WELCOME TO "KENTUCKY TONIGHT."

I'M RENEE SHAW.

THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US.

TONIGHT, A PREVIEW OF THE 2022 KENTUCKY GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

THE 60-DAY SESSION BEGINS JANUARY 4TH, AND IT SHOULD BE A BUSY ON STATE LAWMAKERS WILL CRAFT A TWO-YEAR STATE BUDGET, DEAL WIT REDISTRICTING, ADDRESS WORKFORC AND TAX ISSUES, EDUCATION FUNDING, THE UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE SYSTEM, POSSIBLY TWEA THE STATE TAX CODE, CONSIDER AN OMNIBUS ANTI-ABORTION MEASURE, AND MAY EVEN CONSIDER legalizin MEDICAL MARIJUANA.

TO DISCUSS ALL THIS, WE'RE JOINED IN OUR LEXINGTON STUDIO ENTIRELY BY: STATE SENATOR JASON HOWELL, A REPUBLICAN FROM STATE REPRESENTATIVE JOSIE RAYMOND, A DEMOCRAT FROM LOUISV KATE SHANKS, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT OF PUBLIC AFFAIRS FOR THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER OF COMMERC AND JASON BAILEY, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR FOR THE KENTUCKY CENTE FOR ECONOMIC POLICY.

WE WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU.

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COMING UP ON THE SESSION IN JUST A FEW SHORT WEEKS IT'S HARD TO BELIEVE.

SO I WANT TO DO A ROUND RAB ROBIN, GO AROUND THE HORN.

WE'VE GOT TWO NEWBIES KATE AND JASON SO LET'S BE KIND.

I'LL START WITH YOU, REPRESENTATIVE RAYMOND.

HOUSE DEMOCRATS.

WHAT ARE SOME OF THE MAIN ISSUES THAT YOU ALL WANT TO TACKLE INTO JUST A FEW WEEKS WHEN YOU GO BACK?

>> THEY'RE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT THE THINGS WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT AS LONG AS I CAN REMEMBER.

THIS WILL BE MY FOURTH SESSION.

WE WANT TO LOOK AT STABLE INEZ FAMILIES COMING OUT OF COVID, HOPEFULLY COMING OUT OF COVID.

WE KNOW THAT EVICTION RATES ARE STILL HIGH.

UNEMPLOYMENT IS HIGHER THAN WEI WE'D LIKE IT TO BE.

WORKFORCE PARTICIPATING IS LOWER THAN WE'D LIKE IT TO BE.

HUNGER IS HIGHER THAN WE'D LIKE IT TO BE.

THE WAGES ARE LOWER THAN WE'D LIKE THEM TO BE.

SO WE'RE GOING TO BE LOOKING AT ALL OF THOSE FACTORS THAT FAMILIES ARE CONSIDERING EVERY DAY OF THEIR LIVES AND SAYING, WHAT CAN WE DO TO STRENGTHEN AND STABILIZE FAMILIES IN KENTUCKY SO WE ALL COME OUT OF THIS STRONGER, NOT JUST THE TOP?

>> IT SOUNDS LIKE FROM WHAT YOU SAID IT WOULDN'T BE MUCH DISAGREEMENT ON THAT, SENATOR HOWELL.

SO THE SENATE REPUBLICANS ARE SCHEDULED TOO MAKE A LITTLE RETREAT.

WHEN THAT?

NEXT WEEK?

>> YES.

>> THE 13th THROUGH 14th AND 15th.

PERHAPS YOU HAVEN'T TALKED A LOT ABOUT YOUR AGENDA BUT WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT WHAT THE PRIORITIES WILL BE FOR THE UPPER CHAMBER MAJORITY.

>> >> OBVIOUSLY A BUDGET CYCLE SO WE'LL BE DEALING WITH THE BUDGET WHICH IS ALWAYS A UNIQUE EXPERIENCE BUT IT WILL BE INTERESTING WITH ALL THE FEDERAL MONEY THAT GETS THROWN INTO THE MIX.

REDISTRICTING IS SOMETHING WE'RE GOING TO MOST LIKELY HAVE TO DEAL WITH SOMETHING IN SESSION BECAUSE IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE WE'LL BE CALLED INTO A SPECIAL SESSION TO DEAL WAIT THIS POINT.

AND THEN I THINK THAT THERE'S A LOT OF DISCUSSION BEING HAD AROUND TAX REFORM TAKING A GOOD HARD LOOK AT TAX REFORM AND CONTINUING 13469 EFFORTS OF THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

OF COURSE, EVERYBODY HAS THEIR INDIVIDUAL ISSUES AND PRIORITIES BUT I THINK THOSE THREE ARE THREE OF THE MAIN ONES.

>> AND REDISTRICTING, ACCORDING TO A PRESS CONFERENCE THAT WAS HAD BY SENATE LEADERSHIP, GOP LEADERSHIP I THINK BY THE END OF THE MONTH, NOVEMBER, WAS THAT GET REDISTRICTING DONE THE FIRST FEW DAYS, AND BY THE SECOND WEEK OF THE SESSION IT COULD POSSIBLY BE ON THE GOVERNOR'S DESK.

IS THAT WHAT YOU UNDERSTAND?

>> YEAH.

YOU KNOW, YOU'VE WATCHED THIS A LONG TIME.

YOU KNOW THE NEVER GET MARRIED TO A TIME O.

OR TIMETABLE.

BUT THE SOONER WE CAN DO THIS THE BETTER.

IT WOULD HAVE BEEN MUCH MORE RESPONSIBLE TO BE CALLED INTO A SPECIAL SESSION TO DO IT SO PEOPLE HAVE A CHANCE TO PLAN.

IT AFFECTS NOT JUST THE LEGISLATURE BUT THE CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION AS WELL AS LOCAL RACES AS WELL.

SINCE IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, THE SOONER WE CAN DEAL WITH IT AND GET IT TO THE GOVERNOR'S DESK, THE BETTER IT WILL BE FOR EVERYONE.

>> AND SO STILL MOVING THE FILING DEADLINE FROM WHAT WOULD HAVE BEEN JANUARY 7th TO SOME TIME LATER IN JANUARY?

>> IT WAS A REALLY GOOD IDEA TO MOVE THAT UP UNTIL IT WASN'T 2.

>> THAT'S HOW IT ALWAYS THE WORKS.

UNINTENDS CONSEQUENCES I THINK THEY SOMETIMES SAY.

KATE SHANKS, I KNOW THAT THE CHAMBER PUNCH YOUR LEGISLATIVE PRIORITIES.

TIME TO COMPETE IS WHAT IT SAYS IN BIG BOLD PRINT.

SO WHAT DOES THAT MEAN FOR YOU ALL?

>> WE THINK THE TIME IS RIGHT, THE TIME IS NOW TO JUST FOCUS ON BOLD POLICIES FOR KENTUCKY.

WE ARE FEELING SO MUCH MOMENTUM IN TERMS OF GROWTH.

WE HAVE HAD SOME GREAT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT ANNOUNCEMENTS MADE IN KENTUCKY.

WE'RE EXPECTING LOTS OF JOB GROWTH IN KENTUCKY WE ARE WATCHING WHAT SOME OF YOUR NEIGHBORING AND COMPETITIVE STATES ARE DOING REGARDING TAX REFORM.

WE THINK THE TIME IS NOW TO TAKE THE NEXT STEP ON TAX REFORM.

THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY BACK IN 2018 DID PASS LEGISLATION THAT REALLY IMPROVED OUR COMPETITIVENESS.

THEY TOOK A REALLY GREAT FIRST STEP THAT MADE SOME IMPORTANT CHANGES TO OUR TAX CODE.

SO WHAT'S NEXT?

AND HOW DO WE CONTINUE THOSE REFORMS?

THAT'S GOING TO BE REALLY IMPORTANT.

WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION 1 AS THE REPRESENTATIVE MENTION POND WITH OUR INFORMATION PARTICIPATION RIGHT IS ONE OF LOWEST IN THE NATION.

WE HIT 40th BEFORE THE PANDEMIC.

BEEN KNOCK BACK DOWN TO 47th IN THE NATION.

THAT'S NOT ONE PIECE OF LEGISLATION.

WHEN I TALK ABOUT WORKFORCE, IT'S GOING TO BE SEVERAL DIFFERENT WAYS OF TACKLING THE BARRIERS TO WORK THAT WE SEE IN KENTUCKY.

>> BUT MANY KENTUCKIANS HAVE GONE BACK TO WORK BUT HOW MANY HAVE NOT OR SEEM TO BE TOTALLY DISENGAGED?

>> MOST OF THE PHOENIX WE LOST DURING THE PANDEMIC HAVE RETURNED.

I THINK WE RECOVERED AROUND 76% OF THOSE THAT WE LOST, BUT WE WERE ALREADY STRUGGLING WITH WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION, SO WHEN YOU'RE IN THE HOLE AND YOU GET KNOCKED DOWN FURTHER, IT TAKES THAT MUCH LONGER TO CLIMB BACK OUT OF IT, AND SO I THINK OUR PARTICIPATION RATE IS AROUND 56% 56%.

NATIONALLY IT'S 60, 61 PERCENT.

WE'VE GOT ROOM TO MAKE UP FOR THAT I'M SURE BUT WE WANT TO BE FOCUSING ON THE UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE SYSTEM, SOME IMPORTANT STEPS WE'RE TAKING LAST SECT OF SESSION TO PAY OFF OUR GIGANTIC LOAN THAT WE HAD TO TAKE OUT FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

WE WENT TO RESTORE THE TRUST FUND BALANCE.

WE WANT TO LOOK AT SOME OF THE WORK SEARCH.

RETURN TO WORK TYPO PROVISIONS IN THAT SYSTEM SO WE CAN DO ALL WE CAN TO GET PEOPLE BACK TO WORK.

>> AND WE'LL BREAK DOWN SOME OF THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THE TASK FORCE RECENTLY MADE ABOUT HOW TO PROP UP THE UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE SYSTEM.

JASON BAILEY, GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN, SIR P WE ALSO HAVE A HEALTHY SURPLUS, ALMOST $2 BILLION.

SO WHAT DOES THE KENTUCKY CENTER FOR ECONOMIC POLICY SAY LAWMAKERS SHOULD BE FOCUSED ON IN THIS UPCOMING SESSION?

>> SO THE SURPLUS IS REALLY A ONCE IN A GENERATION, MAYBE ONCE IN A LIFETIME OPPORTUNITY TO BEGIN TO REINVEST IN THE CORE SERVICES THAT WE HAVE FRANKLY DEPLETED AS A STATE THROUGH 20 ROUNDS OF BUDGET CUTS SINCE 2008.

I MEAN, THERE ARE THINGS, CRISES WHEN IT COMES TO CHILD WELFARE, WHEN IT COMES TO THE OPIOID CRISIS, AND WE ARE NOT ABLE TO RETAIN WORKERS IN MANY CASES IN STATE SERVICES TO ... DEAL WITH THOSE IF YOU LOOK AT THE SOCIAL WORKERS, FOR EXAMPLE, NEARLY HALF OF THE SOCIAL WORKERS HAVE BEEN THERE LESS THAN A YEAR BECAUSE THE TURNOVER IS SO HIGH BECAUSE THE PAY IS SO LOW, AND WE'VE GOTTEN RID OF PENSIONS IN 2013 FOR STATE WORKERS.

