>> Braude: TONIGHT ON >> Braude: POLICE REFORM IS OFFICIALLY DEAD AS DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS IN CONGRESS COULDN'T BRIDGE THE DIVIDE.

AND NOW WITH THE LIMIT AND TRANSFORMATIVE HUMAN INFRASTRUCTURE INITIATIVE HANGING BY A THREAD, CAN DEMOCRATS EVEN AGREE AMONG THEMSELVES, OR WILL THEY SINK THE DEMOCRATIC AGENDA.

SHANNON O'BRIEN AND NAD MAIZE JOIN ME.

AND THEN MIKE KEL THEN MIKEA PEDESTRIAN PARADISE, AND YOU HAVE ONE VERY TALENTED LOCAL TV HOST TO THANK FOR.

THAT WILL BE ME.

I'LL EXPLAIN JUST AHEAD.

>> Braude: WITH COVID KILLING MORE THAN 1900 PEOPLE A DAY, HAITIAN MIGRANTS IN TEXAS FACING DEPORTATION EN MASSE, AND SEVERAL STATES STILL RECOVERING FROM DEVASTATING NATURAL DISASTERS, THE U.S. IS BARRELING TOWARDS YET ANOTHER CRISIS IF CONGRESS DOESN'T COME TOGETHER TO RAISE THE DEBT CEILING BEFORE THE END OF THE MONTH.

IF THEY DON'T, THE COUNTRY DEFAULTS ON ITS LOANS, AND ECONOMISTS SAY WE COULD FALL INTO AN IMMEDIATE RECESSION, WITH ONE EXPERT FROM MOODY ANALYTICS TELLING THE "WASHINGTON POST" THAT ECONOMIC DISASTER WOULD COST THE COUNTRY UP TO SIX MILLION JOBS, AS MUCH AS $15 TRILLION IN HOUSEHOLD WEALTH, AND SEND THE UNEMPLOYMENT RATE SURGING TO ROUGHLY 9%.

HOUSE DEMOCRATS PASSED A BILL YESTERDAY TO RAISE THE LIMIT, OVER THE OBJECTION OF EVERY REPUBLICAN IN THE CHAMBER, AND THE G.O.P.

LEADER IN THE SENATE HAS ALREADY VOWED NOT TO WORK ON ANY EFFORT IN THAT CHAMBER EITHER.

>> SINCE DEMOCRATS DECIDED TO GO IT ALONE, THEY WILL NOT GET SENATE REPUBLICANS' HELP WITH RAISING THE DEBT LIMIT.

I'VE EXPLAINED THIS CLEARLY AND CONSISTENTLY FOR OVER TWO MONTHS.

DEMOCRATS DECIDED TO GOVERN ALONE.

THEIR UNIFIED DEMOCRATIC GOVERNMENT MUST PUT BASIC GOVERNING DUTIES AHEAD OF PARTISAN WISH LISTS.

IF THEY DON'T, THE CONSEQUENCES FOR OUR COUNTRY WOULD BE CATASTROPHIC.

>> Braude: BECAUSE THE DEBT CEILING BILL, AND A LARGER DEMOCRATIC BUDGET PROPOSAL, ARE FINANCIAL BILLS, THEY'RE ABLE TO USE A PROCESS KNOWN AS "RECONCILIATION," WHICH WOULD LET THEM BYPASS A REPUBLICAN FILIBUSTER.

BUT THEY WOULD STILL NEED EVERY SINGLE DEMOCRATIC AND INDEPENDENT TO VOTE IN ITS FAVOR.

AND RIGHT NOW MODERATES, LIKE JOE MANCHIN, ARE LOOKING JUST AS LIKELY TO JOIN UP WITH PROGRESSIVES AS MITCH McCONNELL IS.

IT'S JUST THE LATEST BATTLE IN A MONTHS-LONG WAR WITHIN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THAT'S BEEN STALLING MANY OF THE KEY COMPONENTS OF PRESIDENT BIDEN'S AGENDA.

AND WITH THE 2022 MID-TERMS, AND A POSSIBLE UPSET TO THE PARTY'S MAJORITY IN CONGRESS INCHING CLOSER BY THE DAY, WILL THEY EVER BE ABLE TO GET IT DONE?

JOINING ME ARE SHANNON O'BRIEN, FORMER STATE TREASURER AND DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE FOR GOVERNOR, AND NADEEM MAZEN, FORMER CAMBRIDGE CITY COUNCILOR AND THE C.E.O.

OF GREENLIGHT, A SOCIAL MEDIA NETWORK FOR CONTENT CREATORS.

>> Braude: NADEEM, AND SHANNON, GREAT TO SEE YOU BOTH.

NADEEM, POLICE REFORM FAILED, AND THAT WAS DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS WHO COULDN'T AGREE.

BUT IS THAT A SIGN OF MORE FAILURES TO COME, EVEN WHEN THE ONLY ISSUE IS ALL DEMOCRATS AGREEING WITH ALL DEMOCRATS?

