- [Angela] My name is Angela Brown and my business is Brown Angel Skin and Hair, a plant-based clean beauty product line that features vintage black actresses on the labels.

My business is a micro business, and I was concerned about taking that risk to get this new concept out.

The Comcast Rise Grant is given me an opportunity to take that risk and scale up my business and take it to the next level.

I feel that my business helps increase representation for black women on the shelf.

(upbeat jazz music) - [Monica] As students and teachers return to the classroom this fall, they face enormous challenges.

- I think teachers are feeling very, very overwhelmed, and I think we continue to ask teachers to do more with less.

- We have the kids for a third of the time, and they're in the community two thirds of the time.

And so we keep on putting more and more pressure on what happens in that one third of the time.

- Coming up on "Civic Cocktail," three local leaders explore how to tackle these challenges.

(upbeat jazz music) Hello, everyone, and welcome to "Civic Cocktail."

I'm your host Monica Guzman.

This month school is back in session across Washington state after the most turbulent and disrupted years in our lifetimes.

The pandemic is easing we hope, we think, but in its wake our gaps in academic achievement and opportunity, challenges with hiring and retaining teachers and staff, teacher strikes in Kent and Seattle, questions about safety and security, debates about curriculums, and calls for more support around anxiety and mental health in the classroom.

With us tonight are Pavan Venkatakrishnan, student representative for Washington State Board of Education, Brooke Brown, instructional equity specialist at the Franklin Pierce School District and our 2021 Washington State Teacher of the Year, and Dr. Joshua Garcia, superintendent of Tacoma Public Schools.

Among the questions we wanna consider in our discussion tonight, are we ready for this academic year?

What of the last couple years taught our educational leaders that they can apply to better educate our kids, and what is next for a strained public education system that we increasingly expect not just to teach our kids, but to care for them too?

As a parent myself of a fifth grader and a second grader in Seattle Public Schools, I'm grateful and thrilled to be joined tonight by three people who are in the thick of it and can help shed light on these questions and more.

Thank you all so much for taking time out of your busy schedules to talk to us.

And a special welcome too to all the teachers, staff, students, and parents out there tuning in.

So let's dig in, folks.

Pavan, you've made it to your senior year, (laughs) which congrats, by the way.

- Thank you.

- And that's saying something after everything that high school was and wasn't over the last couple of years.

Years from now when people meet you and say, "You went to high school during the pandemic, "what was that like?"

What will you tell them?

- It was difficult, and it's been a difficult experience for every student in the state and across the country.

We are facing mental health challenges, a lot of students are, loneliness, struggling to complete assignments, struggling with grading.

So it's been a difficult time.

2020 was hard for all of us, but students took it especially difficultly.

So if I were telling a person a few years from now what it's been like, I'd probably tell them just that.

It was a lot of challenges, a lot of learnings, and hopefully learnings we can take forward to better our curriculums, be better educators, be better administrators, and ultimately creating experiences more rewarding for students in the future.

- Yeah, that is the hope.

Now you're one of two student representatives.

- Is that right?

- That's correct, yeah.

- On the State School Board.

- Two representatives along with Eastern Washington representative as well.

- [Monica] Right.

And so tell us a couple ways that you try to stay plugged in to the concerns of such a broad range of students, a million students?

- Right, I mean, it's difficult, because this is a diverse state.

You've got a million kids.

It is a huge population.

So one of the ways we try to stay in contact, we talk to student groups all the time.

We have regular meetings.

I'm particularly involved in the Board's legislative agenda, how we engage with the state legislature.

So, I'm interfacing with student groups along with my counterpart on our legislative agenda, trying to get their feedback, trying to get the temperature, see what they think on the issues.

And obviously, I consume a lot of media, maybe too much media.

- (laughs) Don't we all?

- Yeah, so that's about how I stay plugged in.

- All right, thanks.

Now, Brooke, these last couple years, everyone's had their share of life lessons and that includes teachers.

So when you consider what makes a truly excellent teacher back in 2019 and what makes a truly excellent teacher in 2022, what's the difference?

- Ooh, that's a great question.

I don't think there's a really big difference.

I think excellent teachers in 2019 were teachers who centered their students' humanity, were teachers who validated all parts of students' identity, and created places that are welcoming for all students to really nourish their identities, their belonging, and definitely had high expectations and supported learning and just really thought about their students as more than just what they can produce or create, but who they wanted to become.

So, I don't think that has changed.

- Now, you were Washington State Teacher of the Year last year after, is it 14, 15 years teaching?

