[♪♪] GOOD EVENING.

WELCOME TO KENTUCKY TONIGHT.

I'M RENEE SHAW.

THANKS FOR JOINING US.

TONIGHT, WE’RE DISCUSSING SCHOOL CHOICE AND EDUCATION ISSUES.

ADVOCATES OF SCHOOL CHOICE SAY PARENTS SHOULD HAVE OPTIONS FOR THEIR CHILDREN’S EDUCATION.

IN THE PAST, KENTUCKY’S REPUBLICAN-LED GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAS PASSED A “SCHOOL CHOICE” LAW SETTING UP A TAX-CREDIT SCHOLARSHIP PROGRAM FOR STUDENTS TO ATTEND PRIVATE SCHOOLS AND A MEASURE TO FUND CHARTER SCHOOLS WITH PUBLIC DOLLARS.

THE COURTS HAVE REJECTED THOSE LAWS.

SO, THIS YEAR, LAWMAKERS HAVE BEFORE THEM TWO PROPOSED CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS TO CONSIDER ADVANCING SO KENTUCKY VOTERS CAN DECIDE WHETHER TAX DOLLARS CAN BE USED TO SUPPORT NON-PUBLIC EDUCATION.

TO DISCUSS SCHOOL CHOICE• AND OTHER EDUCATION-RELATED MATTERS•.

WE ARE JOINED IN OUR LEXINGTON STUDIO BY: HEATHER LEMIRE, KENTUCKY STATE DIRECTOR OF AMERICANS FOR PROSPERITY; BRIGITTE BLOM, PRESIDENT & CEO OF THE PRICHARD COMMITTEE FOR ACADEMIC EXCELLENCE; JIM WATERS, PRESIDENT AND CEO OF THE BLUEGRASS INSTITUTE FOR PUBLIC POLICY SOLUTIONS; AND EDDIE CAMPBELL, PRESIDENT OF THE KENTUCKY EDUCATION ASSOCIATION.

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WELCOME TO OUR GUESTS.

WELCOME TO ALL OF OUR GUESTS THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE THIS EVENING.

I WANT TO BEGIN WITH THIS SIDE TO GIVE US THE PROS FOR WHY SCHOOL CHOICE AND WHY NOW AND DO YOU HAVE A PREFERENCE OVER WHICH ONE YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE ADVANCED OF THE TWO PROPOSED CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS AND WE COULD SEE MORE BECAUSE THE FILING DEADLINE IS NOT UNTIL THE LAST WEEK IN FEBRUARY.

>> WHEN IT COMES TO THE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT WE WANT CLEAR UNDERSTANDABLE LANGUAGE THAT REMOVES THE OBSTACLES TO ANY KIND OF CHOICE.

I THINK THAT IS THE POINT HERE.

IS THAT NO ONE-SIZE-FITS-ALL.

YOU KNOW SCHOOL CHOICE IS NOT FOR EVERY CHILD IN KENTUCKY BUT IT SHOULD BE AVAILABLE TO EVERY CHILD.

WHETHER IT IS A PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOL.

WHETHER IT IS A MICRO SCHOOL.

WHETHER IT'S HOME SCHOOLING.

WHETHER IT'S PRIVATE EDUCATION, A PAROCHIAL EDUCATION THE POINT IS TO REMOVE OBSTACLES THAT WILL GIVE OUR KIDS THE OPPORTUNITY TO SUCCEED IN THE FUTURE.

AND SO WE NEED A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT THAT DOES THAT.

WE DON'T NEED TO PASS A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT FOR ANY PARTICULAR TYPE OF SCHOOL CHOICE AT THIS POINT THAT IS THE WORK OF THE LEGISLATURE COULD COME BACK AND DO THAT.

>> Renee: SAY THAT AGAIN THE BILLS HOUSE BILL 208 AND HOUSE BILL 2 PROPOSED CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS IS THERE A DIFFERENCE OR DO THEY EMPOWER THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY TO ALLOW FOR THIS TO GO FORWARD AND ENABLING LEGISLATION AT A LATER TIME?

>> THERE'S WRITTENLES IN THE TWO BUT THEY ARE WORKING ON IT.

AND IT'S TIME TO GET THAT WORKED OUT.

AND THERE ARE DISCUSSIONS GOING ON AND RECOMMENDATIONS BEING MADE AND WE APPRECIATE ALL THE HELP WE'VE GOTTEN ON THAT.

I WOULD LIKE TO SAY, I DON'T THINK THE FOUNDERS OF OUR COMMONWEALTH INTENDED TO DENY EDUCATION FREEDOM BACK WHEN THEY WROTE THE CONSTITUTION BACK IN THE LATE 1800'S.

THIS AMENDMENT IS INTENDED TO CLARIFY THAT NOTHING IN THE CONSTITUTION PREVENTS LEGISLATORS FROM FUNDING A SCHOOL CHOICE PROGRAM.

>> Renee: THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US THIS IS YOUR FINAL TIME ON KEN "KENTUCKY TONIGHT".

ANYTHING ADDITIONAL?

>> I WOULD MIRROR WHAT HE SAID.

AMERICANS FOR PROSPERITY BELIEVES THAT THERE ARE SOLUTIONS TO THE EDUCATION PROBLEMS THAT WE'RE FACING.

AND THERE IS A LOT OF INNOVATIVE IDEAS THAT CAN COME FROM A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT SCHOOL INSTITUTIONS.

MANY OF THOSE WOULD BE A PUBLIC SCHOOL CHOICE FOR FAMILIES.

BUT THERE ARE OTHER CHOICES THAT WOULD BETTER MEET THE NEEDS OF A CHILD.

AND SO WE WANT FAMILIES TO BE ABLE TO MAKE THAT DECISION.

AND CHOOSE WHAT IS BEST FOR THEIR OWN CHILD.

>> Renee: Mr. CAMPBELL YOU HAVE BEEN PART OF THIS DISCUSSION FOR A WHILE.

WELCOME BACK.

THE BIG QUESTION THAT WE HEAR IS WHY NOT LET KENTUCKY VOTERS DECIDE?

WHAT IS WRONG WITH PUTTING IT BEFORE THEM?

ARE YOU AGAINST THAT IN PRINCIPLE?

>> SO I THINK THE CONSTITUTION ALLOWS FOR THAT.

WHEN WE LOOK AT SECTION 184 OF THE CONSTITUTION IT ALLOWS FOR A REFERENDUM.

THIS WE ALREADY HAVE SCHOOL CHOICE IN KENTUCKY A PARENT CAN DECIDE WHEREVER THEY WANT TO SEND THEIR STUDENT OR CHILD HOW THEY WANT THEIR CHILD EDUCATED.

THIS ISN'T ABOUT SCHOOL CHOICE IT'S ABOUT INITIATING VOUCHER PROGRAMS THAT TAKE PUBLIC TAX DOLLARS AND SEND THEM TO UNACCOUNTABLE PRIVATE ENTITIES.

AND WE HAVE SUCH APPRECIATE STATE HOUSE RESOURCES WITH OUR TAX DOLLARS.

THEY ARE THERE FOR THE COMMON GOOD.

THEY ARE THERE TO SUPPORT NOT ONLY OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS, BUT OTHER PUBLIC WORKS AND THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE SUPPORTING EVERYONE.

SO ALLOWING FOR OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS TO HAVE ACCESS TO THOSE DOLLARS IS VERY IMPORTANT.

>> Renee: SO Dr. BLOM, WHAT IS WRONG WITH MONEY FOLLOWING STUDENTS AND NOT FOLLOWING SYSTEMS?

>> YOU KNOW, IT'S BEEN MENTIONED TONIGHT THE ACHIEVEMENT ISSUES THAT WE HAVE IN KENTUCKY.

AND THAT'S UNDENIABLE.

WE HAVE ROOM TO IMPROVE WHEN IT COMES TO STUDENT OUTCOMES.

AND WITH LIMITED TAX DOLLARS THOSE TAX DOLLARS COME FROM EACH OF US AS TAX-PAYING CITIZENS WITH LIMITED DOLLARS WE SHOULD BE INVESTING THE DOLLARS AS WISELY AS POSSIBLE AND WE SHOULD BE PAYING ATTENTION TO THE RESEARCH THAT SHOWS STRATEGY SUGGEST STRATEGIES THAT ARE GOING TO BE RETURN THE MOST INVESTMENT FROM AN ACCOUNTABILITY STAND PILOT.

THERE IS NO RESEARCH TO DATE WHICH HE IT COMES TO PRIVATE SCHOOL CHOICE THAT SHOWS THAT THAT IS A BETTER STRATEGY WITH TAXPAYER DOLLARS THAN THE CURRENT STRATEGIES WE'RE UTILIZING AS A STATE.

WHEN IT COMES TO CHARTER SCHOOLS IT IS A DIFFERENT CONVERSATION.

AND I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT IF ANYBODY WALK AS WHAT ARE FROM THIS CONVERSATION THAT THEY UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE IN PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOLS AND PRIVATE SCHOOL CHOICE AND TRADITIONAL PUBLIC EDUCATION.

UNDERSTANDING THOSE THREE THINGS IS REALLY IMPORTANT FOR DECIDING THE STRATEGIES THAT A STATE SHOULD USE TO IMPROVE EDUCATION OUTCOMES THAT IS WHAT WE'RE PAYING INTO AS TAXPAYERS.

>> Renee: SUPPORTERS OF SCHOOL CHOICE MEASURES SAID THAT THE MAJORITY OF KENTUCKY KIDS WILL GO THROUGH THE TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM.

90% OR SO.

DO YOU DISAGREE WITH THAT?

>> ABSOLUTELY NOT.

REGARDLESS OF WHAT STRATEGIES THE LEGISLATURE DECIDES TO INVEST IN, THE VAST MAJORITY OF KENTUCKY'S ROUGHLY 650,000 STUDENTS WILL BE IN TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOLS AS WE KNOW THEM.

MAINTAINING ADEQUATE INVESTMENT IN PUBLIC EDUCATION IS A CRITICAL FIRST STEP TO ANYTHING ELSE WE MIGHT ADD TO THE SYSTEM.

WE WOULD ARGUE ANYTHING ELSE THAT GETS ADDED TO THE SYSTEM SHOULD BE GROUNDED IN RESEARCH THAT SUGGESTS TO THE INVESTOR IN THIS CASE THE TAXPAYER, THERE IS GOING TO BE AN ADEQUATE RETURN ON THAT.