>> YOU KNOW, IN THE ISSUES TO COME, I THINK WE'RE GOING TO SEE -- WE'RE SEEING A LOT OF POSTURING NOW, OF COURSE, BUT I THINK WE'RE ACTUALLY EVENTUALLY GOING TO ERECONCILIATION,SEERECONCILIATION.

NO PUN INTENDED.

THERE HAS BEEN A BY BYFERTATION OF EFFORTS, AND THERE IS INFRASTRUCTURE VERSUS THE SOCIAL SPENDING, BUT IN THE END, THERE HAS BEEN A LONG-STANDING AGREEMENT WE'RE GOING TO DO BOTH.

AND I THINK DESPITE THE POSTURING, WE'VE GOT TO GET THERE.

>> Braude: SHANNON, NANCY PELOSI AGREES WITH NADEEM.

HERE IS THE SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE YESTERDAY.

>> THIS IS CALLED THE LEGISLATIVE RECIPE.

THIS IS CALLED THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

AND CLEARLY WE'RE IN THE MIX OF ALL OF IT, AND THAT IS PRETTY EXCITING BECAUSE EVERYBODY HAS THEIR SAY, WE COME TOGETHER, AND WE GET IT DONE.

>> Braude: ARE YOU AS OPTIMISTIC AT MAZEN AND PELOSI, SHANNON O'BRIEN?

>> I'M CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC BECAUSE I THINK THIS IS A SURVIVAL ISSUE FOR THE DEMOCRATS AND THE DEMOCRATIC MAJORITY.

HISTORY WILL TELL YOU THAT THE PARTY IN PRESIDENTIAL POWER LOSES SEATS IN OFF-ELECTION YEARS.

AND OBVIOUSLY THE DEMOCRATS HAVE A VERY SLIM MAJORITY.

I THINK THE DEMOCRATS ULTIMATELY UNDERSTAND WHAT BEING IN THE MAJORITY IN BOTH THE HOUSE AND THE SENATE MEANS.

SO WHILE I THINK THERE IS AN AWFUL LOT OF POSTURING GOING ON, I DO THINK THAT YOU WILL SEE MANY DEMOCRATS FALLING IN LINE BEHIND NANCY PELOSI.

SHE IS A MASTER NEGOTIATOR.

SHE KNOWS HOW TO COUNT HER VOTES.

AND SHE IS AN INCREDIBLY STRONG LEADER THAT I BELIEVE IS OUR BEST HOPE RIGHT NOW FOR SUCCESS.

>> Braude: IT IS NOT JUST PELOSI.

SCHUMER NEEDS TO SUCCEED IN THE SENATE, TOO.

SHANNON, YOU'RE A FORMER LEGISLATOR, AND YOU'VE BEEN IN THE ROOM WITH THE SENATE OR THE GOVERNOR, TRYING TO PUSH YOU SOMEWHERE.

SENNY HOYER SAYS BIDEN HOPEFULLY HAS THE SECRET SAUCE.

CAN THE PRESIDENT OF A PARTY, AND HE IS MEETING WITH ALL OF THESE PLAYERS TODAY, CONVINCE LEGISLATORS TO DO SOMETHING THEY DON'T WANT TO DO, PARTICULARLY IF THEY THINK IT IS GOING TO BE A PROBLEM FOR THEM BACK HOME?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

AND I DO THINK WE HAVE A PRESIDENT WHO WANTS TO ENGAGE.

PRESIDENT BIDEN KNOWS HE NEEDS TO HAVE A SUCCESS, AND HE KNOWS THAT THAT WINDOW IS VERY NARROW.

SO I DO THINK YOU WILL CONTINUE TO SEE JOE BIDEN BEHIND THE SCENES PRESSING PEOPLE.

I DO THINK HE HAS BEEN A LITTLE HANDSOFF AT THIS POINT IN TIME, BUT I THINK THEY RECOGNIZE WHAT THEY NEED TO DO TO GET HIS AGENDA DONE THIS YEAR.

>> Braude: NADEEM, DESPITE YOUR OPTIMISM OR CAUTIOUS OPTIMISM, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT, IT SEEMS LIKE PEOPLE LIKE YOU, AT THE MOMENT, ARE THE PROBLEM.

WE HAD AYANNA PRESSLEY ON THE RADIO A COUPLE OF DAYS AGO, AND HER POSITION IS LIKE A LOT OF PROGRESS SEFSIVESIN THE HOUSE, WHICH IS, WE WILL NOT VOTE YES ON THE BIPARTISAN INFRASTRUCTURE PACKAGE UNTIL THE SENATE HAS VOTED YES ON THE CHILD CARE, HUMAN SERVICES, CLIMATE CHANGE $3.5 TRILLION.

IT ISN'T EVEN DRAFTED YET.

SO COULDN'T THE PROGRESSIVES BE THE ONES THAT UNRAVEL THE WHOLE PARTY HERE?

