-Week 50.

-Dear Myles, -after taking several flights -and trips to restaurants -and grocery stores with you -!since he was born, I'm convinced -that people are much nicer -when you're carrying a child.

-Marc Pierre is a father -!of a two year old named Myles.

-And like a lot of fathers, -he worries.

-He worries about the usual -!change in diapers, child care, -working while parenting.

-!But as a Black father in 2025, -he also worries -!about the challenges of raising -a Black boy in America.

-Who could descriminate -against those cheeks?

-Who could be mean to that -smile?

-What prejudice could you -hold when you clap your -hands in excitement?

-There are so many stereotypes -!and assumptions that come along -!with Black fatherhood, a big one -!being that they aren't around.

-!They're either absent by choice -or locked up, -or worse, that they're dead.

-And that part, -the not being alive -long enough to raise his son.

-!Marc worries about that a lot.

-I remember the day -my son was born.

-there's like a shift -that happens.

-when two becomes three, like -hey what if, he's born -and I'm not around to see it -!all through and by all through, -like, seeing, -!like him from 5, 10 and older.

-Marc and I sat down to talk -about how he's -channeled some of these fears -into letters to Myles -at this point in his life, -Marc has written -more than 80 letters to him -in both email form -and now on Substack, -under raising Miles, -where his letters are public.

-For other fathers, fathers -with fears like his, -!who can read them and maybe feel -just a little bit less alone.

-The letters, of course, -!are also and always for Myles.

-I want to start something -!where even if, God forbid, I'm -!not here to see it all through -!like I die, I can leave my son -something that he knows, -like who I am.

-That I love him, -that I was present.

-I was here -And I'm worried about, -just not being able -to leave a, like, a legacy.

-From Vermont -Public, this is Homegoings, -a show that invites you -to eavesdrop -on candid conversations -!with people who will challenge -what you think you know.

-I'm Myra Flynn, and today -!a conversation with Marc Pierre, -a Haitian-American father -currently -!living in Birmingham, Alabama, -who responded to the crushing -anxiety of being black -in America with a child -!on the way by writing about it -in his letters -to his unborn son.

-His son has since been born, -and those letters are now -public on Substack, -where he has more -than 4000 subscribers -from around the world, -many of them also fathers -who come for the joy -!and stay for the vulnerability.

-But Marc wasn't always -this vulnerable until he felt -he had to be.

-This is his journey, -and this is homegoings.

-We're a proud member of the -NPR network.

-Welcome home.

-if you were to say, once -upon a time, -where would you begin?

-Once upon a time, -I was on the subway platform -just coming -from getting, a haircut, -and I was feeling myself.

-And I saw Wait.

-Why wait?

-I don't see any hair -there.

What?

-What was this haircut?

-I was I was desperately -holding on to my hairline.

-So I went to the.

-I went to my barber, and -!I am about to get on the train.

-I'm walking on the platform -and I see, -this woman and -I want to talk to her, but -I'm nervous -cause I don't really approach -women on the street -just because I'm like, -I don't want to seem -like a creep.

-eventually I go, I walk past -so I don't say anything.

-And then I'm trying -to figure out what to say.

-And I was like, I got it.

-She's like this huge, -AKA bag.

-She's in a Black sorority.

-So I walk up to her -and I'm like, so you're AKA?

-She's like, looks down like, -!duh.

And then long story short, -I end up just asking for her -phone number number.

-she gives me her number.

-!And then that kind of starts it.

-Oh, a New York romance.

-A true New York romance.

-I met so many boyfriends -on the train.

-It's a great place.

-You didn't marry them?

-I didn't marry them.

-No, but, I mean, I married -somebody who I, -I met in -kind of a similar situation.

-He was on his way to another -date as well.

-And, you know, it's just.

-Yeah, it's nice when kind of, -I don't know, in an age of, -like, Tinder and all of that, -when you can still have -those stories, you know?

-Yeah, it felt like fate.

-You are Haitian American.

-Correct?

-You're a Haitian man.

-Okay, so, listen, I do know -a thing or two about me -some Haitian men, okay.

-And a big one being -that y'all are a little bit, -kind of the king.

-The king.

-The king of every household -that you walk into.

-!Your mama thinks you're a king.

-!Your sisters think you're king.

-Maybe you yourself feel -that way.

-Is any of this resonating -with kind of that culture?

-And yeah, -!I definitely fit the stereotype.

-!Like, I feel like I'm spoiled.

