From WXXI news.

This is connections.

I'm Evan Dawson.

This hour was made on August 13th, 2021, when a rock historian named Jonathan Graziano posted a TikTok with his then 13 year old pug named Noodle.

It was a lighthearted check in with Noodle, was Noodle alert and able to stand up and maybe attack the day.

Or was Noodle drowsy, falling back over into the pillow, wanting more sleep?

By the fall of 2021.

Noodle had gone super viral.

Jonathan would post daily updates on TikTok and it became a kind of forecast.

Either Noodle can stand up and have a bounce day, or Noodle would slump over and have a no bones day and a bones day were encouraged to be ambitious, productive, ready to cross off a ton on our to do list and a no bones day.

Well, despite some early misunderstanding, it doesn't mean it's a bad day means it's a low key day filled with elastic waistbands and maybe an extra cup of coffee.

It is hard to overstate just how viral this went.

Individual TikTok videos featuring Noodle racked up millions of views.

The hashtag No Bones also went viral, with tens of thousands of social media posters writing that they shouldn't have attempted something ambitious on a no bones day, of course.

Celebrities were referring to the bones or no bones forecast.

Noodle was everywhere now.

Sadly, Noodle passed away in 2022 at the age of 14, but Noodle Story was featured in a book called Noodle and the No Bones Day, a great children's book.

Jonathan didn't think perhaps he was ready for another pug right away.

But now, in 2026, we get a new book about a new companion, a pug named Milton.

Jonathan Graziano was living in New York City, but now he's back living in Rochester.

He is a 2009 Brighton High School graduate.

He's on kind of a Rochester book tour right now.

The new book is called Milton Makes a Move.

It's all about embracing hard things, even scary things.

And Milton's real life story fits that theme.

We are so glad to have both of them in studio.

Jonathan Graziano, welcome to you.

Thank you so much for having me.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

And Milton is with us.

Milton is.

I was asking before the program.

How old is Milton?

Milton is ten years young.

Milton's ten years young.

Yeah.

And if you're watching on YouTube, you will.

Throughout this hour, we're going to let Milton kind of just go where Milton wants to go.

In the studio.

It is Milton Studio now.

So you will see Milton on occasion.

Where is Milton now?

Here.

Milton is actually hanging out between the both of us.

He's close to me, but he's keeping an eye on you.

Yeah.

He's sweet, he's sweet, but.

But if you lose track of him, he's a bit of a. He can be a sentinel for sure.

So we're going to talk about your books coming up here because, there are some really lovely stories about the way these books have already affected kids and the way kids see the world.

And I know you've been touched by that.

I want to go back a little bit here and help the audience understand.

I mean, there are people listening or like, oh my God, he's got the bones and no bones guy.

But that's all.

It also feels like it's five year old history and that kind of time moves quickly, right?

It's what you said 2021.

You said August 13th, 2021.

And I was like, oh, that that's that's five years in a couple days.

That's five years in the wild.

That feels really wild.

But yeah, so I had the I had Noodle, my sweet little geriatric king Noodle, who was my little pug, who I actually adopted when he was eight years old.

I adopted him in 2016.

I had worked, I was working at a company called Barkbox at the time, which other people might be very familiar with.

And, you could bring your dog to work with you.

So I lived in New York City, and I loved living there, but I didn't really want to have a dog that I would just leave in my apartment all day.

So I got one that I could bring to the office with me.

And it just worked out that this woman was there who had a dog up for adoption.

His name was Noodle.

I just I didn't meet him.

I just saw this photo of this.

It was adorable.

But in like a in like a, like, you gotta fix that kind of way where he was like 30 pounds.

So he was it was.

Yeah.

It was, it was, it was again adorable.

But it had to change very quickly.

A very fleeting kind of beauty.

But I, I adopted him sight unseen and, he just lived the most incredible life.

But he always he never compromised his comfort.

And when there were days where he didn't want to get out of bed, I would just kind of prop him up, and he would.

He would just flop back down, and I'm sure it was it was interesting when this went viral because so many other people, it was unique to Noodle because he's adorable and hilarious.

And you know how everyone has the best dog in the entire world?

Yeah.

Knew it was the best dog in the entire world.

Holy moly.

But other people's dogs did that.

So I remember thinking like, oh, you know, this would be fun to share because we're in, you know, we're in the height of lockdown, and I haven't talked to anyone in five months.

And it's, you know, this apartment is so far as me, Noodle and the woman in the wallpaper.

