♪ opening music ♪ ♪ Gavin> Welcome to This Week in South Carolina special report.

I'm Gavin Jackson in Elgin, South Carolina, where former Governor Nikki Haley just wrapped up a campaign event as she kicked off her statewide bus tour this week.

We also caught up with former President Donald Trump on the trail.

But first, I want to take you to an interview I had with the former governor in Orangeburg.

But, Governor, thanks for making time for us on your bus tour in the final days of the South Carolina campaign trail.

I want to talk to you about a couple of things we've been seeing and hearing from your main opponent right now, Of course, former President Donald Trump.

We just saw him in South Carolina for the first time since September this past weekend, and he had some, multiple things to say.

But one of them.

We'll listen to a clip that he played, discussing your husband, Michael.

We'll play that clip right now.

Trump> Where's her husband?

Oh, he's away.

He's away.

What happened to her husband?

What happened to her husband?

Where is he?

He's gone.

He knew.

He knew.

Gavin> And so you mentioned that your husband, Michael at every campaign stop.

He's serving overseas.

Tell me what your thoughts were when you heard Donald Trump say that about him.

>> I mean, obviously, as a military spouse, you know, you feel that first.

I mean, we're incredibly proud of Michael, but we're also proud of every military man and woman who serves and their military families.

It's a family sacrifice.

And so the first thing I thought about, obviously, was, yes, my kids, his parents, you know, all of that.

But you go to the bigger story, it's not personal.

And the respect of South Carolina is a strong military state.

My brother was a veteran from Desert Storm.

You know, Michael served in Afghanistan.

Now he's serving overseas.

It's a sacrifice.

And the idea that this keeps happening over and over again from him.

to whether he said in Arlington Cemetery, you know, what was this for or whether it's him saying they're suckers or whether he's saying this about my husband, you can't say something like that and say that you respect the military.

And who shoulders do you think we stand on?

Because it's every man and woman who's ever served.

We stand on their shoulders because they believed in something bigger than themselves and they were willing to sacrifice for it and to have someone mock anyone in the military is a problem.

And it's another reason why he brings chaos and just division to everything he touches.

Gavin> Is that disqualifying for him to become president again?

Haley> I don't even think he should have a driver's license, if you talk bad about a member of the military, I certainly don't think he should be president of the United States.

Gavin> Trump also calls you a globalist warmonger, among other things, that he says who wants open borders.

How do you respond to those claims when people say you want a war?

Haley> Everything he said yesterday at the rally was a lie.

Everything.

You can look at all that.

We can fact check every bit of it.

We passed the toughest illegal immigration law in the country.

President Obama sued us over it and we won.

So you can't say I'm for open borders because I think we haven't done enough and I don't think he did enough.

Then you go and you look at wars.

You don't have a loved one in the military and want to see them go to war.

But you obsess over preventing war.

That's what I focus on, is what do we need to do to prevent war?

What do we need to do to make sure our men and women never have to go fight a war overseas?

That's what I've always focused on.

He knows that.

But look, when you can't say the truth and win, then the only thing he knows to do is to lie, to win.

And, you know, that says more about him than it does about me.

Gavin> Well, Governor, it's been nearly two years since Russia invaded Ukraine.

A lot of folks say you focus too much on Ukraine instead of the southern border.

How do you respond to that?

What about Congress now, the Republicans in Congress scuttling that bipartisan border deal that also had funding for Ukraine?

Haley> First of all, border security is priority number one.

America is acting like it's September 10th.

And we better remember what September 12 felt like.

It only takes one person to cause a 9/11 moment.

You know, I think the border bill that they had, there was a lot of good in it.

I think the fact that it strengthened asylum laws is hugely important.

You know, under Trump, under the Trump administration, he let in 3 million illegal immigrants.

That's because the asylum laws weren't strong enough.

So we have to have that.

The part where the bill was weak was it didn't allow for remain in Mexico.

Very important to make sure no one even steps foot on U.S. soil.

