-[Male VO] This program is brought to you in part by Santa Cruz Guitar Company and Santa Cruz Parabolic Tension Strings.

-[Host VO] Also brought to you by Paige Capos and by Peluso Microphone Lab.

Additional support provided by these sponsors.

Hello, and welcome to the Life of a Musician.

Tonight's episode is recorded live from Glaser Instruments in Nashville, Tennessee.

Let's step inside and listen to part two with Vince Gill.

-I would always tell folks, you know, I come from Rice, you know.

-And that's, that's my Genesis.

-Me too.

-Yeah.

-You know, he's a big insp-- inspiration to me.

-But anybody would ask me, I'd say, "Yep.

Hey, Tony's my-- my guy, my guru, but Vince is my favorite -all around artist of all time."

-Oh, thank you.

-Because you just do so much so well.

-You know, I kind of-- I listen to old tapes and records of me singing in the-- in those Bluegrass years, and Tony and Ricky, those guys were-- those were who you looked up to.

-[Brandon] Yeah.

-You know, obviously you love the Stanley brothers, you love Monroe and Osmond Brothers and on and on.

And I loved all that stuff.

But they were the guys that were, like my generation, kind of that I went, that's what I like, and Tony's playing and singing and Ricky's playing and singing are about as definitive as Bluegrass has ever been.

-[Brandon] Yeah.

-You know, and even the way my voice sounded back then, I could tell I was emulating Tony to some degree.

And I eventually quit doing that, you know.

I had a-- I got a great lesson one time I was making my first record, first country record, and the producer, you know, as a real traditional country song, we're, you know, doing all the things.

And he hit the talk back, he goes, "Hey, no offense, but we already have a George Jones, and you're not him."

[laughter] -He said-- -He's brutal.

-Yeah, he was brutal, but he said, "You need to find a way to sing like you."

And I found my way to sound like me and sing like me and not be an imitator so much.

But that's what-- I think you love most, is hearing somebody and they're so definitive and so whatever that is, you know who it is right away when they open their mouth, start singing a song.

-Exactly.

And it's like that with you or, you know, you think about those artists, and it's up to you whether you-- who you say is the greater or, you know, more or less, or-- but it's always the ones who stand alone that last.

You know, Bob Dylan, Eric Clapton, you know.

-Yeah, and longevity comes from great songs.

You know, I'm experiencing that now.

I've been touring with the Eagles for the last, it's my eighth year.

Tour and sing and play with them and that's the lesson I've learned, is the reason they're them, is their catalog of songs is so just outrageously great.

You know, that's-- there's your reason, you know.

You listen to a James Taylor song, and all others, there's the reason he's great.

-The songs are great.

-[Brandon] Yeah.

-You can't-- you can be a great singer and a great player, but you can't prop up a bad song, you know.

-I was going through, like, just a bunch of your stuff because, like, "Oh crap, I'm gonna sit down with Vince.

I better refresh myself."

And there was one that you did.

I forget what album that was, it's the same album, and I think that had Pretty Little Adriana on it, but you did a tune called Jenny Dreams of Trains.

I abs--that was maybe my favorite song on that album.

Would you care to play just a little piece?

-Oh, yeah, you know, this one of the reasons this song is, is what it is, is because I wrote it with Guy Clark.

I don't know if you ever knew Guy, -but I really loved him.

-I didn't know him like you, -but yeah.

-Yeah.

Yeah.

He was a master songwriter and one of the best storytellers I ever knew.

And you know, got to let [inaudible] ♪ When Jenny was a little girl, she only dreamed of trains ♪ ♪ She never played with dolls or lacy kinds of things ♪ ♪ Jenny counted boxcars instead of counting sheep ♪ ♪ She could go anywhere when she went to sleep ♪ ♪ All she ever talked about was getting on to ride ♪ ♪ She was living in another time you could see it in her eyes ♪ ♪ And every day after school she'd head down to the track ♪ ♪ Waiting for the train that was never coming back ♪ ♪ Jenny dreamed of trains When the nighttime came ♪ ♪ Nobody knew how she made it come true ♪ ♪ Jenny dreamed of trains ♪ At the end, I remembered I played Freight Train.

-[Brandon] Yeah.

♪ ♪ ♪ Because it was the first songs I ever learned when I was a little boy.

♪ ♪ ♪ And... And Jenny was a little kid, and it was one of the first songs she'd ever heard.

So it was a transference of first thing I ever heard to maybe to one of the first things -she ever heard.

-[Brandon] Yeah.

-She sang this song with me a few times at the Opry and things like that.

And the real--I think my favorite part of-- of what happened with that song was John Denver found that song and heard that song and recorded it with one of the last recordings he ever made.

And he changed, I think his daughter's name was Jesse.

He called us, "Do you mind if I change it to Jesse?"

