debate from the Nevada perspective.

That's this week, Don.

Nevada week.

We.

Support for Nevada Week is provided by Senator William H. Hearn.

Stat.

Welcome to a special post presidential debate edition of Nevada week.

I'm Amber Renee Dixon, joining you live from the Vegas PBS studios.

And for our Agatha Christie viewers, Agatha Christie's four O mystery of the Blue Train that will be airing right after this at 8:30 p.m. now Nevada.

Despite being a purple state, has not elected a Republican to the office of president since 2004.

However, in 2020, President Joe Biden defeated former President Donald Trump by less than three percentage points in the state.

And right now, recent Emerson College polling shows Trump, the Republican with a three point lead over Biden in Nevada.

So how well did each candidate do tonight in addressing the issues?

Top of mind for Nevadans?

For that, we bring in our panel.

Sandra Cosgrove is a College of Southern Nevada history professor and executive director of Vote Nevada.

Mo.

Dennis is a former Nevada State Senate majority leader and partner at Alfaro Consulting, and Stephen Hill is vice president of the political consulting team McShane LLC.

So what is top of mind for Nevadans?

No surprise here.

Polling shows it is the economy.

So what are your takes on how well each candidate did in addressing that situation?

Sandra it came up in me.

Inflation came up, housing came up, the price of rent came up.

But it doesn't seem like either one of them had a lot of substance to say.

I mean, both said they would like to get rid of inflation, but I didn't hear of any plan for getting rid of inflation or even what's causing it.

and so I don't think people who have it as their top of mind issue are going to walk away from this debate saying, oh, I know how he won.

Either one of them is going to address that.

Any solution proposed that you heard of Stephen?

I think President Trump stuck on message.

I think he said that that when President Biden came into office, there was little to no inflation.

Now you're seeing housing prices up 30%.

You're seeing grocery prices up.

Nevada has the second highest grocery prices in the nation.

I think President Trump knows that voters are going to vote with their wallets, and they're going to see that they're not in a better financial shape than they were when President Biden took office.

Mo would you like to respond?

Well, I think, you know, I think they didn't address the real issue that the, you know, the inflation issues were actually started under, President Trump.

And then, you know, it became worse as as we went into President Biden.

And I say that I don't think they really address that issue, on, you know, what really happened.

And then they really didn't talk a lot about solutions.

Do you want to respond to that, Stephen, as far as how did inflation start?

Did it start under the presidency of Trump or under Joe Biden, or was it both pumping a lot of money into the economy?

Well, I think you're absolutely right.

Both both presidents pumped a lot of money into the economy.

Right.

President Trump was was faced with an unprecedented Covid pandemic that nobody saw coming.

came remarkably close to the election.

It was it was, a lot happened in a short amount of time.

I think that the inflation may have slightly started under President Trump, but it skyrocketed out of control under President Biden.

You didn't see inflation really increase in the Biden administration until after year one.

That's when you really started to see the inflation really take off and really get out of control.

If Nevadans are voting with their pocketbooks, who are they going to vote for after this?

Sandra.

So if I accept your premise that it's gotten much worse and let's say I'm listening for either one of them to tell me how they're going to fix it.

I didn't hear either one of them tell me how they're going to fix it.

And so even if I say, okay, it got worse under President Biden.

And what are you going to do to fix it?

So I didn't hear a solution from either of them.

Well, I think, you know, while it, it, it peaked, you know, inflation is going down.

and so, you know, I think people look at that, I mean, there are some that are struggling more than others.

But I think we've seen that the, you know, inflation is going down with some of the policies that have been put in place.

All right.

So regardless of who is responsible for it, we aren't hearing solutions from that debate.

What about housing affordability.

Because that is the second issue top of mind for Nevadans.

According to Emerson, polling that was mentioned.

But it was brief, right, Stephen?

Yeah, it was brief.

President Biden mentioned, you know, more government intervention, rent control.

I don't think that's a solution that, you know, like I mentioned earlier, 30% increases in housing costs.

And since President Biden is taken over, this goes back to just the general inflationary things that have been happening under President Biden.

I think a lot of voters are thinking that, return to President Trump, you know, at least in the early part of President Trump's term, prior to the Covid pandemic, a lot of voters felt that that President Trump was handling the economy well.