-I was spoiled, -!for sure, in the sense of that -like, not -!that I got everything I wanted -because we didn't -grow up like that.

-But the fact that I didnt -know how to cook until -I met my wife, -my mom, made all the food, -we don't really wash -dishes like that.

-That she kind of -did everything for us.

-And even when she tried -to make us do it, -we kind of like, half did it.

-And she kind of like, -you know, was upset about it, -but it wasn't really -a high expectation that -these things were going -to be done, probably.

-What is that about?

-Can you tell me culturally -like what that's about?

-I don't know, I really -I think I struggle with that -because I feel like -I didn't understand -!that till I met Maya, my wife.

-!When we end up living together -there's an expectation -that I'm not used to.

-!And again, this is embarrassing -because, like I said, -it's changed so much, -but expectations Im not -used to like, you know, -there's like, 50/50 that you -need to be in this team.

-!And now I'm being so constantly -like, listen, you're not -you're not going to -just be comfortable.

-I'm not.

-I'm not like, -!I'm not like we're both working -a full time job, -Im in a full time job.

-And you as well to be -holding up your end.

-And that was definitely -a shift for sure.

-When we decided -to have a baby -no one tells you that.

-It just happens.

-And I feel like -you spend all your time -as a young at man, like, hey, -don't get pregnant, -don't make any babies.

-And then I'm married -now, and I want to, -you know, have a baby, -and it takes a long time.

-You know, -we're going to doctors, -and the doctors can't tell us -what happened.

-And we, -My wife is stressed out.

-!I'm stressed out.

I'm in therapy -talking about it.

-And every month feels like, -a disappointment, you know?

-They call it -trying for a reason.

-It it's very trying.

-Yeah.

-It was the first time I heard -the term infertility.

-Im talking to friends about -this and -they all have kids and tell -me its not hard.

-Just make it happen.

-So Im stressed about these -!things, friends arent helping.

-At this age, they have two -or three already.

-So its like were doing -something wrong.

-Were going through a lot -and I get a call from -a colleague who started -a school in Ethopia -and she says, hey Im looking -!for a founding english teacher.

-I wasnt sure but my wife was -like, absolutely not.

-!But after a while of trying, one -!day were in bed and she says, -call her and tell her were -open to going.

-And we decide to go to -Ethopia and its amazing.

-!Its supposed to be a two year -contract and two months in -my wife gets pregnant.

-!of course, that's how it that's -how it works.

-Yeah, exactly.

-Exactly.

-Oh, so you got pregnant -in Ethiopia.

Wow.

-yeah.

-!And the goal was to stay there, -but kind of like -in a country area -really far from others.

-One day shes like, -I just want to go home.

-I can't do it -because she's having -severe nausea -every night or every day.

-And so she wants to go home.

-So we decide to come back -to Birmingham.

-!And that's when I think things -really changed for me.

-For sure, in terms of like -who I am -!as a person because my identity -felt no longer wrapped in -!just like a husband or teaching.

-I was like, -!wow, I'm going to be a dad now.

-!So what were you feeling like?

-You know, going from Ethiopia -back to when?

-What year is this?

-This is 2022.

-Yeah.

-So we're just -we're just two years -after the murder of George -Floyd, -!just barely out of the pandemic.

-Whatever that may mean.

-And you're going to -the South, in the US.

-Like, what is this -bringing up for you now?

-As a man, as a black man, -as a father to be?

-Yeah, It's -the word mortality rings -!a bell a lot for me during this -time because I'm like man I -I'm worrying about -!like dying if that makes sense.

-Like hey what if, he's born -and I'm not around to see it -!all through and by all through, -like, seeing, -!like him from 5, 10 and older.

-And I'm worried about, -just not being able to leave -a, like, a legacy, you know, -I think so -because of, like, systems -!in place that I don't, I can't, -I want to start something -where even if, -!God forbid, I'm not here to see -it all through like I die, -I can leave -!my son something that he knows, -like who I am.

-That I love him, that I was -present, I was here.

-And I feel like I was looking -for some way to process -those feelings.

-!I can't process what I'm going -through my wife because she's -having she's nauseous.

-!She's having all these symptoms, -and I'm not in a place -!where I don't have any friends.

-So I do what I started to do.

-Like, can I write, I writing, -I created an email for him -very early on -and I start writing -these kind of short letters -to him -about -what I'm feeling, you know, -and what things -!are coming up now in terms of, -like, I'm going to be a dad.

-What am I going to do?

-No one taught me -these things.

