(upbeat music) - Welcome to A Shot of Ag.

My name is Rob Sharkey, I'm a fifth generation farmer from just outside of Bradford, Illinois.

I started a podcast which led into a XM radio show, which led into a national radio show, which led into me being right here today.

But today is not about me.

Today is about Anant Deshwal, how you doing Anant?

- I'm doing good, how are you doing?

- I'm doing pretty good.

I'm hoping I can get through the show without saying your name wrong.

- That's perfectly fine.

- Anant Deshwal, all right.

You are Assistant Professor of Biology at good old Bradley.

- Yes.

- How long you been doing that?

- I joined Bradley in August 2021, so it's been around nine or 10 months for me.

- Okay, do you like it?

- Oh I am loving it.

- Really?

- It's literally living the dream over there.

(laughing) - Have you been in education long?

- Yes.

I was doing my PhD in Arkansas- - Yeah.

- And then I went to do a postdoc in University of Tennessee, but because I was very interested in teaching, I did a teaching postdoc, and that eventually led me to Bradley.

- Okay.

- Yeah.

- I mean I don't wanna assume, right, but I mean, from your accent, are you Canadian?

- No.

- No, not Canadian.

- Not Canadian, I am from India.

- India.

- Yes.

- I was close.

- It was very close.

Just a little to the east.

(laughing) - Is that where you grew up?

- Yes, I grew up in Delhi, in India.

It's the northern part of India, it's the capital.

If you were to imagine Delhi, think of New York.

- Okay.

- That's how Delhi is.

- You know, just from like what movies show and that, it seems like it's very populated.

- It is very populated.

- Yeah, pretty big.

- It's huge and it's very crowded.

- Yeah.

- Yes.

- So tell me about growing up there, what was that like?

- It was fun.

I used to, growing up in India, it's very different from growing up over here in US.

For example, in schools, everybody is basically friends with everybody.

We didn't have that concept of who's popular and all those different terms.

- What?

- Yeah we didn't have those concepts.

Everybody was friends with everybody.

- How did you know who to look up to?

- Everybody was popular.

- Really?

- Yeah, it was fun.

- How do you, how do you do that?

Because why don't you do that over here?

- I just found out that, you know, I was talking to a student the other day, and she told me that, "Well we've got all these different terms," and how people interact with each other, and we didn't have that.

I was, either I was participating in science quizzes, I was doing theater, or I was out there catching snakes.

Random people and everybody was after, and we were all hanging out.

- You're not sure that you were really popular in school and that you're just looking at it this way?

- I tried to think of it that way at one point of time, when I had just come to US a friend asked me that, "If you grew up in US system, do you think you would popular "or do you think you would be a bully, "or do you think you would be," you know, all those.

And then I thought about all the people in the school, in my school, and I think everybody was popular.

Everybody had groups that they could hang out with, but the groups were interchangeable, and if anybody is sitting by themselves, people would just go and be like, you know, "yo, come over, let's just hang out."

- No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, that was a big no no.

- Yeah?

- If you, there were cliques here, if you went in the other clique, they'd get you, shiv you, you know what I'm saying?

- Yeah.

- It's not good.

- Oh no, we were all over the place.

(laughing) - Okay, I had you on the XM radio show, you did a very good job.

- Thank you.

- We talked there about growing up in a little more humble situations.

Tell me about like the sacrifices that your dad made.

- So my dad, he was from a very humble background.

He could not even afford new clothes in his own marriage.

And right after getting married, and he got a job as a electrical engineer, he got the responsibility of educating and marrying his siblings.

And so he, once he did with all of that, then me and my brother came along, and you know, he spent every penny he had on mine and my brother's education.

And my mom, she had a double masters in languages, but she decided not to do any jobs so that she could be a full-time mom, and be our best friend, be there for us at all points of time, and that we can share all our secrets with her, and never feel judged.

- Not all of 'em.

- Well, yeah, of course.

(laughing) Don't tell my mom.

- Yeah, don't worry, nobody watches.

So I mean, it sounds like you had very loving parents that were willing to sacrifice.

- Yes.

- Yeah.

- We, in fact, my dad he didn't buy, I know, now I know that he didn't buy himself any clothes for a decade, for 10 years, and we didn't have our own house, even today we don't have our own house in India.

- Whoa.

- We didn't- - Whoa, whoa, whoa.

You dad didn't buy any new clothes for a decade?

- Yes.

- 10 years?

- For 10 years, he did not.

- Well you said, okay, he got married, he didn't buy, he was wearing used clothes on his wedding day?

- On his wedding day.

- And he didn't buy any clothes for 10 years?

- Yeah.

- If I wear a shirt three times it falls apart, how did he do that?

