Support for the Statehouse News Bureau comes from the law offices of Porter, Wright, Morris and Arthur LLP.

Porter Wright is dedicated to bringing inspired legal outcomes to the Ohio business community.

More at Porter Wright.com.

Porter Wright.

inspired every day.

And from the Ohio education Association, representing 120,000 educators who are united in their mission to create the excellent public schools every child deserves.

More at OHEA.org Welcome to the state of Ohio.

I'm Karen Kasler.

This week talking with Republican candidate for governor, Vivek Ramaswamy.

Thank you very much for making the time, I appreciate it.

Thank you.

Karen, good to see you again.

So I want to talk about the things that you've said on the campaign trail.

And we have a lot of things that you've said that we could talk about.

We're not going to get to everything.

But I do want to start with property taxes, because you've talked about that extensively.

You had said at the beginning of the campaign you wanted to eliminate them.

Now you're talking about rolling them back to pre-pandemic levels, the largest property tax rollback in Ohio history.

So that implies that you know how big this is going to be.

You know the dollar value and how you're going to get there.

So I want to see if I can find out from you.

What is the total amount of the rollback plan.

And will the state be reimbursing local governments in schools, or will it be up to local governments and schools to make the cuts and pass the levees?

Well, let me say a few things, Karen, and thanks for the opportunity.

It's great to sit down, and I do think it's really important that candidates actually take voter questions and tell the voters where we're at.

And that's what I'm doing every day in this campaign, since it appears we're not going to get debates.

Well, I hope that changes because I do think that we do need debates.

I think candidates should be shoulder to shoulder on a stage answering to their constituents.

I think it's a basic part of the job interview, and I've accepted the debates.

I challenged my opponent to do the same so we can talk about substantive issues like property taxes.

But today I'll talk to you about it.

So so what we need to do is we need to ensure the property tax burden is cut on Ohioans immediately in 2027.

And the reason that's important is that you have a lot of Ohioans.

I've met many of them who are even feeling pressure to move out of their homes because they can't afford to make those property tax payments.

What's the root cause?

Because the solution comes from understanding the cause.

The root cause was during the pandemic, we had horrific policies across the country, really that inflated the value of people's homes on paper.

So you print a bunch of money that inflates the home price.

The government shows up and says, hey, congratulations, homeowner.

You're wealthy on paper, your home is worth more, but you don't feel wealthy because you owe more in property taxes, sometimes two times or more in property taxes.

So my view is, if this is a post-pandemic problem and it is mostly a post-pandemic disaster, then just roll back the property tax base to where it was at pre-pandemic levels before the end of the pandemic.

That's reasonable, that's achievable.

And I'm at once confidence that that will be the biggest property tax cut that Ohio has ever seen in our history.

And we believe it's going to be the largest property tax cut anywhere in the United States of America.

But I'm also confident that we can do it without hurting local police, fire or schools, which is really important to me.

And how do we know that?

Take our schools, for example.

They were functioning better before the pandemic than they are today.

In fact, the number one thing that hurt our schools wasn't the property taxes, which have actually gone up.

It was the fact that the schools closed.

Public schools were forced to close, including because of the actions of my opponent, Amy Acton.

Ohio became the first state in the country to shut down public schools while private schools remained open.

That's what hurt our public schools in the last half decade.

So my plans pragmatic.

It says this is a post-pandemic problem.

Roll it back to the pre-pandemic levels before where it was before the end of the pandemic.

And at the same time, I know we can do that without hurting local police, fire or schools.

And we have all the math to back that up.

That's exactly what we're going to enact in my first budget in 2027.

Speaking of the math, can you put a dollar figure on this?

Sure.

Well, I'll leave it to I'll leave it to those who can analyze this.

Right.

It's easy.

Go back to where it was before that, last year, before the end of the pandemic.

That's the rollback.

So that math is available on display for everyone to see.

Depends on how you count it.

Right.

Because you have different counties that do it differently.

In aggregate.

That's exactly where it's going to be.

So I want people watching this to go back, look at their property tax bill before the pandemic.

That's where I'd ideally like to see your property taxes go.

And we're going to have that reform package by this time next year.

Ohioans are already going to have that relief if I'm elected.

I do want to say about my opponent's plan, which she is laid out.

The overwhelming majority of Ohioans, including seniors, would not see a dime of property tax relief on her plan.

If you read through the details, it does not apply to nearly every, if not most, Ohio seniors.