>> YOU KNOW, THIS HAS BEEN A POPULAR TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, AND A LITTLE BIT REVISIONIST BECAUSE THE AGREEMENT FROM THE OUTSET WAS THAT THIS TWO TRACK WOULD COME TOGETHER, AND EACH PART OF THE PARTIES, THE PROGRESSIVES AND THE MODERATES, WOULD HAVE SOME FINGER ON THE BALANCE OF THE OUTCOME.

AND SO NOW IT IS ACTUALLY WONDERFUL, FOR THE FIRST TIME IN MY LIFE, TO SEE PROGRESSIVES WITH THE POWER TO SAY, HEY, YOU CAN'T NOW GO BACK ON THE AGREEMENT WE MADE.

OF COURSE, THERE IS GOING TO BE A BATTLE ABOUT THAT IN THE PRESS, AND A BATTLE TO REFRAME WHO IS TO BLAME.

BUT IN THE END EACH SIDE, AND THEIR OBLIGATIONS, NEED TO BE MET.

AND IT IS FOR THE BETTER OUTCOME OF THE NATION.

THE NATION NEEDS THIS SPENDING IN ORDER TO COMPETE.

AND THAT SHOULD BE VERY CLEAR NOW.

>> Braude: YEAH, BUT, AGAIN, THAT IS A NICE STATEMENT OF PRINCIPLE, BUT AS OF THE MOMENT, THEY HAVE THE ABILITY TO SINK NOT JUST ONE BUT TWO HUGE TRANSFORMATIONAL MEASURES.

THAT IS FACTUALLY ACCURATE.

>> YOU EVEN HAVE MODERATES IN BUDGET SAYING IF IT DOESN'T PASS THE FIRST TIME, IT WILL PASS THE SECOND TIME.

SO IT GOING TO GET THROUGH.

>> Braude: YOU MENTIONED PELOSI IN THE HOUSE, SHANNON O'BRIEN, A MINUTE AGO.

EVERY DAY I READ AN ARTICLE ABOUT HOW KRISTIN CINEMA AND JOE JOE MANCHIN ARE REALLY DOOMING THE BIDEN AGENDA.

IT SEEMS TO ME THE PERSON WHO IS DOOMING THE BIDEN AGENDA IS JOE BIDEN.

JOE BIDEN, WE JUST TALKED ABOUT HIM BRINGING PEOPLE IN THE ROOM AND CONVINCING HIM HE HAS NOT COME OUT IN FAVOR OF GETTING RID OF THE FILIBUSTER, WITHOUT WHICH YOU NEED 60 VOTES, 10 REPUBLICANS AND ALL 50 DEMOCRATS, AND THERE AREN'T 10 REPUBLICANS FOR ANYTHING.

DOESN'T BIDEN HAVE TO COME TO THE PARTY, TOO?

>> I THINK THAT HE ABSOLUTELY DOES.

I DO UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, HIS CONCERN BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY JOE MANCHIN AND KRISTIN CINEMA, I DISAGREE IT IS THE PROGRESSIVES WHO ARE, YOU KNOW, THE PERSON MOST RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS GAME OF CHICKEN.

YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE TWO SENATORS WHO HAVE PUT A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF PRESSURE, WHO HAVE NOT BEEN AS SUPPORTIVE OF MANY IMPORTANT DEMOCRATIC PRIORITIES, GIVEN THE MAJORITY THAT WE HAVE.

AND JUST AS RECENTLY AS THIS PAST WEEK, YOU HAD THREE MODERATE DEMOCRATS WHO BASICALLY HAVE UP ENDED WHAT MANY HAVE CALLED THE CORNER STONE OF THE BUILD BACK BETTER, THE $700 MILLION THAT COULD BE EXTRICATED FROM BEING ABLE TO NEGOTIATE PRICES FOR MEDICARE AND DRUGS.

>> Braude: $700 BILLION, NOT $700 MILLION -- >> YES.

I'M THINKING MASSACHUSETTS NUMBERS AND NOT U.S.

NUMBERS.

$700 BILLION.

THE UNITED STATES -- CONSUMERS IN THIS COUNTRY PAY TWICE AS MUCH FOR PRESCRIPTION DRUGS.

THERE IS A SIGNIFICANT MAJORITY OF BOTH DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS WHO SUPPORT BEING ABLE TO NEGOTIATE AND LOWER DRUG PRICES.

SO, YOU KNOW, THIS IS SORT OF A POX ON ALL OF OUR HOUSES.

ULTIMATELY, PRESIDENT BIDEN IS GOING TO HAVE TO BE A STRONG NEGOTIATOR AND LEVY A LOT OF PRESSURE ON INDIVIDUAL LEGISLATORS, BUT I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT THING RIGHT NOW IS WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN WITH THE DEBT CEILING LIMIT?