THEY HAVEN'T GOTTEN RAISES IN NINE OF THE LAST 11 YEARS, AND THAT'S BUN ONE OF THE EXAMPLES THAT WE NEED TO USE THIS SURPLUS WHICH IS ENORMOUS, AND BECAUSE OF THE FEDERAL AID THAT'S COME DOWN TO BEGIN TO REINVEST NI IT'S TIME TO REINVEST AND PUT ON US A BETTER TRACK WITH THESE CORE SERVICES:'S'S, HEALTH CARE, HUMAN SERVICES, THAT ARE CORE TO ADDRESSING YOUR PROBLEMS WHEN IT COMES TO CREATING FAMILY STABILITY AND MAKING OUR ECONOMY STRONGER OVER TIME.

>> HOW MUCH MONEY DO WE STILL HAVE LEFTOVER FROM ARPA FUND, AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN ACT?

>> WE'VE GOT $1.1 BILLION LEFT IN THAT ARPA FUNDS, AND THEN IN STATE DOLLARS BECAUSE OF LAST YEAR'S SURPLUS AND THE SURPLUS WE EXPECT NOW IS ANOTHER ABOUT $3.2 BILLION.

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT $4.3 BILLION.

TO PUT THAT IN CONTEXT, THE ANNUAL BUDGET IS ABOUT $12 BILLION.

SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A LOT OF MONEY.

RENEE, WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THE BUDGET FOR MONTHS.

IT'S ALWAYS ABOUT WHAT YOU HAVE TO CUT.

WE DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT THIS TIME AROUND.

WE CAN REINVEST AND PUT KENTUCKY HAVE ON A BETTER TRAJECTORY.

>> BUT IF YOU'RE DIPLOMACYING RAISES ON A RECURRING BASIS WE'VE GOT ONE-TIME MONEY.

>> WE'VE GOT SEVERAL YEARS OF MONEY, AND THEN WE NEED TO DO THINGS THAT WE SAID FOR A LONG TIME WITH OUR TAX SYSTEM WHICH IS NOT TO CUT TAXES BUT CLOSE LOOPHOLES, ASK THE WEALTHY AND CORPORATIONS TO PAY THEIR FAIR SHARE OF TAXES SO WE CAN CONTINUE THOSE SERVICES DOWN THE ROAD.

THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN THE CASE.

BUT NOW IS THE TIME WE CAN BEGIN TO START ON A BETTER PATH.

>> SO NANCY FROM WALTON, KENTUCKY ASKS WHAT CAN THE STATE LEGISLATURE TO DO TO BOLSTER AGRICULTURE IN THE UPCOMING SESSION?

ANY AG IDEAS?

AGRI-BECK TECH IS BIG.

KATE SHANK, WHAT IDEAS DO YOU THINK SHOULD BE FLOATED?

>> DEFINITELY AGRI-TECH.

AGRICULTURE IS AN IMPORTANT PART OF OUR ECONOMY, AN IMPORTANT SECTOR OF OUR ECONOMY.

I THINK ALL OF THE ISSUES THAT WE TALK ABOUT, THOUGH, AT THE CHAMBER REALLY FOCUS BUSINESS WIDE, AND SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT WORKFORCE, WE KNOW THAT THAT'S IMPACTING AGRICULTURE SECTOR AS WELL.

WHEN WE TALKING ABOUT TAXES, THERE ARE IMPACTS ON THE AGRICULTURE SECT AS WELL.

I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT PROMISE THAT CAN BE SHAPED IN A WAY THAT IMPACTS ALL OF THESE SECTORS ACROSS KENTUCKY, INCLUDING AGRICULTURE.

IT'S A VERY IMPORTANT PART OF OUR ECONOMY.

I KNOW INFRASTRUCTURE IS IMPORTANT FOR AGRICULTURE.

I KNOW SOME OF THE STUFF HA WE DO ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL AND SOME OF THE REGULATIONS ON FEDERAL LEVEL IMPORTANT FOR US TO BE ENGAGED ON, AND SO I THINK THAT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY WILL DEFINITELY BE TACKLING SOME OF THOSE USUALS IN THE UPCOMING SESSION.

>> ONE THING THAT I DIDN'T HEAR ANYONE MENTION, AND WE WON'T DWELL ON THIS BECAUSE WE'LL WAIT UNTIL THAT WE HAVE THE LEADERSHIP COME IN AT THE VERY FIRST OF THE YEAR, REDISTRICTING, RIGHT?

AND SO WE'RE NO PULLING OUT MAPS TONIGHT.

THE HOUSE IS WORKING ON THEIRS.

THE SENATE'S WORKING ON THEIRS.

AND AS WE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER, HOPEFULLY MAYBE THAT GETS DONE THE FIRST FEW DAYS OF THE SESSION.

ANYTHING THAT YOU CAN TELL US?

SO WE KNOW THAT SENATOR STIVERS HAD REITERATED AT A RENT RECENT PRESS CONFERENCE THERE ARE TWO GUIDING PRINCIPLES.

YOU CAN'T DIVIDE COUNTIES UNLESS IT'S NECESSARY MULE PER THE STATE AND FEDERAL CONSTITUTION.

FEDERAL REPRESENTATION.

ONE PERSON, ONE VOTE.

SO KNOWING THAT YOU HAD THOSE GUIDING PRINCIPLES, ANY INTEL YOU HAVE, SENATOR HOWELL, ON HOW THE PROCESS IS SHAPING UP AND THE TROYER IS EPPING SHAPE IN THE SENATE?

>> YOU MENTIONED PULLING OUT MAPS AND LOOKING A THEM.

THERE'S PROBABLY MORE MAPS DRAWN THAT PROBABLY LOOKS LIKE A SCHOOL LIGHT ART PROJECT IN BOTH CHAMBERS AS EVERYBODY LOOKS THROUGH THIS AND HOW IT AFFECTS THEIR DISTRICTS.

>> AND INCUMBENTS.

HOW IT AFFECTS INCUMBENTS WHO MIGHT BE PRIMARIED, ET CETERA.

>> THERE ARE A LOT OF ISSUES AT STAKE IN THIS.

AND I. I THINK THAT DISCUSSION IS BEING HAD TO KIND OF NARROW THOSE GAPS AND TRY TO BUILD SON CONSENSUS.

IT'S A PROCESS AND IT'S VERY NEAR AND DEAR TO A LOT OF PEOPLE IN BOTH CHAMBERS, ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE, BUT I THINK AT THAT POINT THE MAPS THAT LEADERSHIP IS WORKING THROUGH WILL BE PRESENTED EARLY ON IN THE SESSION AND WE'LL TRY TO REACH SOME CONSENSUS AND MOVE FORWARD.

>> REPRESENTATIVE RAYMOND, THE LAST TIME WE DID THIS WE HAD A BIFURCATED GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

THE HOUSE WAS CONTROLLED BY THE DEMOCRATS, THE SENATE CONTROLLED BY THE REPUBLICANS.

NOW IT'S A -- >> YEAH.

>> A DUALITY.

>> I CAN'T WAIT TO SEE WHAT THEY COOK UP BECAUSE IF YOU BELIEVE IT I'VE NOT BEEN AND UNDER NOBODY HAS SHOWN ME THE MAPS AND NOBODY ASKED MY OPINION BUT I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE A FAIR AND TRAINS PARENT PROCESS THAT'S NOTE RUSHED.

EVERYTHING I'M HEARING ABOUT HOW THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY IS GOING TO HANDLE REDISTRICTING IT'S ABOUT HOW FAST WE CAN MOVE, AND JUST BECAUSE WE CAN, DOESN'T MEAN WE SHOULD.

WHEN LOUISVILLE METRO CROWNS REDREW NEW MAPS THEY IN THREE PUBLIC HEARINGS AND IMPLEMENTED CHANGES THAT WERE RESPONSIVE TO THOSE CONCERNS.

I THINK IT'S A MODEL.

>> AND KNOW E. WE KNOW THERE'S DEPOPULATION HAPPENING IN THE EASTERN AND WESTERN PARTS OF THE STATE JUST AS IS HAPPENING NATIONWIDE.

PEOPLE ARE FLOCKING ON THE URBAN CENTERS SO YOU CAN SEE CHANGES IN BOWLING GREEN AND REPRESENTATION.

SO WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT HOW THE REDISTRICTING PROCESS SHOULD BE DONE, HOW IT SHOULD UNFOLD, AND MAKING SURE THAT YOU AT LEAST ADHERE TO THOSE TWO GUIDING PRINCIPLES THAT ARE REQUIRED?

>> I THINK TRANSPARENCY IS IMPORTANT.

OBVIOUSLY, THESE THINGS MATTER.

IT'S IMPORTANT THAT COMMUNITIES AREN'T, YOU KNOW, -- THAT THE LINES AREN'T DRAWN IN WAYS THAT DON'T CORRESPOND TO WHAT ACTUAL COMMUNITIES IN THE STATE.

I THINK IT'S AN IMPORTANT PROCESS.

IN TERMS OF THE POLITICS OF IT IN THIS SESSION, HIT THE HAS THE POTENTIAL TO PERHAPS START US OFF ON NOT THE BEST FOOTING.

IF THERE ARE DISAGREEMENTS BETWEEN PARTICULAR INCUMBENTS OR PARTIES ABOUT HOW THE LINES ARE DRAWN, SO IT'S NOT GREAT TIMING WHEN YOU'RE ALSO TRYING TO DO A BUDGET AND DO EVERYTHING ELSE BUT IT'S JUST PART OF THE PROCESS.

>> KATE, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO ADD?

>> WE DON'T GET INVOLVED IN REDISTRICTING PROCESS, RENEE.

>> I WAS EXPECTING THAT.

>> WE'LL BE WATCHING.

>> RIGHT, YES.

>> WE'LL WATCH IT.

>> YOU COULD HAVE PROBABLY ANSWER THAT HAD FOR HER.

>> I KNEW IT WAS COMING.

AND WE WILL TALK ABOUT THAT MORE AT THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR.

SO LET'S TALK ABOUT TODAY THERE HAS A TASK FORCE MEETING, THE HOUSE DEMOCRATS ARE HAVING THESE MEETINGS ABOUT I.

ESSENTIAL WORKERS AND REWARDING FRONTLINE AND ESSENTIAL WORKERS, AND THIS IS THE HOUSE DEMOCRATIC CAUCUS AND THEY'VE HAD A HEARING TODAY, ANOTHER ONE DECEMBER 15th.

HOW DOES THIS ALL CONNECT TO THE GOVERNOR'S AGENDA FOR HERO PAY?

IS IT CONNECTED IN THAT WAY?

AND WHAT DO HOUSE DEMOCRATS WANT?

>> I THINK IT'S RESPONSIVE TO HIS CALL TO REWARD ESSENTIAL EMPLOYEES WHO WERE HEROS AND ALL OF A SUDDEN STARTED BEING TREATED LIKE TRASH AGAIN, AND THAT IS RELATED TO WORKFORCE ISSUES WHERE WE HAVE SEEN THE WORKFORCE SAYING I DON'T WANT TO WORK IN RETAIL OR FOOD SERVICE ANYMORE, AND THEY'RE E EVALUATING THEIR PRIORITIES IN THEIR LIFE.

THIS IS A CORE VALUE OF THE HOUSE DEMOCRATIC CAUCUS.

WE'VE SEEN IN LOUISVILLE WHAT BONUS PAY HAS HA DONE FOR THE MORALE ESSENTIAL WORKERS, WHETHER IT'S OUR BUS DRIVERS.