And now you're helping prepare incoming teachers for this school year at Franklin Pierce.

If those teachers take just one point of advice from you into their classrooms this coming year, given the challenges and opportunities ahead of them, what do you want that to be?

- That's also a great question.

(all laugh) And I would say there's two things, and they're words that I shared with our incoming staff, and I had them write them down.

And I said you have to pencil in time for joy and to pursue that relentlessly every day and to model that for our students and rest, and that doesn't mean scrolling on our phone, consuming social media, right?

Even though that's...

But what really helps us to fill up our buckets and to be rested because our students deserve to have educators that rest, and we deserve to have rest.

And so really thinking about how do we prioritize and be intentional to have those two things in our life.

- Josh, you've been superintendent of Tacoma Public School since 2021.

- I started off on an easy year.

- Yeah, I was gonna say.

You're serving around 28,000 students and over 2,000 teachers.

And you were deputy superintendent in that district since 2012.

So it's been a good long while.

This is a challenging time.

It's easy to come up with concerns, but I wanna start just by asking you, what has been the most rewarding part of this job?

What keeps you going?

- I think watching my colleagues, and when I say my colleagues, we have 5,000 employees in Tacoma, but we're very connected in Pierce county as well, to see how they have rallied during this time, the bus drivers serving meals, nutrition services, the amazing classroom teachers to be selfless and put themselves in the most difficult spots where some other professions may have not was truly inspiring, and it really takes your breath away.

In Tacoma all the way through the pandemic, our most needy students got face to face contact with our teachers, the support staff.

The buildings were open.

Nutrition service folks served over a million meals.

Everyone just leaned in, and they leaned in because the community needed 'em at a whole different level.

And we lost titles, and we all became educators.

It fills your bucket to see that people step up in the most time you need.

And I'm just grateful to be a part of their team.

- [Monica] So school superintendents are no strangers to challenge even when there isn't a global crisis going on.

So how are you setting yourself and your team up for success in another tricky year?

- So we talk a lot about the whole educator.

How do you stay safe, healthy, engaged, supported, and challenged?

It's relentless work.

We're all different, especially as we get to adults.

We have different needs.

We're pulled in different directions.

I think kids are like that as well, but when you're an adult, you might have a family that you're also taking care of.

And so we're really trying to practice empathy and understanding that there's so much that happens outside the classroom for our educators.

And like I said, these are a variety of folks, safety and security guards, office managers, office support staff.

And just trying to, to not only preach, but model, I think a little bit what Brooke said, is, where do you find joy?

How do you find rest?

Educating folks about that.

Maybe screen time is not the best rest in certain situations, to unplug.

I think there's a lot of noise out there, and how do you stay grounded?

We're not perfect at it, but we're committed to trying every day to get better and better.

And so we're trying to find that joy in what we do and what we came into this profession, which is to serve kids, to help them in their journey.

So we're working hard at that.

- Cool.

- So it takes a village.

I mean, we have representatives here from different parts of the education system to do something like educate so many children.

We are gonna dive into a lot of concerns.

I previewed some of them at the start of this show.

I'd like each of you to just quickly list three concerns that are top of mind for folks in your position, and let's start with Brooke.

So, what are the three big concerns for teachers as you see it this year?

- Another great question.

(laughs) I think one concern would definitely be this idea of learning loss and this focus of what we've lost.

And I think reframing that into really think about what our students have gained.

- What's the concern with calling it a learning loss for you?

- Yeah, I think it's really this idea that they lost all of these skills or lost all of these opportunities to learn, when I think a lot of our students learned a lot of different things during the pandemic.

And so really understanding I have four children of my own and just thinking about the things that they learned being at home and really thinking about if we focus on just kind of coming back and solely focusing on academics and solely focusing on trying to make up for that loss, we miss that opportunity to center joy, to center humanity, to center having fun.

And I think when students feel like they belong, when students feel like they are welcomed in class, then the learning can progress.

And so I think that's- We'll come back to questions around academics too.

Do you have a couple other concerns just quickly?

- [Brooke] Oh yeah, sorry.

(laughs) - No, we dug into that one, 'cause why not?

But yeah, anything else that comes up that's unrelated?

- I would say mental health concerns.

And I would also say so academics, mental health, and I would say wellness.

- [Monica] Wellness, okay.

Josh, how about you?

- I'd piggyback on Brooke's.

I think not just for the students, but for the adults, I think we became more aware than ever around what mental health had meant for us as adults and what our need was and maybe the lack of.