HOW DOES MITCH McCONNELL, WHO IS NOW BEING HOUNDED BY FORMER PRESIDENTS, THE FORMER MER GUY, TO GET RID OF HIM AS THE MINORITY LEADER.

I DO THINK THAT THE REPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO HAVE TO STEP UP, ESPECIALLY AS IT PERTAINS TO THE DEBT LIMIT INCREASE.

>> Braude: WHICH IS ALWAYS -- BY THE WAY, FOR THOSE WHO ARE NOT STUDENTS OF THIS, WHICH HAS ALWAYS BEEN BIPARTISAN.

I ONLY HAVE 30 SECONDS LEFT.

STARTING WITH YOU, NADEEM, LET'S ASSUME YOU'RE BOTH WRONG IN TERMS OF YOUR CAUTIOUS OPTIMISM, WHAT IS THE CONSEQUENCES FOR THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, NADEEM?

30 SECONDS.

>> I THINK THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY HAS TO BE EXTREMELY UNIFIED AND EXTREMELY TIGHT IN THE WAY THAT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY HAS BEEN OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS, TO THE DETRIMENT OF THE COUNTRY AND ITS COMPETITIVENESS.

THE DEMOCRATS COULD LEARN A THING OR TWO, IF WE CAN TAKE A FEW PAGES FROM THAT BOOK WITHOUT BEING TREMENDOUSLY TOXIC.

I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE HAVE GOT TO GO.

AND THAT CAME STRAIGHT FROM THE TOP IN THE PRIOR ADMINISTRATION.

I THINK BIDEN COULD HAVE WHAT IT TAKES, BUT, YOU KNOW, IF WE DON'T PUSH THIS ONE ALONG THE LINE, THE MID TERMS CAN BE QUITE BAD.

>> Braude: SHANNON, WHAT HAPPENS IF YOUR PARTY CAN'T PULL IT TOGETHER?

>> I THINK THIS IS AN EXISTENTIAL THREAT NOT ONLY FOR THE PARTY BUT FOR THE COUNTRY.

BECAUSE IF WE DON'T HAVE SOME VICTORIES AND SHOW THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WE CAN TAKE THE POWER AND WIELD POWER TO BENEFIT DEMOCRATS, INDEPENDENTS, AND REPUBLICANS, AND MAKE DIFFERENCE IN THEIR LIVES, THERE WILL BE SOME SERIOUS CONSEQUENCES THAT GO BEYOND THE ECONOMY.

>> Braude: SHANNON AND NADEEM, I MISS YOU BOTH.

I HOPE TO SEE YOU IN PERSON SOME DAY SOON.

BE WELL.

>> THANK YOU.

JIM.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Braude: LONGTIME VIEWERS OF THIS SHOW KNOW THAT THERE ARE SOME THINGS I FEEL STRONGLY ABOUT, AND, NO, THIS TIME I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT HOW MUCH FALL IS OVERRATED AND HOW BADLY WE NEED TO TRANSITION TO PERMANENT DAYLIGHT SAVINGS, THOUGH IT IS, AND WE DO.

I'M TALKING ABOUT A MUCH MORE FUN CAUSE NEAR AND DEAR TO MY HEART: A CAR-FREE NEWBURY STREET, WHERE YOU CAN STROLL, DRINK IN HAND, ANYWHERE YOU PLEASE AS YOU SHOP.

OF COURSE, I HAVE BEEN ON THIS MISSION FOR YEARS.

I FIRST PITCHED IT TO THE THEN-BOSTON POLICE COMMISSIONER BILL EVANS THE FIRST TIME HE EVER CAME ON "BOSTON PUBLIC RADIO."

HE SAID HE'D MENTION IT TO THE THEN-MAYOR MARTY WALSH.

AND A YEAR OR SO LATER?

VOILAÁ!

BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO TAKE MY WORD FOR IT.

A FEW YEARS BACK, WALSH ACKNOWLEDGED THE CRITICAL ROLE I PLAYED.

>> Braude: DO YOU WANT ME TO SPEAK BEFORE YOU AT THE OPENING CEREMONY, OR SHOULD I SPEAK -- WHERE AND WHEN WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO ADDRESS THE CROWD?

>> I WAS THINKING AT THIS POINT I SHOULD PROBABLY INTRODUCE YOU.

[LAUGHTER] >> Braude: HE DIDN'T, BUT HE SHOULD HAVE!

ANYWAY, AFTER THE FIRST OPEN NEWBURY STREET IN 2016 WAS A SUCCESS, IT BECAME A BIT OF A TRADITION.

ONE THAT BECAME ALL THE MORE IMPORTANT THIS SUMMER, WITH BUSINESSES STILL TRYING TO RECOVER FROM COVID.

AND I AM HAPPY TO ANNOUNCE THAT, ONCE AGAIN, A CAR-FREE NEWBURY STREET WILL BE BACK THIS WEEKEND.

MICHAEL SERPA, THE CHEF AND OWNER BEHIND THAT STREET'S GRAND TOUR, AS WELL AS THE BACK BAY'S SELECT OYSTER BAR, JOINS ME NOW TO TELL US MORE.