LAST WICK WAS IN THE 911 DISPATCH CENTER AND HEARING THAT IT MEANT TO THEM TO BE RECOGNIZED AND ACKNOWLEDGE FOR WORKING THROUGH THE MOST TRYING TIME THAT WE'VE HAD IN OUR LIFETIME IT.

MEANT SO MUCH TO THEM.

AND IS ONE WE WANT TO LOOK AT THAT IMPACT STATEWIDE.

>> SO THE $400 MILLION PROPOSITION BY THE GOVERNOR THE USING $400 MILLION OF THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN FOR THIS HERO PAY, ONCE DIVIDE THAT OUT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT $500 A PERSON.

IS THAT IMPACTFUL IN YOUR PURSUE?

>> YOU WOULDN'T WANT TO GET AN EXTRA $500 IN APPRECIATION FOR YOUR HARD WORK AND YOUR DEDICATION TO THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU?

>> IS IT ENOUGH?

>> WE'D LIKE FOOD MORE.

WE'D LIKE TO DO MORE FOR EVERY TOPIC THAT WE'RE GOING DO DISCUSS TONIGHT.

WE THINK WE'D LIKE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THEM IN A MEANINGFUL WAY, AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE HEARING FROM THEM IN THAT WAY.

>> SENATOR HOWELL $6,500 A PERSON MEANINGFUL?

>> ANY KIND OF MONEY IN YOUR BACK POCKET IS MEANINGFUL IN THIS SORT OF THING.

I THINK IT'S INTERESTING THERE'S GOING TO BE, TO REPRESENTATIVE'S POINT, THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF DIFFERENT OPINIONS ON HOW TO YOU SPEND A LOT OF THESE FUNDS, AND THAT'S PART OF THE PROCESS THAT WE'LL WORK THROUGH.

THE GOVERNOR'S OUT IN FRONT OF OF THIS, BUT THIS ALL WILL COME THROUGH AS PART OF THE BUDGET PROCESS AND EVERYTHING WILL BE LOOKED AT TOGETHER AT THAT POINT.

I THINK THAT WE'RE AKIN TO LOOKING A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT THINGS TO ADDRESS WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION AND IMPROVING OVERALL BASIS NOR OUR WORKERS ON A NUMBER OF LEVELS AND TAX REFORM IS PROBABLY GOING TO FIT INTO THAT AS WELL.

>> KATE SHANKS, LEADER DAMON THAYER IN THE SENATE HAD SAID WE WANTS TO REALLY HELP THE TOURISM AND HOSPITALITY INDUSTRY.

$75MILLION TO GO TOWARDS TOURISM WEEK MARKETING, ET CETERA, AND ALL THAT.

GIVE SOME TO THE C CONVENTION AND VISITOR BUREAUS TO HELP THEM BECAUSE THEY ARE THE BOOTS ON THE GROUND, THE RETAIL SALES, GETTING HOTELS TO IF I AM, ET CETERA, ET CETERA.

DOES THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER HAVE A OPINION ON WHAT SHOULD BE DONE WITH THAT $1.1 BILLION OF AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN MONEY WHEN IT COMES TO HELPING REKIVE VIVE THE KE ECONOMY?

>> I'M THINKING OF THE TWO APPROPRIATION REVENUE CHAIRS AND HOW TOUGH IT'S GOING TO BE BECAUSE ALL OF US COMING TO THEM RIGHT NOW AND SAYING, WE THINK THIS IS WHAT YOU SHOULD DO WITH THIS MONEY, BUT LOTS OF GREAT IDEAS OUT THERE AND IT'S A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE INVESTMENTS IN NEW PROGRAMS.

I THINK WE'RE GOING TO TALK A LOT ABOUT THIS SESSION 2 BUDGET RESERVE TRUST FUND AND MAKING SURE MONEY IS SET ASIDE.

ARE THERE GOING TO BE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT PENSION AND PAYING DOWN PENSION DEBT AND LIABILITY.

THE CHAMBERS HAVE ALWAYS BEEN INVOLVED IN PENSIONS AND PAYING THE ACTUARIAL REQUIRED CONTRIBUTION IN KENTUCKY TEACHERS' RETIREMENT STABILITY I THINK THERE'S ALSO GOING TO BE DISCUSSION ON PROJECTS AND PROGRAMS.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT A HOUSEHOLD BUDGET, WHEN ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU GET FUNDS, YOU'RE GOING TO THINK WHAT CAN I PAY DOWN, HOW CAN I SET SOME MONEY ASIDE, BUT WHAT I CAN SPEND MONEY ON THAT I HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO SPEND THE MONEY ON BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T HAVE THOSE RESOURCES.

I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE A PRETTY WELL-ROUND DISCUSSION.

WE HAVE SPECIFIC THINGS WE THINK WE SHOULD FUND.

CHILD CARE IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT.

THERE MIGHT BE SOME NEW PILOT PROGRAMS THAT WE CAN TEST OUT IN THE STATE, NEW GRANT PROGRAMS.

WE'D LOVE TO LOOK AT HOW PRIVATE EMPLOYERS CAN PLAY A ROLE IN CHILD CARE.

MENTIONED THE TRUST FUND.

>> FULL-DAY KINDERGARTEN.

>> FUNDING FOR FULL-DAY KINDERGARTEN IS SOMETHING WE SUPPORTED LAST YEAR AS WELL.

WORKFORCE IN GENERAL.

THERE COULD BE WORKFORCE PROGRAMS THAT WE ARE INVESTING IN TO INCREASE EDUCATION ATTAINMENT LEVEL.

WE TALKED ABOUT SUBSTANCE USE DISORDER IN KENTUCKY THE TRENDS ARE NOT GOOD IN KENTUCKY.

OVERDOSE DEATH ARE UP 2020 OVER 2019, ABOUT A 50% INCREASE.

SO THERE ARE THE WAYS THAT WE CAN PUT SOME MONEY INTO HELPING THOSE WHO SUFFER FROM ADDICTION OR THOSE THAT ARE JUSTICES INVOLVED OR INCARCERATED BECAUSE OF ADDICTION.

SO THERE'S ALL SORTS OF PROGRAMS, ALL SORTS OF A ASKS.

I DON'T THINK I'D LIKE TO BE THE APPROPRIATION AND REVENUE CHAIR IN IN BUDGET.

YOU THINK CUTTING THE BUDGET IS HARBUT THERE'S ALSO GOING TO BE A LOT OF DISCUSSION AND IDEAS FLOATED FOR THESE FUNDS.

>> AND THE CAPITOL IS GOING TO BE OPEN THIS TIME AROUND.

>> WE'LL BE THERE EVERY DAY.

I THINK IT WILL BE AN INTERESTING DISCUSSION THOUGH.

>> JASON BAILEY, SO THERE IS SO MANY DISCUSSION ABOUT PUTTING SOME OF THE $1 BILLION TOWARD THE PENSION LIABILITIES, RIGHT?

WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THAT?

THAT COULD HELP PAY THAT DOWN A LOT QUICKER.

>> WE'VE GOTTEN TO A REALLY GOOD TRACK IN FUNDING OUR PENSION SYSTEMS OVER THE LAST -- STARTING IN 2014 AND 2017 ON THE TEACHERS PLAN.

WE ARE PUTTING A LOT OF MONEY INTO THAT.

THAT PROBLEM WILL NOTING SOLVED SHORT-TERM.

IT IS A VERY LONG-TERM PROBLEM.

WE NEED TO CONTINUE TO MAKE THOSE CONTRIBUTIONS.

BUT, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE BEST, ACTUALLY THE BEST THING WE CAN DO FOR THE PENSION SYSTEM IS TO HIRE NEW PEOPLE AND GIVE CURRENT EMPLOYEES RAISES BECAUSE THE LIFE BLOOD OF A PENSION SYSTEM IS NEW EMPLOYEES THAT ARE PAYING IN THAT AREN'T GOING TO COLLECT A PENSION FOR A LONG TIME SO WHEN WE HIRE SOCIAL WORKERS AND GIVE THEM RAISES, WHEN WE HIRE PUBLIC DEFENDER AND CUT THEIR CASELOAD SO THEY CAN ACTUALLY HANDLE WHAT THEY'RE DEALING WITH, WHEN WE DO THOSE THINGS ON THE PERSONNEL SIDE, THAT'S THE BEST THING WE CAN DO TO CONTRIBUTE TO THE PENSION SYSTEM.

WE'VE GOT TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT -- THIS IS A LOT OF MONEY BUT IT'S NOT A LOT OF MONEY WHEN YOU START THROWING IN A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS.

THE PENSION SYSTEM IS A BIG HOLE THAT CAN EAT UP A LOT.

THERE ARE SOME IMMEDIATE NEEDS.

WE NEED TO GO BACK TO THE PURPOSE OF THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN ACT.

IT WAS A RESCUE PLAN.

WE KNOW THE FOLKS THAT WERE HURT THE MOST ARE THE PEOPLE WHO LOST THOSE LOW WAGE JOBS AND THEY'RE STILL HURTING.

P WE'RE 72,000 JOBS SHORT OF WHERE WE WERE PRE-COVID.

NEARLY A THIRD OF KENTUCKY ADULTS THAY THEIR FAMILY IS HAVING TROUBLE MEETING BASICKEST NEEDS.

SO WE NEED TO BE LOOKING A FOOD ASSISTANCE.

WE NEED TO BE LOOKING AT CASH INCENTIVES.

WE NEED TO LOOK AT THINGS LIKE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

WE NEED TO LOOK AT THINGS LIKE CHILD CARE AND FUNDING FOR ADDICTION P. THOSE ARE THE KIND OF THINGS THAT MOST STATES ARE PUTTING THAT AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN MONEY INTO.

WE ALREADY PUT A BIG CHUNK INTO HELPING BUSINESSES BY PAYING OFF THE UNEMPLOYMENT LOAN WHICH LOWERS THEIR TAXES.

WE PASSED A LOT OF CORPORATE TAX CUTS LAGS TIME.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT PEOPLE ARE THE PRIORITY IN THIS LEGISLATIVE SESSION.

>> BUT KATE SCHANKS SHANKS, FROM THE REPORT THAT THE TAX FOUNDATION RELEASED, WHICH I GUESS THAT WAS FUNDED BY CHAMBERS, IT'S A NON-PROFIT BUT IT IS FUND BY CHAMBERS OF PERHAPS, PERHAPS THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER AS WELL, IT HAS SOME RECOMMENDATIONS ON TWEAKING THE TAX CODE, AND ONE OF THEM IS LOWERING THE INDIVIDUAL AND CORPORATE TAX RATE TO WHAT?

IT'S ALREADY AT 5%.

HOW LOW SHOULD IT BE?

>> THAT'S AN EXCELLENT WELL.

DEPENDS ON WHO YOU ASK.

AND SO THE REPORT WAS PUBLISHED BY THE TSSAA FOUND.

IT'S AN INDEPENDENCE REPORT OF TAX FOUNDATION.

WE DID SUPPORT IT.

WE DID PROVIDE FUNDING TO SUPPORT IT, A GRANT.

LOTS OF DIFFERENT RECOMMENDATIONS IN THAT REPORT.

I HIGHLY ENCOURAGE MEME TO LOOK AT IT AND, OF COURSE, WE'VE SHARED IT FROM THE LEGISLATURE INVESTMENT UNTIL IN TERMS OF INDIVIDUAL TAX RATE WE ARE ATING 5%.

THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY IN 2014 REDUCED THE TOP RATE TO 6.5 AND COLLAPSED THE RATES FOR INDIVIDUAL AND CORPORATE.

