WELCOME TO "KENTUCKY TONIGHT."

I'M RENEE SHAW.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

OUR TOPIC THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION AND CONGRESS ARE DEBATING WHAT TO D ABOUT IMPROVING AMERICA'S ROADS BRIDGES AND WATER, BROADBAND AN BUT THERE'S AGREEMENT ABOUT WHA SHOULD BE INCLUDED IN AN INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN AND WHAT SHOULDN'T AND HOW BIG THE PLAN SHOULD BE AND HOW TO PAY FOR IT WHAT ARE KENTUCKY'S INFRASTRUCTURE NEEDS?

AND WHAT IDEAS THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT IN WASHINGTON COULD EVEN BENEFIT THE COMMONWEALTH?

TO DISCUSS ALL THIS WE'RE JOIN IN OUR LEXINGTON STUDIO BY JD CHANEY, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR AND CEO OF THE KENTUCKY LEAGUE OF C CHAD LARUE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE KENTUCKY ASSOCIATION OF HIGHWAY CONTRACTORS.

COVINGTON MAYOR JOSEPH MEYER.

AND MARK MCKENZIE, JOHNSON COUNTY JUDGE IN OUR LOUISVILLE STUDIO WE HAV ANDREW MCNEILL, VISITING POLICY FELLOW AT THE BLUEGRASS INSTITUTE FOR PUBLIC POLICY SOL.

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WE WELCOME OFF OUR GUESTS WHO ARE JOINING US NEAR AND FAR, BUT BEFORE THE PANEL WEIGHS IN, I SPOKE EARLIER TODAY WITH KENTUCKY TRANSPORTATION CABINET SECRETARY JIM GRAY ABOUT KENTUCKY'S PERSISTENT PROBLEMS WITH INFRASTRUCTURE AND IF WASHINGTON CAN HELP.

>> SECRETARY GRAY, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME THIS AFTERNOON.

WE APPRECIATE IT.

>> THANKS, RENEE.

GREAT WOULD BE WITH YOU AGAIN.

>> AGAIN.

LAST TIME WE TALKED TO YOU ABOUT COVID AND WE MAY HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THAT WHEN IT COMES TO THE INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN.

BUT TONIGHT WE'RE TALKING TO YOU ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE, AND WE LEARNED OR HAVE KNOWN THAT KENTUCKY SCORES LIKE A C MINUS OVERALL WHEN IT COMES TO OUR REPORT CARD FROM AMERICAN SOCIETY OF CIVIL ENGINEERS.

THE REST OF THE NATION DOESN'T REALLY LOOK THAT MUCH BETTER, ACTUALLY.

PUT THAT GRADE IN PERSPECTIVE FOR US.

>> RENEE, THE WAY I DESCRIBE IT IS THIS WAY.

IT'S ALL ABOUT THE ECONOMY.

IT'S ALL ABOUT JOBS.

AT THE END OF THE DAY THAT'S WHAT TRANSPORTATION IS ABOUT, AND WE CANNOT SHRINK OURSELVES TO GREATNESS.

WE CAN'T SHRINK OURSELVES TO GREATNESS.

THESE -- THIS SCORE BY THE AMERICAN SOCIETY OF CIVIL ENGINEERS, WE SEE IT EVERY YEAR, AND WE REGRETTABLY DON'T SEE IT IMPROVING MUCH, AND THAT IN MY VIEW IS WHY PRESIDENT BIDEN, SUPPORTED BY SECRETARY PETE BUDE DAN CAMPBELL, HAS ADVANCED LEGISLATION AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL TO REALLY GIVES A SHOT IN THE ARM AND ONE THAT WILL KEEP OUR COUNTRY AND OUR STATE COMPETITIVE.

WHEN WE LOOK ACROSS THE COUNTRY, WHEN WE LOOK ACROSS NORTH AMERICA, THE WORLD, WE KNOW THAT WE'RE SLIPPING IN TERMS OF OUR INFRASTRUCTURE, AND THROUGHOUT AMERICAN HISTORY, YOU KNOW, WAY BACK, EVEN TO THE RAILROADS WHEN RAIL CARS WERE DRAWN BY HORSES INSTEAD OF STEAM ENGINES, AMERICA WAS ALL ABOUT, ALWAYS ABOUT IMPROVING ITS INFRASTRUCTURE SO THAT IT COULD IMPROVE ITS ECONOMY.

HENRY CLAY WAS ALL ABOUT IT WHEN HE ADVOCATED FOR THE MAYSVILLE TURNPIKE.

THIS WAS IN THE EARLY 1800S.

SO THERE'S A LONG LEGACY IN KENTUCKY OF RESPECTING TRANSPORTATION.

AND RESPECTING THE IMPORTANCE OF IT TO OUR ECONOMY.

>> WE KNOW THAT EVEN THE TERM "INFRASTRUCTURE" AND WHAT IT MEANS, SECRETARY GRAY, HAS BEEN DEBATED.

SOME TAYE THAT CHILD CARE AND CLIMATE CHANGE, THINGS THAT ARE PART OF THE BIDEN PLAN, DON'T CLASSIFY AND QUALIFY AS INFRASTRUCTURE.

SENATE MINORITY LEADER MITCH MONIE HAS SAID THAT.

AND ALSO THE PAY-FORCE, A LOT OF CONVERSATION SHOULD IT BE $800 BILLION BUT CERTAINLY NOT WHAT THE PRESIDENT HAD ORIGINALLY PROPOSED.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT WHAT INFRASTRUCTURE IS, HOW DO YOU DEFINE IT?

AND DOES IT NEED TO INCLUDE THINGS LIKE BROADBAND, OF COURSE, BUT CHILD CARE AND CLIMATE CHANGE?

>> WELL, GOVERNOR BESHEAR HAS GIVEN ME A STRICT -- A CLEAR MISSION, AND THAT IS FOR TRANSPORTATION, AS IT'S DEFINED BY KENTUCKY.

I WILL SAY, HOWEVER, THAT TODAY WHEN WE THINK ABOUT EARLY CHILDHOOD EDUCATION AND WE THINK ABOUT THE IMPORTANCE AND THE SIGNIFICANCE OF YOUNG PEOPLE LEARNING AND GROWING, AND THEN WHEN WE THINK ABOUT THOSE FOLKS IN THOSE IN OUR LABOR MARKET TODAY IN JOBS WHERE THEY NEED THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THEIR KIDS TO BE TAKEN CARE OF DURING THE DAY, IT'S HARD FOR ME NOT TO THINK THAT'S INFRASTRUCTURE.

BUT LET ME GO ON AND SAY THAT WHEN WE LOOK AT A HERE IN KENTUCKY, I THINK OF THE 9,069 BRIDGES THAT ARE TODAY RANKED IN FAIR TO POOR CONDITION OR THE 8,000 LANE MILES OUT OF 38,000 IN OUR STATE THAT ARE RANKED FAIR TO POOR, AND THAT'S PAVEMENTS, SO I SEE THIS EVERY DAY.

I HEAR FROM COUNTY JUDGES EVERY DAY, FROM MAYORS EVERY DAY WHO ARE SAYING, JIM, WE NEED HELP.

THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE CALLING THE GOVERNOR ABOUT, AND THE GOVERNOR HAS BEEN CLEARER THAT HE WANTS TO GIVE EVERY -- EVERY PERSON IN KENTUCKY A LEG UP IN TERMS OF OPPORTUNITY, AND GIVING THAT LEG UP IN OPPORTUNITY, ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY MEANS HAVING AN INFRASTRUCTURE, HAVING A TRANSPORTATION SYSTEM THAT IS COMPETITIVE.

WE'RE COMING OUT OF THIS PANDEMIC REALLY, REALLY STRONG.

THERE ARE LOTS OF COMPANIES THAT ARE LOOKING AT KENTUCKY.

THERE'S A REVOLUTION TODAY, FRANKLY, IN THE AUTOMATIC INDUSTRY WITH ELECTRIC VEHICLES AND BATTERY TECHNOLOGY.

SO HAVING THE OPPORTUNITY, HAVING THE RESOURCES TO BE COMPETITIVE, THAT'S REALLY -- THAT'S AN ENORMOUSLY CHALLENGING.

I'VE SEEN IT ALL MY LIFE BEING IN THE INDUSTRIAL RECRUITING BUSINESS, BUT I SEE IT WITH A REAL SHARP LENS TODAY, RENEE.

>> AND WATER AND SEWER.

WE KNOW HOW PARTICULARLY IN THE EASTERN PORTION OF OUR STATE THEY STRUGGLED WITH CLEAN DRINKING WATER, WHICH MANY PEOPLE FIND UNIMAGINABLE IN THE YEAR 2021.

HOW IMPORTANT IS THAT TO THE ADMINISTRATION?

>> IT'S -- WELL, THE GOVERNOR HAS PUT ANOTHER LENS OF ATTENTION ON THIS WITH A $250 MILLION COMMITMENT TO WATER AND SEWER, WATER AND WASTEWATER PROJECTS, CLEANER WATER PROJECTS.

AND OUT OF THAT -- WITHIN THAT $250 MILLION THERE ARE, $50 MILLION OF IT IS ALLOCATED TO UNSERVED, TODAY UNSERVED COMMUNITIES.

THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION JUST RELEASED A VIDEO THIS WEEK, EARLIER THIS WEEK, AND KENTUCKY WAS REGRETTABLY FEATURED RIGHT OUT OF THE GATE.

KENTUCKY, VOICES FROM KENTUCKY, FROM EASTERN KENTUCKY WHERE THERE ARE CHALLENGES, OF COURSE, WITH WATER, CLEAN WATER, AND THAT TELLS YOU THAT, YOU KNOW, IN A UNFORTUNATE WAY WE'RE A POSTER CHILD.

AND THE REAL CHALLENGE AND THE REAL OPPORTUNITY IS TO TAKE THESE RESOURCES, AND THIS IS WHAT GOVERNOR BESHEAR HAS BEEN SO INSISTENT ON.

HE SAID, LOOK, WE'VE GOT TO GET THESE PROJECTS AS QUICKLY AS WE CAN INTO THE WORK PROGRAM SO THAT CLEANER WATER IS NOT JUST A DREAM BUT IT'S A REALITY FOR OUR COMMUNITIES IN KENTUCKY.

