FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO In FOCUS PROVIDED BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

Gene: THIS WEEK ON NEW MEXICO In FOCUS.

Trapp: I PROBABLY KNEW EARLY ON THAT I'D EVENTUALLY HAVE MY OWN PAPER, BECAUSE EVERY NEWSPAPER MAN BELIEVES HE'S GOING TO HAVE HIS OWN NEWSPAPER EVENTUALLY.

I WAS ONE OF THOSE.

Gene: THE RIO GRANDE SUN HAS BEEN A PART OF THE TRAPP FAMILY FOR MORE THAN 65 YEARS, BUT THAT IS ABOUT TO CHANGE, AND THE NEW OWNERS ARE RAISING A LOT OF QUESTION.

Julia: I DON'T THINK PEOPLE WITH POLITICAL AFFILIATIONS SHOULD OWN NEWSPAPERS.

I THINK IT JUST LENDS ITSELF TO THE ISSUE OF BIAS.

Gene: ALL THIS CHANGE COMES AT A TIME OF MASSIVE DISRUPTION IN THE MEDIA INDUSTRY AS A WHOLE.

THIS WEEK, WE LOOK BACK AT THE SUN'S IMPACT AND LEGACY, AND LOOK AHEAD TO THE CHALLENGES FACING SMALL COMMUNITY NEWS ORGANIZATIONS MOVING FORWARD.

Robert: I WOULD BE HAPPY IF THEY WOULD JUST REPORT LOCAL NEWS AND COVER THE BEATS THAT AFFECT THE PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY THE MOST AND STAY OUT OF POLITICS.

Gene: NEW MEXICO In FOCUS STARTS NOW.

Gene: THANKS FOR JOINING US THIS WEEK.

I’M YOUR HOST, GENE GRANT.

THE RIO GRANDE SUN FIRST HIT NEWSTANDS IN ESPANOLA AND RIO ARRIBA COUNTY ON OCTOBER 6TH, 1956.

IT WAS STARTED BY TWO COUPLE-S WHO MOVED TO NEW MEXICO SPECIFICALLY WITH THE INTENT OF STARTING A COMMUNITY NEWSPAPER.

THE TRAPP FAMILY EVENTUALLY TOOK OVER CONTROL OF THE SUN.

FIRST WAS BOB TRAPP, A JOURNALISM LEGEND WHO ALSO SERVED AS THE NEW MEXICO PRESS ASSOCIATION PRESIDENT AND CO-FOUNDED THE NEW MEXICO FOUNDATION FOR OPEN GOVERNMENT.

HE PASSED THE TORCH TO HIS SON, ALSO NAMED ROBERT.

BUT RECENTLY WE ALL LEARNED THE PAPER WAS BEING SOLD TO AN OWNERSHIP GROUP THAT INCLUDES TWO FORMER CHAIRMEN OF THE STATE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

WE’LL HAVE MORE ON THAT UNIQUE OWNERSHIP GROUP AND WHAT IT MEANS FOR THE FUTURE OF THE PAPER LATER IN THE SHOW.

BUT FIRST, A LITTLE MORE ON THE HISTORY OF THE SUN AND IT’S POWERFUL RELATIONSHIP TO THE COMMUNITY IT SERVES FROM THE 2013 DOCUMENTARY “THE SUN NEVER SETS” FROM FLIMMAKER BEN DAITZ, FOLLOWED BY MORE ON THE YOUNGER TRAPP’S DECISION TO CALL IT A CAREER AND SELL THE PAPER.

Trapp: THERE'S THIS GREAT LINE FROM WALTER LITTMAN THAT A FREE PRESS IS NOT A LUXURY, BUT A VITAL AND ORGANIC NECESSITY OF A GREAT SOCIETY, A TRUE DEMOCRACY.

THAT SUMS UP WHAT COMMUNITY JOURNALISM IS TRULY ABOUT AND ALL THESE SMALL NEWSPAPERS ON THE BLUE HIGHWAYS OF THE UNITED STATES.

IT'S INTENSE.

IF PEOPLE REALIZE HOW MUCH WE WORK AND CARED, THEY WOULD BE AMAZED, I THINK, THAT A SMALL TOWN OF 10,000 PEOPLE, HOW MUCH THIS LITTLE NEWSPAPER CARES.

I CONSIDER US THE BEST SMALL TOWN NEWSPAPER IN AMERICA.

Trapp: IT WOULD HAVE BEEN EASY TO JUST PUT OUT A LITTLE FRIENDLY COMMUNITY NEWSPAPER, BUT I DIDN'T THINK THAT THAT'S WHAT THIS COMMUNITY NEEDED.

I THINK PROBABLY WHAT YOU NEED IS THE DECISION THAT NO MATTER WHAT THE PRESSURES ARE PUT ON YOU, MAYBE EVEN THREATS, THAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO YOUR JOB ANYWAY.

Lou: FROM DAY ONE, KEVIN SAT IN THIS CHAIR -- I WAS RIGHT OVER THERE -- AND HE SAYS, HERE'S HOW IT GOES.

EVERYONE YOU TALK TO IS GOING TO LIE TO YOU EXCEPT FOR ME.

YOU HAVE TO TRUST ME ON EVERYTHING, WHICH IS A BIZARRE THING TO SAY AND A TOTAL LEAP OF FAITH.

BUT YOU TAKE IT.

YOU KIND OF GO DOWN THE RABBIT HOLE AND YOU REALIZE AFTER THREE MONTHS, SIX MONTH, HOW TRUE THAT IS, AND YOU KIND OF START TO SEE THROUGH THE GUISE OF THE POLITICS AND JUST THE BRUTE REALITIES OF HOW THINGS WORK HERE.

WE'VE BEEN READING NEWSPAPERS IN OUR COUNTRY FOR OVER 300 YEARS, BUT THE CRINKLE OF PAPER IS DISAPPEARING.

PEOPLE ARE GETTING THEIR NEWS ON BACKLIT COMPUTER SCREENS.

THE DIGITAL AGE IS TRANSFORMING JOURNALISM.

BUT IN ESPANOLA, NEW MEXICO, THEY STILL GET THE NEWS THE OLD FASHIONED WAY.

FOLKS AROUND HERE SAY, YOU EITHER LOVE IT OR YOU HATE IT, BUT EVERYBODY READS IT.

THE RIO GRANDE SUN SELLS OUT EVERY WEEK.

Jock: THERE ARE ABOUT 7500 NEWSPAPERS IN THE UNITED STATES, AND THE ASTONISHING FACT IS 97 PERCENT OF THOSE NEWSPAPERS ARE DEFINED AS SMALL NEWSPAPERS, CIRCULATIONS 50,000 AND UNDER, AND OF THOSE, THOUSANDS ARE LITTLE WEEKLIES THAT YOU'VE NEVER HEARD OF IN WHAT PEOPLE CALL THE BOONIES OR THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE, WHICH, IN FACT, IS THE CENTER OF SOMEBODY ELSE'S UNIVERSE.

THERE'S AN EXPRESSION ONE OF MY BUDDIES HAS AT A SMALL NEWSPAPER NEARBY.

HE SAYS, WE MAY BE SMALL TOWN, BUT WE'LL NEVER BE SMALL TIME.

Gene: ROBERT TRAPP, FORMER EDITOR AND PUBLISHER OF THE RIO GRANDE SUN.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US HERE AT NEW MEXICO PBS.

Robert: THANK YOU.

Gene: WE'VE BEEN DYING TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT THE SALE.

THERE'S BEEN SO MANY THINGS, SO MANY QUESTIONS OUT THERE.

BUT I'VE JUST GOT TO SAY, THE TRAPP FAMILY NAME IS SO STRONGLY CONNECTED WITH NOT JUST THE PAPER, BUT THE COMMUNITY.

WHY DID YOU WANT TO SELL AT THIS POINT IN YOUR CAREER?

Robert: I DIDN'T WANT TO SELL.

YOU KNOW, IT'S A COMBINATION OF A LOT OF THINGS.

I THINK PROBABLY AT THE TOP OF THE LIST IS A LOT OF THE GOOD JOURNALISTS HAVE LEFT THE BUSINESS.

THEY'VE MOVED ON TO THINGS LIKE IN-DEPTH AND SEARCHLIGHT.

YOU KNOW, THEY'RE GOING TO THESE NONPROFIT BUSINESS MODELS WHERE THEY CAN DO BIG STORIES AND IMPACTFUL STORIES, AND THEY'RE LEAVING THE SMALL LOCAL MARKETS.

SO THE LABOR MARKET IS REALLY SQUEEZED, AND IT WAS BEFORE THE PANDEMIC AND THE PANDEMIC JUST MADE IT WORSE.

ADDITIONALLY, I CAN'T PAY A LOT OF MONEY.

WE NEVER COULD.

EVEN IN OUR HEYDAY, WE COULDN'T.

SO THAT MAKES THE MARKET EVEN SMALLER.

AND TO GET GOOD PEOPLE AT WHAT I'M ABLE TO PAY, IT'S NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE RIGHT NOW.

I GOT LUCKY WITH A COUPLE OF PEOPLE RECENTLY, BUT BY AND LARGE -- YOU KNOW, I CAN REMEMBER DAYS WHEN YOU COULD RUN AN AD ON JOURNALISM JOBS.COM AND YOU'D GET 20 RESPONSES IMMEDIATELY.

I DIDN'T GET ANY THE LAST TIME I RAN.

Gene: NO KIDDING.

INTERESTING.

Robert: ADD TO THAT, IT'S NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE TO HIRE A GOOD NEWS EDITOR NOW.

SO I WAS THE NEWS EDITOR, I WAS THE PUBLISHER, I WAS THE COPS REPORTER, I WAS THE SCHOOL REPORTER, AND THEN IN THE IMPORTANT JOBS, YOU KNOW, OF MAKING SURE THE COKE MACHINE WAS FULL, THAT THERE'S TISSUE IN THE LADIES BATHROOM AND THERE'S PAPER TOWELS EVERYWHERE.

YOU KNOW, THAT'S LIFE AT A SMALL NEWSPAPER.

LIKE I SAID, YOU DON'T OWN A WEEKLY NEWSPAPER, IT OWNS YOU.

Gene: I CAN IMAGINE.

Robert: AND LIFE IS SHORT.

UNFORTUNATELY, WE FIND THAT OUT AT THE END OF LIFE.

