- (female annonuncer) Production funding for Behind the Headlines is made possible in part by the WKNO Production Fund, the WKNO Endowment Fund, and by viewers like you, thank you.

- Representative Justin J. Pearson, tonight, on Behind the Headlines.

[intense orchestral music] I'm Eric Barnes with The Daily Memphian.

Thanks for joining us.

I am joined tonight by State House Representative and candidate for the U.S.

House, Justin J. Pearson, thanks for being here.

- Thanks so much, Eric.

it's good to be with you and Bill.

- Absolutely, and I am also joined by Bill Dries, reporter with The Daily Memphian.

A couple things, at the top here, I mentioned that Justin Pearson here is running for U.S.

House, that's the seat that Steve Cohen holds.

Steve Cohen was on the show last week, if you missed any of that, you can go to wkno.org, The Daily Memphian for the video, or you can get the podcast wherever you get podcasts.

I should also note at the top here that we've reached out to Republican House Member David Kustoff, hope to get him on the show in the coming weeks, he represents parts of Memphis and West Tennessee.

But, Justin Pearson, so let's start with just the quick 30-second pitch, why did you declare to run for this office that Steve Cohen has held since, what, I think 2006?

- Yeah, so I'm running for District 9 U.S.

Congress because I love this district.

District 9 has made me into the person that I am.

I love this community, I married my wife here, we have a home here, and we wanna build a future here.

And we realize and recognize that the times we are living in are quite challenging and difficult.

And if anybody's telling you that we need to keep things going the same, I don't think that's the right direction for us to go in.

The cost of housing is going up, people's utilities costs are going up, it's harder to live and to survive, a dollar doesn't stretch what it needs to, and heck, we were at the grocery store and a lemon's 83 cents.

The issues and problems that need to be addressed have to have new energy, new vision, new direction in order for us to be able to address it.

- We'll talk about lots of issues that we can get to in the 26 minutes we have today, but as we tape this on Thursday morning, obviously one of the biggest issues of the last few months has been the Memphis Safe Task Force, all these federal entities that are in town, from ICE to the U.S.

Marshals to Bureau of Tobacco and Firearms, all the different alphabet soup of many different entities.

Your take on, has it been a positive for Memphis, a negative for Memphis, is it a mixed bag?

What is your take on this intervention?

- I think the first thing we need to do is take a step back.

How did we get here?

Like, why is this happening?

Donald Trump and his administration said they wanted to go after Democratic-led cities, a lot of them who have black mayors, to in essence make an example out of them, and that's what's happened from L.A.

to Chicago, now in Memphis, and so we need to just take a step back and say, okay, what's happening?

And then look at the consequences.

I saw, and you all reported on this, right, where we had a family where allegedly tear gas was thrown into the home, and a mother and a father are separated from their twins, right, who are in the back of a police car.

I was at Walgreens last night, and a lady stopped me, and she said she wanted to share her story more, but she was taken out of her home, she was taking care of her elderly mother who has dementia, who's 85 years old, she's in her 60s, and was taken out of her home because they were looking for someone who they had a warrant on who didn't live in that house, and she was nearly naked, and she said it traumatized her, and not just the experience of seeing a red dot on her chest, but she had been sexually assaulted as a child, and felt humiliated once again.

And so, some of the implications of this, we have to say, do people in our community feel safer when that happens, and I just saw the Catholic Church coming out, saying that we have to treat immigrants and people in our communities better.

Mr.

Calvo, Latino Memphis, I saw him here with the Daily Memphian, and he was saying, look, the trauma and the damage that's being done is causing some irreparable harm, and so what do we do to actually address the root causes of these problems?

Because ultimately, that's how you deal with crime, you tackle the root causes.

- Well, before I go to Bill, we had Charlie Caswell, the county commissioner, Democratic county commissioner, representing Frayser, Raleigh, Nutbush, that area, on a couple weeks ago, and people can get that video online at wkno.org or elsewhere, and he had an interesting response that was, mirrored a lot of what you were saying about ICE.

