(upbeat music) - I'm Geoffrey Baer.

Tonight, a Chicago attraction that went downhill fast.

A perfect nine.

And whose wasteland is it anyway?

All that and much more, but first a pop quiz just for you at home.

(bell rings) Illinois secretary of state, Jesse White, announced his retirement after 22 years in office.

Before entering politics, Jesse White did what, A, served as a US Army paratrooper, B, taught in Chicago public schools, C, founded an internationally known tumbling team, or, D, played minor league baseball for the Chicago Cubs.

Well, the answer is next on "The Great Chicago Quiz Show."

(upbeat music) pbeat mu) Hello and welcome to "The Great Chicago Quiz Show."

I'm Geoffrey Baer.

Now, if you've watched my programs over the years, this should be a piece of cake for you, but we are handicapping the score just to make things fair.

All right, actually we're not even keeping score.

There are no rules, no prizes, and no pressure.

And as always Chicago's TikTok historian, Shermann Dilla Thomas is with us.

Hi, Dilla.

- Hey brother Geoffrey, how are you?

Hey, everybody.

- Now, before we welcome our first contestants, the answer to tonight's pop quiz.

(bell dings) I asked, what did Illinois secretary of state, Jesse White, do before entering politics?

Well, of course, he founded the Jesse White Tumbling Team in 1959.

You knew that, but all four answers are true.

He served in the US Army's 101st Airborne Division jumping out of airplanes.

He was a CPS physical education teacher and administrator for more than 30 years.

And he played outfield and third base for seven seasons with Cubs farm teams including the Carlsbad Potashers, the Wenatchee Chiefs, and the Salt Lake City Bees.

(upbeat music) All right, on with the show.

Let's meet our first round contestants.

A standup comic turned clinical therapist whose comedy skills help him break the ice with his clients.

He's here all week, folks.

Hello, Vance Williams.

- How you doing.

- One of my fellow tour guides on the Chicago River whose narration is so mesmerizing, she once kept a group of trial lawyers quiet for a full 90 minutes.

I wish I could do that.

Hello, Kathleen Carpenter.

- Hi, Geoffrey, how are you.

(laughs) - And someone who might actually be a bigger fan of the L than I am.

In fact, the CTA is one of the reasons he moved to Chicago after growing up in the woods of rural North Carolina.

Hello, Ryan Trimble.

- Hello, wonderful to be here.

- All right, Kathleen, I'm gonna start with you.

We are actually old friends, because we've been river tour guides together for a long time.

(upbeat music) Have you kind of seen it all on the Chicago River?

Have you seen everything you could possibly see happen?

- [Kathleen] I assume I haven't seen everything that could possibly happen, but from weddings, to proposals, to parties at the side of the river, as well as on the boat, we never know what's gonna happen.

- Like it's getting crazier on the river in the last few years, isn't it?

- I think that the river boat captains deserve a lot of credit from maneuvering around the kayakers and all the recreational boats, but people are taking advantage of it, and they didn't used to.

I always tell people about the reversal of the river and how disgusting the river used to be, but things have moved along pretty nicely, and there's a lot of species thriving, and it's just a much cleaner river now.

- All right, we need to get on with the quiz.

Are you all ready?

- I think so.

- The categories are just not that into you, A.K.A., and where in Chicago?

- Where in Chicago, that sounds good.

- Well, guess what?

That is the lightning round.

- Goodie.

(lightning crashes) - All right, I am going to give you an address in Chicago and you tell me what is at that address.

Now, a docent for the Chicago Architecture Center, I think you have a leg up on this.

Are you ready?

- No pressure there, Geoffrey.

(men laugh) (bell dings) - 121 North LaSalle Street, da city dat works.

- City Hall.

- You bet.

1,400 South Museum Campus Drive, sue the T. Rex.

- Field Museum.

- Field museum, yes.

233 South Wacker Drive, what you talking 'bout?

(suspenseful music) I can see your house here.

Oh, it's so tall.

- Willis Tower - Willis Tower, there you go.

5700 South Lake Shore Drive, U505 submarine.

- MSI.

(bell dings) - Of course, you used to work.

- That's right.

(laughs) - 1060 West Addison Street, Ivy League.

- Wrigley Field - Wrigley Field.

You're doing great.

(bell dings) 8400 West 31st Street in Brookfield, lions, tigers, and bears, oh my.

- Brookfield Zoo.

- Of course.