>> AND TO YOUR POINT, SECRETARY GRAY, WE'RE GOING TO SHOW A CLIP OF THE VIDEO THAT THE WHITE HOUSE HAD RELEASED FOCUSING ON THE WATER ISSUE IN EASTERN KENTUCKY.

>> I'M BARBARAYAN MYERS AND I'M FROM MARTIN COUNTY, KENTUCKY I'VE BEEN FIGHTING FOR INFRASTRUCTURE FORE OVER TWO DECADE.

I WANT TO SHOW YOU THE INFRASTRUCTURE ISSUE HERE IN MARTIN COUNTY.

WE USE BOTTLED WATER FOR EVERYTHING, FOR BRUSHING OUR FEITH EVER KEITH, FOR TALK WITH OUR HANDS, FOR WASHING OUR FACE.

WASHING OUR HANDS.

FOR WASHING OUR FACE.

AND WHEN I TAKE A BATH, I DON'T GET TO USE ALL THE SMELL GOOD STUFF UNTIL I HAVE USED BY ANTIBACTERIAL SOAP FOR MY BODY BECAUSE OF THE BACTERIA THAT GETS IN OUR WATER THROUGH OUR LINE BREAKS.

>> NOW LET'S TALK ABOUT, YOU MENTIONED BRIDGES, AND THIS IS ONE WE HAVE LEARNED TO SAY EVEN THOUGH IT CAN BE A TONGUE TWISTER THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE, A LOT OF ATTENTION ON THIS BRIDGE BECAUSE OF WHAT HAPPENED AT THE END OF LAST YEAR, EARLIER THIS YEAR.

WE KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT OF VOLUME ON THIS PARTICULAR BRIDGE THAT'S WORTH A LOT TO THE KENTUCKY ECONOMY AND TO THE NATION'S ECONOMY.

WHAT CAN BE DONE ABOUT REHABBING THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE OR MAKING AN ENTIRELY NEW TRANSPORTATION SYSTEM THERE?

>> WELL, RENEE, I LEARNED A LOT ABOUT THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE MYSELF ON NOVEMBER THE 11th OF 2020 WHEN I GOT THE NEWS THAT THERE HAD BEEN A MAJOR FIRE, A COLLISION AND A FIRE ON THE BRIDGE.

AND WE WERE ABLE TO REPAIR THAT BRIDGE, GET IT BACK INTO WORKING SHAPE WITHIN 41 DAYS AND UNDER BUDGET.

SO WE WERE PROUD OF THAT.

BUT WHEN I ALSO LEARNED WAS JUST WHAT A SIGNIFICANT, WHAT A SIGNIFICANT TRANSPORTATION CHOKEHOLD THERE REALLY IS ASSOCIATED WITH THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE.

$630BILLION A YEAR OF TRANSPORTATION GOES OVER, OUR ECONOMY ACTUALLY GOES OVER THAT BRIDGE DAILY.

3% OF THE NATION'S GDP.

OUR NATION'S GDP IS ROUGHLY $25 TRILLION, AND SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT $600 BILLION HERE.

AND SO IT'S REALLY A CHOKE POINT TODAY.

AND WHAT THE PLAN ALL ALONG HAS BEEN IS FOR NOT A REBUILDING OF THIS BRIDGE.

IT'S BUILT STUDERLY.

BUT FOR CREATING A COMPANION BRIDGE TO THE WEST.

A BRIDGE THAT WOULD SUPPLEMENT THE LANES, THE NORTH AND SOUTHBOUND LANES ON THE BRENT SPENCE TODAY.

AND THEN RELIEVE THIS PRESSURE, THIS CONGESTION.

AND MANY PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO GO OVER IT TODAY BECAUSE YOUR EMERGENCY LANES WERE TAKEN OUT.

THEY WERE REMOVED.

THERE WERE JUST THREE WHEN IT WAS BUILT IN 1963.

THERE WERE THREE LANES IN EACH DIRECTION NORTH AND SOUTH.

IT WAS EXPANDED TO FOUR, AND THE EMERGENCY LANES WERE REMOVED.

SO THE ADDITION OF THE BRIDGE TO THE WEST WOULD RELIEVE THIS CONGESTION ON THE BRIDGE.

TODAY 160,000 VEHICLES A DAY ARE TRAVELING OVER THE BRIDGE, AND IT WAS BUILT FOR 80,000.

IT'S A CAPACITY ISSUE.

IT NEEDS RELIEF.

AND THIS IS JUST SYMPTOMATIC.

THIS IS JUST SYMPTOMATIC.

THE BRENT SPENCE IS A POSTER CHILD NOT JUST IN KENTUCKY FOR INFRASTRUCTURE NEEDS BUT IN THE COUNTRY.

IT'S SYMPTOMATIC OF THE PROBLEMS.

BUT I'M ALSO -- I ALSO EMPATHIZE, HAVING BEEN A MAYOR, I EMPATHIZE WITH MAYOR JOE MEYER, MY FRIEND MEYER WHO IS CONCERNED AND ANXIOUS ABOUT HOW MUCH THE ADDITION OF THIS BRIDGE, THE NEW BRIDGE, WHAT "EXTRA" COMPROMISES IT COMPROMISES IT MAY MAKE FOR COVINGTON AND FOR NORTHERN KENTUCKY.

WE KNOW ABOUT THE BENEFITS, BUT WHAT KIND OF COMPROMISES?

AND WE HAVE -- AND WE'RE PLEDGING TO WORK CAREFULLY IN ANY PLANNING ENDEAVOR WITH OHIO, BETWEEN OHIO AND KENTUCKY.

>> TOLLING?

>> TOLLING'S ALWAYS A CHALLENGE.

IT'S REALLY TOUGH TO -- IT'S REALLY TOUGH TO GET A PROJECT DONE TODAY, AND EVERYBODY KNOWS THIS, THAT WITHOUT LOCAL CONTRIBUTIONS IN SOME FORM, IT'S REALLY TOUGH TO MANAGE THE FULL FINANCIAL PACKAGE.

THAT SAID, YOU KNOW, PERHAPS WASHINGTON WOULD BE WILLING TO STEP UP AND SUPPORT THIS PROJECT IN A MORE MEANINGFUL WAY BECAUSE IT DOES REPRESENT SO MUCH TO THE NATION'S ECONOMY.

>> I WANT TO REAL QUICKLY TALK ABOUT A REPORT THAT I KNOW YOU'RE AWARE OF THAT CHAM OUT FROM THE BLUEGRASS INSTITUTE OF PUBLIC POLICY SOLUTIONS.

THEY'RE CALLING FOR A A FULL AUD OF THE KENTUCKY TRANSPORTATION CABINET'S BIDDING PROCESS.

ACCORDING TO THEIR CALCULATIONS, THERE HAVE BEEN 68 SINGLE BID CONTRACTS AWARDED THAT HAVE EXCEEDED YOUR OWN INTERNAL COST ESTIMATES THAT HAVE TOTALED $57 MILLION TO KENTUCKY'S ROAD CONTRACTORS.

YOUR RESPONSE TO THIS REPORT.

>> WELL, IT'S WHAT I WOULD CITE IS A CONSERVATIVE FOUNDATION CALLED THE REASON FOUNDATION, AND IT'S SUPPORTED BY THE KOCH BROTHERS, AND IT HAS CHARACTERIZED KENTUCKY, RANKED KENTUCKY'S TRANSPORTATION CABINET AS NUMBER ONE IN THE COUNTRY IN TERMS OF ITS EFFICIENCIES, IN TERMS OF ITS COST PER LANE MILE FOR WHAT I WOULD CALL IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR GENERAL AND ADMINISTRATOR OVERHEAD G&AMOUNT OF.

OUR COST PER MILE IS THE LOWEST IN THE COUNTRY AS IT IS RELATES TO THE ADMINISTRATION OF THE PROGRAM.

NOW, THE DYNAMICS IN THE PAYING INDUSTRY AND THE CONSTRUCTION AS IT RELATES TO PAVING ARE SUCH THAT EVERY AREA THERE IS AN INVESTMENT MADE.

PRIVATE SECTOR MAKES AN INVESTMENT, AND THE PUBLIC SECTOR RELIES ON THAT INVESTMENT THROUGH ITS CONTRACTORS.

NOT IN EVERY CASE IS THERE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR A VERY ROBUST COMPETITIVE ENVIRONMENT, AND THIS IS WHY THE CABINET OVER TIME HAS CREATED ITS OWN INTERNAL ESTIMATING SYSTEMS.

AND ON MANY CASES, THE CABINET, WHEN -- ON OCCASIONS WHEN BIDS ARE MADE, WILL ACTUALLY REJECT BIDS AND NOT AWARD THEM AND ASK FOR THE CONTRACTS TO BE REBID FOR THE PROJECTS TO BE REBID.

AND WHAT I HAVE OBSERVED IN THE TIME THAT I'VE BEEN HERE IS THAT THE CABINET DOES A VERY RESPONSIBLE JOB ON BEHALF OF THE TAXPAYERS, GIVEN ALL THE CIRCUMSTANCES IN ENSURING THAT THE TAXPAYERS ARE GETTING A COMPETITIVE AND RESPONSIBLE JOB DONE.

>> IT'S NOT -- >> AND THAT WAS WHAT THE REASON FOUNDATION INDICATED ITSELF.

>> SO THIS IS NOT CONTRIBUTING TO A HIGHER COST OF THESE PROJECTS BECAUSE OF THE LACK OF COMPETITIVE BIDDING PROCESS ABOUT NO,.

>> NO, IT'S NOT.

WHAT I SAID EARLIER IS YOU'LL HAVE AB ASPHALT PLANT IN AN AREA, AND IT'S COSTS FOR TRAVELING, FOR TAKING THE MATERIALS, HAULING THE MATERIALS IN AN AREA, FOR EXAMPLE, IN EASTERN KENTUCKY WILL BE GREATER THAN AN AREA, FOR EXAMPLE, IN LOUISVILLE.

AND HENCE THE COST, THE UNIT COST MAY BE SOMEWHAT HIGHER IN EASTERN KENTUCKY OR IN AN ENVIRONMENT WHERE THERE ARE MORE CHALLENGING ROADS TO MANEUVER OR WHERE YOU DO NOT HAVE AS MUCH INVESTMENT IN PLANT AND EQUIPMENT.