They're not going to see a dime of property tax relief on my watch.

Remember what it was pre-pandemic?

That's what you're going to be paying after I pass my bill next year.

To get to that point, are you going to have to roll back property taxes that voters have approved?

And I mean, you can't you can't roll back property taxes that are tied to bonds.

That's unconstitutional.

Are you how can you overrule voter approved levies?

So what I've said is in aggregate, and this is going to be subject to the legislation next year in aggregate on net.

The net effect is the property tax base is going to be rolled back in aggregate to where it was before the end of the pandemic.

And then another thing that I want to get in that legislation is that we're going to cap the growth from there to make sure that we don't repeat the same mistakes we made this time around.

And I think that puts this issue behind us.

I think this is arguably the top issue in the state of Ohio, bar none.

And we've offered both an ambitious plan, but a pragmatic plan that gives people the level of relief they're looking for.

This plan does it?

And I think that that pre-pandemic baseline with a cap on growth, that's the way we're going to get done.

You've also talked about raising academic standards and offering merit pay for teachers.

Will the state be directly funding those programs, those goals of yours?

Well, here's what I believe in when it comes to education.

And I'm glad we're talking about this.

And it's why I wish we could have a debate.

I just wish Amy Acton would show up.

It would show greater respect to the voters if we could just contrast our views respectfully, but in front of the voters in the way that you traditionally do it, it sadly hasn't shown up.

But I'll tell you what I believe we need to do in education.

I think that we need accountability in all directions.

That doesn't just apply to teachers.

For most, it applies to systems, it applies to the bureaucracy.

It also includes not only parental rights, but parental responsibility to education begins in the household.

And I think everyone needs to really look at how we're going to improve outcomes for our kids as it relates to teachers.

Here's my view.

Karen.

I think the average starting salary for teachers in Ohio, around $38,000 a year.

That's not enough.

It's not attractive enough to enter the teaching profession, and we're losing many young people out of the teaching profession going elsewhere.

I want to fix that, but I want to do it in ways that even at a younger stage of your career, you can achieve greater economic mobility as a teacher.

So.

So you think about this concept of what that means for compensation.

I want to give principals of schools greater latitude to apply their judgment, to say that if somebody is really doing an excellent job, even if they're at an earlier phase of their career, they should be able to be paid more.

And I don't see why that's controversial, though some seem to think it is.

What I really care about is the performance of our students and the academic outcomes they're able to achieve, because right now, this is an uncomfortable reality.

In too many failing public schools, graduation has turned into a participation trophy.

Okay, students should be able to read by the end of third grade.

Yet if you look at the biggest eight Ohio public school districts, what we call the big eight end of third grade literacy is now 45%.

That's unacceptable.

If you can't read by the start of fourth grade, you're several times six times more likely to end up in prison, and you're arguably over ten times more likely to end up in poverty.

When you look at the data, we got to fix that.

And so I have a clear plan to do it.

It starts with bringing standards back to public education, supporting our teachers, and most importantly, ensuring that our education system is actually focused on students and student achievement.

That's what I favored.

Those things cost money.

How do schools do that with arguably less money?

Well, I'm not saying it's less money.

So I'm saying that the way we're going to look at it is standards and achievement first, and then what do we require to fund it?

And here's the thing I do favor, okay.

And I think this is a bipartisan point.

This is not a traditional Republican talking point, but you have both Republicans and Democrats in our state legislature that have favored what I'm about to describe.

I favorite to what I favor is statewide component of funding that gradually weans us off of exclusive reliance on local property taxation as the main way to fund our schools.

I don't think that's the way that we would have designed the system from scratch.

I don't want to complain about the past, the reasons why we got to where we are, but part of what I bring is an outsider's mindset.

I'm looking at this from a fresh perspective.

I didn't I've never served in the Ohio bureaucracy.

Unlike my opponent, I wasn't part of many of the broken systems that got us to where we are.

But what I do want to do is to take a fresh perspective, in the same way that a business minded leader would say, what's working, what's not, and how do we fix it?

And I don't think an education system that is almost exclusively or largely funded exclusively by local property tax revenue is the right long run model for our state.

So I'm not saying that's an immediate change, but that is a long run goal that I'm oriented towards.

And if that means taking a fresh look at the statewide component of funding, I'm absolutely open to doing that on a bipartisan basis.

And I challenge my opponent to be clear about where she stands here.

This is why we should be having a debate.