>> Braude: MICHAEL, GREAT TO SEE YOU.

>>> >> THANKS FOR HAVING ME ON.

>> Braude: WHAT IS THE OCCASIONAL CLOSING OF NEWBURY STREET AND THE STUFF THAT HAS HAPPENED IN TERMS OF COVID, WHAT HAS IT DONE FOR YOUR BUSINESS?

>> FOR WHAT WE'RE DOING ON NEWBURY STREET, THE CITY, YOU KNOW BEING VERY HELPFUL IN TERMS OF ALLOWING OUTDOOR DINING THIS YEAR, AS WELL AS LAST YEAR, AND ALLOWING THE STREET PATIOS -- THAT HAS BEEN -- YOU KNOW, THAT SAVED A LOT OF RESTAURANTS, ESPECIALLY WITH LAST YEAR BEFORE THE VACCINATIONS AND THIS YEAR HELPING KIND OF TO RECOVER A LITTLE BIT AND TO KIND OF DIG OUT OF THE HOLE THAT COVID HAS PUT THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY IN.

>> Braude: HOW ABOUT THE CLOSURES THEMSELVES?

THOSE SUNDAYS?

>> THE SUNDAYS THEY'VE BEEN DOING THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS, THANKS TO YOU, HAVE BEEN, YOU KNOW -- THEY HAVE BEEN SUPER.

IT HAS BEEN SUPER BUSINESS FOR RESTAURANTS, THE SHOPS, AND PEOPLE ON THE STREETS ARE ACTIVE.

AND I THINK AS A PILOT PROGRAM, WHICH WE'VE BEEN DOING IT FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS NOW, OPEN NEWBURY STREET, OR OPEN NEWBURY, HAS BEEN WILDLY SUCCESSFUL.

IT HAS SEEN THAT THE APPEAL AND THE DRAW OF A PEDESTRIANIZED CITY, AND A BIG SHOPPING STREET, A BIG SERVICES STREET -- SO I'VE SEEN IT IN PERSON.

THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE COME OUT FOR THIS, AND IT IS A DRAW.

>> Braude: BY THE WAY, THERE WAS A POLL, AN IN INFORMAL ONE, ASKING PEOPLE IN GREATER BOSTON HOW THEY FELT ABOUT A PEDESTRIAN STREET ONLY IN THEIR CITY, AND 92.5% SAID YES.

SO IF THE RETAIL SHOPS, THE RESTAURANTS, THE COSTUMERS ALL LIKE IT -- I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE THE RIGHT PERSON TO ASK, BUT WHY AREN'T THERE MORE OF THESE THINGS?

WHY ARE THERE ONLY OCCASIONAL SUNDAYS, LIKE THE ONE COMING UP?

>> I THINK THERE IS A LITTLE BIT OF OPPOSITION, WHICH I THINK IS, YOU KNOW -- HONESTLY, I THINK IT IS WRONG.

IT IS OPPOSITION BY SOME VENDORS, PARTICULARLY THE NEWBURY STREET LEAGUE, OPPOSING THE PEDESTRIANIZING OF IT, OPPOSING MAKING OPEN NEWBURY STREET A WEEKLY TRADITION OR A WEEKEND TRADITION OR FULL-TIME BY REMOVING THE PARKING, AND THEY'RE SAYING THAT PEOPLE WON'T COME DOWN IF THERE IS NO PARKING.

LOOK AT THE VIDEO, PEOPLE COME DOWN.

THERE IS NO PARKING, AND THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE COME DOWN.

WE LOST PARKING BECAUSE OF THE RESTAURANTS HAVING STREET PATIOS, AND PEOPLE STILL COME OUT AND THEY STILL COME OUT TO THE SHOPS.

I THINK IT IS ACTUALLY MAKING IT MORE OF A DRAW IF THERE IS AN AREA WHERE YOU CAN GO SOCIALIZE, WALK AROUND, AND MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT OF A BENEFIT FOR EVERYBODY INVOLVED, INCLUDING THE SHOPS, INCLUDING THE SERVICE COMPANIES, THE SERVICES AND ALL OF THAT STUFF, BY SAYING, OKAY, WE'RE GOING TO DO THIS EVERY WEEK.

LET'S DO EVERY SUNDAY TO START, FOR SPRING TO FALL.

NOW YOU CAN INVEST ON HAVING AN OUTDOOR SPACE, AN OUTDOOR MARKET, TABLE, COMPUTER SYSTEMS, ALL OF THAT STUFF, SO THE SHOPS CAN ACTUALLY GET THE BENEFIT -- >> Braude: THAT'S A GREAT POINT.

BY THE WAY, I HAVE TO SAY -- YOU'RE TALKING TO SOMEBODY IF I HAD THE POWER, AND I HAVE NONE, I WOULD SAY EVERY SUNDAY IN A SECOND.