(bell dings) 2122 North Clark Street, Bugs Moran!

- Sight of the St. Valentine's Day Massacre.

- That is a varsity answer, very good.

- Oh my gosh, so glad, 'cause that means I get to keep my docent badge.

(all laugh) - That's right.

- All right, we will move on now to Vance.

Hello, Vance.

- How you doing, Geoffrey?

- You are a therapist, and you were a standup comic.

So you use humor, as we said, in your introduction to break the ice.

So we're gonna do a little role play here.

Let's say that I am, just hypothetically, a Cubs fan and a Bears fan.

Help me with my depression over being a fan.

- Well like with all my clients, we start out with your childhood.

Then we could derive the information to ascertain why you think the way you do.

- I'm having a breakthrough right now, as you say that, because when I was younger, Santo, Kessinger, Beckert, and Banks, Fergie Jenkins, Billy Williams, this was the famous Cubs team of what year?

- That was a year that they lost to the amazing Mets.

- 1969.

- [Vance] If I'm not mistaken, that's when the Cubs kinda got the nickname of the Lovable Losers.

- I think I'm cured.

(contestants laugh) What are gonna charge me for this session?

- The bill is in the mail.

(all laugh) - All right, so the two categories that are left are just not that into you and A.K.A.

Which of those would you like?

(bell dings) - Okay, I'm gonna try just not that into you.

- All right.

(bell dings) This person famously called something a, quote, vast wasteland, end quote.

Who was he, and what was he describing?

Was it, A, president Andrew Jackson describing the future site of Chicago, B, reformer, Saul Alinsky, on Chicago's Union Stockyards, C, FCC chairman and Chicago lawyer, Newton Minow, describing TV in the 1960s, or, D, Chicago born astronaut, Gene Ceran as he walked on the moon?

- Well, the one that makes the most sense to me and the one that I agree with would be C. - And how about the other two of you, does that sound good to you guys?

- I disagree with the sentiment, but I think that the answer is correct.

- Uh huh.

- I agree.

I'd hate to think that the president called this area a vast wasteland.

- Well guess what, Vance, you are correct!

(bell dings) - Yay.

- (laughs) It was 1961, and Newton Minow was the head of the FCC and made a big keynote speech to the National Association of Broadcasters.

"If you watch your own TV station for a full day, "you will see a vast wasteland, and most of all boredom."

- Oh wow.

- The broadcasters were not too happy about being scolded in that way, and one of the producers got back at Newton Minow a little bit by naming the boat in "Gilligan's Island the S.S. Minnow.

- Oh, that's funny.

- I didn't know that.

That's great.

- Good job, Vance, you got it right.

Ryan, you got a lot to live up to here.

- Well, we will see what happens.

(laughs) - So you love the L. - I do.

I grew up in a place where there was no transit unless you had a car or liked walking very, very, very long distances.

And I am thankful to live in a place where I can get on a train or a bus and go just about anywhere.

- Did you know that we did a TV program on WTTW about the Chicago L a few years ago?

- Did I know?

I've seen it.

I love it, it's great.

(laughs) Yeah.

- And do you have a favorite L line?

- Oh, I love the yellow line.

It is adorable.

The yellow line is so cool, because, first off, it goes so fast.

It like zooms.

It's a little guy, which I being five foot six, I appreciate little guys.

(Geoffrey laughs) You feel like you're on the Hogwarts Express almost, 'cause you can see all these trees around you and it's gorgeous and all of a sudden you're zooming over and you're like, ah, look at the fools in their cars.

- I like the Hogwarts Express reference too My daughter's a huge Harry Potter fan, so we'll leave that in.

- Good.

- [Geoffrey] There is one category left, A.K.A.

You ready?

- Well, yes, we'll see.

(laughs) - All right.

(bell dings) Musician McKinley Morganfield was born in Rolling Fork, Mississippi in 1913.

He later moved to Chicago and performed under what stage name?

Was it A, Howlin' Wolf, B, Muddy Waters, C, Bo Diddley, or, D, Chuck Berry?

- It's Muddy Waters, isn't it?

- Yes, it's Muddy Waters!

Very good.

- Yes!

- I knew it, oh my gosh, yay.

- Did the other two of you know that too?

- Yes.

- Oh yeah.

(laughs) - These questions are too easy.

McKinley Morganfield, later Muddy Waters, migrated to Chicago, part of the Great Migration, and the apocryphal story is that the city was so loud.