>> Renee: YOU SAY THAT RESEARCH DOES NOT PROVE THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS?

>> DO DATE THERE IS NO UNBIASED RESEARCH IN THE AREA OF PRIVATE SCHOOL CHOICE THAT SUGGESTS INVESTING IN PRIVATE SCHOOLS WITH TAXPAYER DOLLARS WILL RETURN A BETTER OUTCOME THAN TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE.

>> Renee: BUT CHARTER SCHOOLS IS A DIFFERENT STORY.

>> IT IS A DIFFERENT STORY.

THERE WE HAVE RESEARCH META ANALYSIS THAT DO POINT TO CHARTER SCHOOLS HAVING A POSITIVE IMPACT STATISTICALLY SIGNIFICANT ABOVE TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOLS FOR SOME SETS OF STUDENTS IN SOME CIRCUMSTANCES.

AND THAT IS LARGELY IN URBAN AREAS FOR TRADITIONALLY MARGINALIZED STUDENTS WHERE CHARTERS CAN DELIVER A BETTER EDUCATION FOR THOSE STUDENTS THAN THE TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOL.

>> Renee: RESPOND TO WHAT SHE SAID THAT THE END WITH CHARTER SCHOOLS YIELDING POSITIVE RESULTS FOR DISADVANTAGED STUDENTS.

>> OUR PUBLIC STUDENTS OPEN THEIR DOOR TO ALL STUDENTS.

IT DOESN'T MATTER WHERE THEY COME FROM AND WHAT THEIR BACKGROUND IS.

MAKING SURE OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS HAVE ALL THE OPPORTUNITIES TO GIVE TO STUDENTS IS IMPORTANT.

SO WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE'RE FUNDING.

THE BETTER QUESTION WE NEEDING TO ASKING IS WE HAVE A SURPLUS IN THE BUDGET WHY ARE WE NOT INVESTING IN OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL OF OUR STUDENTS NO MATTER WHERE THEY ARE LOCATED WHETHER IT'S URBAN OR RURAL HAVE THE SAME OPPORTUNITIES.

WE SAW WHEN CARA PASSED IN THE EARLY 90s THAT INVESTMENT IN OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS, EDUCATION ACCOUNTABILITY IN THE STATE ROSE KENTUCKY WENT FROM THE BOTTOM TO THE MIDDLE AND WAS GROWING AND KENTUCKY WAS A LIGHTHOUSE IN THE SNAKES ON WHAT TO DO RIGHT WHEN YOU INVEST IN YOUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

RIGHT NOW WE HAVE RECORD REVENUE THAT IS COME INTO THE STATE AND WE SHOULD BE INVESTING IN THOSE SCHOOLS.

RIGHT NOW THE SEEK FUNDING IS 29% BEHIND WHERE IT SHOULD BE WHEN YOU ADJUST FOR INFLATION.

OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE NOT IMMUNE TO INFLATION.

THINGS GO UP.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE PUTTING THE MONEY AND THOSE DOLLARS IN THE PUBLIC SCHOOLS SO WE CAN OFFER ALL OF THOSE OPPORTUNITIES FOR STUDENTS NO MATTER WHERE THEY COME FROM.

>> Renee: PROPOSED BY HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUTS IT AT 4800.

WHAT IS THE BETTER NUMBER PER STUDENT?

WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT FUNDING WHICH IS SEEK.

>> IF IT KEPT UP WITH INFLATION FROM 2008 IT SHOULD BE AROUND 5500 RIGHT NOW.

AND THAT'S A MAJOR JUMP FROM WHAT IS BEING PROPOSED.

CAN YOU IMAGINE WHAT OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS COULD DO HOW THEY COULD PROVIDE OPPORTUNITIES WITH A THOUSAND DOLLARS EXTRA PER STUDENT AS REVENUE FOR THAT DISTRICT TO PROVIDE SMALLER CLASS SIZES TO PROVIDE TUTORING PROVIDE OTHER OPPORTUNITIES THAT STUDENTS DON'T HAVE RIGHT NOW.

>> Renee: SO Mr.

WATERS DOES MORE MONEY MEAN BETTER ACADEMIC OUTCOMES.

>> I WANT TO SEE THE EVIDENCE WHERE SPENDING MORE AUTOMATICALLY MEANS A BETTER EDUCATION SYSTEM.

WE HAVE INCREASED SPENDING SINCE CARA PASSED IN 1990 WAS IMPLEMENTED IN 1990 PER PUPIL FUNDING IN KENTUCKY HAS RISEN BY 122%.

Mr. CAMPBELL TALKS ABOUT THE SEEK FUNDING AND THAT IS ONE OF THE STREAMS.

WE HAVE SEVERAL STREAMS OF REVENUE THAT COME IN FOR EACH STUDENT IN OUR PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM.

FEDERAL DOLLARS, LOCAL PROPERTY TAX DOLLARS.

OTHER DOLLARS THAT COME IN.

REALLY AN HONEST DISCUSSION ABOUT THIS LOOKS AT THE OVERALL FUNDING THAT SCHOOLS HAVE GOTTEN.

IF YOU LOOK AT THAT, EXCEPT FOR THE GREAT RECESSION PERIOD THERE 2008-2013 THAT PURCHASE PUPIL -- PER PUPIL FUNDING INCREASED.

IF YOU TAKE INFLATION IN 1990 WE WERE SPENDING 7800.

TODAY IT'S 17,000 PER STUDENT.

BUT I'D LIKE TO -- THERE IS A LOT TO TALK ABOUT WHEN I AGREE WITH Mr. CAMPBELL ON SOMETHING HE SAID WE HAVE SCHOOL CHOICE IN KENTUCKY AND WE DO.

WE DO IF YOU'RE WEALTHY AND ABLE TO WRITE A CHECK TO A PRIVATE SCHOOL, COVER THE TUITION.

YOU HAVE CHOICE.

IF YOU ARE ABLE TO UP AND MOVE TO A SCHOOL DISTRICT THAT IS BETTER FOR YOUR CHILD YOU HAVE CHOICE.

BUT IF YOU ARE NOT ABLE TO DO THAT THE QUESTION I'D LIKE TO ASK HERE AND THIS QUESTION IS OFTEN DUCKED AND NOT ANSWERED AND AVOIDED, SHOULD A CHILD WHOSE FUTURE CAN ABSOLUTELY BE CHANGED FOR THE BETTER IF THEY WERE IN A SCHOOL THAT WORKS BETTER FOR THEM SHOULD THEY BE DENIED THAT OPPORTUNITY SIMPLY BECAUSE THEIR PARENTS CAN'T WRITE THAT CHECK OR CAN'T MOVE TO A BETTER SCHOOL DISTRICT?

>> I THINK WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL THERE THERE IS A BIT OF A MISNOMER.

PARENTS ARE NOT DENIED AN OPPORTUNITY TO ATTEND PRIVATE SCHOOLS BECAUSE WE CURRENTLY HAVE MANY SCHOLARSHIP FUNDS IN THE STATE THAT DONORS DONATE TO.

TO ALLOW STUDENTS TO BE SCHOLARSHIPPED INTO PRIVATE EDUCATION IF FAMILIES KNTS' AFFORD IT.

>> LET'S ALLOW ONE MORE.

>> AND ONE MORE, THE LEGISLATION THAT HAS BEEN PROPOSED IN THE PAST THAT THAT ONE MORE IS ACTUALLY A TAX CREDIT WHICH RETURNS THE MOST RECENT LEGISLATION UP TO 90 CHENS ON THE DOLLAR TO THE DONOR.

SO THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS PARENTS CAN ACCESS ALTERNATIVES TO PUBLIC EDUCATION IF THEY CHOOSE TO.

AND THERE ARE GENEROUS DONORS IN THE STATE WHO ALLOW FOR STUDENTS TO ATTEND CATHOLIC SCHOOLS, PAROCHIAL SCHOOLS OTHER PUBLIC INSTITUTIONS WITH THOSE SCHOLARSHIP DOLLARS.

IT'S IMPORTANT FOR AS THIS GOES TO THE VOTERS LATER IN THE YEAR, AND THE VOTERS WILL DECIDE IF THERE IS PUBLIC WILL TO MOVE IN THIS DIRECTION.

THEY NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCES IN THESE THINGS LIKE TAX CREDITS AND DEDUCTIONS FOR DONATIONS AND SCHOLARSHIP FUNDS.

>> AND GET RID OF THE MISNOMERS.

>> THE MISNOMER WE NEED TO GET RID OF THAT WE NEED TO PUT THE NEEDS OF STUDENTS FIRST OVER THE SYSTEM.

LET THE SYSTEM RESPOND TO THE STUDENTS.

LET THEM.

WE'VE GOT 35,45 STATES THAT HAVE CHARTER SCHOOLS NOW WHICH YOU ARE RIGHT THERE IS A DIFFERENCE PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOL BECAUSE OF THE DATA WE CAN GET FROM PUBLIC EDUCATION WE KNOW HOW THEY ARE PERFORMING AND THEY ARE REALLY THE ONLY KIND OF EDUCATION IN SOME PLACES THAT HAS CLOSED THE GAP BETWEEN BLACK AND WHITE STUDENTS.

WE DES FRATLY NEED THAT IN OUR URBAN AREAS.

BUT THE MISNOMER THAT WE DON'T NEED TO SUPPORT FAMILIES THAT CAN'T AFFORD OR CAN'T MAKE THAT JUMP I THINK THAT IS A MISNOMER.

MOST KENTUCKIANS WOULD AGREE IF SOMEBODY NEEDS HELP IN SENDING THEIR CHILD TO A SCHOOL THAT WORKS BETTER FOR THEM WE SHOULD DO THAT.

>> JIM ON THE POINT ABOUT CHARTERS ARE THE ONLY SCHOOLS THAT CLOSED ACHIEVEMENT GAPS.

>> THE ONLY PROGRAMS.

>> WE HAVE EXAMPLES RIGHT HERE IN KENTUCKY OF SCHOOLS THAT HAVE CLOSED ACHIEVEMENT GAPS AND NARROWED THEM SIGNIFICANTLY.

ONE IS YEARS AGO WHEN WE REPORTED ON SOUTH HEIGHTS ELEMENTARY IN HENDERSON, KENTUCKY.