IN THINKING ABOUT WHAT SHOULD IT BE, WE LOOK AT LOT AT SURROUNDING STATES, AND WHAT WE HAVE FOUND IS THAT A LOT OF STATES AROUND US MIGHT LOOK LIKE WE'RE COMPETITIVE WITH THEM BUT THEY'RE ALL DROPPING THEIR INDIVIDUAL INCOME TAX RATES.

>> TENNESSEE DOESN'T HAVE ONE.

>> TENNESSEE DOESN'T HAVE ONE.

TENNESSEE NEVER HAD ONE.

BUT 12 STATES IN 2021 HAVE REDUCED THEIR INCOME TAX AND THERE IS MORE COMING.

SO IF WE SIT WHERE WE ARE TODAY AT 5% WE'RE GOING TO START LOSING GROUND AND WE'RE GOING TO LOOK LESS AND LESS COMPETITIVE RELATIVE TO OTHER STATES.

THE INDIVIDUAL INCOME TAX IS VERY IMPORTANT FOR MULTIPLE REASONS.

ONE, THERE ARE LOTS OF BUSINESSES THAT PAY IT AS PASSTHROUGHS.

SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS, FOR EXAMPLE.

AND THEN, OF COURSE, US INDIVIDUALS PAY THE INCOME TAX, AND WHEN WE DEAL WITH INFLATION, HIGHER COSTSCH LIVING, HAVING MORE MONEY IN OUR POCKETS BY REDUCING THE INCOME TAX RATE IS IMPORTANT.

WHEN WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE CENSUS DATA AND YOU LOOK AT THE STATES AND HOW THEY HAVE GROWN IN TERMS OF POPULATION, GDP, WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION, WE KNOW THAT STATES WITH A LOWER INCOME TAX RATE ARE DOING BETTER IN GENERAL THAN THOSE WITH THE HIGHER.

SO THE INCOME TAX RATE IS VERY IMPORTANT.

IN TERMS OF HOW LOW SHOULD WE GO, I THINK FOR US WE WANT TO JUST START MOVING DOWN.

JUST START MOVING THAT INCOME TAX RATE DOWN.

AND PERHAPS LOOK AT SOME OF THE THINGS THAT NORTH CAROLINA DID WITH REVENUE TRIGGERS.

WE KIND OF HAVE TO BE CAREFUL NOT TO MAKE A BIG CHANGE OVERNIGHT BECAUSE IT IS BRINGING IN THE MAJORITY OF OUR REVENUE.

THE INCOME TAX DOES BRING IN THE MAJORITY OF OUR REVENUE.

AND SO IF YOU GO FROM 5 TO ZERO OVERNIGHT, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A PRETTY BIG HIT TO THE BUDGET.

BUT WE CAN MAKE INCREMENTAL CHANGES TO THE INCOME TAX AND START DRIVING IT DOWN AND STAY COMPETITIVE WITH SURROUNDING STATES AND COMPETITOR STATES ARE ON EVEN DO BETTER THAN THEM.

WE'RE AT 19th IN THE NATION IN TERMS OF OUR TAX CODE COMPETITIVENESS, ACCORDING TO THE TAX FOUNDATION.

INDIANA AND NORTH CAROLINA DO BETTER THAN US.

SO DOES TENNESSEE.

SO WE CAN START MAKING CHANGES TO IMPROVE OUR COMPETITIVENESS AND THE REPORT LAYS OUT NUMEROUS EXAMPLES AND OPPORTUNITIES OF HOW TO DO IT.

>> REPRESENTATIVE RAYMOND, DO YOU BUY THAT APPROACH?

>> NO.

SO THAT REPORT COMES FROM A CONSERVATIVE ORGANIZATION, RIGHT?

AND TAX REFORM, YOU'RE ALREADY HEARING IT A LOT.

THAT CAN MEAN A LOT OF THINGS.

IT'S A REDUCTION IN INCOME TAX THAT'S COMING.

WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO THAT AND SEE LOUISVILLE TURN INTO NASHVILLE OVERNIGHT OR EVER.

YOU WOULD HAVE TO MAKE UP FOR THOSE LOST FUNDS, PROBABLY WITH THE TAX ON GROCERIES.

SO YOU'RE THAT I GO ABOUT FAMILIES WHO HAVE A CAREFULLY CALIBRATED GROCERY BILL AND WE'RE ABOUT TO FLOW A WRENCH INTO IT.

THERE'S BEEN TALK OF CLOSING CORPORATE TAX LOOPHOLES.

THAT'S A GOOD IDEA.

DEMOCRATS NOT GOING TO FIGHT ANY BURDEN ON LOW-INCOME KENTUCKIANS.

BUT I THINK WE'VE GOT TO FORGIVE THE PEOPLE OF KENTUCKY FOR BEING TOLD THAT, YOU KNOW, WE CAN COMPETE WITH ANYBODY DUE TO OUR LOGISTICS INDUSTRY AND OUR RESOURCES AND OUR WATER AND OUR UNBRIDLED SPIRIT.

FORD JUST INVESTED $5 BILLION.

AND THEN WE'RE BEING TOLD THE SKY WILL FALL IF WE DON'T LOWER OUR INCOME TAX RATE BY 1%.

NOW, I'M NOT GOING TO MOVE MY FAMILY ACROSS STATE LINES TO SAVE 1% ON NIGH INCOME TAX BUT I MAY FOR PRE-K AND OTHER INVESTMENTS THAT WE CAN MAKE.

>> SENATOR HOWELL.

>> I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TAX REFORM TO LOOK AT IT IN A GLOBAL SCALE.

I THINK THE REPRESENTATIVE'S POINT IS CORRECT.

IT'S VERY COMPLEX.

I THINK THAT ONE OF THE KEY THINGS TO REMEMBER ABOUT TAX REFORM IS THAT WE NEED TO TRY TO BUILD ON OUR PRO-JOB CREATION POLICIES.

IT'S IMPORTANT, I THINK, THAT THE INCOME TAX REFORMS WOULDN'T BE FOCUSED ON RAISING THE AMOUNT OF TAXES THAT PEOPLE PAY, BUT IT'S GROWING THE NUMBER OF TAXPAYERS IN OUR SYSTEM BY IMPROVING OUR OVERALL BUSINESS ENVIRONMENT AND JOB ENVIRONMENT TO CREATE MORE JOBS.

I THINK THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT GETS LOST IN IT.

THE INCOME TAX STARTED IN A ENVIRONMENT WHERE OUR ECONOMY WAS A LOT SIMPLER THAN IT IS TODAY.

OUR ECONOMY'S CHANGED IN A LOT OF WAYS THAT WE DO BUSINESS MOVING MORE TOWARD A SERVICE ECONOMY.

AND IF WE'RE GOING TO DO RESPONSIBLE TAXATION, WE HAVE TO TAX OUR ECONOMY THE WAY IT OPERATES.

>> CONSUMPTION-BASED TAX SYSTEM.

>> RIGHT.

>> WHAT YOU FREQUENTLY CALL IT.

JASON BAILEY, YOUR THOUGHTS ON THAT.

AND COULD IT BE THAT BECAUSE OF THE 2018 REFORMS, THAT WAS WHAT KIND OF SWEDEN THE POT FOR FORD TO INVEST BEFORE F.L.D.S.

IN KENTUCKY?

>> -- >> NO, KENTUCKY HAS THE INFRASTRUCTURE TO ATTRACT THE AUTO INDUSTRY TOTE CENTRAL LOCATION IN THE EASTERN PART OF THE UNITED STATES.

SO THAT'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ISSUE THAT'S ALREADY BEEN UNFOLDING FOR A LONG PERIOD OF TIME WHEN WE HAVE HAD AN INCOME TAX.

PEOPLE LOOK AT THE TAX FOUNDATION'S RANKINGINGS OF COMPETITIVENESS.

THEY SAY THE NUMBER ONE COMPETITIVE STATE IN THE COUNTRY IS WYOMING.

THEY HAVE HALF A MILLION PEOPLE COMPARED TOWER 4 MILLION PEOPLE, AND THE STATE THAT RANKS AT THE BOTTOM ARE THE BIGGEST AND MOST VIBRANT ECONOMIES IN THE ENTIRE COUNTRY.

THIS IS EXACTLY UPSIDE DOWN OF WHAT WE NEED TO DO.

WHEN YOU'RE MOVING AWAY FROM THE INCOME TAX YOU'RE CUTTING SHIFTING TAXES.

CUTTING TAXES FOR CORPORATIONS AND WEALTHY INDIVIDUALS AND ACTUALLY RAISING THEM FOR THE MIDDLE-CLASS KENTUCKIANS, THE WORKING CLASS AND THE POOR.

WHAT THE PROSPEROUS STATES ARE DOING, THE STATES THAT ARE GLOWING, THE STATES THAT ARE LEADING THE COUNTRY IS THEY ARE RAISING MILLIONAIRES TAXES.

THEY ARE CLOSING CORPORATE TAX LOOPHOLES, AND THEY'RE USING THAT MONEY TO INVEST IN EARLY CHILDHOOD.

>> WHAT STATES ARE THOSE?

>> STATES LIKE MINNESOTA, STATES LIKE OCCURRING.

WASHINGTON STATE HAS CREATED A CAPITAL GAINS TAX.

COLORADO.

NOT STATES LIKE TENNESSEE THAT ARE POOR SOUTHERN STATES LIKE WE ARE.

SO WE NEED TO LOOK AT WHAT REALLY WORKS, AND THE RECIPE OF WHAT REALLY WORKS, AND THAT'S TO INVEST AND TO ASK THOSE WHO HAVE MORE TO PITCH IN.

THIS IS A -- THIS IS A PATHWAY THAT WILL LEAD TO A GREATER INEQUALITY, AND WE ALREADY SAW THAT IN 2018 WHEN THAT PACKAGE PASSED, THE BOTTOM 95 OF KENTUCKIANS PAID MORE IN TAXES ON AVERAGE.

ONLY THE TOP 5% GOT A TAX CUT.

MILLIONAIRES.

IT LOOKS LIKE MILLIONAIRES ARE DOING WELL WITH THE STOCK MARKET.

CORPORATIONS ARE DOING DOING WELL.

BUT EVERYDAY PEOPLE, WORKERS ARE HAVING A HARD TAME, AND TO INCREASE THEIR SALES TAXES WOULD MAKE THEIR OVERALL TAXES GO UP.

>> IS THE KENTUCKY CHAM L. CHAMBER FOR INCREASING THE TAXES AND.

>> FIRST FAYETTE COUNTY I WANT TO MEAN IT DOES NOT AUTOMATIC THATTING GROCERS.

WILL IT ABSOLUTELY COME UP IN CONVERSATION.

WE HAVE BEEN HAVING A TOUR OF THE STATE, HAVING A LISTENING TOUR, TALKING TO PEOPLE.

IT COMES UP.

THERE ARE DIFFERENT WAYS THAT STATES PAY FOR GROCERIES.

IN TERMS OF THE SALES TAX RATE WE HAVE ONE OF THE LOWER ONES IN NATION.

TENNESSEE IS THE HIGHEST AT ALMOST 10% COMBINED LOCAL AND STATE SALES TAX, AND SO THERE COULD BE TWEAKS TO THAT.

WE NOT ANT OUR SALES TAX RATE EVER INCREASED TO THE POINT WHERE WE WOULD BE LESS COMPETITIVE OR WE'D BE ON THE HIGHER SIDE.