-And that's how it kind of -like starts, -when I'm writing -!kind of weekly or little small, -small snippets -of what I'm going through -just to kind of capture -what I'm feeling, to process.

-I just send it to him.

-!And then my goal was eventually -that I would just -!I get the ideas of someone like, -I would, I would, -I would give this to him, -when he's old enough, -just so he knows that, like, -you know what I was feeling -because I don't know -what my father was feeling -When -he had me, at the time.

-You know, even if he's here -we don't have that kind -!of relationship, that intimacy.

-And I think I wanted to, -as a dad, -!I wanted to create that for him -by, like, writing letters to -him, you know?

-Every -letter, comes with the title -and it comes with the week -that he was born as well.

-!And starts out in the same way.

-And so smart to write -an email account too, -not necessarily have to do -physical letters on paper, -but to like create this -very easy thing that you can -just kind of write regularly.

-And so, -so, okay, you're writing -these letters, -your wife is pregnant, -she's nauseous.

-But then eventually, like, -two becomes three, right?

-Like you, -you end up having this baby.

-I'm curious.

-Like, -what did that bring up for -!you once the baby was actually -here, right.

-Because it's one thing -to, like, write letters -!and think about what could be.

-It's another to be like, -!I as a mother myself, it's like, -oh, okay, this is happening.

-Yeah.

yeah.

-Would that bring up for you?

-I remember the day my -son was born.

-Theres a shift that happens -when two becomes three -that I wasnt prepared for.

-I felt like most of the dad -!stuff out there was just for fun -!like joking, its not really a -serious thing.

-But in the hospital, when she -givers birth, -!I remember part of our birthing -plan was to breast feed and -!all of these things, so I want -to support, you know?

-So the babys born and shes -trying to get the collostrum -out of her breasts and thats -!been difficult, to breast feed.

-I didnt know, no one told -me that breast feeding -!is not just an automatic thing.

-Oh, Lord.

-Lord, no, it is not.

-So.

Yes yes -!Okay.

Yes.

It was easy for you?

-I don't think I met a woman -or a breast -feeding person who ever said -it was easy.

-it's incredibly difficult.

-Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So.

-But I don't blame you -for not knowing.

-Even as, like a young woman -myself, -I don't think I understood -the stress that would come -from it.

-And I'm -watching my wife stress out -because babys crying.

-!Babies hungry doctors are like, -hey, we have formula.

-We're like, -we want give him breast milk.

-Should we consider -giving him formula?

-Because babys hungry.

-My wife is like, no, -we want to do this thing.

-Anyway, I'm trying -I'm trying to help, -help her and give advice.

-And I realized, like, -she's like, -!there's nothing I can say, do I?

-I feel useless, useless.

-And she asks, -and she kind of is upset, -and she's like, I've just.

-I got to say, move.

-And I literally I go to that -uncomfortable bed on the, -on the couch and I start -!to cry, to be honest with you.

-I, I don't, I mean, -there's nothing for me to do.

-Literally nothing for me -to do.

-And I want to help.

-I want to be supportive -because, like, -this is what husbands -are supposed to do.

-But then what -does it look like when -they don't need you?

-!You know, I want to be needed.

-And this was like -kind of the first moment.

-I was like, wow.

-Like this situation -or what's going on?

-The shift that happened where -everything we've done -has been about us.

-And its about -my son now.

-And I think I wasn't -really ready for that.

-And I think even now I'm -so sometimes navigating that.

-!But that was the like a paradigm -shift that kind of like -man, the change is here, -you know?

-!Did you, would you describe it -as like jealousy?

-Did you feel jealous?

-Yeah.

-When you say jealous -I kind of like, -wants to go in defense mode.

-!And I'm I'm trying to challenge -that.

-What was the feeling.

And -I think definitely, I went -through periods of jealousy.

-That was jealous I didn't -I felt angry -that I wasn't able to help, -but I definitely felt moments -of jealousy, -when we got home, especially -because again, it's not like -she left the hospital -and breastfeeding was fine.

-We go through -like some, like we go through -he goes through trush.

-So her breast is hurting -and he has it in his mouth -and the yeast in his mouth -and like it's a struggle.

-And so he's crying.

-And again, -!emotionally I want to be in it.

-But like, -I didn't birth this child, -so I don't feel like -the same feelings.

-I just want to be supportive.

-And I think watching, like, -the love -that she has -for him, that was once mine -to begin with, -I do feel a sense of like, -damn, this is it.

-My whole -life is about to be watching, -you know, her love -!this thing that just got here.

