♪ Gavin Jackson> Welcome to "This Week in South Carolina", I'm Gavin Jackson.

This was the final week of the special U.S.

Senate Republican primary campaign to replace the late Senator Lindsey Graham on the ballot, with the appointed Senator Darline Graham and fifth District Congressman Ralph Norman, in a dead sprint to the August 25th runoff, after neither secured a majority on August 11th.

The two candidates have been crisscrossing the state campaigning, and President Donald Trump is set to hold a rally for Graham in Myrtle Beach on Friday evening.

Myrtle Beach is in the Republican stronghold of Horry County, which Graham came in second in, behind seventh District Congressman Russell Fry, who has since endorsed her.

Also, this week was the only runoff debate.

It was held at the Newberry Opera House and moderated by Newsmax's Greta Van Susteren, as well as former SCGOP Chairman Van Hipp and myself.

On this episode, we recapped key moments from the debate ahead of the August 25th election.

>> I'm Ralph Norman.

I'm from Rock Hill, South Carolina.

Been a real estate developer for 40 years.

I'm married to the same woman for 51 years: four children, 17 grandchildren, and I turned 40 back in June and we're doing very well.

No.

I, it's such an honor to be here under unfortunate circumstances.

Darline, you were a good sister, and he was a good brother.

But that being said, I'm anxious and I'm excited about what we can do for South Carolina.

My, our, my differences are, aren't with, Darline or really any of the Republicans.

Our differences and who we're fighting are the Socialist Democrats and the rhinos that go along with it.

That's our real battle to save this country.

It's not other Republicans.

That being said, we have, we have a task ahead of us.

And the differences, I'm a proven I've got a proven record, folks.

You can look me up.

For eight years I've been in Congress.

I'm the most conservative member.

You know how I'm going to vote.

My résumé is my record.

And whether it's all the agencies that that rate how you vote.

I've been a taxpayer hero for as long as I can remember.

Club for Growth, Heritage Foundation, the rating agencies I'm conservative.

What you see is what you get.

The differences that I will point out, we have an unknown candidate, who I'm running against.

What's clear and loud and clear, I'm not the candidate for the Washington mainstream, Greta Van Susteren> Mr Congressman... <-the what> Mister Congressman, sir, I've got to call time over the unfortunate.

I know that your shot clock is not working, so I'm gonna have to call time on you, sir.

I'm sorry.

Rep.

Ralph Norman> That's good.

Greta> Senator, You have 90 seconds.

Sen.

Darline Graham> Thank you.

...it is quite a lively crowd tonight.

But thank you for having me.

And I want to begin by saying thank you for the prayers.

It's been a difficult month for me and my family, so the prayers are very much appreciated.

I also want to thank President Trump for his endorsement and other state and national leaders like Tim Scott and Russell Fry.

I also want to thank Lindsey's staff because they have committed to staying with me, and they are the gold standard when it comes to providing constituent services.

A little bit about me.

Lindsey and I grew up in one room in the back of a bar and liquor store in Central, South Carolina, where my parents worked long, hard hours.

That's where we learned a work ethic... work...block, work ethic, and, the value of a dollar.

For 30 years, I have served the people of South Carolina.

For the past seven, I led a state agency.

I turned it from a struggling agency into a national model.

We had 130 employees and a $90 million budget because of that, I was elected president of a national organization for blind agencies.

I was a member of the State Workforce Development Board.

I served on that for several years.

I'm a problem solver, a critical thinker, and a leader.

I'm a volleyball mom.

I love watching my daughter play volleyball, and I know that boys do not belong in girls sports.

They certainly don't belong in the girls locker room.

I'm pro-life.

I was honored and excited today to get the Susan B Anthony endorsement.

That meant a lot to me.

I strongly support the Second Amendment.

Greta> Senator, I'm going to do the same to you that I had, unfortunately have to do to the Congressman.

I have to cut you off at the 90 seconds, so we get through the debate.

I've now done this to both of you.

So I'm going to go to the questions now, and I'm going to ask the first question.

Congressman, I give it first to you.

Gas prices are a record high.

Americans are pinched at the gas station.

Half the country is living paycheck, paycheck to paycheck.

What can you do in the U.S.

Senate to try to allieve this economic pain for so many citizens?

Rep.

Norman> First thing, I'm going to do in the Senate is wake them up.

Save America is my goal.

Save America.

Save America is my goal.

The SAVE Act should, it should have been passed.