WHEN WE WERE DOWN IN THE SOUTHERN PART OF KENTUCKY ALONG THE BORDER WITH TENNESSEE TALKING WITH PEOPLE ABOUT TAXES, THEY WOULD TELL US ABOUT ALL OF THE NASHVILLE LICENSE PLATES COMING ACROSS THE BORDER.

WE KNOW THESE THINGS.

WE ALSO KNOW THAT THE REFORMS FOR 2018 WERE IMPORTANT.

THEY WERE HELPFUL FOR OUR ECONOMY.

AND I'M GOING TO AGREE WITH JASON THAT HE SAID THAT IS A VERY IMPORTANT POINT.

OUR LOCATION, OUR PROXIMITY IN KENTUCKY WHERE OUR STATE IS LOCATED, CLOSE TO TWO-THIRDS WITHIN A DAY'S DRIVE, TWO-THIRDS OF THE POPULATION IS SUGGESTED, AND ABSOLUTELY THE AUTO INDUSTRY CARES ABOUT THAT AND SO DOES THE LOGISTICS INDUSTRY AND SO DOES THE MANUFACTURING INDUSTRY AS A WHOLE WHOLE.

SO WE LOOK A TAX REFORM AND OTHER POLICIES THE WAY FOCUS ON IS SWEET TENG POT WE HAVE IN KENTUCKY THAT MAKES US SUCH A GREAT LOS ANGELES.

WYOMING IS A BEAUTIFUL STATE BUT IT IS FAR AWAY.

SO HERE IN KENTUCKY YOU'RE CLOSE TO MOST OF THE POPULATION.

WE HAVE SO MANY PEOPLE TRAVELING THROUGH OUR STATE FOR TOURISM REASONS, PEOPLE COMING IN TO WORK.

WHAT WE WANT TO DO IS TAKE WHAT MAKES US UNIQUE AND PASS LEGISLATION AND ADOPTED POLICIES THAT HELP US GROW OUR STATE.

WE CAN'T STAND STILL AND GROW THAT WAY.

WE NEED TO GROW THROUGH REFORM.

>> I WANT TO PICK UP THE POINT ABOUT GROCERIES BECAUSE I KNOW WE'LL GET COMMENTS ABOUT THAT.

WHAT'S THE CONVERSATION?

ARE PEOPLE FOR IT AGAINST IT?

>> I THINK THE CONVERSATION IMMEDIATELY GOES TO PEOPLE WHO ARE LOWER INCOME AND, OF COURSE, PEOPLE WHO ARE ON SNAP AND WHIP BENEFITS WOULD BE EXCEPTED BUT DOES THAT COVER ALL OF THEIR GROCERY BILL?

INEVITABLY THERE'S A CONVERSATION ABOUT PREPARED FOODS, WHICH YOU THINK OKAY THAT MIGHT BE SOMEBODY WITH A HIGHER INCOME THAT'S PURCHASING PREPARED FOODS, BUT WHAT ABOUT YOUR GRANDPA THAT LIVES ALONE THAT'S NOT GOING TO MAKE A MEAL ON HIS OWN AND ISN'T GOING TO BUY GROCERIES SO HE'S BUYING PREPARED FOOD.

MAYBE HE'S HOW FIXED INCOME.

MAYBE THE INDIVIDUAL THAT HAS MORE INCOME THAT'S BUYING A NICE STEAK OR PIECE OF FISH ISN'T PAYING TAXES ON THAT.

IT'S A VERY COMPLEX ISSUE.

SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT TENNESSEE, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT TAXES GROCERIES BUT THEY TAX IT AT 3%.

THEY DON'T TAX IT AT THE FULL AMOUNT AND I'M NOT ADVOCATING FOR TAXING GROCERIES.

>> KENTUCKY CHAMBER IS NOT ADVOCATING FOR TAXING ISSUES.

>> WE ARE NOT.

WE ARE PUT A POLLUTANT THERE AND HAVING A BROAD CONVERSATION SO THAT PEOPLE CAN TALK ABOUT THESE THINGS BUT IT WILL COME UP IN THE CONVERSATION.

>> SO IT USED TO BE SACRED COWS AND I THOUGHT FOOD AND GROCERIES WERE.

>> THE ISSUES IS THAT IF YOU CUT THE INCOME TAX ONE POINT, THAT COSTS ABOUT $1.2 BILLION.

THAT IS FAR MORE THAN WE SPEND ON OUR ENTIRE HIGHER EDUCATION SYSTEM IN KENTUCKY.

EIGHT UNIVERSITIES, 16 COMMUNITY COLLEGES.

THAT'S HOW MUCH IT COST TO TAKE ONE POINT OFF THE INCOME TAX.

SO IF YOU WANT TO DO THAT, YOU'VE GOT TO LOOK AT WAYS TO PAY FOR IT, AND THAT'S WHY GROCERIES COMES UP.

IN A POOR STATE WHERE PEOPLE STRUGGLE TO MAKE ENDS MEET, ESPECIALLY EVEN MORE SO IN A PANDEMIC, WHY WE WOULD E WIEHN CONSIDER SOMETHING LIKE TAXING GROCERIES TO PAY FOR A TAX CUT FOR WEALTHY PEOPLE?

I DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND WHY THAT WOULD EVEN BE CONSIDERED AN OPTION.

BUT THAT'S THE DIRECTION THAT THE CONVERSATION HAS TO GO WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT CUTTING THE INCOME TAX BECAUSE IT IS SO INCREDIBLY EXPENSIVE.

>> SENATOR U.L.

HOWELL.

>> JUST ONE THING ON THIS.

IN LESS THAN 90 SECONDS WE WENT DEEP INTO THE WEEDS ON THE TAX POLICY, WHAT WE WERE DOING, WHAT WE NEED TO DO, AND THIS DISCUSSION IS GOING TO BE HAD AD NASEUM, BUT WE GET LOST IN WHAT'S RIGHT, WHAT'S THE RIGHT APPROACH, WHAT'S THE RIGHT WAY TO DO THINGINGS AND WE LOSE SIGHT OF THE RELEVANT, AND SOMETIMES IT'S MORE IMPORTANT IN LIFE TO BE RELEVANT THAN IT IS TO BE RIGHT OF THE SOME OF THE THINGS WE DID IN THE LEGISLATURE WITH RIGHT-TO-WORK AND PREVAILING WAGE PUTS IN THE DISCUSSION FOR LOCATIONS OF SOME BUSINESSES THAT JUST SIMPLY WOULD NOT CONSIDER A STATE THAT DIDN'T HAVE THOSE ISSUES.

IF WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO EVOLVE IN THIS ECONOMY, THEN MAYBE WE HAVE TO MIRROR SOME OF THE STATES IN THE PRACTICES THAT THEY'RE DOING WITH TAX REFORM AND MOVING MORE AWAY THE FROM INCOME TAXES AND OTHER THINGS IN ORDER TO REMAIN COMPETITIVE FROM A PERCEPTION AND RELL VANTS STANDPOINT.

>> ANY FURTHER COMMENT?

>> I DON'T KNOW ABOUT BEING RIGHT BUT WE'RE NOT GOING TO BUDGE ON DOING RIGHT TO THE PEOPLE OF KENTUCKY.

KNOW THE EARFUL WE GET ABOUT TAXES ON VETS, ON LAWN CARE.

I WAS AT PUTT PUTT A WEEK AGO AND GOT AN EARFUL ON THE TAX IN 2014.

>> I DIDN'T SAY IT WOULD BE EASY.

>> AND IN AN ELECTION YEAR.

>> IT'S ALWAYS GOING TO COME UP.

GROCERIES WILL ALWAYS COME UP.

>> SO THIS IS A REALLY TOUGH PIVOT.

FROM MIKE MEANHART.

LEGALIZINGS MARIJUANA WOULD RELIEVE BOTH OUR LAW ENFORCEMENT AND CHFF CABINET FOR FAMILY AND -- AND COULD WEEP MORE FAMILIES TOGETHER.

WHERE DOES THE PANEL STAND ON LEGALIZATION?

HE'S HAVING LEGALIZATION BROADLY.

IT COULD BE RECREATIONAL.

IT COULD BE MEDICAL.

LET'S JUST STICK WITH THE MEDICINAL MARIJUANA.

MAYBE YOU CAN ANSWER BOTH.

WHERE ARE YOU?

>> LET'S STARTED WITH MEDICINAL.

SENATOR REPUBLICANS ARE THE BARRIER SO WE'LL HEAR FROM SENATOR HOWELL ABOUT WITH THAT IS.

SINCE WE'VE I NEVER HAD CLOSER LEGISLATOR FROM EVERY COUNTY ACROSS THE AISLE HAVE HEARD HEART-WRENCHING STORIES FROM OUR NEIGHBORS AND OUR CONSTITUENTS ABOUT THE CONDITIONS THAT THEY HAVE FACED AND THE REASONS THEY SEEK MEDICAL MARIJUANA AND THE PAIN THAT THEY HOPE TO ALLEVIATE.

WE HEAR FROM FEROCIOUS FAMILY MEMBERS, AND WE HERE PEOPLE SAYING LET'S WAIT.

FOR WHAT?

36 STATES HAVE MEDICAL MARIJUANA RIGHT NOW.

IF WE WANT TO GET TO THE NEXT POINT 18 STATES HAVE APPROVED IT FOR ADULT USE.

WE'RE EVEN FURTHER AWAY ON THAT.

BUT OUR SIGNATURE INDUSTRIES ARE BOURBON, HORSE RACING, AND TOBACCO.

SO IT BAFFLES ME THAT WE'RE MOVING SO SLOWLY ON MEDICAL MARIJUANA.

SOME PEOPLE THINK THIS DOESN'T EFFECT MY LIFE OR MY FAMILY.

IT COULD COME TO YOUR FAMILY.

A FEW WEEKS AGO SOMEBODY IN MY FAMILY GOT DIAGNOSED, A TERMINAL CANCER DIAGNOSIS AND ONE OF MY SIBLINGS TEXTS ME, "YOU CAN GET WIEDER?"

NOT YET LEGAL NECESSITY KENTUCKY.

MAYBE NEXT YEAR.

>> SENATOR HOWELL, WHERE IS THE SENATE GOP CAUCUS ON THIS?

>> I KNOW WE'VE BEEN MOVING TOWARD THIS ISSUE FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS.

I KNOW REPRESENTATIVE NEMS AND SENATOR WESTERFIELD HAVE BEEN WORKING TOGETHER IN THE INTERIM TO TRY TO DRAFT CRAFT A BILL THAT CAN PASS MUSTER POLITICALLY IN BOTH CAUCUSES.

I'VE SPOKEN WITH BOTHCH THEM, AND THEY ARE VERY FOCUSED ON THIS ISSUE AND ARE WORKING TOWARD BEING ABLE TO PRESENT A BILL THIS SESSION THAT -- >> REPRESENTATIVE NEMES REPORTEDLY SEEMS VERY OPTIMISTIC.

>> IF YOU KNOW REPRESENTATIVE NEMES, HE'S OFTEN OPTIMISTIC ABOUT A LOT OF THINGS.

TO HER POINT, I'M NOT SURE THAT HIS END OF THE BUILDING HAS BEEN THE GREATEST IMPEDIMENT TO THIS.

IT'S BEEN MORE ON OUR END.

SENATOR WESTERFIELD HAS DONE A WOULD THE, ON ON THIS AND HAS FOCUSED ON IT A LOT AND WE'RE HOPEFUL THAT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER OTHER WE'LL HAVE SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE CAN AGREE ON.