-And I feel like -no one prepares you -for that, -for that moment where -where, I'm sitting at her -and I'm looking at her like, -again, this is my own -postpartum, right?

-And I say to her, -!I remember kind of she's again -!trying to breast feed and its -late in the morning.

-I'm just feel like, -I don't know, emotional.

-Kind of like -!just lonely in a relationship, -just trying to be helpful.

-And I say to her, -!you know, do you still love me?

-I'm laughing now but -I was sad before.

-My wife, -you know, in full postpartum, -as nicely as you could have -said it was like, -I need you to stand on -what we created before.

-Like, I need you to kind of, -like, boss up.

-And that was like I got, -you know, and, -I think I needed to hear that -because I had to learn how to -stand in the love -we created together -because this is the shift -that happens, he needs us.

-And I had to realize -!she was, like, in so many words.

-Like, he needs us -more than anything right now.

-So this is the focus.

-!And that, as embarasing as it is -to communicate that out loud, -I think it really -helped me because -I needed to, -!I needed to, to feel the love.

-But I wasn't feeling it then -for obvious reasons, because -she just birthed this child -and we have a responsibility -to do now.

-Right.

-But not so obvious.

-I mean, -!I actually I'm really thankful -to hear a man's perspective -in this.

-And also, like, I can imagine -just given your upbringing -!and what you were saying about -being a Haitian American man -and being the center -of the household.

Right.

-There's probably some of that -!stuff there that's popping up.

-yeah.

I'm happy -you mentioned I feel like -it was.

-I talked -really vulnerable and openly, -but I -!there's some nights that like, -I think men, -!we have to tell ourselves like, -!hey, be strong or I had to tell -!myself some really mean things -to get through the night, -like that nobody cares.

-Like, shut up and just do it.

-Like you're going to be fine.

-Like, -!this is what I'm supposed to do.

-Like, you tell yourself these -things, to convince yourself -psychologically, emotionally, -!mentally so you can get through.

-!I think a lot of men are feeling -I have felt this thought, -this shift, you know, -resentment, anger, jealousy -!when it comes to having a child.

-But like, -no one wants to hear that -because it's like men dont -talk about that kind of thing -because then you're like, -less of it.

-And I'm like, for me, -I just feel like my wife -!and I has something that I just, -I'm really proud of, -that we kind of talk about it -to kind of help -them navigate those things.

-where were your letters -!at this point, your emails that -you were sending to your son?

-Were you saying -some of this stuff?

-And what happened -next with those?

-My son was born, I think -the week after I decided to -post the letters publicly, -because I realized, like, -these feelings -that I'm going through, -I'm not the only one -feeling these things.

-!And I'm, as I'm looking online -for these things, -I don't see the -!the openness, the vulnerability, -like the sadness, the joy.

-I'm not seeing these things.

-!It's kind of like I said, it's -a, it's a, -!it's a standup role, it's comedy -you know, -and I was looking for -something more serious.

-!So I decided to take the letters -and I decided to post them -publicly on, Substack and -that was -because I also realized -this is something special.

-And I think the pressure -to have to people, like -putting it in the public eye -!would forced me to keep doing it -and not like, -I'm gonna just take a break -this week, you know?

-So I wrote more letters -because I did it every week -because I knew people -were actually going to, like, -want to read them as well.

-!And the response has been like, -just beautiful, you know?

-People are much nicer when -you are carrying a child.

-did you feel like -maybe there was just -these men out there -!just waiting for another man to -lead something like this?

-So, I post -and I start to see -mostly women saying -wow, -I never knew -!that kind of what you're saying.

-I wish I wish -I knew this myself.

-And I start to meet other men -that are going through this -same exact thing, like hey I -felt this too and I also meet -other men who also had their -own version of writing -!for different reasons, to their -kids too.

-And I have a small community -doing this.

-And I realized, the more -vulnerable I am, and of -course, what were doing is -taboo.

-Black people, we dont share -our personal business.

-I dont know if its shame or -where it comes from but -!we dont air family drama out.

-So, Im learning how to share -my truth without -sharing embarassing stories -about anybody or -putting anyobody -on front street.

-Sharing these letters, I meet -!people from all over the world -!who are looking forward to this -but we are connecting over, -especially dads are like, -Im going through this too.

-And thats encouragement for -me to keep showing up -in this way because my son -cant read, hes only 2 -right now, you know?

-He's only two.

Yeah.

two.