WHERE THE MATH AND THE READING PERFORMANCE OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN STUDENTS IN THAT ELEMENTARY SCHOOL WAS TWICE THE NATIONAL AVERAGE.

I'M SORRY TWICE THE STATE AVERAGE.

AND WE LOOKED INTO -- >> Renee: WHAT WERE THEY DOING DIFFERENTLY THAT CAUSED THAT SUCCESS?

>> WHEN WE TALK ABOUT INVESTING DOLLARS WE HAVE TO BE REALLY INTENTIONAL WHAT WE'RE INVESTING IN.

WHAT THE RESEARCH SHOWS WORKS IS ENSURING THAT ALL OF OUR YOUNG PEOPLE HAVE ACCESS TO THE HEALTH AND MENTAL HEALTH AND PHYSICAL HEALTH SERVICES THAT THEY NEED TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN THE CLASSROOM.

THAT THEY HAVE EXTENDED LEARNING TIME.

THAT IS BOTH AFTER SCHOOL AND IN THE SUMMER MONTHS.

YOU THINK ABOUT HIGHER WEALTH FAMILIES THEY HAVE THOSE SORTS OF THINGS THEY ARE ABLE TO PROVIDE FOR THEIR YOUNG PEOPLE ON THEIR OWN N A STATE THAT IS SIXTH IN POVERTY, MANY KENTUCKY FAMILIES ARE NOT ABLE TO PROVIDE EXTENDED LEARNING SERVICES, ARE NOT ABLE TO PROVIDE ADEQUATE HEALTH SERVICES.

>> Renee: THE SCHOOL IN HENDERSON DOING THOSE THINGS?

>> INVESTING IN THAT IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD AROUND THE SCHOOL TO MAKE SURE ALL KIDS COMING TO SCHOOL READY THEY WERE IN AN ENVIRONMENT THAT HONORED THE BACKGROUND THEY WERE COMING FROM AND THOSE STUDENTS PERFORMED AT HIGHER LEVELS.

>> Renee: HOW DID THEY AFFORD THAT?

>> THEY INVESTED THE DOLLARS IN THAT DISTRICT AND IN THAT SCHOOL IN A WAY THAT HONORED THAT APPROACH.

SO WE NEED TO START GETTING MODELS LIKE THIS OUT INTO THE STATE AND HAVE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT MODELS LIKE THIS.

>> Renee: WHEN WAS THAT?

THE SEEK MONEY WOULD HAVE BEEN LOWER AT THAT TIME.

THAT DISTRICT MADE IT WORK WHAT WAS GIVEN FROM THE STATE.

>> ANOTHER IMPORTANT WAY THAT IT'S IMPORTANT FOR FOLKS TO UNDERSTAND HOW THIS WORKS IS BRINGING COMMUNITY RESOURCES TO THE TABLE.

SO THOSE THAT ARE ARGUING FOR SCHOOL CHOICE ARE ARGUING AGAINST SCHOOL CHOICE WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE ARE WE THINKING ABOUT THE SYSTEM REALLY IN A COMPREHENSIVE WAY?

BECAUSE IT'S NOT JUST OUR TRADITIONAL SCHOOL AND THE SCHOOLHOUSE AND THE SCHOOL DISTRICT.

OUR SCHOOL DISTRICTS NEED TO WELCOME THE COMMUNITY TO THE TABLE AND THE COMMUNITY NEEDS TO BE WILLING TO COME TO THE TABLE ROLL UP ITS SLEEVES AND SAY WHAT ARE ALL THE ASSETS WE HAVE IN THIS COMMUNITY IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD IN OUR COMMUNITY AT LARGE AND HOW ARE WE GOING TO BRING ALL THAT TO BEAR FOR THE STUDENTS AND FAMILIES IN OUR COMMUNITY TO ENSURE THEY SUCCEED.

>> Renee: THAT IS A LOFT GOAL.

WHAT DOES IT LOOK LIKE OPERATIONALLY?

WHAT DOES A COMMUNITY DO TO OPERATIONALIZE?

>> THERE ARE THINGS LIKE WE COULD LOOK AT HOW DO WE COLLOCATE HEALTH SERVICES IN A SCHOOL THAT NEEDS IT.

LET'S THINK ABOUT THE WEST END OF LOUISVILLE.

DEEPLY URBAN AREA.

HIGH POVERTY, MANY NEEDS.

LET'S THINK ABOUT COLLOCATING THE HEALTH SERVICES THAT THOSE STUDENTS AND FAMILIES NEED RIGHT THERE IN THE MAYBE EVEN IN THE SCHOOL PROPERTY ITSELF AND ALLOW THE COMMUNITY, ALLOW THE MEDICAL COMMUNITY, THE ON TOMORROWRY COMMUNITY TO BRING THOSE SERVICES TO BEAR FOR THOSE STUDENTS.

SO THAT THE COMMUNITY CAN TAKE CARE OF THE NEEDS OF STUDENTS THAT THEREFORE ALLOWING THE SPACE FOR HIGH QUALITY TEACHING AND LEARNING TO TAKE HOLD.

AND HONORING THE PROFESSION THAT OUR TEACHERS ARE IN ALLOW THEM TO DO THE JOB THEY HAVE BEEN TRAINED TO DO WHILE THE COMMUNITY AND ASSETS ALL THE FOLKS WHO WANT THE DIFFERENT SCHEMES CAN SAY WE'RE GOING TO ROLL UP OUR SLEEVES AND HELP WITH THE THINGS THAT KEEP KIDS FROM LEARNING.

>> Renee: THE WHOLE CHILD SUPPORTS.

>> THE WHOLE CHILD SUPPORT AND IT'S COMMUNITY SCHOOLS.

YOU KNOW, AND OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE POISED TO BE PARTNERS WITH THEIR COMMUNITIES THEY WANT TO BE PARTNERS.

IF YOU DRIVE BY MY SCHOOL RIGHT NOW, ALL THE DISTRICT TOURNAMENTS ARE GOING ON.

YOU WILL DRIVE BY A SCHOOL THE PARKING LOT WILL BE PACKED THE COMMUNITY IS IN THERE SUPPORTING THEIR STUDENTS, SUPPORTING THEIR TEAMS.

IT IS A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO REACH OUT TO THE COMMUNITY AND SAY, HEY WE WANT TO PARTNER WITH YOU TO MAKE SURE WE'RE MEETING ALL THE NEEDS THE WHOLE CHILD WHETHER IT BE MEDICAL SERVICE, DEPOSIT TALL, VISION, AND KENTUCKY HAS SET THAT UP THROUGH OUR FRISKY CENTERS AND THOSE LAID THE FOUNDATION TO MAKE THOSE COMMUNITY PARTNERSHIPS HAPPEN.

SO, AGAIN, INVESTING IN OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS TAKING THIS OPPORTUNITY WE HAVE RIGHT NOW TO LIFT UP EVERY SINGLE PUBLIC SCHOOL ACROSS THE COMMONWEALTH.

GIVES EVERY STUDENT IN THE COMMONWEALTH THAT OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE A HIGH QUALITY EDUCATION.

AND NOT ALL STUDENTS HAVE OPTIONS.

I GREW UP IN LESLIE COUNTY THERE IS NO PRIVATE SCHOOL THERE.

AND FUNDING THAT WOULD GO AWAY FROM IN THE STATE AS STUDENTS TAKE THE ADVANTAGE OF THESE VOUCHER SCHEMES, LOWERS THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT WILL BE SUPPORTING THOSE RURAL SCHOOLS.

>> I JUST WANT TO BRING THE POINT THAT THIS IS OVERWHELMINGLY SUPPORTED BY FAMILIES IN KENTUCKY.

WE ARE A GRASSROOTS ORGANIZATION.

WE HAVE TALKED TO OVER 200,000 PEOPLE AT DOORS SINCE MAY ABOUT THIS ISSUE.

AND WE ARE FINDING THAT OVER 70% OF THE PEOPLE THAT WE HAVE TALKED TO AT DOORS AND HAVE LONG CONVERSATIONS WITH ABOUT THEIR THE BIGGEST ISSUES THAT ARE FACING THEM THIS WAS ONE OF THE TOP ISSUES FOR THEM.

AND -- >> Renee: DID YOU ASK THEM POINT-BLANK SHOULD STATE DOLLARS BE DIVERTED TO PRIVATE SCHOOLS AND THEY SAID YES.

70%.

>> YES.

THEY WANT CHOICES FOR THEIR CHILDREN.

AND I THINK WE SAW A MAJOR INCREASE IN SCHOOL CHOICE LAWS PASSED ACROSS THE COUNTRY AFTER COVID.

BECAUSE PARENTS WERE JUST DISILLUSIONED WITH THEIR CHILDREN'S EDUCATION AND THEY WANTED OPPORTUNITIES TO PUT THEIR CHILD IN THE BEST EDUCATIONAL ENVIRONMENT FOR THEIR CHILD.

SO I THINK WE CAN'T IGNORE THIS IS SOMETHING THAT KENTUCKY FAMILIES WANT.

AND THAT THEY ARE ASKING FOR.

AND IT IS THE REASON IT'S PASSED IN 33 STATES ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

IT'S WHAT PARENTS WANT.

>> Renee: SO THIS COMMENT QUESTION QUOTE KENTUCKY STRUGGLES TO HAVE EQUITABLE AND WELL FUNDED EDUCATION WITHOUT FUNDS BEING DIVERTED TO PRIVATE INSTITUTIONS.

HOW CAN KENTUCKIANS TRUST THE LEGISLATURE WITH OUR CHILDREN'S FUTURE.

DO YOU CARE TO RESPOND TO THAT?

>> SURE.

ACTUALLY THESE DOLLARS ARE FOR WHAT PURPOSE?

THEY ARE FOR THE PURPOSE OF EDUCATING STUDENTS.

AND THE SUPREME COURT RULED THAT IN THESE TYPES OF PROGRAMS, THAT THEY ARE CONSTITUTIONAL BECAUSE IT'S PARENTS DECIDING WHERE THE DOLLARS GO AND I THINK THAT IS A KEY IMPORTANT THING.

THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE IN VOUCHERS DIRECT VOUCHERS VERSUS A SCHOLARSHIP TAX CREDIT IS ON A SCHOLARSHIP IT'S PARENTS, FAMILIES THAT DECIDE WHERE THE DOLLARS GO.