- He was, some, what they would do is, my dad, what he would buy was quality material that he knew would last long.

And then my mom would keep patching them up.

- Gotcha.

- Yeah, so they didn't fall apart.

- When you're growing up though, did you know, were you aware of that sacrifice?

- My dad ensured that me and my brother did not know any about it.

- Wow.

- Anything.

He was like, he made us believe and feel as if, you know, we're living king size, while at the background he was doing all of this.

In fact he ensured that we got the best education by going to the best schools in Delhi, that is the Delhi public school system in Delhi, we were going to those schools, and he ensured that we got like all the latest books we wanted, and all of this.

The only place where I felt I could feel sometimes the thing, the financial cringe come up, was I would be handed over my brother's books instead of getting new books.

And for me it just made sense.

Why buy new books when those books already exist at home?

- But I mean, for him to do all that, I can tell you right now I don't love my kids that much.

I would buy new clothes.

I mean they can do without, right?

- Now see- - Make them write their own books.

(laughing) - The thing is it's very easy to compare, but, you know, the situation in India was quite different from here, and yeah.

I wouldn't want anybody to make the judgment that loving their kids less after listening about my dad.

- Oh no, believe me, after hearing that story, I think we all gotta admit, yeah, what it is.

Okay, so you get a good education.

- Yes.

- So tell me, like do you, college level, what happens there?

- So I always wanted to be studying wildlife, I wanted to spend my life studying wildlife, but I did not know how to do it.

I did not know, and nobody I knew knew, how you can get a degree in wildlife ecology or conservation biology.

It was just not existent.

So we decided that I'd do engineering and then we'll figure things out.

So I went, I gave engineering exams, and I got selected as a civil engineer.

- So, okay, not to interrupt you, but to make the decision to go to engineering, was there almost a pressure situation to do that?

- There was a lot of societal and peer pressure, and like I said before, my father had a very tight financial condition, and he never wanted me and my brother to endure those, go through the same struggles that he did.

And so he, what we decided was, that first get an engineering job, and make so that I have a fallback, like a fallback plan, something, and in case things don't work out in wildlife.

But I wasn't too happy about it.

You know you're young, you got all that energy, that drive, that passion, like no I want to be running after snakes, and you're seeing Steve Irwin shows, and David Attenborough, and I'm like no, I want to be doing all this.

And so there was a lot of pressure though.

- Those damn crocodile hunter isn't it.

- Yeah.

I have a crocodile bite of my own, actually.

- Okay.

(laughing) I've got a pen, I don't know.

Is that really, did you get bit by a crocodile?

- Yeah.

- Okay.

Maybe engineering doesn't look so bad.

(laughing) I see both sides though, right.

Because I mean your dad, your parents obviously sacrificed a lot for you guys, and then you as a kid say, "Hey I wanna go chase snakes."

And they're like, well, I get it, I get both sides, and I get your side too.

- Yeah.

- So begrudgingly, you get, do you get an engineering degree?

- I did get an engineering degree, and I worked for six months in construction of highways and interstates in India.

But my boss was always mad at me.

- Why?

- Highway is there, and I was with my binoculars looking like this up at the trees.

- Oh you were looking for birds and stuff.

- Yeah, and so, six months of working as a highway engineer I told my boss one day, "You know what, I'm out."

And I quit.

- Is that what you actually said?

- No I went and- (laughing) It wasn't this dramatic.

- Sir, I quit.

No, no, yeah, you're quitting right, go tell him to pound sand.

- Actually I told him my passion for wildlife, and he was very encouraging.

He didn't accept my resignation letter for six months, saying that just in case if things don't work out for you, you've got a place in this company, - Oh wow.

- Yeah.

- Well okay, then he's not such a bad guy.

- No, no he wasn't.

It was, you know, if I'm not doing my job, I'm looking at birds, he's bound to be angry.

(laughing) - But here you are, you're sitting there with an engineering degree, you've just quit your job, and you want to work with wildlife.

- Yeah so call up one institute that I find out does wildlife degrees.

And I called them and I asked them, "I want to work with wildlife conservation, what do I do?"

And they tell me that, "Look, "you don't have a background degree in biology, "you have a engineering degree, you can't do anything."

In India things are very rigid.

You get a degree in a field, you stick to that field, you don't hop around.

- Okay.

- And they said, "We can't do anything."

- I said, "Can I come over there in person "and explain to you my passion?"

And they were like, "Nah."

And so the next day I'm there, and I'm telling the secretary for the chair of the department that I've made an appointment yesterday, when she said don't come.

- Oh you fibbed.

- Yeah I fibbed, and I went in, and I spoke to the chair- - They let you in?

- I just told her that I have an appointment and she let me in.

- Were you carrying a ladder?

Have you ever seen that thing?