This was some weeks ago, and it wasn't clear at that time what was going on with immigrants.

He said there was a lot of concern, and he had real concerns about ICE.

But he said, with the U.S.

Marshals and some of the other entities that have been in Memphis and cities, they're regularly in these cities, maybe not at this level, certainly not at this level.

But he really, a lot of people in his district, Frayser, Raleigh, Nutbush, welcomed that presence because, as he said, and I'll paraphrase poorly, that there are damaged people in our community, and for the young people, we want to invest in them, and I think he wanted the same level of law enforcement investment dollars in other things that would help these young people, but he said, for some people, they're broken, and they need to be removed from our neighborhoods and our streets.

Do you agree with that, that there are parts of a federal intervention, parts of federal law enforcement in removing violent people, Paul Young has said the same thing, to an extent, that there's benefits to that, or that's even a necessity?

- If there was a focus on getting resources into our community at the level that we have seen with this federal surge to tackle and address poverty, we wouldn't be talking as much about crime.

Nearly, at least, I think it's about $1 million a day is being spent, so if they're here for a year, that's $365 million, that's a third of the city's budget that could have went to addressing housing, access to healthcare, the affordability crisis that we're dealing with, and the truth is, if they were focusing on violent crime, that would be one thing, but over 4,000 tickets have been given to people because of license plates and tags, a lot of things that folks who don't have a lot of money struggle with, a number of people, particularly, who are being targeted by ICE, are not committing crimes.

I think research shows 72% of the people who are in ICE detention centers are not criminals, did not commit a crime, their only crime is not having documentation, and so what I think, Commissioner Caswell, and we represent some parts of the similar areas in Frayser-Raleigh, what people want is investment, we want federal investment that's actually going to improve our lives, but if the only resource that you give us is more law enforcement, that's oftentimes what people take, but what we know, and what we have to hold the truth about, is that if we address poverty, if we address housing, if we give medical access and opportunity, if we take care of veterans in the ways that we know, the government obviously can marshal the resources to directly address the things that are impacting people's lives, change will positively happen.

- Let me bring in Bill.

- All right.

- Representative, you've now been in Nashville in the State House for two years, I think you've run how many elections, primaries in general?

- Six.

- Six.

- Yeah.

- Of them in that time.

Talk a little bit about the transition from the State House to the U.S.

House, if you win this election next year.

- Absolutely.

If District 9 gives me the opportunity to serve them, I can guarantee you I got the best experience, cut my teeth at the Tennessee General Assembly, about how to do work.

Some elected officials say, well, Democrats aren't in power, and so there's nothing we can do, right?

I have to wait until I'm on a committee, or I have to wait until I'm a this or that.

But the truth is, when you're an elected official, you have a responsibility to do work, whether you're in the majority, whether you're in the minority, whether you're in the superminority, and that's one of the things that I've learned at the State House.

I'll tell you a couple of my folks, a couple examples.

Monty Fritz and I disagree on a whole lot of things.

Monty voted to expel me, right, from the State House, and now I consider him a friend.

Why?

Because we found common ground.

He and I agree that we need more investments in veterans.

He had served, my grandfather served in the 101st Airborne, Screaming Eagles, and I learned through my own research that our veterans are missing nearly $400 million in benefits compared to other counties in the state of Tennessee.

And so, we find common ground without compromising our values.

Brent Taylor, who I disagree with on a whole lot of things, posted about an environmental justice concern in North Memphis.

I reached out to him, and he called me on the phone and said, let's work together on this.

And so now I'm working to schedule a meeting with him, the company, and people in the community.

I think our community wants to see us, and I think people even in Washington, D.C.

need to make sure that we're finding common ground, even with people who we disagree with.

And the General Assembly was a good place for me to learn those lessons.