The economy was growing.

you had record low inflation.

sorry.

Excuse me.

record record low interest rates that were allowing more, more Americans to purchase homes, lower home prices.

And I think that that a lot of voters will look to President Trump to have a return to that.

Is rent control the solution?

I know you come from the Democratic Party, but you are also a landlord yourself.

More correct.

Yeah.

And so what I've seen is actually rent, rent prices starting to come down because they kind of got out of hand.

but there's still not enough housing.

And, I think, you know, President Biden, does have a plan for that.

I don't think that he went in in enough detail in that plan.

but, you know, there needs to be something done because there's a need for housing in especially here in Nevada.

And I know that there's been a lot of money put in in this administration, to be able to help with that.

And I think we're going to see some of those come into fruition here as those projects are done, things we've seen in the news here a lot is these big investment companies coming in and buying up a lot of property and then putting them out for rent.

I didn't hear that come up.

we have we have problems where the big developers are making a lot of money, so they don't want to have a lot more units come on, because supply and demand, if you put more supply out, then your profits are going to come down.

Are we helping smaller developers put, you know, houses into places where there's just maybe a small place for a duplex or a small apartment building?

I think there's a whole lot more that needs to be talked to about this.

I don't know if these two can talk about it as somebody is going to need to talk about it if know, I'll let you know.

I was going to say, yeah, I think that's kind of becomes more of a local issue.

you know, how do we handle it?

And, and even within municipalities, how do they handle housing in those areas?

And, you know, I think, but I think the funding part is one of the things that, you know, the presidents can, can work on, but actually how it gets implemented and how those details have to be done at the local level.

Yeah.

Because can rent control be something that is implemented by a president?

No.

Right.

No.

What issues in your opinion, does a president have the most impact on?

Steven, I think the president has a huge impact on economy.

Obviously, Congress is the one who passes the laws and the end of the day.

But, especially with with a Congress of the same party as the president, the president has a lot of influence.

And what gets passed, you saw in President Trump's first term, you saw, the Trump tax cuts, right?

Trump work with with, Republican House members to, to pass one of the largest tax cuts in American history.

I think the president has a lot to do in regulating the economy.

The pressure that that, a president can put on the Federal Reserve and, in, in setting interest rates across the board, and working with the Congress to pass different laws.

You look at President Biden, President Biden worked with, with a Democratic Congress to pass some of the largest spending bills ever passed in American history, which a lot of people believe caused a lot of these inflationary things that have been happening in the country.

Want to add on to that?

Well, I think, you know, I think that the you had, the opportunity to under the prior administration to lower taxes, but at the same time, we had the highest debt that we've ever had in this country in history.

and so, you know, now and, and, and, you know, under President Biden, there's, there's also that debt hasn't gone away.

But, you know, at least he talked about a plan to be able to come up with more money, you know, taxing those that that are taxed aren't paying as much as others.

You know, when it comes to talking about a percentage is changing on those with the over $180,000 a year and so I think those are a 24% tax on those making over $100 million.

Correct.

A billionaire tax is what he called it.

But Sandra, your thoughts on that kind of tax policy?

And then also how Biden distinguished himself and Trump distinguished himself from Biden in terms of tax policy.

So one of the tax credits came up for something very specific that didn't get talked about enough and kind of offended me that it didn't get talked about enough.

And that's child care, right?

That is a huge problem for a lot of families right now, and especially if we've got rent up or if you've got inflation and you've got both mom and dad or working and you're paying as much in childcare as you're paying in rent, that has got to be an issue.

That is top of the ticket for anyone who gets elected president, because sure, it can be done at the local level, but in many ways it's people who are the most vulnerable.

Oftentimes it's single moms and dads who are paying the price for high child care, and they said almost nothing about it.

President Biden did bring up tax credits for former President Trump, almost said nothing.

And then off they went off to something else.

Stephen, what did president, former President Trump say about taxes?

And then, your thoughts on what Biden responded, I think more than Trump saying anything, Trump let Biden speak for himself, right?

Biden said that he's going to increase the tax rate from 8.2 to 24% for for billionaires, the the objectively most productive members of our economy, the folks who are employing the most Americans and creating the most in the manufacturing industries and industries across the board.

