>>This week on NewsNight, the debate over oil and gas drilling off the Florida coast enters the Republican presidential primary campaign.

Plus, the U.S.

Fish and Wildlife Service considers restoring endangered status for manatees following a record die off.

NewsNight starts now.

[MUSIC] Hello, I'm Steve Mort, and welcome to NewsNight where we take an in-depth look at the top stories and issues in central Florida and how they affect all of us.

First tonight, the debate over fracking and offshore drilling in Florida.

In 2018, Florida voters approved a constitutional amendment banning oil and natural gas exploration or extraction on lands beneath state waters.

Governor DeSantis campaigned against fracking in Florida, and after taking office in 2019, he signed an executive order amid concerns over the potential impact on the coastal environment and the tourism industry, tasking the state's Department of Environmental Protection to, quote, take necessary actions to adamantly oppose all offshore oil and gas activities of every coast in Florida and hydraulic fracturing in Florida.

Now, the governor's record on the issue of drilling has become a source of debate on the presidential campaign trail.

At the last GOP debate on Fox Business, Nikki Haley accused Santos of being against fracking and drilling.

>>What you don't need is a president who is against energy independence.

Ron DeSantis is against fracking.

He's against drilling.

He's been against - you did it.

>>Our voters enacted a constitutional mandate-- >>You banned it before they voted.

>>No, it's not true.

>>You banned it before they voted and not only that-- >>You're not you're not-- >>They didn't vote-- >>Shes just totally wrong.

>>According to PolitiFact, Governor DeSantis continues to oppose fracking and oil drilling off Florida's coast, but supports it elsewhere.

But Florida waters only extends three nautical miles into the Atlantic and nine nautical miles into the Gulf of Mexico.

Federal waters are a different matter, though, sometimes extending as far as 200 nautical miles offshore.

>>The Sunshine State is truly one of the most beautiful places on Earth.

I love it.

>>In 2020, then President Trump signed a moratorium prohibiting oil and gas drilling in federal waters off both coasts of Florida, Georgia and South Carolina until 2032.

This year, bipartisan legislation was introduced in Congress to make the moratorium permanent.

NewsNight spoke recently with Irene Gutierrez, a senior attorney from the Natural Resources Defense Council.

>>Florida has a really thriving coastal economy and it's something that fishermen depend on.

Fishermen, the fisheries, both recreational and commercial, are an $8 billion industry in Florida.

Maybe more prominently, Florida also has a thriving tourist economy.

So people who come to Florida to use the beaches and enjoy a clean and healthy ocean that is over a $400 billion industry and it supports over 900,000 jobs.

Allowing an industrial practice like fracking or allowing offshore oil gas development in the coastal waters off the coast of Florida puts all of that at risk.

And, you know, it's it's.

Florida has some really special marine and coastal resources that should not be placed at risk in that way.

Even with the moratorium in place, there is a lot the Biden administration can do in order to make oil and gas development in other parts of the Gulf less risky.

So, for example, the Biden administration could exclude certain areas of the western and central Gulf from drilling.

They could put also additional protective measures in place to make sure that well operations are not as risky as they currently are.

And they could also make oil producers bear the costs of the risks of oil and gas development more than they currently do.

So, you know, even with the moratorium in place, there's a lot that the administration can still do to make oil drilling less, less risky.

>>Irene Gutierrez there.

Well, let's bring in our panel now to break it all down.

Joining us in the studio this week, Amy Green from InsideClimate News.

Thank you so much for coming in, Amy.

Appreciate your time today.

And Molly Duerig, 90.7 WMFE News, Environmental reporter over there.

Thanks for being here as well, Molly.

>>Thanks for having me.

>>Good to see you guys today.

Molly, let me start with you on this.

We heard the voices against offshore drilling there, but what does the energy industry say about access to Florida waters?

>>So the energy industry would probably point to advancements in technology that they say make drilling safer now than it was before.

They would also point out that just off of Florida's waters alone, there is enough to produce at least 18% of the entire country's annual oil and gas needs just just off of our coastline here.

>>Yeah, we heard discussion there at that GOP debate about Governor DeSantis energy policy.

Amy, how does where he stands now on the campaign trail look and how does it compare to his record here in Florida?

>>Steve, it contrasts sharply with at least some of his environmental policy here in Florida.

You know, as a presidential candidate, DeSantis has talked of withdrawing the U.S. from the Paris Agreement, which is a green - it's an agreement of countries aimed at slowing global warming.

