>> major chat -- funding for Chat Box is provided by the members of the New Jersey education Association, making public schools great for every child.

♪ David: hey everybody.

Welcome to Chat Box.

Less than a month to go before election day and we are talking about it.

First with the partisan punditry and then politics Professor Lindsay Cormack on how we can talk to our kids about politics and government.

Let's start with Republican Chris Russell of checkmate strategies and LeRoy Jones, chairman of the state drama Craddick -- Democratic committee.

Good to see you both.

>> great to see you.

Always a pleasure to be on with you.

>> same here.

David: two friendly.

Let's start at the top of the ticket.

Fair to say Donald Trump is unlikely to win Jersey.

What evidence are there that he prevails nationwide?

>> I think he's going to do better in Jersey than he did in 16 or 20.

Nationally, this is a tossup.

It will come down to six or seven states that will all be decided by a point or two.

Right now, it's anybody's race.

From one week to the next and one pole to the next, that leans back and forth.

Right now, people know Donald Trump you get they are still trying to figure out who Kamala Harris is.

Every time she gets on TV, she doesn't seem to meet the moment.

He will continue to do what he does.

The pressure is on her to distinguish herself.

David: Democrats have been fanning out Pennsylvania come elsewhere.

You said Georgia and North Carolina.

They are in play.

What makes you think that?

>> as Chris mentioned, Jersey is going to be Kamala Harris.

But the other seven states are where it's going to be at.

I disagree with Chris.

I don't think Trump will do as well in New Jersey as Chris had indicated.

We've been moving aggressively in Pennsylvania.

Boots on the ground.

New Jersey has been very impactful in sending people to Pennsylvania.

We are doing buses there every week.

We have a mobilized phone attack.

It will be a nailbiter.

I believe Kamala is going to rue the day and be victorious.

It won't be election night.

We all know that.

But it will be a Democratic victory.

As Chris mentioned, these down ballot candidates in New Jersey, they are going to be dealing with the albatross that they have around their neck.

That's Donald Trump.

David: Republicans always say, we will do better in Jersey than you think.

Is Jones crazy thinking that Georgia and North Carolina are in play?

>> I'm sure when Andy Kim and Sue Weltman watch this, they will be really happy to hear that.

Though seven hours -- the seven or eight states where the modern presidential races are decided.

They could go either way.

You could see in electoral college win for either candidate.

Again, you see Trump out there doing what he does.

He's making inroads in place -- in places like Michigan.

These are places in the Midwest.

If he wins one of those states and Pennsylvania, this is over her -- for her.

If Trump kicks off one of the states and Pennsylvania, it turns the lights out.

David: we keep hearing about how this is a turnout election.

What does your candidate need to do?

>> we are partnering with other states.

We are moving into CD7.

That's in play.

Tom Kane is just showing himself as an empty suit.

You will see a surprise there with Sue Altman turning CD7 from red to blue.

Andy Kim has demonstrated that very calm and humble demeanor.

Looms large going forward.

He will be victorious come election night.

The rest of the nation is in play.

I don't know where Chris comes off with Minnesota.

That's a little out there.

But look, we are dealing with a guy that is a convicted felon.

Yes, he has somewhat of a cold fall -- cult following.

When people really take a look at him, and I'm talking about Democrats, very sensible Republicans and independents.

They do not want to see an individual who is marred in legal issues that have not finished yet.

Be the leader of the free world.

He has demonstrated his inability to articulate real issues.

He is so bizarre with respect to suggesting that people in Springfield, Ohio -- >> I get that you are not done with Trump.

But the question is about the operation.

What needs to happen?

is it get out the vote?

>> of courts.

-- david: of course.

david:Is there any convincing that Kamala Harris needs to make to how and -- however many independent voters there are?

>> she's not concentrating on Democrats alone.

Independence as well as Republicans.

Liz Cheney has come out for her.

There's been a number of Republicans.

Maybe Chris is even thinking about that.

Who knows?

the operation has been on par.

We are chasing vote by mail nationally.

We are doing that in New Jersey.

There's boots on the ground.

There's text banking, phone banking.

There are no stones left unturned.

The operation in this particular case is near flawless.

