(dramatic beat plays) (upbeat music plays) - Welcome to "At Issue".

I'm H Wayne Wilson.

Thank you as always for joining us on the program.

There has been some progress recently in Springfield with legislation affecting the African-American community.

But it affects more than the African-American community.

So we're going to talk about legislation that crosses all of ethnic diversity but we also are going to talk about some history and most notably, I want to talk about the civil rights act but not that civil rights act, the civil rights act of 1875.

Yes, there was one.

And we're gonna talk about that a little bit later in the program but first let me introduce to you, pastor Marvin Hightower.

Pastor is the NAACP Peoria branch president.

Thank you for joining us, Pastor.

- Thank you for having me.

- [Wayne] Senator Dave Kaylor is here.

Senator as always, it's good to have you.

- Thank you.

- [Wayne] He is a Democrat representing the 46 district, excuse me.

And resides in Peoria.

And then over in McLean County, Arthur and Camille Taylor.

Arthur is a member of the Bloomington public safety and community relations board.

Arthur, thank you for being with us.

- Thank you for having me.

- And also with us, his wife, Camille Taylor Camille is co-chair of Not in our town steering committee and also Not in our schools' education committee.

- Thank you, Camille.

- Happy to be here with you today.

- And let me start with that legislation that I referred to, Senator, we call it the four pillars.

It was put forth by the black caucus in Springfield.

In brief, can you describe the four pillars and what it means for the future?

- Well, the four pillars really came about, I mean these ideas have been floating around for quite some time but I think the George Floyd incident this summer kind of galvanized things.

And so there was a feeling really amongst the whole legislature that something needed to be done to address that situation.

And so the Illinois legislative black caucus came together under the direction of a Senator leader, Kimberly Lightford and developed four pillars address criminal justice reform, education, healthcare and economic opportunity.

And you're right in describing that, it's not just you know, that we're trying to make things fair for African-Americans, but really anybody in society.

Making sure that there are not racial barriers or bias or ethnic barriers to somebody having a good education, having an economic opportunity, having their rights maintained if they're in the criminal justice system and making sure that they have adequate healthcare.

Certainly right now with the pandemic going on, we can see that there are disparities in black and brown communities throughout the state.

Disparities in terms of how the communities have been affected by this pandemic.

And we need to correct that.

- And none of these bills, in fact, one hasn't even passed yet, but the ones that have passed, they have not been signed by the governor yet.

- They've not been signed yet.

- [Wayne] Do you have an indication as to how he will treat those?

- I'm guessing within the next month.

He's got 60 days when it's passed over to him from either chamber, from the Senate or the House.

He's got 60 days to take action.

If he takes no action, it automatically goes into effect.

He can veto it or he can amendatory veto or he can sign it.

I'm guessing he's gonna sign all of these.

And yes, you're right.

The healthcare bill was sent to the house, it was not called, just ran out of time.

And so that'll be reintroduced this legislative session.

- Arthur and Camille, what does it mean from your perspective to have legislation like this?

I mean, this is why the legislation have this move forward.

- Well as an educator or a retired educator, 35 years in the public schools, a lot of the reforms, a lot of the things that are being included in this education pillar.

Things that I personally was fighting for for years when I was an educator And the developmental education reform act is of special interest to me.

Last 12 years were spent as a high school guidance counselor and I watched too many students leave high school and go to our community colleges and get bogged down in the quagmire of these developmental learning courses and never completed their two year education because they could not get to the credit courses.

Developmental courses do not earn community college credit.

And you take these based on your entrance exam to the community college.

If your score is too low, you have to take these quote transition type courses.

And by the time the student would take those for two or three semesters, maybe even four semesters, they got discouraged, gave up and never went on to complete their two-year community college career.

With this new act, they're looking at different ways that people can go into a community college and be able to be successful at the college credit courses by doing things even in high school were transitional courses or using their standardized scores from high school, things of that nature.

So I'm glad to see they're addressing this.

- And Arthur?

- I'm just happy to see that priorities that particularly those that the black caucus have brought forward, which have kind of laid dormant within the state legislative system.

Have been brought to the foresight to the forefront as far as priorities for the upcoming general assembly and getting these things on governor Pritzker's desk.