It hasn't been.

That being said, on lowering gas prices, we got to get the Straits of Hormuz opened.

And the president has done a good job.

He inherited a wreck with Joe Biden.

So what he will have to do is, is move forward to get making sure the war, the oil prices are low.

I've got to make sure and I will do as a, as a businessman, go to the businesses, cut regulations, talk to exactly what is needed.

Affordability is needed all over the country and it's not happening in South Carolina.

It's not happening, it's straining people all over the country.

So with, with regulations and getting involved, I know what they go through from, from day one.

And I will take the time to do that.

Greta> Senator, same question to you.

Gas prices are a record high.

Americans are pinched at the grocery store, living paycheck to paycheck, half of America.

So what can you do in the U.S.

Senate to alleviate that pain?

Darline> Well, I know how that feels.

There's 50 million people in...South Carolina.

Half of them live paycheck to paycheck.

60% (percent) of them don't have three months savings to get by.

I've been there before.

I've struggled too.

I trust President Trump to get the Strait of Hormuz open.

Iran is the weakest it's been in 47 years.

But we cannot let them get a nuclear weapon.

But I tell you who voted to increase the gas tax, and that's my opponent.

And I can tell you that doesn't help people at the pump.

Greta> Next question goes to my colleague.

Van?

Van Hipp> On the economy, Senator Graham, the national debt is approaching $40 trillion dollars, and interest payments are consuming an increasingly large part of the federal budget.

What significant area of federal spending would you be willing to cut or reform to put the country on a more sustainable fiscal path?

Darline> I think President Trump has already done a great job cutting spending.

He's cut a lot of fraud, but I think there's more fraud to be cut.

When I worked in state government, one of the things I focused on was duplication of services.

I worked to cut duplication of services to save taxpayers dollars.

I think there's more duplication going on in the federal government that we can work on cutting.

So I think we need to identify more fraud, wasteful spending and duplication of services.

Van Hipp> Right.

Congressman Norman, same question.

What areas of federal spending would you be willing to cut or reform?

Rep.

Norman> The cancer of America is overspending.

The fact is, we don't cut anything in Congress.

I've been a lone wolf, lone voice for cutting.

The D.O.G.E commission identified over $100 billion, and we only got nine.

Only had 9 billion in cuts because politicians, both Democrat and Republican, cannot cut.

You got to live within your means.

And we're facing a crisis, not just on the national level, at every single agency, the highway trust fund.

Social security is going to run out at the end of, actually, before the end of the six year term, that I'll serve in the Senate.

So, it's cutting spending, it's identifying the waste, fraud and abuse and, that we already know, but we hadn't had the courage to do it as a body.

And that's what I will be a voice for doing that and singling out exactly what items needed to be cut and bring it to, bring it back to South Carolinians and to the people all over the country.

Greta> Gavin, you have the next question on the economy.

Gavin> Congressman, back to you talking about, social security.

Can you kind of elaborate on that?

1.1 million South Carolinians rely on social security.

But like you said, the program faces a significant financial shortfall and insolvency in six years.

At that point, the law requires a 22% percent cut.

Do we keep social security?

How do you fix it?

And please be specific.

Rep.

Norman> No, we can't keep it as the way it is.

Again, it's kind of like the cuts.

We just haven't had the courage to, to tackle social security because we have worthless notes that it's not like the money that is the taxpayers that's, that's accumulating for them to spend and to say it's a, to face a 25% percent cut is outrageous.

It ought to infuriate every American.

What we will do is put up concrete bills that will let Americans spend more of their own money.

And the politicians simply have not been willing to do that.

Americans are perfectly capable of spending their own money.

Money is one thing.

The other thing is just calling it out for what it is.

There are people that have a,... social security number that aren't even living.

That's part of the waste, fraud and abuse that's taken advantage of the system.

We'll have the courage to call it out and, to try to get this system solvent.

Gavin> Senator Graham, to you talking about social security, how you would save it.

Sen.

Graham> Social security was put in place to protect our elderly from living in poverty.

So we have to keep social security.

Lindsey and I relied on social security when our parents, our parents died when we were younger.

So social security is important.

I have an aunt who's 90 something years old.

She relies on social security.

At the agency I worked at, one of the ways we did it is we helped train individuals who are blind or low vision go to work.

Our successful employment rates were trending up each year.

What that meant is they were no longer relying on the government, on social security, disability insurance and S.S.I., so there were less reliant on the government and earning wages to support their families.