And it had a 5000 person threshold.

We don't even want one person coming over that's illegal.

But what they should have done, there are two things that went wrong.

One, Congress should stay in D.C. and not come home until they figure this out and get the job done.

Two President Trump does not need to tell them not to do anything until the election because you're putting every American in harm's way by saying that.

That's the problem, is he's more focused on himself than he is on protecting the American people.

But Congress needs to do their job because they pushed the can down the road long enough.

And we can't continue to have what's happening on the border happen.

Gavin> But you would have supported that bill as it was, the way it was?

Haley> No, I think we needed I think they needed to go in there and strengthen it.

It wasn't strong enough and we needed to do that.

In terms of Ukraine, I'll tell you that the one thing about that is I don't think we should give any country cash because you can't follow it and you can't hold it accountable.

But the reason people should care about Ukraine is because Putin said once he takes Ukraine, Poland and the Baltics are next.

Those are NATO countries that immediately puts America at war.

This is about preventing war.

So I think we should support them, giving them the equipment and ammunition they need to win.

Gavin>We'll talk about NATO in a moment, but do you think the Republican Party, the Republican Party, is falling apart under Donald Trump right now?

You're talking about Congress.

You look at the RNC, at this race alone.

What do you think?

Haley> I mean, look at just this last week.

You had Trump lose his immunity case, which he's got a lot of cases he's going to have to deal with.

He, by his own words, has said he's going to spend more time in a courtroom than on the campaign trail.

That's a problem.

He spent $50 million of campaign contributions on personal court cases.

The RNC is broke.

I don't know how they think they're going to defeat Biden that way.

Republicans lost a bill on Israel.

Republicans lost a bill on the border.

The RNC chair lost her job.

Trump had his fingers in all of that.

It's total chaos.

We can't continue to live like this.

We can't continue to go like this.

And that's why in every general election poll you see, Trump does not beat Biden.

You look at all of those same polls and I beat behind Biden by 17 points.

And you think about what a win like that would be.

That's bigger than the presidency.

That's House.

That's Senate.

That's governorships.

But it's a mandate going into D.C. with a double digit win to stop the wasteful spending and get our economy back on track, to get our kids reading and go back to the basics in education to secure our border, not let them go home.

No more excuses, and to make sure we prevent wars around the world.

That's what we want, is to have a strong and proud America again.

Gavin> Why can't folks quit Donald Trump then?

What is this?

Haley> I mean, look, I think that a lot of people see that when he was in office, he never got a moment's peace or an ounce of credit.

I'm the first one to say I voted for Donald Trump twice.

I was proud to serve America in his administration, but we have to look at the losses.

He lost in 2018.

He lost in 2020.

He lost in 2022.

How many more times do we have to lose before we say, okay, maybe he's part of the problem?

Gavin> We were just talking about foreign wars and he also made a comment about NATO undermining the security of the NATO Alliance.

We'll play that clip right now.

Trump> NATO was busted until I came along I said, everybody's going to pay.

They said, well, if we don't pay, are you still going to protect us?

Absolutely not.

They couldn't believe the answer and everybody - You never saw more money pour in.

The Secretary General, Stoltenberg- I don't know if he is anymore, but he was my biggest fan.

He said all these presidents came in.

They'd make a speech They'd leave and that was it.

And they all owed money, and they wouldn't pay it.

I came in.

I made a speech and I said, you got to pay up.

They asked me that question.

One of the presidents of a big country stood up and said, "Well, sir, if we don't pay, and we're attacked by Russia will you protect us?

I said, you didn't pay, you're delinquent?

He said, yes, let's say that happened.

No, I would not protect you In fact, I would encourage them to do whatever the hell they want.

You've got to pay.

(applause) You've got to pay your bill.

Gavin> And during that clip, he said, "One of the presidents "of a big country stood up and said, "Sir, if we don't pay "and we're attacked by Russia, will you protect us?

"I said, No, I would not protect you.

"I wouldn't not protect you.