The L trains were so loud, then they had to use this amplified sound, almost to the point of distortion, kind of a hallmark of Chicago blues.

- That's very neat.

- You did so well individually that now we are going to give you a team question.

What?

- Yes, you're not getting out of this that easily.

(all laugh) (bell dings) Chicago once had an actual downhill ski resort within the city limits.

It lasted only one year before closing and has since become the site of what, A, Palmisano Park, which is formally Stearn's Quarry in Bridgeport, B, Dan Ryan Woods highest point in Chicago in Auburn Gresham, C, a towering, unstable landfill overlooking Lake Calumet, or, D, the Brickyard Mall in Belmont Cragin?

- Well, I grew up on the South side of Chicago.

Actually, I live not too far from Dan Ryan Woods.

And then me being a silly kid, I would actually go to the top of the hill and I would lay on my side and just roll all the way down to the bottom.

(Ryan laughs) - But if that's not the right answer, what do you think might be a plausible alternative?

- I think the towering, unstable landfill sounds potentially just like perfect for Chicago.

(all laugh) - Skiing on trash.

- Okay, Ryan, it's up to you.

I'm gonna go with my gut.

I'm gonna say Belmont Cragin.

- Brickyard Mall and Belmont Cragin, you are correct!

(bell dings) - Yay.

- Wow.

- I think we're gonna give that one to you, even though I helped a little bit.

- Yay!

(laughs) (upbeat music) - It was called Thunder Mountain, but it was mostly a big hole in the ground.

The Carey Brick Works dug the hole to extract clay for one of our city's most sought after products, the humble Chicago common brick.

Material that wasn't clay was piled up next to the hole, creating a mean mountain.

After the brickyard closed in the early 1960s, some thrill seeking Carey family members started skiing down the mountain to the bottom of the hole, and patriarch, Robert Carey, saw a new business opportunity.

He built a chalet, installed rope tows, mapped three trails, easy, medium, and hard and opened Thunder Mountain to the public in January of 1968, but mother nature apparently had used up all her snow in the blizzard the previous winter.

After one snowless season, Thunder Mountain closed.

Carey sold the property.

The hole was filled, and Chicago's one of a kind attraction became just another shopping mall.

(quirky music) (upbeat music) We are back for more with the second round.

Let's meet our contestants.

He says he is a nerd, a jock, a weirdo, basically a chameleon.

Not a bad skillset for a hard working actor.

Please welcome Jalen Gilbert.

And we have a serious architectural preservationist whose alter ego is Scrunchy the Clown, Elizabeth Blasius.

And he spent 14 years opening for Frank Sinatra, appeared 61 times on "The Tonight Show," toured with some of the greatest entertainers in America, but he's never lost sight of his roots in South suburban Harvey, Illinois.

Hello, Tom Dreesen.

- Hello, hello, hello.

- So, Tom, you were the opening act for Sinatra for 14 years?

- I like to think that Frank closed for me, but if you wanna put it that way, okay.

(both laugh) (upbeat jazz music) - But I want to ask you about Tim and Tom, 'cause that was really, really something That was really groundbreaking, wasn't it?

- Yeah, I started out in show business, as you know, with Tim Reid.

We were America's first black and white comedy team.

Think about this in 1969, when we started, everywhere we went, people said "We need more discourse among the races."

And Tim Reid and I were having the discourse America was not having.

Of all the things that I've done in my 51 years in show business, I'll treasure those moments above almost all other things.

- All right, well, this is fantastic, but we gotta get on with our quiz show here.

Your categories are pioneer pride, what a relief, (bell dings) and I got the sauce.

And don't forget.

Dilla is waiting in the wings with one of those.

- I'll go pioneer pride.

- I feel like Johnny Carson how he used to do that with the cards (all laugh) (bell dings) Chicago's Henry Gerber created the first documented gay rights organization in the country, which was chartered by the state of Illinois in what year, 1924, 1944, 1964, or 1984?

- I think it's 1964.

- And why do you think that?

- I was debating between '64 and '84, to be honest with you.

And '84 seems more logical, but the reason I picked '64 is, 'cause I just think that was an era of revolution.

- Well, that is wrong, I'm afraid.

Believe it or not, it is 1924.

(bell dings) - Wow.

Wow.

- Henry Gerber, he was a Chicagoan, founded a society called the Society for Human Rights in 1924, and it was recognized by gay rights organizations as the first one in the United States.

