>> CATHY: IT'S FRIDAY NIGHT AND CONGRESS IS RACING TOWARDS A MIDNIGHT DEADLINE TO AVERT A FEDERAL GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN.

THE SENATE IS CURRENTLY DEBATING THE SPENDING BILL SENT OVER BY THE HOUSE EARLIER TODAY.

THAT BIPARTISAN HOUSE VOTE HAS ALSO PROMPTED HARDLINE REPUBLICANS TO ONCE AGAIN THREATEN TO DUMP THEIR SPEAKER.

A LOT OF GROUND FOR OUR NEXT GROUP TO COVER SO LET'S DIVE IN.

UP FIRST, LARRY JACOBS IS THE DIRECTOR OF THE CENTER FOR POLITICS AND GOVERNANCE AT THE U OF M'S HUMPHREY SCHOOL.

DAN HOFRENNING TEACHES AMERICAN POLITICS, CAMPAIGNS AND ELECTIONS TO STUDENTS AT ST. OLAF COLLEGE DOWN IN NORTHFIELD.

AND CINDY RUGELY HEADS UP THE POLITICAL SCIENCE DEPARTMENT AT THE UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA-DULUTH.

WELCOME ONE AND ALL.

GREATS TO HAVE YOU HERE BEFORE THE SNOW STARTS.

PROFESSOR, THE HOUSE PASSED $1.2 TRILLION SPENDING BILL AND THEN MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE MOVES TO OUST THE SPEAKER.

THAT'S AN ODD COMBO THERE.

WHAT'S GOING ON?

>> YEAH, THERE IS A LOT GOING ON AND IT TELLS YOU, I THINK ONE INTERESTING PART OF THAT VOTE WAS THE WAY IN WHICH YOU GOT KIND OF A BACKWARDS BIPARTISAN ALLIANCE.

YOU COULD EE THAT IN THE MINNESOTA DELEGATION.

I THINK THREE OF THE FOUR DEMOCRATS VOTED FOR IT, ILHAN OMAR VOTED AGAINST IT.

THREE OF THE FOUR REPUBLICANS VOTED AGAINST IT AND TOM EMMER VOTED FOR IT SO IT'S KIND OF AN INTERESTING DYNAMIC AND I THINK THE VOTE TO OUST JOHNSON, IT'S SUPPOSED TO HAPPEN USUALLY IN TWO DAYS BUT I THINK BECAUSE OF THE RECESS, THEY'LL HAVE A LITTLE MORE TIME.

>> Eric: COULDN'T A DEMOCRATIC LEADER OF THE HOUSE BECOME SPEAKER IF -- IS THIS THE WAY SHE WANTS IT TO?

>> IT'S A WEIRD SITUATION IN THAT THEY GOT -- GALLAGHER FROM THE WISCONSIN AND ASKED -- HE'S DONE -- >> Eric: NEXT MONTHS.

>> SO ITS WILL BE A ONE-MONTH DIFFERENCE AT THE TIME, SO, YEAH, IT COULD HAPPEN.

I DON'T THINK IT WOULD.

IF IT DID HAPPEN, IT WOULD BE UNTIL ALL THESE SPECIAL ELECTIONS ARE OVER, THEN THEY'D SWITCH IT BACK SO IT WOULD JUST BE MORE CHAOS.

>> I THINK THE DEMOCRATS -- DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP IS EAGER FOR THIS MESS, TO BE GEORGE WITH A ONE-OR TWO SEAT MARRIAGEIN.

WORKING WITH HE REPUBLICANS IS JUST BEGIN FOR IFFICULT.

GREENE'S GRIPE WITH JOHNSON IS THAT THIS LEGISLATION IS OPPOSED BY MOST REPUBLICANS IN THE HOUSE, AND THAT'S JUST AN EXTRAORDINARY SITUATION, TO HAVE THE MAJORITY PARTY PASS LEGISLATION THAT'S SUPPORTED BY MOST OF THE MINORITY PARTY, SO THE REPUBLICANS HAVE REALLY STRUGGLED TO DEVELOP A GOVERNING MAJORITY.