WE WERE TALKING ON THE WAY DOWN HERE, I THINK WE'VE GOT TEN REALLY GOOD YEARS.

WE CAN TRAVEL ANYWHERE WE WANT.

WE GOT GOOD KNEES AND WE'VE GOT GOOD EYESIGHT AND EARS.

AND THEN YOU START TO DETERIORATE, AND I WATCHED MY MOM AND DAD DO THAT.

I LIVED THAT.

"WE'RE GOING TO RETIRE NEXT YEAR, WE'RE GOING TO RETIRE NEXT YEAR."

AND NEXT YEAR NEVER CAME.

THEY LITERALLY WERE BOTH WORKING THE DAYS LEADING UP TO THEIR DEATHS.

THEY BOTH DIED OF -- MOM DIED OF A STROKE, AND DAD HAD ACUTE LEUKEMIA.

BUT MY MOM FELL IN THE SHOWER GETTING READY FOR WORK, AND THAT'S NOT GOING TO BE ME.

Gene: IS THERE A WAY TO FOLLOW-UP THE GOOD WORKS WITH THESE NEW OWNERS?

ARE THEY GOING TO BE ABLE TO BE THE TRAPP TYPE FOLKS THAT CAN -- Robert: NO.

Gene: OKAY.

WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR SPECIFICALLY FROM THESE FOLKS?

Robert: I WOULD LIKE THEM TO -- I WOULD BE HAPPY IF THEY WOULD JUST REPORT LOCAL NEWS AND COVER THE BEATS THAT AFFECT PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY THE MOST AND STAY OUT OF POLITICS.

THAT WOULD BE MY HOPE.

Gene: HAVE YOU HAD THAT DISCUSSION WITH THEM?

Robert: WE HAD PARTIAL, I'M GOING TO CALL THEM PARTIAL DISCUSSIONS ABOUT POLITICS AND WHERE THAT FITS IN NEWSPAPERS AND BEING UNBIASED.

AND, YOU KNOW, HARVEY YATES TOLD ME MORE THAN ONCE THAT HE THINKS A GOOD NEWSPAPER, HE THINKS A GOOD STORY IS A STORY WHERE YOU READ IT AND YOU DON'T KNOW IF THE WRITER WAS A REPUBLICAN OR A DEMOCRAT.

AND I HEARD HIM TELL MY STAFF THAT THE DAY HE TOOK OVER, AND I HOPE HE DOES THAT.

I HOPE EVERYBODY DOES THAT.

THAT WAS WHAT I'VE ALWAYS STRIVED FOR.

Gene: WERE YOU SHOCKED WHEN YOU GOT THE CALL?

I MEAN, CONSIDERING WHO IS BUYING THE PAPER, IT MUST HAVE BEEN KIND OF A MOMENT TO THINK, WELL, I WANT TO SELL IT, BUT THERE'S SOME QUESTIONS HERE.

I'M CURIOUS ABOUT THE PROCESS WHEN YOU FIRST GOT THE CALL.

Robert: WELL, THE CALL DID NOT COME FROM HARVEY.

HARVEY DIDN'T ENTER THE PICTURE FOR A COUPLE OF MONTHS.

THE CALL CAME THROUGH A FRIEND OF MINE WHO CONNECTED ME WITH TOM WRIGHT, WHO IS ONE OF THE NINE BUYERS.

AND TOM AND I MET, AND TOM AND I HAD THE DISCUSSION.

I THOUGHT ABOUT IT AND I CONTACTED HIM AGAIN -- THIS WAS LAST SUMMER -- AND I CONTACTED HIM AGAIN ABOUT A MONTH LATER AND DECIDED I WOULD MEET WITH HARVEY.

YOU KNOW, I DID MY HOMEWORK ON HARVEY AND IT'S LIKE, I KNEW WHO HE WAS, AND IT KIND OF EVOLVED FROM THAT.

AND THE OTHER BUYERS NEVER EVEN ENTERED THE PICTURE.

I JUST DEALT WITH HARVEY MOSTLY AFTER TOM HANDED ME OFF TO HIM.

Gene: WHEN MONEY DOES COME IN WITH NEW OWNERSHIP, THERE IS A POSSIBILITY TO TAKE THE PAPER TO A NEW PLACE.

WAS THAT KIND OF CONVERSATION HAD AS WELL?

Robert: YES, AND THAT WAS KIND OF WHAT APPEALED TO ME.

HARVEY HAD SOMEONE DEVELOP SOME SORT OF APP, SO HE'S THINKING MORE -- IT'S FUNNY.

HE'S OLDER THAN I AM.

AND WE WERE TALKING, I THINK I WAS TALKING WITH YOUR PRODUCER ABOUT HOW IN THE DOCUMENTARY, I SAID, YOU KNOW, THE INTERNET IS A WASTE OF TIME.

STILL AGREE WITH THAT, IT'S A WASTE OF TIME.

BUT HE HAD THIS APP DESIGNED THAT HE CAN GET NEWS TO PEOPLE AND MONETIZE IT SOMEHOW.

AND YOU KNOW, HE WANTS TO EXPAND IT MORE TO GO MORE TOWARDS STATE NEWS.

I'M ALL FOR THAT AS LONG AS YOU COVER THE LOCAL NEWS AND MAKE THAT A PRIORITY.

Gene: I'M ALSO CURIOUS WHAT THE LOCAL RESPONSE HAS BEEN.

YOU'VE HAD A LOT OF LOYAL READERS FOR A LONG TIME.

I HAVE NOT A DOUBT IT WAS JOLTING FOR SOME PEOPLE ONCE YOU START BANDYING ABOUT SOME OF THESE NAMES.

WHAT'S BEEN THE FEEDBACK YOU'VE GOTTEN FROM THE LOCAL ESPANOLA COMMUNITY?

Robert: YOU KNOW, IT'S FUNNY.

IT WAS WAITING FOR A BUNCH OF GOOD RIDDANCE CALLS.

YOU KNOW, THANK GOD YOU'RE GONE.

AND NEVER GOT ONE.

NEVER GOT A NASTY EMAIL.

I WAS REALLY SURPRISED.

I GOT A COUPLE OF QUESTIONABLE ONES.

BUT I GOT A LOT OF PHONE CALLS AND E-MAILS AND PEOPLE IN-PERSON WHO WERE AT FIRST UPSET.

LIKE, HOW COULD YOU DO THIS?

AND THEN IMMEDIATELY, I UNDERSTAND, I KNOW WHAT YOU'VE BEEN DOING FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS AND I KNOW HOW CRAZY YOU ARE RIGHT NOW, AND GOOD LUCK.

Gene: SURE.

Trapp: THEY ACCEPT THE JOB, AND I WOULD TELL THEM THAT YOU CAN GET A NEWS STORY IN RIO ARRIBA COUNTY.

NO MATTER WHERE YOU GO, YOU'LL BE ABLE TO GET A NEWS STORY, BECAUSE YOU'RE GOING TO LEARN HOW TO DO IT HERE, BECAUSE IT'S A TOUGH AREA, A TOUGH COMMUNITY FOR A YOUNG REPORTER TO BREAK INTO.

WE ASSURE THEM THAT WHAT THEY REPORT AND WHAT THEY DIG UP, IF IT IS LEGITIMATE NEWS, THAT THE PUBLISHER, THE EDITOR, WILL NOT KILL IT BECAUSE OF AN ECONOMIC OR ADVERTISER'S PRESSURE, OR ANYONE ELSE.

Robert: ALL THE RESUMES I GET, THERE'S ALWAYS A PARAGRAPH IN THERE ABOUT, I CAN EDIT, I CAN VIDEO, AND I CAN EDIT VIDEO, AND I CAN POST, AND I CAN BLOG, AND I CAN DO ALL THIS STUFF FOR YOUR WEBSITE, AND I ALWAYS TELL THEM, DON'T CARE, DON'T CARE, DON'T CARE.

CAN YOU WRITE?

CAN YOU GO OUT AND ASK HARD QUESTIONS?

CAN YOU GET AROUND SOMEONE WHO SAYS, NO, AND GO FIND SOMEONE IN THE NEXT CUBICLE WHO WILL SAY, YES?

CAN YOU DO THAT?

CAN YOU COME BACK AND CAN YOU WRITE A SENTENCE?

AND GOOD GOD, SOME OF THEM CAN'T WRITE A SENTENCE.

THERE'S PEOPLE GRADUATING COLLEGE THAT CANNOT WRITE NEWS.

THERE'S PEOPLE GRADUATING COLLEGE WHO CAN'T WRITE.

Jock: I LOVE TO WATCH, WHEN YOU SEE A KID GO TO A PAPER LIKE THE SUN, AND THEY REALIZE, OH, MY GOSH, I CAN DO MY BEST WORK RIGHT HERE.

I WILL DO MY BEST WORK.

AND THE COMMUNITY DESERVES MY BEST WORK RIGHT NOW, BECAUSE HERE'S A COMMUNITY THAT NOT ONLY IS IN NEED, BUT HERE'S A COMMUNITY THAT TRUSTS MY NEWSPAPER.

Kevin: IT'S PRETTY INTERESTING.

LIKE THE WHOLE PLACE IS JUST STORIES TO ME.

LIKE DOWN HERE, WHEN I THINK OF 31 MILE ROAD, I ALWAYS THINK OF THAT ONE GRANDMA THAT WAS MURDERED A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO BACK IN 2005 THAT THEY'VE NEVER SOLVED THE MURDER OF.

THAT CRIME IS JUST PROBABLY GOING TO ALWAYS BE UNSOLVED.

A GRANDMA GETS MURDERED IN COLD BLOOD AND THEY'LL NEVER SOLVE IT, PROBABLY.

IN 1999, THE SUN BROKE THE NATIONAL STORY THAT RIO ARRIBA COUNTY HAD THE HIGHEST PER CAPITA HEROIN OVERDOSE RATE OF ANY PLACE IN THE COUNTRY.

OVER A DECADE LATER, IT STILL DOES.

Danny: ALL THESE, LOOK AT HOW THEY'RE ALL NEW.

THEY'RE ALL NEW.

ALL THESE ARE ALL MY FRIENDS THAT HAVE PASSED AWAY RECENTLY, LIKE ALL FROM DRUGS, OR LIKE THE ONE THAT SHOT HIMSELF.

SHE GOT INTO AN ACCIDENT.

HE SHOT HIMSELF.