And I just think that I owe it to the voters of this state to sit down and take hard questions in town halls that we're doing several times a week.

Karen.

And the fact that my opponent has not done that once and then earlier this week announce that she will not be participating in debates hosted by either CNN or local news WLWT, and accepted both.

I think raises some serious questions about someone else's capacity to serve, and that's her issue.

But what we're going to do is we're going to give people clear vision, clear answers, and clear leadership that this state deserves, including to bring down property taxes while improving educational outcomes for our students.

The other big issue that's really developed is data centers.

And so I want to ask you about your data center plan.

You've talked about residents getting free residential electricity in that plan.

Specifically, how would your plan pay for that electricity?

And are you talking about just the generation part of the bill, or are you talking about the whole bill overall?

And also there's been auctions already held for next year.

How do you change those rates?

Well, look, I think that what can happen next year happens next year.

What happens in future years happens in future years as it relates to specifics of rates.

But you can actually backfill and address direct payments from data centers in a way that addresses this.

So mechanics want to one side, let me talk to you about my actual data center policy.

This is really important to understand.

Data centers I think, have done a horrific job of earning public trust.

I wouldn't say a bad job.

I would say a horrific job.

If I had to give the industry a grade from a rate from A to F, I'd give them an F minus if that were available.

Okay, a lot of locals are skeptical that these things are doing anything positive for their community.

There's been a bit of a leadership vacuum on this issue.

I'm filling that leadership vacuum.

I'm filling that leadership vacuum on day one when I'm governor.

And what I've said is the first thing I'm doing.

Think about inauguration will have inauguration in the morning.

I'll put my kids to bed at night.

One of the things I will do before I do bedtime for my kids that night is I will sign an executive order that says there are no more new data center project announcements in Ohio unless and until we pass my comprehensive data center legislation.

And what does that legislation include?

Include some common sense measures.

The first is if a data center is built in your community, then you're going to pay lower electric bills.

And in the immediate community, the benefit zone of that community, you will actually not pay for electric bills at all, not paid for by taxpayers, but paid for.

But the you pay for electricity, the electricity, the power component of the electric bill, you won't pay for electricity.

And the reason why is the excess power that these hyperscalers would require anyway, to fund to fund the energy of their data center would have to go directly to a power purchase agreement for that local community.

So the example is if you have 700MW of offtake from a hyperscalers, you're likely to see a gigawatt plan the extra 300MW.

Let's just do the math on that.

100MW would be enough electricity to feed roughly 100,000 homes in most places in Ohio.

In many places, that's a full county.

So we'll talk about the specifics of the benefit zone when we get to the legislation next year.

But back to the data center plan.

In the immediate zone where a data center is built, you're not paying for electricity residentially.

Number two is you're going to pay lower property taxes.

And here's why.

This goes to our earlier discussion of creative ways to pay for that property tax relief.

What I'm saying is that we can't do property tax abatements for these data centers.

It doesn't make any sense, because if you shrink the base, you have to increase the rate for everybody else.

I say let's expand the base to include new developers like data centers, and then send that directly as a rebate to residents in the area so that data center payment, a property tax in this case, goes directly to the pockets of residents in that area.

And I'm not done because there's more to this than just the the money part of this, which is free electricity for residents, lower property taxes for residents.

We also have to protect air and water quality.

If the water goes in, it has to come back at least as clean as when it went in.

We have to prioritize abandoned industrial sites rather than virgin, fertile farmland, which is something that is is not happening in the right way today.

We need process transparency, where a lot of these NDAs, they have not helped or served anyone.

The public deserves transparency, especially in those local communities.

And then I'm also going further to think about other solutions on noise.

Think about vegetative insulation.

Think about the unsightly.

I don't think it's too much to ask to be required to say, if you're going to build one of these, even on an abandoned industrial site, you line it up with trees around it to insulate sound, to make it more visually appealing and visually palatable to the members of that community.

That's the right way to do this.

So if it's not going to be done the right way, and if it's not going to be done on those terms, they're not going to get built, period.

That's the legislation I've committed to.

And again, on this issue, Karen, this is a detailed issue.

This is an important issue that deserves respectful, thoughtful, substantive, open debate.

And again, I just challenge Amy Acton to really show up and have a respectful debate rather than hiding from these issues, because I just think it should raise serious issues for every person in this state.

You think about it, if someone is too afraid to show up for a basic debate that we've always done.