THEY JUST HAVEN'T HAD IT, THERE ARE JUST DEEP SPLITS WITHIN THE PARTY.

THE FACT THAT YOU'VE SEEN MIKE GALLAGHER, WHO'S WIDELY RESPECTED CHAIR, LEAVING IS YET ANOTHER SIGNAL ABOUT THE REALLY THE CHAOS THERE.

>> Cathy: AND E'S OUTS AT THE END OF APRIL, NOT EVEN WAITING -- WHAT DOES THAT SAY EXACTLY?

>> WELL, THAT'S AN INTERESTING MANUEVER BECAUSE ACCORDING TO WISCONSIN LAW, THERE WON'T BE A SPECIAL ELECTION SO THAT SEAT WILL BE VACANT.

IF YOU LOOK BACK AT EVERY MAJOR VOTE THAT'S HAPPENED, THERE'S BEEN MORE DEMOCRATIC VOTES THAN THERE HAVE BEEN REPUBLICAN VOTES SO I -- IT'S JUST NOT ODD ANYMORE, I GUESS.

>> Eric: BOTH BIDEN AND TRUMP HAVE 100% NAME I.D.

BIDEN HAS LIKE MORE THAN DOUBLE THE AMOUNT OF CAMPAIGN FUNDING AVAILABLE THAN TRUMP DOES.

DOES THAT MATTER SO MUCH IN THE MODERN ERA WHEN PEOPLE KIND OF KNOW WHO THESE GUYS ARE OR -- >> WELL, IT'S ON INTERESTING DYNAMIC.

I THINK FOR A LONG TIME, DEMOCRATS COMPLAINED ABOUT BEING OUTSPENT.

THESE DAY, DEMOCRATS ARE IF ANYTHING OUTSPENDING REPUBLICANS.

I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT IN A PRESIDENTIAL RACE, MONEY DOESN'T MATTER, SWATCH.

TRUMP WON IN 2016 WITHOUT RAISING THAT MUCH MONEY.

>> I THINK THE KEY THING HERE IS THAT THE BIDEN CAMPAIGN'S GOING TO BE ABLE TO SETS UP OFFICE INS MORE STATES.

THERE'S SEVEN CLEAR BATTLE GROUND STATES BUT THE DEMOCRATS WOULD LIKE TO EXPAND THAT TO ABOUT A DOZEN AND SO HAVING THAT MUCH MONEY LETS THEM HAVE STAFF, RUN ADS, AND REALLY FIGHT, WHEREAS THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN IS GOING TO BE CONSTRAINED.

THEY JUST DON'T HAVE THE RESOURCES.

NOW, THERE'S PLENTY OF TIME AND THERE'S LOTS OF WAYS FOR, YOU KNOW, THE KIND OF HIDDEN PACS TO START RAIDING MONEY AND PUTTING IT IN SO I DON'T THINK ANYONE'S DECLARING THE REPUBLICANS TO BE WITHOUT FUNDS.

THEY'LL HAVE THE MONEY.

>> WHAT LARRY SAID MAKES A VERY GOOD POINT BECAUSE GETTING OUT THE VOTE IS A BIG DEAL SO THE FACT THAT THEY'RE ABLE TO SETS UP THE GRASS ROOTS MECHANISM WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE IF THIS CONTINUES.

>> TRUMP DID WIN IN 2016 WITHOUT THAT EXTENSIVE OF A GROUNDS GAME.

>> BUILT HE DID HAVE AN INCREDIBLE AMOUNT OF FREE MILD I CAN'T.

AND THIS DOESN'T LOOK LIKE FREE MEDIA, IT LOOKS PAINFUL TO HAVE TRUMP.

>> Cathy: WHAT WOULD BE THE --F JEOPARDY -- YOU'RE KIND OF A KENNEDY EXPERT.