AND.

>> Renee: THE SAME TYPE OF SCHEME.

WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN EDUCATION OPPORTUNITY AND A VOUCHER?

>> A VOUCHER IS MONEY DIRECTLY GIVEN TO A SCHOOL FOR A STUDENT.

WHEREAS A SCHOLARSHIP TAX CREDIT IS A DONATION LIKE Dr. BLOM SAID TO A THIRD PARTY NONPROFIT.

>> Renee: A TAX DEDUCTIBLE.

>> TAX DEDUCTIBLE DONATION THE NONPROFIT THEN HANDS THE DOLLARS OUT ACCORDING TO QUALIFIED STUDENTS.

AND WHERE THEY WANT TO GO TO SCHOOL.

MY QUESTION THOUGH I HAVE A QUESTION IS, WHY DOES THIS HAVE TO BE EITHER OR?

I'M FOR BOTH AND.

>> Renee: BOTH AND WHAT?

>> I WANT A GREAT PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEM REALLY THIS IS WE HAVE GREAT SCHOOLS WE HAVE GREAT TEACHERS.

WE HAVE AND ABOUT A THIRD OF OUR KIDS IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE GETTING A GREAT EDUCATION IN TERMS OF RESULTS.

ABOUT A THIRD ARE THERE BUT THEY ARE NOT GETTING THE RESULTS THAT WE NEED TO SEE AND ANOTHER THIRD ARE FALLING THROUGH THE CRACKS.

SO WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE EITHER OR?

IT CAN BE A WIN-WIN.

WE SEE IN FLORIDA FOR EXAMPLE, THE MORE CHOICES FLORIDA HAS HAD THEY HAVE THE MOST EDUCATIONAL OPTIONS IN THE COUNTRY.

AND GUESS WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO THE PUBLIC SCHOOL PERFORMANCE?

ESPECIALLY WE SEE WITH CHARTER SCHOOLS OUTPERFORMING MANY TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

SO THIS -- >> Renee: HAS IT IMPROVED THE TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOLS BECAUSE OF THE COMPETITION?

>> AND THEY ARE SPENDING LESS DOING IT.

SO TO YOUR POINT, I AGREE RESOURCES ARE PRECIOUS AND THEY NEED TO BE USED WISELY.

BUT FROM WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN OTHER STATES THIS IS NOT ABOUT DESTROYING PUBLIC EDUCATION THIS IS ABOUT IMPROVING IT.

AND I THINK WITH THAT MOTIVATION OF CHOICE AND COMPETITION, I THINK IT WILL CAUSE IMPROVEMENT IN OUR PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEM.

AND, LOOK, WE'VE GOT AREAS IN OUR STATE LIKE APPALACHIA THEY HAVE MADE PROGRESS IN SCHOOLS WITH READING PERFORMANCE.

POVERTY CAN'T BE -- POVERTY IS A REASON EVEN MORE OF A REASON TO GET THIS RIGHT.

BECAUSE WE HAVE A LOT OF KIDS WHO NEED US TO GET THIS RIGHT.

AND IN LOUISVILLE, WE'VE GOT A 30-50S OF OUR KIDS THAT THE CANNOT READ PROFICIENTLY IN OUR STATE.

LET'S NOT SUGAR COAT WHAT IS HAPPENING.

>> I WOULD ARGUE THERE THAT ABSOLUTELY, POVERTY SHOULD BE AN ARGUMENT FOR US TO MAKE WISE DECISIONS WITH PUBLIC DOLLARS.

IF WE ARE ALLOWING, RIGHT, LESS THAN IMPACTFUL POSITIVELY IMPACTFUL STRATEGIES TO BE PAID FOR WITH TAX DOLLARS, WE'RE ACTUALLY HURTING THE FAMILIES AND THE YOUNG PEOPLE IN OUR STATE AND HURTING OUR OUTLOOK FROM AN ECONOMIC COMPETITIVENESS STANDPOINT.

SO IF POVERTY IS THE ARGUMENT, IT BEHOOVES US TO MAKE EXCEPTIONALLY WISE DECISIONS WITH PUBLIC DOLLARS BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE DOLLARS TO WASTE.

>> AND WE'RE CAUSING OUR CHILDREN TO SUFFER IF WE DON'T TEACH THEM HOW TO READ AND IF WE DON'T TEACH THEM HOW TO DO MATH IF THEY ARE NOT PREPARED FOR THE JOBS WE ARE FAILING THEM IN THAT WAY.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

>> I'M ALL FOR THE MENTAL HEALTH PROGRAMS AND THE DENTAL AND ANYTHING WE CAN DO.

BUT IF WE DO ALL OF THAT AND WE DON'T EDUCATE OUR CHILDREN, I THINK THAT IS A REAL PROBLEM.

>> YOU WILL NEVER HEAR ME SAY WE DO ALL OF THAT AND WE DON'T EDUCATE.

>> THE EMPHASIS NEEDS TO BE ON THAT.

>> MAKING SURE AS THIS GOES TO AS WILL LIKELY BE A VOTE FOR A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT THIS YEAR IT IS SO IMPORTANT THAT VOTERS ARE INFORMED ON THESE ISSUES.

SO REALLY OWNING THE FACT THAT WE HAVE DROPPED FROM 8TH IN THE NATION IN FOURTH GRADE READING IN 2015 TO 29TH.

WE ARE GOING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION AS A STATE AND THAT IS UNDENIABLE.

WE'VE NEVER RANKED HIGHER THAN 33 IN THE NATION IN MATH AND WE'VE DROPPED TO 41.

DO WE HAVE PROBLEMS THAT NEED TO BE SOLVED?

ABSOLUTELY WE DO.

AND WE MUST SPEND THOSE DOLLARS WISELY.

>> Renee: SO DOES THAT ALSO MEAN IN INVESTING THE READ TO SUCCEED PROGRAM AND ADDRESS LITERACY AND NOW BILL WILL BE CONSIDERED ADDRESSING NUMERACY AND MATHEMATICS.

>> AND WHAT WE KNOW WORKS.

LET'S GO BACK TO THE RESEARCH AGAIN.

WE CAN TALK ABOUT PARENT CHOICE AND WE HAVE POLLING THAT TELLS US WHAT PARENTS WANT, TOO.

AND THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY 93% OF BOTH PARENTS AND VOTERS WANT KIDS TO BE ABLE TO READ, WRITE AND TO DO AATHYMIA PARTICULAR.

THEY WANT THEM TO THINK CRITICALLY AND SKILLS TO BE SUCCESSFUL.

WHAT WE KNOW WORKS IS INVESTING IN TEACHING AND ENSURING OUR TEACHERS HAVE THE TOOLS THEY NEED WHETHER THEY ARE IN PRIVATE SCHOOLS AND SUPPORTED BY TUITION OR THEY ARE IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS AND THEY ARE SUPPORTED BY TAX DOLLARS.

THOSE ARE THE THINGS THE STRATEGIES THAT WE NEED TO HE FOCUS ON.

>> Renee: THIS QUESTION FROM MARTIN RIVERS OF LEXINGTON IS IT TRUE THAT PUBLIC SCHOOLS RE8 A PLACE TO BRING TOGETHER CHILDREN OF ALL KINDS OF BACKGROUNDS, RELIGION, RACE, INCOME WOULD CHARTER SCHOOLS NOT EFFECTIVELY SEGREGATE ALONG MUTUAL TELL AXIS.

ISN'T HAVING CHILDREN INTERACT WITH DIFFERENT PEOPLE GOOD AND IMPORTANT FOR CIVIL SOCIETY?

YOU MENTIONED THIS EARLIER, Mr. CAMPBELL ABOUT HOW PUBLIC SCHOOLS TAKE IN ALL CHILDREN NO CHERRY PICKING.

IS IT YOUR CHILDREN THAT OTHER SCHOOLS WHO ARE ALLOWED A LITTLE BIT MORE LIBERTY IN THE TYPE AND QUALITY OF STUDENT THAT THEY CAN ACCEPT WOULD IT LEAD TO THE SEGREGATION THAT Mr. RIVERS ELUDES TO HERE?

>> I THINK HE IS RIGHT.

WHEN YOU HAVE THE -- THERE'S NO REQUIREMENTS PLACED ON PRIVATE SCHOOLS THAT THEY PROVIDE ANY KIND OF SERVICES.

THAT THEY PROVIDE SERVICES FOR STUDENTS WITH DISABILITIES.

THEY CAN PICK AND CHOOSE WHO THEY ALLOW TO COME INTO THEIR SCHOOL OR BE ACCEPTED.

>> Renee: SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO FOLLOW FEDERAL LAWS THAT PUBLIC SCHOOLS HAVE TO FOLLOW?

>> EXACTLY.

OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE VERY ACCOUNTABLE.

FOR THE PUBLIC DOLLARS THAT THEY ARE USING FOR THE DOLLARS THAT THEY ARE PUTTING TO EDUCATE OUR STUDENTS.

AND IF IT WASN'T, IF IT WASN'T AN ISSUE YOU WOULDN'T HAVE SEEN IN THE BUDGET BILL LANGUAGE YOU HAVE TO POST READING AND MATH RATES ON YOUR WEBSITE WHEN WE HAVE A SCHOOL REPORT CARD THAT HAS ALL THAT INFORMATION IN IT RIGHT NOW.

I THINK WE HAVE TO REALLY THINK ABOUT THE ACCOUNTABILITY PART.

IN THE OTHER SCHOOLS DON'T ALWAYS HAVE THOSE BOUNDARIES THAT OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS OPEN THE DOOR THEY WELCOME EVERYBODY IN.

AND I WANT TO GO BACK TO THE POINT ABOUT DOING THE RIGHT THINGS AND BASED ON RESEARCH.

WE HAVE EDUCATORS IN THE STATE THAT ARE DOING PHENOMENAL INNOVATIVE WORK IN THEIR CLASSROOMS.

THEY ARE THE EXPERTS WHEN IT COMES TO TEACHING AND LEARNING.

AND WE'RE NOT HAVING DIRECT CONVERSATIONS WITH THEM ABOUT PROGRAMS THAT THEY CAN INITIATE, RESEARCH BASED PROGRAMS, EVIDENCE-BASED PROGRAMS THAT COME RIGHT OUT OF THE CLASSROOM FROM THE PRACTITIONERS WHO ARE DOING THE WORK.