>>> BUT I HAVE TO SAY, WHY ARE YOU THINKING SO SMALL?

>> I'D LIKE TO SHUT IT DOWN ALL OF THE TIME.

>> Braude: THAT'S EXACTLY -- FOR THOSE WHO DON'T KNOW, FOR 40 PLUS YEARS IN MY HOME TOWN, CHESTNUT STREET WAS CLOSED, AND THE MAIN THOROUGHFAIR, AND THEY ENDED IT A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, AND NOW THEY'RE REGRETTING IT.

ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS GO TO BROADWAY IN TIMES SQUARE, AND IT IS SHUT DOWN.

YOU SPEND TIME IN FLORIDA, AND MIAMI HAS LINCOLN ROOTER.

>>ROAD.

>> LINCOLN ROAD IS A PRIME EXAMPLE.

LINCOLN ROAD HAS, JUST LOOKING AT COMMERCIAL REAL ESTATE, SOME OF THE HIGHEST RENT RATES IN THE CITY.

BUT LINCOLN ROAD IS A DESTINATION ON ITS OWN.

IF IT IS JUST CARS DRIVING DOWN IT AND LOOKING FOR PARKING, IT IS JUST A WHATEVER.

BUT NOW THAT IT IS PEDESTRIANIZED, IT IS ONE OF THE BIGGEST DRAWS IN SOUTH BEACH.

>> Braude: BY THE WAY, THE THING I DON'T -- AGAIN, YOU'RE NOT THE POLICY GUY, BUT QUICKLY, I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE PARKING THING.

IF YOU CAN'T PARK ON NEWBURY STREET, WHICH GENERALLY YOU CAN'T ANYWAY, YOU PARK ONE BLOCK OVER, YOU TAKE A RIDE SHARE, OR GOD FORBID YOU TAKE THE "T." THERE ARE OTHER PLACES THAT SUPPORT TRAVEL, RIGHT?

>> SO THERE IS A WAY TO GET HERE, AND THERE IS OPPORTUNITY.

AND THE PARKING IN BACK BAY, THEY JACKED THE PRICES UP ON METER PARKING, WHICH IS TOTALLY FAIR, AND YOU CAN'T PARK.

SO, AS AN EXAMPLE, I WAS LOOKING AT OUR PATIO, AND WE HAVE A NICE STREET PATIO ON NEWBURY, AND IT IS ABOUT THREE PARKING SPOTS.

THAT IS USUALLY THREE PEOPLE IN THREE CARS, AND THEY'RE SITTING THERE THERE FOR HOURS, IT COULD BE TWO HOURS OR SIX HOURS.

THE PATIO WAS FULL OF 40 PEOPLE OR SO HAVING A GREAT DINNER, UTILIZING THAT PUBLIC SPACE, SO MORE PEOPLE ARE UTILIZING THE PUBLIC SPACE, SPENDING MORE JOBS, I HAVE TO HAVE MORE KITCHEN STAFF.

SO A SPACE THAT THREE PEOPLE WOULD USE TO LEAVE A CAR IS NOW BEING UTILIZED BY 40 OR 80 PEOPLE TO ENJOY DINNER.

IT IS THE HIGHEST AND BEST USE OF THE SPACE OF THE CITY BY TAKING AWAY THOSE PARKING SPACES AND THEN GIVING THAT TO THE RETAIL SPACES THAT THRIVE HERE.

AND IT IS JUST A DRAW FOR THE CITY THAT WE'RE REALLY MISSING.

>> Braude: WE'RE OUT OF TIME.

I HAVE TWO THINGS TO SAY: ALL THREE OF YOUR RESTAURANTS ARE FABULOUS, AND THINK BIG.

THINK BIG, MICHAEL.

>> I THINK IT SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN ALL OF THE TIME, AT LEAST SPRING TO FALL, AND I THINK THE CITY IS MISSING AN OPPORTUNITY TO TRANSFORM THE CITY.

>> Braude: MICHAEL, IT IS GOODS.

GOOD LUCK.

>> THANK YOU.

LIKEWISE.

>> Braude: NEXT UP, SPACE IS KNOWN AS THE FINAL FRONTIER.

BUT THERE ARE PARTS OF PLANET EARTH WE'RE STILL LEARNING ABOUT, TOO.

IN FACT, WHILE ONLY TWO DOZEN PEOPLE HAVE FLOWN TO THE MOON, EVEN FEWER HAVE EVER TRAVELED TO THE DEEPEST KNOWN POINT OF THE OCEAN, CLOSE TO SEVEN MILES BELOW SEA LEVEL.

IT'S KNOWN AS CHALLENGER DEEP IN THE MARIANA TRENCH.

WAYLAND RESIDENT AND OCEAN EXPLORER ROBERT McCALLUM MADE THE JOURNEY EARLIER THIS YEAR AND JOINED ME SHORTLY AFTER TO TALK ABOUT IT.