KEEBLER, KEVIN OVER THERE, NOT THIS ONE, BUT THE NEXT ONE, AND ALL THE OTHER ONES OVERDOSES, MORE OR LESS.

Kevin: BASICALLY, THESE AREN'T PEOPLE JUST SMOKING MARIJUANA OR GETTING HIGH OCCASIONALLY, THESE PEOPLE ARE JUST DOING SCIENTIFIC EXPERIMENTS WITH THEIR BODIES.

YOU LOOK AT THE TOXICOLOGY REPORTS AND THEY'VE GOT, YOU KNOW, HEROIN, COCAINE, ALCOHOL, FOUR DIFFERENT KINDS OF PRESCRIPTION DRUGS IN THEM.

THAT'S LIKE COMMITTING SUICIDE OR SOMETHING.

AND IF THIS PLACE IS SO WONDERFUL, WHICH I THINK IT IS, THEN WHY ARE THESE PEOPLE ALL TRYING TO KILL THEMSELVES?

I DON'T THINK ANYBODY'S REALLY KIND OF GOT TO THE HEART OF THAT.

Trapp: MAYBE DRUGS, INSTEAD OF BECOMING A PROBLEM, HAS BECOME A WAY OF LIFE HERE, I DON'T KNOW.

BUT IT GOT THEIR ATTENTION.

AND THERE WERE ATTEMPTS MADE TO IMPROVE THE SITUATION.

BUT IT'S SOMETHING THAT I THINK IS -- I'M NOT SURE THERE'S A SOLUTION TO IT.

IN SPITE OF MILLIONS IN FEDERAL AND STATE AID, THERE'S BEEN NO CURE FOR THE EPIDEMIC OF DRUG AND ALCOHOL USE, NO SOLUTION FOR THE RELATED CRIME AND VIOLENCE.

ADD IN THE STORIES ABOUT GOVERNMENT INEPTITUDE, POLITICAL SHENANIGANS, FAILING SCHOOLS, AND IT'S CONTINUING FRONT PAGE NEWS FOR THE SUN AND AN EMBARRASSMENT FOR MANY IN THE COMMUNITY.

David: FIRST OF ALL, I'VE NEVER READ THE RIO GRANDE SUN.

I DID NOT WANT AN ENTITY, NO MATTER WHETHER IT WAS A PAPER OR OUTSIDE ENTITY, TO KEEP MY FOCUS FROM WHAT REALLY NEEDED TO HAPPEN, BECAUSE ANY PAPER, IF YOU SEE ANY TYPE OF PROGRAM OR WHATEVER, CAN TRY TO SWAY YOUR DECISION-MAKING PROCESSES, AND I DID NOT WANT ANY TYPE OF ENTITY PERSUADING ME EXACTLY WHAT MY DIRECTION AND WHAT I NEEDED TO HAPPEN, MY GOALS AND MY DIRECTION.

I THINK THE RIO GRANDE SUN INVARIABLY PICKS THE HEADLINE BEFORE THEY WRITE THE STORY, AND SO THEY MAKE THE STORY FIT THE HEADLINE.

IT'S JUST UNFORTUNATE.

I THINK THE RIO GRANDE SUN IS A NEGATIVE AND DISTORTED REFLECTION OF THE COMMUNITY.

AND THERE ARE CHEERLEADING NEWSPAPERS AND THERE ARE CHAMBER OF COMMERCE TYPE NEWSPAPERS, AND THEN THERE ARE FEARLESS NEWSPAPERS.

I THINK THE BEST EDITOR-PUBLISHER-OWNERS ARE ONES WHO KEEP THAT JOURNALIST MORAL COMPASS, IF YOU WILL, POINTED ON TRUE NORTH, AND THEY KNOW THAT THE NEWSPAPER COMES FIRST.

Kevin: LIKE THE OTHER DAY, TUESDAY AT 4:00, 5:00, A KID IN A NICE TRUCK, NICE TENNIS SHOES THAT ARE PROBABLY WORTH MORE THAN MY WHOLE WARDROBE, ALLEGEDLY DIES OF A DRUG OVERDOSE UP IN THE HILLS, RIGHT OUTSIDE OF TOWN.

I MEAN, THERE'S SOMETHING MESSED UP WHEN THAT'S JUST ACCEPTED AND THAT'S A NORMAL -- THAT'S PAGE 2 NEWS.

IT COULD HAVE EVEN BEEN DEEPER IN OUR PAPER JUST BECAUSE IT'S KIND OF A SEMI-REGULAR EVENT.

I MEAN, THAT'S DEPRESSING.

THAT'S JUST THE FACT OF LIFE HERE.

YOU KNOW, THERE'S GOOD AND BAD TO EVERYTHING, BUT IF YOU DON'T WANT TO ADDRESS THESE PROBLEMS, IT'S PRETTY BRUTAL.

Jeannette: COULD I HAVE SIX PAPERS, PLEASE?

OKAY, AND HERE'S $3.

Joe: JEANNETTE, DID YOU THE RIO GRANDE SUN?

Jeannette: YEAH, I SURE DID.

Joe: WHAT'S THE HEADLINES?

Jeannette: OKAY, THIS IS THE MAY 14, 2009, ISSUE, AND THE HEADLINES ARE: JAIL'S DRUG PROGRAM SPUN OUT OF CONTROL.

I'D KIND OF LIKE TO READ THAT ONE IN A MINUTE.

BUT THE OTHERS ARE, DEPUTY ROBS PHARMACY.

Leslie: BECAUSE OF THE NATURE OF THE COMMUNITY, I FIND FOR FOLKS WHO HAVE BEEN USING HERE FOR ANY LENGTH OF TIME, THERE'S JUST TOO MANY REMINDERS FOR THEM THAT SETS OFF TOO MANY CRAVINGS.

I HAD ONE GENTLEMAN WHO HAD BEEN CLEAN ABOUT SIX YEARS.

HE HAD BEEN ON METHADONE AND WEANED OFF, AND HE SAID HE SAW SOMEBODY HE USED TO BUY HEROIN FROM, AND HE SAID HE JUST WENT INTO WITHDRAWAL RIGHT THERE IN THE CAR.

YOU KNOW, FULL BLOWN SWEATS, CRAMPING, THE WHOLE NINE YARDS.

Bryant: I WANTED TO DO SOME COMMUNITY REPORTING, AND LOOKING AROUND THE STATE AT THE PAPERS THAT WERE HIRING, ESPANOLA CAUGHT MY EYE BECAUSE OF THE PUBLIC HEALTH ISSUES UP HERE.

ESPANOLA IS PRETTY FAMOUS FOR THE DRUG PROBLEM AND ITS HIGH OVERDOSE RATES AND OTHER PUBLIC HEALTH ISSUES.

I KNEW THERE WAS A DRUG PROBLEM.

THE BRUTALITY, THE VIOLENCE CAME AS -- I THINK I WAS A LITTLE NAIVE ABOUT HOW BIG A PROBLEM THAT IS UP HERE.

Joe: WHY DON'T WE READ THE FIRST ITEM.

Jeannette: WELL, OKAY.

THE CAPTION SAYS: RIO ARRIBA HAS SPENT THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS ON POWERFUL AND CONTROVERSIAL ANTI-PSYCHOTIC DRUGS FOR INMATES.

AND THIS IS, JOE, THE FIRST OF A TWO-PART SERIES.

"THE RIO ARRIBA COUNTY JAIL SPENT MORE THAN $140,000 OVER FIVE YEARS TO KEEP INMATES SEDATED WITH DANGEROUS AND ADDICTIVE PSYCHIATRIC DRUGS ACCORDING TO THE RIO GRANDE SUN INVESTIGATION."

Kevin: WE FOUND A LITTLE BIT OF EVERYTHING.

WE FOUND THAT THERE'S A PSYCHIATRIST WHO'S CONTRACT GOT YANKED WITH THE JAIL, OR GOT PULLED FROM THE JAIL IN AUGUST 2008, WHO HAD BEEN PRESCRIBING THOUSANDS OF DOSES OF THIS DRUG AND OTHER DRUGS, PSYCHIATRIC DRUGS, ESPECIALLY XANAX, TO PRISONERS, AND WHAT WE FOUND WAS THAT THEY WERE USING THESE TO SEDATE THE PRISONERS AND A LOT OF TIMES TO MAKE THEM, AS MULTIPLE PEOPLE SAID, ZOMBIES IN THE JAIL.

Bryant: THE GUY WHO WAS THE COUNTY REPORTER HERE BEFORE ME, HIS NAME WAS MATT VAN BUREN, AND HE ENDED UP AT THE TAOS PAPER, HE HAD DONE AN INTERESTING LITTLE STORY IN 2008 ABOUT HOW MANY PHARMACEUTICALS WERE BEING THROWN AWAY AT THE COUNTY JAIL UP IN TIERRA AMARILLA, AND WHEN I READ THAT PAPER AND LOOKED BACK THROUGH HIS FILE, HIS NOTES ON IT, I KEPT SEEING THAT THERE SEEMED TO BE A DISPROPORTIONATE NUMBER OF SEROQUEL PRESCRIPTIONS.

SO IT MADE ME THINK THERE WAS SOMETHING UP WITH SEROQUEL AT THE JAIL.

I DID SOME LITERATURE SEARCHING TO SEE WHAT THE FDA APPROVED USES OF SEROQUEL WERE, AND THEY WERE FOR HEAVY-DUTY MENTAL ILLNESSES LIKE SCHIZOPHRENIA AND BIPOLAR DISORDER.

SO I ASKED THE WARDEN ABOUT IT AND I FILED SOME OPEN RECORDS REQUESTS TO LOOK AT THEIR PHARMACY FILLING RECORDS.

Kevin: THE INTERESTING EXPLANATION THAT THE DOCTOR HAD GIVEN, THE PSYCHIATRIST HAD GIVEN, WAS THAT THE THING HE WAS TREATING WAS POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS SYNDROME, AND THAT'S A SYNDROME THAT MOST PEOPLE WOULD ASSOCIATE WITH COMBAT.

IT WAS ALMOST A CONDEMNATION OF THE COUNTY AND THE CULTURE, THAT IT'S SO VIOLENT THAT HE HAS TO TREAT THIS WITH THIS POWERFUL DRUG.

Bryant: THE THING THAT STOOD OUT WHEN YOU LOOKED AT THE BILLING RECORDS IS THAT THERE WAS A DRAMATIC INCREASE THROUGH TIME IN HOW MUCH SEROQUEL WAS BEING PRESCRIBED.