WE NEED TO BE HAVING THOSE CONVERSATIONS.

>> Renee: WASN'T THAT THE PURPOSE OF SCHOOLS OF INNOVATION?

>> IT WAS.

AND WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF THAT GOING ON.

BUT WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT OUR TEACHERS AND OUR OTHER EDUCATION SUPPORT PROFESSIONALS WORKING WITH STUDENTS EVERYDAY, HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO PUT IN PLACE AN EVIDENCE-BASED STUDY THAT SHOWS AND CAN PROVE THAT THEY ARE GROWING THEIR STUDENTS.

BUT THEN BE ABLE TO SHARE THAT INFORMATION ACROSS THE BROAD SPECTRUM OF PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

AND IF WE'RE NOT CAREFUL, IF WE'RE NOT INVESTING IN OUR PUBLIC SCHOOLS, WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE THE HIGHLY QUALIFIED, HIGHLY SKILLED EDUCATORS THAT ARE TRAINED IN WHAT TEACHING AND LEARNING IS SUPPOSED TO LOOK LIKE.

>> Renee: THIS COMMENT REAL QUICKLY.

CHARTER SCHOOLS GET TO PICK THEIR STUDENTS FROM A VIEWER WHO IS ECHOING WHAT THE PREVIOUS CALLER HAD SAID AND WHAT Mr. CAMPBELL SAID IS IT POSSIBLE THAT THEORY SUCCESS IS BASED ON THE CHOICES IN OPPOSITION TO PUBLIC SCHOOLS WHO HAVE TO PROVIDE EDUCATION TO TO THE STUDENTS THAT CHARTER SCHOOLS WOULD NEVER ACCEPT?

>> I THINK WE KEEP MENTIONING PRIVATE SCHOOLS IS THE ONLY OTHER OPTION TO FAMILIES MAKING A DECISION FOR THEIR CHILDREN TO ATTEND A DIFFERENT TYPE OF EDUCATIONAL SYSTEM.

AND I THINK THERE IS A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT THINGS THAT THEY CAN USE THIS FUNDING FOR.

IT CAN BE HOME SCHOOLING.

IT COULD BE A MICRO SCHOOL.

THERE IS A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT WAYS THEY CAN USE THE FUNDING.

I DON'T WANT US TO JUST FOCUS ON PRIVATE SCHOOLS BECAUSE THERE IS A NUMBER OF OPTIONS AND INNOVATIVE IDEAS AND HOW A CHILD CAN BE EDUCATED.

AND SO I JUST WOULD LIKE US FOR -- YEAH.

>> Renee: HAS THE CONCEPT OF MICRO SCHOOLS COME UP IN KENTUCKY?

>> DURING COVID.

>> Renee: DEFINE WHAT MICRO SCHOOLS ARE.

>> IT CAN BE SMALL COUPLE OF FAMILIES DECIDE THEY WANT TO AND DURING COVID WHEN SCHOOLS WERE SHUT DOWN SOME FAMILIES ASSOCIATED TOGETHER WHICH IS TRULY AN AMERICAN THING.

AND DECIDED WE DON'T WANT OUR KIDS TO MISS OUT BECAUSE THESE BUREAUCRATS IN JEFFERSON COUNTY DID NOT WANT TO REOPEN THE SCHOOLS THEY GOT TOGETHER AND SAID WE'RE GOING TO EDUCATE OUR CHILDREN AND THEY FOUND AND HIRED A TEACHER TO DO THAT AND THE KIDS DID NOT MISS OUT.

I HAVE TO CLEAR UP SOMETHING IN CHARTER SCHOOLS ALL 45 CHARTER SCHOOLS LAWS STIPULATE THAT CHARTER SCHOOLS CANNOT PICK AND CHOOSE THEY MUST TAKE FIRST-COME-FIRST-SERVE AND THAT IS EVERY LAW INCLUDING THE LAW THAT PASSED HERE IN KENTUCKY THAT HAS BEEN STRUCK DOWN BY THE COURT STILL TO BE HEARD PROBABLY BOOT THE SUPREME COURT.

THESE ARE PUBLIC SCHOOLS IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE BEFORE THIS VOTE IN NOVEMBER, WHAT REALLY IS WHAT.

CHARTER SCHOOLS ARE PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

THEY ARE PUBLICLY FUNDED THEY HAVE TO ABIDE BY THE SAME TESTING REQUIREMENTS AND MANY OF THE OTHER REQUIREMENTS.

THE DIFFERENCE IS THEY CAN BE MORE INNOVATIVE IN THEIR APPROACH IN THEIR DAY-TO-DAY APPROACH.

AND THEY HAVE A CHARTER AND THEY HAVE A PRINCIPAL FOR THAT SCHOOL THAT IS IN CHARGE OF THAT SCHOOL AND THEY HAVE TO BE ACCOUNTABLE FOR WHATEVER THEY SAY THEY ARE GOING TO DO IN THE CHARTER.

FOR EXAMPLE, IN THE LAW, IF THERE ARE MORE STUDENTS WANTING IT TO GET INTO A CHARTER SCHOOL THAN THERE ARE SEATS THEY TO HAVE A RANDOM LOTTERY.

THAT IS AS UN-- THAT IS NOT CHERRY PICKING AND THAT IS NOW MAGNET SCHOOLS CAN THEY HAVE AN ADMISSION PROCESS WHERE THEY CAN DENY STUDENTS THAT DON'T FIT THAT REQUIREMENT.

EVEN SOME OF THE TRADITIONAL SCHOOLS DO THAT.

CHARTER SCHOOLS BY LAW CANNOT DO THAT.

AND WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT LEARNING DISABLED CHILDREN THAT IS ANOTHER AREA WE NEED CHOICES IN.

WE NEED SCHOLARSHIPS FOR THOSE FAMILIES TO BE ABLE TO GET THE SERVICES AND THE TUTORING OR WHATEVER IT IS THEY NEED.

LET'S BE CLEAR THAT CHARTER SCHOOLS ARE PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

>> THIS IS A REALLY IMPORTANT POINT THAT JIM IS MAKING THAT PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOLS ARE HELD ACCOUNTABLE UNDER THE CURRENT ACCOUNTABILITY SYSTEM AND TO THE LOCAL DISTRICT.

BECAUSE IN KENTUCKY THEY WOULD BE AUTHORIZED BY THE LOCAL DISTRICT OR IN THE CASE OF NORTHERN KENTUCKY BY NORTHERN KENTUCKY UNIVERSITY.

BUT THAT ACCOUNTABILITY PIECE IS IMPORTANT.

WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PRIVATE SCHOOLS HOME SCHOOLS MICRO SCHOOLS ALL THE THINGS BEING THROWN INTO THAT CONVERSATION NOW, THERE'S NO ACCOUNTABILITY.

>> THAT IS NOT TRUE.

THAT IS NOT TRUE.

>> THE ONLY ACCOUNTABILITY IS THE PARENT'S CHOICE.

>> THAT IS A HUGE ACCOUNTABILITY FACTOR BECAUSE IF A PARENT ISN'T SATISFIED THAT A SCHOOL IS EDUCATING THEIR CHILD, THEN THAT SCHOOL DOESN'T EXIST.

WHEREAS IF WE HAVE A FAILING PUBLIC SCHOOL AND EVEN UNFORTUNATELY SOMETIMES CHARTER SCHOOLS, BUT THEY WILL REMAIN OPEN AND THEY WILL CONTINUE TO FAIL STUDENTS OR TO UNDERPERFORM.

THE GREATEST ACCOUNTABILITY FACTOR YOU HAVE IS A PARENT DECIDING THIS SCHOOL WILL DO THE JOB FOR MY CHILD.

I DON'T WANT TO GET IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT.

I THINK THAT IS A HIGH ACCOUNTABILITY FACTOR.

>> WE NEED TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT CALLING SCHOOLS ESPECIALLY OUR SCHOOLS FAILING.

THERE IS NO FAILING SCHOOL.

THERE ARE SCHOOLS UNDER RESOURCED, SCHOOLS NEED SYSTEMS THAT NEED TO BE PUT INTO PLACE BUT WE HAVE EDUCATORS IN THOSE SCHOOLS SERVING THOSE KIDS, WORKING WITH THEM EVERY SINGLE DAY.

BUT TO SAY THE SCHOOL IS FAILING IS JUST NOT TRUE.

>> WELL, I DISAGREE.

>> WE ARE BASING THAT ON AN ARBITRARY PICTURE IN TIME ON ACCOUNTABILITY.

>> NOT ARBITRARY, OBJECTIVE.

>> IT IS A PICTURE IN TIME.

THIS IS A SNAPSHOT IN TIME.

>> THEN IT WAS FAILING DURING THAT TIME.

>> NOTHING MEASURES HOW FAR THAT STUDENT HAS COME SINCE THEY WALKED IN THE DOOR THE FIRST DAY.

AND WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO REALLY LOOK AT AN ACCOUNTABILITY SYSTEM THAT MEASURES THE WHOLE CHILD AND THEIR SUCCESS THROUGHOUT A YEAR AND NOT JUST FROM A SNAPSHOT POINT OF VIEW.

THE ACCOUNTABILITY SYSTEM THE TEST THAT IS PUT IN PLACE IS ACTUALLY TO LOOK AT THE SYSTEMS THAT THE SCHOOL SYSTEM IS PROVIDING TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY ARE PROPER SYSTEMS.

>> I FIND IT IRONIC THE UNIONS ARE ALWAYS OPPOSED TO ANY OBJECTIVE RELEASE OF HOW SCHOOLS ARE PERFORMING.

IN EVERY OTHER SECTOR OF OUR SOCIETY WE HAVE JUDGMENTS THAT WE MAKE ABOUT THAT.

I THINK THAT THERE IS A LOT OF GREAT TEACHERS EVEN IN SCHOOLS THAT AREN'T DOING WELL FOR THEIR STUDENTS.

BUT FOR THE SAKE OF THE STUDENT, IF THE STUDENTS ARE THE MAIN CONCERN, WE HAVE TO BE HONEST ABOUT THE FACT THAT NOT EVERY SCHOOL IS HIGH PERFORMING IN OUR STATE LIKE WE WANT IT TO BE.

AND WHATEVER WILL CAUSE THAT TO HAPPEN I'M FOR.