- And I believe what you've also said before is that finding common ground does not mean that you mute what your views are when you're talking to someone who you know through experience sees things exactly the opposite way, right?

- That's exactly right, because that's what, honestly, what I think elected officials should do.

And that's, I think, the care that our constituents expect of us.

You might not agree the same on something like abortion, or you might not agree on issues like that, but you do have a responsibility to say, okay, where can we agree?

And there can never be one issue that you say, this is going to prevent me from ever talking to you again.

That is not how you operate.

That's not how you do good work.

That's not how you build coalitions.

And being a community organizer to help our community protect its drinking water with Protect Our Aquifer, Southern Environmental Law Center, and others, and the defeat of the Byhalia Pipeline, all the way to now investing in air quality monitoring in Southwest Memphis, you have to build coalition, and you have to address the issues that are deeply impacting people.

- Do you want a debate before the primary in August?

- I think voters deserve a debate between myself and Steve Cohen to see the differences in our views, and how we operate, particularly being an active legislator who says, if I read something and there's a problem affecting my constituents, then I feel accountable for doing something.

So, in 201 Poplar, we saw several people have recently died.

I've been on this issue before, but I've talked with Sheriff Bonner, reached out to Frank Strada, and today I'm meeting with a number of elected and appointed officials, including DA Mulroy, to see what can we actually do to resolve the crisis that we're experiencing.

Some people look at that and say, hey, that's not my issue.

That's not who I am.

That's not how I serve.

That's not what I do.

And there are those types of distinctions that I think voters need to see on the podium, on stage.

- As we record, this is the day after the House voted to pass the spending bill that the Senate already passed, ending the shutdown after 42, almost 43 days.

What would your vote have been in that regard?

- Yeah, I would not have supported ending the Republican shutdown, simply because there's no guarantee that we are going to tackle the healthcare crisis that is looming in January 2026.

For people in our district, 11.9% of them have the Affordable Care Act.

Ninety percent of those folks have Affordable Care Act premium subsidies.

And what we're going to see for a 60-year-old couple is a 253% increase in their cost.

And so, it's gonna go from, say, six hundred or some dollars to about twenty-five hundred.

If you're 30 years old and you're making $32,000 and you're paying $58, that's gonna go up to upwards of $120.

Where's the money gonna come from?

When you're dealing with the situation that we are, we have to be realistic that people are going to be suffering if we do not guarantee access to healthcare.

And the leverages that we have in this administration, which is corrupt in so many ways, but the leverage that Democrats have, we can't yield when we know there isn't a new influx of money coming.

And people are either gonna not have health insurance, get sick, and have medical debt.

We know our state has the most medical debt of any state in the country.

Or they're just gonna struggle and use the ER as their primary care.

- Is your candidacy a reflection of a larger divide among Democrats?

Or is it unique to this district and what you see as Congressman Cohen's failings in the job?

- I think this campaign and our campaign is about how do we build the best District 9 possible.

You know, I'm grateful for Steve Cohen and his 43 years of service to this community in the State and in Congress.

And the truth of the matter is, we can be grateful for what someone has done with the recognition that we need to move in a new direction.

We need new energy and new vision to tackle the problems of today.

Because the issues of today are not the same as they were 20 or even 43 years ago.

And so, my focus is on District 9.

It's how do we lower the cost of healthcare?

How do we raise wages?

How do we invest in our veterans?

How do we tackle a public education and literacy crisis and make sure we get more investments?

A lot of folks rest on their laurels saying, look, this is what I've done in the past, which we can be appreciative for, but look at where we are.

And we know we need more.

And we have to have someone advocating for us to get more, even with a Republican administration.

- I'd say we're midway through the show.

We mentioned Steve Cohen.

We had Representative Cohen on the show last week, if you came in late.

And you can get that at wkno.org, Daily Memphian, wherever you get your podcasts.