You can get into anywhere if you're carrying a ladder.

People don't wanna stop you because they think you're doing something important.

- I should have done that.

- No you didn't even have that right?

- No.

- You just- - I just went bare handed and I walked in and I spoke to the chair and he told me about a couple, and then I spoke to every faculty member literally in the university.

I knocked on doors, I walked in- - Okay so you're not playing.

You want to do this and you're dead serious and you're gonna make it happen.

- Yes, yes.

- That's awesome.

- Thank you.

- Well everybody says they're passionate about stuff, right?

But they don't wanna go fight for it.

I mean you, obviously, were willing to go fight for it.

- For me, I'll be honest, ever since I quit my job as a civil engineer and I've become a wildlife conservation biologist, I don't see this as a job.

I see this as a way of life.

This is what I would be doing during my free time, during my hobby, to relax.

Now I get paid to be relaxed.

(laughing) - Okay.

What we have here, you told me, is a 17 foot Anaconda.

- I wish, I wish I brought a 17 food Anaconda.

- There's a snake in here.

- There's a snake in here.

- Is it poisonous?

- No it's not.

It's a very harmless snake.

In fact it's a snake that you would see in and around houses, in yards, backyards, in agriculture fields.

You encounter it almost every other day, but they're so good at hiding that you're close to it, you don't see it.

- What kind is it?

- It's a garter snake, and they are very friendly.

Do you want me to bring this fellow out?

- I would love for you to bring that snake out.

- Awesome.

I was, the other day I was up and about looking for birds and all, and I was in a private property, and I saw this snake, I'm like, "You know what?

"I'll bring this over and show it to you."

- So this is just for us.

- Yes, so after the show I'll go and release it back to its environment.

The way I tie the bag, like this, it's made from like parachute silk, this bag.

And it's very light.

- What'd they used to make parachute pants out of?

That stuff.

- That kind of stuff.

- Yeah exactly.

- And the snake can breath in it and it feels, it's like it's in a hole and very comfortable.

- Okay.

Oh, he's a big one.

- Yeah, he peed over me right now.

(laughing) And that's okay, that's because- - That's what they do, right?

- That's their defense mechanism.

- Yeah.

- So now if you look at this guy, this is an adult snake.

- That is a garter snake?

That's a pretty big one isn't it?

- That's a big one, yeah.

And if you look at its tongue, it's flicking out it's tongue right now.

- Yeah.

- And that is just because it's curious, it wants to know what's going on.

- It wants to know who to kill.

(laughing) - It's not hungry right now, I can tell you that, so it does not want to kill.

In fact if you look at the snake right now, people are scared of snakes.

- Yeah.

- They think snakes are there to bite us, but if you look at it right now, not once did it try to bite me, and it's not even coming towards me.

It's trying to go away from me.

- Uh huh, it's coming towards me.

(laughing) Why is it, I mean, if I went and picked up a snake, I've done it before right, and they turn around and they give you a nip, how come he's not biting you?

- So I've been handling snakes for as long as I can remember.

- Oh, you know what you're doing.

- It's, my theory is keep the snake calm.

It's, the more calm the snake is, the better it is.

And if it's not calm that means I might be doing something wrong.

- Yeah.

- Right now if you see I'm moving my hand constantly.

So the snake gets the feeling that it is moving and going somewhere.

- Oh you're fooling it.

Stupid snake.

(laughing) - It's an absolute beauty.

If you look at its neck you can see slight hints of red on the neck.

- That's probably not, I thought that was danger, red.

- Not always.

Yes sometimes snakes have, and other animals have that red, bright red coloration on them, and that's to show others that they are dangerous.

But not with this guy.

If you see the red is very, very light in color, it's just to attract females.

- Ah, it's bling, yeah, I get that.

See most people don't understand though that they are very beneficial.

'Cause what I, I'm not a fan of snakes, they're fine, I don't like mice and rats though.

- Yeah so this guy would eat mice and rats all around.

They control the rodent population.

In fact sometimes having non-venomous snakes like, not this one, but prairie snakes, king snakes, they will eat venomous snakes.

- Oh.

- Yeah so they keep all the danger out.

This guy will mostly eat fish, amphibians, and it would eat mice and rats.

- Kind of like Jedis and the Sith, right?

- Yes!

- Exactly.

- Yes!

- That's what I'm saying.

- Perfect, I love it, I love it.

- So this is what you like, right?

- Yes.

- This is what you were willing to walk away from in engineering job, which I assume was pretty good.

- It was a good paying job.

- But this is, this is your passion.

- This is where my heart lies.

- Okay.

- Yeah.

- And are you still, as you sit back today, are you happy with that decision?

- I can't be even more happier.

I think I'm living a dream right now.

- Really?

