the Democrats.

I think rather than focusing on their game of the progress they've made in the economy, and I don't think Vice President Harris didn't have time, it was so much "We're against Donald," "I'm a prosecutor," "I'm going against," "I've taken on thugs," and they were attacking the integrity.

But I think the Trump base saw, that galvanized the base after the assassination, the legal cases brought against him.

They made him a victim.

I mean, let's not forget, two years ago in 2022, his unapproval rating was at 60%.

- He lost the midterms after they overturned Roe v. Wade.

But somehow he was able to max out, you know, 47% of Latino Americans, 23% of Black men, single white men, white men, white uneducated voters voting for this man, not realizing the consequences.

Now, I think they're waking up in the aftermath, saying, "Oh my God, what have we done?

We didn't think he was gonna really do that."

- Well, I think too, there is the current reality and then there's the context.

Everybody recall, during this election cycle, people showing a grocery cart from four years ago and a grocery cart today.

Without context, I think they drove a narrative around the cost of goods, the cost of gas.

Those are things that we can really see.

We can't see inflation.

We can't hear this long drawn-out process around how we have gone and maybe increased the GDP.

But what we do understand is that the cost of milk, people were able to articulate that that has risen, the cost of eggs, the cost of gas, the cost of cars.

And I think without context, voters were allowed to follow a narrative that the Republicans played without hearing some of what you're saying, Steve.

And I think for a lot of individuals that are loyal to the Democratic Party, there has to be a true reality between what we have done and how we're explaining it and how people really feel.

- And the two issues I would add to that is the immigration issue was big, right?

I mean, I think if we had to do it over again, if she had said, "I would shut down the border," but under the Biden administration, they ran a lot of ads on that.

You know, 50% of the American people were upset about immigration.

Two years ago it was 20%.

And then also just the issues of, you know, the economy, right?

I mean, I think those two issues, what you're paying now at the grocery store plus immigration, took away the focus from taking away your reproductive rights, right, and, you know, pulling away DEI, social equity, racial equity.

So these are all things now that are reality and maybe the American people will learn now that there's consequences for their election.

- There's consequences.

Well, you've already mentioned a lot of top-of-mind issues.

But more specifically in the Black community, let's talk about what are some of those concerns?

We have employment, obviously, housing, health, abortion.

You've mentioned that.

In Texas, we've seen four women who have passed away from complications due to pregnancy because they weren't allowed to have a D&C performed, right, which is essentially an abortion, but it's a medically-navigated abortion.

How are Black communities specifically going to be impacted by many of these decisions that are being made that are really kind of adverse for us?

- First of all, I think there are a lot of services that these healthcare providers are not able to provide in the midst of just the stigma now that is addressed in regards to maternal health or women's health.

I think that is the bigger balloon that bursts when we are narrowly focused on the abortion issue alone.

I think that there are so many different layers around access to healthcare, particularly in rural communities.

We still don't know, some of these rural parts of the state, men and women, are in more of a desperate need for access to healthcare than they were prior to this election.

We know that corporate interest in pharmaceutical companies and the amount of skyrocketing bills that are coming from the healthcare industry, under this administration, where corporations are going to benefit, we don't know what the bottom line is gonna look like for all of the different aspects of the healthcare industry and I think it's gonna be exacerbated when we get down to the root issues around abortion and access to abortions in the most critical and extreme situations, and even in the most, in the least situations where a woman just wants to choose what right she has to do with her body and her choice across the South.

I think North Carolina is somewhat of a outlier, where there's still a little bit of hope - I wanna add one thing - in that as well.

- to that.

I've seen, and this is just TikTok, but people talk, right?

People post content.

And women across the country have been approached by men saying, "Sooner or later, you're mine."

- Right.

- Right?

- Yeah, I know.

- And that to me feels like a scary, - It's a very scary thing.

- place to live in.

- It's very scary.

I mean, I totally agree with that.

And I think the other thing I would add to your points is that education.

I mean, we're looking at now, they wanna eliminate the $88 billion Department of Education.

That means less money for Pell grants, student loans, our schools, training young Black Americans on the new jobs and new economy when we have AI in the room that's gonna be automating and displacing many jobs.

Child poverty.

President Biden's tax credits reduced child poverty by 40%.

That's not gonna come back because those expired.

So the working American actually, tax cuts are gonna help the wealthy, but that money isn't distributing into these communities to help them.

And I would even see HBCUs being affected by this with, you know...

I can't remember who the department of public education head is, but I think he'll be naming that soon.

- Lovegreen.

- Yeah.

No, for the federal.

- No?

Oh, oh.

- Yeah, so he'll be announcing that secretary.

And then with RFK leading the DHHS, I think, you know, people might not wanna get vaccinated because there'll be fear about that.

What if we have a public health emergency?

Climate change.

I mean, we could take another hour on that.

But every major issue of our time is gonna be affected now by the leaders running the federal government and the White House with a Republican Congress and a Republican Senate.

- And I think that's the slippery slope, that Republicans could even fall into, right?