He has talked of expanding fossil fuel use, and he's even talked about limiting the use of phrases like climate change in federal documents.

Now, you'll remember that he was elected governor in 2018 during a time when toxic algae blooms were a very major issue in the state of Florida.

And DeSantis vowed to make the environment a priority of his administration.

And he invested a lot of money toward Everglades restoration and water quality programs.

On climate change, he established a program called Resilient Florida that was aimed at fortifying the state's infrastructure against rising seas and more damaging hurricanes.

But he has faced criticism in the state for not doing more to move the state toward cleaner energy.

But now, as a presidential candidate, he seems to be turning his back on climate change altogether.

And this at a time when Florida just had a very damaging hurricane in Hurricane Idalia.

>>Molly, then president Trump got GOP backing, including from governor desantis, right when you extended the offshore drilling moratorium for Florida.

What do we know about the party's position now on energy more broadly?

>>There's this thing called Project 2025.

It's really a sweeping Republican strategy for a future Republican presidency developed by conservative think tanks, other groups that deny climate science.

And really what that plan outlines is an idea ideas to basically strip greenhouse gas emission regulations that are currently in place and it would actually declare the federal government's obligation to develop vast oil and gas and coal resources on U.S. public lands.

Very different from the administration that we're seeing right now.

However, really important to point out that that is sort of the overarching larger party's stance.

But younger Republicans in particular are starting to speak up here and criticize that, saying, you know, climate change and global warming is a concern for everybody, including younger members of the party.

>>Interesting.

Maybe a generational divide there.

Republicans have criticized, Amy, President Biden, over energy policy, that is to refer to improve American energy independence.

But what is the administration's record on on offshore drilling?

What does it look like at this stage?

>>The Biden administration has sought to limit offshore drilling in the Gulf of Mexico, although conservation groups have pushed him to limit that entirely.

You know, world wide scientists agree that the best way to avoid the worst consequences of climate change is to limit fossil fuel use.

>>Molly, let's just talk about some legislation that was filed in the US House earlier this year on making that moratorium off the Florida coast permanent.

What does it aim to do?

Two US House representatives from Florida, bipartisan representatives Castor and Buchanan filed the legislation that would permanently ban oil and gas drilling off both of Florida's coasts.

There was also a move earlier in the summer, more than 100 elected officials urging the Biden administration to prevent new offshore drilling leases.

That's something that we're going to want to keep an eye on, because in the near future, in December, we should know more about basically how many new leases will be permitted.

>>I mean, we're talking about offshore drilling here, but there has been also a discussion for years over potential drilling in the Everglades and in the Big Cypress Park just to its south.

What's the status of that discussion, briefly, Amy?

>>So Big Cypress National Park is protected by the federal government, but there are underground mineral rights that are owned by private entities there.

And there is a small amount of drilling that does take place there.

So there is an effort to push the federal government to take control of those underground mineral rights so that drilling can stop.

>>Well you can find a link to the Florida Coastal Protection Act filed in the US House of Representatives on our website.

It's at wucf.org/newsnight.

Okay.

Next tonight, a citizen environmental group is celebrating a big win in the Florida budget.

The Friends of the Loch Haven Chain of Lakes has secured more than $1.3 million from the state to develop a flood control and long term nutrient management plan with capital improvements for the bodies of water.

A lightning strike in 2020 unleashed 350,000 gallons of sewage into Lake Rowena that then flowed into other interconnecting lakes, even promoting a toxic algae outbreak.

Part of the state funding will help mitigate stormwater issues.

Central Florida continues to clean up from Hurricane Ian.

Volunteer Tim De Palma says there are several factors at play and he hopes the state funding will help restore the affected waterways.

>>The county, because we have a lot of pollution problems from fertilizer and yard runoff, they've gone to a moratorium for fertilizing during the summer because that's when, you know, people fertilize their lawns and then the rain comes or their irrigation systems and it winds up everything winds up in the lakes.

And that's, you know, that's our water system.

And, you know, you get those big rafts of green algae and that's eutrophication.

And what that does is it stops the sunlight, the underwater plants die.

So they're not photosynthesizing.

There's no more oxygen being produced, dissolved oxygen for the fish.

And that's where you get the dead zones.

And the fish kills.

And that's a very serious thing.

As I understand, up in Lake Sue, they even have trouble getting boats around because the lakes are so clogged with eutrophication.