"In fact, I would encourage them to do "whatever the hell they want."

Talking about Russia.

So what's your reaction when you hear that clip?

When you hear those words.

Haley> It's irresponsible at best, and it's reckless to even imply something like that.

Understand, you're siding with a thug who invaded a pro-American free, you know, freedom loving country and half a million people have died and been wounded because of it.

This is the same thug, Putin, who kills his opponents.

This is the same thug who has wanted to destroy us forever.

I worked with Russia every day at the United Nations.

They are not a friend of ours.

They don't want to be a friend of ours.

They are playing him like a drum and he needs to see that.

But the idea that you would put our friends in harm's way to help an enemy is unthinkable.

NATO has been a success story for 75 years.

We haven't had war in the region.

Russia has never invaded a NATO country.

They've invaded Georgia, Moldova and Ukraine because they're intimidated by the alliance.

You don't weaken the alliance.

You strengthen the alliance.

Now, do we want those countries to pay more?

Of course.

But you don't do it by weakening.

By what he just said, he put more Americans in harm's way.

Gavin> So do you think he trusts Vladimir Putin more than he does his own allies, America's allies?

Haley> I mean, I talked about this in my book.

I wrote about during the administration.

I had to go sit down with him and say, stop this bromance that you're having with Putin, because I saw the press conference that he gave and he was trusting Putin and he was believing Putin.

And he had some sort of like, I don't know, some sort of fan issue over Putin.

And what you have to understand is the guy is evil and the guy's never done anything to help America.

He's always done everything to try and hurt America, including partnering with China, saying they're their total friends, and with Iran.

We don't want to be friends with someone like that.

Gavin> So do you trust Donald Trump, then?

Haley> I don't trust Donald Trump's judgment, because if you're going to go and criticize military members and say the things you do about them and you're going to go and praise dictators, that's not a winning combination for keeping Americans safe.

Gavin> So, Governor, you've been on the campaign trail for about a year now.

Tell us about that, what it's been like.

A lot of people even here in South Carolina remember when you first launched your campaign back last February, didn't think you'd make it this far.

A lot of people were even pressuring you to drop out before even ballots were cast in Iowa at the caucuses or New Hampshire as well.

What's your reaction been?

What's it like being on the campaign trail?

Haley> I've always been an underdog.

It's the only thing I know to be, and I'm incredibly proud of how far we've come.

We had 14 people in the race.

We've beat a dozen of the fellows.

We got one more left.

We're going to work really hard to close this gap in South Carolina.

Then we're going to go on to Michigan and Super Tuesday.

This is about the fact I don't want my kids to live like this.

I don't want anybody else's kids to live like this.

America is better than what we're seeing now.

You don't defeat Democrat chaos with Republican chaos.

And you have to acknowledge 70% of Americans don't want a Trump Biden rematch.

The majority of Americans disapprove of Donald Trump and a majority disapprove of Joe Biden.

And do we really want to look at a point where we've got a country in disarray and a world on fire and our two candidates be in their 80s?

We don't want that.

We've got to have a new generational leader, someone who can serve eight years fully focused to get things back on track.

Gavin> So, is that what really motivates you?

I mean, I know that does because you mention all the time on the campaign trail, but when it comes to folks telling you to drop out or, or any number of things, obviously you're still fundraising.

Plenty of money in the bank.

Is this more of a matter for you to say, I did everything I could to prevent the inevitable and the inevitable being him losing to Joe Biden in November?

So maybe in 2028 or in the future, you can say you should have listened to me essentially, and that we need to do this better.

Haley> No.

This is not about a future run.

That's not in the cards.

That's not anything I'm looking at.

This is very much about the fact that if you look at the younger generation, they see the debt and they don't know how it's going to impact them.

They worry about whether they can find a job.

They wonder if they can own a home.

The average home buyer in America is 49 years old.

The American dream is leaving them.

We've got to make sure that we leave things in good shape for our kids and our grand kids.