>> Renee: IN HOUSE BILL 208, AND I WILL PIVOT TO HOUSE BILL 2, IN HOUSE BILL 208 IT DOES SAY IN SECTION ONE TO GIVE FAMILIES OF LIMITED FINANCIAL MEANS MORE EDUCATIONAL CHOICES.

ARE YOU IN FAVOR OF THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY PROVIDING A PORTION OF EDUCATIONAL COSTS FOR STUDENTS OUTSIDE OF THE COMMON SYSTEM OF COMMON SCHOOLS LIMITED FINANCIAL MEANS.

SOME PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED THAT THIS WOULD OPEN THE DOOR FOR RICH PEOPLE TO GET TAXPAYER FUNDED ASSISTANCE TO SEND THEIR RICH KIDS TO PRIVATE SCHOOLS.

IS THAT THE ULTIMATE END GOAL?

>> I WOULD SAY AMERICANS FOR PROSPERITY SUPPORTS UNIVERSAL SCHOOL CHOICE.

WE BELIEVE -- >> Renee: WHICH MEANS WHAT?

EVERYONE.

>> EVERYONE.

REPRESENTATIVE CALLAWAY IS ACTUALLY AMENDING HIS BILL TO INCLUDE EVERYONE.

NOT JUST LIMITED INCOME.

SO THAT WILL BE CHANGED.

AND PROBABLY HOUSE BILL 2 IS PROBABLY THE ONE THAT WILL BE MOVING.

AND SO OUR COALITION OF SCHOOL CHOICE SUPPORTIVE ORGANIZATIONS ARE WORKING WITH THE LEGISLATURE ON JUST RECOMMENDED LANGUAGE CHANGES TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE'S NOT ANY CHALLENGES UNDER THE SUPREME COURT.

BUT OBVIOUSLY HOUSE BILL 2 IS PROBABLY THE ONE THAT WILL MOVE.

>> Renee: AND IT DOESN'T REFER TO FINANCIAL MEANS AT ALL.

Mr.

WATERS THAT BRINGS UP A POINT BECAUSE THE ARGUMENT THAT SCHOOL CHOICE ADVOCATES MADE IT'S SUPPOSED TO HELP THOSE DISADVANTAGED OF LOW MEANS FINANCIALLY DOWN TRODDEN GET THE ACCESS TO THE TYPES OF EDUCATION RESOURCES THAT MORE WEALTHY FAMILIES HAVE.

THIS SEEMS TO POKE HOLES IN ALL OF THAT?

>> I WOULD SAY, TOO, I MEAN JUST BECAUSE YOU LIVE IN A CERTAIN ZIP CODE DOESN'T MEAN THAT -- A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE WILL CHOOSE TO GO TO A PUBLIC SCHOOL IN A DIFFERENT ZIP CODE BECAUSE THEY WANT THE EDUCATION THAT THAT PUBLIC SCHOOL PROVIDES.

THIS ISN'T JUST, AGAIN, IT'S NOT JUST RELEGATED TO PRIVATE SCHOOLS OR -- >> .

>> Renee: THEY ARE NOT GOING TO GO TO A FREE OR REDUCED SCHOOL.

>> WE HAD 10 STATES LAST YEAR THAT WENT WITH THE UNIVERSAL SCHOOL CHOICE PROGRAM INCLUDING INDIANA, WEST WEST VIRGINIA.

MANY STATES WE COMPETE WITH HAVE GONE THIS ROUTE ARE ARE MOVING THAT DIRECTION.

UNIVERSAL OPTIONS BECAUSE ONE SIZE DOES NOT FIT ALL AND THAT MEANS ONE SIZE DOES NOT FIT ALL.

THAT MEANS A PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOL ISN'T FOR EVERY STUDENT.

BUT JUST LIKE A TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOL IS NOT FOR EVERY STUDENT.

SO I THINK THAT WHAT WE WANT HERE ARE OPTIONS.

WE WANT ALTERNATIVES.

AND LOOK ARE OUR KIDS NO MATTER WHAT THE ZIP CODE IS THEY DESERVE A CHANCE TO HAVE THE SCHOOL THAT WORKS BEST FOR THEM.

LET'S REMOVE THOSE BARRIERS AND IF THEY CHOOSE NOT TO USE THAT, THEN FINE.

BUT WE'VE SEEN POSITIVE RESULTS THAT HAVE IMPACTED OUR PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEMS BECAUSE WE HAD THAT DYNAMIC.

>> Renee: THIS COMMENT SAYS QUOTE STATES SURROUNDING US HAVE MASSIVE BUDGET DEFICITS DUE TO THE FUNDING OF PRIVATE SCHOOLS WITH PUBLIC DOLLARS DO WE KNOW THAT TO BE TRUE?

>> I CAN'T COMMENT WHAT IS DRIVING OUR BORDER STATES BUDGET DEFICITS.

BUT I DO THINK IT'S INTERESTING TO LISTEN TO A CONVERSATION ABOUT ADDITIONAL OPTIONS WHEN WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS WE WANT TO INCREASE THE NUMBER OF OPTIONS EVEN THOUGH WE KNOW THAT THOSE OPTIONS MAY NOT ALLOW THAT STUDENT TO PERFORM BETTER.

AND WE KNOW THAT AS THE ADULTS IN THIS SPACE.

>> WHAT ABOUT THE PARENTS?

>> WE KNOW THAT GOING IN BASED ON WHAT THE RESEARCH SHOWS.

>> THE PARENTS KNOW WHAT IS BEST.

>> THERE IS RESEARCH IN FLORIDA RIGHT NOW THAT SHOWS THAT AS THE CHOICE PROGRAM HAS PERSISTED THEY ARE ACTUALLY SEEING MORE NEGATIVE RETURNS.

>> ARE YOU SAYING FAMILIES DON'T KNOW WHAT IS BEST FOR THEIR CHILDREN.

>> LOW-INCOME FAMILY ACCESSING THOSE PROGRAMS.

FROM A FISCALLY CONSERVATIVE STANDPOINT -- >> FLORIDA IS NOT ACCURATE.

WE'VE SEEN WHEN CARA BEGAN IN THE EARLY 90s, AND FLORIDA THEN TRAILED KENTUCKY IN EVERY AREA ALMOST EVERY OTHER STATE THEY WERE ONLY OUTPERFORMING A COUPLE OF STATES AND WASHINGTON D.C. TODAY, ONLY ONE STATE IS OUTPERFORMING FLORIDA'S PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEM AND THEIR KEY ACADEMIC AREAS AND THEY'VE PASSED UP KENTUCKY AND THEY ARE SPENDING LESS TO DO IT.

THEY HAVE INCREASED SPENDING LESS MUCH LESS THAN WE HAVE OVER THAT SAME AMOUNT OF TIME.

AND IN FLORIDA, THERE'S BEEN A BIG DEMOGRAPHIC SHIFT BACK WHEN THAT STARTED, OF COURSE, 60% OF THE KIDS IN FLORIDA'S PUBLIC SCHOOLS WERE WHITE STUDENTS WE KNOW THEY DO BETTER ON TESTING.

NOW IT'S ONLY 40% THEY ARE A MAJORITY MINORITY STATE WHEREAS KENTUCKY 75% OF OUR STUDENTS ARE WHITE.

FLORIDA'S OUTPERFORMING US AND WE'RE SPENDING MORE WE'VE INCREASED MORE THAN THEY HAVE.

WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE?

THE MORE CHOICES THEY'VE GIVEN PARENTS THE PUBLIC THEIR PUBLIC EDUCATION HAS PERFORMED.

>> LET'S LOOK AT ARIZONA FOR A MOMENT.

>> WHAT ABOUT FLORIDA?

>> I COVERED -- YOU JUST COVERED FLORIDA.

>> THAT IS GOOD WE HAVE AGREEMENT.

>> LET'S GO TO ARIZONA FOR A MINUTE WHERE IN ARIZONA THEY EARMARKED $33 MILLION FOR SCHOOL CHOICE VOUCHER PROGRAM.

THEY ENDED UP SPENDING $550 MILLION.

AND THERE ARE 10 TIMES MORE SCHOOL CHOICE VOUCHERS GOING TO STUDENTS IN THE 25 HIGHEST INCOME ZIP CODES THAN THERE ARE GOING TO THE LOWEST 25% OF ARIZONA FAMILIES.

>> Renee: AND THAT POINT, PIGGY BACKS OFF WHAT THIS CALLER SAYS, I HEAR ARIZONA IMPLEMENTED A VOUCHER SYSTEM AND THERE HAVE BEEN INSTANCES OF WASTE, FRAUD AND ABUSE WITH NO ACCOUNTABILITY FOR THE PRIVATE SCHOOLS AND HOME SCHOOLING PARENTS.

WHAT IS TO PREVENT THAT FROM HAPPENING IN KENTUCKY?

>> I MEAN, I WOULD SAY THAT WE SEE THAT SOME IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS AS WELL.

THAT CAN HAPPEN, I THINK IN ANY EDUCATIONAL ENVIRONMENT.

THERE NEEDS TO BE ACCOUNTABILITY AND I MEAN THAT IS, I THINK, A FURTHER DISCUSSION THAT WE CAN HAVE ONCE THIS AMENDMENT PASSES AND WE LOOK AT THE SPECIFIC TYPE OF SCHOOL CHOICE PROGRAM THERE'S ESA'S, SCHOLARSHIP.

>> .

>> Renee: EDUCATION SAVINGS ACCOUNTS.

>> Renee: AND THAT IS DIFFERENT FROM THE OPPORTUNITY ACCOUNTS THAT THE COURT STRUCK DOWN.

>> THEY HAD A LOT OF SIMILARITIES.

THEY ALLOW STUDENTS AND PUBLIC SCHOOL STUDENTS TO USE THE DOLLARS FOR WHATEVER THEIR NEEDS ARE.

THIS IS ABOUT THE STUDENTS.

THIS SHOULD BE ABOUT THE STUDENTS.

AND YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT IS A GOOD POINT.

THAT THE DOLLARS OUGHT TO BE ABOUT THAT.

AND LOOK, WE CAN PASS THE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT.

ONE OF THE GREAT THINGS ABOUT KENTUCKY BEING BEHIND THE REST OF THE NATION, IS WE HAVE ALL THE LABORATORIES OF DEMOCRACY LIKE JUSTICE BRANDEIS SO FAMOUSLY LABELED IT.

