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With the deadline drawing closer, a group working on an amendment to change the redistricting process again gets a strong boost.

And the third in my series of conversations with the candidates in the Republican U.S. Senate primary this week, Secretary of State Frank LaRose.

That is this week in the state of Ohio.

Welcome to the state of Ohio.

I'm Karen Kasler.

Volunteers have been working for months gathering signatures for a constitutional amendment that would overhaul how Ohio handles redistricting.

For the second time in a decade.

Citizens, not politicians, is proposing a 15 member commission to take over the political map making process and a state House correspondent Sarah Donaldson reports.

They recruited a film and bodybuilding icon and longtime advocate to make their case.

There's no mistake they intentionally tried to screw you, the citizens.

As the Arnold Sports Festival wound down in Columbus, its namesake headlined a Terminate Gerrymandering campaign event for a standing room only crowd at the downtown Hilton.

It featured no shortage of jokes.

I was asked to come here that day since I'm already in the building.

Or a sci fi film.

Callbacks, maps.

We do say hasta la vista to those gerrymanders.

It also wasn't former California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger's first time rallying behind the issue of redistricting reform before in Ohio.

He was at the state House in March 2018 when legislative leaders passed an amendment on congressional redistricting to put before voters.

They celebrated with shots of schnapps.

About one third of states have independent redistricting commissions, including Schwarzenegger's home state.

He says he became intimately familiar with gerrymandering while serving as governor.

But he says it's going to take a fight to get the other two thirds of the states to change course.

Because it's a very, very difficult subject.

It's not a sexy subject.

It's not easy to explain.

It's so easy to talk about because most people don't even know there is such a thing.

Like I said, I didn't know.

In conversations, Schwarzenegger said lawmakers on both sides would blame how their districts were drawn for why they wouldn't back policy proposals, even popular ones.

They wanted to stay in power because it feels good being in charge of a district or being in charge of a state of being judge of a country.

Of course, it's addictive, but we got to go and fight that.

Other panelists at the Sun event included American Ninja Warrior moderator Matt Iseman, Ohio State University political science professor, and Marie Hancock, Janice Brock with the Ohio Organizing Collaborative, and Jen Miller with the League of Women Voters of Ohio.

The proposed constitutional amendment would throw out the current process in which elected officials on the Ohio Redistricting Commission draw the districts for congressional and Ohio General Assembly races.

Right now, that commission has seven members, including the governor, secretary of state auditor and four legislative appointees.

The state would then establish an independent commission of 15 members, five Republicans, five Democrats and five independents.

Frank Straw Gary served as legal counsel for the Ohio Senate GOP until last year and was involved in the battles over the redistricting process that took up much of 2022.

That year, five legislative maps drawn by the Ohio Redistricting Commission and two congressional maps okayed by the commission were ruled unconstitutionally gerrymandered by the Ohio Supreme Court.

Straw Gary works as a government affairs lawyer and lobbyist.

Now he says he's against handing the process over to independent commissions, period, because he feels it silences voters by removing their elected officials from the redistricting equation.

I don't think any system is perfect.

Our current system is not perfect.

But he says this proposal might preclude anyone with a redistricting background from participating.

Sugary says he remembers that moment in 2018 when Schwarzenegger did shots with lawmakers.

And he said the same thing when he came in town here six years ago.

When we terminated gerrymandering.

Back then.

The group behind the amendment, citizens, not politicians, is headed by Republican former Ohio's Supreme Court Chief Justice Maureen O'Connor, who was a key vote in those rulings against the maps in 2022.

The amendment seems likely to make the fall ballot, and Miller says she's confident they'll win.

It's a signature gathering is going very, very well.

Our accuracy rates are high.

As I said, we have thousands of volunteers in every congressional district, every Senate district, every Ohio House district out there collecting signatures.

Citizens, not politicians, needs more than 413,000 valid signatures by July to make it on the November ballot.

But they'll gather significantly more than that to ensure they reach the number they need.

Sarah Donaldson, Statehouse News Bureau.

93% of people in Ohio, six state psychiatric hospitals were there because they committed crimes and need to be restored to mental competency so they can stand trial.

Governor Mike DeWine says that's not a new problem, but it is a serious one because those beds are not available for people who need them and are not in the criminal justice system.

They're for months and months and months and months and we have to take them.

