- [Narrator] Funding for this edition of One-On-One with Steve Adubato has been provided by PSEG Foundation.

NJM Insurance Group.

Serving New Jersey’s drivers, homeowners and business owners for more than 100 years.

RWJBarnabas Health.

Let’s be healthy together.

The New Jersey Education Association.

Horizon Blue Cross Blue Shield of New Jersey.

The Russell Berrie Foundation.

Making a difference.

New Jersey Sharing Network.

And by New Jersey Institute of Technology.

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Promotional support provided by New Jersey Globe.

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The magazine of the Garden State, available at newsstands.

- This is One-On-One.

- I'm an equal American just like you are.

- The way we change Presidents in this country is by voting.

- A quartet is already a jawn, it’s just The New Jawn.

- January 6th was not some sort of violent, crazy outlier.

- I don't care how good you are or how good you think you are, there is always something to learn.

- I mean what other country sends comedians over to embedded military to make them feel better.

- People call me 'cause they feel nobody's paying attention.

_ It’s not all about memorizing and getting information, it’s what you do with that information.

- (slowly) Start talking right now.

- That's a good question, high five.

(upbeat music) - Welcome, everyone.

Steve Adubato, Jacqui Tricarico, my co-anchor on "Remember Them."

Jacqui, we kick off remembering the great Franco Harris.

Played for the Pittsburgh Steelers in the NFL, 13 seasons.

All Pro, Super Bowls, multiple Super Bowls.

Jacqui, do you know, and also, 2011 New Jersey Hall of Fame inductee.

Do you know the number that Franco Harris wore?

- I don't know, and I should know because I was a Steelers fan for many years.

(laughs) What was the number?

- They retired it.

Number 32.

And no one ever wore it again.

All right, you're gonna see in this interview with Franco "Dok" Harris, Franco's son.

He'll be talking about his dad as a great athlete, as a philanthropist, as an entrepreneur, as a great dad.

I'm putting you on the spot again, Jacqui.

What was the catch that Franco Harris was famous for?

- Now I can't remember the name of it, but I know it won one of the Super Bowls.

- The "Immaculate Reception."

- "Immaculate Reception."

- Jacqui's gonna go, "Well, hold on.

We prepare for all these shows and you asked me stuff that."

- Oh, I remember you talked to Dok about it.

Obviously, he told a really good story about it and what he remembers from that time, which isn't much 'cause he was such a young kid when his dad was playing for the NFL.

So it's interesting 'cause Dok talks a little bit about that, but it's more word of mouth, things that he heard over the years from his family and really, what Franco Harris instilled in his kids was working hard, philanthropy, giving back.

And that's what Dok continues to do.

Taking over some businesses that Franco started and making sure he's continuing his dad's legacy.

- Jacqui, back in the day when you were a little, little kid, Franco Harris came to Newark, New Jersey, to my dad's place, the Northward Center.

It's a community center in Newark.

It was an Italian American celebration.

Franco's mother was from Italy.

Franco came with his mother.

She was very short.

Franco was big, strong.

He was part Italian, part African American.

We celebrated together Columbus Day, at the time, it was called in Newark.

And it was extraordinary to meet him in person, to meet his mom and to get a sense of him.

It was one of the highlights of my life.

And I will say that this interview with Dok Harris, his son, brings Franco to life.

We remember the great number 32, the "Immaculate Reception," Franco Harris.

(inspiring music) - I credit New Jersey for where I am at today.

The sports programs that we had through my whole period of growing up in Jersey and the education that I got in our school system was incredible.

And that gave me the foundation to really let me pursue and then to accomplish things in the future.

Sports gives you a lot, but education is where it all is, that's the most important thing.

And because of sports, I was able to further my education by going to college and by graduating college, I now use that knowledge in my business currently.

So sports and education combination, that really makes you a winner.

We're now joined by F. "Dok" Harris, president of Super Bakery and the son of NFL legend, icon, the great number 32, Franco Harris.

Dok, good to see you.

- Great to see you too.

- You know, I was just telling you before we got on the air what a fan I was of your dad, honored to get to meet him back in the day at the Northward Center where my dad was the founder and in an Italian American community.

And your dad was there and you know, his mom, from Italy.

Make the connection about who he was, racially, ethnically.

And then we'll keep talking about him as a great man and a great athlete.

- You know, my dad's one of those amazing American stories.

My grandfather, Cad, came from Mississippi, a Black sergeant in the Army and over in Italy in Pietrasanta, he met Gina, my grandma Gina.

They got married.

War bride.

And you know, one of the things that my dad would always talk about was growing up in army housing in New Jersey.

And when they first started out, you know, all the families were mixed.

So you'd see a Black soldier with an Italian wife, a Black soldier with a Japanese wife, a Black soldier with a Swiss or German, you know, and he always said, you know, "Man, growing up, I thought everybody looks like me, you know?