WE CAN SEE AND TO YOUR POINT I AGREE I THINK WE SHOULD LEARN FROM THE MISTAKES OF OTHER STATES HAVE MADE ON THIS AND LET'S GET IT RIGHT.

LET'S HAVE THE MOST ROBUST EDUCATION SYSTEM IN AMERICA.

>> Renee: YOU MENTIONED FLORIDA.

BUT THIS LEXINGTON CALLER SAYS WHAT WILL KEEP PRIVATE CHARTER SCHOOLS FROM RAISING TUITION LIKE IN FLORIDA.

DID THEY RAISE IT?

>> I'M SURE SOME SCHOOLS LOOK AT INFLATION LIKE Mr. CAMPBELL SAYS IT'S AFFECTED EVERYBODY.

HERE IS THE THING WE FOUND CAN SCHOLARSHIPS THAT A LOT OF PRIVATE SCHOOLS AND THEY GET BEAT UP ON A LOT UNFORTUNATELY, A LOT OF THEM HAVE SAID, HEY IF WE GET A SCHOLARSHIP PROGRAM PASSED WE WILL WORK WITH FAMILIES TO MAKE SURE THAT THEIR KIDS GET THE EDUCATION THEY NEED.

IF THIS IS THE BEST FIT.

AND SOME CASES THAT MIGHT MEAN THAT FAMILIES PAY SOMETHING TOWARD THAT IN ADDITION TO THE SCHOLARSHIP THAT WOULD BE BASED ON THEIR INCOME.

WE'VE SEEN PROGRAMS LIKE THAT IN THE PRIVATELY DONE HERE BEFORE AND THEY WORKED TO EDUCATE KIDS AND REALLY HIGH POVERTY FAMILIES.

>> Renee: SO YOU ARE NOT ADVOCATING OR ARE YOU ADVOCATING FOR TUITION FREE CHOICE?

>> NO.

THIS IS ABOUT PROVIDING FUNDING AT A CERTAIN LEVEL AND THEN IT'S ABOUT SCHOOLS AND PARENTS AND FAMILIES WORKING THAT OUT.

THAT IS BY FAR THE BEST WAY TO DO THAT.

>> Renee: Mr. CAMPBELL?

>> WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE OTHER STATES WHERE VOUCHER PROGRAMS 80% OF THE PEOPLE THAT ARE ACCESSING THOSE PROGRAMS ARE ALREADY STUDENTS ARE ALREADY ATTENDING PRIVATE SCHOOLS.

PRIVATE SCHOOLS ARE TELLING THEM THEY HAVE TO FILL OUT.

>> THAT IS A TRAGEDY, ISN'T IT.

I MEAN THE KIDS ARE GETTING INTO THE SCHOOLS THAT FITS BEST FOR THEM WHATEVER THEIR INCOME.

>> THEY ARE ALREADY IN THE PRIVATE SCHOOL THEY ARE NOT COMING FROM THE PUBLIC SCHOOL THEY ARE TAKING AWAY PUBLIC SCHOOL DOLLARS TO BE PUSHED INTO A PRIVATE SCHOOL AND WHEN WE TALK ABOUT ARIZONA, THEY STARTED WITH THEN THEY INSTITUTED THEIR VOUCHER PROGRAM, IT WAS A ABOUT 25 MILLION WAS THAT THE STARTING.

NOW IT'S ALMOST A BILLION DOLLARS PER YEAR IN THEIR BUDGET AND THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT WHAT PROGRAMS WILL HAVE TO BE CUT.

SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TAKING PUBLIC TAX DOLLARS FOR THE COMMON GOOD AND NOW WE'RE GOING TO FIND WAYS IN BUDGETS AND THIS IS NOT JUST ARIZONA THIS IS MULTIPLE STATES, WHERE THEY FOUND THEY HAVE TO CUT SERVICES.

THEY HAVE TO CUT PUBLIC SCHOOL FUNDING AND CUT POLICE AND FIRE.

THOSE OTHER PUBLIC SERVICES THAT ARE SUPPORTED BY TAX DOLLARS BECAUSE THIS IS DRAINING THOSE PRECIOUS TAX DOLLARS OUT OF THAT GENERAL FUND.

>> THAT IS THE POINT HERE.

WE CAN MAKE SURE WHEN THE LAW IS PASSED THAT IT'S DONE RIGHT, IT'S SETUP RIGHT, AND THAT THERE IS A ACCOUNTABILITY.

I DO NOT WANT US TO CREATE MORE FAILING SCHOOLS.

I WANT CHARTER SCHOOLS.

I WANT THE PROGRAMS TO BE ACCOUNTABLE.

THE.

>> WHAT IS IT GOING TO LOOK LIKE?

>> THE LAW HOUSE BILL 563 THAT PASSED A COUPLE YEARS AGO HAD VERY RIGOROUS STEPS THAT YOU HAD TO FOLLOW IN IN ORDER TO CREATE A ACCOUNT GRANTING ORGANIZATION.

I THINK WE HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE FOR HOW THEY SPEND THOSE DOLLARS.

AND THAT WAS A VERY SMALL PROGRAM IT WAS A $25 MILLION PROGRAM HERE WHICH WAS VERY SMALL COMPARED TO OUR OVERALL BUDGET.

BUT WHAT AN OPPORTUNITY FOR EVEN A FEW KIDS YOU KNOW TO GET A BETTER EDUCATION.

THAT IS WHEY WANT.

I WANT OUR STUDENTS TO HAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY AND THEN LET THE SYSTEM ADJUST TO THAT.

THAT OUGHT TO BE THE PRIORITY.

WE'LL FIGURE IT OUT.

BUT I THINK WE LOOK AT OTHER STATES LIKE YOU SAID, I AGREE LET'S GET IT ON THE TABLE HERE ARE THE MISTAKES MADE AND HERE IS WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE AND WE HAVE THAT ADVANTAGE.

>> THERE WAS ACCOUNTABILITY ON THE GRANT ORGANIZATIONS THE AUTHORIZING ORGANIZATION NOT ON WHERE THE DOLLARS WERE BEING SPENT.

>> THE LAW WAS SETUP TO ADDRESS THAT.

>> GRANT ORGANIZATION GOT TO KEEP 10% OF THOSE DOLLARS.

>> THIS LAW HERE WOULD HAVE BEEN JUST -- >> 563 ALLOWED FOR THE ORGANIZATION TO KEEP 10% OF THE SCHOLARSHIP DOLLARS FOR FEES AND RUNNING THE ORGANIZATION.

>> AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE PUBLIC -- >> PUBLIC SCHOOL 100% OF THOSE DOLLARS GO INTO THE PUBLIC SCHOOL.

>> THE PUBLIC EDUCATION SYSTEM HOW MUCH ARE THEY SPENDING?

THIS HUGE INCREASE IN NONTEACHING PERSONNEL THAT ARE BEING HIRED.

WE NEED TO PAY OUR TEACHERS MORE.

WE NEED TO DO BETTER FOR OUR TEACHERS LIKE YOU SAID.

WHERE ARE THE DOLLARS GOING?

WE NEED LOTS AFTER COUNTABILITY FOR THE 12 BILLION WE ARE GOING TO SP SPEND ON K-12 EDUCATION.

>> Renee: THERE IS A QUESTION ABOUT CENTRAL OFFICE PERSONNEL HAVING SUBSTANTIAL SALARIES COMPARED TO THOSE IN THE CLASSROOM.

>> THAT IS A CONCERN AND A QUESTION THAT SHOULD BE ADDRESSED AND LOOKED AT.

EDUCATENERS THE CLASSROOM HAVE FALLEN FURTHER AND FURTHER BEHIND WHEN IT COMES TO PAY IN THE STATE OF KENTUCKY WE HAVE NOT FOCUSED ON THAT.

THERETO'S NOT BEEN BUT 3% ADDED TO THE STATE MANDATED SALARY SCHEDULE SINCE 2008 SINCE 2008 ONLY 3% HAVE BEEN ADDED TO THAT SCHEDULE.

OUR FIRST YEAR TEACHERS MAKE AN AVERAGE OF $34,000 A YEAR.

WE KEEP FALLING BEHIND.

WE'RE 44TH IN THE NATION FOR FIRST YEAR TEACHER PAY.

40TH FOR AVERAGE TEACHER PAY.

AND WHAT IS REALLY SAD ALL OF THE INDIVIDUALS WHO MAKE THE SCHOOL WORK OUR TRANSPORTATION WORKER OUR FOOD SERVICE OUR CUSTODIANS AND SCHOOL NURSES ALL OF OUR SUPPORT STAFF WE RANK 48TH.

WE HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF THE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE TAKING CARE OF OUR KIDS EVERY SINGLE DAY.

AND THAT INVESTMENT HAS TO HAPPEN.

WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY RIGHT NOW TO INVEST IN THOSE EDUCATORS.

>> Renee: LET'S GET BACK TO A QUESTION ABOUT -- THIS QUESTION FROM A VIEWER ABOUT IF WE GIVE OPTIONS HOW DO WE TRANSPORT THESE CHILDREN TO THEIR CHOICE?

THE TRANSPORTATION SYSTEM?

>> JEFFERSON COUNTY IS HAVING TROUBLE TRANSPORTING THEIR PUBLIC SCHOOL STUDENTS THEY ARE NOT GOING TO TRANSPORT SOME OF THEM.

I THINK THESE ARE THINGS THAT NEED TO BE FIGURED OUT.

>> Renee: WHAT HAVE OTHER STATES DONE TO REMEDY THE TRANSPORTATION CONCERNS?

>> MOST PLACES PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOL STUDENTS ARE TREATED AS PUBLIC SCHOOL STUDENTS THEY ARE TRANSPORTED BY THE DISTRICT.

AND OTHER PLACES THEY MAKE ARRANGEMENTS WITH PARENTS WHO MIGHT HELP FUND THAT OR GET THEIR KIDS TO SCHOOL.

THEY MIGHT NOT PROVIDE TRANSPORTATION.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT HAB TO BE UP FRONT AND PARENTS HAVE TO KNOW.

>> Renee: FAMILIES OF LESSER MEANS THAT WOULD BE A BIG BARRIER FOR THEM?