How can they possibly lead the state through complex issues, from property taxes to data centers?

That really matters.

When you talk about the behind the meter generation that these plants would be bringing in, they bring in their own power.

So we're talking about natural gas, small nuclear plants, winter, solar.

How do you feel Ohioans will look at this if there is a data center and a natural gas plant next to that that wasn't there before and could be potentially producing more air pollution, look on the facts that in the framework that I have laid out, if it is not a blessing to the local community and seen as a blessing to the local community and obvious ways that I've laid out, then it's not going to get built.

But what I am confident is we can bring an economic boom to Ohio that spans the sectors.

We spend a lot of time talking about this one sector.

I think we should be talking about other sectors too.

Let's talk about chip production.

Let's talk about rebuilding our defense industrial base.

Let's talk about other sectors of the future life sciences, health care, innovation.

Let's talk about even the kind of economic development that will help our farmers.

I'm the only candidate who's ever talked about this, and it's really important bringing more dairy processors to our state, pursuing opportunities in ethanol.

These are areas where economic development is not intention with backing our farmers.

Backing our farmers means economic development that increases demand for their products.

And so that gives you a sense of how I want to lead the state.

I want to lead this state, Karen, with a one Ohio mentality, okay?

It's not economic development versus AG.

It's not water quality versus farming or versus economic development.

All of these things matter.

And I think we need a sensible common sense executive at the top who's willing to take tough questions from voters, who's willing to have respectful dialog with opponents, even who disagree.

Even my opponent in this race, that's the spirit of leadership I want to bring to Ohio for the next four years.

And I think we can.

And so I am confident we will be able to do economic development on terms that lift up local communities while respecting air and water quality standards, while respecting environmental standards.

I am a conservative, but part of being a conservative means we believe in conserving in conservation and the Teddy Roosevelt tradition of conservatism.

We're beautiful state.

And that's why when my dad is Senator Policy said, we're not going to just prioritize farmland being developed.

We're going to prioritize industrial sites that have been abandoned.

That's common sense.

And that's what I bring as a businessman.

When you talk about putting more energy into the grid than we're taking out of the grid, and this is all just kind of related to your energy policy in general, small nuclear plants.

And we've heard a lot of folks talk about this as a possibility down the road.

Federal law says that that nuclear waste has to stay on site.

Are Ohioans going to be okay with nuclear waste on site in their areas?

And your data centers near their homes is not a dumping ground for anybody.

Let me just start with that.

We have to be clear that our local communities come first, full stop.

That's the way I lead.

Now, I do see a major opportunity for Ohio to participate in the next generation of nuclear reactors that are getting built in the United States, and this is probably the the accomplishment of the current administration, the Trump administration that admire most is the regulatory reforms in energy, particularly including nuclear energy, that has resulted in a new renaissance of all kinds of next generation technology that actually use maybe nuclear waste even as input fuels.

So you're not storing waste at all.

This is where I believe in progress, and this is where coming from the business world, coming from the world of of outside of government, I see the actual progress is let's avoid yesterday's debates by solving the actual problem.

And that's what we're seeing from a lot of these newer models.

Rather than worrying about burying or storing nuclear waste, instead use that as fuel in a different reactor.

That's the direction of the future.

And I want to take Ohio to that future, but we're only going to do it on terms that actually leave local communities and residents better off.

That's why I answer to I don't answer to anybody else, as the governor of the state, than the 12 million Ohioans who elect me to be their leader.

That's my moral duty.

And every decision we make, whether it's an energy policy, property tax policy, education policy, we've already covered a lot.

My number one question will be what improves the lives of the Ohio I lead?

How do I fight for them to have a better life?

That's it.

And we're running out of time.

I want to get to a couple of other questions.

One of them on that whole quality of life thing.

You've got states that are expanding, gambling, you've got Christian groups, some of whom have come.

Their leaders have come out and back to you who have been opposed to expanding gambling.

Ohio, say, ruins lives, especially for young men.

Where are you on expanded gambling?

Since actually gambling interests have been donating to get you elected, so I'd be glad to have a few different topics to cover.

Let's get through them.

I can go more a little more quickly.

What I'll say is I'm going to take a fresh look and a fresh perspective to this whole discussion.

You have legislators that have gone deep into it in the past.

That's fine.

I want to bring a fresh perspective, and what I'm committed to is whatever we do, it is going to be done in a responsible way that protects Ohioans.