-And until -he could read it himself, -I'm like, depending -on, like, people to read this -!so I can kind of keep showing up -and realizing like, oh, -!I'm not alone in this, you know?

-And I think, the more I write -in, the more I connect -with other men.

-I realize that -not only -are we going -through the same thing, -but we don't have to suffer -kind of together.

-And from me its been -healing because, -like, came to Birmingham, -!where I don't have my mom here, -who I depended on for -so long.

-I don't have any family here, -and at the time, -I was kind of depressed.

-I don't have any friends here -either.

-And like, like the the men -I, I meet online, through -!these letters and the community, -really, really kind of -in some way help with -that depression because -I didnt -feel alone anymore.

-Yeah.

-And you didn't have to put it -on your wife.

-Right?

-I yes, yes, yes, yes.

-And I think that was, -that was beautiful because I -I had this other other place -to kind of put -like the emotions on versus -having to process, you know, -and I think that's helped the -relationship tremendously -because I use this term -I saw before like, -she already has my son -!and I don't want to be another -thing on her back, you know, -and if I could carry my -own emotions -or another or another child -or another child.

-Right, right, exactly.

-And I think that's -what I learned.

-When I was going through -that period of, -I think, jealousy and anger -and wanting love -is that a lot of us, I think -especially Caribbean men, -me specifically, -that we were, that we depend -!on our partners to, become like -second mothers, you know?

-And I realized I kind of like -that wasn't fair to her.

-And when she told me, -in so many words -!that you got to depend on what -we created together.

-!She was actually saying, like, -hey, I'm not your mom.

-I can't be your mom.

-Especially right now -that we have a child.

-And I think that was like, -got it.

-Facts.

-Yeah.

-I hear that.

-And I'm like, listen, -black women -!being like, the shock absorbers -for the whole globe -is, like, such a real thing -in so many ways.

-But also, so is -the feeling -that we are all children.

-Once we have a child, -!like we're all new to this and -we all don't know what to do.

-And like everybody's -newness is valid.

-!And it just it gets me thinking -like how much I wish -there was more support -for for men or partners -!who aren't the birthing partner -in a relationship.

-But it's really, -really cool that you created -you created these letters -to find your own.

-And also like you just said, -!something just to back up that, -like I keep hearing on this -!show, the more interviews we do -!and it's like we weren't going -!to put our business out on Front -Street, right?

-We weren't going to tell -our business outside.

-And it's just such a thing -!that's embedded in our culture.

-I feel like -I need to get a therapist -on this show to be like, -how have you -how can you teach us -to overcome this?

-Because, I mean, -your Haitian way of saying -that feels like the same way -I hear it in my black -American family, right?

-!It's just like, keep it inside.

-have you changed, like -!your thought process around how -!you're going to raise your son -regarding vulnerability?

-Yeah.

-It's a great question, Myra.

-I think one of the biggest -struggles is like, -what does it mean to raise -a black boy -who gets to be soft -and gets to be open -without being looked at like -softness, -being a derogatory term, -!you know, I struggle with that.

-Like, what does it mean -to let him be emotional here.

-But if he's older, like, -you know, -there's a consequence -that can come easily -with him acting out if -that makes sense, you know.

-So I think I struggle -even at 2 now, -one of the things -that I struggle with is like, -how do I teach him -to be his full self -in a world that cant really -accept that beauty, you know?

-!And that's kind of what scares -me, because there's a moment -!that I know is going to happen -where, like, -we take him everywhere.

-He's like, -oh my God, he's so cute.

-He's so cute.

He's so cute.

-Like he's beautiful.

-And I -agree, but I'm always like, -eventually, like, he's -going to become not cute -anymore.

-There's a point, -!I think, in a black boy's life -where the cuteness comes -up, comes -and turns into, like, he's -a problem, he's a threat.

-Maybe its the behavior -or how he looks, -because he might be taller, -maybe bigger.

-He might say words in -a certain kind of way.

-And I know it's true, -because it happened to me.

-I can't take him -and put him in a -a place -where it doesn't exist.

-Because no matter -where we go, like -racism, is there, structural -!things out there that are like, -you know, damaging and in -the air we breathe.

-We can't avoid these things.

-I, I think about that -constantly.

-!Do you write any of this to him?

-yeah, 100%, literally 100% -all the time.

-!Thanks so much for joining us.

-If you want to continue -!to be a part of the homegoings -family, stay in touch -at homegoings.co -and subscribe -to the homegoings podcast -wherever you listen.

-Take good care.