>> THANK YOU.

SECRETARY JIM GRAY, WE APPRECIATE A FEW MINUTES OF YOUR TIME.

>> THANK YOU, RENEE.

>> SO NOW I WANT TO GO RIGHT IMMEDIATELY TO ANDREW MCNEILL WHO IS IN OUR LOUISVILLE STUDIO THERE, AND I WANT TO ASK YOU BECAUSE THIS WAS A REPORT THAT YOU ALL HAD ISSUED, THE BLUEGRASS INSTITUTE OF PUBLIC POLICY SOLUTIONS BASED ON YOUR CALCULATIONS ABOUT THESE SINGLE-BID CONTRACTS, YOU HEARD SECRETARY GRAY'S RESPONSE TO THAT REPORT.

DID YOU BUY THAT?

>> WELL, I HAVE A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF RESPECT FOR SECRETARY GRAY AND THINK THAT HE GAVE A RESPONSE THAT JUSTIFIES THE POSITION THAT HE TAKES, WHICH IS HE'S OVERSEEING THE CABINET THAT HE BELIEVES TO BE AS EFFICIENT AS POSSIBLE IN HIS MIND.

BUT THIS IS NOT ONLY A REPORT BUT IT'S SOMETHING WE'VE BEEN TRACKING FOR ABOUT 12 MONTHS NOW, AND THE FACT IS, IS THAT CONTRACTS CONTINUE TO BE AWARDED BASED UPON SINGLE BIDS IN VARIOUS COUNTIES THROUGHOUT THE STATE TO CONTRACTORS THAT ARE SUBMITTING BIDS THAT ARE HIGHER THAN CABINET INTERNAL ESTIMATES.

AND SO, YES, THESE PROJECTS ARE COSTING MORE THAN EVEN WHAT THE CABINET BELIEVES THOSE PROJECT COSTS SHOULD BE.

TO SECRETARY GRAY'S COMMENTS ABOUT REASON FOUNDATION STUDY.

I HAVEN'T SEEN THAT.

BUT AGAIN SECRETARY GRAY IS SOMEBODY WHO I APPRECIATE HIS PRIVATE SECTOR EXPERIENCE AND BELIEVE THAT HE HAS THE BEST INTENTIONS IN MANAGING HIS CABINET IN AN EFFECTIVE WAY.

I THINK THAT THEREFORE HE MIGHT EMBRACE THE CHANCE TO AUDIT THE CABINET, LOOK AT THE BIDDING PRACTICES, HAVE A CLOSE LOOK AT HOW THOSE BIDDING PRACTICES ARE MANAGED, AND COMMUNICATE TO THE TAXPAYERS WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE GETTING THEIR MOST BANG FOR THE BUCK FOR THESE PROJECTS AND THE BIDS THAT GO OUT FOR PAVING AND ASPHALT.

>> BUT YOU BELIEVE THAT IT SHOULD GO A STEP FURTHER, THAT THOSE -- THAT CONTRACTING SHOULD STOP UNTIL THAT AUDIT IS CONCLUDED OR IT FINDS WHAT YOU BELIEVE IS ACCEPTABLE?

>> NO, I DON'T THINK YOU CAN STOP, I DON'T THINK YOU CAN STOP THE LETTING OF CONTRACTS.

I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE MOVE FORWARD WITH KEEPING THESE PROJECTS IN THE PIPELINE AND MOVING FORWARD.

BUT I THINK THAT YOU CAN DO BOTH AT THE SAME TIME.

I THINK THAT YOU CAN CONTINUE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH COMPREHENSIVE AUDIT OF THE CABINET WHILE ALSO CONTINUING TO GET THROUGH THE SUMMER CONSTRUCTION SEASON AND PREPARE FOR THE LETTING OF CONTRACTS IN THE NEXT YEAR.

>> CHAD LARUE, LET ME GET YOUR RESPONSE TO THIS ONGOING KIND OF INVESTIGATION THAT THEY HAVE BEEN DOING IN EVALUATING THESE SINGLE BID CONTRACTS.

>> NO, I APPRECIATE THAT, AND I APPRECIATE ANDREWS POSITION ON THIS AS WELL AND SECRETARY GRAY'S.

WHAT I WOULD ACTUALLY TELEYOU RENEE AND SHARE WITH THE FOLKS IS A CIVIL ENGINEER I WORKED TO TRANSPORTATION CABINET FOR TEN YEARS SO I HAVE FAMILIARITY WITH THE CONTRACTING INDUSTRY.

WHAT I WOULD TELL YOU IS THAT THE CABINET HAS A COMMITTEE THAT EVALUATES EVERY BID, ESPECIALLY THOSE THAT ARE SINGLE BID OVER THE ENGINEER'S ESTIMATE, AND THAT TEAM EVALUATES THAT BID AGAINST THEIR ESTIMATE.

THEY TAKE POTENTIAL INPUT FROM THE CONTRACTING INDUSTRY, IF THERE ARE EXTENUATING CIRCUMSTANCES THAT MAY IMPACT THE COST OF A PROJECT.

THE CABINET'S COMMITTEE EVALUATES THAT PROJECT AND MAKES A DETERMINATION BASED ON THAT FULL INFORMATION.

SO WE WOULD MAKE -- WE WOULD TAKE THE POSITION THAT THE CABINET HAD A GOOD POLICY IN PLACE.

IT'S ABOVE BOARD.

IT'S PUBLIC.

THAT INFORMATION IS A GROUP OF HIGHLY EXPERIENCED LONG-TERM PROFESSIONAL ENGINEERS WITH THE TRANSPORTATION CABINET, AND ON THE PROJECTS THAT HAVE FEDERAL FUNDING IN IT, IT LETTERS INCLUDES A REVIEW FROM THE FEDERAL HIGHWAY ADMINISTRATION.

SO THERE IS A THOROUGH PROCESS IN PLACE.

>> DO YOU THINK THAT A FULL AUDIT WOULD HELP REASSURE TAXPAYERS AND OTHERS OF THE EFFICACY AND THE REASONABLE APPROACH THAT THE CABINET IS TAKING?

>> I WOULD NOT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT.

WHAT I WOULD HOPE TO HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO IS SHOW THEM THE POLICY AND PROCEDURES THAT ARE IN PLACE NOW BECAUSE I THINK A LOT OF THE PUBLIC THAT MAY HAVE A QUESTION ORE WANT TO UNDERSTAND THAT BETTER DON'T KNOW WHAT'S BEING DONE NOW TO OVERSEE THAT.

>> AND SO THE BIG QUESTION FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE WATCHING AT HOME IS WHY DOES ANY OF THAT MATTER ABOUT THE ROADS AND THE BRIDGES THAT I HAVE TO TAKE TO GET TO AND FROM HOME AND WORK IN OTHER PLACES.

WHY DOES IT MATTER, JD CHANEY?

>> FIRST LET ME GIVE A SHOUT-OUT AND SAY AMEN TO ONE OF MY FORM BOSSES, MAYOR GRAY.

I THINK HE SUMMED THAT UP REALLY WELL.

I KNOW HE'S GOTTEN A PROMOTION IN SOME TERMS.

I WOULD HAVE, FROM THE LEAGUE STANDPOINT, THE BIDDING PRACTICES, I WOULD HAVE FULL CONFIDENCE IN MAYOR GRAY.

YOU LOOK AT WHAT HE DID IN HIS TERM OF MAYOR HERE IN LEXINGTON, BUT ALWAYS ANY GOVERNMENT, ANY ORGANIZATION COULD ALWAYS BE MORE EFFICIENT AND COULD LOOK AT THAT.

BUT FROM A LOCAL PERSPECTIVE, FROM THE CITY GOVERNMENT AND COUNTY GOVERNMENT PERSPECTIVE, THAT PROCESS ISN'T AFFECTING THE REVENUES AND THEIR ABILITY TO DO OUR CROSS CONTRACTS AT THE LOCAL LEVEL USING COUNTY AID ROAD FUNDS AND MUNICIPAL ROAD AID FUNDS.

SO LARGELY WE WOULD LEAVE THAT LIKE WE ASK THE STATE TO DO IN LOCAL AFFAIRS, WE WOULD PROBABLY STAY OUT OF THAT DEBATE WITH REGARD TO STATE GOVERNMENT.

>> I WANT TO GO TO YOU.

I APPRECIATE YOU BEING HERE, JUDGE.

IT'S GOOD TO SEE YOU.

I I THINK YOU GET THE REWARD FOR THE LOGAN TRAVEL TIME.

THERE WERE SEVERAL THINGS IN THE INTERVIEW WITH SECRETARY GRAY THAT WE CAN BREAK DOWN.

BRENTY SPENCE WE'RE GOING TO GET TO IN A MINUTE BUT I DO WANT TO TALKING ABOUT IN EASTERN KENTUCKY THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF FOCUS ON WASTEWATER, AND YOU HEARD THE LADY MS. BAR BIANN MAYNARD ABOUT THAT WHITE HOUSE PIECE THAT STARTED CIRCULATING RAS WEEK.

I'D LIKE YOU TO COMMENT ON THAT PARTICULAR PORTION AND THE IDEA THAT YOU ALL ARE DEALING WITH BASIC BLACKTOP AND ROAD ISSUES AND EXPANDING FOUR-LANE HIGHWAYS AND THINGS THAT MAYBE OTHER PARTS OF THE STATE DON'T QUIET FAMILIARITY WITH.

>> WE CAN START BY TALKING ABOUT THE ROADSIDE OF THINGS AND, YOU KNOW, WE OBVIOUSLY AREALITIES LOOKING TO FRY TO IMPROVE THE PUBLIC SAFETY OF OUR ROADS AND ARE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PURPOSES.

WE'RE WORKING TO REINVENT OUR ECONOMY OBVIOUSLY, OUR ENERGY SECTOR HAS DEDECLINED SEVERAL YEARS AND WE'RE TRYING TO REINVENT OURSELVES, AND THE WAY WE DO IS WE DO SO WITH WHY I'M PROVED ROAD SYSTEMS.

WE HAVE TWO BASIC THE WAYS WE LOOK AT IT.

WE HAVE MAJOR PROJECTS THAT EITHER UPGRADE OR EXPAND ROADS TO ALLOW SAFER TRAVEL FOR FOLKS TO COME ON OUR AREA, AND THAT'S WHAT WE WANT TO DO.