And I particularly care about our young Ohioans who are really vulnerable to, I would say, you know, a lot of modern forces, you think about social media, you think about the future of AI, you think about the online gambling issue.

I care a lot about our young Ohioans and make sure making sure that they're not pulled into paths of addiction, etc., that could really, particularly for a young person, make a big difference in their lives.

And so protecting our youth as a top priority for me and whatever we set into motion, I'm going to listen to legislators on both sides of this issue and hear them out.

But it's going to be responsible the way we do it in Ohio real quick.

Do you support the requirement that children have to have vaccines to go to public school?

I'm not making any changes to the status quo there, but what I have opposed, and I continue to think in retrospect was a really bad idea was Covid vaccine mandates, particularly for kids.

And I just think that our decisions have to be science driven and data driven.

And I have to say the decisions made and led and advised by my opponent, Amy Acton, in many cases were not.

You think about shutting down public schools while leaving private schools open.

What's the science behind that?

You think about the science behind shutting down county fairs, outdoor county fairs, while letting BLM riots proceed in the streets of Columbus and Cleveland?

Where's the science?

Some of those were local decisions.

Well, I think the tone was set at the top by Amy Acton.

And I'll tell you what wasn't a local decision the effort to shut down county fairs.

This was the main issue.

She said that it was cause for her to quit her words, not mine.

It was the final straw, is what she said, that the reason she quit is that she was asked to reopen.

What?

Our county fairs.

I've been to tens of them.

Their outdoor events, their important to the to the culture and foundation of our state.

And we know that wasn't a science driven decision because other outdoor protests were allowed to proceed at the same time.

So.

So I'm committed to this, Karen, I'll give you this is I don't think science should be politicized.

I think it should be driven by hard data.

As someone who has overseen the development of now six medicines that have gone on to be FDA approved, one of which is life saving in kids, I understand the importance of science, and that's what I'm going to do when I make every decision.

As governor.

I want to end this with some a question.

On that note, you've been accused of pushing through an all times drug that didn't work and then bailing before it tanked, costing investors millions while you made tens of millions of dollars.

These are serious allegations.

What can you say about that?

I can say shame on Amy acted in her allies for pushing outright defamatory lies.

They know they're false.

And in any other context, these would be actionable against these people.

Let me give you the truth.

I actually developed a company, built a company that oversaw the development of now six FDA approved drugs.

One of them is an approved drug for prostate cancer, helping people in Ohio who have approached me and told me how it's helping save their lives.

Another is a life saving therapy in kids.

There's a mother I met with in Cincinnati whose son benefited from it, who would have otherwise died by the age of two, who are alive today because of the therapy that my company and I took the risk of developing.

And sometimes in science, you have to take risks.

Most drugs fail.

We developed an Alzheimer's drug.

That drug failed.

That's not how I made my money.

I made my money through the successful drugs that we developed.

And the company I built is revenge.

It's a $25 billion company on the Nasdaq today, one of the most successful biotech companies founded in the 21st century.

And the fact that Amy Acton would pretend to know anything about science while rejecting those who actually dare to take risks to get drugs approved to patients and save lives.

I think says a lot about her character, and I would say, shame on her for slandering me and my family instead of celebrating life saving medicines for patients.

And I think that that says a lot about a person who, in my view, unwilling to debate, unwilling to show up, slandering her opponent while doing so from the shadows, she's disqualified for spreading those lies.

But what I do believe is that I'm going to be able to lead this state and help people's lives in the same way that I was able to in my prior career by developing life saving medicines.

I have so much more I could ask you, but we run out of time here, so thank you very much for me.

Thank you.

Next week, our scheduled conversation with Democratic candidate for governor, Amy Acton.

And that is it for this week for my colleagues at the state House News Bureau of Ohio Public Media.

Thanks for watching.

Please check out our website at State News or find us online by searching State of Ohio Show.

Stay in the know by registering for Ohio State House alerts through this QR code, or by texting state news to this number.

And you can also hear more from us on our podcast, The Ohio State House scoop every Monday morning.

And please join us again next time for the State of Ohio.

Support for the Statehouse News Bureau comes from the law offices of Porter, Wright, Morris and Arthur LLP.

Porter Wright is dedicated to bringing inspired legal outcomes to the Ohio business community.

More at Porter Wright.com.

Porter Wright.

inspired every day.

And from the Ohio education Association, representing 120,000 educators who are united in their mission to create the excellent public schools every child deserves.

More at OHEA.org