I really appreciate, I think, the concern of how we're labeling this generation of students is deep concern for me, and we can talk more about that at a different time.

And then just I worry about everything else that's going on in society that is impacting our kids that is channeled through the school of education or the system of education that we're not really addressing as a society, whether that's long term healthcare or crime or homelessness, all these other impacts that I think are being captured in a manner outside of school, but our kids are experiencing on a daily basis, and we're not, as a community, wrestling through that impact.

- Yeah, it's striking me already kind of a theme, a little bit about some of the boundaries maybe that we used to have have really kind of fallen away, and everything's sort of- - I think the boundaries were maybe not spoken in public, but as educators and students, they were always real.

We always saw 'em, and now I think the rest of the community is maybe experiencing what that looks like.

- [Monica] Right, more exposure.

Pavan, how about you?

- I would begin by talking about where students are at academically versus where they were two years ago.

I think that's top of mind for most students, I was reading some research.

Most Americans read at, what, a fifth grade level generally?

So to imagine that we have a generation of students who might be behind that level is really concerning, and that's my peer set.

So obviously looking at ways that we can recoup, get students back to where they need to be, prepared for the workforce.

And next I'd say is obviously mental health challenges.

Students have been alone, alone in their rooms online doing school.

Maybe they've come back- - [Monica] You know firsthand what that was like.

- Yeah, or coming back to school and being different kids, being changed kids, having their development impacted in ways maybe they don't even know.

And the last I would say is a curriculum and a school experience that is responsive to what kids are actually interested in, getting ready for careers, but more importantly, making sure that we're teaching history, that we're teaching all sorts of other subjects the way they actually happen, the way they need to be taught in a way that's preparatory for the future.

- We will definitely come back to that for sure.

All right, well, let's move into the first topic area that I think you all mentioned.

A lot of the conversation around education is turning to mental health.

Our students of all ages are carrying a lot these days as are adults, as you mentioned.

So give us specifics.

Brooke, where have you seen all of this in your students?

Tell us the stories, and then how does it get in the way?

- Yeah.

I think there was this idea that we were gonna come back to school different.

I think there was a lot of really great intention.

And then I think when we came back to the buildings, a lot of things just kind of got back to, quote, normal.

And I think there's a lot of reasons for that.

And I think there was a lot of COVID restrictions and a lot of things that were happening.

- [Monica] And when you say they got back to normal, what do you mean?

- I think just the way that we were doing school, I think there was this idea that this was an opportunity to rethink the way that we were doing things.

And so I think a lot of people came back with these really great, beautiful ideas and had great intentions, and then once they got back into the building, sort of fell back into those similar patterns, which is what as humans we do when things are difficult.

And I think when I spoke about joy earlier, I remember going into a lunchroom and seeing kids, and I'm used to going into the lunchroom at the high school and there's kids being loud and having conversations and eating lunch and all this stuff.

And I went in and kids are six feet apart sitting in a chair with a lunch on their lap, and they can't talk to each other, and they have 15 minutes to eat.

And then the bell will ring, and then they have to shuffle out, and a new group, shuffles in.

And I asked a student, we were talking about sort of what are the things that were different?

And he said, "Everything that I looked forward to "about school doesn't exist anymore."

And so I think when we're thinking about, what do we really want students to do.

how can we support students?

I think it's really thinking about what are the things that get students up in the morning?

What are the things that get them excited about coming to school?

And we need to do more of that within COVID restrictions, of course.

And we can't do that without asking them.

And so I think a big part of that is really asking students and giving them a seat at the table and having those conversations.

- So teachers checking in really directly one on one.

- Absolutely.

- Josh earlier, you told me what many people in education are saying that schools need more mental health support, but there just aren't enough resources to meet the need, at least not now.

So, if you would picture one of your Tacoma schools having enough support, what would that actually look like?

Is that in terms of a number of staffers per number of students?

What does it look like and how would it happen?

- So I think even the way that we're framing that is that all the support has to go in that same period of time.

- What do you mean by period of time?

- I tell our community we have the kids for a third of the time, and they're in the community two thirds of the time.

And so we keep on putting more and more pressure on what happens in that one third of the time.

I would say that what society needs, and so I'm gonna keep on that, is that our kids and our staff and our community have mental health needs.

If we're gonna continue to put all that back onto the schools, we're gonna surely fail.

- That's a good segue.

Schools are bearing the burden of caring for our kids in more ways than one.

I wanna talk about lunches as an example of that.