David: when you hear Democrats talk about, we got Liz Cheney and George Bush and Mitt Romney.

Is that a good sign or a bad sign?

>> I'm old enough to remember when Democrats considered Bush Cheney the devil.

The next coming of the Nazis.

Now they are put forth as somehow the key for Kamala Harris to win the election.

I think it shows desperation.

He can't find a lot of good things.

After that convention which was well orchestrated, she has proven to be an empty suit.

Talk about empty suits.

She hasn't been able to answer simple questions on inflation, the border, how she would do simple things.

The stuff with Trump and all of his issues is baked in with motors -- voters.

They want to make a decision on the things that matter for them.

Money in their pocket, their neighborhood being safe.

Trump is hammering those home while, is talking about being middle-class.

It's not a convincing campaign.

>> Trump cannot get out of his own way.

>> he seems to be doing just fine with that.

People don't care about that.

>> explained to me how the members of the Haitian community in Springfield, Ohio are eating pets.

Come on.

Give me a break.

This is a guy that is vying for the position as leader of the free world.

This is what he's dumped down the campaign to be.

[crosstalk] David: all right.

I'm going to stop you there.

We are going to move back to New Jersey here.

>> -- as a real candidate.

[crosstalk] David: I can't hear either one of you.

>> -- he's a threat to our freedoms.

He is the guy who should be in this space.

Chris knows all that.

David: let's move onto the state of New Jersey now.

Asha on -- and Kim.

We will be in conversation with both candidates Tuesday live right here.

Andy Kim's race to lose, no?

>> certainly Curtis david: is -- Curtis Bashaw is the underdog.

Andy Kim put more effort into winning the primary than the general election.

His ad had me asleep and 15 seconds.

Curtis Bashaw has the road in front of him that he has to get his name out, he has to get himself on TV and be able to make a case of -- to voters.

Right now, this is a sleepy race.

That gives Bashaw an opportunity.

He's a credible guy with a credible backbone.

These reaching out to people.

He can make a case that Andy Kim is the one that is too extreme for New Jersey.

Bashaw occupies the middle.

David: did Andy Kim come back to the fold or did the party have to come to Andy Kim?

he was not your first choice.

>> I think we met each other halfway.

>> in Harrisburg.

>> it's funny how Chris is touting a moderate Republican, at the same time that he supports an extreme person.

I will leave it at that because I have another adjective I could throw on the orange to pay of Donald Trump who will soon be wearing an orange jumpsuit.

David: let me talk about this incident.

>> when you start talking about radicals, I thought he was going for Sue Altman.

David: you are on fire today.

The incident at the debate.

Curtis Bashaw almost fainting.

That may have been there first and only look at him.

Do you think it's a lasting impression?

>> it's unfortunate.

I'm sure he's disappointed, knowing that these are fleeting opportunities to get in front of voters where it is so it's pensive to advertise.

I'm sure he wishes he had eaten a slice of pizza before.

I think voters look at that.

I thought he handled it well.

To Andy Kim's credit, I thought he handled it well.

I don't think that will give voters a decision point.

I think it was a missed opportunity for Bashaw and he has to overcome that a bit for the people that only read about the debate.

It's an unfortunate thing for him.

I hope he is able to recover from that.

I'm glad he's OK. >> same thing on my end.

David: I'm running out of time.

Your guy came -- kim is mostly known for being a nice guy.

What else is there in his record to define him?

>> when you are in Congress, in this Congress, it is hard to establish yourself outside of Washington when you go back home.

He has certainly been one of the most learned and intellectual members of Congress.

He has certainly been at the forefront of issues that impact marginalized people.

He champions freedoms and liberties.

He will be that voice as we continue to hold on to the sacred part of our Constitution called our democracy.

David: one minute left.

This congressional race has attracted the most attention in the state.

Sue Altman and Tom Kane Junior.

Kane is terrible at media.

This elevator scene with Ben Hulac dogging him was cringe of the week.

He's got to get out of himself and start to use some of his charm, no?

>> he's a really nice guy.

He's not comfortable in some of those situations.

Certainly not like his father was.

That doesn't mean he's not a good congressman.

In that race, he has a long track record of public service.

Someone who is a very mainstream guy.