Yeah.

So, you know, we want to build the ark and everybody does.

To keep this looking beautiful and make it is beautiful as it used to be.

I've talked to some real old timers and they will say that, yeah, when they were kids, you could see the bottoms of these lakes.

So it would just be great if we could someday get back to that.

>>Tim De Palma there.

Okay, Molly, let me start with you on this one.

You've covered this issue.

The Friends of Loch Haven Chain of Lakes, right, have really become quite a potent political force.

I mean, they've achieved quite a lot in the short amount of time.

How did they get what they wanted from the budget?

>>Steve, it's a great question.

And you mentioned the potent force.

Well, of all the things, you know, sewage is something a potent force that folks might - it might be easier to rally folks around.

Nobody wants that.

Nobody wants our waters to be polluted.

So that inciting incident that they had back in 2020 with that a massive amount of sewage that's spilled into the lakes.

I mean, that certainly is something that, again, is something that a lot of people rally around, including the two bipartisan state lawmakers, Senator Broder and Representative Eskamani, who normally are on totally opposite sides of the political spectrum, both came together for this state allocation that they've won.

They're finally expanding three jurisdictions.

So that's more layers of complexity.

But I think also because it spans those three jurisdictions, impacts so many people.

A lot of people close to 400 people I think have rallied around this group.

And honestly, it's a lot of persistence over time and dedication.

It was not easy.

There was a moment where the allocation was reduced, for example, but then with the lawmakers help, they were able to get it.

The full requested amount back in.

So, I mean, it's no small feat what they've been able to do.

>>It's a good point.

Less sewage is probably something that everybody can get behind, right.

I mean, what's the city of Orlando doing to ensure that that pumping station that was hit by lightning doesn't fail again?

>>Yeah.

So there have been numerous improvements made since that incident.

And again, partly thanks to this group's efforts, there's now more backup power supply to ensure that if something like that happens again, there's four different backup power supplies now.

So they have made improvements to mitigate the risk for that particular live station.

However, as the group has learned and of course adding more layers of complexity, there are other things that are adding pollutants to those lakes, as we just heard, over fertilization is a concern.

It's not just one thing.

So it's not one simple catch all solution.

>>You've covered this issue of toxic algae in the waterways, particularly to the south and also in Lake Okeechobee.

It sounds like there are a lot of similar issues at play Amy.

>>Absolutely wastewater is a big problem.

It's a big contributor to the nutrient pollution that we see causing these harmful algae blooms and toxic algae blooms all over the state.

And it's a common problem during storms and hurricanes where power outages lead to lift station failures and wastewater spills.

And so that's why after hurricanes, when there are flood waters, it's important to stay away from those waters because you don't know what's in those waters.

>>What is the plan now for those monies?

What's the route forward?

>>So that money is going to be managed by the Saint John's River Water Management District.

They've got the funds that they are using now, first for a professional study that they're working on.

They think that's going to take between 10 to 14 months and that's basically going to be analyzing what we were discussing, the many different sources of pollution.

And then after that, they're going to be using the funding for restoration projects to try to mitigate some of those some of those issues.

But first is to look at what exactly is going on, and then they're going to be working to enhance water quality and flooding protection.

>>I mentioned Hurricane Ian in my in my introduction just now.

That storm has caused lasting issues, right?

Environmental issues for our region that might not be immediately visible to people.

>>That hurricane, it was just it was a monumental hurricane.

You know, it was the costliest hurricane in state history.

It was the third costliest on record in the United States after Hurricane Katrina and Hurricane Harvey.

And in central Florida, it dropped just an enormous amount of rain, you know, like 20 inches in some parts of the region.

And this in a peninsula that's accustomed to receiving 50 inches of rain annually.

>>Let's talk about some of the other initiatives briefly to wrap this one up, Molly.

I mean, Orange County is attempting some other measures to improve the quality of its waterways.

What are officials looking at, though?

>>The big focus right now for Orange County is they're working to update their wetlands ordinance.

So one big update that they are proposing is adding a 100 foot upland buffer around all wetlands.

That buffer could have some flexibility to be either larger or smaller, depending on the project.

They're also streamlining administrative processes or hoping to with the proposed updates, including new expedited permit types for low impact development projects, which does have some folks concerned.

But overall they say that the ordinance is outdated.

It was last updated or it was created in the late eighties.

They're they're working to update it, they say, to better protect the wetlands in the county.