After two years, free lunches for every student regardless of whether their families could afford them ended this year across the state, replaced by a process where nearly 1,200 schools, more than double than before the pandemic, are likely to provide free lunches for all their students.

Is that a smarter use of district funds, given the expense, or should districts find a way to feed all our kids going forward and close this gap for good?

And, Pavan, I know you've taken a look at this at the state level and just on legislation, but what's your position on this?

What's your take?

- I think it's a travesty that the money that was coming from the feds is expired.

I don't see a reason why any student should have an outstanding balance in a school cafeteria.

We're already providing them a free public education.

It's the job of school, it's the job of districts.

It's the job of our government to make sure that no kid in the school goes hungry.

So, my position is that those waivers should continue.

And I think it's an unfair proposition to say that school districts, individual school districts, individual schools should just take on this burden.

What it really means is that policy makers in DC have to get together and make sure this extension continues.

I mean, I can tell you one thing, the amount of kids I saw in my school cafeteria eating, because it was free, it looked like a lot more than before the pandemic.

So, I would really hope that folks get together and make sure that that money continues and that school kids can eat and they aren't hungry.

- So, Josh, you've seen district budgets pulled in so many directions.

What do you think?

And does it make sense for schools to be taking this service on in this way?

You're talking about broader society.

- So I can only speak for our community and what we've decided to do is we've decided to prioritize this and think differently.

So we've applied for some additional grants and supports.

We've changed our practices of how we're creating free and reduced lunch applications.

And we're gonna continue forward with both breakfast and lunch.

And then we're also working with our partners to provide snacks after school for our kids.

There's a lot of research on a healthy brain is a fed brain.

We have to be more innovative and creative with the food supply chain.

It's been problematic for us.

We're gonna have to change our practices to get better, but we're committed to ensuring that no kid comes to school and doesn't have that opportunity.

And there's all kinds of good reasons why they may come and not have a meal, but let's not have that be a shame game.

Let's just move forward and let's feed 'em, and we'll keep 'em going.

- Brooke, any thoughts on that?

- Yeah, I agree.

And I see the tension of school district budgets, but I do think it's really important that we support our students and make sure that they're being nourished.

I also think it's important to think about ways to support families on the weekends and thinking about other wraparound services to support their needs on the weekends as well.

- [Monica] So you mean meal meals on the weekends?

- Mhm.

- Interesting.

- Yeah, we send home backpacks with our students that need them, and the need for that has grown since COVID.

And so I think this is a start and just thinking about what are other ways that we can partner with folks in our community to continue to serve our families.

- So safety in schools is a growing concern.

There's a rise in school shootings across the country.

We've all seen.

Josh, you described the difference between safety and security.

Can you reiterate what you told us and describe the specific measures that Tacoma Schools are taking to improve security?

- Yeah, I don't know what I shared at that time, but I can talk to you that what we've learned is that safety is so much a personal feeling.

And when we're having kids in a developmental process, it's not a fixed moment that says I am safe, and, therefore, I'm safe forever.

It can be my mental health safety.

It can be what's going on in my community, what's going on in my home, or it can be like I'm afraid to say something, because of social media, and I'm gonna be filmed at the wrong time and blasted amongst my peers.

And so we're really having to work on, what does that safety look like for self, and then for the classroom and the social community, and trying to use that as a learning experience through restorative circles, value circles, through conversations around, so what does this mean and what was my impact?

- [Monica] What is a restorative circle?

- Yeah, that's a great question.

So these are practices that we've learned around, how do you build community intentionally?

So what are our values of this learning community that we're in both as a school, but as a classroom, or even as a small group?

And how do we have conversations in a facilitated trained manner to bring what are our shared values in a world that is oftentimes divided by either if you're not all on the same page on this, you're somehow at fault?

And we're trying to build that.

And restorative is we know there's gonna be mistakes made.

I make mistakes.

I say things, and the intent versus my impact is not the same.

I could have all the positive intent, but the impact that I had on the other person.

And so how do we have a restorative conversation that's facilitated to say, it's okay, that wasn't my intent, but I recognize my impact was not matched?

And really talking about security and the infrastructure of security.

- So safety is a personal, it's almost subjective to the person at any given moment.

What is security to you?

- Security is all the wonderful things that our community supports.

And how do you have a central location that when you come into the schools that there is a checkpoint?

How are you verifying who's coming into the schools from your volunteers and your mentors?

What are the best evidence based practices around social media, chat rooms that you're facilitating a variety of supports?

How are you installing cameras to be a safe place, but not a place that is ideally catching a student doing something that may be subjective, but exterior cameras in there?