Versus someone who is a complete lack job.

Sue Altman is a defund the police radical.

That candidate won't be elected in that district.

Tom will be fine on election night.

David: Sue Altman, now a potential rising star if she wins.

She has had to soften some of her rhetoric from her working family days.

Is that red district turning purple enough to elect Sue Altman?

>> I believe you will see an upset there.

Sue is passionate about what she believes in, what Chris just mentioned in terms of defunding the police was an over exaggeration on the Kane campaigns part.

Tom Kane, in this role as a congressperson, has only allowed the light to be shed on him.

The fact that he's just simply not -- he is nothing like his father.

He has just begun to where the mantra of being an empty suit.

David: chairman, you get the last word.

Great to talk to you guys.

Talk to you soon.

>> thanks David.

>> Seo.

David: for a lot of us, that was an interesting conversation.

For kids, maybe not so much.

Even though today's kids are going to be stuck with the fallout and saddled with all the bills of the things that politicians are talking about today, tomorrow.

How much should kids know about this process?

Lindsay Cormack teaches politics in Hoboken.

Her book touches on this very thing.

Welcome, good to see you.

>> I'm excited to talk with you.

David: you say it's up to us to help raise good citizens.

How do we go about that today with fewer and fewer examples of what to point to?

>> so I think it's up to all of us.

The research that I've done with my students here is that it's hard to get this message delivered accurately and in enough time in schools.

We aren't straining our kids to understand their government or own roles or how to pull levers of power.

I make the case that we as families should do this work.

David: you talk about a civic deficit.

What do you mean by that?

what should kids be learning?

>> I mean that many of us do not understand the very basic foundational parts of our government.

This is true when we look at national levels or understanding politics.

It's worse when we think about how little people think about state and local politics.

These deficits expand.

We get people who opt out of politics and feel apathetic.

I don't know any parents who want kids to be less powerful than they can be.

That's why we should take this on.

David: I feel like it's always been this way.

You asked kids about politics and they say, I hate it.

I imagine that is still the same thing.

>> no.

Not really.

The last survey we had of this was done by Harvard in 2023.

It found that 77% of 18 to 24-year-olds said they wanted to know more about politics.

They wanted to do no more -- more but they wanted the -- they wanted to do more but they didn't have the expertise.

David: it's hard to make a kid a Republican or a Democrat.

Personally, I'm generally on the left of things.

My children are much more centrist.

My son particularly goes towards the right.

How should that impact the way that parents approach conversations with kids?

you don't want to make your kid blue or red necessarily, do you?

>> yeah.

That's right.

There's a difference between raising a partisan and raising a citizen.

If we are raising athletes, in politics, we are athletes.

If you were trying to raise your kid to be good at football you might say, let's learn the rules.

Let's run practice drills.

Let's do training to make you stronger.

If you are trying to raise a spectator, you teach them the chanting, here's the teams we root for.

In politics, we don't have a choice.

We are all athletes.

We need to teach our kids the ground rules in trust they will figure out what team makes the most sense for then.

It's not a failure.

That's a marker of success.

It shows your house is full of love and you can understand different appreciations for different perspectives.

David: the study talked about 18 to 24-year-olds.

You talked to different age groups in some of your research.

Five to 9, 10 to 14, 15 plus.

How about younger ages?

>> yes.

The challenge there for parents is to make sure that they don't just focus on the negative things about politics.

Young children get messages about politics that are negative even if we look at things like kids literature or media.

Often times when they have a government character, it is a mayor.

At best, they are a bumbling doofus.

At worst, they are out to do harm.

The goal is not to quiz your five-year-old on the Constitution.

Make sure that they see you caring about these things and understand that there are positives and government.

Take them to vote for you.

-- vote with you.

Point out bright spots instead of complaining about the frustrations of politics.

David: you make the distinction between politics and government.

Is the difference between calling the local DPW and calling your councilman.

One of them handles government get the other one handles politics.

No?

>> yeah.

That's a fair sort of distinction.

The reason I use that word is because when we say the word civics, people glaze over.

They don't know what that means.

We do know what politics is.

We do know what government is.

Those are the institutions that carry out all the things that politics them -- get to.