>> IF YOU LOOK AT THE THIRD PARTIES AND YOU MASH THEM TOGETHER, THE BATTLEGROUND STATES, THE 7 BATTLEGROUNDS STATES, THE THIRD PARTY CANDIDATES, INCLUDING KENNEDY, ARE COMING IN AROUND 10 TO 15%.

IT'S JUST A HUGE AMOUNT OF SUPPORT AND THE DEMOCRATS ARE NOW SAYING THEY'RE SETTING UP KIND OF A WARROOM TO TAKE THEM ON BUT KENNEDY IS UP IN FOUR OF THE SEVEN MOST COMPETITIVE STATES, SO THIS IS A REAL PROBLEM FOR DEMOCRATS AND JOE BIDEN HAS A ONG LIST OF CHALLENGES FACING HIM.

AND SO ADD THIS TO THE LIST BUT IT COULD BE KILLER FOR HIM.

>> Eric: TO THE BUSINESS PAGE FOR A SECOND, FORMER PRESIDENT HAS MERGED HIS TRUTH SOCIAL WITH ANOTHER TECH COMPANY, I GUESS STOCK CAN NOW BE SOLD AND TRADED ON THE MARKETS.

THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT $3 BILLION DOWN THE ROAD, ARE HIS MONEY TROUBLES OVER OR... >> WELL, DONALD TRUMP IS, WHAT, DECLARED BANKRUPTCY SIX TIMES AND I SUPPOSE CATS HAVE NINE LIVES, RIGHT?

HE'S GOT TO HAVE AT LEAST A COUPLE MORE IN HIM, I THINK.

HE'S NOT GOING TO RUN OUT OF MONEY.

>> BUT I THINK THE KEY POINT MAYBE YOU'RE DRIVING AT IS THAT DONALD TRUMP IS UNDER A LOT OF PRESSURE TO COME UP WITH ALMOST HALF A BILLION DOLLARS.

>> Eric: QUICKLY.

>> QUICKLY FOR THE TRIAL THAT THE NEW YORK ATTORNEY GENERAL'S BEEN RUNNING.

THIS MONEY THAT IS COMING TOGETHER FOR HIS SOCIAL MEDIA OPERATION WILL NOT BE USABLE FOR THAT.

>> Eric: WHY WON'T IT?

>> YOU CAN'T CASH IN THE STOCKS AND THE JUDGE IS UNLIKELY TO ACCEPT THAT MONEY.

SO HE STILL HAS GOT A PROBLEM AND THE QUESTION IS, WILL HE HAVE TO DECLARE BANKRUPTCY HEADING INTO A PRESIDENTIAL RACE?

WILL THERE BE A SUGAR DADDY THAT COMES ALONG, IN WHICH WAYS WE WANT TO KNOW A WHOLE LOT ABOUT THAT PERSON.

>> BUT THERE'S NO QUESTION, ALSO, THAT THERE IS A GREAT DEAL OF OVER-INFLATION ON THE VALUE OF TRUTH SOCIAL STOCK.

I MEAN, THAT'S PRETTY WELL AGREED PON BY MOST OF THE PEOPLE SO WILL IT STILL BE WORTH THAT KIND OF MONEY IN SIX MONTHS WHEN HE CAN CASH IN?

>> Cathy: A QUICK QUESTION HERE AND THIS IS IN REFERENCE TO A STORY THAT OCCURRED EARLIER THIS WEEK.

SOME OF US WHO HAVE BEEN IN THE BUSINESS A LITTLE WHILE WERE KIND OF SURPRISED THAT SIX MEMBERS OUT OF THE 8 MINNESOTA CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION WEIGHED IN ON HIS STATE TROOP' SHOOTING CASE AND GOVERNOR WALZ IS KIND OF WONDERING -- >> Eric: AND WALZ HAS JUMPED IN.