Also trying to get David Kustoff on, the Republican member representing parts of Memphis and West Tennessee.

On that, picking up on some of what, and we're about midway through the show here.

So, picking up on some of what you were just talking about with Bill here and this, if you look at the elections of what, I guess it was a week ago, you had Zohran Mamdani, a Democratic Socialist win, Mayor of New York.

And you had Abigail Spanberger, former Representative, now Governor of Virginia, a former CIA officer, more of a moderate kind of figure.

The Democratic Party has this wide spectrum of people and backgrounds.

Where do you see yourself fitting in that?

- Yeah, look, one of the things that is paramount and that we saw in those elections was that affordability was a core issue for each of those folks.

If you operate from a place of understanding that people are struggling right now, you're not operating from a place of privilege, being a multimillionaire and living in that world, but instead you're with people who are struggling.

You know that there's an affordability crisis right now that is taking hold.

And that was an issue that was focused for everybody.

And I think for me, that's one of the primary things that I want for us to address and tackle.

Corporations are really bending the rules to create more wealth and more power for themselves.

And a lot of even small businesses and a lot of people who don't have that wealth and don't have that money are struggling in this day and in this age.

But I'm excited for Democrats because we're building a big enough tent and it's gotta be big enough for the Zohrans of the world, the Abigails of the world.

We need a bigger tent, but our message has to be focused on the issues that matter to voters and to our constituents.

- One of the things that, when Steve Cohen was on the show last week, he talked a lot about projects and money, money that he's brought home.

And that is another thing that people look to, in many cases, to the representatives and senators to bring home projects, be it for bridges, be it for parks, be it for schools, anything and everything in between.

The way the House works, there's a seniority system, right?

Steve Cohen is a very senior member at this point.

If Democrats were to take control, he would have more authority, higher positions on committees and so on.

You would be very junior, right?

And you talked a little bit at the top of the show experiencing that in the Tennessee State House.

How do you balance that?

How do you go there and say, and is it even a priority for you as you run for this office, to bring home the bacon, as people say, to bring home the dollars for those projects?

- Absolutely, we're gonna make sure that we bring home millions of dollars for projects in our community.

But that's table stakes, right?

Like every congressperson brings home money, brings home the bacon for their district.

He's not doing anything differently.

And I used to work in workforce development, helping young folks get jobs in corporate America.

And if you're doing exactly your job and what's on the resume, you get a three.

But if you are exceeding those expectations, that's how you get a four and a five.

And what we need in this moment is to exceed the expectations because the crisis that we are in, in our communities and in our country, requires people to do more.

And to your point about sort of the seniority system, I mean, one, we do need to have term limits.

I think that's something that's important.

- At the federal and state level?

- At the federal and at the state level.

Because you need new energy, you need new ideas.

And people, honestly, they get a little complacent and a little comfortable.

They get all these checks from corporate PACs and that's guiding their decision making more than their constituents.

But the truth is, when you look at what the job of a congressperson is, it is to bring home resources.

But in this time, Democrats aren't getting money in the budget.

- Yep.

- Trump's still gonna be president in the next two years.

Democrats unlikely get money in the budget.

So, then what is your congressperson gonna do?

They're gonna have to start working with the administration, start working with the other leaders to get grants and resources into the community.

- So, you'd be willing to work with the administration?

- Absolutely, I'm doing it now.

- Yeah, okay.

- I'm doing the same thing now with Governor Bill Lee's administration.

- Let's shift one more from you.

Let's shift to xAI.

You've been a real vocal opponent to the xAI, the big Colossus plant that was built down on President's Island.

There's another one now.

Granted, it's in South Memphis.

Oh, excuse me, in Southaven, but right up against the Memphis border.

Different people have different perspectives on this.

Some people look at it and say the mayor of Memphis, Paul Young has said, Steve Cohen has said, look, these are jobs, this is investment, this is the future.

And we want those jobs, investment, and the future and the tax revenue that comes with it.