>>It's certainly an ongoing effort and one that we'll keep watching here on the program.

Be sure to join the conversation meanwhile, on social media, we're at WUCF TV on Facebook, X, formerly known as Twitter, and also on Instagram.

Okay.

Next tonight, the status of Florida's manatee population.

The US Fish and Wildlife Service this month announced it would look into whether it should reclassify the West Indian manatee, including those found in Florida from threatened to endangered.

It's the latest move in a years long debate over the health of the state's manatee population.

The U.S.

Fish and Wildlife Service says it conducted a 90 day review after receiving two citizen petitions calling for a reclassification for manatees.

Now, following the findings of that review, the agency says it will carry out an in-depth status review which will then go for public comment.

A record manatee die off in 2021 and 2022, partly erased gains made in previous years.

All right, Molly, well, let's first of all talk about those numbers, shall we?

How does the population change in more recent years compare to the trend sort of since the mid 1990s, would you say?

>>Steve I recently spoke with the state supervisor for the US Fish and Wildlife Services Ecological Services Program here in Florida, and he told me that in the mid-nineties there were only about 1,500 manatees at one point.

So that's what encouraged agencies to implement speed zones across the state-- >>1,500 for the whole state.

>>That's what he that's what he told me in the mid-nineties.

And so from between 1995 and 2017, he says those speed zones helped boost the manatee population in our state to nearly 7,000 manatee.

So in 2017, they remove them from the endangered status.

Now groups are pushing for that to be reconsidered, of course.

And so they're coming back now to say, all right, you've convinced us there's enough evidence for us to do a thorough review to see if really we are going to be able to make them endangered again.

According to the state's Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission.

800 manatees died in 2022, which is above the recent five year average, but it's also lower than in 2021.

We saw a record number of manatee fatalities, 1,100.

So.

>> So yeah.

So why were fatalities so high in those couple of years Amy?

>>So this die off, it really started toward the end of 2020.

And so in the Indian River Lagoon, which is this incredibly important habitat for manatees in Florida, for several years there had been ongoing water quality problems, harmful algae blooms and widespread seagrass losses.

And so by 2020, manatees were stressed because their food supply was compromised.

And and they are cold, sensitive animals and so when this cold snap occurred in 2020, when a cold snap like that happens for manatees, it can present them with kind of this crucial choice, which is, you know, do I stay where I am and it's warm and maybe there's less food or do I go look for food someplace else and maybe it's a little bit colder.

And so in 2020, this cold snap occurred and they just started dying and it just triggered this horrible die off that continued for months and years, really.

>>So it was boating accidents and injuries that were causing the previous issues until those new rules that that Molly talked about were put in place.

So it sounds like the reason for manatee deaths is change, right?

There's less sea grass for them to eat.

>>That's right.

Yes.

The seagrass die off has been a huge problem in the Indian River Lagoon and it affects all species who live there, you know, and these water quality problems, you know, people who live around there and use the Indian River Lagoon frequently, you know, it's been a big change there.

What was the response?

I'm kind of interested in this because you've covered this for for so long.

When the manatee was downgraded in 2017 from endangered to threatened, was that controversial move at that point?

>>To describe that as controversial would be putting that lightly.

There was widespread outcry and a lot of people thought it was premature because of these obvious habitat problems and this important habitat for them, which is the Indian River Lagoon.

The proposal to downlist the manatee, it was opposed by all four scientific experts who peer reviewed the proposal.

It was opposed by the vast majority of organizations and individuals who submitted public comments in response to that proposal.

It was also opposed by the Miccosukee Tribe.

And a lot of the concerns, you know, there was an array of concerns.

There were concerns about conditions in the Indian River Lagoon.

There were also concerns about climate change because the proposal had no discussion about impacts like warming waters and rising seas and hurricanes and how these impacts might affect manatees.

>>We had the stakeholders there back in 2017, who's leading the charge for a change in status now?

>>So you've got the Center for Biological Diversity, the Harvard Law School Animal Law and Policy Clinic, right here in Longwood Save the Manatee Club, Miami Waterkeeper and then another private citizen.

Those are the folks who filed this petition for the federal agency to uplist it what they call it back to endangered the managed manatee status.

So it's those groups that came together earlier this year and basically asked the federal agency to to make this consideration.

And they have now said, yes, we are going to really consider it.

So it's still going to be 12 months of them figuring out if they're going to elevate it.

And they did tell me when I asked, you know, why does it take that long?

