(upbeat latin music) - Good evening and welcome to Horizonte, a show that takes a look at current issues through a Hispanic lens.

I'm Catherine Anaya.

In this episode, we will take a look at the controversial use of the term Latinx.

It's a word meant to be inclusive of the Latino members of the LGBTQ community, but is not widely accepted or used by the Hispanic community.

Latinx emerged as an alternative to describe the nation's Hispanic population, but the term has generated debate about its appropriateness in a gendered language like Spanish.

We spoke with two Phoenix community members about the word.

One is in favor, and the other is not.

Producer Julio Cisneros reports.

- I didn't grow up saying Latinx.

I think in terms of the work that I do.

Working with Latinx organizations, I use it.

I personally do not identify as Latinx.

I identify as a Latina.

- I think it's important as LGBT community, as person who comes from Latin America, to really understand that in order for us to have a world that represents us and for us to feel included, it's important to have terms that are not gendered.

- To me as an immigrant woman from Guatemala is what makes the most sense.

I think identity is such a complex thing.

And putting a label on it has always been so hard.

- The use of Latinekis is really a proposal of a world where we feel included.

Where we can feel comfortable, and where we know we're gonna be respected.

- People find comfort in the term Latinx because I think it is more inclusive in terms of when we're thinking about masculinity or femininity or non-binary people.

- [Dagoberto] I think academia should be very careful in the way that they're pushing these words and to make sure that there's a plan so that we are able to answer the hard questions.

Cuz at the end of the day, things won't change if we're not able to address the hard questions.

And I think at the center of the word, Latinekis is really a lot of cultural background.

It is a lot of community and I think we have to hold that with love and push something forward.

- You know, I think in like countries in South and Central America, we would say, Oh, he's Peruvian, or I'm Guatemalan.

There hasn't been that like Latin X, and I think that more and more that's becoming more common with the generation as generations, you know, evolve, and that's okay.

You know, if it's the X, or not the X, you know we are still people of color, and it's okay to evolve the language.

- For us as an LGBT community, I think is a good step forward for our people to show respect towards us and to really understand that we're in this together.

- And joining us to talk more about this controversial topic is Rafael Martinez, an Arizona State University Assistant Professor of Southwest Borderlands.

He is for the use of Latinx.

And Gabriela Acuna Pacioni, she holds dual citizenship in the US and Mexico and does not prefer using that term.

So thank you both for joining me- - Thank you so much.

- Really appreciate it.

So I'd like to start with you, professor.

Where did the term Latinx come from, and how does it differ from Latino, Latina and Hispanic?

- Yeah, so the term is very recent.

It's less than a decade old, and it's primarily being used by academic or scholars to identify and be inclusive of gender and sexuality.

But also more in particularly, the today's youth is a generation that's pushing for the term as gender and sexuality inclusive.

And that's something that I think today's youth is much more conscious, socially conscious about, being inclusive of their classmates, about their generation, and how we see the world.

So I think it's a new term, but it's something that we are pushing for thinking about being inclusive in how we see the world.

- Studies show though that a growing momentum against the use of Latinx exists with 40% of Hispanics saying they find it offensive.

So Gabriela, my question to you is, why do you personally not prefer using Latinx, and why do you believe maybe some Hispanics find it offensive?

- To me, the term it's, it's pretty new, actually.

And I wouldn't say I'm opposed at all.

It's not what I grew up with.

It's, I was born in Mexico and came here until I was 30 years old.

So I've lived most of my life in Mexico opposed to being here.

But I'm just a true believer, and I have passion for my culture, for the language, it's roots, where it came from.

And Latina and Latino, as far as I'm concerned, I've never seen anybody get offended by it.

I do believe that we should be inclusive in every way, in every culture, but I personally believe in keeping our roots in our language.

- [Catherine] Well, and that's something professor that seems to be a discussion when we talk about the term Latinx.

You mentioned it's very popular in academic circles and among younger Latinos.

So is there that discussion between, you know, how we're evolving as a society, but also, you know, some of us trying to stay true to our roots?

- Yeah, definitely.

So as a historian and particularly looking at the US southwest borderlands, we have to acknowledge that language, that culture and traditions come from a certain place.