'Cause all the kids were mixed (Steve chuckles) and we had such a great time of all these different cultures and all the different foods and everything.

Then we went outside in the bigger world.

It was a whole lot different.

You know?"

- I love how people debate, "Are you this or you're that?"

Some people come from interesting, complex, beautiful backgrounds.

That's all I'll say.

Let me ask you this.

Beyond the great accomplishments of Franco Harris, of your dad as an athlete, as a football player, as a Hall of Famer, what was he like as a father?

- You know, it's funny.

He was working so much when I was young, playing football and then starting his first company, Franco's Au Natural, that I never thought we'd spent that much time together.

But now, years later, we are exactly alike.

And I don't understand how the science works.

(laughs) You know, it's wonderful having somebody like that.

- How so?

How so?

- Having somebody like that who was just always such a positive spirit.

You know, my dad never said, "We can't do this."

It was, "Let's figure out a way to do this."

And, you know, that works on the football field, but it works in business too.

And his hobby, strangely enough, was business.

If you'd ever seen the house when I was growing up, there would just be stacks and stacks and stacks of business books.

He read voraciously and it'd be notes and notes and going through those, I think sometimes he'd forget where he was, even.

There was just so many pages that he crafted trying to figure out the best way to build the system.

- What was his fascination with business?

- So his undergrad degree was in hotel and restaurant management.

- From Penn State?

- Yes, sir.

Yeah.

At Penn State.

And he always said that it's just, it's what he fell in love with.

He was always hustling from a young age.

My grandparents didn't have much money, having nine kids on an army sergeant's salary.

So from a very early age, it was out there shining shoes, picking blueberries, running errands for soldiers and stuff.

So he always had that very strong work mentality.

And then from that, he fell in love.

I think the big push was, he tells this story, the first time he was getting recruiting trips and he flew on an airplane and they took him out to dinner, this huge steak and all this other stuff.

And he went, "All right, this is pretty good."

And I think that's what got him into the food service and hotel industry.

The first time you saw the "Immaculate Reception," which I still, "I'm sorry, what did I just see?"

The first time you saw it, A, your reaction, B, your conversations with your dad about it afterwards, if you had 'em.

- Well, you know, I saw that, man, I just had my 45th birthday.

So let's go ahead and say about 44, 45 years ago the first time.

So I couldn't tell you about the first time I saw it, but all the different times, all the different analyses, all the different discussions, my dad would always bring up what Joe Paterno told him when he was playing college football.

- Joe Paterno, the great Joe Paterno at Penn State, his coach.

- Yessir, and uh... Joe would always say, "Franco, go to the ball.

Franco, go to the ball.

No matter what was happening on the play, after the pass, after the run, someone else has the ball.

You go to the ball because that's where the action is and that's how you can make a play."

So my dad lived up to that standard and said, "You know what, this play's breaking down.

This is the end of a great season, but maybe if I go towards that ball, I can make a play."

And like they say, the rest is history, in a way, that is.

The way I always look at it personally is the way it happened, the city in which it happened in, Pittsburgh feeling kind of down and out as the collapse of the steel industry.

The Steelers having never really won anything up until then.

And the people there watching this miraculous, you know, literally hand of God kind of situation, you know?

And experiencing that must have been magical.

And for the next decade, that Steelers family was magical.

And the fact that so many of those guys stayed around, stayed in town, stayed friends, really shows you the very best in team sports and the very best in commitment for where you play.

- Was he in the same backfield with Rocky Bleier?

- Yes, sir.

And in 1976- - Number 20.

Number 20, Rocky Bleier.

A great blocker, great teammate.

They were close?

- Very close.

Yeah, Rocky and my father remained friends, very close friends for a long time.

Rocky's like an uncle to me.

1976 when Bradshaw got hurt, Rocky and my pops both rushed for 1,000 yards.

Right?

Amazing.

And knowing Rocky, who has probably the most inspirational story in professional football, honestly.

- Sure does.

- You go to Vietnam, you get your foot blown off, they tell you you'll never walk again.

And instead you train hard and you get to be a professional football player and win Super Bowls?

That's inspiring on a level that you can't compare to anything else.

- Lemme ask you this.

Your dad was bigger than life.

He was strong, he was tough.

He carried people on his back and was just a giant of an athlete, a football player.

Was he gentle as a dad?

- Absolutely.

What's funny is that what you saw in public and what we saw at home was the exact same thing.

There was no pretense in any way.

My dad really lived up to his ideals at all times.

None of it was an act.

It was, I mean, I have been blessed with two amazing parents who raised me.

And the ability to have somebody who is, you know, famous and out in public all the time, and then to have that person love you and help raise you and you know, craft you into the man you are, you know, I'm truly blessed.

- Hey, Dok, thank you.