This notion of being able to marginalize certain communities, being able to pick apart certain benefits for certain communities because of the socioeconomic status and the equality in that case.

There are poor working class white people who will suffer under some of these cuts, under some of these changes.

- All Americans.

- And I think that is the slow reality that people are coming to as they're looking up how to Google changing their vote - Change their votes.

- when we know it's too late.

Too little, too late.

- It's too late.

- Let's take things locally.

We've seen a beautiful win by Josh Stein.

Let's talk about...

I think, you know, before the show, we were talking about Mark Robinson's loss, but you had some things you wanted to add to that.

- I think one of the differences in North Carolina in regards to the kind of Southern dismay at what has happened is the fact that North Carolina has been able to maintain some sort of balance of power, or semblance of balance of power.

Half of our Council of State represents two parties now.

We have five Democrats, five Republicans on the Council of State.

The governor has the power of the veto narrowly by, thankful the House, House intervention, individuals voted down ballot making sure that it wasn't just a red wave.

We don't understand that no party should have control unilaterally over any form of government.

And this balance of power that we're seeing at the executive level, what's happening at the legislative level, that could also be an intervention that could prevent what we're seeing at the judicial level, where the Republicans have an overwhelming number of individuals now in the state Supreme Court, where the Court of Appeals is also an area in which we're seeing a lot of extreme partisanship.

Now there's still hope, if the Democrats will hold the line, and particularly rural Black legislators that oftentimes aren't included in the Democratic playbook.

Now, the Democratic leadership is gonna have to figure out how to address their concerns.

The governor's gonna have to figure out how to listen to those rural constituents or rural voters, and even the rural delegations, because that could be the difference maker when we talk about sustaining a gubernatorial veto.

- Yeah, and I'm excited about Governor Stein.

I mean, I've known him for many years, senator, former attorney general, now the governor-elect, the new quarterback of North Carolina.

And I think he makes quick decisions.

I think his strategy is gonna be the hurricane relief efforts.

$55 billion of damage.

The legislature approved a couple billion to recover.

Opioid abuse.

I think he's gonna continue to focus on that.

Public education, public safety, workforce education training.

He'll be the first governor with AI on his watch so that's gonna be important.

And then continue to recruit new jobs.

But I think because he doesn't have a super majority now, he'll be able to work with these legislature, having the legislative experience, knowing senators and legislators on both sides.

So I think he's gonna get off to a start.

He's a very sharp guy.

And he's named some great people on his transition team Richard Stevens, a former state senator, a Republican; Kristi Jones, chief of staff for Ray Cooper; - Courtney Crowder.

- Courtney Crowder; and others, so I think... And then Seth Dearmin, who was his chief of staff and advisor.

So I think he's coming out of the gate.

The party is over, he's won, he's the governor, and I think he's gonna go in now and really govern, which is good, and I think we'll see some quick results for North Carolina.

- So let's talk, and we've just got about three minutes left here in the conversation, but let's talk about the leadership lineup for North Carolina.

You know, we did go pretty liberal, and so that seems like a good thing for the state.

Thoughts?

- Pretty and liberal are two debatable topics right now, I think especially after the shellacking that liberals have taken in this election cycle.

But I think there are some crowning accomplishments.

For the first time in North Carolina's history, there is a Black state superintendent of public instruction, in a moment where public schools were under attack, not just in North Carolina, but across the country, where charters are being led with corporations with no accountability, very limited accountability.

We saw in North Carolina a real definitive fight for public schools.

And I think that was one of the difference makers in the North Carolina election.

One of the highest vote getters was Mo Green, who even received more votes than Mark Robinson.

And so it was a real repeal on not just the value of public education to Democrats, but to all citizens across North Carolina.

There are a very limited number of individuals that have the benefit of seeing their dollars go into other alternative means of education.

Public school is still the great equalizer for a lot of rural and urban individuals and we saw that determining factor make a difference.

When Republicans went in with the idea of what they wanted at the federal level, but then questioning what it made sense for their future in voting for a Democratic governor and a Democratic Department of Public Instruction Chief.

- Yeah.

I think the fact that he has a lieutenant governor as a Democrat now, Governor Stein will be able to go on trade missions because he won't worry about an acting governor taking over.

But I think everything you said is dead on.

I mean, I think that, you know, the fact that he has a legislature with no super majority, he can veto things like constitutional amendments.

I mean, the constitutional amendment that passed, there was no need for that, citizens that couldn't already not vote.

So they were doing it, so I think he'll be able to veto stuff like that but I think work.

And then Mo Green winning is a big one.

- Jessica Holmes.

- You know having these... You know, so if you're a Democrat and you're liberal, there's a silver lining in the cloud.

You have a Democratic governor.

Stein always ends his stump speeches with "Wherever you come from in North Carolina, no matter where you're from, what your gender or race is, everyone should have the same shot."

And he's been leading like that since he was a state senator.

So I think that he really believes that.

And every day he gets up as our governor, we know a governor that's gonna represent even the Republicans and independents.

He's gonna represent everyone in North Carolina, so I think that that's a good thing for all of us.