I think President Trump let Biden speak for himself when when he when he proposed these large tax increases.

Anything you want to add to that?

Well, I think, you know, I think when you're talking about individuals who, you know, have an opportunity to have businesses here in this country, you know, they benefit from all of the infrastructure and everything else.

It's here.

and while they, they, they're able to create more business, at the same time, that doesn't necessarily reflect on the individuals.

The salaries don't reflect, you know, that they're getting these, you know, record profits.

So I think you know, when you're talking about the economy, you have to be able to talk about things like, you know, the childcare.

I mean, if somebody doesn't have something to take care of their child and they're not going to work.

So, you know, they're not able to get that in the economy.

So I think there are ways to increase our economy if we would just provide some help for those that need it the most.

Is there anything else anyone wants to add on the economy because it was okay, go ahead.

So let's make sure we understand what a tariff is a terrorist attacks on an import.

And so if you import something into the country the tax gets added to it.

And then the consumer pays it.

The country that it's coming from does not pay.

It's a tax on consumption.

Yeah.

So and I did look that up because I knew you had an issue with that.

And economists say the costs are largely passed on to consumers.

But why do you bring that up.

Is that because of former President Trump bringing that up as how he would sort of punish China.

But but the intent is also to help local businesses to help.

Right.

It is protectionist for local business.

And sometimes it will hurt the import that's coming in because it makes it more expensive, but it makes it more expensive by making the consumer pay more.

And so it is disingenuous to say somehow that a tariff is does not impact consumers.

That is just a way to get money from another country.

Is there anything else we want to talk about on the economy?

It's a huge issue to voters in Nevada and across the country.

However, I think how many minutes was spent on it in this hour and a half long debate.

Yeah, and very few.

And I think here in Nevada, I think we've seen a lot of jobs come.

You know, I think, you know, part of it, you know, with the pandemic we lost jobs, but we've been able to rebound and create a lot of new jobs.

And under Biden, I mean, with the new train coming in, for example, that's like thousands of jobs that are going to be there to put that train into.

So we're seeing some things that are happening that are going to help the economy going into the future.

Trump responded to that, though, that they were bounce back jobs.

What did that mean?

Do you know, Steven, I think what he's referring to, our jobs that were just lost in the pandemic, that, you know, businesses that that couldn't operate at full capacity, businesses that might have been deemed nonessential, that we knew were going to come back at some point?

we're going to the economy.

Another thing I want to touch on, especially here in Nevada, a service based economy, it's a huge part of our economy here, the the casinos, the service industry and President Trump's new, new proposal that he unveiled here.

It is rally in Las Vegas was was no taxes on tips right.

That's a big thing for for service workers though the Culinary Union might come out and said that, you know, it's not going to dissuade their members from from voting for President Biden.

I think you'll see a lot of service workers.

This is a this is a big issue for them, right.

And I think that you might see a handful of service workers come over to the Republican side and vote for President Trump just based on that policy.

We did have David Damore on the show recently.

He is the executive director at Brookings Mountain West.

I asked him about that.

Is that possible?

And he said that would have to be through Congress in order for that, not to tax tips.

So it's it's something he's proposing.

But whether he can implement that on day one, I'm not so sure, but I'm it is a good transition because with him, we also discussed the unique Nevada electorate in terms of immigration.

And as he broke it down, there is a component that is conservative and anti-immigrant, and that exists even within some of the Latino electorate.

But then he said, there are a lot of mixed status families, families whose members have different immigration statuses.

Then you add on that the economy here is dependent on migrant labor.

There are a lot of varying opinions on this issue within Nevada.

So from the consultant perspective, how would you advise a presidential candidate to speak to Nevadans on this issue, and how do you think they did tonight?

Well, I you know, I would say, you know, I have worked on immigration issues for a long time.

And here in Nevada, I mean, our economy is based on having workers, whether it's in hotels, whether it's in construction, you know, I mean, one of the things that President Trump, former President Trump, mentioned was that they're taking away black jobs and that that is not accurate.

if you actually look at the outlook from now to 2050, as far as jobs, our, our population growth is only going to go up, in, in the non-Hispanic non immigrant population, very little.