Within a few months, all the members were arrested for obscenity or indecency.

Gerber ended up moving to New York, writing under a pseudonym advocating for gay rights.

So 1924, unbelievable.

- LGBTQ Chicagoans have been doing their things since the early 20th century.

- Elizabeth, hello, Elizabeth.

- Hi, Geoffrey.

- So Scrunchy the Clown?

(Jalen laughs) - Oh wow.

I have no sense of personal embarrassment.

I like to make people laugh.

And one year I made a clown persona called Scrunchy, and of course, Scrunchy loves the actual hair accessory.

So that's where Scrunchy is from.

- Elizabeth, you are an architectural preservationist.

So the Thompson Center, I will say, I will put it out there is one of my favorite buildings in Chicago.

- It's a really important civic building, and we really think that as a group of advocates that it's a gem of architecture.

- So given all the praise for the building, why did you choose to make a pinata out of it and encourage people to try to beat the heck out of it?

- As the James R. Thompson Center Historical Society, it was an activity that I think broke up the seriousness of preservation, and that was a really fun and sort of radical artistic activity to participate in.

- The categories that are left are what a relief and I got the sauce.

(bell dings) - I just wanna say I've got the sauce on public television.

I got the sauce.

- Well, guess what?

That is the Dilla question.

Dilla.

- Yeah!

- What's the question?

- I got the sauce.

Question, the classic Chicago original mild sauce is made from ketchup, barbecue sauce, and what other ingredient, A, hot sauce, B, horse radish, C, soy sauce, or, D, mayonnaise?

- What a tricky question.

I thought vinegar would be one of those answers.

I'm gonna go with A - You think it's hot sauce?

Now it's called mild sauce.

- I feel like this is a trick.

This seems like it's a...

It's soy sauce.

Soy sauce.

- Oh wait, wait.

Now you're changing your answer?

- This is tough.

- Tom, have you had mild sauce out there in LA?

- No, I don't have any sauce out here in LA.

(both laugh) - Jalen, do you have an instinct one way or the other?

- Trust your first mind, your first thought.

- Okay, it's hot sauce.

- Hey, Elizabeth, I see you getting a little help there.

You guys are correct.

(bell dings) - Thank you, Jalen, for your help with that.

I appreciate it.

- Gotcha.

(laughs) - I've been to a lot of cities across this great nation.

I've had some pretty good sauces or condiments, but nothing beats Chicago mild sauce.

Like deep dish pizza and the Italian beef sandwich, we know that mild sauce originates from Chicago, but we can't pin down who the inventor is.

If I had to guess, it was probably invented by some enterprising brother when he realized he was running outta barbecue sauce and needed to stretch it.

So he added some ketchup and some hot sauce and, bam, Harold's chicken hasn't been the same since.

Chicago is known for our food invention.

We've given the world Butterfingers, Twinkies, and of course, the chocolate brownie.

- Excellent.

- All right, hello, Jalen Gilbert.

So you are a chameleon.

- Growing up, we moved around a lot.

I found myself in a lot of different environments, constantly in situations where I need to make friends and come to understand the new community I was in.

I blend in everywhere.

(laughs) - We are gonna charter a boat.

- Well, we're talking about it.

- [Jalen] It's a great skill, especially when acting.

- So this is the whole small town to kind of a bigger place like Chicago for your training.

And then you go on from there to Galena, Illinois.

- My fiance is from Galena.

Illinois.

Fell in love and started making a life together in Chicago.

Then good old pandemic hit.

And we thought, do we stay in Chicago, or do we go out to like little small town Galena, Illinois?

And we planned to come here for two weeks, and two years later... (all laugh) - Well you could be in a much worse place than Galena.

It's beautiful there.

- Big time, man.

You make it in Galena, you can make it anywhere.

(laughs) - There is only one category left, and it is what a relief.

- I like that.

That sounds confident.

- All right, what a relief.

Here we go.

(bell dings) This ornate relief sculpture on Wentworth Avenue in Chinatown is called the Nine Dragon Wall.

It's a replica of one in Beijing.

Why are there nine dragons, A, they represent the nine generations of the emperors of the Qing dynasty, B, the number nine is the highest single digit representing power and authority often associated with royalty, C, nine was the most dragons the Chinatown chamber of commerce could afford when it commissioned the work, or, D, they represent the nine donors who funded the wall?