>> I THINK THERE IS SYMPTOM -- REPRESENTATIVE MOSER, WHO IS THE CHAIR OF THE HEALTH AND FAMILY SERVICES COMMITTEE, I THINK SHE HAS SAID PUBLICALLY BEFORE THAT SHE THINKS THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE STUDY AND WILL PROBABLY PRESENT A BILL THAT WOULD CAUSE FOR MORE STUDY ON IT.

DO YOU THINK MORE STUDY IS NEEDED?

>> NO, WHEN I VOTE AGAINST IT.

THERE'S A CASE OF REAR OF MAD NESS IN THE LEGISLATURE.

WE'VE GOT ENOUGH DATA ON THIS.

OUR PEOPLE ARE IN PAIN.

OUR PEOPLE ARE SCREAMING OUT IN AGONY.

THEY'RE COMING TO CAPITOL.

THEY'LL BE THERE STRONGER THAN EVER NEXT YEAR, AND THEY'RE DEMANDING IT.

AND WE CAN DO SOMETHING TO IMPROVE THE LIVES OF KENTUCKIANS, PEOPLE WHO ARE SUFFERING, AND WE OUGHT TO DO IT.

>> BUT THERE'S NO REVENUE GENERATION TO THIS AS IT'S BEEN PROPOSED IN THE PAST.

IS THAT GOOD OR BAD, JASON BALEY?

>> IT'S THE FIRSTET STEP THAT EVERY STATE TAKES AND IT'S A STEP THAT IS PAST DUE TIME FOR TO US TAKE IN KENTUCKY AND THEN WE'LL LOOK ITS A OTHER OPTIONS DOWN THE ROAD.

>> DOES THE CHAMBER HAVE A POSITION ON LEGALIZING MEDICINAL MARIJUANA?

>> WE WORKED WITH REPRESENTATIVE NEMES EARLY ON.

THE BILL HAS BEEN OUT THERE A FEW YEARS U.

TO PUT LANGUAGE IN THERE THAT WE THINK IS IMPORTANT FOR EMPLOYERS.

>> NOT GOING TO CHANGE YOUR MIND ON THAT FOR 202, RIGHT?

>> NO, MA'AM.

>> LET'S TALK ABOUT UNEMPLOYMENT AND I'M SURE THERE WILL BE OTHER QUESTIONS THAT COME IN.

SO UNDER THE EMPLOYMENT TASK FORCE WE ALL HAVE READ KIND OF DOMINATED THE HEADLINES ABOUT THOUSANDS OF KENTUCKIANS WAITING TO HAVE THEIR UNEMPLOYMENT CLAIMS RESOLVED, BUT CHANGES COULD BE COMING, JASON BAILEY.

ARE YOU LIKELY LIKING WHAT YOU'RE READING?

OR WHERE DO YOU PUNCH SOME HOLES?

>> I THIS WE'RE CONCERNED ABOUT THE SOME OF THE SUGGESTIONS THAT ARE OUT THERE THAT MAY INVOLVE SOME COUTS TOWN EMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.

IF ANYTHING, IF YOU LOOK BACK THROUGH THIS CRISIS IN THE PANDEMIC, IT SHOULD I.

BE A REMINDER TO US OF HOW IMPORTANT UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS ARE.

OUR SYSTEM WAS ANTIQUATED INCLUDING TECHNOLOGY, INADEQUATE STAFFING AND THE BENEFITS WERE HARD TO QUALIFY FOR.

THAT'S WHY PEOPLE STOOD IN THOSE LONG LINES FOR SUCH A LONG PERIOD OF TIME TO GET UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.

BUT THE PEOPLE WHO DID GET THEM, WHEN THEY SPENT THEM, THEIR FAMILIES WERE ABLE TO GET BY.

IT HELPED KEEP BUSINESSES OPEN WHEN THEY SPENT THOSE DOLLARS.

AND WE WOULD BE IN A MUCH DEEPER AND LONGER HOLE IN TERMS OF THE RECESSION IF IT WASN'T FOR THOSE UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.

SO IF ANYTHING WE SHOULD BE LOOKING BACK AT THE LESSONS OF THIS AND FIGURING OUT HOW WE STRENGTHEN THE PROGRAM.

>> BUT HAS IT INCENTIVIZED WORK?

>> IT HASN'T 37 THERE WERE STATES THAT WERE INTERESTS THAT WERE PUSHING THE STATES TO QUIT THE FEDERAL BENEFITS, EXPANDED BENEFITS EARLY.

THANKFULLY WE 20 DO THAT IN KENTUCKY.

NO ALL THE STUDIES THAT HAVE LOOKED BACK AT THAT, AND FOLKS ARGUED THAT THAT WOULD RESULT IN PEOPLE APPLYING FOR MORE JOBS, IT DIDN'T.

THERE WERE OTHER ISSUES GOING ON, MAINLY THAT WE'RE IN A PANDEMIC THAT HAVE KEPT PEOPLE OUT -- SOME PEOPLE OUT OF THE WORKFORCE.

IT WASN'T TUB EMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.

SO IT WASN'T THAT.

IT WAS ACTUALLY A BENEFIT TO THE ECONOMY AS PEOPLE SPENT THAT MONEY.

SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT -- FROM THE TASK FORCE THAT WAS CREATED AROUND UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE TO THE LEGISLATURE IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE BUT I DON'T THINK NOW IS A GOOD TIME TO BE CUTTING ACCESS TO BENEFITS.

WE NEED TO BE MODERNIZE 10 SYSTEM INSTEAD, MAKING SURE IT HAS THE TECHNOLOGY IT NEEDS, MAKE SURE THAT WHEN PEOPLE CAN GET AHOLD OF SOMEBODY IF THEY NEED TO GET THE BENEFITS IN THE FUTURE, THAT WE HAVE THE STAFFING, THE ELIGIBILITY AND THAT WE HAVE THE TAXES TO PAY FOR THE SYSTEM IN THE FUTURE.

THE ONLY REASON WE BORROWED IS THAT OUR TAXES ARE SO LOW, UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS, THEY WERE LOWER THAN THEY HAD EVER BEEN GOING BACK TO 1938 WHEN THE PANDEMIC HIT.

THAT'S WHY WE HAD TO BORROW FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

WE HAVE TO REBUILD THE TAX AND MAKE IT ADEQUATE TO FUND THAT SYSTEM IN THE FUTURE.

IT'S A KEY STABILIZER WHEN THE ECONOMY CALLS IN THE HOLE.

PEOPLE GET BENEFITS, IT HELPS THEIR FAMILIES AND HELPS THE WHOLE ECONOMY BOUNCE BACK.

WE NEED TO PROTECT IT MOVING FORWARD AND STRENGTHEN IT.

>> IS IT A MATTER OF MORE FUNDING OR DO YOU THINK IT NEEDS SOME MORE DRASTIC CHANGE.

>> >> BOTH.

WE THINK THAT WE NEED TO REPLENISH THE TRUST FUND BALANCE TO WHERE IT WAS BEFORE THE PANDEMIC HIT, AND WE THINK THAT THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE WE NEED TO GET TO CO-SOLVENCY.

FUND NEEDS TO BE AT A LEVEL AT THE TIME FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DEEMS SOLVENT, AND IT WOULD BE A SAFER SITUATION IF WE HAVE NOT DOWNTURN IN ECONOMY.

UNDER THE EMPLOYMENT INSURANCE TRUST FUND IS FUNDED SOLE LIE BY EMPLOYER TAXES.

NOW, WE HAD FEDERAL MONEY PAY OFF THE LOAN BUT THAT'S NOT TYPICALLY HOW IT WORKS.

IT IS FUNDED SOLELY BY EMPLOYER TAXES.

AND SO WHEN JASON SAID WE WERE AT THE LOWEST LEVEL BEFORE THE PANDEMIC HIT, WHEN THE FUND HITS $500 MILLION IT TRIGGERS SCHEDULE A WHICH I THINK IS THE SECOND LOWEST, THE SCHEDULE IN THE PROGRAM, AND SO THAT'S WHAT WE WERE PAYING AT.

AND THEN THE PANDEMIC HIT AND IT WIPED OUT IS 650 SOME ODD MILLION DOLLARS IN THE FUND AND ANOTHER $500 MILLION.

IT WAS A SIGNIFICANT HIT.

IT TOOK US INTO THE RED.

SO WE THINK WE NEED TO REPLEN TISSUE TRUST FUND BECAUSE THEN THE TAXES THAT WILL BE PAID IN BY EMPLOYERS WILL GET TO US SOLVENTS THAT MUCH QUICKER WHICH IS WHERE WE NEED TO BE.

BUT WE ALSO THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE REFORM TO THE SYSTEM, AND I TESTIFIED TO THIS IN THE UI TASK FORCE.

WE ARE REALLY LOOKING AT THE WORK SEARCH REQUIREMENTS AND INCREASING THOSE REQUIREMENTS AND REALLY REDEFINING WHAT THAT MEANS TO NOT JUST SIMPLY BEING APPLYING FOR A JOB BUT IT MIGHT BE SHADOWING, LEARNING ABOUT NEW YEAR'S.

WE'D LIKE TO CONNECT EMPLOYERS TO THE SYSTEM ZHAO SO IT'S LIKE A PIPELINE OF WORKERS.

WE THINK THE DEFINITION OF SUITABLE WORK PROBABLY NEEDS TO BE REFORMED SLIGHTLY SO THAT THE LONGER YOU'RE ON, IT'S A BROADER DEFINITION.

BUT IN 2019, PRIOR TO THE PANDEMIC, AND WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS ISSUE SINCE BEFORE THE PANDEMIC, KENTUCKY HAD THE LONGEST AVERAGE DURATION SPENT ON UNEMPLOYMENT IN THE NATION.

SO PEOPLE JUST STAY ON UNEMPLOYMENT LONGER IN KENTUCKY THAN OTHER STATES THAT HAVE SOME MORE ROBUST WORK SEARCH REQUIREMENTS.

SO THIS ISN'T ABOUT PENALIZING PEOPLE.

IT'S ABOUT HELPING PEOPLE FIND WORK BECAUSE THE POINT IS YOU'VE DRAWN IT, YOU'RE NOT ON IT FOR LONG, AND THEN YOU CAN GO BETTY BACK TO WORK.

THE IF WE CANNY IMPROVE THOSE WORKFORCE HIMSELF AND RESOURCES AVAILABLE TO PEOPLE TO FIND JOBS, CONNECTED WITH EMPLOYERS, I THINK THAT WILL HELP AS WELL.

>> AND SOME OF THE SEMANTIC LARGE LANGUAGE WAS HAS BEEN NOT CALLING IT UNEMPLOYMENT BUT REEMPLOYMENT, REPRESENTATIVE JOSIE RAYMOND.

HOW DOES THAT SIT WITH YOU?

>> YOU'RE AN EXPERT IN SEMANTICS, RIGHT.

>> >> WHAT WE NEED TO NOT DO IS DEMONIZE PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT NUMBER WORKFORCE.

NOBODY GOES TO WORK FOR THE ECONOMY.

THEY GO TO WORK TO MAKE MONEY FOR THEMSELVES AND THEIR FAMILY AND HOPEFULLY THEY FIND FULFILLMENT IN WORK.