I mean, as a kid growing up, I mean, I related to your dad in so many ways, just loving football, but also the Italian, I would be lying if I didn't say that the Italian American connection...

But I'll say this to you, he was an iconic figure, a figure that so many of us looked up to, not for just the way he played football, but for the way he carried himself, with dignity, class, integrity, and you honor him by joining us, Dok.

And I cannot thank you enough.

To you and your family, we wish you all the best.

Franco Harris, we need to remember him.

Thank you, Dok.

- Thank you.

Have a great day.

- You got it.

Stay with us, we'll be right back.

- [Narrator] To watch more One on One with Steve Adubato find us online and follow us on Social media.

- We now remember one of the greatest boxers in American history in world history.

He was Jersey Joe Walcott.

That's right, he was from New Jersey, inducted to the New Jersey Hall of Fame in 2013.

He fought, Jacqui Tricarico, he fought, wow, check this out.

1930 to 1953 at 37 years of age, the oldest person to win a world championship.

I interview Larry Hazzard, who I've known for years.

He was a teacher over at Broadway Junior High School as a kid in Newark, where I went to school.

And also as a commissioner, as a commissioner of New Jersey Athletic Board knows boxing better than most.

Jersey Joe Walcott.

what did you learn about Jersey Joe?

- Well, it took him 21 years battling in the ring for him to take home that world heavyweight title.

Perseverance, let's talk about perseverance, right?

But funny enough, that's not what, that wasn't his whole entire life.

He did a lot of other things.

He was an actor, started, was in a couple of different movies, but also he was the sheriff of Camden County, New Jersey.

- That's right.

- The first African American to do so from 1975 to 1984.

So just such an interesting guy to learn about through Larry Hazzard, like you said.

Some interesting facts and things that probably a lot of people didn't know about Jersey Joe Walcott.

- So you may know the name Jersey Joe Walcott.

But here's the story behind the man who he was, why he mattered, and why we remember him in an in-depth interview with a terrific teacher, athlete, understands boxing better than most, the great Larry Hazzard.

Let's talk about Jersey Joe Walcott.

(soft music) (light music) - We are honored to be joined by Larry Hazzard, Senior Commissioner of New Jersey State Athletic Control Board.

Also a boxing referee in the past.

An educator who I knew as a very young boy at in Newark, New Jersey in the public schools.

Larry, it's great to see you again, my friend.

- Same here, Steve.

Great to see you as always.

- You got it.

So Jersey Joe Walcott, I mean, as a young man I remember reading about and hearing about him.

What made Jersey Joe Walcott so special?

Because you knew him in a very special way, please.

- Well, what made him special.

In 1978, aside from being a great heavyweight champion, of course, but personally, in 1978, as you know, I was in the Newark public school system as an administrator, principal.

That was my real job during the day.

My nighttime job, I was a budding amateur boxing referee, and I was doing fights all over the state of New Jersey and parts of Pennsylvania.

So I was enjoying the best of two worlds really.

So I had done a boxing tournament in Northern New Jersey one night.

And so when the event was over, I was in the dressing room getting ready to go home and in walks a fellow by the name of Al Certo and Jersey Joe Walcott, they were good friends.

Al brings Jersey Joe over to my locker.

He says, "Joe, this is the kid I've been telling you about."

And I'm like, "Huh?"

I didn't even know who Al Certo was at the time.

"So this kid, you gotta make him a professional.

You saw him working tonight.

This guy is good.

Boxing is big, is gonna get big in Atlantic City.

You're gonna need somebody like him."

And so I just took off from there.

Jersey Joe Walcott, from that point, got all my contact information.

He turned me professional as a referee in 1978.

He brought me to Atlantic City.

I started my professional boxing refereeing career because he had recruited me from the amateurs and brought me to Atlantic City.

And the rest is history.

And little did I know at that time, and I'm sure he didn't even know at that time that seven years later I would succeed him as the boxing commissioner.

It just goes to show you sometimes when, you know, you're looking, you're trying to find your destiny.

Sometimes your destiny will find you, you know?

Unbeknownst to me and the rest is history, Steve.

- But part of the history, Larry, if we can go back, is this is a guy, Jersey Joe Walcott, born in 1914 in New Jersey, in Merchantville, New Jersey, 15 years old when his father dies.

He had his first professional middleweight fight in 1930.

17 years, it took him to earn a title fight with the great Joe Lewis.

He loses to Joe Louis, both times he fights him.

He then fights Ezzard Charles in 1951, he's getting older, right?

For boxing, 40 is like 65 in boxing.

So he is getting older and he fights Ezzard Charles and he wins the heavyweight championship at 37 years of age.

The oldest person, and afterwards it was the great George Foreman.

- George Foreman.

- So 30- Put that in perspective.

All those years fighting, he finally wins the championship, go ahead.

- Listen, listen.