So our growth is going to come from immigrants.

And we've always here in Nevada, I mean if can go back, I mean we've always used immigrants here, even the Chinese in the 1800s.

you know, so so it's a critical piece for us.

You know, we've seen states like Utah that have said, hey, we we want to bring more businesses, but we don't have workers.

So it's disingenuous to say that somehow by bringing immigrants, we're taking jobs away because we're not filling all the jobs that need to be filled currently today.

Stephen, I think what President Trump wants is not no immigrants, right?

I think that's a common misconception.

I think President Trump wants to reform our immigration system to promote legal immigrants, right.

The folks who want to come here and work hard and and support our country and do good things for our country, President Trump said tonight.

Every state is now a border.

And I think that's absolutely right.

You know, President Trump referenced, the murders of several American citizens by illegal immigrants in recent weeks.

And it's obviously very tragic.

President Trump has spent time with some of their families, and President Biden has not even mentioned or acknowledged some of these problems.

And I think that that, a lot of your kind of middle ground electorate, a lot of the Republicans are with President Trump on immigration, but you're kind of middle ground electorate.

I think a lot of them are concerned about our economy and concerned about the effects that illegal immigration might have on our economy in our concern about the crime, quite honestly.

Right.

Crime is crime is on the rise right now.

And, you know, we've we've seen crimes committed by illegal immigrants on the rise as well.

I think that I think you have to get the numbers right there.

because, you know, I mean, President Trump made it sound like immigrants, all the immigrants coming across the border are criminals.

But if you actually look, there's a recent study done in Texas that shows that actually the non immigrant population, crime rate, is a huge is huge compared to immigrants.

It's immigrants.

So the fact that the immigrants coming in are far safer than the regular population when it comes to so to to talk about immigrants as being the problem of all these, issues, it's just disingenuous and totally false.

As far as the data, the data does not show that these immigrants coming actually want to solve this problem.

I mean, what I hear from my students is they seem this is a political football that nobody actually puts a plan on the table to say, we're going to get people a pathway to citizenship.

We don't have enough workers.

Can we bring the program back?

It just seems like it becomes a issue that the candidates use and don't want to fix or actually address President Trump.

I don't I don't remember him putting anything on the table to say that we're actually going to reform our immigration system.

It just was something that was in the news.

People were all upset and they were mad.

And we saw that happen tonight.

We're just kind of got pulled out and laid on the table.

Any time one of the other didn't want to talk about an issue.

But I think there are plans out there, and the problem is trying to get everybody together.

I mean, we've had several opportunities now with the Gang of Eight way back and even more recent, they had a plan that they agreed to.

And then also when they pulled out, and, you know, even though they could have had something but, you know, became political season and, and, you know, the Republicans didn't want to, you know, accept the, the agreement that they had come to on at least doing something about immigration.

I think to the senator's point on, on, crimes committed by illegal immigrants, I think President Trump was more trying to draw attention to the folks who who have been apprehended at the border, who are on the terrorist watch list to the folks who who have committed crimes previously in this country and in their home countries.

I think that's more what President Trump was trying to draw attention to versus, labeling a whole group of people as criminals.

Yeah, that actual number of actual criminals that are coming across the border is a very low number.

and so he made it sound like it was like every, you know, the way he talks about it is that everybody coming over the border is a criminal.

When in actuality, if you look to see all the criminals come because it's a very low number.

Sandra, do you remember a solution being proposed in this debate?

Because we've been sitting here, what, for 2 or 3 hours now, just going round and round.

We know why didn't President Biden talk about the two recent executive orders that he's issued in terms of immigration.

Well because he has to be careful because a lot of his base does come from the Latino community.

And so he needs to be careful that he's threading the needle from the fact that, yes, many of them are also worried about crime, but many of them are also saying we don't have enough workers to fill all of our jobs.

And yet Washington is too broken to figure out how to make sure people who are not criminals, they're fleeing violence in Latin America.

They're trying to make them they're hard workers and trying to make a better life.

Why can't we help them get into one of these jobs?

It doesn't seem like we can actually solve this problem.

Threading the needle is a good way to describe it.

What did you think?