And the idea for me is that rising water raises all boats.

So those initiatives that are brought forward by the Illinois black caucus, which some people may think are the agenda of the the black caucus.

They're very good for all the citizens of the state of Illinois in that a focus will be placed on inequities that have prevented the rising of different segments of the community and will eventually help all segments of the community.

So I'm pleased to see that these things are being placed at a higher level of priority at the state legislative area.

And that governor Pritzker is pretty positive and progressive in his attitude toward getting these things accomplished.

So I'm pleased at where we are right now.

- And I wanna add that it's not just legislation and bills that hopefully will be signed by the governor that will affect across the board citizens of Illinois, but there have been role model examples, Senator.

We have Kamala Harris of course is vice-president.

- Yes.

- [Wayne] But Chris Welch is speaker of the house in Springfield and then actually three new African-American senators.

- Yes, yes.

There are three new senators, Senator Turner from Springfield, Senator Simmons from the Northern Chicago area and Senator Johnson from up in Waukegan area.

And they've all replaced white senators.

That makes the black caucus stronger.

I welcome them.

And I think there'll be a good addition to the Senate.

- And pastor, that that's important.

The role model situation that I mentioned.

That it's not just a piece of paper that passes Springfield but they're actually role models that with the speaker of the house, the new senators, et cetera.

- Oh yes, no doubt.

Diversity has to be a priority.

And it seems as Illinois is leaning into that direction.

And also wanna go back to the four pillars and that discussion being spurred from George Floyd.

The one thing that has been pointed out was because of the pandemic and when the George Floyd incident happened as well as the Brianna Taylor, people were concentrated on that more than two weeks, because it's usually a couple of weeks period, then the things die down.

But this had a sustained movement not just in this country, but around the world which put focus on those four pillars.

And I'm glad that Illinois has decided to take the lead and focus on those pillars.

- [Wayne] Let me turn to the Taylors again and ask if you have any concerns about the "Black Lives Matter" movement, in terms of it gains some momentum this past summer, after the killing of George Floyd.

And there was a lot of discussion about black lives and black lives do matter.

Are you concerned that we might be losing some momentum, some initiative there?

- I'm not so concerned about losing momentum because it was Reverend Hightower just mentioned the "Black Lives Matter" movement of the summer placed focus not only locally, statewide level, but nationally and around the world.

Still a lot of that momentum is being brought forward by the four pillars that we're discussing today.

As well as the agenda that president Biden has brought forward to to the national agenda for racial equity and healthcare and things like that.

That are part of the "Black Lives Matter" initiative.

That is not monolithic.

It's part of a general wide agenda that can be brought forward.

- And my only concern.

One of my main concerns would be that the "Black Lives Matter" movement is not being misperceived, twisted into something that they're not as we witnessed on January 6.

The difference between how those insurrectionists and seditionists were treated compared to the "Black Lives Matter" protesters during the summer.

It became apparent that when "Black Lives Matter" people speak up and speak out, they are seen in a different way than when others protest.

So what my main concern is that as the "Black Lives Matter" movement goes forward, that people continue to actually listen to what they're saying, what their concerns are.

So that agenda is not seen as something that is so radical that is not accepted as something that's actually long overdue in many aspects of our society.

- [Wayne] Senator, and I'll get to you just a moment, Pastor but I wanted to follow up something right now in terms of the "Black Lives Matter".

Has there been a sense in the Senate in Springfield that "Black Lives Matter" has changed the atmosphere the way you approach legislation?

- Well, I think the focus yes, has been more intense and more intentional.

These issues have been around for quite some time but they were finally really a focal point for the summer for us to say, "Let's not just talk about this," "You know, again, let's do something."

And I think what's important here is to understand the real change effort that's going on here.

And that is how do we make this society, our nation more inclusive and really mean it?

And we all point to the constitution and say that, you know, it presents opportunity for all.

But we've got to really make sure that those are not just words, but our actions.

And so I think that's the focus here is that, you know, let's see what we can do to become really inclusive and mean it.

- [Wayne] And I didn't mean to delay your response, Pastor.

- Oh, no problem.

And it actually supported what he's just said.