- I'm just waiting for somebody to pinch me and wake me up and you know, I'd be like, "Dang it, I've got to go back to engineering life."

- I can't pinch him, it's not my job, somebody wanna?

(laughing) Well that's fantastic.

Illinois, this Peoria area, there's no poisonous snakes?

- You can get, not in Peoria area.

Over here in and around you won't get any poisonous snake.

You might get Timber rattlesnakes, but you'll see them in Sand Ridge State Parks, those kind of areas, so not over here.

- Just armadillos.

Did you see those things coming up?

- So they are moving further north.

- Yeah.

- They are.

- That's what we have to worry about.

- Yes.

- They carry leprosy.

- They do, in fact.

But I'm doing three research projects.

One is on snakes- - Yeah.

- Hello.

It's just like up.

- Well you've got him now.

(laughing) - So one is on snakes, one is on conserving grassland birds and insects, and third one is on northward movement of armadillos.

- Okay, listen to me right now.

Forget the snakes, forget the birds, focus on stopping the armadillos.

- Well, here's the thing.

We, I don't think we can stop them.

- Oh yes we can.

We can build a dillo wall or something, I don't know.

- I like that term, dillo wall.

It has to be at least 12 inches high, otherwise they'll be able to climb it.

- Okay, we can, I'm willing to sacrifice.

We'll take out Pekin, nobody will care if there's a wall in Pekin, they can step over.

- They have been spotted in Pekin.

- Yeah.

- And they have been spotted in Tazewell County as well.

- It's not good.

- It's not good.

- No.

- And people, where I've been seeing right now as I'm moving around Peoria and going different places, I'm staying there indirect evidences of armadillo, their dig, and that effects agriculture land and everything.

And it has negative effect on agriculture land.

And they dig, and they make these six inch holes, and four or five of them at a time.

And I'm seeing those every now and then.

So armadillos are here at least as far as I know more than we think they are.

- Okay that's not what I wanted to hear.

- Is there a snake we can introduce to eat the armadillos?

- I would rather not do that.

Why?

- We gotta think outside the box at this point.

- We do have to think outside the box, and I think our best chance at controlling armadillos is working towards and mitigating the climate change crisis.

Because the more the weather in Peoria and in central Illinois warms up, and it is predicted if we look at the weather models, if climate change continues like this, Illinois will become more like Texas.

And if it becomes more like Texas, that means it's becoming better and better environment for armadillos.

- They aren't in Texas anymore.

You talk to people in Texas, they've left.

I'm serious I've got friends in Texas, I said, "Your stupid armadillos are up here," and they said, "We don't have 'em anymore."

- Whoa, so see, now, what we are doing, what is happening is, the armadillos don't love cold weather.

They can't hibernate.

So they slow down in cold weather, but they don't like it.

And because it's getting warmer and warmer, armadillos are here now.

So you know, we are just creating right conditions for them which is going to have negative effect on farmers.

And I don't want that to happen.

- Not a fan, not a fan.

Anant I've done a horrible job of getting through your list, so I think we're gonna have to do another show with you.

- I would love to come back here and talk to you.

- I say we're gonna do it right now.

- Let's do that.

- Before this one ends though, is there a way people can find you?

Internet, social media, any of that?

- So you can, people can email me on adeshwal@fsmail.bradley.edu.

And I'll be more than happy to respond on that.

I'm not on Instagram or Twitter.

- TikTok?

- No.

- Oh, okay.

- I haven't tried them, honestly.

I have once opened an Instagram account, but then I forgot my password, and so just never went to it.

I'm on Facebook, so if you search my name- - And you're teaching children.

(laughing) This reminds me of the XM show, remember?

I didn't tell you we were going off air enough, and you're sitting there spelling out your email.

And they cut us off, oh my gosh, okay.

- So that's why I didn't spell it out this time.

(laughing) - But yes people have to come back next week because literally I didn't even get through half the stuff.

But we got to look at a snake.

See we can't do that the next episode because we'll spend half the time on the snake.

But he's gonna be, for all the people worried, he's gonna be let go and he is going to go eat an armadillo this afternoon.

- Oh that would be brilliant.

- Maybe a small one.

- Small one, yeah.

- So they have the little lumps.

(laughing) You know what you're doing right now would terrify a big percentage of the population?

- Is?

- Holding a snake.

- Yeah, my mom's not a fan of me holding snakes.

She was super excited when she found out that I'm doing my PhD on birds.

And so she calls my friend, a friend of mine, and she's like, "You know Anant's doing a PhD on birds?

"He's moved over here from snakes and crocodiles."

- That, we're gonna talk about that, yes, so tune in next week.

Anant Deshwal, thank you so very much for being here.

Everybody, we'll catch a second part next week.