That's what I worry about, is I see all of the dangers around the world and the fact that it's becoming more chaotic.

I look at all the division in our country and we're getting further and further away from the values that made our country so great.

I just want to help get it back to where it needs to be.

I think every American family deserves that.

And I think if I don't fight for that, then, you know, what's your purpose in life?

I think my job, has always been, to try and make life better for people today than it was yesterday.

And that's, this is the way I'm trying to do that.

Gavin> And when you do your fundraising swings and you talk to folks, what are you telling them?

What is breaking through to them to give you so much money?

I mean, it's interesting that some people would think maybe things would have dried up by now, but there are still people giving you millions of dollars.

What's getting through, in your opinion?

Haley>...first you have to look, these aren't like big donor bigwigs that everybody likes to say.

I've had 250,000 donations from all 50 states.

95% of those are $200 or less.

These are grassroots donations that we're getting from people who are tired of the chaos.

They're tired of the division.

They want to see Republicans and Democrats respect their taxpayer dollar.

They worry about their kids.

They want a country that's at peace and safe.

That's what people want.

And so when you talk about it and they hear it in a way, that's one normal.

Two, they know I've got executive experience, but I've also dealt, you know, on a foreign policy level where I dealt with Russia, China and Iran every day.

That's where they see us want to go.

And so they encourage me because they, too, have hope and faith for our country.

Gavin> And wrapping up here, Governor, we heard that you were requesting Secret Service protection.

Tell us a little bit about that.

What's so credible?

What you're facing on the campaign trail right now?

Haley> I mean, when you... put yourself out there, you're going to have threats.

The threats have increased.

You know, we've had a couple of different swatting incidents.

We've had some threats that have come across.

It's been things that get uncomfortable.

Gavin> Have you ever been approached or anything ever happened to you?

Haley>...we're not going to talk about what the threats are, but I will tell you, I'm not stopping.

That doesn't slow me down.

It doesn't stop me.

You know, they filed for us to get that.

We're going through whether we get it or not, because we think this country, we have a country to save.

And I'm going to keep on pushing.

Gavin> And then also looking at the folks that are in this race, too.

Senator Tim Scott obviously was in this race, he had a lot of money and you're still here, He's not.

Any thoughts on him and how he's gone about endorsing former President Trump, too?

Haley> It's his decision.

He's got to sleep with his decision.

I sleep very well at night.

Gavin> And these other politicians that you've seen that have always underestimated you.

Your thoughts on them?

Haley>...look, I look at the South Carolina political elite.

I never thought I was going to get their endorsements.

I didn't ever try to get their endorsements.

And the reason was I know they're upset because I required them to show their votes on the record and not hide behind voice votes.

I know they're upset because I made them disclose their income and pass ethics reform and show taxpayers who was paying them.

I know they're upset because I vetoed half a billion dollars worth of pet projects.

I know people in D.C. don't like the fact that I want term limits.

I don't like the fact that I say if they don't give us a budget on time, they shouldn't get paid.

Don't like the fact that I don't think they should trade in the stock market.

You know, all of those things I've always pushed against the political elite.

That's why I've always been the underdog.

It's because I don't get the establishment people.

But I'm okay with that.

I don't want the establishment people.

That's not who I am at my core.

At my core is I want to help every average American family make today better than yesterday.

I don't care about whether the political elite like me any more than I cared about Russia, China, Iran liking me when I was at the U.N., I've always been very focused on who it is I serve, and I'm very mission focused on the fact that it will be serving the American people.

Gavin>...we'll be going forward right?

Haley> Yes.

Absolutely.

>> All right, Governor Haley, thank you so much.

Haley> Thanks so much.

Gavin> Appreciate it.

Haley's barnstorming bus tour brings smaller crowds, but at multiple stops a day, like at a Harley Davidson dealership in Elgin, Monday, where she was asked about still supporting Trump should he become the Republican nominee.

Haley> Right now, it's not about losing my vote, because I'm still trying to defeat him and I'm going to do it until the very last day in South Carolinians have not voted.