IN DECEMBER OF 2007, THE RIO ARRIBA COUNTY JAIL HAD ORDERED, 88 SEPARATE TIMES THEY HAD ORDERED SEROQUEL, AND A YEAR LATER, AFTER THAT DOCTOR WAS NO LONGER SEEING INMATES, THE NUMBER OF SEROQUEL PRESCRIPTIONS IN THE JAIL IN DECEMBER '08 WAS NINE.

John: I LOVE NEWSPAPERS, BECAUSE I STARTED IN NEWSPAPERS.

I LIKE THIS NEWSPAPER.

IT'S SCRAPPY, IT HAS BALLS.

THEY CLEARLY TAKE ON THE GOVERNMENTAL ORGANIZATIONS WHEREVER THEY CAN.

THEY PRINT BUDGETS, THEY HOLD PEOPLE ACCOUNTABLE FOR SPENDING TAXPAYERS MONEY ON JUNKETS.

THERE IS STILL IN THIS NEWSPAPER A FLAVOR OF OLD NEWSPAPERING, WHICH I LOVE.

THEY'RE NOT AFRAID OF OUTRAGEOUS HEADLINES AND OF BLARING IT ACROSS THE FRONT PAGE.

ON THE BACK OF BOB TRAPP'S BUSINESS CARDS ARE THE WORDS OF BENJAMIN FRANKLIN.

"WHOEVER WOULD OVERTHROW THE LIBERTY OF A NATION MUST BEGIN BY SUBDUING THE FREENESS OF SPEECH."

THE WORDS ARE TAKEN SERIOUSLY.

Robert: WHEN YOU COME AROUND HERE, THESE ARE ALL ROCKS THAT CAME THROUGH THE FRONT WINDOW.

THAT ONE HIT UP THERE SOMEWHERE.

WHOEVER THREW THAT ONE HAD AN ARM, BECAUSE IT CAME THROUGH THAT WINDOW DOWN THERE.

THAT'S ABOUT 20 OR 30 FEET.

AND THEN THESE ARE ALL ALSO FROM THE SAME COLLECTION, AND THOSE ALL CAME THROUGH A WINDOW.

FORTUNATELY, NINETY PERCENT OF THE TIME THEY HIT A WALL.

THEY KEEP TRYING, BUT AS THEY BREAK, I PUT IN LEXAN.

THE ROCKS HAVEN'T STOPPED THE PAPER FROM LEADING THE FIGHT IN NEW MEXICO FOR OPEN RECORDS AND OPEN MEETINGS.

IT'S FILED AND WON MULTIPLE LAWSUITS IN THE PROCESS.

Robert: ONCE UPON A TIME, THAT'S WHAT WE DID.

REPORTERS WENT OUT, GATHERED INFORMATION, CAME BACK AND WROTE IT.

NOW TODAY, REPORTERS -- AND IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT BEAT -- REPORTERS GO OUT, THEY ASK QUESTIONS, THEY'RE STONEWALLED, THEY ASK FOR DOCUMENTS, THEY'RE STONEWALLED MORE, THEY COME BACK AND SAY, WHAT DO WE DO?

IF LAWYERS CAN'T SOLVE IT, WE FILE A SUIT.

BUT IT'S A TAKE-NO-PRISONERS ATTITUDE, BECAUSE YOU CAN'T LET ONE ORGANIZATION GET A AWAY WITH IT, BECAUSE THEY KNOW IF THEY DID ONCE, THEY CAN AGAIN.

Trapp: NO ONE GOES TO THE CITY COUNCIL MEETING UNLESS THEY'VE GOT A COMPLAINT, SO IT'S UP TO THE NEWSPAPER TO TELL THE COMMUNITY WHAT'S GOING ON AT CITY COUNCIL.

THE SAME GOES FOR THE SCHOOL BOARD.

IT'S SORT OF A PAPER OF RECORD.

IT TELLS WHAT HAPPENED HERE 50 YEARS AGO THAT NO ONE WILL KNOW OR REMEMBER.

BUT THEY CAN ALWAYS GO BACK TO THE NEWSPAPER, AND THAT NEWSPAPER IS A RECORD OF WHAT HAPPENED 50 YEARS AGO, OR IN SOME CASES 100 YEARS AGO.

THERE ARE SOME NEWSPAPERS THAT ARE 100 YEARS OLD.

A COMMUNITY WITHOUT A NEWSPAPER IS SORT OF LIKE A COMMUNITY WITHOUT A LIBRARY.

YOU'VE GOT TO HAVE IT.

Gene: A LOT OF TALENTED JOURNALISTS GOT THEIR START IN THE SUN'S NEWSROOM.

MANY OF THEM HAVE GONE ON TO NATIONAL ASSIGNMENTS OR OTHER OPPORTUNITIES HERE IN THE STATE, INSIDE AND OUT OF THE JOURNALISM INDUSTRY.

BUT ALL OF THEM TALK ABOUT HOW FORMATIVE THEIR TIME AT THE SUN WAS AS I FOUND OUT WHEN I CAUGHT UP WITH A FEW OF THEM OVER ZOOM RECENTLY.

JULIA GOLDBERG WAS AT THE SUN IN THE 1990s, BUT NOW WORKS AT THE SANTA FE REPORTER.

TABITHA CLAY ALSO CAME UP THROUGH THE SUN'S RANKS AND NOW WRITES FOR THE PAPER HERE IN ALBUQUERQUE.

AND MIKE KAEMPER IS A FORMER EDITOR AT THE SUN WHO NOW WORKS LOCALLY AS AN ATTORNEY.

Gene: THANK YOU ALL FOR JOINING US.

MIKE, LET ME START WITH YOU.

WHAT WAS YOUR REACTION TO THE NEWS WHEN YOU HEARD THAT THE PAPER HAD BEEN SOLD?

Mike: WELL, I HEARD IT FROM BRADEN, AND THAT'S WHAT I CALL THE YOUNGER BOB.

I HEARD FROM BRADEN ABOUT IT, AND I COULDN'T -- I COULDN'T TALK HIM OUT OF IT.

WE'RE FRIENDS AND I'VE BEEN ASSOCIATED WITH THE PAPER SINCE I LEFT, BUT I COULDN'T SEE A WAY OF TALKING HIM OUT OF IT.

I KNOW WHAT THE DAILY GRIND IS FOR HIM AND HOW TOUGH IT IS TO KEEP THAT GOING.

BUT I DID SHED A TEAR.

I MEAN, TO SEE THE PAPER OUT OF THE TRAPP FAMILY WAS SOMETHING THAT REALLY HIT ME HARD.

BUT, YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND WHY HE DECIDED TO SELL.

HE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO SELL, AND SO I THINK IT'S GREAT THAT HE'S GOING TO GET TO LIVE HIS LIFE OUTSIDE THE DAILY GRIND OF RUNNING A WEEKLY NEWSPAPER.

Gene: MIKE, WHEN DID YOU START THERE AND HOW MANY YEARS WERE YOU THERE?

Mike: I WAS THERE FROM '89 UNTIL '96.

SO I WAS A REPORTER FOR ABOUT A YEAR AND A HALF, AND THEN BECAME NEWS EDITOR UNDER BOB TRAPP FOR THE REMAINDER OF THAT TIME, AND REALLY ENJOYED MY TIME THERE AS A REPORTER AND EDITOR.

Gene: JULIA, WHEN DID YOU START THERE AND WHAT DID YOU DO AT FIRST, AND HOW DID YOU FINISH?

Julia: DATEWISE, I STARTED I BELIEVE IN '95.

MIKE WAS MY EDITOR.

BOB HIRED ME.

I WAS VERY YOUNG.

I CAN'T DO THE MATH ON IT, BUT I WAS YOUNG ENOUGH THAT I HAD THE SCHOOL BEAT AND WAS FREQUENTLY MISTAKEN FOR A STUDENT AS I WANDERED AROUND ESPANOLA HIGH SCHOOL.

AND I WAS THERE ABOUT TWO YEARS.

Gene: INTERESTING.

A LOT CAN HAPPEN UP THERE IN JUST A COUPLE OF YEARS.

OBVIOUSLY THE SAME QUESTION FOR YOU, TABITHA, AS WELL.

WHEN DID YOU START AND HOW LONG WERE YOU THERE, AS WELL?

Tabitha: I STARTED IN OCTOBER OF 2018, AND ACTUALLY I WAS THERE JUST A YEAR.

I LEFT IN OCTOBER OF THE NEXT YEAR.

AND I WAS THE COPS AND COURTS REPORTER.

Gene: JULIA, I WANT TO PICK UP ON SOMETHING THAT MIKE JUST SAID A SECOND AGO.

CAN YOU PICTURE THIS PAPER WITHOUT A MEMBER OF THE TRAPP FAMILY RUNNING IT?

IS THAT SOMETHING YOU CAN GET YOUR HEAD AROUND AT THIS POINT?

Julia: I MEAN, NO, NOT REALLY.

I MEAN, I DO UNDERSTAND THE SUN, I THINK, FOR ANYONE THAT WORKED THERE, AND CERTAINLY FOR BOB AND FOR RUTH, IT WAS A LABOR OF LOVE.

THEY WERE ALWAYS THERE.

THEY WORKED REALLY HARD.

SO I DON'T THINK YOU CAN FORCE SOMEBODY INTO COMMITTING A LABOR OF LOVE, THEY HAVE TO ACTUALLY WANT TO DO IT.

I CAN IMAGINE IT HAVING BEEN PUT INTO OTHER HANDS.

I THINK HAVING IT PUT INTO THE HANDS OF A MEDIA GROUP WITH SUCH STRONG POLITICAL AFFILIATIONS IS A WHOLE OTHER BALLGAME, SO THAT CONFUSES THE ISSUE FOR ME.

SO I'M CHOOSING JUST TO FOCUS ON NOSTALGIA PERSONALLY AT THE MOMENT.

BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT WILL MEAN.

Gene: WELL, YOU BROUGHT US HERE, SO LET'S GO THERE.

THIS NEW OWNERSHIP GROUP IS A VERY INTERESTING SITUATION.

WE JUST INTERVIEWED ROBERT HERE JUST A LITTLE BIT AGO, AND HE MENTIONED THAT HE HAD NOT MET WITH THE OWNER GROUP, JUST WITH THE INITIAL PERSON, AND THEN IT GOT TURNED OVER TO HARVEY YATES.