Well, I think amongst ourselves prior to this, we talked about what is what is the middle think what are what are the undecided voters thinking?

What are the voters who quite honestly don't like either candidate?

What do they think?

And I think that an issue like that with President Biden taking what is probably is hard to stand on on illegal immigration.

Yet with the executive orders, I think he was he was quite honestly afraid to say in front of his base.

I think he's worried about the impact that it might have on his base.

And I think he's he's more worried about losing folks from his base than gaining folks from the middle.

With an issue like that, you bring.

Okay.

Well, I don't I mean, I think at the same time, the way that the debate was going, it seemed like they were, you know, just going around in and bringing up, you know, this, these issues that are non-issues and he's having to respond to that, which takes time.

And I don't think he had time to really get into all the immigration stuff that they really should have got into.

I wanted to ask the consultant question to you from the consultant perspective, how would you advise these candidates to address immigration, which is so complex?

Absolutely.

I mean, I think, I would advise the candidates to, to discuss the things like, like the terrorists, folks on the terrorist watch list who are apprehended at the border, that it might be a small fraction.

I think we can all agree nobody wants folks on the terrorist watch list, you know?

You know, coming across our southern border, folks coming from from Europe and Asia, crossing on our southern border, I would I would draw attention to that.

I think I would I would draw attention to that.

I think I would draw attention to the to the crimes committed, you know, by these people both in this country and in their home countries, though that's not all of them by any means.

I think there is at least a portion of that.

And I think we can all agree that that's not the kind of people that we want on our streets.

Right.

And and I think everybody agrees nobody wants criminals here.

Actually, the, the terrorists that have come across into the US have actually come across on the Canadian border.

So we always talk about the southern border.

But, you know, we need the a comprehensive immigration that covers all our borders and allows people to be able to come to fill the jobs that we need filled, and for criminals to not be here.

Right.

So I think that that's the, the, the ultimate solution that that I think the way they could get to if, if it, if it wasn't such a political issue, the Emerson College polling that I mentioned said 12% of the Nevada voters that they polled were undecided in who they were going to vote for.

What did tonight do for them?

Sandra?

I just looking at Twitter after the debate, I don't think any of them have moved one way or the other.

what I want to know is I've talked to some people who said I've undecided.

I don't know which one.

And then you just mentioned there's another group there.

Like, I hate them both.

I don't like either one of them.

I want different choices.

I want to know what that group is going to do.

Is that group going to not vote at all?

Are they going to leave that blank?

I want to know what that group is going to do, because I think it's a large group.

It's I think it's an interesting question.

I don't I don't think too many voters were moved in either direction tonight by, by this debate, I think, both candidates did their best job at shoring up their own bases.

We I already mentioned, you know, what President Biden didn't want to say to to shore up his own base.

I think that was kind of the game that both candidates played tonight, shoring up their own base.

we're likely going to have some more debates between now and November.

we'll have an opportunity for both candidates to kind of address that middle ground a little bit more.

but I think it will be interesting to see who else the candidates look at.

Will with, who the voters will look at.

Will they look at third party candidates?

Will they simply not vote?

And I think it's a little too early to see that, you know, depending on the month, polling shows that Robert Kennedy Jr is either taking votes from Biden or taking votes from Trump.

It goes back and forth by the month, and I think it'll be really interesting to see who these voters look to between now on the next debate.

And I, you know, I think in Nevada historically is just such a hard place to poll.

when you look at across the country.

and so it's really hard to tell.

you know, I think that, you know, I agree that, what makes Nevada so difficult to pull?

Well, I think, you know, we are actually a really good microcosm of the country because people come from all over, and, and we're also 24 hour, economy.

and so, you know, a lot of times when you're polling or you, you know, trying to get the right mix and at the right time and, you know, all of that, I think that all of those issues come into what happens when they when they do polling, who's at home when you're calling right.

It is a transient population that lives here.

You know, what was also up for debate tonight was the mental fitness of each candidate.

So Sandra, what did you think about 78 year old former President Donald Trump and 81 year old President Biden, that they're both old?

I mean, you could tell that the President Biden probably had a cold or, you know, it seemed like he had some phlegm in his throat.

He was the way he is.

Former President Trump was the way he is.

This is the two choices that we've had.