>> BUT SEE HERE IS THE THING IT'S NOT A ZERO SOMETHING THIS WAY OR THAT WAY.

WHEN A SCHOOL CAN BE INNOVATIVE IF THEY CAN BE INNOVATIVE IN THE TYPE OF PROGRAM THEY WILL BE INNOVATIVE IN TRANSPORTATION.

WE HEARD OF ALL KINDS OF IDEAS.

>> LIKE AN UBER?

>> TAXIS, WHATEVER OR BUSES SMALL BUSES OR WHATEVER.

SO LOOK, I DON'T A-- I'M NOT CALLING FOR US TO SPEND OUR RAINY DAY FUND WE DON'T NEED TO SPEND OUR RAINY DAY FUND ON PAYING TEACHERS MORE.

WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS REALIZE THAT THE LEGISLATURE HAS GREATLY INCREASED THE AMOUNT OF FUNDING GOING TO LOCAL DISTRICTS FOR THEM TO DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH THOSE DOLLARS.

THEY SHOULD BE THE ONES MAKING THOSE DECISIONS.

I HAVE A QUESTION TONIGHT SOMEBODY HELP ME WITH PLEASE, BECAUSE I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW THE LARGEST SCHOOL DISTRICT IN KENTUCKY CAN HAVE A $2 BILLION BUDGET AND YET WE HAVE TEACHERS IN THAT SYSTEM WHO ARE HAVING TO DIG INTO THEIR POCKETS TO PROVIDE SUPPLIES AND TEXTBOOKS AND THE THINGS THEIR STUDENTS NEED.

$2 BILLION.

THAT'S MORE THAN TWICE WHAT THE METRO COUNCIL BUDGET IS.

WHERE IS THE MONEY GOING?

>> Renee: YOU SHOULD ASK THE JEFFERSON COUNTY EDUCATION DISTRICT ABOUT THAT.

SO THIS QUESTION FROM JEFFERSON COUNTY TO Mr. CAMPBELL SAYS HOW CAN YOU SAY WE DON'T HAVE FAILING SCHOOLS YOU MENTIONED THAT BEFORE WHEN 198,000 STUDENTS ARE CHRONICALLY ABSENT AND OVER 30% OF OUR KIDS CAN'T READ, DO MATH OR MEET ANY OUTCOME AT GRADE LEVEL.

>> I'M SAYING WE CAN'T LOOK AND MAKE A GENERALIZATION ABOUT A FAILING SCHOOL.

YOU CANNOT CALL A SCHOOL FAILING.

THERE ARE SCHOOLS UNDER RESOURCED.

THEY DON'T HAVE THE FUNDING TO DO PUT IN PLACE ALL THE SYSTEMS AND MAKE SURE THAT EVERY STUDENTS' NEEDS AND OPPORTUNITIES ARE BEING MET.

WE HAVE TO HAVE THE SYSTEMS IN PLACE.

THOSE COST MONEY.

WE HAVE SYSTEMS THAT ARE NEED LEADERSHIP.

THERE'S FAILING IN THE LEADERSHIP AND MAKING SURE THAT EVERYTHING IS BEING DONE IN THAT SCHOOL.

WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE WHOLE CHILD SERVICES PROVIDING AND CREATING COMMUNITY SCHOOLS TO MEET THE NEEDS OF STUDENTS.

IF A STUDENT IS HUNGRY OR SICK OR HAS SOME HEALTH ISSUE, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THE SCHOOL IS THERE TO SUPPORT THAT STUDENT 365 DAYS A YEAR.

NOT JUST DURING THE SCHOOL DAY.

>> Renee: THIS QUESTION OR RESPONSE COMMENT FROM VAN SMITH.

I WILL POINT THIS TO YOU, YOUR GUEST STATED THAT AMERICANS FOR PROSPERITY IS A GRASSROOTS ORGANIZATION THAT IS FALSE THEY ARE A COKE BROTHERS FUNDED ORGANIZATION.

TRUE OR FALSE?

>> CHARLES COKE WAS ONE OF THE FOUNDER OF AMERICANS FOR PROSPERITY WE ARE DONOR FUNDED AND DONORS BELIEVE IN THE ISSUES THAT WE WORK ON WHICH THEY SUPPORT BOTTOM UP SOLUTIONS TO COMPLEX PROBLEMS.

AND SO I WOULD SAY YES, CHARLES CAULK WITH HIS BROTHER.

BUT DONORS ARE THE ONES WHO KEEP THE ORGANIZATION GOING.

AND THEY SUPPORT INNOVATION IN EDUCATION.

>> Renee: SO IN THE LAST FOUR MINUTES, A QUESTION BASIC IS THERE MIDDLE GROUND?

CAN THIS SIDE AND THIS SIDE FIND A SOLUTION IN THE CENTER?

>> LET'S HAVE BOTH AND.

IF SCHOOLS OF CHOICE DON'T DO WELL AND THEY DON'T ATTRACT STUDENTS THEN WHAT IS THE HARM IN ALLOWING THAT WE'LL KNOW?

WHAT IS THE HARM IN ALLOWING THAT POSSIBILITY I SAY WE HAVE BOTH AND RATHER THAN EITHER OR.

>> Renee: IS THERE A BOTH AND POSSIBILITY?

>> I THINK IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE THIS DISCUSSION WE SHOULD FIRST FULLY FUND AND FOCUS ON THE PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM THAT WAS INTENDED BY THE FRAMERS OF OUR CONSTITUTION HERE IN THE STATE OF KENTUCKY.

A SYSTEM OF COMMON SCHOOLS FOR ALL STUDENTS THAT PROVIDED A FREE PUBLIC SCHOOL EDUCATION.

FOR ALL STUDENTS.

WE DON'T NEED TO BE TRYING TO BUILD ANOTHER SYSTEM ON TOP OF A SYSTEM THAT WE ALREADY HAVE.

LET'S LOOK AT THE SYSTEM WE HAVE.

LET'S TALK ABOUT WHAT IS NEEDED HOW WE CAN CREATE INNOVATION WITHIN THOSE SCHOOLS.

MAKE SURE WE'RE MEETING THE NEEDS OF ALL STUDENTS NO MATTER WHERE THEY COME FROM.

WE MEET THEM WHERE THEY ARE WHEN THEY COME TO THE DOOR AND PROVIDE THEM OPPORTUNITIES THROUGHOUT THEIR CAREER.

WHEN THEY ARE IN SCHOOL.

THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO BE LOOKING AT.

NOT TRYING TO BUILD A NEW SYSTEM ON TOP OF ONE THAT WE HAVE.

I THINK THE FRAMERS OF THE CONSTITUTION WERE VERY THOUGHTFUL WHEN THEY WROTE THIS AND WE HAVE PUBLIC DOLLARS FOR PUBLIC GOOD SO LET'S MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE USING THOSE DOLLARS TO ENHANCE EVERYBODY IN THE COMMONWEALTH.

ALL AT THE SAME TIME SO THAT KIDS HAVE THE SAME OPPORTUNITIES AS KIDS IN PIKEVILLE AS THEY DO IN JEFFERSON COUNTY.

>> THAT IS NOT HAPPENING THOUGH, WE NEED THE CHANGE.

>> THAT IS THE POINT WE NEED TO FOCUS ON THAT RIGHT NOW.

>> .

>> YOU WILL SAY THIS IS -- I WILL SAY THAT KENTUCKIANS WANT OPTIONS FOR THEIR CHILDREN.

AND WE'RE HEARING IT LOUD AND CLEAR ACROSS THE STATE.

YOU CAN EVEN LOOK AT THE TWEETS THAT THE GOVERNOR AND THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR HAVE MADE ABOUT THIS ISSUE AND PEOPLE'S OVERWHELMING RESPONSES TO SAYING THEY WANT SCHOOL CHOICE AND WANT THE OPTIONS FOR THEIR CHILDREN.

>> KENTUCKY HAS LED THE NATION IN ECONOMIC EDUCATION IMPROVEMENT IN THE PAST.

WE'VE LED THE ENTIRE NATION.

WE CAN DO THAT AGAIN.

IF WE GROUND OUR STRATEGIES AND OUR INVESTMENT IN WHAT RESEARCH SHOWS IS GOING TO WORK.

IT'S CRITICALLY IMPORTANT THAT AS THIS SIXTH POOREST STATE IN THE NATION WE DO THAT WELL IF WE ARE GOING TO ACHIEVE ECONOMIC COMPETITIVENESS AND THE ECONOMIC PROSPERITY OF KENTUCKIANS.

SO GROUNDING WHAT WE KNOW WORKS.

AND INVESTING IN THOSE IS CRITICALLY IMPORTANT.

TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOLS YES WE HAVE WORK TO DO BUT WE'VE LED THE NATION BEFORE.

PUBLIC CHAFORTER SCHOOLS CAN BE A TOOL IN THE TOOLBOX IF DONE WELL AND APPROPRIATELY.

SCHOOL CHOICE PRIVATE SCHOOL CHOICE THE RESEARCH IS NOT THERE.

>> Renee: ALL RIGHT.

20 SECONDS Mr.

WATERS.

>> 82% OF KENTUCKY'S WHITE HIGH SCHOOL GRADUATES AN ASTONISHING 97% OF GRADUATING BLACK STUDENTS LACK COLLEGE READINESS ACROSS THE FOUR ACADEMIC AREAS TESTED BY THE ACT.

I WANT TO SEE THAT CHANGED.

>> Renee: GOOD DISCUSSION.

GOOD RIGOROUS DISCUSSION THANK YOU ALL FOR REPRESENTING YOUR VIEWPOINTS AND INFORMING OUR VIEWERS TONIGHT.

WE A GREAT SHOW FOR NEXT MONDAY WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT ABORTION AND FAMILY SUPPORT LEGISLATION THAT WILL BE ALSO A RIGOROUS DISCUSSION I CAN PREDICT.

MAKE SURE YOU TUNE BACK IN NEXT MONDAY AT 8:00 P.M. ON "KENTUCKY TONIGHT" FOR THAT.

AND JOIN US EACH WEEKNIGHT AT 6:30 WHERE WE ARE AT THE STATE CAPITOL REPORTING ON THESE ISSUES THAT MATTER TO YOU.

WE'LL SEE YOU TOMORROW NIGHT AT 6:30 EASTERN 530 CENTRAL.

TAKE GOOD CARE.