SO HE REALLY DOESN'T KNOW WHO THE OWNERSHIP GROUP IS.

JULIA, AND THIS WILL BE A GOOD ONE FOR ALL OF YOU HERE, WHAT'S YOUR BIGGEST PAUSE THAT YOU HAVE COMING IN WITH THIS NEW OWNERSHIP GROUP?

WHAT WORRIES YOU THE MOST?

Julia: I DON'T THINK PEOPLE WITH POLITICAL AFFILIATIONS SHOULD OWN NEWSPAPERS.

IT'S NOT A VERY COMPLICATED VIEWPOINT.

I JUST DON'T THINK THAT THEY SHOULD.

I THINK IT BECOMES PROBLEMATIC.

I WOULD FEEL THE SAME WAY IF IT WERE PEOPLE ASSOCIATED WITH THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY OR THE GREEN PARTY OR ANYBODY.

I MEAN, I THINK IT JUST LENDS ITSELF TO THE ISSUE OF BIAS, AND IT SEEMS VERY STRANGE TO ME.

AND I THINK THERE WERE PROBABLY OTHER OPTIONS THAT COULD HAVE BEEN PURSUED, BUT THAT'S NOT FOR ME TO SAY.

Gene: TABITHA, LET ME BOUNCE TO YOU REAL QUICK.

YOUR EMPLOYER IS AN CITY COUNCILOR, PAT DAVIS.

DOES THIS GIVE YOU PAUSE AT ALL?

Tabitha: I DON'T KNOW PAT.

I DON'T TALK TO PAT.

AS FAR AS I KNOW, HE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ANYTHING I WRITE, AND DEFINITELY HAS -- I'VE NEVER HEARD, DON'T WRITE ABOUT ALBUQUERQUE OR THESE PROBLEMS IN ALBUQUERQUE.

SO IN MY MIND, I THINK THAT THERE CAN BE GOOD EDITORIAL SEPARATION.

I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT WILL PLAY OUT AT THE SUN.

I KNOW HOW IT PLAYS OUT FOR ME.

Gene: IN GENERAL TERMS, THOUGH, WHERE JULIA WAS A SECOND AGO -- AGAIN, YOU HAVE A GOOD SITUATION THERE.

BUT THE BUSINESS IS CHANGING AND WE'RE STARTING TO SEE SOME INTERESTING OWNERSHIP SITUATIONS.

I'M CURIOUS WHETHER, AS A WORKING REPORTER, DOES IT NOT ENTER YOUR MIND AT ALL WHETHER THE OWNERSHIP HAS SOME POLITICAL AFFILIATION, OR YOU JUST PUT YOUR HEAD DOWN AND DO YOUR THING ANYWAY?

Tabitha: I THINK IT'S ENTIRELY DEPENDENT UPON PROBABLY WHO THE PEOPLE ARE.

I MEAN, YOU COULD HAVE BAD PEOPLE WITH AN AX TO GRIND THAT DO ANYTHING, AND OTHERS AREN'T, I GUESS.

Gene: MIKE, AS I MENTIONED TO ROBERT, THERE'S A HECK OF A LEGACY THAT'S BEEN LEFT THROUGH THE EFFORTS OF YOU FOLKS AND THE OWNERS, OF COURSE, AND ALL OF THAT SEEMS TO BE ABLE TO FLIP IN A LITTLE BIT.

I'M INTERESTED IN HOW YOU ALL FEEL ABOUT THE LOCAL COMMUNITY AND HOW THEY MIGHT RECEIVE A CHANGE IN THE PAPER THAT IS THIS DRASTIC, SOMETHING THEY'VE BEEN RELYING ON FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS.

WHAT'S YOUR SENSE OF IT, HOW ESPANOLA IS GOING TO TAKE THE NEW OWNERSHIP AND THEIR NEW ATTITUDE ABOUT IT?

Mike: WELL, I THINK THE -- I MEAN, THE RIO GRANDE SUN HAS A VIBRANT READERSHIP.

IT'S NOT AS HIGH AS IT WAS BACK IN THE NINETIES WHEN JULIA AND I WERE THERE, BUT IT STILL HAS A LOYAL FOLLOWING.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT YOU'VE GOT YOUNGER FOLKS THAT WANT TO GET THEIR NEWS OFF THE PHONE RATHER THAN PICKING UP THE PAPER ON A WEDNESDAY NIGHT.

SO THAT'S AN ISSUE.

BUT I THINK THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF PEOPLE, AS ROBERT SAID IN HIS LAST EDITORIAL, YOU KNOW, THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF PEOPLE CHEERING THAT THE TRAPPS NO LONGER HAVE A PAPER, BUT THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO AREN'T CHEERING AND WHO LOOKED TOWARDS IT.

I MEAN, THE PAPER WAS DEFINITELY A FOURTH ESTATE IN THAT COMMUNITY.

AND WE HAD, YOU KNOW, WE HAD FUGITIVES WHO WOULD TURN THEMSELVES IN AT OUR OFFICE.

WE HAD PEOPLE CALLING UP, YOU KNOW, AS A DIFFERENT FORM OF GOVERNMENT -- NOT GOVERNMENT, BUT THEY KNEW THAT THEY COULD TRUST US AND THEY KNEW THAT THEY COULD REACH OUT TO THE PAPER AND GET SOME RESULTS.

AND SO, I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S GOING TO BE AN ISSUE THAT THE COMMUNITY IS GOING TO LOOK AT AND SAY, IS THIS GOING TO BE THE SAME LOCAL PAPER?

I MEAN, THE TRAPPS LIVED AND BREATHED IN ESPANOLA, AND WHEN YOU HAVE SOMEBODY THAT'S COMING IN FROM OUT OF STATE TO RUN THE PAPER, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE SOME ISSUES ABOUT THAT.

I MEAN, HOW WELL DO YOU KNOW THE COMMUNITY?

AND THERE'S A GOOD GROUP OF REPORTERS RIGHT NOW WHO CAN CARRY THE TORCH, BUT YOU JUST DON'T KNOW.

AND I THINK THERE'S GOING TO BE A LITTLE BIT OF HESITANCY ABOUT WHERE THIS IS COMING FROM.

Gene: JULIA, I'M INTERESTED IN YOUR OPINION ON THIS.

CRITICS OF THE PAPER BACK WHEN OFTEN CLAIMED THE PAPER WAS, LIKE, TOO NEGATIVE.

I USED TO HEAR THAT A LOT, TOO NEGATIVE IN ITS WATCHDOG ROLL.

POLITICOS WERE MAINLY THE ONES COMPLAINING.

DOES THE LOSS OF THAT ROLE CONCERN YOU?

BECAUSE THAT WATCHDOG ROLE IS VERY SERIOUS FOR THE SUN.

Julia: YEAH, THE AD THAT I RESPONDED TO WHEN I APPLIED THAT I HAVE BEFORE ME -- I DIDN'T WEAR READING GLASSES WHEN I WORKED AT THE SUN, THAT'S HOW LONG AGO IT WAS -- SAID: "THE WORST HOMETOWN NEWSPAPER THAT EVER EXISTED HAS AN IMMEDIATE OPENING FOR A GENERAL ASSIGNMENT REPORTER COVERING EXCITING RIO ARRIBA COUNTY."

AND I THINK, MIKE, TELL ME IF I'M RIGHT, I THINK THAT WAS A QUOTE FROM ONE OF THE SUN'S CRITICS THAT APPEARED IN A SMITHSONIAN MAGAZINE ARTICLE ABOUT THE SUN THAT SORT OF COMMEMORATED THE RELATIONSHIP THAT IT HAD WITH THE COMMUNITY.

AND, YOU KNOW, I CAN'T IMAGINE EVEN THEN, EVEN HOWEVER MANY YEARS AGO, IT WAS RARE TO FIND A PLACE WHERE YOU COULD WORK WHERE A NEWSPAPER WAS SO CONNECTED TO THE COMMUNITY.

YOU KNOW, WHERE PEOPLE WOULD CALL YOU AND WANT TO MEET YOU IN AN ALLEY AND THEY'D HAND YOU PHONE RECORDS THEY HAD GONE AND GOTTEN THEMSELVES TO GIVE TO YOU.

THEY WOULD SHOW UP IN THE OFFICE TO COMPLAIN TO BOB ABOUT ME WHILE I WAS SITTING THERE, AND THEN THEY'D LEAVE AND BOB WOULD GIVE ME A $10 RAISE, LIKE EVERY TIME SOMEONE SHOWED UP TO COMPLAIN ABOUT ME.

YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK THOSE EXPERIENCES -- I CAN'T IMAGINE BEING A JOURNALIST WITHOUT THEM, AND I FEEL SAD AT THE IDEA OF OTHER JOURNALISTS NOT GETTING TO HAVE THAT.

Gene: TABITHA, YOU WEREN'T THERE A WHOLE LONG TIME, BUT I'M CURIOUS WHAT YOU LEARNED DURING YOUR TIME THERE AND HOW IT'S HELPED YOU IN YOUR CURRENT ENDEAVORS.

Tabitha: I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT THING THAT I LEARNED THERE WAS HOW TO GO AFTER A STORY AND NOT TAKE "WELL, WE'RE NOT GOING TO TELL YOU" AS AN ANSWER, WHICH THE SUN IS REALLY GOOD ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHERE THAT BOUNDARY IS.

YES, YOU CAN DO THIS.

YES, YOU CAN PUSH ON THIS.

AND JUST A REALLY SUPPORTIVE NEWSROOM AS FAR AS LIKE WHAT GOES ON IN THE CLIMATE THERE, ESPECIALLY FOR ME.

WHEN I WAS REPORTING ON POLICING, IT WAS HELPFUL.

Gene: OH, YOU DID POLICING?

NO KIDDING, OHHH.

ARE YOU EVER GOING TO HAVE A BEAT THAT THAT'S INTENSE AGAIN?

I MEAN, POLICING IN RIO ARRIBA COUNTY, THAT'S A HECK OF A BEAT.

WHAT DID YOU TAKE OUT OF THAT?

AGAIN, DOES THAT INFORM WHAT YOU DO TODAY?

THAT'S A TOUGH BEAT.

Tabitha: IT ABSOLUTELY DOES.