>> Braude: ROB, IT IS A PLEASURE TO MEET YOU.

>> THE PLEASURE IS MINE.

THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Braude: TO PUT THIS IN PERSPECTIVE, YOU WENT QUITE A BIT FURTHER DOWN INTO THE OCEAN THAN FELLOW NEW ZEALANDER HAD TO GO TO EDMUND HILLARY TO REACH THE TOP OF MT.

EVEREST.

WE NO HOW DANGEROUS HIS EFFORT WAS.

HOW DANGEROUS WAS YOURS?

>> IT IS ALL RELATIVE.

WE WERE CONTAINED IN A TITANIUM SPHERE THAT IS ABOUT SIX FEET ACROSS, AND SO THE PRESSURE IS ALL ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE SPHERE.

INSIDE THE HULL OF THE VEHICLE, WE'RE NOT SUBJECTED TO ANY PHYSIOLOGICAL STRESS THAT THE MOUNTAIN CLIMBERS WOULD HAVE BE SUBJECTED TO.

I HAD AN EASY RUN COMPARED TO SIR EDMUND.

>> Braude: WHEN YOU SAY "ANAN EASY RUN," THERE IS ALSO A PSYCHOLOGICAL PART TO THIS.

20,000 POUNDS OF PRESSURE PER SQUARE INCH, IS THAT A CORRECT DESCRIPTION OF WHAT YOU ENCOUNTER AS YOU GO DOWN?

>> AT THE DEPTH THAT WE'RE OPERATING, IT IS ABOUT 16.5 P.S.I., SO POUNDS PER SQUARE INCH.

SO WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT YOUR CAR TIRE, IT HAS A PRESSURE OF AROUND 35 POUNDS.

I MEAN THE PRESSURE IS IMMENSE.

TO PUT IT INTO LAY TERMS, JUST ON THE HATCH THAT WE GET IN AND OUT OF THE VEHICLE FROM, THERE IS THE WEIGHT OF ABOUT 2200 TONS.

SO THAT'S AKIN TO FIVE FULLY LADEN BOEING 747s.

IT IS AN IMMENSE AMOUNT OF PRESSURE.

>> Braude: I'D SAY SO (laughing).

WHY DID YOU DO THIS?

>> THIS IS THE LAST FRONTIER OF EXPLORATION ON EARTH.

I MEAN, FROM HERE WE GO TO MARS.

IN FACT, WE'RE TAKING OUR FIRST BABY STEPS ON MARS, AND YET WE HAVE THIS VAST PART OF OUR PLANET, THE HIDDLE ZONE, THE OCEAN BELOW 20,000 FEET, THAT WE'VE SCARCELY VISITED.

>> Braude: ARE YOU AS CALM AS YOU ARE RIGHT NOW WHEN YOU'RE DOING THIS?

I'M SERIOUS, BY THE WAY.

>> YES.

IT IS A TRAIT.

WE SAY DON'T GET FRIGHTENED, JUST THINK FASTER.

BECAUSE THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS GOING ON.

AND YOU CAN ONLY MANAGE THEM IF YOU'RE THINKING CLEARLY.

SO THERE IS NO NEED TO PANIC.

WE TRUST IN THE ENGINEERING.

WE TRUST IN THE MATH.

AND WE TRUST IN THE SCIENCE.

>> Braude: SO I BELIEVE WHERE YOU WENT IS CALLED "IN THE HADAL ZONE," AND I BELIEVE IT IS NAMED AFTER HAITI'S.

CAN YOU DESCRIBE TO US MERE MORTALS, WHAT IS IT LIKE DOWN THERE?

>> FOR ME, IT IS IMMENSELY CALMING.

I MEAN, YOU CANNOT HEAR ANYTHING OUTSIDE THE VEHICLE BECAUSE THE HULL IS SO THICK.

YOU CAN ONLY HEAR THE SOUND OF YOUR OWN BREATHING AND THE WHIRL OF THE COMPUTER.

AND THERE IS NO SENSATION OF MOVEMENT.

SO IT IS A VERY RELAXING PLACE TO BE.

YET AT THE SAME TIME, YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT IS GOING TO COME INTO VIEW NEXT.

AND SO WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT SCREEN THERE ARE THE SULFUR MOUNDS, WHICH UNTIL OUR DIVE NO ONE HAD ANY IDEA ACTUALLY OCCURRED AT THESE DEPTHS.

SO IT IS A VERY INTERESTING PLACE TO BE.

IT IS BOTH RELAXING AND YET IMMENSELY EXCITING, WHAT IS GOING TO COME INTO VIEW NEXT.

>> Braude: WHAT KIND OF LIFE EXISTS DOWN THERE?

>> THERE ARE NO FISH BELOW -- AROUND 28,000 FEET.

>> Braude: BECAUSE OF THE PRESSURE?

>> BECAUSE OF THE PRESSURE.

IT IS NOT POSSIBLE FOR ANIMALS TO GROW STRUCTURE AS WE KNOW IT.