How are we greeting visitors that are coming in?

How are we having to make sure that the doors are lockable in all different places?

I think there's some real work that needs to be done around communities and schools and capital budgets, and we're very fortunate that our community has stepped up to say, yes, we want these infrastructure upgrades.

What does your partnership with your local police department?

What does that mean, both from a safety, how do I feel about police?

Some of that needs to be restorative, as well as how do we make sure that we recognize that police staff are putting their lives at stake every day?

And then also the security of we try to use our buildings 24/7, 365 days a year.

So how do we allow the community to come in and still make sure that our kids are safe in these designated time?

- Right, Keep those open and shared spaces, but also secure.

Pavan, I'm really curious, these conversations around safety and security for students, there's a lot of conversation around adults from adults, but how have you received all those conversations as a student?

- It is a issue that I can tell you is very present on the minds of students when you see elementary schoolers.

You're talking about safety.

My mind sprints to kids getting owed down in classrooms, five year old kids.

It's appalling.

At the same time, we need to have a balanced national state local conversation that is holistic, so balancing people's constitutional rights with kids not being shot in the head in their classroom.

And in addition, I mean, you need to have a community that is built towards ensuring that a person who might have these inclinations never gets to that point, that they get counseling at some point, or maybe a family member notices something.

I think talking about nationally, the recent bipartisan gun common sense bill sets kind of the right center in my view.

I mean, I know how many students in the state, they grow up around guns, their parents own guns.

It's for sports hunting.

So nothing but respect for that, that proud lineage, but we've gotta have a balanced conversation that incorporates that perspective and also ensuring that kids are safe in their classroom.

- I'm ready to vote for Pavan, how about you?

(all laugh) - There you go, you already got support.

So moving on to something we brought up earlier.

Throughout the pandemic, we assured each other that the important thing was taking care of our kids at such a hard time for all of us and not worry too much about academics, about these metrics.

A recent article in the New York Times gave some grim news on this, saying that for the first time since tracking began in the 70s, nine year olds lost ground in math and scores in reading fell by the largest margin in more than 30 years.

The decline spanned almost all races and income levels.

Those students of color fared worse.

Brooke, is it time to worry about academics yet?

- Another great question.

(laughs) I think academics, of course, are important as we're in education.

That's what we're about.

I do think though, we can't look solely at the negative.

I think it's really important to think when I'm not currently in the classroom and talking to educators last year, yes, students were behind and the growth they made from the beginning of the year last year to the end of the year was more growth than they had seen the previous years in their students.

So even though they may be, quote, behind.

they're making growth.

And so I think we have to look at it differently.

And I think educators really understand that their job is to teach the students in their classroom.

And so really thinking about, how are we universally designing curriculum?

How are we making sure that our curriculum is culturally responsive and providing students the opportunity to feel seen in what they're doing?

And I think the more that teachers can focus on building those relationships and creating that sense of belonging then will add to their academic achievement.

And so, yes, I think it's something that we continue to have high expectations for, but I don't think it's the only thing to be focusing on right now.

- I wanna add a little bit, and I wanna represent our teaching colleagues out there.

I mean, I was in a lot of Zoom.

I did a lot of substituting.

There were a lot of people that were working very hard and were not just sitting back and saying, "Oh my gosh, well, this is just what it is."

I think there are a lot of things that need to be at play here.

Those guidelines and requirements, everything from how many days you were required to be out of school played such a significant role.

How many kids weren't able to test during those times.

And so I don't know all the research of New York and the New York Times.

I think Brooke captured it well to say I think kids learn differently.

I don't think all of our standardized tests captured all that learning.

I wasn't aware of the state saying that you didn't have to meet certain graduation requirements in order to graduate.

I think they gave some flexibility and waivers to do it differently in some places, but this generation of kids, out of any other generation, has the highest level of standards.

And so I think that we also have to recognize when we say they're somehow behind, the expectations for them are so much higher than anybody else's, and the whole world paused.

So behind of who?

- [Monica] Oh, interesting.

Like relative to what, to reality?

- Exactly.

- And kids are thriving in these environments the best they can, and we've gotta keep on meeting where hey are that date, but I think we love to label it as some kind of a deficit.

We had kids doing entrepreneurial classes, starting businesses in different ways, writing different ways.

- But let me push back on that a bit.

Me being a parent and a couple of you are as well.

I mean, you're saying to reframe this idea of a lost year, but if the data are showing us that in some metrics we are falling behind, shouldn't that be something we take into account?