So it's not that we don't want to help them, but what that means is that these beds are all occupied.

So if you or someone who has not committed a crime, you don't have really resources.

You don't have the insurance.

You don't have what you need to actually be able to pay for this.

But you've got significant mental health challenges.

There's no room there.

There's no room in the hospital for you.

That's an outrage.

And we have to do something about it.

DeWine said he will soon announce a working group of judges, mental health experts and law enforcement all looking at how to help people with severe mental health issues who end up in jails.

He expects the group will conclude that those psychiatric facilities are not the most appropriate place for many of those in them and come up with some recommendations to do something about that.

The state spends nearly $42 million on care for the nearly one third of inmates with mental illness in Ohio, and it's a big strain on counties as well.

DeWine made the announcement at a meeting of the Ohio members of the Stepping Up initiative, a national effort to reduce the number of mentally ill people in jails.

This week, we conclude a series of conversations with the three men who are running in the Republican primary for the US Senate, with the winner moving on to run against incumbent Democrat Sherrod Brown, who's been in that office since 2006.

All three candidates support cutting taxes, streamlining regulations and blame President Biden for increased inflation.

They all strongly support Israel in its war against Hamas, though they may disagree on funding for that.

And they all say they're concerned about cancel culture and what they see as liberal indoctrination in schools and universities.

So with the limited time available, I'm asking the candidates about the issues where they disagree with their opponents, as well as specific questions about their campaigns.

This week, Frank LaRose.

He's the secretary of State and was a state senator from 2011 to 2019.

Before that, he was a US Special Forces Green Beret with the Army's 101st Airborne and was awarded the Bronze Star for his service in Iraq.

He's the grandson of the founder of the House of La Rose, a beer and wine distributor in Akron.

You have won two statewide elections as secretary of state, so you have some name recognition.

Your opponents have a lot more money than you do.

Why do you think you have a good shot in this race, especially without the endorsement of former President Trump?

Well, two things.

First of all, I'm the one that has the best shot of beating Sherrod Brown.

Senator Brown and the Democrats decided long ago, I'm the most dangerous weapon against him.

They've been attacking me pretty consistently for almost a year.

But it's not good enough to beat him, although I'm proven to be the one that can beat him.

We've got to replace him with someone who's a proven tested conservative, not just somebody that says it.

And of course, any candidate in a Republican primary is going to say they're a conservative.

I think that it's pretty clear that neither of my opponents really are.

If you look at their very recent records on issues, they have taken some very liberal views.

I'm the one that's proven it.

If we're going to save this country and I believe that's what's at stake here, we need to replace Senator Brown with somebody that we know is going to run into battle and fight for our values.

And Ohio voters know that.

That's who I am and that's what I'll do.

Let's talk about some of those issues.

For instance, immigration is a key issue in your campaign, as it is for former President Trump and a lot of Republicans.

You say you want three military divisions deployed to the border, about 60,000 troops, a temporary deployment till the wall is completed.

You want to define drug cartels as foreign terrorist organizations and use any force necessary to stop them from killing Americans.

Deporting anybody who came here illegally.

Notices sonship, no birthright citizenship, no access to asylum for people who do come to this country illegally.

Your opponents have pointed out that you were aligned at one point with No Labels, a nonpartisan group that's been talking about launching a third party presidential ticket.

But also has advocated for a path to citizenship.

Where are you on that?

This is very clear.

My label is well known.

That label is Republican.

In fact, it's conservative Republican.

It's laughable some of the sort of attacks that your opponents try to launch when they're desperate.

That conference that I spoke at in 2016, Donald Trump spoke for 45 minutes after me.

And so I'll talk to two groups on all parts of the political spectrum that want to hear how we do things in Ohio, that in that case, I was there to talk about election integrity, where Ohio has really been an example for the rest of the country to follow.

So my stance on border security is very clear and this comes from experience.

This is not a photo op or a field trip for me.

This is a lived experience from serving on the border as part of a counter-narcotics task force.

I was down there as a volunteer, as a soldier with the 101st Airborne Division 24 years ago.

The reason I've said three military divisions, it's about 60,000 troops.

We and I'm still a reservist.

We are called the Department of Defense for a reason.

And the the invasion that's occurring on our southern border, the only entity truly equipped to deal with that in the short term is the US Defense Department.

Three divisions can get that job done until the wall is built.