So the more programs we have like that and also cutting fraud and waste.

Gavin> Yeah, we'll go to you, Senator.

President Trump signed a 60 day deadline for ending the war with Iran and reaching an accord on its nuclear program.

That deadline passed on Monday.

Do you support continuing this war with Iran?

You have both voted against a war powers resolution, containing the president.

So what does victory look like?

What is a win for you when it comes to Iran?

Sen.

Graham> You know, I fully trust President Trump when it comes to the war in Iran.

47 years this has been going on.

Iran is the weakest they have been in 47 years.

The one thing that concerns me is we cannot let them get a nuclear weapon.

So I trust President Trump and everything he's doing.

I think he's got this, and I trust him on it.

Gavin> Congressman, what does a win look like in Iran for us?

Rep.

Norman> Well, it looks like we took them out militarily.

As far as, a nuclear, getting a nuclear weapon, where where you had, you know, Obama paying cash bribes in the middle of the night.

So he did the job to take them out.

They were a severe threat, and he had the courage to do that.

Now, I think that we've got to end it.

I think he, we're going to have to tell.

He's going to have to tell the American people, what's it going to take if, if the Straits of Hormuz are still dominated by a country that's supposed to be decimated.

We got to have some, you know, some understanding on that, because I'm not for endless wars.

You win them and you get out.

And so I think once he explains, that, it's what's going to have to be done.

You know.

(applause) Greta> Let me, let me follow up on that, Congressman.

So what would you recommend to the president that he do?

Rep.

Norman> Well, I think he needs to you know, he sees the, the what's happening in Congress.

It's codified.

If you if you had to put if you've put boots on the ground after 60 days, you have to get approval from Congress.

He doesn't have the approval.

The Democrats hate him for anything he does.

So he can't get approval from Congress.

But I think he just needs to, if it's more air power, if it's more, taken out the, you know, the whoever the lunatics are that are running the country.

Now, what makes it difficult is they have no regard for human life.

I mean, they made the comment that they will outlast this president, President Trump.

And so, you know, how are they able to do that?

So if that, he's going to have to go ahead and do whatever it takes to get them out?

Greta> Senator, what, how would you answer that?

What would you tell the president to do?

Sen.

Graham> Well, he's already decimated the leadership over there.

I think he's doing a great job.

The Strait of Hormuz, obviously, is not open yet, but I think it will be again.

I trust him, to do what he can to end, end the war in Iran.

Again, they're the weakest they've been in 47 years, and I know they're still dangerous.

But his goal is to make sure they don't have a nuclear weapon.

We cannot let these people get a nuclear weapon.

So we, I think we have to pay a little bit now, but ultimately, in the end game, if we prevent them from getting a new nuclear weapon, which is his goal, I think he will be he'll be successful and our country, will be much better off.

You have a question, munition supply.

Senator, are Taiwan and the South China Sea, national security issues for the United States?

If so, why?

Sen.

Graham> I'm sorry, could you repeat the question?

Are Taiwan and the South China Sea, national security issues for the United States, and if so, why or how?

Sen.

Graham> I'm just going to be honest here.

I'm not on national security, that I'm not that informed on national security.

So, But I do support the military.

My brother was in the Air Force for 33 years.

So I will do everything I can to support the military.

My, my dad was in the Army.

I'm not a polished politician up here.

National security is not my thing, not my area of expertise.

But I do support the military.

Greta> Congressman, I'll give you a chance to respond.

And I'm sure you recognizes that- Rep.

Norman> Taiwan's a definite ally.

And, you know, we have a trading relationship with them that is beneficial to the United States, Chips being one of them and others.

So what the, what the president is doing right, is he's enabling Taiwan to defend themselves against China.

But it's peace through strength that he's showing with Iran that China, Russia, others, are looking at it so that, that they don't want to deal with, with America.

And that's why they haven't attacked, Taiwan.

If they had some weak Democrat in office like Biden or...another Obama, yeah, they'd take it over.

But, we can't let that happen.

We've got to take, take a strong, a peace through strength is, is working.

Greta> So we're going to turn to artificial intelligence.

Gavin, you have the first question of whether to regulate or not.

Gavin> Yeah.

That goes to Congressman Ralph Norman talking about A.I.

There are currently no regulations on A.I.. It's truly the Wild West.

Is A.I.

too powerful to be left to companies to regulate at this time?