So regardless of what y'all want to report about, you better think about that.

What I will tell you, though, is anyone who will put down members of the military, anyone who will say that while they are deployed, which is pretty disgusting.

Do you really want that person being the leader of all those who may have to go fight in a war?

Gavin> Haley's been crisscrossing the state on her bus tour, and I've spoken with some of the voters about what's important to them ahead of the primary.

Robert Collins> She's I mean, she's in the middle.

She's somebody who can, I think can work with Republicans and can work with Democrats and the way it is in the Congress now is, it's like they're bitter enemies.

They're supposed to work together and they won't, and they won't for one reason.

That's Donald Trump.

Look what he did with the border deal.

That's the best chance we've had in 40 years to do something, and he just killed it.

So I think it could be better, like Nikki said.

I mean, I was a Vietnam veteran and you know what he said about the military in the past and the idea about NATO.

I mean, he has...seems to have this fixation about Putin.

I don't even know where that's from.

You know, Kim Jong Il, whatever.

I mean, he's crazy.

He's crazy.

Doug Busbee> Every day, Donald Trump blows my vote.

When he made fun of John McCain, John McCain was a war hero, served in Vietnam, as did my older brother who got shot all up.

♪ My heart goes out to veterans.

Any man, any man (who) makes fun of our veterans and belittles our veterans.

There's a low life, in my opinion, and I can't go along with that.

He is a self-serving individual.

We need a person that's willing to bring everybody together.

And I can't go along with any man that belittles our military.

I am the odd man.

A lot of my friends, a lot of people that I respect highly, ♪ listen to what Donald Trump is saying and how they can swallow it.

I don't understand it.

I really don't.

And... it even divides within families, divides within churches.

Yes, I've seen it within my own family, within my own church.

So...it's tough.

It's tough.

But I believe Nikki Haley is our best hope.

I really do.

Gavin> With two weeks to go until the primary, former President Donald Trump held a rally at Coastal Carolina University in Conway.

His first rally in the state since September.

It drew more than 3300 people and came just days before his rally in North Charleston, which drew more than 1700 supporters.

>>Yes, so we got an email like we just got tickets and then we heard Trump was coming to our campus and was like, I got to go because this is a once in a lifetime opportunity where this is never going to happen again.

You know.

You can hear it.

Listen, listen, You hear it.

You hear it.

USA.

Everyone loves Trump.

No one doesn't like Trump.

So, (Gavin with off screen question) Steven Fehervari> Yeah, yeah.

So, yeah.

So it's my first time ever voting.

So I'm very excited and I'm excited to give my vote to Trump for sure.

First of all, his energy, it's different, you know, and this rally, you're going to, you're going to see from this rally.

Second of all, like I agree with most of the things that he does.

Like politically, like, you know, like the wall and everything like that, so, and, so...I mean, yeah, I agree with most of the things he does.

And, you know, if I agree with him I'll vote for him.

So.

Cheryl Sieracki> Dr. Fauci's virus hits.

I had to move to a red state.

So what really brought me to South Carolina was the weather, the warmth, and because there are so many more Trump supporters down here.

No, never, Nikki.

Never anybody else but President Trump.

He deserves another term.

It was his last time and he deserves to be in again.

Gavin> What are your thoughts about - you have the wanted- You have that, like, Cheryl Sieracki> Who cares.

He's just being persecuted is the word.

And you can definitely tell there's a two tier justice system.

Look at what just happened.

Gavin>...what do you, think might happen if he does get convicted?

Do you think that will hurt his chances in November, or do you think you guys will.

rally behind him?

Cheryl Sieracki> Every time he gets indicted or convicted his poll numbers go up and we support him more because we know what's happening.

And yeah, Trump for President.

Trump all the way.

Rep. Russell Fry> Look, I call this a primary in name only because the results continue to show that Donald Trump is not only winning in the polls, but he's winning at the ballot box.