WE WANT FOLKS TO LIVE IF OUR AREA.

WE THINK BEVE HAVE WE HAVE LIGHTER TO OFFER THEM.

WE HAVE THAT PART OF IT THAT COMES PRIMARILY FROM STATE AND FEDERAL FUNDING THAT COMES FROM THE CONVERSATION YOU'RE HAVING OTHERWISE.

THEN THE OTHER SIDE ON IT IS THE LOCAL WITH OUR BASIC COUNTY ROAD AID, AND THERE'S SIGNIFICANT NEEDS ON BOTH SIDES.

SO THE SUPPORT THAT WE CAN GET FOR FUNDING IS SO CRITICAL TO US.

WHEN YOU TAKE A LOOK AT OUR COUNTY ROAD AID, WE HAVE A DESIGNATED, AN ALLOCATED AMOUNT FROM THE URAL SECONDARY ROADS ROUGHLY 150,000 AIDS YEAR, AND THAT MAY PAVE 2, 2-1/2 MILES OF ROADS AND JOHNSON COUNTY IS SITTING 250 PLUS MILES OF ROADS.

OBVIOUSLY WE'RE NO TALKING ABOUT BEING ABLE TO UPGRADE ROADS IN YEARS.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DECADES.

AND SO THE NEED FOR THAT FUNDING IS OBVIOUSLY SO SIGNIFICANT ON THE ROADSIDE OF THINGS.

>> AND TO GET TO YOUR POINT ABOUT JOBS AND THE ECONOMY, AND THAT'S WHAT SECRETARY GRAY I THINK WAS SAYING THE IN BEGINNING, THAT IT IS ABOUT JOBS, YOU'RE SEEING SOME MIGRATION BACK TO YOUR AREA, IS THAT CORRECT.

>> ?

WE ABSOLUTELY ARE.

>> AND IS COUNTER THE NARRATIVE THAT WE'VE BEEN HEARING ABOUT AN OUTMIGRATION FROM EASTERN KENTUCKY BECAUSE OF THE ENERGY DECLINE.

>> CORRECT.

AND WE'RE SO HAPPY TO SEE THAT HAPPENINGS, AND WE ANY THAT'S HAPPENING BECAUSE PEOPLE SEE OPPORTUNITY IN EASTERN KENTUCKY NOW, THEY SEE THINGS LIKE IMPROVED BROADBAND,Y THIS SEE IMPROVED ROAD SYSTEMS, THEY SEE IMPROVED INFRASTRUCTURE AND WATER AND SEWER, THEY SEE THAT QUALITY OF LIFE.

THAT'S OUR OVERARCHING GOAL IN WHAT WE DO AS LOCAL COMMUNITY LEADERS IS TO TRY TO IMPROVE THAT QUALITY OF LIFE FOR EVERY CITIZEN WE POLICE DEPARTMENT I THINK FOLKS ARE SEEING THAT OPPORTUNITY NOW AND WE'RE WANTED TO COME HERE TO EAST KENTUCKY, SO THAT'S A KEY PART.

THE ROADS AIR KEY PART.

BUT THE WATER AND SEWER IS OBVIOUSLY THAT OTHER PIECE OF THE PUZZLE THAT WE'RE NOW STARTING -- NOW WE HAVE FUNDING THAT'S BEEN ALLOCATED TO US DIRECTLY, AND WE HAVE FUNDING THAT OBVIOUSLY IS AVAILABLE INTO SENATE BILL 36 WITH THE STATE.

AND SO THOSE ARE GOING TO BE PRESENT OPPORTUNITIES FOURS AS WELL.

>> SO WHEN YOU SEE THESE CLIPS LIKE WE SAW THAT CAME FROM THE WHITE HOUSE, BUT THIS IS A ONE-WOMAN STORY OF WHAT SHE'S DEALING WITH USING BOTTLED WATERS TO BRUSH HER TEETH AND ANTIBACTERIAL SOAP BEFORE SHE SHOWERS, THAT IS THE NARRATIVE, THE STORY THAT WE HEAR MORE OF.

IS THAT WIDESPREAD IN EASTERN KENTUCKY OR IS THAT REALLY JUST RELEGATED TO MARTIN COUNTY?

>> I THINK EVERY COMMUNITY, EVERY COUNTY HAS A VARYING LEVELS CHALLENGES WHEN IT COMES TO THEIR WATER AND SEWER INFRASTRUCTURE.

I THINK THAT'S OBVIOUS.

AND YOU CERTAINLY HATE TO SEE THOSE SITUATIONS IN ANY COUNTY, ESPECIALLY IN COUNTIES THAT ARE IN NEIGHBORING COUNTIES TO MY COUNTY.

AND SO YOU HATE TO SEE THAT.

BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU KNOW, WE ALSO I THINK EVERY COMMUNITY IS LOOKING AT OPPORTUNITIES LIKE WHAT WE HAVE NOW TO UTILIZE THE FUNDS THAT HAVE BEEN ALLOCATED FOR COUNTIES THROUGH BOTH SOURCES BUT THROUGH THE STATE AND ALSO THROUGH, DIRECTLY FROM THE TREASURY TO COUNTIES.

WE'RE LOOKING TO USE THOSE FUNDS TO IMPROVE THOSE SITUATIONS, AGAIN TO IMPROVE THAT OVERALL QUALITY OF LIFE FOR OUR CITIZENS.

SO WE CERTAINLY WANT TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE OPPORTUNITIES THAT WE NOW HAVE TO DEAL WITH SOME OF THESE ISSUES.

>> AND BROADBAND IS AN ISSUE THAT WE'RE GOING TO TACKLE INTH OWN SINGULAR PROGRAM.

YOU'LL HATER MENTIONED TONIGHT BUT IT'S A JUGGERNAUT THAT WE DON'T WANT TO SHORTCHANGE IT AND WE WANT TO GAVE IT LOT OF ATTENTION IN JULY.

I WANT TO GO TO YOU, MAYOR MEYER WHO I'M PROBABLY GOING TO SLIP AND UP CALL YOU MR. SECRETARY BECAUSE I REMEMBER YOU IN THAT CAPACITY AS WELL.

WE TALKED ABOUT THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE AND YOU'VE BEEN VERY VOCAL.

YOU'VE BEEN QUOTED ALL OVER NATIONAL PUBLICATIONS AND ON CABLE TELEVISION TALKING ABOUT THIS ISSUE, AND WHEN SECRETARY GRAY MENTIONED ABOUT A NEW BRIDGE COULD COMPROMISE COVINGTON, THAT IT HAS ITS BENEFITS BUT IT ALSO HAS ITS AND WHAT DOES THAT MEAN EXACTLY N. >> RENEE, LET'S START FIRST WITH THE WHOLE FUNDING ISSUE, AND THAT'S TOLLING.

KENTUCKY TRANSPORTATION CABINET DAY STUDY THAT SHOWED THAT IF THERE'S A $2.00 TOLL ON THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE, 77,000 CONSIDERATION DAY WOULD GET OFF THE EXPRESSWAY TO AVOID PAYING A TOLL.

NOW, THAT ANALYSIS HAS BEEN SUPPORTED BY THEIR INTERFERENCE IN LOUISVILLE I-65 BRIDGE WHICH IS WHICH HAS SEEN A 49% DECLINE IN TRAFFIC SINCE THE TOLLS WERE INSTITUTED.

IN COVINGTON'S CASE, WE EXPERIENCED WHAT DIVERSION WAS LIKE LAST NOVEMBER AND DECEMBER WHEN THE BRIDGE WAS SHUT DOWN.

AND LET ME TELL YOU, THERE WERE SO MANY VEHICLES IN OUR CITY THAT BUSINESS WAS FROZEN.

TRAFFIC BACKUPS WERE SO SEVERE, SO LONG THAT EVERYTHING STOPPED.

TRUCKS AND VEHICLES WERE LOOKING FOR EVERY SHORTCUT.

THEY WENT THROUGH A LOT OF RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS AND JUST IMPAIRED THE QUALITY OF LIFE IN ALL THE RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS.

IN ALL, IT IS A -- THE DIVERSION IS A DISASTER.

AND TO PUT THAT 77,000 VEHICLES.

IN CONTEXT, AND THE I-69 BRIDGE BETWEEN HENDERSON AND EVANSVILLE, WHAT THEY'RE PROJECTING, 30 OR 35,000 CARS A DAY AND THEY'RE SPENDING $1.5 BILLION FOR IT, YOU KNOW HOW MUCH MONEY THE STATES ARE WILLING TO GIVE COVINGTON FOR THE 77 CARS A DAY?

NOTHING.

ZERO.

THEY'RE SAYING LIVE WITH IT.

ISN'T 7,000 CARS.

$1.5BILLION FOR I-69.

AND HOW MUCH ARE WE SPENDING ON THE EXTENSION OF THE MOUNTAIN PARKWAY FOR 8,000 CARS A DAY?

$600,000, $700 MILLION.

AGAIN, FOR COVINGTON NOTHING.

SO HOW CAN I TELL THE PEOPLE IN MY CITY THAT WE SHOULD BE COLLATERAL DAMAGE TO THIS FUNDING MECHANISM FOR A BRIDGE THAT DOES NOT SERVE OUR COMMUNITY?

IT SERVES THOSE WHO DRIVE THROUGH OUR COMMUNITY.

>> SO WHAT WOULD BE THE ANSWER THEN?

>> WELL, IF YOU ELIMINATE TOLLS, YOU ELIMINATE THE IMMEDIATE DIVERSION ISSUE.

BUT THERE'S A SECOND ISSUE WITH TOLLING THAT I REALLY HAVE TO MENTION.

THIS IS NOT A $2.5 BILLION BRIDGE.

IT'S A $2.5 BILLION PROJECT.

$1BILLION OF IT IS IN OHIO.

$700MILLION IS THE BRIDGEES.

AND $600 MILLION IS KENTUCKY.

60% IS IN OHIO.

40% IN KENTUCKY.

THE PROPOSAL PROPOSED WAS TO HAVE TOLLS ON THE BRIDGE, SO WHEN KENTUCKIANS WHO ARE 65% OF THE LOCAL TRAFFIC ON THAT BRIDGE DRIVE FROM FORT MITCHELL AND GET OFF AT THIS STREET IN CINCINNATI TO GO TO WORK, THEY PAY A TOLL.