ACTUALLY, A LOT OF THE REPORTING THAT I STARTED AT THE SUN, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO STATEWIDE POLICING ISSUES, IS STUFF THAT I'M STILL CONTINUING TO REPORT ON TODAY, AND IN A LOT OF OTHER RURAL COMMUNITIES THROUGHOUT THE STATE.

Gene: MIKE, PICK UP ON THAT, IF YOU WOULD.

YOU DID A LOT OF CRIME STUFF, BECAUSE IT'S UNAVOIDABLE, CERTAINLY.

AND I'M CURIOUS WHERE -- AGAIN, YOU IN YOUR CAREER, WHERE YOU'RE AT NOW, HOW DID THIS INFORM WHAT YOU'RE DOING NOW, YOUR SIX OR SEVEN YEARS THERE AT THE SUN?

Mike: YEAH, IT DEFINITELY -- I'VE ALWAYS CALLED THE RIO GRANDE SUN THE BOB TRAPP GRADUATE SCHOOL OF JOURNALISM BECAUSE IT HAS TRAINED SO MANY GOOD JOURNALISTS, BUT IT'S ALSO THE BOB TRAPP SCHOOL FOR GOING INTO LAW SCHOOL.

SO THERE'S A LOT OF LAWYERS WHO, LIKE MYSELF, HAVE GONE THROUGH THAT AND THEN JUMPED OVER TO LAW.

AND IT'S VERY SIMILAR.

I MEAN, I INTERVIEW PEOPLE, AND I WAS TALKING TO THESE FOLKS EARLIER ABOUT SUBPOENA POWERS ARE A LITTLE DIFFERENT THAN A REPORTER CALLING, BUT THERE'S SO MUCH OF IT.

MY STORIES THEN LASTED A WEEK, NOW THEY LAST A YEAR AND A HALF, BUT IT'S STILL THAT SAME STORYTELLING, THAT FINDING THE NUGGETS OF TRUTH AND ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF THAT MAKES BEING A LAWYER, IT WAS A GREAT TRAINING GROUND FOR IT.

Gene: I'M GOING TO STICK WITH YOU ON THIS NEXT QUESTION, AS WELL.

THE IDEA THAT IT'S A DIFFICULTY, BECAUSE YOU CAN GET YOUR NEWS IN A LOT OF DIFFERENT WAYS NOW FROM A LOT OF DIFFERENT PLACES.

I'M CURIOUS WHERE YOU SEE, MIKE, THE PAPER FITTING IN IN A SOCIAL MEDIA WORLD.

IS THE PAPER DESIGNED, AND IS THE CONSTITUENCY THAT IT'S SERVING, IS IT DESIGNED FOR SOCIAL MEDIA AND THAT KIND OF STUFF?

Mike: I MEAN, IT MAY BE.

I THINK THAT SMALLER PAPERS FOR A WHILE WERE INSULATED, WHEREAS THE KIND OF ALBUQUERQUE MARKET LOST A LOT OF READERSHIP DUE TO PHONES AND SOCIAL MEDIA AND STUFF, WHEREAS THE LITTLE PAPERS STILL CONTINUED TO THRIVE.

BUT THAT'S STARTING TO DRIFT AWAY, I THINK, AND I THINK THERE ARE NUMEROUS FACEBOOK PAGES ABOUT ESPANOLA, OR PEOPLE THAT WANT TO START THEIR OWN NEWSPAPER OFF OF FACEBOOK OR WHATEVER SOCIAL MEDIA, AND THAT'S HAPPENED.

PEOPLE HAVE TRIED THAT.

AND I THINK PEOPLE LOOK AT THOSE THINGS A LITTLE MORE NOW THAN THEY DID IN THE PAST.

BUT THERE'S STILL -- THERE IS STILL SOMETHING.

IF YOU GO TO ESPANOLA ON A WEDNESDAY NIGHT, THERE IS GOING TO BE A LINE OF CARS PICKING UP THE PAPER, AND THAT'S JUST PART OF IT.

IT MAY BE IN PART BECAUSE THEY NEED SOME FIRE STARTER FOR THEIR WOOD STOVES A LITTLE LATER, BUT IT ALSO MEANS THAT THEY'RE PICKING UP THE PAPER.

SO THAT TRADITION IS STILL THERE.

IT'S NOT AS BIG AS IT WAS 20 YEARS AGO, BUT I THINK IT'S -- I MEAN, IT'S A PROBLEM THAT ALL NEWSPAPERS FACE, HOW DO YOU MAKE THAT TRANSITION.

AND HOPEFULLY IF THERE'S AN INFUSION OF MONEY FROM THESE NEW OWNERS AND THEY CAN REACH OUT THROUGH SOCIAL MEDIA AND KEEP LOCAL JOURNALISM ALIVE IN ESPANOLA, THEN THAT'S GREAT.

BUT IT'S GOING TO BE A LITTLE BIT OF A HARD SELL, I WOULD THINK, FOR ANY LOCAL PAPER TO KIND OF GET THE ATTENTION FROM PEOPLE WHEN THEY'RE GETTING ALL THEIR NEWS FROM FACEBOOK.

Gene: THAT'S RIGHT.

JULIA GOLDBERG WITH THE SANTA FE REPORTER, TABITHA CLAY, YOU JUST HEARD FROM THE PAPER, AND MIKE KAEMPER, FORMER EDITOR AT THE SUN, NOW AN ATTORNEY, THANK YOU GUYS VERY MUCH.

VERY INTERESTING HOW YOU HAVE COME THROUGH THIS WHOLE PROCESS OF THIS FASCINATING -- I THINK IT'S ONE OF THE MOST FASCINATING LOCAL PAPERS IN THE COUNTRY.

I MEAN, I LOOK AROUND THE COUNTRY AT THESE THINGS A LOT, AND THERE'S NOT MANY OUT THERE THAT HAVE A LEGACY LIKE THE SUN.

THERE JUST ISN'T.

DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT, MIKE?

ARE YOU OF THE SAME THOUGHT?

Mike: ABSOLUTELY.

Gene: IT'S VERY INTERESTING WHEN YOU REALLY STEP BACK FROM IT AND LOOK AT IT, AND YOU SHOULD ALL BE PROUD OF YOUR CONTRIBUTIONS TO THAT, AS WELL.

GUYS, NEXT TIME WE'LL TALK MORE ABOUT MEDIA STUFF.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME TODAY.

Gene: AS YOU'VE ALREADY GATHERED, THE RIO GRANDE SUN HAS EARNED QUITE THE REPUTATION BOTH LOCALLY AND NATIONALLY, BUT IT HAS NOT BEEN IMMUNE TO THE CHANGING MEDIA LANDSCAPE AND THE CHALLENGES THAT CREATES ESPECIALLY FOR SMALL NEWSROOMS.

I ASKED ROBERT TRAPP, THE YOUNGER, ABOUT ALL OF THAT AND HOW IT PLAYS INTO THE PAPER'S FUTURE UNDER NEW OWNERSHIP.

Gene: WATCHDOG.

YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN A WATCHDOG, I MEAN, WITH A CAPITAL W, AND FOLKS HAVE COME TO RELY ON THAT HERE.

IS THAT GOING TO GO AWAY AT THE SUN?

Robert: I FEAR IT IS.

I WAS DOING THAT.

THE NEWS EDITOR AND THE TWO REPORTERS WERE REALLY WORKING LOCAL NEWS AND BEATS, AND I WAS DOING MOST OF THE OTHER STUFF, AND THEN HANDING IT OFF TO WHATEVER BEAT IT APPLIED TO.

THEY'RE CAPABLE OF IT.

I KNOW THEY'RE CAPABLE OF IT.

I DON'T KNOW IF THEY'LL DO IT, THOUGH.

Gene: LET ME GO BACK TO THE INDUSTRY AND WHERE IT'S HEADED, AND YOUR OPINION ABOUT THIS, AS WELL.

A LOT OF FLUX RIGHT NOW, OF COURSE.

YOU MENTIONED THE INTERNET AND FACEBOOK AND ALL THAT OTHER SOCIAL MEDIA STUFF THAT SORT OF FLOWS INTO NEWS GATHERING, NEWS DISSEMINATION.

FOR SOMEONE TO DO IT LIKE YOUR FOLKS DID WAY BACK WHEN AND BUILD SOMETHING FROM THE GROUND UP, IS THAT POSSIBLE IN YOUR MIND NOW?

IS THAT A POSSIBILITY?

OR DO YOU JUST HAVE TO HAVE SO MUCH MONEY WALKING IN THE DOOR, THAT'S THE ONLY WAY THESE DAYS?

Robert: THE LATTER.

YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE MONEY TO COME IN AND DO THAT.

WHEN MY MOM AND DAD STARTED THE PAPER, THEY WERE ACTUALLY ASKED BY LOCAL BUSINESS PEOPLE TO COME DOWN AND START IT.

THERE WAS ALREADY A PAPER IN ESPANOLA, BUT IT WAS VERY -- IT WAS A REPUBLICAN NEWSPAPER AND SO -- IT LABELED ITSELF AS A REPUBLICAN NEWSPAPER, AND WE WANT NEWS.

AND SO THEY WERE INVITED TO TOWN TO PRODUCE A NEWSPAPER THAT HAD NEWS IN IT.

CAN YOU IMAGINE THAT TODAY, SOMEBODY ASKING SOMEBODY, HEY, COME START A NEWSPAPER HERE, WE NEED A NEWSPAPER HERE.

AND YEAH, YOU'D BE CRAZY TO DO IT.

Gene: YOU KNOW, WHEN I THINK ABOUT ALL THE STUFF YOU COVERED, EVEN JUST IN THE LAST FEW YEARS, THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT STUFF, PEOPLE HAVE GONE TO JAIL.

I MEAN, THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF VERY HUGE BIG HITTING NEWS OUT THERE.

DID YOU FEEL LIKE YOU GOT A LITTLE BIT LUCKY TO BE IN A PLACE LIKE ESPANOLA?

THE NEWS JUST NEVER SEEMED TO STOP, IF YOU GET MY DRIFT ON THIS.

DO YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?

IT'S MUCH DIFFERENT THAN COVERING THINGS IN A VERY SLEEPY TOWN, SO TO SPEAK.

Robert: YOU KNOW, A LOT OF PEOPLE TELL ME, IT HAPPENS EVERYWHERE.

ESPANOLA IS NOTHING SPECIAL.