And she started to save me and things.

So I wanted to start sharing these Noodle videos, and I thought the I thought this would resonate with some people, and it ended up just really just taking off because of him.

So the kind of the weird thing of modern life and, and I guess this will be a feature of life forever going forward.

That was not a feature of life when I was growing up.

Was that at any on any day, any one of us could go viral and we'd go viral for something we are not that we don't like, and we go viral for something that is amazing, that we thought would be just cute and small.

There's no real predicting it.

You can't force virality.

There are marketing firms that are hired by companies and they make us go viral.

That's not how that works.

So you didn't post on August 13th, 2021 thinking, oh yeah, this is going to have tens of millions of views.

We're going to have celebrities talking about a bouncer.

No bounce day.

There's no way.

No, I hadn't showered.

No.

You would have showered if you thought you were going viral.

I had known that it was going to be reposted on like national media outlets.

I would have at least put deodorant on.

Do you know what I mean?

Like, this was just something I did in the morning.

And I remember thinking how I thought specifically with with TikTok and thinking this is a place where really do smaller communities can really be built.

I did yeah, yeah, sure.

I, I was not expecting what we got.

No way.

And that was in summer.

It was by the fall that Noodle was super viral.

Yeah, but but how long did it.

When did it really take off?

Do you know why it took off?

How it how it took off?

So it's a it's it's, it's so interesting to think about because I also work in social marketing.

Like that's my day job.

And algorithms have changed so much.

And a lot of these platforms are there are husks of what they once were.

But TikTok was a really great space for just that was a place where it was sort of where Instagram was many years ago, where it was like, no, if you're just posting something that's getting engagement, it doesn't matter if it has paid behind it, it's going to get shown to people.

And I think what really boiled down to we did this, we did this interview, a few years ago, and they were asking like this, very this exact same question.

Like people, all people want to do is go viral.

What's the secret sauce?

They're like, there is no secret.

The only thing that I can say that is guaranteed to go viral is like outrage.

Outrage is a very quick thing.

Like, if you want to live live, stream yourself going onto the train and starting a fight with someone like you will get views brands.

This is a free tip.

Don't do it.

But to know that we got into a place where, we were able to share something that was good and positive and it just took off.

Like I think people were hanging on by a thread.

I think they were hanging on by a thread, and they didn't have a good enough reason to take anything even important to themselves seriously.

And I say that from experience.

I was posting the videos, but I was I was on the receiving end of that as well.

I would see what kind of day it was.

I'd post it right away and start relating to the people in the comments.

So I think it it gave people permission to start to care about themselves again after, because again, this was October 2021.

Like, you know what I mean?

It's sign.

It's set a long time ago.

And it was just a positive thing that people really needed.

The point about outrage, it's interesting because you're certainly right, that outrage, I mean, it's the reason that cable news became popular a generation ago because outrage.

So people are yelling at each other.

It's the reason that doing public radio is more challenging because we don't we don't really do that.

Yeah.

Hopefully.

You find something more positive that comes out of that.

But I do want to ask you about if you think that there's a danger in our culture when people know that if, like you said, if you've run onto a train and punched somebody, you can go viral, you can do outrageous, dangerous things and go viral.

You can do violent things, can go viral it.

And yet it's the new rules of the world that are kind of the outliers, that it's such a lovely story.

Yeah, but it's not as easy for a Noodle to go viral.

I mean, if you did this again in a parallel universe, you might not go viral.

Oh, there is no, that's that's what makes I think that's the other thing that kind of makes this so exceptional is that this we and we posted cute videos and Noodles.

Adorable.

And there are a lot of reasons to look.

You can look now in hindsight and be like, oh, this this video had a lot of, elements to it that that lent to its virality.

It was it was a it was serialized content.

It happened around the same time every day.

Something new was going to happen.

There was a lot of conversation in the like.

It was almost like a live streamed moment when it went live for 30 minutes.

Comments were just it would just blow up in the comments and people were talking to each other, right?

Again, they were in lockdown.

People were sharing with each other, which is not something that really happens on social media.

But I think because that's such an outsider, I couldn't I absolutely think it's dangerous.

And I think, I mean, we posted anytime I post events where I'm like, I just let who knows how many people where I'm going to be.

You hate to think that.

Yeah, you hate to think that way.

And for the most, like, I've only had good experiences so far.

But I mean, social media is it's a it's a very and I do it intentionally to be public and I want people to come and I want people to know about our events and people event, especially when it's, you know, a children's book and families can come out together and, you know, kids get read too.