ON THE OHIO SIDE THE FOLKS WHO GET ON THE MOST EXPENSIVE PART OF THE PROJECT AND GET OFF AT FIFTH STREET IN CINCINNATI, THEY PAY NOTHING.

SO PART OF OUR ISSUE IS -- AND THE TOLLS WILL BE SPLIT 60s% GOING TO OHIO, 40% TO KENTUCKY, AGAIN, 65% OF THE TRAFFIC ON THAT BRIDGE IS LOCAL TRAFFIC IS KENTUCKIANS.

WHY SHOULD KENTUCKY SUBSIDIZE AN OHIO INFRASTRUCTURE PROJECT?

SO THERE'S AN EQUITY ISSUE THERE THAT WE NEED TO DEAL WITH TOO.

THE NEXT BIG THING IS THAT THE SCALE OF THE BRIDGE, THE CURRENT BRIDGE IS 42 FEET WIDE, AND THE PROPOSAL IS TO BUILD A BRIDGE NEXT TO IT THAT'S 120 SOME ODD FEET WIDE.

IT WOULD LITERALLY QUINTUPLE THE LANDING SPACE IN COVINGTON THAT IS REQUIRED BY THE EXPRESSWAY.

OUR CITY WAS EXTREMELY DAMAGED THE IN 1960s WHEN THE INTERSTATE WENT IN IT.

JUST CUT OUR CITY IN HALF.

THIS EXACERBATES THAT.

IT MAKES IT FAR, FAR WORSE.

IT'S COMPLETELY OUT OF SCALE TO OUR CITY.

AND THE LAST THING I'LL SAY IS THIS.

THEY WANT EIGHT SOUTHBOUND LANES ON THAT BRIDGE.

EIGHT LANES.

YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU GET TO KYLE'S LANE WHICH IS RIGHT OUTSIDE THE COVINGTON CITY LIMITS?

THE EXPRESSWAY GOES BACK TO FOUR LANES.

WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN WHEN YOU HAVE EIGHT LANES OF TRAFFIC GOING INTO FOUR LANES?

IT'S GOING TO BE CALL CONGESTION SUSPECT SO ALL THIS PROJECT DOES IS IT DOESN'T SOLVE THIS OUTBOUND CONGESTION IT.

JUST MOVES IT INTO KENTUCKY.

AND WHO PAYS FOR THE POLICE AND THE FIRE AND THE AMBULANCE TO DEAL WITH ALL NOSE WRECKS AND ALL THOSE PROBLEMS?

JUST THE COVINGTON TAXPAYERS.

AGAIN, THIS PROJECT THE WAY IT'S DESIGNED IS MAKING COVINGTON AND ITS PEOPLE AND ITS NEIGHBORHOODS AND ITS BUSINESSES COLLATERAL DAMAGE TO A PROJECT THAT REALLY DOESN'T SERVE US VERY WELL.

>> SO IS THERE ANYTHING THAT A, PERHAPS AN INFRASTRUCTURE COMPROMISE COULD DO IN WASHINGTON TO HELP YOU?

>> YOU KNOW, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF THINGS.

ONE OF THE MAJOR PROBLEMS THAT WE HAVE WITH THE TRAFFIC ON THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE IS THAT THAT BRIDGE WAS BUILT FOR UNEXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR, I-75, AND OVER TIME TWO MORE EXPRESSWAYS WERE ADDED TO IT, I-74 FROM INDIANAPOLIS DOWN TO CINCINNATI, AND THEN I-71 USES THE SAME BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE CORRIDOR.

WHEN YOU HEAR STORIES ABOUT THE CONGESTION ON THE BRIDGE, IT'S ACTUALLY AT THE NORTH END OF THE BRIDGE WHERE I-7 JOINS INTO I-75.

IF YOU COULD TAKE I-71, DISDISTRICT I-75, PUT ON IT I-471, RUN IT OUT TO I-275 AND THEN OVER TO I75, YOU WOULD ELIMINATE THE MOST EXTREME CONGESTION ON THE BRIDGE.

YOU WOULD ENHANCE SAFETY.

AND YOU WOULD REDUCE THE TRAFFIC VOLUME BRIDGE SIGNIFICANTLY.

>> AND HOW MUCH WOULD THAT COST?

>> WELL, MATTER OF FACT THEY'RE DOING IT RIGHT NOW FOR NOTHING BECAUSE WHILE THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE IS IN THE PROCESS OF BEING PAINTED, THE OHIOANS HAVE DIVERTED ALL THE I-471 TRAFFIC ACROSS I-471.

SO THERE ARE LESS EXPENSIVE OPTIONS THAT ARE AVAILABLE TO MEET THE NEEDS.

AND, RENEE, LET ME GO BACK TO THE BEGINNING.

YOUR SECRETARY GRAY YOU HEARD HIM SAY THERE WAS ABOUT 160,000 CARS A DAY USE THE BRIDGE.

IF 77,000 OF THEM LEAVE BECAUSE OF A $2.00 TOLL, THAT BUDS THE TRAFFIC VOLUME BACK WITHIN THE ORIGINAL DESIGN STANDARD.

>> 80,000 IS WHAT IT'S SUPPOSED TO -- CAST.

>> 80,000.

>> JAW.

>> SO, YOU KNOW, WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT THESE TRANSPORTATION ISSUES IN A DIFFERENT WAY.

WE JUST CAN'T KEEP WIDENING AND WIDENING AND WIDENING AND PRETEND IT'S GOING TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM BECAUSE IT DOESN'T.

>> MR. CHANEY, YOUR THOUGHTS ON THIS.

>> YOU GOT TO ENGAGE LOCAL COMMUNITY THAT'S IMPACTED.

SO THE LEAFING CITIES HASN'T TAKEN ANY FORMAL POSITION OBVIOUSLY.

MAYOR MEYERS IS A BOARD MEMBER, BUT WHAT HE'S SAYING IS SUPPORTED BY ALL FOUR OF HIS BOARD OF COMMISSION MEMBERS.

SO YOU HAVE A UNANIMOUS VOICE THERE IN COVINGTON TALKING ABOUT THAT IMPACT.

AND SO AS THE STATE MOVES FORWARD, AS THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT MOVES FORWARD WITH THIS, THEY'VE GOT TO ENGAGE AND LOOK AT THE LOCAL IMPACT BECAUSE MAYOR MEYERS MADE THE POINT, IT DOES HAVE A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON THE QUALITY OF LIFE IN COVINGTON.

THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY THERE AND OTHERS.

SO WE WOULD ENCOURAGE, ENCOURAGE THAT PROCESS TO GO FORWARD.

>> WHICH HASN'T STARTED YET.

>> WHICH HASN'T -- I'LL DEFER TO MAYOR MEYER, BUT -- >> SECRETARY GRAY AND THE KENTUCKY TRANSPORTATION CABINET HAS BEEN SUPERB IN WORKING WOWS AND VOTING FOR US BECAUSE THIS IS A BISTATE THING.

WE'VE GOT TO GET OHIO AT THE TABLE, AND OHIO HAS TO RECOGNIZE THE LEGITIMACY OF OUR CONCERNS AND BE PART OF THE PROCESS OF FIGURING OUT, OKAY, HOW ARE WE GOING TO ADDRESS THIS IN A WAY THAT'S SUSTAINABLE BECAUSE THE CURRENT PLAN, IT'S REALLY -- ONE OF THE OHIO DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION ENGINEERS SAID THAT THE THE WAY THE TRANSPORTATION NETWORK IN CINCINNATI IS DESIGNED, ALL OF THE ROADS, MAJOR ROADS FUNNEL TO THE I-75 CORRIDOR, AND HE SAID, LITERALLY, YOU CAN BUILD AS MANY LANES AS YOU WANT, BUT NO MATTER HOW MANY LANES YOU BUILD, IT WILL FILL.

SO THERE ARE SOME BASIC PLANNING ISSUES HERE THAT THE COMMUNITY AS A WHOLE HAS TO COME TO GRIPS WITH BEFORE WE DECIDE TO SPEND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS FOR A PROJECT THAT WILL NOT SOLVE THE REGION'S PROBLEMS.

>> SO WHEN WE TAKE A BROADER PERSPECTIVE STATEWIDE, AND I'LL GO TO YOU ALSO, MEMBER ANDREW MCNEILL IN OUR LOUISVILLE STUDIO, AND YOU THINK ABOUT WHAT WASHINGTON COULD DO TO HELP KENTUCKY, WHETHER IT'S BRENT SPENCE OR IT'S ANOTHER -- WE KNOW THAT THERE'S A C MINUS RATING IN INFRASTRUCTURE FOR KENTUCKY STATEWIDE WHEN IT COMES TO OUR INFRASTRUCTURE.

WHAT DO YOU THINK WASHINGTON SHOULD BE DOING?

IF ANYTHING, IN YOUR VIEW.

>> WELL, LET'S -- LET'S RECOGNIZED THAT WASHINGTON IS ALREADY DOING A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT IN TERMS OF PROVIDING FUNDING FOR FEDERAL INFRASTRUCTURE PROJECTS.

THE DEBATE IN WASHINGTON IS NOT ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT WE SHOULD INVEST IN INFRASTRUCTURE BECAUSE WE ARE INVESTIGATING IN INFRASTRUCTURE.

EVEN IF THERE WAS NO INFRASTRUCTURE BILL, IF THERE WAS NO INFRASTRUCTURE COMPROMISE, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WOULD SPEND ABOUT $450 BILLION OVER THE NEXT DECADE ON HIGHWAYS AND BRIDGES.

SO AS IS OFTEN THE CASE, THE DEBATE IS ABOUT HOW MUCH MORE TO SPEND.

AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE BIPARTISAN BILL THAT THERE SEEMS TO BE SOME SUPPORT CONGEALING AROUND, THE TOTAL SPENDING ON THAT IS APPROACHING $1 TRILLION OF WHICH $560 BILLION IS NEW FUNDING.

SO, YOU KNOW, MUCH LIKE THE DISCUSSION HERE IN KENTUCKY ABOUT OUR STATE FUNDING, THE ROAD FUND SPENDS $1.5 BILLION A YEAR ON STATE HIGHWAYS.