And so I think what I'm hearing most from voters is that they are frustrated that there's still a primary that is ongoing.

They're ready to coalesce and they're ready to march towards victory in November.

...this district is incredibly important, Horry County, where this rally is being held today.

It's a top three voting county in the state when it comes to a Republican primary.

So this county propelled Nikki Haley in 2010.

It propelled Donald Trump in 2016.

It is a central piece to victory in whatever you're running for.

And...look, you have a pretty interesting mix of retirees that have moved here from the "Rust Belt" in the Northeast.

You have.

You know, people who have lived here their entire lives who think conservatively anyway.

And so it's a very good snapshot in this county and in this region of the broader Republican electorate.

Trump> She did a job.

She was fine.

She was okay.

But I didn't put her there because I wanted her there at the United Nations.

That wasn't up to me.

I wanted to take your lieutenant governor.

Who's right here and make him governor.

That's what I wanted.

(applause) And I wanted you to have Peggy as a first lady.

You have the best first lady.

So let's...I was interested in that too..because this man, when I was campaigning for a long time, I got along with her, make contributions to the governors.

She had always called contributions.

Called for years.

And then I decided to run.

And I said, one person I know I have is Nikki.

I have Nikki Haley, Tricky Nikki, (laughter) I have Haley.

And so now I announce and I call various people for endorsements.

I don't think they mean much unless it's my endorsement.

Right, Henry?

It doesn't mean much.

And she didn't return my call, just years ago.

I then I call her again and again, and finally she returns.

"No, I'm sorry.

I'm with somebody else."

I won't tell you who because it happens to be, now, a friend of mine, we've all unified and friends.

But you know what?

She is such an...(laughs) (crowd laughter) But I had a man who at the time I didn't know the lieutenant governor believed in Donald Trump.

He believed in me.

And I had the lieutenant governor and the governor had some other candidate, and Henry, we blew that field away like nothing.

Right?

Rep. Nancy Mace> Right.

I mean, South Carolina likes Nikki Haley, but they love Donald Trump.

And I've been speaking to voters for the last several months, voters in the Lowcountry, voters across the state.

He's crushing it.

And you're going to see a giant.

Huge win on February 24.

Lowcountry is very diverse.

It's probably more competitive down here than anywhere else in the state.

But by and large, in the polling that you're seeing, he's running away with it by over 30 points, 30 to 35 points in most places.

Sen. Tim Scott> We need a president who stands for American values, not a president who sits down, and can't remember exactly where he is.

We need a president who not only loves our Country, but loves every single American, And goes to work Every single.

Day for our country.

Trump> But I told Tim, -so, he was - look, he did well, but he wasn't as forceful as he is because he feels, you know, he doesn't want to talk about himself.

It's sort of interesting.

And then I see him on Face the Nation and Meet the Press and all the stuff, and he's just killing everybody.

And I called him, I said, you know, you're a much better candidate for me than you were for yourself.

I mean it.

This guy is the best.

He was like a different person.

(applause) He was like a different person.

(applause) And I say that with admiration because I'm the opposite.

I'm much better for me than I would be for somebody else.

I would be terrible.

I'd be terrible if I was in that position, I'd get up.

All right, I did a great job.

You should have voted for me,....

But this guy's okay.

All right.

I'm going home.

No, I would be terrible.

I'd be the opposite of Tim, but that shows great character with Tim.

It really does.

We will make America strong again.

We will make America proud again.

We will make America safe again.

And we will make America great again.

Thank you, South Carolina.

God bless you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

God bless you all.

Gavin> For more from the campaign trail, you can check out the South Carolina Lede podcast that I drop on Tuesdays and Saturdays.

You can find it on South Carolina Public Radio.org or wherever you find podcasts.

You can also stay with This Week in South Carolina as we continue to cover the primary.

And of course, we'll have live primary night coverage on February 24th on ETV starting at 7:00.

For South Carolina ETV, I'm Gavin Jackson.

Be well, South Carolina.

♪ closing music ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