But on amnesty, this was really this was really interesting to me.

Bernie Marino, in his own words, wrote a column just a few years ago calling for amnesty.

And now he wants you to believe that he's somebody different.

I don't think he is.

Just just a couple of years ago, he said there should be a path to citizenship for those that are here illegally.

I've been clear, no path to citizenship for people that come to our country illegally and deport those that are here illegally.

Because if you don't have a sovereign, a secure border, you don't have a sovereign nation.

If the border situation, the invasion, as many people have called it, is an emergency and a crisis, Should Republicans in Congress be opposing a bipartisan bill that was supported by the Border Patrol?

I mean, is it an emergency that needs to be fixed right away or is it not an emergency and can wait till after the November election?

And what comes after that?

It is an emergency and it must be fixed right away and it must be fixed correctly.

That's why opposing that bill was so important.

Let me be clear about this.

It seems like when the Democrats name a bill, it does the opposite.

The Inflation Reduction Act wasn't really intended to fight inflation.

The Inflation Reduction Act actually funded billions of dollars for wind and solar subsidies, a bunch of other things that actually makes inflation worse, just like the so called border security bill was really meant to be a public relations piece by the Democrats so that Sherrod Brown can go around saying, I voted for the border security bill.

It doesn't actually do border security.

It funds sanctuary cities and actually encourages their bad behavior.

It allows 5000 illegal migrants a day.

That's like saying we're not going to enforce the law on carjackings until there have been 5000 a day.

No, the acceptable number is zero.

And so it was a it was the right thing for Republicans in the Senate and in Congress to oppose that.

Now, we can have a serious conversation about actually doing border security, not just a bunch of funding for foreign wars and a bunch of things that don't actually fix the border.

You say you want to remove everybody who's here illegally, which the Trump campaign has also backed, saying if he's elected, the U.S. would launch what it calls the largest domestic deportation operation in American history.

But you've also said that it would not be realistic to take 20 million workers out of the US economy.

Plus, is it even realistic to go after all of the illegal undocumented immigrants who are here now, given the time that takes the space and deportation camps?

I mean, is it realistic?

Let's provide the context.

This was a conversation in a Senate forum where Mr. Marino is doing what he often does and promising things.

He can't deliver or knows he can't deliver whatever it takes to make the sale tell people what they want to hear.

I was being very rational and truthful about this.

Everybody who's here illegally, of course, should be deported because a law that's not enforced is not a law.

It's a suggestion.

But to say you can do that in a matter of weeks or even months is unrealistic.

20 million people as the entire population of Ohio, Indiana and part of Illinois.

It's a huge task.

And so what I've laid out and I wrote an op ed about this is a phased approach to that, where we start, of course, with the Biden surge, those that have come here that are not assimilated and integrated into our society in the last few years.

Those should be the first to go focus on those that are dangerous, those that have committed crimes like this horrific crime in Georgia, for example, those that have shown that they're breaking our laws and then move through the process until you're able to deport everyone, it happens in a phased process.

It's not something that can be done overnight, but it does need to happen.

On Ukraine, you've said that Bernie Moreno wants to wave the white flag of surrender and have nothing to do with Ukraine.

You've also said Matt Dolan just wants to, quote, continue pouring more money into a losing endeavor without changing strategy.

You helped oversee an election in Ukraine in 2019.

Where are you specifically on the issue of helping Ukraine battle the Russian invasion?

Yeah, And so and that's that interesting spectrum where over here is Bernie, who's kind of the isolationist, who just says, let it burn.

That's foolish.

Over here is Dolan that says keep throwing money at the problem the way the Biden administration has.

Equally foolish.

What we need to do is bring this to a prompt close.

I believe that that also involves having somebody in the White House with the courage to lead with strength.

When America leads with strength, the world is a safer place and our country is a more secure place.

This president has led with weakness.

And so what that means is creating the situation on the ground to make sure that this can come to a quick end.

That means training the Ukrainians, for example, as Green Berets.

What we do is train foreign militaries.

We've got battalions in places like Fort Bragg and Fort Campbell.

They could just as easily be in the safety of a place like Poland, training Ukrainians to get this fight, one so that they can fight their own bad guys.

And we don't have to do it for them.

How about making the sanctions work?

There are loopholes in this sanction regime that you could drive a wagon through, and the Biden administration is doing very little about it.