- I think it makes sense to mention too that even though there were some huge wins, there were still some very challenging defeats, right?

Look at our first Black woman state auditor not winning - Oh yeah, she's such a- - her election.

- I was really upset about that.

- But then also, not getting support by what is believed to be a Democratic apparatus that should have gotten behind some of those down ballot Council of State candidates - Yeah.

- Braxton Winston as well, - Yes.

- Dr. Wesley Meredith.

These are gonna be some individuals that we're going to regret not having in office, and hoping that we can get those coattails back for the people in the next few years.

- Yeah, and I think those Council of State seats, I mean, you know, I think you have to run your own race.

I think the Mark Robinson effect wasn't as much for those other Council of State seats, maybe for the lieutenant governor, Hal Weatherman, but not the down ballot.

So the money wasn't there, the resources.

Bullock beat Holmes because I think he was on TV.

- Right.

- Yeah.

- Farley the same thing, outworked Braxton, had more money in the bank.

And Brad Briner for treasurer, beating Wesley Harris.

- I wanna put a pause there in the- - Sorry.

No, it's okay.

We could go on and on about this.

I wanna pause because we are at the time of our show where we are going to highlight this week's Small Business Holiday Feature.

I want you to get ready to shake it up, stir it down, and raise your glass because we're serving up something special.

This week's spotlight is a business owner that has a story behind every pour.

Let's toast to creativity and community while taking a look at this week's feature.

[mellow music] - I'm Diesha Banner, owner and founder of A Glass Above.

We are a mobile mixology and beverage catering firm.

That means that we curate your beverage catering choices in your events, from color scheme to theme to favorite spirit to flavor profiles.

We'll elevate all of your experiences by adding a touch of something different.

[mellow music continues] As a single mom, my son was very involved.

And I was working in nonprofit.

I worked in nonprofit for 17 years.

And I would miss the things that I really wanted to be a part of, which was like his games and parent nights and things that were going on through school and all those sorts of things.

So as a single mom, I didn't wanna keep telling my son no.

[mellow music continues] This was kind of a way to control my schedule as well as kind of create some additional income.

But when I got involved in it, I was like, "Oh, this is so much more than what I thought."

I've been in the beverage space for almost 10 years.

I started out when it wasn't as popular so there were not that many services that looked like mine, definitely not that many that were owned by people that looked like me.

This is a space that was predominantly faced by white males, and so to be a Black female to be in this space was very different.

Well, Black and Brown people have always been in this space of service, in hospitality, and so this is kind of a revolution of some sorts to kind of put our faces out there so there are more Black products, you know, and there are now more wines and beer and there are more spirits that are Black-owned and not just Black-faced.

So throughout this journey, I have been intentional about creating experiences for people that look like me, but also to just show that we can do business well.

For us, it is always a celebration.

So it's always somebody celebrating something, whether that's, again, a new home, celebrating the holiday season, being with family, being with friends.

If it's a corporate event, maybe they've reached a milestone, there's a new contract, or you just want to kind of get to know your coworkers.

So being a part of those experiences is always a good time.

There is a mindful movement as far as drinking is concerned so we do offer options for people who don't drink.

To hear people say they enjoyed it, to hear people say they loved, they never had this experience before, they've never tasted anything like this before.

What are those flavors?

All of those things kind of excite me because then that gives me the opportunity to share.

[mellow music continues] For me, it's about making sure that it tastes good, introducing new flavors, and then the way it looks.

'Cause people are always like, "Oh, that's pretty.

It's so pretty, I don't wanna drink it."

But I'm like, "Yes, drink it."

But it can still be pretty.

So whether that's the glassware, whether that's the garnish, all of those things kind of factor into me creating.

So that's my outlet for creativity.

[mellow music continues] Our books are open for the holidays, so if you are looking for entertainment for your holiday events, we're certainly available.

We also offer the option to pre-mix it.

So if you don't necessarily need service, but you want to have something and you can kind of select your own spirit, you can add whatever you like to it, we'll create the base for it, but you... Everybody deserves a great cocktail for the holidays.

[mellow music continues] You can find us on the web at www.aglassabove.com.

We are also available through email, hello@aglassabove.com.

Or you can reach us by phone at 919-408-7376.

- Well, that was so great.

I love all the work that Diesha does with A Glass Above.

If you haven't had her drinks, make sure that you visit her website and book her today.

Well, everybody, I am so grateful for you being here today, the conversation that Marcus Bass, Steve Rao, as always, insightful.

Great thoughts.

- Thank you.

- And wonderful show.

Thank you.

- Thanks for having us.

- Thank you.

And I thank you for watching.

That's all we have.

If you want more content like this, we invite you to engage with us on Instagram using the hashtag #BlackIssuesForum.

You can also find our full episodes on pbsnc.org/blackissuesforum and on the PBS video app.

I'm Kenia Thompson.

I'll see you next time.

[upbeat music] ♪ [upbeat music continues] ♪ [upbeat music continues] - [Announcer] Quality public television is made possible through the financial contributions of viewers like you, who invite you to join them in supporting PBS NC.