Rep.

Norman> Absolutely.

It's too powerful.

Anybody who has grandchildren when what you see on TV and the dangers that it has when they can make images exactly, and imitate your voice.

Now, it's going to be tough to do because, you know, the Internet is unregulated anyway, for the most part, and government hasn't been able to do it.

It doesn't mean you stop trying, but, yeah, you try to regulate what you can and find out what you can to so that it's used in a good way, instead of, instead of hurting American children and Americans in general.

Gavin> Senator Graham regulating A.I.?

Sen.

Graham> A.I.

is definitely out of control.

There have been so many nightmare stories and situations.

There have been situations to where A.I.

has gotten out of control and hacked into businesses and taking over accounts and systems.

This is very concerning.

A.I.

is growing smarter and smarter, so there has to be some federal bans put on this.

We have to step in and get control of A.I.

It's against China, but, I mean, A.I.

itself is becoming smarter, so I'm very concerned.

It's a scary situation.

I'm, I'm personally very scared of A.I.

Greta> Van, you have a question?

Artificial intelligence.

Van Hipp> Yes.

Senator Graham, multiple South Carolina counties Colleton, Newberry, Greenwood and others have passed or are advancing moratoriums on A.I.

data centers because of concerns about the power grid water and ratepayer bills and so forth.

President Trump and his administration, however, views A.I.

data centers as a top national security priority in the A.I.

race versus China.

As a senator, where would you come out on this, and how do you balance the state and the federal interests?

Sen.

Graham> Well, we were just talking about how dangerous A.I.

is, how China is leading in this.

So we can't let China beat us in this A.I.

battle.

That's a national security issue.

And it becomes very concerning to me.

So when it comes to data centers, I think it needs to be heavily involved by the communities.

There needs to be guardrails in place, regulations in place.

But again, we have to have data centers because we can't let China win in this, A.I.

battle.

But the way to do it is to put guidelines on these companies to where they have to build their own water and power supplies, or either subsidize utilities so that the rates decrease, not increase.

So again, it's more about community involvement.

It's about having a transparent framework in place to protect the environment.

So it's, putting the guidelines and guardrails in place for communities, and they should decide.

Van Hipp> Congressman Norman?

Rep.

Norman> You know what, you changed your position because you originally said you were just data centers in general.

That's what you said.

(applause) I hear you.

Here's where, here's where I stand on this.

I believe in the 10th Amendment states' rights.

I think that, for that, data center, that's being built, whereas it causes diminution in value of homes around it, the community does going to have is going to have to take ownership, and use what they can and find out what's the water usage do for their community.

What is the electricity needs?

The big thing I will do is not let the politicians in local communities or advocate for them, not to give the farm away and not do have incentives for these data companies, let them pay their own way and if it has a return on investment for them.

But it's got to have a return on investment for the community.

And they've had a free ride.

So I will call attention to it and I will, we'll do whatever it takes to, to educate the public on what's going on.

Greta> Senator, do you want to respond to the comment he made about you?

Sen.

Graham> Yes, I do.

Obviously, I just said I'm for data centers, but I also said that there needs to be community involvement, community guidelines, community guardrails.

Maybe you didn't hear that part, but, what about Silfab that you negotiated a deal in your backyard where a company that mixes chemicals was built near several schools, and I believe one school has been shut down because there was a leakage into the ground water near the school.

Rep.

Norman> ...you tell them.

Silly, silly season again.

Silly season again.

This was a company that took over a vacant building.

The schools aren't in process.

Henry McMaster and his group gave them money.

They approved it.

So, that's just not true.

All that stuff that was put out, was not true.

But it's, it's a, something that is not an issue, now.

Those community did the right thing to sue them.

It'll end up in the courts It's actually more of a zoning issue that they are operating a business that maybe didn't fit the zoning.

I'm not on the county council.

I'm not on the city council.

I didn't approve any funding that they went, that they got.

Greta> Senator... Sen.

Graham> Can I rebut that?

Do I get a rebuttal to that?

Greta> Go ahead.

Sen.

Graham> Okay, well, okay.

Okay, let's, let's say that you didn't negotiate the deal.

It was up to the county council.

I don't necessarily believe that.

But you did take money from the lobbyists for Silfab.

Thousands of dollars from S.E.I.A.

that's a lobbying group for Silfab.

Rep.

Norman> Sil.... There again, it's silly season again.