Here's the other thing that's really questionable to me.

There have been efforts to put an inspector general in charge of looking at the money and where it's going to make sure it's not being siphoned off.

This is a part of the world that has well known corruption problems, oligarchs and groups of people that are not on the up and up.

And why has the Biden admin why has the Biden administration fought those efforts to actually have an inspector general inspect those dollars and make sure they're going to the right place?

I've been very clear about this.

Russia is the bad guy.

Ukrainian Ukrainians are the good guys.

But we also need to focus on our own security.

And this is where I've said I would be willing to say not another penny to Ukraine until we secure our border, because my oath of office as a U.S. senator obligates me to protect Americans and 200 a day are dying from fentanyl.

And there are not only drugs, but crime coming across that border.

So we need to get our priorities straight.

And yes, of course, there are things the world's most exceptional nation can do to make sure that that conflict comes to a prompt close in Ukraine.

Are you at all concerned about the relationship between Trump and Putin?

No.

Listen, heads of state have to build their own relationships.

That's a interpersonal kind of a dynamic.

I can tell you that as a country, we have been very clear that the Russians are not operating in America's best interest.

Far from it.

They are a source of instability in the world to pair them together with Iran and China and North Korea, for that matter, when it comes to people that are creating instability in the world.

I've been very clear about that.

You and Bernie Marino were both endorsed by Ohio Right to Life, and it seems possible if Republicans win the House, the Senate and the White House, that a national abortion ban or abortion restrictions will be introduced.

You want to get specific about what kind of restrictions that you would like to support.

How would you vote on a 15 week ban given that it would go against what Ohio voters said in November that they wanted in terms of abortion access, and also given that a 15 week ban would allow 90% of abortions to still happen.

Well, I'm pro-life, and I believe that life is precious and deserves to be protected.

And so that's how I would legislate as a member of the Senate.

But this negotiation about how many weeks in which exceptions, that doesn't happen in the context of a Senate campaign or in an interview, it happens among members of the Senate and members of the House.

I want to see us as a nation do things that affirm life.

That also means that it's not good enough to be pro birth.

We have to truly be pro-life.

That means supporting pregnancy centers.

That means making sure that wraparound supportive services are available to mothers who are making that choice to bring a child into the world.

And this is also, in some ways an economic issue.

One of the major factors that people cite for feeling like they can't bring a child into the world is the desperate situation that this Biden and Brown economy has created.

So we need to have options that affirm families, that create economic stability so that people can have a child.

What I do things to help promote a culture of life in the U.S. Senate.

Absolutely.

I don't know what that context would be, but I want to see us do the most that we can to protect life.

I can tell you this.

Sherrod Brown has the extreme position of supporting late term abortion.

I recognize those are rare, but that's something most European countries don't even support.

That's the extreme position.

Supporting life is not.

Now, your office wrote the ballot summary language for the November Abortion Access and Reproductive Rights Amendment.

And you did.

When that ballot language was written, there was no notation that it did protect fertility guarantee to right to fertility treatments.

You campaigned against as you want in November as well.

Don't those two things mean that you were on record as against being IVF when it comes to the right to fertility treatment in the Constitution?

100%, no.

And let me be clear about this.

I am pro-life and I'm pro IVF because I'm pro-family and I want to make sure that people have the ability to start a family and to bring a child into the world.

We need to encourage that.

You don't have a strong country or a strong state unless you have strong families.

Of course, any medical procedure can be done ethically or unethically.

We need to make sure IVF is done ethically, but we need to be very supportive of that and other fertility services to make sure that people have those options to start a family, just like my wife and I have been able to do.

We want to help all Ohioans that choose that to be able to take advantage of that.

You were not able to get the coveted Trump endorsement.

You had reservations about Trump a few years ago as expressed in tweets, including one with the hashtag NeverTrump that you have now deleted.

So I have to ask you, do you have any doubts about a supporting candidate who's been indicted on 91 felony counts, who said he'd encourage Russia to do whatever the hell they want with NATO's allies who don't meet spending guidelines, who added more than 8 million $1,000,000,000 to the national debt when he was in office, and who has repeatedly lied about the 2020 election being stolen from them?

Karen, I'm I'm my own man and I have my own views.

And that means I agree with President Trump the vast majority of the time.

That's why I was proud to support him.