IT'S JUST LIKE THIS EVERYWHERE.

I DON'T BELIEVE THAT.

I DON'T BELIEVE THAT FOR A MINUTE.

I THINK SOME OF THE STUFF THAT GOES ON THERE IS VERY UNIQUE, AND THE FACT THAT THESE GUYS CONTINUE TO RUN FOR OFFICE AND GET ELECTED, RUN FOR OFFICE AND GET ELECTED, IT'S JUST BAFFLING.

AND IT'S LIKE I SAID IN MY LAST EDITORIAL, RIO ARRIBA COUNTY IS A GREAT PLACE TO COVER NEWS, IT'S FANTASTIC, IT JUST GIVES AND GIVES AND GIVES.

AND WHEN YOU THINK IT'S GOTTEN AS CRAZY AS IT CAN GET, YOU GET SOMEBODY WITH HEROIN IN A BURRITO TRYING TO GET IT INTO THE JAIL, OR YOU GOT A SHERIFF GOING TO FEDERAL PRISON.

YOU NEVER KNOW.

Gene: THAT'S RIGHT.

DO YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'VE LEFT ESPANOLA A BETTER PLACE FOR YOUR EFFORTS?

Robert: NO, HUH-UH.

Gene: WHY NOT?

YOU DID A LOT.

Robert: I THINK WE DID.

BUT, AGAIN, IN MY LAST EDITORIAL, I CALLED IT.

WE'RE DONE AFFLICTING THE COMFORTED, THE COMFORTABLE, AND I THINK THE PEOPLE IN CONTROL, THE PEOPLE IN POWER, THE PEOPLE WHO ARE RUNNING THE BUDGETS AND NOT SERVING THE PUBLIC ARE STILL THERE.

THEY HAVE DIFFERENT NAMES NOW.

YOU KNOW, IT WAS EMILIO NARANJO ONCE UPON A TIME, AND NOW TAKE YOUR PICK.

THERE'S A BUNCH OF THEM THERE WHO ARE STILL RUNNING BUDGETS AND DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING, OR DO KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING AND JUST NOT SERVING THE PUBLIC, AND THAT'S STILL GOING ON.

MY DAD SAID -- YOU KNOW, I USED TO ASK MY MOM AND DAD 20 YEARS, HOW HAVE YOU GUYS DONE THIS FOR 50 YEARS?

I'M WRITING AN EDITORIAL THAT I WROTE TEN YEARS AGO AND IT'S JUST A DIFFERENT GUY'S NAME NOW.

AND DAD ALWAYS SAID, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE GOT HERE, IT WAS A BIG DEAL FOR KIDS TO GET OUT OF 6th GRADE.

THAT WAS A BIG DEAL.

8th GRADE, AND THIS WAS IN THE FIFTIES.

HE SAID, WE'RE GRADUATING KIDS FROM HIGH SCHOOL, THEY'RE GOING ON TO COLLEGE.

THERE ARE KIDS COMING OUT OF THE ESPANOLA SCHOOL SYSTEM WHO ARE DOCTORS AND LAWYERS.

UNFORTUNATELY, AS WE WERE SPEAKING BEFORE, THEY'RE BACK EAST SOMEWHERE.

BUT IN THAT INSTANCE, THERE HAS BEEN A DIFFERENCE.

AND MY MOM, HER BACKUP WAS ALWAYS, THINK ABOUT WHAT THE VALLEY WOULD BE LIKE IF THE NEWSPAPER WASN'T HERE, AND I TRY TO HOLD ONTO THAT.

BUT IT'S HARD WHEN I'VE BEEN BANGING MY HEAD AGAINST A DESK FOR 31 YEARS, 32 YEARS, WHATEVER.

Gene: SO WHAT ABOUT THAT NEW OWNERSHIP AND DIRECTION OF THE PAPER THAT WE MENTIONED AT THE TOP OF THE SHOW?

WE'VE HEARD ABOUT THE CONCERNS ABOUT HAVING POLITICAL OPERATIVES IN OWNERSHIP ROLES, BUT WHAT EXACTLY IS THE PLAN FOR THE SUN AND HOW IS THE PAPER GOING TO APPROACH COVERING ESPANOLA AND THE SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES?

CORRESPONDENT GWYNETH DOLAND SAT DOWN WITH NEW EDITOR AND PUBLISHER RICH CONNOR TO FIND OUT.

Gwyneth: THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING WITH US TODAY.

I WANT TO ASK YOU FIRST, TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT YOUR BACKGROUND.

HOW DID YOU GET INVOLVED WITH TAKING OVER AS PUBLISHER OF THE SUN?

Richard: WELL, I DID MAJOR IN JOURNALISM IN COLLEGE.

I WAS AN ENGLISH MAJOR, WANTED TO WRITE, GOT A JOB AT A NEWSPAPER, AND IN A RELATIVELY SHORT TIME UNDERSTOOD WHAT A NEWSPAPER, A GOOD NEWSPAPER CAN DO IN A COMMUNITY, AND THAT WOULD BE 55 YEARS AGO, AND IT'S ALL I'VE EVER DONE.

NEVER INTENDED TO DO IT.

I WAS A PHOTOGRAPHER, A REPORTER, AN EDITOR, THEN BECAME THE PUBLISHER FOR A LARGE MEDIA COMPANY OUT OF NEW YORK.

AND MY LAST JOB WITH THEM WAS AS PUBLISHER, PRESIDENT AND PUBLISHER OF THE FORT WORTH STAR TELEGRAM, FORT WORTH, TEXAS, BIG PAPER.

I LEFT THERE AND STARTED MY OWN COMPANY.

SO FOR THE PAST REALLY 25 YEARS OR SO, I'VE OWNED MY OWN NEWSPAPERS, BOUGHT AND SOLD THEM, AND I'VE DONE CONSULTING.

AND THIS OPPORTUNITY CAME ALONG TO HELP SOME INVESTORS WHO HAVE NEVER BEEN IN THE BUSINESS LEARN THE BUSINESS, AND SPEND SOME TIME AT A FAMOUS WEEKLY NEWSPAPER HOPING THAT I CAN CONTINUE THE AGGRESSIVE REPORTING TRADITIONS OF THAT PAPER.

Gwyneth: YOU BROUGHT UP THE ROLE THAT A PAPER CAN PLAY IN A COMMUNITY.

WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE IN ITS IDEAL FORM?

WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO CONTINUE, OR EVEN IMPROVE ON IN TERMS OF THE SUN'S ROLE?

Richard: I'VE BEEN LUCKY THAT I'VE BEEN WITH A COUPLE OF NEWSPAPERS THAT WERE LITERALLY START-UPS.

SO WHEN YOU DO THAT, YOU SAY, PARTICULARLY IN A WEEKLY NEWSPAPER, WHAT IS IT PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW ABOUT THEIR COMMUNITY?

THEY NEED TO KNOW, QUITE FRANKLY, WHO DIED.

THEY NEED TO KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THE CITY POLICE, COUNTY SHERIFFS, STATE POLICE, FIRE, EDUCATION.

SO YOU START WITH THOSE BASICS AND SAY, LET'S FORGET ABOUT THE FEATURE STORY ON SOMEBODY THAT IS DOING SOMETHING PHENOMENAL AND UNIQUE OUT THERE, LET'S FIGURE OUT HOW WE'RE GOING TO COVER THE BASICS OF COMMUNITY LIFE, AND THAT'S PRETTY WELL COVERED IN ESPANOLA.

WE'LL TAKE A NEW LOOK AT HOW WE THINK WE OUGHT TO DO THAT.

AND THEN BEYOND THAT, WHAT I ADD TO IT, MY OWN PERSONAL BELIEF, IS THAT PEOPLE LIVE IN A COMMUNITY BECAUSE THEY LIKE IT.

NOW, SOME MAY HAVE NO CHOICE, BUT MOST PEOPLE TODAY, WE'RE VERY MOBILE.

IF THEY DON'T LIKE WHERE THEY LIVE, THEY COULD MOVE.

SO THEY LIVE IN A COMMUNITY THAT THEY LIKE; IN FACT, LOVE.

AND I THINK THAT WHILE YOU'RE REPORTING ON THE THINGS THAT MAYBE PEOPLE DON'T LOVE -- CRIME, CORRUPTION -- YOU OUGHT TO ALSO SHINE A LIGHT ON THOSE THINGS THAT MAKE PEOPLE PROUD TO LIVE THERE.

THAT WILL BE SOMETHING THAT PROBABLY WE WILL ADD MORE OF AT THE RIO GRANDE SUN.

Gwyneth: HAD YOU HEARD OF THE SUN BEFORE THIS OPPORTUNITY CAME PAST YOU?

Richard: I HAD NOT.

THERE'S A NEWSPAPER BROKERAGE COMPANY IN SANTA FE CALLED DIRKS, VAN ESSEN & APRIL, SELL PROBABLY MORE NEWSPAPERS THAN ANY COMPANY IN THE COUNTRY, AND I'VE DONE A LOT OF BUSINESS WITH THEM.

OWEN VAN ESSEN CALLED ME AND SAID, HAVE YOU EVER HEARD OF THIS NEWSPAPER?

THEY MAY NEED SOMEONE TO HELP THEM LEARN THE BUSINESS.

AND HE SAID, YOU BETTER WATCH THIS DOCUMENTARY.

SO I IMMEDIATELY DID LEARN A LOT ABOUT ESPANOLA AND THE RIO GRANDE SUN, BUT NOT BEFORE THEN.

Gwyneth: SO WHAT ARE YOUR GOALS FOR THE PAPER?

NOW THAT YOU KNOW WHAT IT'S ABOUT AND YOU'RE IN ESPANOLA, WHAT ARE YOUR GOALS MOVING FORWARD?

Richard: WELL, I'VE BEEN THERE A MONTH, SO I THINK IT WOULD REALLY BE SOMEWHAT PREPOSTEROUS FOR ME TO SAY THAT I FULLY UNDERSTAND.

I DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND THE COMMUNITY AT THIS POINT.

I'M OLDER THAN WHEN I USED TO DO THIS.

I HAD JOBS LIKE THIS WHEN I WAS IN MY 20s AND I WOULD BE MORE A BULL IN THE CHINA CLOSET.