And in this case, when we're talking about the Spanish language, we're also talking about colonial legacies and the way in which colonial places, colonial places used to look at gender in these binary where you only fit being male or female.

But even looking at the Americas before thinking about colonial times, indigenous peoples had multiple genders, right?

They used to identify as different genders, not just male or female.

Sometimes the third gender or sometimes gender non-conforming as well.

And so part of looking at our roots is also looking at our indigenous roots.

And I, being able to associate with how gender is not just thinking about it in colonial terms, and thinking about it being rude as male or female.

And part of the language situation is that we wanna move away from those binaries.

- So if somebody prefers, like Gabriela, prefers to use the term Latina, and she's in a group speaking to a large group, let's say of Latinos, and she says, Latinas, Latinos, Hispanics, is she being offensive by not using Latinx?

I think that's a concern for some people is that they wanna be inclusive, and they don't wanna be offensive, but it's not the term they prefer.

- [Rafael] Yeah.

And so I don't think necessarily it's being offensive or not.

Again, it's such a recent term that we're all learning to adjust and learning to think about this the way we see the world in non-gender binary.

But we also have to be conscious and aware that this is the way the society has operated for many generations.

Meaning that people who don't identify as Latina or Latino, right, have been forced to always being identified as Latina and Latino when they choose not to identify through a gender.

And so by us learning and processing internally, right, is thinking of how we could be inclusive, right?

And not how you choose to identify yourself, but thinking of like the larger population, and understanding that LGBTQ community and queer community is also part of our community, and we wanna be welcoming to those folks as well.

- [Catherine] Gabriela, would you say that that's something that's entered your mind, or at at least, you know, been part of a discussion with say your children at home?

- Yes, actually, like I said, I prefer when anybody asks me what I identify with, I love my country, I say I'm Mexican.

And I asked friends around me too, and if they're Dominican, they say they're Dominican actually instead of saying Latino, Latina, or Hispanic.

They like to be identified as who they are from the country they came from.

Cause we're all so different than, we all bring rich into this country.

So it's very important to keep in mind where we come from.

And like I said, our language.

And to me, inclusivi, inclusivity is not about a battle between women and men or genders.

It should be a battle about trying to find what's good, what's bad, cause we all have good and bad.

And also giving voice to those people that cannot give their own or express their own feelings like the blind or to the deaf.

To me, that is more about being inclusive.

- Well, language is constantly evolving as we know.

And is there really, and this is a question for both of you.

Is there really a right term, especially if we are trying to be inclusive when it comes to language with, for example, with Spanish when you're talking about, you know, masculine and feminine structure?

What are your thoughts on that?

- Yeah, so also very recently, when people from Latin America are beginning to incorporate the term, they're not necessarily using Latinx, but they're using Latine, which is also gender neutral with an E at the end as a way to remove some of that masculinity or femininity from some of the language that we use.

I'm a Spanish speaker myself and so it does take time right?

Because you've been trained to think in this particular way.

But again, part of that is thinking through.

If we've accepted gender norms, what other kinds of norms are included in the language that we speak on a daily basis that hold power?

And so part of thinking of internally with ourselves, about the language that we speak to our children is also how they're gonna grow up to see the world tomorrow in terms of gender, in terms of other important topics as well.

- [Catherine] Would you agree with that, Gabriela?

- [Gabriela] Yes, I agree.

I have no problem with someone telling me they identify as Latinx.

Just express it and I'll be fine with that.

I just don't see why generalize it or push it into a language.

I don't see the point of doing that.

I think most people are happy or comfortable with the term Latino, Latina right now.

And if for some sake someone wants to be identified as Latinx, I'm also good with that.

- Well that's why these conversations are so important.

Especially as language evolve, So do these conversations.

And like you were saying earlier, it all comes down to just learning and being educated right?

- [Rafael] Certainly.

- Yes.

Well, thank you both for being here so much.

I appreciate it.

And again, the discussion I'm sure will continue.

I appreciate it.

- Thank you so much.

All right, that's gonna do it for this show for now for Horizonte and Arizona PBS.

I'm Catherine Anaya.

Thanks for joining me.

Have a good evening.

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