We have the parties have decided that for us, I think there's a whole other debate on whether the party should be making this decision for the for all of us, but those are the choices.

And so people are going to have to decide, do you want somebody that maybe comes across as a little bit slow, but was being trying to be thoughtful and then somebody that was being rapid fire, but then said some things that were nonsensical.

But again, this goes back to people saying I don't like either choice, anything to add, or we both fall in agreement on.

They just both looked old.

I think President Biden started, very weak.

I think he slurred his words a lot.

You know, there was a pointwhere he just totally stopped speaking because I don't think he knew exactly what he was saying.

and obviously the cold didn't didn't help that.

I think President Trump came across stronger, though, even though he might have gone a little rapid fire and gotten a little off topic at different points, as he oftentimes will, in his speeches, I think that that President Trump came across as the stronger, probably more mental fit Canada.

And I looked a little different.

I, you know, I thought Biden was being, more pensive and trying to make you say answer.

And President Trump just seemed like he just would go right off.

And since a lot of the stuff that he was talking about was actually nonsense, it wasn't really information.

You know, every time he talks about being the best, this or this or that, there is no data there.

So I think he he can just go on because he doesn't have to base it on fact.

and I think, you know, Biden was just trying to do, you know, put together good.

You know, his thoughts on on that was going to respond.

Preserving democracy is also an issue that made the top five list of concerns for Nevadans who eased those concerns tonight.

Sandra, I don't think either one of them really addressed it, but I think I think there's two ways to look at it.

The question that came up is they asked, former President Trump, will you accept the results of the election?

They talked a little bit about January 6th.

But again, I am more worried about the fact that we have two very unpopular people standing on that stage.

And we have a lot of Americans who are upset about it, who may not vote.

So that's voter suppression.

When you are not giving people options, not being able to say, okay, I don't like these two choices, what else do I have?

Is there something else I can do?

You're pushing people away that's going to have repercussions down ballot.

And when we're talking about school board races and we're talking about mayors races, local stuff's way more important.

I mean, that's where the rubber hits the road.

And actually things get done.

I am worried that we're going to have a low turnout election, just like we had a low turnout primary.

Stephen, who best addressed preserving democracy.

I think President Trump made two important statements tonight.

Number one is my retribution will be my success.

Right.

I think that I think that, President Trump is saying that that he wants to return to the success of his previous administration, and that will be his retribution.

He doesn't have it out to, you know, take it out against his political opponents.

He wants to show them how successful his administration can be.

And then secondly, he said he absolutely would accept the results of the election if they were fair and free.

And, I think the objective, though it is, but I think in the last four years I think we've seen a lot of improvements.

The Covid pandemic caused a lot of things in voting that we never seen before, widespread mail in voting in states that we never seen that in before.

states not really knowing how to count and process ballots in that manner.

I think that there's been a lot of reforms in Nevada and across the country in since the 2020 election, in kind of cleaning up these processes, making it safer and easier to vote in a lot of states.

And I think that President Trump will be a lot happier with with the way that elections have been run in the last four years.

Well, and yet there wasn't anything ever found in anything that the last elections weren't fair.

even though there was a lot of new process and people were learning things, they still did not find any issues with that.

And the last time, President Trump said the same thing, you know, if there, if there, if this and this and this, then I'll accept the thing.

And that's all we saying this time again, which, you know, and a lot of people won't trust that, that, you know, he didn't come right out and say, yeah, I'll accept it.

I mean, everybody assumes that that, you know, if that's fair.

Right?

But he didn't come right out and say, yeah, I'll accept it.

All right.

We got to wrap up now.

a quick closing statement from each of you.

Your takeaway from tonight, Stephen, I think that President Trump came across as a as a little bit stronger.

I think President Biden having a cold didn't really help anything.

I think, images a lot in politics.

It's not everything, but it's a lot.

And I think coming across quickly, you know, as, as having having a cold and not presenting himself well was really tough for him.

So, I think the President Biden, at least took the opportunity, to point out, you know, some of the inconsistencies and some of the things that are being said.

I think he took the opportunity to talk about some of the things that he wants to talk about and the fact that they were able to cut you off there.

But we have both sides on that perspective.

Thank you so much