I don't agree with him on everything.

I was proud to support him in 2016.

I was proud to support him in 2020.

And I have endorsed him in this race not because he's perfect.

No public servant is, but because I think he's the man to save this country and put it back on track.

And I will be an excellent ally of his in the US Senate.

I'll work with him, not for him.

I'll work with him.

And that's exactly what I'll do in the US Senate.

You not only don't have a Trump endorsement, but also Donald Trump Jr has been actively campaigning against you and also against Matt Dolan as well.

JD Vance as well.

How does that hurt your campaign?

Where is your path to victory here?

Well, my path to victory is very clear.

Ohio conservatives want a genuine conservative.

They want one of them, not just somebody that got certain endorsements.

People know what an endorsement is.

It's one politician supporting another.

There are a variety of reasons why people do that.

Voters don't go into the voting booth and make their decision based on an endorsement.

They go to a voting booth making a mind and heart decision.

Right.

Who do they like?

Who do they believe shares their values and who do they know is actually going to go into battle and fight for the things they believe in?

That's why I've continuously led in the polls.

So you ask where my path to victory is, is because Ohioans want a genuine conservative who can beat Sherrod Brown, not somebody who is a former Democrat.

Like both of my opponents are pretty remarkable.

In a three way Republican primary.

I'm the only one that's never been a registered Democrat, but also somebody who's had consistent conservative views, not somebody who has sort of flip flopped or changed those views just in recent years, like both Bernie and Matt have done.

Will you support Trump even if he is convicted?

yeah.

No, because, listen, this is up to the people of the United States to choose their president.

I believe that we have a problem with a two tiered system of justice that they're coming after Trump because they fear him.

Look at this case in the Supreme Court just the other day, a unanimous decision saying, of course, the 14th Amendment should not be misapplied.

So that in some cases, unelected and unaccountable people can keep their political adversary off the ballot.

That's not who we are as a country.

We believe in letting the voters decide.

I believe in November they're going to decide that Donald J. Trump is their next president.

And again, I'll work very well with him when he is.

And finally, you were known for a long time as a proponent of civil discourse and bipartisanship.

You led workshops, spoke at events.

You even mentioned that earlier in the interview here, including with the Michigan secretary of state, a Democrat, and an interstate that stayed up north.

It seems that you've abandoned that in favor of a much more partizan approach, which some might have concerns about since you are the head of elections in Ohio.

Absolutely not true.

I'm the guy I always have been.

I believe in working with people.

I come from a mixed family where my mom's a Democrat, my dad's a Republican, and we love them both.

Listen, I will never compromise on my values, but I know how to work with other people to get things done.

That's what statesmen and women have to do.

That's always been who I am.

That's who I was in the state Senate.

I was known for being able to get things done in a bipartisan way.

Again, that doesn't mean abandoning your principles.

It means working with people to actually solve the difficult problems that face our state and our nation.

Civility is very much a part of who I am and how I approach this work, because I believe in treating people with decency and respect.

And that's going to continue when I'm a member of the U.S. Senate.

By the way, the Senate is a body that was really built for that.

The founders created this upper chamber with 100 members, with six year terms where people could get to know each other.

If you're going to solve the issues related to the border or a $34 trillion national debt or rising great power competition with China, which could define the next century of geopolitical life on this planet.

By definition, it means bringing people together to solve those problems.

I know how to do that, and that's exactly what I'll do.

Cleveland area businessman Bernie Marino was on this show last week and State Senator Matt Dolan was on the week before that.

You can find those interviews and all our shows in our archives.

And that is it for this week for my colleagues at the Statehouse News Bureau of Ohio Public Radio and Television.

Thanks for watching.

Please check out our Web site at State News dot org or find us online by searching the state of Ohio show.

And please join us again next time for the state of Ohio.

Support for the statehouse news bureau comes from medical mutual dedicated to the health and well-being of Ohioans offering health insurance plans as well as dental, vision and wellness programs to help people achieve their goals and remain healthy.

More at med mutual dot com the law offices of Porter right Morris and Arthur LLP.

Porter Right.

Is dedicated to bringing inspired legal outcomes to the Ohio business community.

More at Porter right.

Porter Right.

Inspired every day.

The Ohio Education Association representing 120,000 educators who are united in their mission to create the excellent public schools.

Every child deserves more at OHEA.org.