NOW I WANT TO WAIT, I WANT TO MEET PEOPLE, I WANT TO MAKE AN ASSESSMENT, AND I WANT TO BE RESPECTFUL OF THE GREAT BUSINESS AND THE COMMUNITY SERVICE THAT THE TRAPP FAMILY PERFORMED IN ESPANOLA OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS.

WE ARE NOT GOING TO LOSE THAT ZEAL FOR AGGRESSIVE FIRST AMENDMENT OPEN MEETINGS KIND OF REPORTING, WHAT THE PUBLIC NEEDS TO KNOW, AND SO WE'RE GOING TO STAY LOYAL TO THAT.

AND THEN WE'RE JUST GOING TO TAKE OUR TIME TRYING TO FIGURE OUT IF THERE'S A NEW AND EXPANDED ROLE FOR US.

Gwyneth: ONE OF THE THINGS THAT'S KIND OF MARKED THE SUN IS IT'S BEEN REALLY OLD SCHOOL ABOUT ITS PRINT EDITION AND PRETTY RELUCTANT TO SPEND TOO MUCH TIME AND EFFORT ON DIGITAL.

DO YOU INTEND TO KEEP THAT, OR IS IT YOUR PHILOSOPHY THAT THIS PAPER SHOULD MOVE MORE INTO THE DIGITAL REALM?

Richard: WE WILL DEFINITELY MOVE MORE INTO THE DIGITAL REALM.

WE ARE NOT GOING TO ABANDON PRINT.

I AM A FIRM BELIEVER THAT THE SAME PEOPLE THAT WILL READ YOU ONLINE WILL READ YOU IN PRINT.

WE HAVE, AS YOU PROBABLY KNOW, 6000 TO 8000 PEOPLE ON ANY GIVEN WEDNESDAY -- THERE ARE SEVERAL MAIL COPIES IN THERE, HOME SUBSCRIPTIONS.

BUT THESE PEOPLE DRIVE UP TO A STREET VENDOR OR WALK INTO A STORE AND BUY THE PAPER.

THAT COMMITMENT AND LOYALTY IS NOT GOING TO GO AWAY JUST BECAUSE WE HAVE A MORE ENHANCED ONLINE DIGITAL PRESENCE.

BUT WE'LL SPEND A LOT OF TIME ON THAT.

FOR INSTANCE, JUST TODAY WE ARE UPDATING THE WILDFIRES ONLINE REGULARLY.

THAT WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN PART OF THE TRADITION OF THE NEWSPAPER BEFORE.

WE WILL BE VERY AGGRESSIVE IN THAT AREA.

Gwyneth: YOU TALKED ABOUT THE OWNERSHIP CHANGE HERE.

YOU'VE NO DOUBT HEARD CONCERNS ABOUT THE NEW OWNERS OF THE PAPER, WHICH INCLUDES TWO FORMER STATE REPUBLICAN PARTY CHAIRS.

WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO THE CONCERNS THAT THIS WILL MAKE THE PAPER OBVIOUSLY PARTISAN?

Richard: NO, IT WON'T.

I HAVE MADE IT CLEAR TO -- THERE ARE NINE INVESTORS -- THAT IF THEY WANTED ME, WHICH THEY DID, TO COME HELP THEM LEARN THE BUSINESS AND RUN THE NEWSPAPER FOR THEM, THAT I WOULD BE RUNNING IT.

THAT'S MY WHOLE CAREER.

WHEN I WORKED FOR A PUBLICLY HELD COMPANY, PEOPLE IN NEW YORK WERE NOT TELLING ME WHAT TO PRINT AND WHAT NOT TO PRINT.

IT'S JUST PART OF MY NATURE AND IT'S PART OF WHAT'S ESSENTIAL IN THIS BUSINESS.

I WOULD SAY THAT I THINK THE CONCERN THAT'S BEEN RAISED TO ME IS A CONCERN I WOULD HAVE ABOUT JOURNALISM.

YOU HAVE TWO FORMER REPUBLICAN CHAIRMEN OF THE NEW MEXICAN REPUBLICAN PARTY -- I SAID REPUBLICAN A LOT THERE -- THERE ARE NINE INVESTORS, TOO.

WHAT PARTY AFFILIATION DO THE OTHER SEVEN HAVE?

GUESS WHAT?

I DON'T KNOW.

AM I REGISTERED IN A PARTY?

WHO KNOWS.

SO I THINK, TOO -- AND I'M NOT BEING CRITICAL OF THE QUESTION.

I'M REALLY GLAD YOU ASKED IT.

I THINK THE CENTER ON THAT, AS WELL AS THE MANAGING PARTNER OF EL RITO, HAS BEEN IN THE OIL AND GAS BUSINESS.

FOR SOMEONE TO LOOK AT NINE INVESTORS -- AND WE NAMED ALL OF THEM.

EVERY ONE OF THEM HAS BEEN NAMED.

I'VE BEEN IN NEWSPAPER PURCHASES WHERE THE INVESTORS DID NOT WANT TO BE NAMED.

NAMED ALL OF THEM, TWO OF THEM ARE FROM ESPANOLA, ONE IS RUNNING FOR OFFICE RIGHT NOW AND TRYING TO RECLAIM HIS STATE REP SEAT.

BUT WE NAMED ALL OF THEM.

TWO OF THEM JUMP OUT BECAUSE THEY'RE PROMINENT REPUBLICANS IN THE STATE.

I GET THAT.

THAT'S GOOD REPORTING.

ONE'S PARTICULARLY BEEN IN THE OIL AND GAS BUSINESS, AND HIS FAMILY HAS.

SO FOR A REPORTER TO TAKE THOSE TWO PIECES AND WRITE A STORY THAT SAYS TOP REPUBLICANS, BIG OIL, OWN THE RIO GRANDE SUN, THAT'S AN ASSUMPTION THAT A REPORTER SHOULDN'T MAKE.

IF A COLUMNIST WANTS TO SAY, HEY, WHAT -- BUT IN A NEWS STORY, I THINK IT IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I PERSONALLY DON'T LIKE IN DAY-TO-DAY JOURNALISM, AND I HOPE WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO THOSE THINGS AT OUR LITTLE, ALTHOUGH BIGGEST PAID WEEKLY NEWSPAPER IN NEW MEXICO.

Gwyneth: WE JUST HAVE ONE MINUTE LEFT.

THIS IS A TOUGH TIME FOR NEWSPAPERS AND NEWS ORGANIZATIONS IN GENERAL.

WHAT ARE YOUR TOP IDEAS FOR KEEPING THE PAPER SOLVENT AND MAYBE MAKING MORE MONEY?

Richard: I LEARNED THIS A LONG TIME AGO.

TRY TO BRING IN MORE THAN YOU SPEND.

BUT IT'S NOT THAT SIMPLE TODAY.

WE WILL ADD ONLINE REVENUE.

THAT WILL BE AN AREA THAT WE THINK WE CAN GROW.

AND I THINK THERE WAS SOME OTHER AREAS WHERE WE CAN -- I THINK THERE'S MORE PRINT REVENUE FOR US.

I MAY BE WRONG ABOUT THAT, BUT I JUST HAVE A SENSE THERE IS -- I FELT FOR A LONG TIME THAT AFTER ABOUT TEN YEARS, THE LEADERSHIP OF A BUSINESS CAN EASILY GET STALE.

YOU'VE COME UP WITH NEW IDEAS AND MAYBE YOU'VE CHANGED THE CULTURE AND YOU'VE MADE THINGS BETTER, AND MAYBE WORSE.

IT'S JUST MY OWN PERSONAL FEELING.

THE RIO GRANDE SUN HAS BEEN OWNED BY THE SAME FAMILY FOR 66 YEARS, AND THEY HAVE DONE A SPECTACULAR JOB OF KEEPING IT GOING WHEN OTHER PAPERS FAILED.

SO NOW WE HAVE TO CARRY ON FROM THERE.

BUT I THINK THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR NEW IDEAS, HOPEFULLY NEW LEADERSHIP.

I HAVE LITERALLY RUN NEWSPAPERS FROM MAINE NOW TO NEW MEXICO.

I OWNED OVER NINETY NEWSPAPERS AT ONE TIME, MOST OF THEM TINY WEEKLIES, AND I THINK I'VE PICKED UP SOME EXPERIENCE AND SOME IDEAS ALONG WAY THAT I CAN IMPART HERE.

WE'LL HAVE TO SEE.

BUT THIS GROUP BOUGHT THE RIO GRANDE SUN BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO CONTINUE IN ESPANOLA, IN RIO ARRIBA COUNTY, AND MAYBE EXPAND BEYOND THAT, AND I'M CONFIDENT THAT THEY ARE COMMITTED AND CAN RIDE THROUGH THE UPS AND DOWNS WHILE WE HAVE NEW OWNERSHIP AND NEW LEADERSHIP.

Gwyneth: WELL, THANK YOU FOR COMING IN AND TALKING TO US ABOUT IT.

WE'LL CHECK BACK IN WITH YOU AS YOU MAKE SOME PROGRESS.

Richard: PERFECT.

THANK YOU.

Gene: IT IS A CRUCIAL TIME FOR LOCAL JOURNALISM AND SMALL NEWS OUTLETS LIKE THE RIO GRANDE SUN.

TIME WILL TELL HOW THAT NEW OWNERSHIP GROUP WILL FAIR WITH ITS AUDIENCE, BUT ONE THING IS FOR CERTAIN.

WE CAN'T AFFORD TO LOSE ANY NEWS ORGANIZATIONS, ESPECIALLY IN A STATE LIKE OURS WITH SO MANY DIVERSE COMMUNITIES AND ISSUES.

NEWS DESERTS ARE BECOMING A REAL THREAT AND ONE THAT DOES NOT BODE WELL FOR THE FOUNDING FATHER'S IDEALS OF A DEMOCRACY WITH A WELL INFORMED ELECTORATE.

IF YOU WANT TO SEE MORE OF "THE SUN NEVER SETS" DOCUMENTARY WHICH WAS MADE IN 2013, BE SURE TO TUNE INTO NEW MEXICO PBS AT 7:00 P.M. ON MAY 19th.

WE'LL BE BROADCASTING THE FULL FILM, WHICH WILL ALSO BE STREAMING ON DEMAND ON THE NMPBS WEBSITE.

THANKS AS ALWAYS FOR TUNING IN AND HELPING US ALL STAY INFORMED AND ENGAGED.

WE'LL SEE YOU AGAIN NEXT WEEK In FOCUS.

FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO In FOCUS PROVIDED BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.