"Black Lives Matter" is more than a movement or an organization.

It's about really black lives mattering.

And that's what the "Black Lives Matter" movement is all about.

That black lives do matter.

And legislation must match that sentiment other than saying a slogan or writing it on a poster board or even just a saying it about an organization.

Black lives actually matter.

And that has to be supported with legislation.

- So we've made some progress.

The four pillars that the Senator explained, we have a new African-American speaker of the Illinois House, Kamala Harris is the vice president, et cetera.

Where are we short?

What do we need to approach next?

- Well, we have got to continue in that vein, but it's not only in the government that African-Americans have ascended.

All throughout society, over this past year, there have been major gains for African-Americans having opportunities in leadership positions, CEO positions, on board positions.

And even yesterday in the Super Bowl, Tampa Bay has three, one assistant coach and office of coordinator and a defensive coordinator that is African-American.

So there have been other gains made simply because of everything that's going on in this country over this last four years.

Now, I will say that I definitely was not a big fan of the last four years, but what the last four years has done was put a spotlight where the spotlight needed to be along with COVID.

- And I might point out, it's black history month.

So we've been talking about African-American issues in particular, but it does affect everybody.

And the first female line referee in Super Bowl history was in yesterday's game or as we tape this yesterday's game.

Now, what's the biggest step we need to take, Pastor?

- [Marvin] Well, the first step of course, is sign the John Lewis voting rights act.

That has to be done this first part of this administration because of everything that we've just witnessed with the insurrection and Charles Johnson said this about an insurrection.

An insurrection is merely a failed revolution.

So we have to do something (Dave laughs) to bolster up the voting rights act.

It has to be done, or else voter suppression which we've seen in the news already.

States are doing it, trying to suppress the votes.

So we have to have the voting rights act signed.

- Arthur, do you share that opinion with the voting rights act?

- I absolutely do.

Reverend Hightower is on the mark.

The John Lewis voting rights act is essential for the ending of voter suppression.

And as we've just seen in the last national election, that effort to suppress the vote, particularly in areas of high concentration of people of color voting.

Particularly in Georgia and Philadelphia and Detroit and all of these efforts to suppress those votes would be eliminated with a federal law or federal act, the John Lewis act, to basically ensure the right to vote to every American.

- [Wayne] Camille, I know you can put a number on the number of bills that have been introduced.

- What I recently read was 110 bills have already been filed in about 15 States.

And those States are Republican-controlled legislatures.

So if those 110 bills are passed by Republican-controlled legislatures in those States, that's 110 bills that will erode the rights of the citizens for voting in those 15 States and set us even further back than we were before.

So that's why the national voting rights act has to be passed.

Something has to be done to fight against what's happening on the state level.

- [Wayne] I wanna talk about voting rights.

We just went through the last several months, accusations of voter fraud, manipulation of votes, et cetera.

And I wanna reflect back to the 1800s.

There was a Congressman from South Carolina by the name of Rainey, Joseph Rainey.

The first African-American elected to the United States Congress.

And he ran several times, was elected several times.

And then in 1878, if I recall, he lost the election because of what were called tissue ballots.

Tissue ballots.

Thin ballots were inserted inside the paper ballots that were used back then.

And they were votes for his opponent.

Can you reflect a little bit on the reconstruction era and why it was important to have the African-Americans elected to Congress?

And then all of a sudden they all were defeated?

- Well, whenever there's a step forward, there's always a backlash.

Especially when it comes to African-Americans, whenever there's a step forward in our country, there's always a perceived backlash.

For instance, when president Obama was elected, we didn't know at the time what the backlash would be but obviously the last president that we had was a backlash to a gain that had been made.

So it's not surprising.

It may be shocking.

It's not surprising because it always happens.

Jim Crow, it morphed into James Crow, Esquire.

Things of that nature.

There's always a backlash to gains made especially in particular in the African-American community.

- Senator, I wanna talk a little bit about the civil rights act.

And I will say this upfront, none of us are experts on the civil rights act.

(indistinct) Not that one, 1875 civil rights act.

And I was, to be honest, I knew it existed, but I didn't know much about it.

And eventually, the guts of it were eliminated.

- [Dave] Yeah.