I think I may have the name wrong.

But I said, "No, I don't mind."

You know, and here's what's cool.

That was one of the last things he ever recorded was a song of mine.

And the first thing I ever recorded when I was a little boy was with my dad on a tape machine that he had worked up, and we sang along to Country Roads, and I was playing... ♪ ♪ ♪ Playing the little licks, and my dad was singing, and I don't have that tape anymore.

-That's one of those beautiful, -full circle kind of things.

-Hmm hmm, yeah.

-That's--music's like that.

I've always believed that some music, you know, the stuff that comes from someplace real, has a life of its own, a story of its own.

And then there's other music that, man, it helps you sell hamburgers, you know.

-Yeah, I mean, it's interesting.

I think that that if you look at music from whenever, how long we've been, you know, being able to play it and sing it and record it and all that for around 100 years now, but it's always evolved.

It's always been kind of, it will go in circles.

It'll stray away from something traditional, and it'll find its way back to it and stray away again and come back to it.

And I think all music is like that.

Everybody kind of goes, "Hey, let's rediscover."

What maybe made this great in the first place, and then it goes back to that at times, and that's-- those are nice stretches of life when everybody goes back to simpler time.

-I agree, it's not the frills, it's the foundation.

-Uh-huh, I always, I say this ad nauseam all the time.

I said, "I don't play music or listen to music "to impress you or be impressed.

"I play it the way I do because I want it to move you.

-I want it to move me."

-[Brandon] Yeah.

-And so it's not about watch how many licks I can sing, watch how many notes I can play.

It's really about if I can connect with you.

Tell you a story that takes you somewhere, -[Brandon] Yeah.

-that means something to you.

That's when it's the best for me.

-Yeah, I agree 100 percent, just placement, thought.

-Yeah.

-You know, things like that, that's the eternal thing.

That's, you know, you just do that.

You know, not everybody-- like when I was a kid, as soon as I learned to lick, everybody had to see it.

-Sure.

-You know, I had to fit-- I had to fit 15 into a box of two.

-That's how you know hillbillies about to die.

That's what he says is, "Hey, y'all watch this."

[laughter] -It's about [inaudible].

-Yeah, it's-- -Oh, yeah, but, I mean, that's what you do.

You know, you're like a sponge, you know.

And I sat with all those records.

I tried to learn to play like Clarence.

I tried to learn to play like Tony.

And I tried to learn to play like Doc Watson.

-All those guys, you know.

-[Brandon] Yeah.

-That's what you're supposed to do.

In your youth, you're supposed to take in all this information as much as you can.

You're like a sponge, and then you kind of find out, "Okay, what do I need?

Let's play what's necessary."

And that's a hard thing to get to, is to be willing to edit yourself, you know.

And that's what I think I might be best at.

-That's, you know, that-- you're right, that's a tough lesson.

I didn't start doing stuff like that until I started listening back to what I was doing.

-Yeah, my great lesson was in the studio and played a solo on something.

It's about like the one I was telling you.

We already have a George Jones.

But guy comes on the talk back and goes, "Man, that was impressive."

He goes, "Let's try it again."

He goes, "This time, just play me half of what you know" [laughter] I said, "Ouch.

Okay, point taken."

And that's the real beauty of what yours, I think what you're supposed to do is serve the song, serve what's in front of you -[Brandon] Yeah.

-with, you know, minimal information, if that's what it calls for.

There's times where it does call to place, you know, -and you do and it's fine, but-- -When you know how to do that?

-Well, occasionally.

-Yeah.

-It's harder and harder.

This does not coexist with this like it used to.

-Me neither.

I-- -Yeah.

I have to sit there, and I got a whole massage routine that I go through now.

And after massage routines done, my hands tired because I done massage day and-- -Advil will do it.

A little Advil.

-Advil, yeah.

Advil, a little Tylenol -and Aspirin.

-Take the salt away.

You want to do a cameo?

-[Joe] I'd like to request a song.

-All right.

Salty Dog?

-[Joe] Tennessee Blues.

-Tennessee Blues, wow.

-Oh, jeez.

I don't know if I remember the words for that.

-♪ If I had my way ♪ -[Joe] Beautiful song.

-Yeah.

I'll sing.

♪ I'd leave in a hurry ♪ ♪ I'd find me a place where I could stay ♪ ♪ And not have to worry ♪ ♪ A place I could use ♪ ♪ A place I could lose The Tennessee blues ♪ -I don't remember the whole lyrics, -but I'll try the harmony.

-That's right.

♪ I'd find me a spot on some mountain top ♪ ♪ With no one around me ♪ How am I remembering this?

♪ Valleys and streams and birds in the trees ♪ ♪ And hills that surround me ♪ ♪ A place I could use ♪ ♪ A place I could lose ♪ ♪ The Tennessee blues ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ -[Joe] It's a beautiful song.