They attributed it to low staffing resources.

They said they really wish that they could make it go quicker, is what they told me.

>>Yeah.

I mean, as Molly said, it's going to take a while.

Amy, what are the current trends in terms of the manatee population now, and could that sort of play into the final verdict when the Fish and Wildlife Service does indeed come back with a decision?

>>Well, yeah.

So the development is coming at a time when things may be looking up a little bit for Florida's manatees.

The number of deaths this year is down a little bit.

And it could be because the seagrass in the Indian River Lagoon is rebounding.

And that's great.

It also could be because the population has been so impacted by this die off.

You know, 2,000 manatees died in Florida in 2021, and 2022.

And that's a two year record.

And the advocacy organizations say that represents 20% of the population in the state.

So it could be that we're seeing fewer deaths now because the population has been reduced.

You know, so but the seagrass is rebounding.

And Pat Rose at the Save the Manatee Club is a great source of mine.

And I just talked with him the other week and he told me that he's optimistic enough that, you know, the seagrass to the point is to the point in the Indian River Lagoon where these supplemental lettuce feedings that the wildlife agencies have been doing there, he thinks that may not be necessary this winter, which is great.

>>So far, our efforts have seen some successes.

As Amy mentioned, we are seeing somewhat of a rebound of sea grasses.

Now, whether or not that's directly attributable to the seagrass planting is less certain.

We kind of have to see what is the long term ability of these efforts to work.

But yeah, so far it's having some success.

>>I would just add to that too.

You know, the seagrass plantings, you know, there is some success with that, but you know, we have to remember that there's this larger problem in the Indian River Lagoon, which is these, you know, this nutrient pollution that's leading to these harmful algae blooms and these ongoing water quality problems.

And that these are really hard problems.

And that's going to take a lot of money and a lot of time to address those problems.

And there are restoration efforts underway in the Indian River Lagoon.

But the reason this manatee die off, you know, the reason we talk about it a lot and the reason it's so important is because, you know, again, the manatee die offs and the seagrass losses, these are symptoms of a bigger problem, which are these these water quality problems.

And these habitat problems.

And that's a really important story.

And it's a big problem and it's one we really need to pay attention to.

I just wanted to stay with the lagoon to finish and some additional reporting that you've done on this issue, Molly.

And that's the sort of the northern migration of mangroves right beyond their usual range because of climate change that's causing a problem for the lagoon, right?

What is that?

>>Yeah, so mangroves have a lot of benefits, including mainly they protect shorelines from storm surge.

Whenever hurricanes come, oysters are also very beneficial.

They help keep the waters clean.

But when these two organisms come together, that's what seems to be creating problems.

So essentially mangroves appear to be dissolving oyster shell, that is according to UCF Pegasus professor of biology Linda Walters, who oversees a coastal and estuarine lab over there.

>>Shes done a lot of work on the lagoon.

>>Yes.

And they recently got another boost from the Disney Conservation Fund to expand their work.

So basically, they she says that this has not really been studied before because it hasn't happened before.

It hasn't been observed before, but because the waters are warming, the mangroves are migrating north, which is bringing them closer to us and bringing them to this point where they're overtaking oyster reefs.

And that is the problem.

>>Do the scientists you talk to have any ideas on what the solutions might be?

>>They are working on solutions now.

They think they think that it looks like chemicals are being released from the mangroves roots, that that's what's dissolving the oyster shell.

But they are looking into many ways to do coastal restoration more sustainably.

They're also doing a lot of work bringing in the community.

So they have programs where they have school schoolteachers growing more mangroves throughout the year in the classroom, and then they have an event at the end of the year where they bring them into the lagoon.

So working to bring the community in, to help them understand how important this is.

>>The Indian River Lagoon is certainly such a central environmental issue for our community and one that well follow as efforts continue to sort of try to regenerate that waterway.

You can find a link to the latest reporting on manatees from both Amy and Molly on our website.

Visit us online at wucf.org/newsnight along the bottom of your screen.

But that is all the time we have for this week.

My thanks to Amy Green, InsideClimate News.

Thanks so much for coming in, Amy.

Appreciate your time.

Molly Duerig, 90.7 WMFE News environment reporter.

Thanks for being here as well Molly.

>>Always great.

>>Good to see you guys.

We'll see you next Friday night at 8:30 here on WUCF.

In the meantime, from all of us here at NewsNight, take care and have a great week.