And, Pavan, you had mentioned that this was a concern of yours and of many students.

So I wanna hear your take too.

- I appreciate all to talk on reframing it.

To me, it's like kids have gotta be prepared, 'cause once they're outta the arms of the schools, I mean, they're out in the world.

If we have kids who are reading at fourth grade level, fifth grade level, are 25 years old, it's frightening.

And I think we can take a forward looking approach by saying, how do we modify the way that we graduate students, not to reduce rigor, but to make sure that you're as responsive as possible to student interests?

So like, for example, if a student is working on the side in high school and working 500 hours a year, how do we as a education system reward that?

So just as an example, but going back to looking back, I mean, it is hard to blame any educator, any administrator, and any teacher for making the choices that they did in snap judgments, because we were dealing with a pandemic.

Nobody had ever dealt with that before.

But at the same time, now that we've got the hindsight, I see a lot of kids who have fallen behind, and it is really frightening, because ultimately the kids that we turn out today are the ones who represent this country, the ones who are gonna be our nation's next vaccine developers, the next rocket scientists.

If we want to compete globally, then we've gotta have kids who are as educated as possible.

So this data, I read it and it's pretty shocking.

- Segueing from there, Josh, you've told us that you like to work on a community centered holistic approach to address student and teacher needs and issues including academics.

So can you describe the whole child and whole teacher programs and the successes you've had with those strategies and maybe specifically the whole child program?

- So the whole child is not a program, but it's a more of a lens of how we build several programs.

So how do we ensure that students are safe, engaged, supported, healthy, and challenged?

So challenged, how are we developing multiple threads to ensure that kids are able to challenge themselves up?

- And what are those threads?

- Yeah, so how many kids are taking an AP an IB, a college in the high school or running start to prove that they are truly college ready?

How many students are earning an industrial certification to prove that they are career ready, not some pathway, but actually an industrial certification to prove that they are there.

How are families able to say, "My child doesn't belong in third grade?"

What is the program or practice to allow them to go to fourth grade and those approaches.

Engaged, so how many kids are engaged in extracurricular activities, clubs, activities, sports?

We saw the largest participation in middle school athletics than we ever had last year.

Kids were dying to come back and get engaged in those things, 'cause as a community, we took them away.

The Beyond the Bell program is a classic example of that.

- [Monica] This is the after school, right?

- Yep, so how do kids have access to the arts, STEM, and recreation in a consistent place right at their school provided by expertise in the community?

So those are a few examples of how are we're doing it.

How are they staying healthy?

Okay, are we providing food for them?

Are we partnering with outside agencies to provide advanced mental health supports?

What is our approach to teaching explicit curriculum of here's social awareness, here's self-awareness?

How are we allowing kids to measure their moods in real time?

And so we use zones of regulation.

And so it's in a belief system that says this is our responsibility.

And then we all have to work and develop business plans and supports to that.

- And how do you know it's working?

What tells you that it's working?

What do you track?

- We have 37 different indicators, benchmarks, in the Tacoma Public Schools.

We call it the Whole Child Accountability system.

So we actually measure, and you can go on our website and see where we are in those.

And have we hit everybody and every day?

No we haven't.

And so, we go back to that last point, and we say nine year olds, reading, well, developmentally, not everybody is reading at the same level at the same time at nine year old.

So yes, some of our kids are beyond that, but they have to demonstrate high school level reading in order to graduate from high school in the state of Washington.

I don't know about every other state.

So you can't graduate without an indicator that you have demonstrated that unless you have an individual education plan that says I have a disability and I don't have to use that same measure.

And so we look at data regularly, and we're measuring that.

Our graduation rates would be another example.

- So, Brooke, again, going back to the theme that's really emerging here, teachers in particular have what seems like an outsized responsibility and a lot of pressure today to help students succeed academically, and Pavan talked very well to that, but also to develop personally.

How specifically can teachers address academic challenges to get students caught up?

Caught up, and I know that you'd push back on that, but from the remote learning years, and at the same time address their personal growth?

You were talking about checking in one on one.

Bring us into the classroom.

What is a teacher to do specifically in that classroom?

- Yeah.

I think what we've really figured out is doing more of what necessarily wasn't working isn't the way forward.

And so I think it's, how can we think about different activities to get kids kind of, quote unquote, caught up in different ways?

And one of those ways is really building those solid relationships.

And so for me in my classroom, when students come in, I always use like a check-in scale, one to 10, human blob, scale of one to llama, how you doing?

- Wait, it's human blob to (indistinct)?