THE GROUPS THAT ARE ADVOCATING FOR MORE AND FOR HIGHER TAXES TO FINANCE THAT, THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE INTERESTED IN, IS MORE GOVERNMENT SPENDING AND THE TAXES TO FINANCE IT.

SO THERE IS QUITE A BIT OF WORK AND SUPPORT AND RESOURCES THAT ARE ALREADY BEING PROVIDED AND WILL CONTINUE TO BE PROVIDED EVEN IF THESE BIPARTISAN INFRASTRUCTURE TALKS FAIL.

>> AND SO YOU WOULDN'T BE FOR USER FEES OR AN INCREASE IN FUEL OR GAS TAXES.

WHERE DO YOU STAND ON ADDITIONAL FINANCIAL SUPPORT FOR INFRASTRUCTURE?

>> WELL, THE -- IT'S INTERESTING.

THE CURRENT BIPARTISAN PROPOSAL THAT IS GETTING SO MUCH ATTENTION, IT DOES NOT HAVE AN INCREASE IN THE FEDERAL GAS TAX.

IT DOES HAVE AN INDEXING OF THAT FEDERAL GAS TAX TO INFLATION SO THAT YOU WOULD SEE SOME SLOW RATCHETING OF THE FEDERAL GAS TAX GOING FORWARD.

BUT THERE'S NO IMMEDIATE GAS TAX INCREASE.

THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION HAS REJECTED THAT.

INSTEAD, THEY HAVE A PREFERENCE FOR RAISING CORPORATE INCOME TAX RATES AS WELL AS USING POTENTIALLY SOME WEALTH TAX APPROACHES TO FINANCE EITHER INFRASTRUCTURE PACKAGE BUT THEN THE UNITED STATES CHAMBER OF COMMERCE, WHICH IS ONE OF THE LEADING VOICES FOR A 25-CENT INCREASE IN THE GAS TAX, REJECTS THE USE OF OR AN INCREASE IN THE CORPORATE INCOME TAX TO PAY FOR THIS.

SO I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF MOVING PARTS.

I THINK THAT IT'S HARD TO COMMENT ON EXACTLY WHAT OUR POSITION WOULD BE ON FINANCING MECHANISMS UNTIL WE SEE MORE DETAILS, BUT IT LOOKS LIKE FROM A FINANCING STANDPOINT THEY'RE REALLY FAR APART IN WASHINGTON IN TERMS OF COMING TOGETHER ON SOMETHING EVERYBODY CAN AGREE WITH.

>> WELL, AND WE'VE TALKED ABOUT INCREASING THE MOTOR FUEL TAX HERE IN KENTUCKY.

JD CHANEY, I THINK YOU ARE PART OF THE KIT GROUP AND YOU ARE TOO, CHAD LARUE, SO THIS IS -- >> WE ALL ARE HERE.

>> YOU ALL ARE HERE, RIGHT?

EXCUSE ME.

YOU ALL ARE.

SO ARE YOU OPPOSED TO THAT ON A FEDERAL LEVEL?

DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT.

>> >> YOU KNOW, WE HAVE -- THE LEAGUE HASN'T TAKEN A POSITION, A LOT LIKE ANDREW SAID.

I THINK THERE'S A LOT TO SEE WITH REGARD TO HOW THAT PACKAGE IS GOING TO PLAY OUT.

THE HOPE WOULD BE THAT SOME OF THAT MONEY THAT WOULD GO IN A FEDERAL PACKAGE WOULD TRANSLATE INTO HELPING WITH SOME OF THESE BIGGER STATEWIDE PROJECTS, SOME OF THESE, LIKE THE BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT COULD PROVIDE SOME SOLUTIONS TO THAT IF THEY WERE ABLE TO DO THAT.

YOU KNOW, WE HAVEN'T WADED THROUGH IN TERMS OF A POLICY DISSECTION OF ALL THOSE COMPONENT PARTS OF EVEN BIDEN'S ORIGINAL $2 TRILLION PROPOSAL, BUT FOR HERE IN KENTUCKY, ABSOLUTELY.

WE DON'T HAVE A CHOICE.

MOST OF THAT MONEY IN THE FEDERAL PLAN IS PROBABLY NOT GOING TO TRANSLATE INTO JUDGE MCKENZIE'S COUNTY ROADS OR MAYOR MEYERS' CITY STREETS AT ALL IN TERMS OF DOING THOSE PROJECTS WHY LARGELY SUPPLEMENTED BY GENERAL FUND.

IN CITY AND COUNTY BUDGETS.

>> WHAT ABOUT USER FEES?

ELECTRONIC VEHICLES BECOMING MORE AND MORE PROMINENT, AND THERE'S BEEN LOTS OF SCHOOL BUS IN KENTUCKY DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT.

REPRESENTATIVE, YOU HAD A BILL FOR HOW MANY SESSIONS NOW WHEN.

>> FOUR.

>> MR. LARUE, ON THE STATE LEVEL THAT CAN BE DONE TO HELP?

>> CERTAINLY HIT THE HAS TO BE A COMPREHENSIVE LOOK.

IT HAS TO BE FEES THAT HAVEN'T BEEN INCREASED FOR TEN, 20, 30 YEARS, WHETHER THAT BE DRIVER'S LICENSING, REGISTRATION TYPE FEES.

THERE'S CERTAINLY THE DESIRE AND THE NEED TO LOOK AT ALLEGED AND HYBRID FEES.

THERE'S BEEN SOME DISCUSSIONS.

REPRESENTATIVE SANTORO'S BILL HAS PUT LANGUAGE FORTH EACH OF THE LAST FOUR SESSIONS.

RENEE, WHAT I WOULD SAY IS WE'RE IN AN YOU'LL HAVE RIST I.ERY PHASE.

WE KNOW THAT THE MOTOR FUELS TAX AND THE MOTOR VEHICLE USAGE TAX WHICH HAVE BEEN THE PRIMARY DRIVERS FOR DECADES, THAT THAT MODEL THAT WE'VE COUNTED FOR DECADES IS STARTING TO FAIL.

IT'S NOT PROVIDING THE FUNDING WE NEED TO KEEP UP WITH OUR TRANSPORTATION SYSTEM.

WE KNOW THAT, WHETHER IT'S TEN YEARS, 15 YEARS, 20 YEARS FROM NOW, THE MOTOR VEHICLE FLEETS IN THE UNITED STATES ARE GOING TO TRANSITION TO MORE OF A HYBRID AND/OR ELECTRIC FLEET.

SO WE'RE GOING TO NEED TO MAKE A TRANSITION.

BOUGHT WE'RE PREMATURE TO DO THAT NOW.

SO I THINK WHAT BOTH AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL AND AT THE STATE LEVEL WHAT THEY'RE GRAPPLING WITH IS HOW TO MAKE THAT BLEND, SOME BLEND OF MOTOR VEHICLE USAGE TAX, USERS FEES FOR ELECTRIC AND HYBRIDS AND ALSO A TRADITIONAL MOTOR FUELS TAX OUR A GAS TAX.

>> AND MANY PEOPLE STAY THAT OTHERS REGRESSIVE TAXES AND IT CAN HURT THOSE WHO CAN LEAST AFFORD IT.

MAYOR MEYER, WHAT ABOUT THAT ARGUMENT?

>> WELL, HERE'S WHAT I KNOW.

OUR ECONOMIC GROWTH IN COVINGTON IS BEING HELD BACK BECAUSE OF LACK OF OF SUPPORT FOR INFRASTRUCTURE.

ACROSS THE BOARD, BE IT THE WATER LINES, BE IT THE STREET SYSTEM.

THIS IS COMPLETELY INFANT BRENT SPENCE BRIDGE ARGUMENT, AND WE NEED TO HAVE A FAR GREATER SUPPORT FOR INFRASTRUCTURE INVESTMENT TODAY SO THAT OUR PEOPLE BE ENJOY THE FRUITS OF EXPANDED ECONOMIC GROWTH IN THE FUTURE.

AND I THINK THAT THE KENTUCKY MOTOR FUEL TAX HAS BEEN AT SUCH A LOW NUMBER FOR SUCH A LONG PERIOD OF TIME THAT A SMALL INCREASE IS CERTAINLY REASONABLE, AND I ALSO THINK THAT THE FORMULA THAT ALLOCATES MONEY BETWEEN COUNTIES AND CITIES AND THE OTHER PARTS IS WAY OUT OF DATE AND NEEDS TO BE ADJUSTED SO THAT THE AREAS THAT ARE REALLY PRODUCING ECONOMIC GROWTH HAVE THE FINANCIAL RESOURCES TO SUPPORT THAT GROWTH.

>> SO BEFORE WE TALK ABOUT THE FORMULA, WE DID HEAR SOME OF THIS CONVERSATIONS FROM SOME INSTANT REPUBLICAN LEADERS WHO SAY AT THE TIME WHEN GAS WAS NEARING $3 AND DEPENDS ON WHAT GRADE YOU'RE GETTING WELL OVER THAT, THIS WASN'T THE TIME TO BE CONSIDERING RAINES MOTOR FUELS TAX.

SO THERE'S THAT.

AND THEN THE FORM LAW.

IF YOU CAN ADDRESS BOTH OF THOSE.

>> WE'RE FIVE OR SIX SESSIONS WITH IT NOW BEING THE RIGHT TIME TO DO IT, AND KENTUCKY FALLS FURTHER AND FURTHER BEHIND EVERY TIME THE LEGISLATURE REFUSES TO ADDRESS THE ISSUE.

IT'S TIME.

IT'S TIME FOR THE LEGISLATURE TO TACKLE THAT AS WE'RE WATCHING EVERY OTHER STATE AROUND US DO IT, AND IT'S OUR RESPONSIBILITY AND IT'S CONSUMPTION-BASED.

THE BEAUTIFUL PART I THINK ABOUT THIS WHEN I REPRESENT CITIES, WE'RE MAINLY PRODUCT OF-BASED WITH REGARD TO THE REVENUE, BUT WE'RE FUNDED THROUGH A CONSUMPTION-BASED TAX WITH REGARD TO THE MONEY THAT FLOWS INTO OUR STREETS AND COUNTY ROADS, AND IT HAS THE PEOPLE THAT USE THOSE, WHETHER THEY'RE FROM OUT OF STAYED OR OUTSIDE OF OUR CITY OR COUNTY, CONTRIBUTE TO THAT INFRASTRUCTURE THAT THEY GET THE PRIVILEGE TO USE.