You've been an opponent of those projects, why?

- Well, let me clarify this.

One of the problems with this project is they illegally polluted the air that we breathe for an entire year.

And they were allowed to do it by the Shelby County Health Department.

That has serious consequences when you're a representative of the district that's the most polluted in the entire county.

And not only is it the most polluted district, I also live there.

My wife and I have a home in 38109 where 80% of the pollution is produced.

And so, when people are talking about this, they should go and stand in front of Valero and recognize that for me and for my, the ore refinery down there, I think someone said it was Vesicle, it's actually Valero.

When you are there, you can smell the stench.

And two to three times out of the week, we wake up and it smells like sewage in our homes.

And so, it was the illegality that they were operating in.

Then it was the fact, and this was in a Daily Memphian article, that they were supposed to pay upwards of $100 million in taxes on $12 billion worth of property.

And they ended up only just paying $2 billion.

And this was an April Daily Memphian article.

- The valuation.

- The valuation.

- The tax was $2 billion.

- Exactly.

So, Ted Townsend had said it was going to be $12 billion, but it ends up being $2 billion.

- Yeah, - And so, what I want is fairness.

I am pro-business.

I think we can be pro-business.

And I also think we can be pro-people.

- The water plant that they are saying they're going to build, is that a trade-off that they would stop using water from the aquifer?

They would be recycling water.

It would not just be for them.

It could be for the steel plant and other big users, the TVA power plant down there.

I mean, there's this balance.

You've talked about sort of working with the other folks.

Is that a win?

If it happens?

- Absolutely.

If it happens, it's definitely going to be a win.

And I give a lot of credit to the community that's been advocating for that.

And I would say this, look, because of our advocacy, we send some money, go to Mitchell High School, where me and my brother graduated, Westwood, the YMCA.

They're trying to do some other things, right?

But the reality is we have to make sure that communities, no community, is being felt like they're being left behind or targeted for bad projects.

I want more headquarters in Westwood, in North Memphis, not hindquarters.

- About six minutes left.

I mean, there was pushback on this idea that they, I just, I'm not taking a position on this, that they were doing illegally, that really, they used a, the law allowed them to pollute for that period of time.

That doesn't take away from what you're saying, but they would say that they had permission to do so in the way the law was structured.

We've written about that extensively in The Daily Memphian.

I want to clarify, too, you mentioned the million dollars a day.

That is overwhelming that's being spent on the task force.

That's overwhelmingly federal money.

It doesn't take away from what you're saying.

- Exactly.

- But now, locally, it's not clear yet locally what's being paid.

I'm running for Congress.

We need federal money.

- I just wanted, just because we were comparing it to the size of the city budget, but it is actually overwhelmingly federal dollars.

Let me get, oh, and let me also say that I'm glad that Justin Pearson has agreed to do a debate on WKNO.

So, we're really excited.

- Absolutely.

You tell me the date, I'll be here.

- Okay, no, we are gonna reach out to you in the new year as well as Representative Cohen.

And if there are other candidates who are viable candidates, we will try to do some kind of debate or conversation on WKNO.

- That'll be great.

- But let me get Bill back in the mix.

- Let me get your view on the temperature nationally.

Do you think Democrats become the majority in the House and/or the Senate in these midterms?

- Look, I think Democrats have a strong chance of winning more races at the local level, at the state level, and at the federal level.

What we need to have are Democrats who are willing to stand up to this administration, but also willing to do the work of bringing home resources for their community to address the causes and the problems that they have.

One of the things that I'm talking to a lot of people about is what active leadership looks like.

Even if Democrats don't get the majority, and we don't need to wait on that to happen for people to use their influence, their voices, and their power to create change right here in the communities where we live, which is why we invested, you know, through MCAP, Memphis Community Against Pollution, because people were saying, you know, there's no air quality problem.

We invested $350,000 into studying air quality.