The lobbying group, Silfab was one out of... they had hundreds of clients, solar panels I've investigated because it's, I'd rather get it from the sun than I had from buying it from one of the companies.

So again, that's that's misinterpretation.

It's- Greta> All right, let's... All right, let's move on.

♪ Rep.

Norman> First of all, it's a privilege being here.

I wish we had another debate like this.

We had one tomorrow.

You canceled it.

You didn't want to come.

All that to say is, all that to say is that, you know, we have a, we're at a turning point in America.

We are in a turning point where the democrat socialists are taking it over.

We've got to stop it.

Again, I mentioned the fact where her money is coming from.

The main street, Washington is with her.

They're not with me, nor do I want them.

I've never been, subservient to anything in Washington.

Washington is broken.

Look, I will, I will use whatever I can to break the filibuster.

I will take, make sure that the Senate wakes up, and votes on the SAVE Act.

But other than that, we're going to call them out for what they're doing to this country.

Faith, family and freedom, what the Democrats are against.

The people supporting you are against that.

And we got we have to stop that.

I will recruit more solid business people to run, and I'll put South Carolina first.

(applause) Greta> Senator.

(applause) Senator.

Senator, Senator Darline Graham.

Your closing argument, closing remarks, please.

Sen.

Graham> Yes.

First of all, I'd rather be out in South Carolina meeting the voters than here on this stage with you.

But the fact is, I've done more in 20 days than you have done in 20 years.

I did a lot of research to try to find out exactly what you have done.

You named a post office, so good job.

That's all I can find out that you've done.

And we have spent $1.7 million dollars on your salary for the past ten years, and you named a post office.

So, yeah, I've done, again, more in 20 days.

I've got the Russia sanctions bill passed.

I've co-sponsored the SAVE America Act.

I've co-signed seven anti-abortion bills.

I was the deciding vote in President Trump's A.G.

pick, Todd Blanche.

So again, more in 20 days than you have done in literally 20 years.

And I think you're confused because I don't know if you want to be in South Carolina or Washington because you said you wanted to go to Washington to clean up the swamp, then you wanted to come back to South Carolina to run for governor.

Now you want to go back to Washington again to clean up the swamp.

So what is it you want to do?

♪ Gavin> Congressman, more than 40 million acres of farmland in the United States is owned by foreign entities, according to the Department of Agriculture.

Chinese investments amount to less than 1% percent.

What does Congress need to do to restrict our adversaries from owning, American land and our resources?

Rep.

Norman> What South Carolina needs, needs to do is find the land that's owned by China, and they either get it back or make it so hard so they can't develop it.

You don't put up with that.

They bought land in Columbia that is near our military institutions.

You stop that.

Same thing on the Confucius Institute where they had, colleges were letting Chinese students come in under the guise of majoring in one, one, major and then switching to get our secrets.

They sent the brightest and the sharpest over here.

You got to stop that.

I called them out.

Guess what.

Two were, were guilty of it.

U.S.C., Carolina and Presbyterian College, my alma mater.

I called them out.

Guess who called me.

The lobbyists.

We're making all this money.

I said, yeah, because you're giving the country away.

And they changed it.

But we, we have to be aware of that and stop it and not let them form these L.L.C.s, where they buy them and then, then move forward.

And I'll tell you, TikTok, you hadn't heard it yet, but TikTok is still controlled by China.

We would never be able to have a TikTok in, into China.

as they're into our country.

Greta> Time.

Gavin> All right, Senator Graham.

Sen.

Graham> I think China is destroying our businesses.

So President Trump has been the strongest president we've had against China.

It's kind of scary.

They have bought up too much farmland, the military base he's talking about is Shaw Air Force Base.

They bought farmland right next to Shaw.

They're interfering with our food supply chain.

That's a national security threat.

A.I.

and they're becoming leaders in the A.I.

industry.

This is dangerous for our children, interfering with A.I.

and businesses.

There have been instances where children are committing suicide because of A.I.

So we cannot let China win.

We have to continue to fight against China.

I would support a federal ban to prevent them from buying farmland because we, we cannot let China win.

(applause) Gavin> You can watch this report, campaign trail coverage, the full debate, and much more at youtube.com/SCETV news.

We will also have a live election night show on Tuesday, August 25th that you can watch here on SCETV, listen on South Carolina Public Radio or on C-Span.

For South Carolina ETV, I'm Gavin Jackson.

Be well South Carolina.

♪ ♪