Now you do have an architectural expert there with you.

- I don't know.

You're on your own.

(Geoffrey laughs) I'm sorry.

- Oh, God, Elizabeth.

(laughs) - I know the name of nine Chinese restaurants that I've eaten that, but that's about it.

I can't help much.

(laughs) - I wanna go with D. I'm gonna trust my first actor instinct and see if it lands the job this time.

- Well, you know, you gave Elizabeth great advice to trust her instinct.

In this case, your instinct is wrong I'm afraid.

- Oh!

Actually it's because the number nine is the highest single digit and therefore was associated with royalty.

This is a kind of wall that is in traditional Chinese architecture called a screen wall where you would screen the entrance to a home or the gate to some property.

The Chinatown Chamber of Commerce and the Chinatown Parking Corporation installed it in Chinatown in Chicago to promote tourism.

- The more you know.

- I'm going to ask one more question, and you have to collaborate on this and give me one answer for all three of you.

So are you ready for your team question?

- Ready.

- Let's go.

- Yes.

(bell dings) - What term was inspired by detective Allen Pinkerton who lived in west suburban Dundee?

Was it, A, make my day, B, gumshoe, C, private eye, or, D, secret service.

- We know it wasn't make my day, 'cause that's Clint Eastwood's line in a film.

- Process of elimination.

- Yeah, I'm with you Jalen.

What do you think, Liz?

- I think it's between private eye or gumshoe, right?

- I kind of don't go for gumshoe, just because I don't think they had gum in the days of the Western.

I mean you never see cowboy movies where a guy's blowing bubbles before he draws his gun?

- Some Wrigley gum.

- So do we have a consensus then on private eye?

- Private eye.

- Let's do it.

- You are correct!

(bell dings) - Yay!

- Teamwork.

- And here's the story.

America's most famous detective was a Scottish immigrant who started out as a barrel maker.

While scavenging for wood one day, he stumbled on a gang of counterfeiters on an island in the Fox River.

He helped to arrest them, and his detective career took off.

He foiled a plot to assassinate president-elect, Abraham Lincoln, who hired Pinkerton to organize a secret service during the Civil War and spy behind enemy lines.

Later, the US government created its own secret service to do what Pinkerton did, protect the president and prevent counterfeiting.

Pinkerton's reputation was tainted in later years when industrialists hired his company as spies and strike breakers.

As for the nickname, the agency's intimidating logo was an unblinking eye with the words we never sleep.

So people started calling Pinkerton and detectives for hire private eyes.

All right, every week we welcome back one of our contestants as the geek of the week.

(retro 8-bit music) And this week, Ryan, you get to come back as the geek of the week.

Congratulations.

- Well, thank you.

I'm proud and humbled and honored to be here.

(bell dings) - A few us presidents have called Illinois home, but only one was actually born in the state.

Who was it?

Was it A, Abraham Lincoln, B, Ulysses S. Grant, C, Ronald Reagan, or, D, Barack Obama?

- I know that I can eliminate some.

- Okay, good, that's good.

- My boyfriend is from Hawaii, and I visited Hawaii with him and he showed me the hospital.

So I know it's not president Obama.

- Perfect.

- I know it is not Lincoln, because even though we're like, oh Illinois's the land of Lincoln, he was born in Arkansas.

- Kentucky, actually.

- Kentucky, dang it.

And if you hadn't corrected me, millions of people would go around being like Ryan said he was born in Arkansas, so it must be correct.

(Geoffrey laughs) I'm gonna stop babbling, and I'm just gonna say Ronald Reagan.

- And you are correct!

(bell dings) - Yes!

(laughs) - Reagan was born in Tampico, Illinois.

And as you pointed out, Obama was born in Hawaii.

Lincoln, as I mentioned, was born in Kentucky, moved to Illinois as a small boy, and Grant was born in Ohio, but actually after serving in the military, he moved to Galena, Illinois.

So very good, you got that right?

- Yay!

- That's it for this week.

Thanks to Jalen Gilbert, Elizabeth Blasius, Tom Dreesen, Vance Williams, Kathleen Carpenter, Ryan Trimble.

You will each receive a set of 100 Great Chicago Quiz Cards, so that you can host your own trivia night home.

And thanks to you for playing along with us at home.

I'm Geoffrey Baer.

Study up, and we'll see you next time on "The Great Chicago Quiz Show."

(upbeat music)