>> Cathy: HAS ALSO JUMPED IN AND WAS WONDERING IF HE NEEDS TO TAKE IT FROM THE HENNEPIN COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE AND GRIFFITH TO THE ATTORNEY GENERAL.

HAVE YOU HEARD OF THE CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION WEIGHING IN ON SOMETHING LIKE THIS?

>> NO, AND THE KEY THING HERE IS THAT YOU'VE GOT BOTH PARTIES DOING IT AND I THINK THE CONCERN IS PARTLY ABOUT DUE PROCESS, ABOUT WHETHER THE TROOPER'S BEING TREATED FAIRLY BUT THERE'S ALSO A POLITICAL ANGLE.

THE DEMOCRATS JUST GOT THEIR CLOCKS CLEANED ON, YOU KNOW, THE KIND OF DEFUND THE POLICE AND THIS COULD EASILY BE, YOU KNOW, TURN INTO AN ATTACK AD ON DEMOCRATS FOR BEING, OU KNOW, TOO TOUGH ON COPS.

AND TRYING TO BREAK THE RULES.

SO I THINK WE ARE GOING TO SEE THESE DEMOCRATS PUSHING BACK.

MAYBE THE GOVERNOR MOVES THIS CASE, LIKE ANOTHER ONE, TO THE ATTORNEY GENERAL AND JUST, YOU KNOW, FURTHER ISOLATES MORIARTY.

>> Eric: IS THE BIDEN IMPEACHMENT BUSINESS DONE IN THE HOUSE OR ARE THEY STILL PUTTING TOGETHER A BILL OF TENSION OR -- >> SEEMS LIKE WITH JUST SUCH A NARROW MAJORITY, IT'S HARD TO SEE THAT EVERY SINGLE REPUBLICAN IS GOING TO HOLD TOGETHER FOR THIS.

I THINK THE LEGAL CASE IS PROBABLY WEAK ENOUGH, I WAS LISTENING TO JAMES CARVEL A MONTHS AGO OR SO ND HE WAS SAYING I HOPE THEY BRING IT BECAUSE THERE'S SO LITTLE EVIDENCE ON THE TABLE THAT IT CAN ONLY HELP DEMOCRATS.

>> Cathy: SAY, WHAT ARE YOUR STUDENTS STAYING IN CLASS?

WHAT WHAT ARE THEY REALLY FOCUSING ON, JUST CURIOUS, WHEN IT COMES TO ISSUES?

>> THE SAME THING EVERYBODY ELSE DOES.

>> Eric: LOON FORGIVENESS, MAYBE?

>> NO, NOT REALLY.

[Laughter] NO, I MEAN, DEPENDS ON THE CLASS YOU'RE TEACHING.

ONE I'M TEACHING IS PUBLIC POLICY SO THEY'RE FOCUSED ON THAT.

I MEAN, AS FAR AS WHAT THEY TALK ABOUT, I MEAN, THEY THINK BOTH OF THEM ARE TOO OLD.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW -- >> Eric: HAT'S A PROBLEM FOR BIDEN, YOU CAN'T MESSAGE AWAY FROM THAT, OR CAN YOU?

>> E'S NOT THAT MUCH OLDER THAN TRUMP.

THE OLD SAYING IS HAT, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, I THINK THAT THE ONLY PERSON TO CONVINCE PEOPLE HE'S NOT TOO OLD IS THE CANDIDATES THEMSELVES.

>> I THINK WHAT WE'RE GOING TO SEE IS BIDEN RUN A REFERENDUM ON TRUMP AND YOU CAN SEE, IT'S ON DEMOCRACY, IT'S ON TRUMP BEING AUTOCRAT AND JUST MOVE THE FOCUS AWAY FROM BIDEN AND PUT IT ON TRUMP.

THAT MAY BE THE ONLY WAY HE CAN INCH.

>> I THINK HE'S GOING TO LET TRUMP SPEAK FOR HIMSELF.