SO IN TERMS OF A FAIRNESS STANDPOINT, AND I KNOW I AGREE WITH CHAD COMPLETELY, WE'RE GOING TO TRANSITION OUT BUT IT'S WHAT WE'VE GOT RIGHT NOW, AND WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO UTILIZE THAT.

IN TERMS OF THE FUNDING FORMULA, I'M PROUD TO SAY EARLY ON WE WEREN'T -- MY ORGANIZATION WASN'T SUPPORTIVE OF THE INCREASE IN THE GAS TAX TO FUND THAT.

WE HAD TO HAVE SOME LONG POLICY DISCUSSIONS WITH OUR COUNTY FRIENDS ABOUT THE FORMULA THAT MAYOR MEYER BROUGHT UP, AND WE CAME TIE CONCLUSION WE DON'T WANT TO GUT OR LEAVE COUNTY BUDGETS HIGH AND DRY, AND SO THEIR PROPOSAL SAID, LOOK WEEK WE'LL GO HOLD HARMLESS AND MOVE FORWARD AND MOVE THE MOVE FORE MONEY TO CITIES WANE CREASE BECAUSE MAYOR MYER IS CORRECT.

WEAVE HIRE UTILIZATION.

IT'S MORE COMPLICATED WITH REGARD TO CURBING, GURTING, MILLING THOSE STREETS IT.

COSTS A LOT MORE.

RIGHT NOW WE'RE ON A FOOTER-YEAR REPLACEMENT CYCLE PLAN BECOME THE INDUSTRY AVERAGE IS 15 OR 20 IS WHAT THEY RECOMMEND.

SO 40 YEARS IS WHAT IT'S TAKEN FOR US TO HIT THOSE CITY STREETS THAT ARE RIGHT THERE IN FLOVENT BUSINESS OR RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF THAT HOUSE THAT THE SCHOOL BUSES ARE TRAVELING AND THE TRANSPORTATION.

AND SO, YEAH, WE ARE RELYING ON THE STATE TO TAKE ACTION.

IT'S ONE THAT'S FUNDED BY THE STATE.

>> SO AS THE HEAD OF A COUNTY, JUDGE MCKENZIE, LET ME HEAR FROM YOU.

>> WELL, OBVIOUSLY WE'RE TRYING TO PROVIDE AS QUALITY ROADS AS WE PROBABLY CAN.

OUR ROADS MAY NOT HAVE THE VOLUME OF EUGENIA BUT WE DO HAVE TERRAIN AND CONTOUR CHALLENGES THAT WE STILL HAVE TO FACE TO PROVIDE THAT TO OUR CITIZENS.

WHAT WE DO KNOW IS THAT WE DON'T HAVE FUNDING THAT'S AVAILABLE, WE DON'T HAVE FUNDING AVAILABLE TO US TO DELIVER THAT QUALITY OF ROAD THAT WE BELIEVE ME WE NEED TO FOR OUR CITIZENS HA THEY DESERVE.

SO WHAT WE'RE BASICALLY HAVING EVER ASKING IS FOR THE LEGISLATURE TO GIVE SERIOUS CONSIDERATION ONCE AGAIN, THE NEXT OPPORTUNITY, TO ADDITIONAL FUNDING DOESN'T FOR US.

OUR FISCAL QUARTER ALONG WITH MANY OTHERS, PASSED RESOLUTIONS LAST YEAR BEFORE THIS SESSION THAT BASICALLY SAID TO OUR LEGISLATORS, WE WANT YOU TO PUT FORTH YOUR BEST EFFORT TO FIND A SOLUTION, WHATEVER THAT CONFIGURATION MIGHT BE, FIND A SOLUTION TO TRY TO HELP GENERATE ADDITIONAL FUNDING FOR US TO BE ABLE TO DELIVER THOSE ROADS THAT WE NEED FOR NOT ONLY THE CITIZENS FOR QUALITY OF LIFE BUT ALSO AGAIN, AS WE TALKED ABOUT, FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND PUBLIC SAFETY.

>> AND WE KNOW THERE WAS ONE SESSION IN PARTICULAR THAT THAT HIT A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT SNAG AND YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT EVEN GIVING YOU THE POWER TO CONTROL YOUR OWN REVENUE STREAMS, RIGHT?

THAT THERE HAS TO BE SOME RELYNN INQUIRE OR POWER TO EMPOWER YOU TO DO THAT.

YOU DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO THAT.

>> RIGHT, AND THERE'S A LOT OF DISCUSSION IF B.

THAT IN OTHER AREAS.

THERE'S A OPPORTUNITY TO RAISE REVENUE ON A LOCAL LEVEL AND THAT AS YOU WELL KNOW HAS BEEN DISCUSSED PRETTY HEAVILY, AND THAT IS ONE OF THE HOSPITALIZATIONS THAT COULD BE AVAILABLE TO US TO BE ABLE TO MAKE NOSE DECISIONS.

>> JUST ONE THING -- A COUPLE THINGS I WOULD ADD TO YOUR QUESTION INITIALLY ABOUT IT BEING REGRESSIVE.

WE'RE CERTAINLY SENSITIVE THAT ANY INCREASE, ESPECIALLY IN THE MOTOR FUELS TAX, HAS THAT POTENTIAL TO IMPACT THE POORER PART OF OUR COMMUNITIES IN A GREATER WAY THAN THOSE WHO ARE MORE AFFLUENT.

BUT WHAT I WOULD TELL YOU IS THE LAST FEW BILLS HAVE PROPOSED A 10-CENT MOTOR FUELS TAX OR GAS TAX INCREASE.

THAT EQUATES TO THE AVERAGE E. CANNAN $5 A MONTH, AND THAT'S NOT BEING DISMISS I HAVE BUT JUST TO PUT IN IT PERSPECTIVE.

AND THEN AS FAR AS IT BEING REGRESSIVE, THIS LAST BILL, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT IS RECENTLY PASSED IN BOTH NORTH CAROLINA AND MISSOURI, IS REED A REBATE OPENING IN THERE AS WELL WHERE CITIZENS OF KENTUCKY, IF THEY DEPARTMENT THEIR MOTOR TAX RECEIPTS FOR THE YEAR, COULD TURN THOSE IN FOR A REFUND ON THAT INCREASE IN THE MOTOR FUELS TAX.

SO SOME OF THOSE THINGS ARE BEING CONSIDERED.

>> OFFSETTING.

YES.

>> THE FLUCTUATION IN GASOLINE PRICES IS SO GREAT AND SO CONSTANT THAT AT 10 CENTS IS UNNOTICEABLE.

>> AND TO GO FROM LET'S SAY $1 AT THE HEIGHT OF PANDEMIC TO NOW, THE MORT FUELS DAKOTA IN KENTUCKY THIS WKYT A $2.99 A GALLON LOCALLY HAS INCREASED SINCE 2015.

IT HAS HAD TO GO WELL ABOVE $3.00 A GALLON AND AVERAGE THAT FOR AN ENTIRE YEAR BEFORE WE SEE ANY GROWTH IN THE CURRENT FORMULA.

>> THERE IS THIS QUESTION FROM R. IN COVINGTON.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU KNOW HIM.

WHAT GROUP OF COUNTIES HAVE BEST -- HAVE THE BEST ROAD STRUCTURE?

AND WHAT GROUP OF COUNTIES HAVE THE WORST?

IS THIS SOMETHING THAT YOU COULD SPEAK TO, MR. LARUE?

>> NO.

>> NOTE YOU THAN THE WANT TOO START NAMING NAMES.

>> THAT'S A COUNTY QUESTION.

>> I'M NOT GOING TO DO THAT TO YOU, JUDGE McCANCELS.

>> YOU HAVE HEARD I'M SAYING WE HAVE NEEDS.

>> IT'S ONE OF THE 120.

>> RENEE, I WILL SAY JUST ANECDOTAL AND TALKING WITH OUR FRIENDS AT THE COUNTY JUDGE EXECUTIVES ASSOCIATION WE DID SOME EVALUATION OF JUST A HANDFUL OF COUNTIES JUST TO DO A TEST SAMPLE, AND TO YOUR POINT, JUDGE, IT WAS 40 TO 70 YEARS IS THE AVERAGE OUT THERE, SO WHILE THERE MAY BE SOME DOING IT BETTER THAN THE MORE, I THINK SUFFICE IT TO SAY IS THAT NONE OF THEM ARE ON THE CYCLE OF A 15 OR EVEN 20-YEAR CYCLE THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE TO KEEP THE ROADS IN GOOD OPERATING CONDITION.

>> WHAT'S THE STATUS OF OUR ROAD FUND RIGHT NOW?

>> AS FAR AS THE REVENUES COMING IN?

>> THE REVENUES COMING IN.

>> SO THE REVENUES COMING IN, AND I KNOW WE HAVEN'T WRAPPED UP 2021, BUT ON YEAR-END 2020 WE HAD GOTTEN, BEFORE THE PANDEMIC WE HAD GOTTEN BACK UP TO ABOUT WHERE WE WERE IN 2014 BEFORE THE GAS TAX AND EVERYTHING ELSE DROPPED.

SO THE GOOD NEWS IS REVENUES AS A WHOLE ARE UP, PRIMARILY DUE TO THE MOTOR VEHICLE USAGE TAX WHICH IS THE, QUOTE/UNQUOTE, 6% ON A CAR, BUT MOTOR FUELS TAX, AND I LOSING TODAY, WEIR SEAL 7/10 OF A PERCENT YEAR TO DATE IN '21 BEHIND WHERE WE WERE IN 2020.

AND SO TO PUT THAT IN PERSPECTIVE, IN 2020 WE WERE $110 MILLION LESS THAN MOTOR FUELS TAX THAN WE WERE IN 2014.

WHICH WAS THE PEAK.

AND SO THAT MEANS A WHOLE LOT TO THE PEOPLE SITTING AT THIS TABLE BECAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY REVENUE THEY GET THROUGH THE REVENUE SHARING MODEL FOR THE COUNTIES AND CITIES COMES FROM THEIR SHARE, THE 26% OF THE MORT FUELS TAX.