(laughs) - Yeah, so it's like a human blob, like this blob tree, or there's like llama one through nine.

Llama's like, which llama are you today?

And so really thinking about, first of all, like how are you and just checking in on how you are, and that's a great way as a teacher just to connect with you on a human level.

And there's some kids that are twos every day, and that's okay, and we know that.

- And what do you as a teacher when someone comes in and consistently says, "I'm a blob, I'm a two."

What do you do?

- I'm able to have that conversation with them and sort of check in and see what's going on, but if you have a kid that's higher and then is a two that day, that also is a way for you to connect and to see what's going on.

And then I'll have a check in question for us to get to know one another and then spend some time doing some mindful breathing, and we recite in (indistinct) together.

And so really thinking about all of those things happen before we start engaging in the curriculum for the day.

And so really thinking about I want my students to understand that their wellbeing matters before we even get to the content.

- What do you see in the students that tells you that making the space and time for that is really working?

Yeah, demonstrate that.

- They tell me.

Yeah, they say, "You know, Ms. Brown, "you are one of the first teachers "that I feel like cares about how I'm doing."

So when they walk in the door, I'm really silly, and I'm always like, "You're entering the learning zone."

And so like, we're here to learn and we talk about it.

We're really transparent.

And so when we're doing really difficult things, I tell them like, okay, this is our like brain jog today.

We're gonna take our brains and put 'em on a treadmill and we're gonna do really hard things in this class, but know that you never have to do them alone.

We're always gonna do them together together.

And so really just building that practice in of trying, of working hard, and really building those skills in them and having those high expectations.

And I tell them a story every year at the beginning of the butterfly.

And there's a story, I don't know who said it to give credit to, but this idea that this butterfly, this man saw this butterfly struggling to get out of the cocoon, and there's this great science explanation, I was an English and ethnic studies teacher, that there's a process that they have to go through.

And so this guy cut the cocoon open, and the butterfly got out, but then was never able to fly.

And so I tell them that story at the beginning and just always come back to that as like I'm never gonna cut that cocoon open for you.

I'm gonna be here as you struggle, but we're always gonna struggle together.

And so it's building those relationships, but also that support for them to know that, yes, this is hard.

We're gonna name it.

This is hard.

This is challenging.

This is tough work, and we're gonna do this together.

And then that feeling of accomplishment that when they walk across that stage at graduation and tell me, like, "I didn't think I was gonna do it," or, "You pushed me so hard," but that feeling of accomplishment that they have in themselves is I think what's the most important.

- So, Pavan, I'm curious, what sorts of things have you seen from your teachers in the last couple years that you think were really hitting the nail on the head between kind of personal growth like this is all crazy time, but also, yeah, we gotta push y'all to do your best?

- I mean, I think all of my teachers in their own way have really adapted to this environment and pushed us to do our best.

I mean, even when it was super uncomfortable, especially for me as a student.

So I'm starting to school now.

So I'm seeing like teachers who are beginning their classrooms with that opening PowerPoint or that opening explanation of the class procedures and how much it's changed versus 2019, 2020.

They're talking a lot more about like teachers and students being in this together and talking about mental health and talking about personal growth.

So that really occurs to me teachers are doing a hell of a job, and they're adapting to this environment just as we are.

- So let's move to another aspect of teachers that's gotten tough.

It's gotten tough to hire and retain teachers and staff in many districts, and there have been consequences.

We've seen dropped school days in some schools for low staffing, contract negotiation struggles that have led to teacher strikes, and schools start delays.

Brooke, what are you hearing specifically from teachers on this?

Is teaching a harder sell under the circumstances now than it used to be?

What's gonna turn this around?

- Yeah, I think when the pandemic started in 2020, there was this really deep love and appreciation for educators as folks had to educate their own children at home.

And then I think that question earlier that you talked about is just all of the pressure that is now coming into that one third of the day.

I think teachers are feeling very, very overwhelmed, and I think we continue to ask teachers to do more with less.

And I think it's been really interesting to be a part of the Teacher of the Year community across our nation and to see how it has impacted educators across the country and to see how many have award-winning educators also have left.

- So in those conversations, what are people saying is the solution?

What needs to be done even if maybe it's proving difficult?

Like, what is it?

- I think it's time.

I think it's respect.

I think it's a seat at the table.

I think it's the professionalism to do what kids need.

I think it's a lot of different things.

I think for some districts it's pay.

I think it has to do with just a whole host of things.

- So moving to another concern, Pavan, I think you brought up.

Our society is changing very fast.