He fought five times for the heavyweight championship.

The two guys that stood in his way was the great Joe Lewis and Ezzard Charles.

He fought Joe Lewis twice.

The first time he fought Joe Lewis, he got robbed.

Joe Lewis had left the ring because he knew he had lost the fight.

They brought him back into the ring to announce him as the winner of the fight.

He fought Jersey Joe Walcott.

Jersey Joe walkout fought him again and lost.

Then he fought Ezzard Charles.

He lost to Ezzard Charles.

- He fought him for three times.

He fought Lewis twice, fought Ezzard Charles three times.

He beat Charles on the third time.

- And that's how he becomes champion?

- He becomes champion after his fifth try.

On the fifth try.

Two losses to Lewis, two losses to Charles.

And then on the fifth try against Charles, he becomes the champion at age 37.

- How significant was and is that, Larry Hazzard?

- Very significant.

It had never been done, okay?

He was the oldest man to win the heavyweight championship at 37, which was, you were like 37 years old fighting then, it was unheard of.

- But then Larry, he actually fights the great, undefeated from Brockton, Massachusetts, - Rocky Marciano.

- Marciano, what happens?

- Well, they say he was ahead in that fight.

I got the picture.

And Jersey Joe hated that picture.

He tried to throw a right hand.

He tried to throw on a left hook and Marciano hit him with that right hand.

And that's a world famous picture with that grimace on his face.

Marciano knocked him out.

- He was very late in his career.

Explain to folks if he, again, Mike Tyson, the youngest to win the heavyweight championship and you refereed some of Mike Tyson's fights, okay?

- Yes.

- Okay.

Young, I think he was 20 or 21 years of age.

- 21 when he won that.

- 21.

37, and then he is fighting Rocky Marciano, this great fighter from Massachusetts getting close to 40 years of age.

- That's right.

- Was there any part of him that he said, "I gotta get outta this," or was that his way of making a living, Larry?

- Well, that was part, that was part of his way of making a living.

You know, he was helping to support his family during his fighting days.

And then, of course, into his fighting career.

He had a relatively large family that he supported.

And, you know, the thing that, with him was that just drive and that intensity and that stick-to-it-iveness, that toughness.

You know, this man, this was a unique person.

Jersey Joe Walcott was a unique individual that I was so honored to have known on a personal level.

- And again, he becomes, he has an acting career for a short period of time.

In 1971, Jersey Joe Walcott becomes the first African American to be elected the Camden County Sheriff.

How the heck does that happen?

- I don't know.

I mean, this man, (Steve laughing) this man was in me.

He was admired and he was respected.

And, you know, after he was served that at the Camden County Sheriff, he became the New Jersey Boxing Commissioner.

- And that's how you became, He then- - He recruited me.

You see, this is how, unbelievable, man.

Unbelievable.

While he was the commissioner, he recruited me out of the amateurs.

I had no aspirations whatsoever of becoming a professional boxing referee.

I was as happy as you could be in the schools during the day, refereeing amateur fights at night.

And that was the best of two worlds.

I had no aspirations whatsoever becoming a professional referee.

- So the great, Larry Hazzard, who is an institution in the world of boxing and in public urban education, talking about the extraordinary life and career of Jersey Joe Walcott, who we lost at 80 years of age in 1994.

I cannot thank you enough my mentor and friend from Newark, New Jersey, Broadway Junior High School, back, back, back in the day.

I cannot thank you enough, Larry.

- Well, I can't thank you enough for having me.

- You and my dad were like this.

You and my dad were like this growing up to me.

- That's right, that's right.

And I can't thank you enough for having me on, Steve, and it's great seeing you.

My love to you and your family.

You will always have my respect.

- It is an honor.

It's an honor for me to just to be able to talk to you.

Larry Hazzard, thank you so much.

For everyone watching our series, remember them on one-on-one.

The great Jersey Joe Walcott.

Some people know the name but they don't know the man.

You just got a sense from the great Larry Hazzard of who Jersey Joe Walcott was and why he still matters today.

Thanks for watching.

We'll see you next time.

- [Narrator] One-On-One with Steve Adubato is a production of the Caucus Educational Corporation.

Funding has been provided by PSEG Foundation.

NJM Insurance Group.

RWJBarnabas Health.

Let’s be healthy together.

The New Jersey Education Association.

Horizon Blue Cross Blue Shield of New Jersey.

The Russell Berrie Foundation.

New Jersey Sharing Network.

And by New Jersey Institute of Technology.

Promotional support provided by New Jersey Globe.

And by New Jersey Monthly.

- New Jersey Institute of Technology has supported New Jersey businesses since 1881, when it was founded as the Newark Technical School and through their partnership with the non-profit New Jersey Innovation Institute.

They're igniting innovation and delivering transformative products and services throughout the state.

Learn more at NJIT.edu and NJII.com.