>> DO YOU WANT TO ADD TO THAT?

>> I WAS GOING TO JUMP IN AND SAY THAT.

THAT IS EXACTLY RIGHT.

THAT IS STAGNANT OR LESS.

AND WE'VE LOST SINCE $20,151,000,000,000, IF YOU LOOK AT IT, THE -- SINCE 2021, $51 BILLION.

BECAUSE OF THE FLOOR AND TOLLING CREDITS HAVE BEEN LOST, WE'RE MINUS $1 BILLION WITH $900 MILLION IN NEEDS.

>> AND COUNTIES AND CITIES ARE ABOUT, IF YOU TAKE INFLATIONARY INTO ACCOUNT IN THAT PERIOD, RENEE, IT'S A 30% LOSS THE COUNTIES AND CITIES FOR THEIR ROAD FUNDING.

>> ESCAPEE CERTAINLY HOME WE HAVE DOLLARS COMING FORWARD FOR THESE SUGGESTS PROJECTS THAT WE HAVE HAD ON OUR WISH LIST FOR A ALONG TIME BUT ALSO TO GO WHEN THAT WE NEED DOLLARS TO SUSTAIN THOSE PROJECTS ONCE THEY ARE IN.

ONCE THE SOLUTION IS GOING FORWARD, IT NEEDS SOMETHING TO HELP US SUSTAIN THE MAINTENANCE ON THESE ROADS.

WE CAN ELLEN 7:30 DOLLARS ON THE FRONT END TO BUILD THEM BUT WE NEED OBVIOUSLY SUPPORT TO SUSTAIN THE MAINTENANCE OF THEM GOING FORWARD.

>> ANDREW MCNEILL, AFTER HEARING ALL OF THIS CONCERN FROM CITY AND COUNTY OFFICIALS, WHAT WOULD BITS HAVE TO SAY IN AND WEIGH IN ON EITHER FORMULAS OR THE HEALTH OF THE FUNDS TO HELP CITIES AND COUNTIES AND THE ROAD PROJECTS?

>> YEAH, RENEE, WHAT I'D SAY IS THAT ACTUALLY THE MOST RECENT BUDGET PASSED BY THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, AND, OF COURSE, FOR YOUR LISTENERS MANY OF THEM UNDERSTAND THAT THIS I WAS BIT OF AN ODD SET OF CIRCUMSTANCES IN LAST SESSION IN THAT DUE TO THE PANDEMIC THERE HAD BEEN TWO ONE-YEAR BUDGETS THAT HAVE BEEN CONSIDERED AND ENACTED, BUT IT WAS A PRETTY GOOD BUDGET FOR THE ROAD FUND.

IT WAS A PRETTY GOOD BUDGET FOR INVESTMENTS IN INFRASTRUCTURE DUE TO THREE THINGS: ONE, THERE WAS SOME ORGANIC GROWTH IN REVENUES WITH, AS CHAD REFERRED TO, THE GROWTH IN SALES AND USAGE TAX.

SOME HEALTH IN THE GROWTH OF THE GAS TAX.

SOME SAVINGS THAT WERE GENERATED FROM THE FEDERAL CARES ACT WHICH WERE THEN ALLOWED TO BE PUT BACK AND REINVESTED INTO INFRASTRUCTURE.

BUT ALSO A RELATIVELY INTERESTING AND IMPORTANT THING GOING FORWARD IS THAT SENATOR JIM HIGDON AND SENATOR CHRIS MCDANIEL WORKED VERY CLOSELY TO CORRECT THIS DECADES-LONG SWEEP OF GAS TAX DOLLARS FROM TRANSPORTATION AND INFRASTRUCTURE INTO THE GENERAL FUND.

NOW, THERE'S A LOT OF REASONS FOR WHY THAT SWEEP HAD OCCURRED OVER THE LAST DECADE, BUT THOSE TWO MEMBERS IN THE SENATORS AND I'M SURE WORKING WITH THEIR HOUSE COLLEAGUES REALIZED THAT THERE WAS AN OPPORTUNITY GIVEN EVER, GIVEN THE GENERAL BUDGET SITUATION, TO MAKE A SERIOUS CORRECTION.

AND BY MY CALCULATION, THAT'S GOING TO BE ABOUT $55 MILLION OF DOLLARS THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN NORMALLY SWEPT INTO THE GENERAL FUND THAT ARE GOING TO BE IN THE ROAD FUND AND DEDICATED TOWARDS INFRASTRUCTURE.

>> YEAH, YOU LIKE THE SOUND OF THAT, CHAD LARUE?

$55MILLION IS NOT GOING TO BE SWEPT.

>> AND WE HAVE AGREED WITH ANDREW'S POSITION IN THE PAST ON THIS AS FAR AS EVALUATING THOSE TRANSFERS.

WHAT I WOULD SAY IS, AND STATE PLACE CERTAINLY THEY PROVIDE SERVICES ON THE HIGHWAYS SO THAT'S THE LOGIC HUNDRED DOLLARS THAT TRANSFER.

IT HAS GROWN THE IN PAST.

I KNOW THERE'S BEEN HEARTY DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT'S THE RIGHT NUMBER AND TO ANDREW'S POINT, SENATOR HIGDON AND OTHERS IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY SAW IT FIT THIS YEAR TO PUT $55 MILLION BACK OF THAT COST INTO THE GENERAL FUND WHICH CERTAINLY WE'RE SUPPORTIVE OF.

THERE ARE MANY OTHER DIVERSIONS, RENEE.

A LOT OF THOSE ARE PAYING FOR SERVICES THAT KYTC GETS FROM MORE AB NETS, AND SO IT'S -- I THINK EVERYTHING LIKE THAT SHOULD BE LOOKED AT ANY TIME WE CAN FIND MONEY TO REPURPOSE IS GREAT, INCLUDING THE CARES ACT MONEY HE ACKNOWLEDGED.

UNFORTUNATELY, THE CARES ACT MONEY IS ONE-TIME MONEY.

SO IT'S BACK TO WE CAN'T COUNT ON THAT TO BE THE LONG-TERM FIX, AND IT'S $150 MILLION ON ABOUT A $900 MILLION A YEAR NEED THAT THE CABINET HAS IDENTIFIED GOING FORWARD.

>> AND WHAT ABOUT THE ARPA FUNDS?

IS THERE SOME CONCERN THAT THOSE COULD BE CLAWED BACK AND USED FOR INFRASTRUCTURE?

IS THAT A LEGITIMATE CONCERN?

AND WHAT YOU ARE HEARING ABOUT WHAT MOVEMENT ON THAT.

>> THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN ACT, WE'RE VERY GRATEFUL FOR THE FUNDING, COMES WITH A LOT OF STRINGS, A LOT OF ATTACHMENT, AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT FROM A INFRASTRUCTURE SPENDING STANDPOINT WEBSITES WATER, WASTEWATER, BROADBAND.

>> VERY SPECIFIC.

>> VERY SPECIFIC.

THEN WHEN YOU BREAK DOWN THE NUMBERS, THEY -- IT'S CLEAR THAT CITIES AND COUNTIES LABEL TO USE THE MONEY FOR THAT.

I THINK THAT'S WHERE YOU'LL SEE A LOT OF CITY GOVERNMENTS, AT LEAST -- I'LL LET THE JUDGE SPEAK FOR THE COUNTIES -- ARE GOING TO HAVE A LOT OF EXPENDITURE IN THAT AREA.

BUT IF YOU LOOK AT IT AND YOU BREAK DOWN THE MONEY, YOU KNOW, HEIDEN GETS $85,000, RICHMOND GETS $7 MILLION.

THAT'S ONE WATER ORE WASTEWATER PROJECT OR MAYBE NOT EVEN A WHOLE TREATMENT FACILITY.

SO THESE ARE GREAT.

IT'S A GREAT GIFT BUT IT DOESN'T FIX THE SYSTEMIC ISSUES WHICH YOU KIND OF BROUGHT UP THERE ABOUT REVENUE AND BEING ABLE TO RAISE REVENUE IN DIFFERENT WAYS FOR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS.

WE HAVE STILL GOT TO ADDRESS THAT.

I THINK WE CAN MAKE SIGNIFICANT CHANGES.

WE'RE ENCOURAGING THE DELIBERATIVE PROCESS WITH STRATEGICALLY LEVERAGING THESE ONE-TIME FUNDS BUT TRANSPORTATION IS NOT ONE OF THOSE.

NOW, THERE'S A LITTLE SECTION THAT SAYS YOU CAN CAPTURE SOME LOST REVENUE.

>> RIGHT.

>> IF YOU CALCULATE THE LOST REVENUE.

BUT THAT'S PROBABLY GOING TO BE $100,000 FOR THE CITY OF PADUCAH, YOU KNOW, IN FISCAL YEAR '21.

WHEN YOU START LOOKING AT THOSE CALCULATIONS, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE SIGNIFICANT PROJECTS.

EVERY PROJECT IS IMPORTANT, BUT IT'S NOT GOING TO SYSTEMICALLY ADDRESS THE ISSUES.

>> I'LL GIVE YOU JUST A QUICK WORD ON THAT.

>> MAXIMIZE THE OPPORTUNITY.

IT'S PROBABLY ONCE IN A LIFETIME.

SO BE THOUGHTFUL ABOUT IT, BE PATIENT IN THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS, WORK TOGETHER WITH YOUR COMMUNITY PARTNERS, WITH YOUR CITIES, WITH THE UTILITY COMPANIES.

MAXIMIZE THE OPPORTUNITIES FOR THIS TO BENEFIT YOUR COMMUNITY.

THAT'S WHERE WE ARE.

>> THOSE ARE GOOD WORDS TO END ON.

THANK YOU, GENTLEMEN.

I APPRECIATE YOU.

IT'S BEEN A GOOD DISCUSSION.

WE'LL HAVE IT AGAIN I'M CERTAIN.

MR. MCNEILL THERE IN LOUISVILLE, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR INSIGHT AND ALL OF YOU HERE AND SECRETARY GRAY FOR HIS PARTICIPATION EARLIER ON.

MAKE SURE YOU TUNE IN FRIDAY NIGHT.

BILL BRYANT AND JOURNALISTS WOULD INFORM YOU ON THE WEEK'S NEWS.