You can't just sit on your hands and hope for things to change, or hope for the election to happen.

You have to do work right now.

- Something that I didn't know until this campaign really got underway is that you had worked for Congressman Cohen as an intern.

And I'm wondering what that experience was like.

What do you learn from that?

How you saw politics really at a very close view?

- Yeah, my mentor in politics really is Representative Dr.

Barbara Ward Cooper, who stood up for the community, showed up to rallies, organized power, and served as a conduit for power for the people whom we serve.

And that really told me and showed me that a good politician is one who knows how to be proximate, knows how to use power and their voice in a way to create positive change for their community.

And God rest her soul, she was 93 years old when she passed away, and I still voted for her in the primary, because she had the energy to stand up and to be a part within the community.

She never thought of herself as above the people, never thought, she was entitled to a position.

She always had a servant's heart.

And that's what I seek to do.

And in serving District 86 and in talking to people, we had 50 veterans just a couple of days ago that we were talking with about the hundreds of millions of dollars that the federal government has not been giving them.

And the lack of leadership and the lack of advocacy at the federal level that has allowed for that to happen and the need for us to change it.

And so, we are building power, we're organizing, and I'm meeting everybody where they are, whether it be the business community, community organizers, and other leaders.

Like I was telling you about the organizing we're doing to save people's lives at 201 Poplar.

We have to have leaders who are actively engaged, not just resting on their hands and hoping for things to get better.

- Barbara Cooper, from my experience, was a master of grassroots politics.

- Yes.

- How does grassroots politics exist in the age of social media?

- I mean, you have to be able to do both.

We, you remember this, when we were organizing with the pipeline, protecting a million people's drinking water and saving hundreds of people's land from the misuse of eminent domain, who also thought they had a legal right to use eminent domain, similar to how other companies think they have these rights that they don't.

We were on Facebook, we were on social media, talking and engaging with people.

It's a lot of young people, a lot of young voices there.

But nothing beats knocking on the door and seeing somebody face to face.

And that's what I love doing more than anything, going door to door, canvassing, explaining our position and earning people's vote.

- Let me run through a number of projects.

We could do a whole show on each of these.

In some cases, we have, but these will at least come up at the Tennessee House, forgetting for a second what happens with the U.S.

race.

The jail, does the city, county need a new jail and should the state fund it?

- We do need more resources to make a more humane jail.

I visited it for five hours with Chief Buckner.

I told you, I talked with Sheriff Bonner yesterday.

There are things that we're gonna have to do and it is a priority of mine to determine how we make those conditions more humane.

- Okay, the takeover of Memphis-Shelby County Schools, it's almost got through last session.

They've got to reconcile some things.

Are you supportive of that?

- I'm not supportive of a school takeover.

- Okay, Regional One, big, massive expansion.

They're looking for hundreds of millions of dollars from the state, they're trying to fundraise.

Is this the right time and is the business plan solid for that kind of investment?

- We absolutely need that investment and Mayor Lee Harris has come to the state house before, and I'm supportive of that investment along with other ones that the state should do.

- Last one, not as important as those, but important to lots of people, is the Grizzlies lease deal.

If that involves more state money, would you support that?

- I would absolutely support that, recognizing that sometimes they slip in things that we want with things that we don't, as happened with the bridge.

I advocated for the bridge, but they slipped in toll roads and so you have to negotiate that, but I'll definitely advocate for anything for our district.

- Justin J. Pearson, thank you for being here.

We appreciate it, Bill, thank you.

If you missed any of the show today or missed the show we did with Steve Cohen last week, you can go to WKNO.org, YouTube, or The Daily Memphian, get that full video, or you can download the full podcast of the show wherever you get your podcasts.

Coming up next week, Interim Superintendent Roderick Richmond.

We also had Paul Young on the show recently, and I mentioned some county commissioners on the show talking about the Memphis State Task Force.

Thanks very much, and we will see you next week.

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