BUT THERE IS LIFE ON THE BOTTOM.

AND THE STUFF THAT WE'RE REALLY INTERESTED IN IS THIS BACTERIAL MASSING, WHICH IS A VERY PRIMITIVE FORM OF LIFE.

THERE IS SOME THOUGHT THAT THIS IS ACTUALLY WHERE LIFE ITSELF BEGAN.

BUT THE REASON IT IS INTERESTING IS BECAUSE IT IS WHAT WE CALL AN EXTREMAPHILE, WHICH IS AN ORGANISM THAT CAN SURVIVE EXTREMELY HOSTILE ENVIRONMENTS.

THAT'S THE KIND OF LIFE MARS IS LOOKING FOR AND EVENTUALLY WE'LL LOOK FOR FURTHER OUT IN THE GALAXY.

>> Braude: WHAT VALUE MIGHT THERE BE TO ME AND THE REST OF THIS PLANET OF WHAT YOU AND PEOPLE LIKE YOU LEARN AT SEVEN MILES DOWN IN THE MARIANA TRENCH?

>> I SAY TO PEOPLE THAT WE KNOW SO LITTLE ABOUT THIS ENVIRONMENT THAT WE BARELY UNDERSTAND WHAT QUESTIONS WE SHOULD BE ASKING, LET ALONE HAVE THE ABILITY TO UNDERSTAND THE ANSWERS.

I MEAN, WE WILL LEARN THE LAST LITTLE BIT OF THE PIECE OF EVOLUTION BY UNDERSTANDING HOW THIS LIFE SURVIVES IN EXTREME CONDITIONS.

WE WILL LEARN A LITTLE BIT ABOUT HOW OUR PLANET WAS FORMED.

WE MAY FIND USEFUL COMPOUNDS, PARTICULAR MEDICAL COMPOUNDS, IN THE DEEP.

WE MAY START TO CRACK THE RIDDLE OF HOW WE'RE GOING TO REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF CARBON IN THE ATMOSPHERE.

WE MAY LEARN A LOT MORE ABOUT THE DYNAMICS OF OUR OCEAN.

THERE IS SO MUCH TO LEARN, AND YET WE'RE SORT OF IN THE -- WHERE I WENT, YOU KNOW, LESS THAN 20 PEOPLE HAVE BEEN, AND 24 PEOPLE HAVE ORBITED THE MOON.

WE'RE REALLY AT THE DAWN OF EXPLORATION.

>> Braude: YOU USED THE WORD "CALM" TWICE, BUT CAN YOU DESCRIBE FURTHER -- I CAN'T IMAGINE WHAT IT MUST BE LIKE WHEN YOU ACTUALLY GET THERE, AND YOU KNOW, AS YOU SAY, YOU'RE IN A PLACE WHERE FEWER THAN TWO DOZEN HUMANS HAVE EVER GONE.

YOU'RE AT THE DEEPEST PART OF THE OCEAN.

CAN YOU DESCRIBE JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE WHAT YOU FEEL LIKE INSIDE WHEN YOU GET TO THAT POINT?

>> THERE ARE THREE PHASES TO THE JOURNEY.

THE LAUNCH AND THE VOYAGE DOWN TAKE AROUND FOUR, FOUR AND A HALF HOURS.

AND DURING THAT TIME WE ARE REHEARSING THE SORT OF FINAL DRESS REHEARSAL, IF YOU LIKE, WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO ON THE BOTTOM.

AND WE'RE DOING THAT BECAUSE IT COSTS SUCH A LOT OF MONEY AND TAKES SUCH A HUGE IN VERI- OF INVESTMENT TO GET PEOPLE THERE, YOU DON'T WANT WASTE A SINGLE MINUTE.

ONCE WE'RE ON THE BOTTOM, WE'RE CARRYING OUT ALL OF OUR TASKS.

ONCE WE LEAVE, WE ARE SO PLEASED TO HAVE DONE THE MISSION, IT IS TIME TO KICK BACK, RELAX, FLY THE FLAGS, AND CHAT ABOUT WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO WITH ALL OF THE INFORMATION WE PICKED UP.

>> Braude: YOU'RE SO THRILLED WITH YOUR TEAMMATE, I'M TOLD IS AUSTRALIAN, YOU WERE WILL TO EAT THE WORST SANDWICH IN THE WORLD, A VEGA VITE SANDSANDWICH.

>> THAT'S CORRECT.

FOR BOTH OF US TO BE ON THIS VOYAGE TOGETHER WAS A TRIP OF A LIFETIME, LITERALLY.

>> Braude: ROB, CONGRATULATIONS.

IT IS REALLY THRILLING, AND I'M GLAD TO HEAR ABOUT IT.

THANKS FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Braude: THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT.

WE'LL BE BACK TOMORROW.

THANKS SO MUCH FOR WATCHING, AND PLEASE STAY SAFE.

♪♪ Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org