There's a difference.

You fairly identified that.

David: it's tough to do this in schools.

Even when social studies or civics are offered -- they are devalued when it comes to testing and prioritizing.

What pools do parents have at their disposal that they probably didn't even know were tools for teaching?

>> we are the best role models for our kids.

The best thing we can do is let our kids see us care about this and understand the process.

In this moment right now, we will be facing an election.

Many of us will get pieces in the mail that will be like a voter guide.

If you have a child in your home, grapple with what this position is.

We have a lot of tools around us.

We have to make sure to use them and show our kids that it's cool to care about these things and the world would be better if we do.

David: take your kids to Council meetings, yeah?

>> you should.

It's good for kids and councilmembers.

I sit on a very small local appointed board.

When we have kids in the audience, that makes us consider, it's not just adults who are going to have an impact on this policy.

That's good for the system from the beginning to end.

Both from the perspective of the child but also the people who are making the rules.

David: we've been hearing a lot in New Jersey this year about giving 16-year-olds the right to vote in school board elections.

Ultimately to expand that right to other offices.

What do you think of that?

>> for school boards, I understand the argument.

That's the people who are going to make decisions about how their lives are for most of the day.

Some states do this for local and municipal elections.

I doubt we will see that at the federal level.

School boards isn't necessarily a bad idea.

It has more buy-in for the kids to see how the process impacts them.

David: the earlier they start, the longer they participate.

>> voting is habit-forming.

It is contagious.

If we can start the habit earlier, that gets them the muscle memory to be able to exercise that in all of the other elections they will have for the rest of their lives.

David: you teach politics to college kids.

How civic literate are the kids that you teach?

>> that's one of the reasons that I wrote this book.

I work at a good school.

My students are so smart.

They have high test scores.

They often come in with a really poor level of knowledge.

Part of that is that we just don't focus on this enough in K-12.

When we compare this to stem, for every $50 we spend on stem, we only spend five cents on civics instruction.

They aren't getting enough instructional time.

They don't have the resources for the teachers to support this work.

Most of the students I have come in do not know a lot.

David: it's getting to be that time of year.

The holiday season.

There is always the pitfalls of politics at the holiday event.

Any tips on how to navigate either away from politics entirely during the holiday season or a good way to navigate it to make it become a constructive part of family life?

>> I always think we should Lehman on these things.

If we can't talk about politics with our family, who can we do this with?

this is supposed to be a supportive environment.

The way that I encourage my students to go home is when they are asking someone about a political question, don't start with, what do you think about that.

The first question should be, what have you heard about that?

the reason I like that is that it releases someone from having to justify their opinion.

They don't have to be so offensive.

They can say, here's what I heard about that.

It might be online or a coworker or whatever.

Then we can start a conversation with better input.

We are saying, we have all heard different things.

Then you can move on to, what do you think?

what have you heard is the best first question because no one has to feel responsible for saying, this is the right way to see it.

David: tell us what D.C. inbox is.

>> thank you for asking about that.

It was my first big project.

It's a free resource for anyone that has every email that every member of Congress sends in their official capacity as newsletters to their constituents.

It has 200,000 emails and you can see what words have been trending over time.

What does your member talk about?

what pictures do they use?

it's a tool for us to better understand how our politics have happened at the federal level.

It is something for archivists, journalists, and researchers to have so they can understand our Congress better.

David: in real context, this is history we are living and we are shaping.

>> absolutely.

David: good talking to you.

Things were coming on with us.

>> thanks for having me.

David: here's a recommendation for a good family civics activity.

Join us for a conversation with the U.S. Senate candidates.

This is not a debate.

No rehearsed statements.

No time clock.

Just rate talk about the things that are important to you.

We are partnering with Rowan University for the slides -- this live event.

Be with us Tuesday night on 8:00 -- at 8:00 p.m.. That is Chat Box for this week.

Thanks to Chris Russell for joining us.

Follow me on X.

If you like this content, share and subscribe to the YouTube channel defined more great work from our journalists.

For the entire crew in downtown Newark, things are watching.

We will see you next week.

>> major funding for Chat Box is provided by the members of the New Jersey education Association, making public schools great for every child.

♪