SO PARTICULARLY LOW WAGE WORKERS, IF THEY DON'T GET FULFILLMENT IN WORK AND THERE'S ENOUGH MONEY IN THEIR HOUSEHOLD AND REDETERMINED THEIR PRIORITIES, WHY WOULD WE DEMONIZE THEM FOR MAKING A RATIONAL DECISION?

AND WE ALSO DEMONIZED EVER NIZE UNEMPLOYMENT.

IT'S LESS THAN HALF OF WHAT PEOPLE WERE MAKING IS WHAT THEY RECEIVE.

NOBODY'S JUST SITTING ON THEIR ASSES COLLECTING UNEMPLOYMENT GLEEFULLY THINKING THEY'RE MILKING THE GOVERNMENT.

THESE ARE PEOPLE WHO NEED SOME HELP AND THEY DESERVE IT BECAUSE THEIR EMPLOYERS PAID INTO A SYSTEM ESTABLISHED TO HELP THEM.

AND TO JASON AS A POINT, WHAT WE WILL DO WITH UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE, THEY USE TO IT KEEP THEIR KID IN CHILD CARE.

THEY GET THEMSELVES A NEW INTERVIEW OUT-FIT AND IT HELPS HEM REENTER THE WORKFORCE SOONER.

IF WE CUT PEOPLE OFF, THIS UNINSURANCE TASK FORCE SAYS LET'S PEOPLE WORK HARDER FOR LESS BENEFITS, CUT THEM OFF SOONER.

I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO SEE IT SPIRAL AND ULTIMATELY NEED MORE HELP.

>> SENATOR HOWELL?

>> THE COVID EXPERIENCE STRESS TESTED A LOT OF THINGS IN OUR SOCIETY AND ONE OF THEM WAS OUR UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE SYSTEM.

THE SYSTEM DIDN'T GO IN THE RED BECAUSE WE HADN'T PREVIOUSLY FUNDED IT.

IT WENT IN THE RED BECAUSE WE NEVER FUNDED THIS TO HAVE THE DROP-OFF OF A CLIFF WITH THE NUMBER OF UNEMPLOYED PEOPLE THAT WE HAD DUE TO THIS PANDEMIC.

I.

WANT TO GO BACK TO SOMETHING THAT YOU SAID ABOUT WORKING AND HAVING A JOB AND WANTING TO MOVE THE JOB.

THIS IS INTERTWINED.

NONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT REALLY EXIST IN A VACUUM.

THEY'RE ALL INTERRATED RELATED, AND A LOT OF THINGS WITH THE WORKFORCE PARTICIPATING RATE, THEIR ALL INTERRELATED.

I HAD A DISCUSSION, IT'S REALLY UNIQUE.

I HAD THIS DISCUSSION COMING UP WITH A CLIENT OF MINE THAT WAS IN A REALLY -- HE EXIST WIFE ARE BOTH IN A REALLY BAD SITUATION IN THEIR LIFE.

AND I'VE BEEN WORKING THROUGH THIS WITH THEM WITH LEGAL ISSUES AND TALKING TO HIM TODAY, HE AND HIS WIFE ARE BOTH EMPLOYED, AND IT'S JUST LIKE I'M TALKING TIE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MAN THAN I TALKED TO SIX MONTHS AGO.

AND I DON'T THINK THAT WE CAN DISCOUNT THE DYNAMIC IMPROVEMENT IN PEOPLE'S LIVES THAT WE HAVE, NOT JUST FROM THE FINANCIAL STANDPOINT OF BEING ABLE TO PUT FOOD ON THE TABLE, BUT WHAT IT MEANS TO PEOPLE RIGHT HERE AND THE PRIDE THAT THEY CAN TAKE AND IF SELF-CONFIDENCE THEY GET FROM HAVING A JOB TO WHERE THEY CAN SUPPORT THEMSELVES AND THEIR FAMILIES, AND I THINK THAY THAT A LOT OF WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH THE UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFIT IS NOT JUST STOPPING BENEFITS BUT ENABLING THEM TO MOVE FROM BENEFITS TO BEING BACK AS A DYNAMIC PART OF THE WORKFORCE.

>> WHEN WE TALK ABOUT UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS, AND WE BRING UP SORT OF PEOPLE NOT WORKING, YOU HAVE TO HAVE WORKED TO RECEIVE UNEMPLOYMENT.

YOU LITERALLY LOST YOUR JOB.

AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE DATA HOW LONG PEOPLE STAY OWN EMPLOYMENT BENEFITS IN KENTUCKY, THEY DON'T STAY ANYWHERE NEAR THE FULL LENGTH OF TIME THEY CAN ON AVERAGE.

IT'S ABOUT HALF AS LONG.

WHEN YOU PUSH PEOPLE WHO ARE IN A TOUGH SITUATION WHO ARE ONLY RECEIVING HALF WHAT THEY RECEIVED BEFORE 1 WHEN YOU PUSH PEOPLE AND CUT THOSE BENEFITS OFF EARLY, A LOT OF TIMES YOU'RE PUSHING PEOPLE INTO JOBS THAT AREN'T THE BEST USE OF THEIR SKILLS, TAKES A LITTLE TIME TO FIND SOMETHING THAT YOU NEED.

IT'S PUSHING THEM TO ACCEPT LOWER WAGES.

THAT MAY HELP CORPORATIONS THAT ARE GOING TO PAY LOW WAGES BUT IT'S NOT HELPING FAMILIES.

SO THIS IS A PROGRAM THAT WORKS.

IT ACTUALLY WORKS REALLY WELL.

WHEN WE FUND IT, WHEN WE HAVE MODERN TECHNOLOGY AND MAKE SURE PEOPLE ARE ELIGIBLE FOR IT, WHICH IS EAT PROBLEM WE NEED TO ADDRESS, BUT WHEN WE CUT IT, WE'RE MAKING WORKERS MORE DESPERATE WHICH I DON'T THINK WE WANT.

WE'RE HURTING OUR ECONOMY OVERALL WHEN PEOPLE LOSE THEIR JOBS AND THEY HAVE LESS TO SPEND BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT GETTING THOSE UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.

AND THAT'S NOT THE WAY THAT WE'RE GOING TO RECOVER FROM THIS RECESSION AND BUILD BACK STRONGER.

>> ALL RIGHT.

SO WITH TEN MINUTES REMAINING, I'M TEMPTED WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE IN THE TIME BECAUSE I WANT TO HIT SOME SCHOOL FUNDING ISSUES.

THERE'S ALSO A TASK FORCE ON SCHOOL FUNDING.

I KNOW, JASON, YOU HAVE WRITTEN A LOT ABOUT THIS AND YOUR COLLEAGUES AT THE KENTUCKY CENTER FOR ECONOMIC POLICY ABOUT WHAT NEEDS TO CHANGE TO MAKE IT MORE EQUITABLE.

WHAT DO YOU HOPE LAWMAKERS WILL CONSIDER?

>> THERE IS A SCHOOL TASK FORCE AND THEY HAD GOOD RECOMMENDATIONS.

ONE WAS TO MAKE FULL-DAY KINDERGARTEN WHICH WE HAVE ONE YEAR OF FUNDING FOR, MAKE THAT PERMANENT.

>> WHEN THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER SUPPORTS.

>> EXPAND FUNDING FOR FAMILY RESEERS CENTERS WHICH WE KNOW ARE INCREDIBLY EFFECTIVE AT HELPING KIDS.

ALSO PAY -- INCREASE THE FUNDING SO THAT THE STATE IS AGAIN PAYING FOR TRANSPORTATION, WHICH IS A STATE RESPONSIBILITY, BUT THE STATE HAS DUTY CUT BACK ITS MONEY MONEY FOR THAT IT.

ONLY PAYS ABOUT HALF THE COST NOW.

SO THOSE ARE GOOD AND POSITIVE RECOMMENDATIONS, AND I HOPE THEY'RE ACTED ON IN THE BUDGET.

HOWEVER, WE HAVE AS WE MENTIONED BEFORE, BILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN SURPLUS AND WE CAN DO A LOT MORE OF AND WE NEED TO DO A LOT MORE TO BEGIN TO REGAIN THE GROUND THAT'S BEEN LOST SINCE 2008 FROM THE CUTS TO K-12 EDUCATION.

>> BUT THERE'S BEEN MORE MONEY LOW.

IATED PER BASE PEOPLE FUNDING.

$4,000 IS WHAT THE APPROPRIATION IS NOW PER STUDENT.

IS THAT NOT HISTORICAL LEVELS FUNDING?

>> NO, BECAUSE WE HAVE SOMETHING CALLED INFLATION, AND IF YOU ADJUST FOR INFLATION AND LOOK AT THE STATE VERSION WE'RE ACTUALLY $900 LESS IN STATE CONTRIBUTIONS THAN THAT $4,000 THAN THERE WAS IN 2008.

2 STATE IS BACKING OFF OF ITS RESPONSIBILITY FOR FUNDING K-12 EDUCATION AND WE'RE NOT PUTTING 911 INTO THINGS, NO MONEY FOR TEXTBOOKS IN THIS BUDGET, NO MONEY FOR TEACHER PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT.

THERE ARE OTHER THINGS WE NEED TO DO.

AND WE KNOW THAT WE ARE MISSING A LOT IN TERMS OF NOT INVESTING IN EARLY CHILDHOOD EDUCATION.

WE HAVE A REALLY GOOD OPPORTUNITY IN IN BUDGET BECAUSE OF THIS SURPLUS TO REINVEST IN OUR SCHOOLS AND BEGIN TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE OPPORTUNITIES THAT WE MISS WHEN WE CUT FUNDING AS WE HAVE.

>> ONE OF THE PAIN ILL EVER MAIN.

I AMORS FOR KENTUCKY CHAMBER IN THEIR, IS A HEALTHY, EDUCATED AND SKILLED WORKFORCE.

YOU GET AT THAT BY HAVING A HEALTHY PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEM.

PEOPLE WOULD SAY.

DOES THE CHAMBER AGREE?

>> WE HAVE LONG BEEN ADVOCATES FOR A HEALTHY EDUCATION SYSTEM, AS YOU MENTIONED.

>> PUBLIC EDUCATION OR CHOICE?

>> WILLIAM WE WERE INVOLVED IN CHARTER SCHOOLS ARMY ON WHEN THAT LEGISLATION WAS PASSED AS WELL.

WE LOOK AT THE EDUCATION SYSTEM HOLISTICALLY AND WE WANT A SYSTEM THAT WORKS.

WE EVALUATE, WE LOOK AT THE TEST ENDORSE, WE LOOK AT THE GAPS THAT ARE EXISTING -- TEST SCORES.

THESE ARE OUR FUTURE WORKERS.

THESE ARE OF COURSE OUR CHILDREN BUT THESE ARE OUR FUTURE WORKERS.

WE'VE BEEN LOOKING AT THE TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATIONS, THE FULLY FUNDING KINDERGARTEN.

I WOULD EXPECT THAT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY LAVE PRETTY ROBUST DISCUSSION ON FUNDING EDUCATION.

WE'RE ALSO INTERESTED, OF COURSE, IN WHAT HAPPENS IN THE POST-SECONDARY SPACE INVESTMENT BECAUSE WE DO KNOW WHEN WE LOOK AT THE WORKFORCE SITUATION IN KENTUCKY AND REALLY NATIONALLY, THERE IS A SKILLS MISMATCH, AND WE HAVE TO INCREASE THE EDUCATION ATTAINMENT LEVEL OF KENTUCKIANS SO THAT WE CAN ADDRESS SOME OF OUR WORKFORCE CHALLENGES.