-Yeah, it is.

-Gorgeous, too.

-It's an awesome song.

Always a first record-- second record I ever made, recorded that.

-[Joe] Oh, you recorded that?

-Yeah, yeah, with the Bluegrass Alliance.

-[Joe] I mean, there's so much in its melody, you know, you know.

-Yeah.

-Yeah.

It's ours was with sparks is one I always remembered -with that one.

-Yeah.

-With Larry.

-Well, my stint was brief in the Bluegrass world, but I--the Alliance did it.

And I don't know who, I think, there was a fellow's name who play guitar after Tony, I can't--Glen Lawson.

That's who the first person I heard sing Tennessee Blues, and we recorded it here in Nashville.

And I remember Lonnie tenor singing.

God, I love that song.

-That's such a beautiful song.

-[Joe] It's a beautiful song.

-Yeah.

-Yeah, it's-- -it's absolutely, just hadn't thought of it forever.

-[Joe] Some years ago, I went and put together a mix tape of all the miserable songs that mean a lot to me.

And I thought, there maybe about 20 of them.

There weren't a whole lot more of them, but.

-Oh, man, if it ain't sad, I don't want to hear it, you know.

I don't want to hear if it ain't sad.

-No.

-[Joe] None of that happy stuff.

-How did you-- what made you say that song?

You had no idea?

-Just came out of the ether.

-Yeah.

-[Joe] I figured you-- yeah, probably knew it.

-That's funny.

-It's just kind of-- it's kind of like Blue Moon of Kentucky.

You just, you've always known it, -you just don't remember it.

-Yeah.

-[Joe] Well, there's a bunch of those things that aren't that Rock Salt nails.

-I love Rock Salt.

-[Joe] That's another-- incredibly beautiful song that is pretty obscure for no good reason.

-Yeah.

I just-- I absolutely--that was a double up 44, love that.

Love that song.

Do you sing them?

-Hmm-mm.

-Oh.

-Sorry, no.

-It's all right.

-[Joe] You know, you can go on.

Chiseled In Stone.

- I mean, there's a-- -Oh, that's a good one.

Chiseled In Stone is about as good as good as it gets.

♪ You don't know about lonely till it's chiseled in stone ♪ -[Joe] Do you know this song?

-You ever heard it?

-Absolutely, I've heard it, but.

-[Joe] I'll put in another dollar and-- -I'd--I'll follow Vince.

-Can I tell you a great story about Chiseled In Stone?

I'm right-- I'm--I get the chance to write with Max D. Barnes who wrote that song.

And it's the saddest song I've ever heard.

And I think it's the saddest song except for Old Shep.

You ever heard Old Shep?

Yeah.

And my dad used to sing that to me as a little boy and make me cry every time he'd do it.

And so I went out-- I was going to write some songs with Max.

And so I had this song idea, and it was actually Look At Us.

But the way I had it going was, 'Look at us, We're not going to make it after all these years together.'

I had it as a sad song because I knew I was going to write with Max.

I go, "He wrote Chiseled In Stone.

He's going to love this.

It's really sad, you know."

And so we went out and visited each other a while, and he said, "Well, kid, you got any ideas?"

I said, "I got this one idea I think you might like."

And started playing Look At Us, but flipped as the couple's not going to make it.

And I finished a verse or two and said, "What do you think?"

And he goes, "Son, that's too sad."

[laughter] I said, "Excuse me.

So what do you mean it's too sad?"

I said, "You wrote Chiseled in Stone."

I said, "That's the second saddest song of all times."

And he bowed up, he goes, "What's sadder Chiseled In Stone?"

I said, "Old Shep."

And he said, "Is that a song where the guy shoots his own dog at the end?"

I go, "Yeah."

And he goes, "Okay, you might have me there."

And he said, "You got a good idea, son, but that couple has to stay together."

And he couldn't have been more, right?

-[Joe] It worked.

-Yeah.

Couldn't have been more-- -[Joe] Not only did they stayed together, they earned some money.

-Did all right for 'em.

-Yeah.

-He paid the electric bill on that week.

-[Joe] The thing about Chiseled In Stone, though, is it basically is a positive message buried in one of the saddest songs in the world, and, you know, there is a-- did I ever tell you my story about Chiseled In Stone?

So there's an artist from Texas whose-- -Initials are?

[laughter] -[Joe] JB?

I don't get you there.

-[Joe] But anyway-- -That's gonna be an inside-- -[Joe] When he lived here for a while, he came to--over one night.

I forgot-- he reminded me of this about a year ago, he and the wife, you know, his wife, came over and he said, "You know, thank you.

You're the reason we're still together."

I was like, "What?"

I've never even been an advocate of marriage, you know.

I've ruined two of myself.

-I tried it a couple times.