Well, I think there was, as pastor Hightower said, there was a reaction.

I mean not only was Congressman Rainey elected as the first African-American.

There were 15 African-American Congress people from the South.

Five from South Carolina.

They were all Republicans.

They were all Republicans.

And this was just, you know, the circumstance at the time.

The Democrats were supporting slavery, were supporting keeping the votes within white power.

And the Republicans had, you know, black elected officials.

And finally that caught up.

And when the reconstruction took place that was all eliminated.

And, you know, we were set back quite a bit.

But it's interesting how that has kind of turned and, and flip-flopped.

I mean, we've gone through these several eras in our history but I wanna go back to what the point of all this is.

The point of all of it is that the constitution lays out that all men and women are created equal and that this becomes our bill of rights for people to be able to, you know achieve whatever they can achieve.

See, I think this country is stronger as a nation and our communities are stronger when we have everybody working together.

Black and white and Brown whether you be of one religion or another.

I mean, it's that diversity that becomes our strength.

It becomes our strength and we all have a singular focal point and that is to have a decent and justice system.

And that's where we're trying to get to.

- [Wayne] I wanna open the conversation and continue that train of thought that the Senator started with Camille first, if you would, please.

- When I read about the civil rights act of 1875 and what happened with Congressman Reiny.

The thing that struck me most was the things that were going on in the background to undermine the black congressmen.

To make them look like they were less than.

And everything that could possibly be done was done to pull the rug out from under them, even as far as the deal that president Rutherford Hayes made with the South, in terms of a trade, that if he were to be president, then he would help them or allow reconstruction to- The federal troops will be pulled out.

There'll be no more protection for the black citizens against the terrorist groups.

And consequently, the white supremacist group would prevail.

I also saw that he had his own misinformation campaign similar to what we see going on today where he maligned the black people at the time saying that they cared more about having power or just they were too lazy to want to work towards their freedom or work towards being part of this democratic society.

When in fact, congressmen like Joseph Rainey and Hiram Revels and the others were tirelessly working to try to get equity for the black citizens post civil war and their story was- It was taken away, basically, it disappeared into history because the history books don't reflect accurately what they actually did.

It just says that reconstruction happened.

And these people, these black people that had a little bit of power for a short amount of time, they went away and the country moved on.

It doesn't accurately reflect what they were trying to do and how they were undermined by the white supremacists that were against them at the time and afraid of equity by black people.

- And I wanna point out, you mentioned Hiram Revels.

I believe he was the only black Senator and the rest of those were a Congressmen.

- That's correct.

- And Pastor, could you continue the conversation for us, please?

- Well, sure.

It's amazing how even back then a wrong was trying to be righted and then all of a sudden the right, instead of it being righted, a wrong came back into play.

It was okay as long as black people or slaves were willing to do the work for free.

And then the South was okay with that.

But once the African-Americans or black people want their freedom, then to have a chance at what the constitution said that we should have, then there was always that backlash again.

So, I mean, I'm short on that, but I think it's always important to point out how the gains are always met with a backlash - [Wayne] And Arthur, if you could in about 30 seconds your final thoughts on this particular topic.

- It's about power share.

It was always about power sharing as it is now, as it was with the previous administration.

And even back during reconstruction, the white supremacist organizations of the democratic party were disinclined to power share with the newly freed slaves.

As people today are disinclined to power share with people of color and the rising generations of of new voters that ought to be included in our society as citizens of this country.

And it's about power sharing where one side wants more inclusivity and the other side wants a very strict exclusive club, if you will, with their power.

- [Wayne] And with that, we have run out of time.

I might point out that the Supreme court on an eight-one vote took key parts of that 1875 civil rights act and said no, this does not apply.

But that was in 1883.

It's a new age.

And we hope we can move forward, especially with the four pillars of legislation in Springfield.

Let me say thank you to Arthur and Camille Taylor over in Bloomington.

And to Senator Dave Kaylor and to pastor Hightower.

I appreciate the conversation.

We hope that you continue it there at home as well.

Next week, we'll be back with another edition of "At Issue" This time we're going to be talking about issues facing law enforcement.

Please join us to then.

(upbeat music plays) - Nope.