AND SO, OF COURSE, WE NEED TO LOOK AT KINDERGARTENERS ARE A LONG WAY FROM WORKING BUT THEY'LL BE HERE BEFORE YOU KNOW IT, BUT WE LOOK AT THE EDUCATION STEAM FROM THE BEGINNING, FROM EARLY CHILDHOOD ALL THE WAY UP AND MAKE SURE THOSE INVESTMENTS ARE MADE, AND I EXPECT THERE WILL BE A ROBUST DISCUSSION ON FUNDING EDUCATION IN THIS SESSION.

>> AND TRANS ISING FROM AVERAGE DAILY ATTENDANCE ADA TO WHAT, JASON BAILEY?

>> MEMBERSHIP.

-- THE MEMBERSHIP LEVEL, NUMBER OF KIDS ENROLLED IN SCHOOL.

TEDISCO KIDS WHO TEND NOT TO BE IN SCHOOL AS MUCH TEND TO BE LOWER INCOME, AND THE SCHOOLS THAT HAVE MORE OF THOSE KIDS GET LESS MONEY UNDER THE CURRENT FORMULA AND THEY NEED MORE MONEY TO DEAL WITH THE KIND OF SCHOOL POPULATIONS.

>> DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS WANT TO SHARE?

SENATOR HOWELL ON EDUCATION FUNDING.

>> THANK YOU.

ITS I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT TO CONSIDER THAT A LOT OF WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS INVESTING ONE-TIME MONEY INTO SOMETHING THAT'S GROWING TO HAVE A RECURRING COST TO IT.

I KNOW WE'VE BEEN THROWING MILLIONS OF EXTRA DOLLARS TO FIX SOME OF OUR PENSION ISSUES.

IF WE INVEST SOME OF THAT -- SOME OF THE FEDERAL MONEY INTO PAYING DOWN THAT DEBT, THEN MAYBE WE CAN CASH FLOW THIS OUT TO ADDRESS FULL-DAY KINDERGARTEN, TO ADDRESS EARLY CHILDHOOD DEVELOPMENT WHICH HAS -- FROM A TESTING STANDPOINT HAS SHOWN FROBEL PROBABLY AS GOOD OF A RETURN ON OUR INVESTMENT AS ANY SINGLE THING THAT WE CAN DO YOU ARE W. OUR TAX DOLLARS AND FOR THE BENEFIT ALL OF OUR STUDENTS, BUT WE CAN'T DO THIS NOT GOING KNOWS GOING ON IN THE PUT UP.

OUR COFFERS ARE VERY FULL RIGHT NOW BUT IT'S MOSTLY FROM FEDERAL STIMULUS MONEY, AND PEOPLE SPENDING FEDERAL STIMULUS MONEY.

WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE ECONOMY IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE IN THE FUTURE, AND WE'VE GOT TO MAKE SURE WE DON'T OVERRUN OUR FUNDRAISING CAPABILITIES.

>> REPRESENTATIVE RAYMOND, HOW ABOUT THAT?

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ONE-TIME MONEY FOR RECURRING EXPENSES, AND YOU'VE BEEN A BIG ADVOCATE FOR PRE-K. >> I'M THRILLED TOBY HERE WITH THESE EARLY EDUCATION CHAMPIONS BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT EARLY CHILDHOOD CARE AND EDUCATION, INCLUDING PRE-K, IS THE SILVERREST BULLET TO WE HAVE TO DISRUPT CYCLES OF GENERATIONAL POVERTY.

THAT'S THE SINGLE GREATEST THINGS KENTUCKY CAN DO.

IF WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT BUILD BACK BETTER, IF WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THE RAINY DAY FUND, I'M GOING TO BE TALK ABOUT PRE-KATE B I CAN'T TO TALK ABOUT ANOTHER EDUCATIONAL ISSUE THAT WE'RE GOING TO TACKLE IN 202 WHICH IS EDUCATION OPPORTUNITY ACCOUNTS OR SCHOLARSHIP TAX CREDITS OR WHATEVER NEW NAME WE HAVE KIND FOR 2022.

THIS IS THE BILL THAT FORECAST LAST YEAR THAT SAID PEOPLE COULD FOREGO PAYING STATE TAXES TO PAY FOR PRIVATE SCHOOL SCHOLARSHIPS, AND THIS WASN'T ABOUT CHOICE.

THIS WASN'T ABOUT CHOICE.

IT WAS ABOUT MOVING PUBLIC SCHOOL MONEY TO PRIVATE BUSINESSES.

CHARTER SCHOOLS ARE NOT OPENING IN KNOTT COUNTY.

AND REPUBLICANS SAID WE NEED TODAY PASS THESE THINGS TO HELP US.

A SINGLE CHILD.

A SINGLE CHILD.

BUT THEY WON'T TAKE UP ANY OF MY GUN BILLS.

BUT IF WE DO NEED TO HELP A SINGLE CHILD, THEN IT MAY BE LIKE THE JUDGE SAID WHO STRUCK DOWN THAT BILL, IT'S UNYOU CONSTITUTIONAL THAT IN OUR SYSTEM OF PUBLIC SCHOOLS DOESN'T MEET THE CONSTITUTIONAL STANDARD, AND THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO TURN OUR ATTENTION TO.

>> I THINK THAT WILL COME UP CERTAINLY.

CHILD CARE, WHICH I DON'T HAVE TIME TO GET INTO WITH THREE AND A HALF MINUTES BUT I THINK THERE IS MORE OF A GENERAL CONSENSUS ABOUT HOW DO YOU ELEVATE CHILD CARE.

THERE'S A GREAT BOOK, USUAL DON'T DO THIS, SARAH VANOVER, AMERICA'S CHILD CRISIS.

I HIGHLY RECOMMEND THAT BOOK.

JASON BAILIE AND KATE SHANKS, AWE YOU ALL BE AGREE WITH WHERE WE ARE WITH THE CHILD CARE CRISIS WITH CHILD CARE DESERTS, THE LOW PAY OF WORKERS, HIGH PAY AND HIGH COST FOR PARENTS.

THERE'S SOME COMMON GROUND THERE, RIGHT, ON WHAT WE NEED TO BE DOING.

>> AND IT'S A GREAT -- A KEY AREA WE NEED TO REINVEST IN.

WE'VE SEEN THIS HUGE DECLINE IN THE NUMBER OF CHILD CARE CENTERS AND HALF THE STATES IN THE DESERT, AND WE HAVE A POTENTIAL REAL OPPORTUNITY IF THE BUILD BACK BETTER LEGISLATION PASSES CONGRESS.

THERE'S HUGE MONEYS FOR STATES TO GREATLY EXPAND CHILD CARE ASSISTANCE, MAKE IT FREE FOR MANY PEOPLE, EARNING UP TO 7% OF THEIR FAMILY INCOME AND TO PROVIDE UNIVERSAL PRE-K FOR ALL THREE AND FOUR-YEAR-OLDS.

SO IF THAT LEGISLATION DOES MEDINA BASS THIS MONTH WE'RE ALSO WATCHING TO SEE, STATES CAN TAKE THAT UP AND THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY CAN TAKE THAT UP AND BEGIN TO BUILD THAT PROGRAM OVER THE NEXT FEW YEARS.

>> KATE SHANKS, WHAT DO YOU THINK.

>> CHILD CARE ABSOLUTELY IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO TACKLE IN KENTUCKY.

IT CAME UP ON OUR LISTENING TOUR CONSTANTLY.

I'M A MOTHER OF TWO BOYS.

DEALT WITH CHILD CARE ISSUES YEARS AGO WHEN THEY WERE IN CHILD CARE, AND SO SO MANY FAMILIES STRUGGLE WITH CHILD CARE, QUALITY, AFFORDABLE CHILD CARE, AND SO I THINK WE REALLY NEED TO TACKLE THIS ONE AND I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF LEGISLATORS THAT WANT TO ROLL UP THEIR SLEEVES ON IT.

THERE'S PROBABLY MULTIPLE THINGS WE CAN DO.

PERHAPS THERE'S SOME OF THE FEDERAL ARPA DOLLARS THAT WE CAN PUT INTO NEW EMS PROGRAMS ESPECIALLY AND HOW WE CAN BRING EMPLOYERS INTO THE FOLD WELL SUSPECT WE'LL HAVE TO WAIT AND SEE ON BUILD BACK BETTER.

I KNOW YOU'VE A LOT OF CONCERNS IN THE CHAMBER ABOUT THAT AND THE HUGE TAX INCREASES THAT WE'RE GOING TO SEE FROM THAT LEGISLATION BUT ALSO WE EXPECT CHANGES IN THE SENATE AS WELL.

MORE TO COME ON THAT.

BUT DEFINITELY AS THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY CONVENES WE'RE HOPEFUL WE CAN TACKLE THIS ISSUE AND MAKE STEPS IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

>> WE KNOW THERE HAVE BEEN SIGNIFICANT CLOSURES USUALLY OVER THE LOOSE CAKED, LIKE FRISK% DECLINE.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

FRISK% DECLINE IN THE AVERAGE WAGER A CHILD CARE WORKERS IN KENTUCKY IS $47,000 A YEAR.

THIS IS PROBABLY THE MOST IMPORTANT JOB OUT THERE.

>> AND WHICH IS RIVALS GOING INTO A COMMUNITY OR TECHNICAL COLLEGE ARE ALMOST A YEAR'S TUITION AT A REGIONAL UNIVERSITY SEW.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

FAMILIES JUST CAN'T AFFORD IT.

>> SENATOR HOWL, I'LL GIVE YOU THE LAST WORD OH THIS.

>> THANK YOU.

I THINK THAT IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT THIS FROM A NUMBER OF SITUATIONS, INCLUDING THE REGULATION THAT GOES INTO IT THAT MAKES SOME OF IT AS EXPENSIVE AND CUMBERSOME AS IT IS.

IF YOU WANT TO DO ANY ONE THING TO INCREASE OUR WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION RATE, ESPECIALLY IN OUR WORN MOTHERS AND WORKING POOR CLASSIFICATION MOTHERS, THEN THE ABILITY TO HAVE CHILD CARE ACTUALLY IS GOING TO BE THE ONE SINGLE DRIVER I THINK MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE THAT'S GOING TO ALLOW THEM TO MORE SUCCESSFULLY REINTEGRATE INTO THE WORKFORCE.

>> I THINK REPRESENTATIVE RAYMOND WOULD SAY YES, I AGREE.

>> YES, I DO AGREE.

>> TEN SECONDS.

>> WHEN CHILD CARE THE IS NOT WORKING, KNOWING IS ON WORKING.

100,000 MOMS LEFT THE WORKFORCE DURING COVID.

I'VE ASKED CHAMBER.

NOBODY KNOWS HOW THEY REENTERED AND RECOVERED.

>> WE'LL KEEP FOLLOWING IT.

THANK YOU ALL.

MORE CONVERSATION BUT KENTUCKY GENERAL ASSEMBLY KYGA 22.

LET THE #WE ALL USE.

YOU'LL BE FOLLOWING IT JUST AS WE WILL BE NEXT MONDAY FIGHT ON KENTUCKY TONIGHT.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT CITY AND COUNTY ISSUES WITH MAYORS AND JUDGE EXECUTIVES, SO WE HOPE YOU WILL JOIN US FOR THAT DISCUSSION.

SAME TIME, SAME CHANNEL, SAME HOST.

THEN JOIN BILL BRYANT ON "COMMENT ON KENTUCKY."

BELIEVER