-[Joe] He came-- he called me up one-- back then, there was a real phone, and he called me up one night.

This was probably in the 90s, because this was The Old Shop.

It was probably the early 90s, and he said, "I'm leaving my wife, you know, and I got to come talk to you, I got some places-- I need a place to stay."

Because he'd stayed with us at one point when he first moved to town, before he moved here.

So he came over to the shop, and he started telling me that, "I've had it with-- this is the last time."

And I said, "What'd she do?"

And he gave me something like, "She just doesn't-- She just isn't fair to me or something."

And I said, "Oh, well, let me play you something.

You know, you are.

Think about it."

And I played him Chiseled In Stone.

And we both were pretty much crying by the end of it.

And he just liked the thing, the song, he went home.

I said, "Listen, Junior."

I said, "You need to go home and think about this, and think about life this way, or life that way."

And so anyway, I forgot about this totally.

And then they came, they came in into the shop about a year ago, I was like.

And a hard headed guy.

And if you think that anything, if there were ever anybody where something wouldn't sink in and stick, it would have been-- it had been him, but it sank in and stuck, apparently.

-But that's the power of a song.

-Oh my God.

Yeah.

-Well, you gotta do it now.

You gotta do-- -if you feel like it -What, Chiseled In Stone?

-Yeah.

-I don't know the words.

-I don't know the words either.

-I don't know.

-I'll go like you, like, you know.

-I'm the harmony singer, I don't know the verses.

-Joe, you want to sing?

-Oh, that'd be great.

Come on.

-Come on.

Come over here, man.

-I come over here and hold the phone for you, so you guys have it.

-That'll work, that'll work.

Let's--that's-- -All right, here you go.

-Let me talk to the folks and tell them who you are, and where we're at and things like that.

So we'll have it in context.

-All right.

-Bless your heart.

Thank you.

[chuckles] Anyways, we got Mr. Joe.

the legendary Mr. Joe Glaser here, and we are shooting this episode from Glaser.

How you want it say it, Glaser Instruments, or?

-Yeah, Glaser's or just, you know, the shop.

The machine shop inside of the shop.

-The machine shop inside of the shop.

-Not completely run over by stuff.

-That's the machine shop.

-Well, we want to shoot here because it's a real place, and it's, you know, that's what the show wants.

And you were super nice guy and really had mercy on a poor soul.

-So thank you, Joe.

-I like a losing proposition.

-Thank you.

-Not that your show is, but the idea of finding a place where-- -But me and him are.

[laughter] -I find a place where we can pull this off perfectly.

-You know, what the difference between a musician and a mutual fund is?

The mutual fund will eventually mature and earn money.

[laughter] But Joe and I have been friends for 41 years.

When I moved here in '83, I knew I had to find somebody that could take care of my stuff, and he's been the guy, all these years.

Good pal.

-My version of that is just that he took about 60 percent of that time for him to come to trust me.

-I get that.

You look a little-- you look a little shady, you know.

-You know, you earn it day by day.

And like anything, people think, people pitch it, you know, they pitch a story.

Everybody--every walk of life, the songwriters, everybody, pitches this big story.

It's like your car guy, it takes a while to figure out, you know, somebody on your side or not.

-Absolutely, yeah.

-But it's been-- it's been one of the great relationships.

-Yeah, we've been through a little bit of everything.

-Well, it's--if you can find a real friend, keep them.

-Yup.

-You know, and that's cool that you guys have done that, and it's cool that you picked up the phone from me.

God bless you, Sir.

-Well, you know, leave no stone- -You've got all the way to the V's before you found somebody -to come to your show.

-God, I don't believe it.

[laughter] -Well-- -I'm sorry.

-No, you know, you leave no stone unturned.

You know, you really don't know when, what, who people are, and what opportunities are, and what, you know, what were--an idea or a thought or a good day comes from.

-You just don't know.

-Thank you so much, man.

-What a treat, brother.

-It's--this has just been cool.

-Thanks.

-Like really cool.

Absolutely.

Do Salt Creek and we'll go home.

[guitars strumming] [chuckles] -I believe that [inaudible].

-Oh, man.

Obviously, me neither.

-That sounded good.

-Oh, thanks, pal.

I'm gonna go home, do a little practicing -and come back, all right?

-Me too.

That was, that was so awesome.

♪ ♪ ♪ -[Male VO] Thank you for being a part of our show.

We look forward to seeing you on the next episode of The Life Of A Musician.

♪ A place I could lose these Tennessee blues ♪ -[Vince] We're all brothers, we're all sisters.

- They look at it the right way.

-[Brandon] Amen.

-[Announcer] This program is brought to you in part by Santa Cruz Guitar Company and Santa Cruz Parabolic Tension Strings.

-[Host VO] Also brought to you by Paige Capos and by Peluso Microphone Lab.

Additional support provided by these sponsors.