And so our ideas about how best to teach our kids about issues around things like race and gender, for example.

Pavan, you're coming of age in an interesting time (laughs) to say the least.

How do you hear the concerns of parents who in good faith would critique schools teaching around race, gender, sexuality, or any other topic under what's become a very political debate?

- Well, I would say first parents having concerns about the curriculum is awesome.

That's how you create a community that's responsive when parents are engaged with the curriculum just as much as educators are, just as much as students are.

What I would say is when you bring politics into the classroom, when you create a political debate over teaching history, the students are the ones who lose.

If you make this curriculum into some sort political party contest where folks are fighting over what part of our history are we not gonna talk about today, then students come out uninformed, and that's not to say we can't have a conversation about what we emphasize, what we don't.

That's how curriculums work.

We discuss what we teach what has the most relevance to students, and that's important.

And I welcome that discussion.

To move on even beyond curriculum, I just broadly believe when you have governors, members of Congress inserting themselves into the classroom, trying to make a political name for themselves by grandstanding on top of kids, it's embarrassing and it should stop.

- I want us to kind of think bigger picture.

So, what are your hopes for the future of public education in general, given everything we've talked about?

How can we reimagine a system that is more supportive, safe, nurturing, and academically challenging for all students, teachers, admin, and support staff?

- Sure, I mean, I look at this from a policy lens, 'cause that's kind of my thing.

I'd probably began by saying we need a universal pre-K system for three and four year olds.

We need to prepare kids who are coming into kindergarten, who are reading, and they're smart and they're ready to take on the challenges of the K through 12 system.

I would look broadly at high school, making sure that kids in that junior, senior year are doing things they like to do, are getting ready for the career field that they wanna pursue, getting ready for the college experience they wanna pursue.

And beyond that, we've had real revolution getting degrees in computer science, engineering, all that.

What does it mean for a kid who maybe wants to go into the trades, maybe he wants to be a plumber, maybe wants to work on a factory line?

We want to make sure that kid can pursue that career too.

So that means ensuring that we have a school system that makes it easier for kids to pursue that kind of stuff.

- Josh, how about you?

How would you think big on this?

- It's a tough job.

And I think that we read headlines and we make judgements.

I think if we're gonna reimagine who we are and we see the potential in our kids and what is coming through partnerships, I think the greatest teacher is our families, our parents, our grandparents that are teaching for that two thirds of that time.

And we're just gonna have to keep on working at it.

I don't think we're broken.

And I think it's very important that we recognize that our kids aren't broken.

They're developing.

If I ask folks, do you believe everybody learns at the same rate on the same time?

Well, no.

I mean, if you've ever raised a child and you have multiple children in your house, you realize, wait a second, I have three of you, and you're all different.

I know that you came from the same people.

And how does that work?

And so I also know what it's at stake for a family when they feel like this is my baby, I've gotta have the absolute best.

And we have to be a little bit patient and try to seek understanding first, which we're trying to teach our kids.

Be a little empathetic.

The work that Brooke described, most folks would say, "Oh, my gosh, yeah just do that."

That's a master teacher at work with lots of trial and error, planning an individual lesson plan with all the standards is ours for just one day.

- Brooke, how would you reimagine the role of a teacher?

But take the question anywhere you want really.

- Okay.

(laughs) I think it's really about creating those partnerships.

And I think, we really want and we've talked a lot about having students be college and career ready, but I also think it's really about being community ready.

And I think it's really about understanding the unique communities that each of us teach in and each of us live in.

And so how are we really partnering with our community partners?

How are we partnering across faculty, not just educators, but with our amazing classified staff, everyone?

And so it's really about, I think, shifting from this hierarchy to a partnership, I think it's really about giving folks a seat at the table that haven't had one.

And I think it's listening.

I think it's listening to teachers, because every content area, educators are different.

And so I don't think there's one magic thing that you're like, and now everyone's good.

And so I think it's really about listening to what teachers need, because they are the voice for the kids.

- All right, well with that, I really wanna thank you all for your time today.

And I'm sorry to say, we are out of time.

(all chuckle) Thank you so much to Pavan and Brooke and Josh for joining us tonight and giving us a glimpse into this incredibly important and very timely topic.

So "Civic Cocktail" will return on October 12th when we will dig into the upcoming election and take a look at an issue that doesn't often get a lot of attention, disability rights.

You can find out more at crosscut.com/events.

Thanks, everyone.

Thanks again to you three and to everyone tuning in.

And goodnight.

(upbeat jazz music)