It's really wonderful.

But there is a there is an element of this.

That is the amount, the amount of brides whose wedding days I singlehandedly ruined because what day was on a no bones day?

No way.

The amount of messages I got from bride actually got like an angry message.

Oh oh, my coffee table book is going to sell one day.

It's just going to be full of these messages that go, you know, Brittany loved you and she just needed a bones day.

She loved your dog.

And I was like, he I'm so sorry.

He 13.5 years old.

And Brittany needs to have a stronger foundation in her marriage.

If this dog is going to be know junior.

I mean, it was up, but I know bones day is not a bad day.

That's what I try to explain to them.

I was like, hey, maybe she could put, you know, when she wants to dance, tell her to put her flats on early.

You're the creator of it.

Noodle was a creator.

Explain to the audience what's up, bones?

They want to know.

So bones and I. No bones day again.

The audience created this.

I. If you go back and look at the early videos.

I just said that it was happening.

A no bones day is when Noodle I'd sit him up in his little bad nude flat back down like he didn't have any bone, didn't have any bones made of rubber.

And exactly.

And my favorite one was someone commented one said one time and said, my dog does this too and we call it sack of pudding.

And I thought that was hilarious.

Exactly.

But a no bones day, is a day that it means you can take it easy.

You have, like, permission to self-care.

You can take it easy.

You don't have to.

Do you know, you can put something off if you needed to.

And even during lockdown, I think a lot of people were feeling bad when they were like, having moments of joy.

And it was that kind of thing of like, no, you're allowed to find semblance of normalcy in this and enjoy yourselves.

And on a practical level, it meant that he didn't need to go out on a walk for like two hours.

On a practical level, that was a true litmus test, and I was like, I'm off the hook for a little while.

On a bonus day, it meant that you had to do the thing you were putting off.

It meant you needed to be productive.

You needed to like, you know, it's a carpe diem kind of day.

And it just meant nothing.

Was ready for breakfast, Noodle or.

Excuse me, I met Noodle.

Oh, look at you.

Gosh, that's a beauty, but that's beautiful.

Oh, my beautiful, beautiful little, you know, beautiful dog.

I know I get and they do for as different as they are there.

I can't tell you how many times I do that.

I understand why my like, my mom would do it.

Now I'm like, you're both different, but you're also the same here.

I totally understand.

So, I am, I actually, I'm kind of amazed that, you would get any angry messages about a no bones day, but I it's an interesting world that we live in.

Very much so.

Do you remember the first celebrity who who called out bones or no bones?

I mean, like, this became a thing that was everywhere.

The first.

Oh, oh, was there, like, a moment where you went?

I cannot believe how big this is.

Yeah.

Yes, yes.

This is, this is a really good like this was lock like lock down.

This is why this happened.

It was a video that went viral on TikTok because when Noodle started to take off, it wasn't just his videos that went viral.

And I think this is where you have sort of echelons of content that goes viral.

It's like there's the individual video and then like, is there a culture around it?

So there were people making music about Noodle, there were people making videos, their own videos that were also going viral.

So and we were just posting this stuff like this was just enjoy it.

Like he's just a silly dog.

I got I theme songs for this dog now that people just made for him, and it's incredible.

But I remember it was there was a woman who worked.

It was it was a viral video that went through like it was seen through like, security footage, like nest cameras in her home.

And there was a senior, a woman who is like a senior official at the United States, like Defense Department.

Was on the video.

Is her on a work call?

Like on a work call for the Department of Defense?

The Department of Defense at home.

Everyone was home, right?

Everyone was working from home.

And she's on one of those, like, I don't know, hoverboards, are they?

They're called hoverboards.

Like the two things you just on bipedal, and she just falls to the ground giggling and you don't know why it is.

And she ends up saying that like, she was on a call with the senior officials of the, like, United States Department of Defense, and they started the meeting, was saying, okay, it's a bonus day.

Let's get to it and see to that was like the whole that was the that was a moment where I looked at this dog and we had a running joke for the longest time that he was excommunicated from our country for many, many crimes.

And I looked at them and I was like, it's the running again.

The the joke on social that the government knows who Noodle is is in the hilarious and then on the top level of like, I adopted an eight year old dog and I really don't know his backstory.

And now he's got this viral fame to him.

Like, who knows if they have a dossier on him?

And it was crazy.

It was crazy.

You know, like the most watched video, the most viewed, how many views?

So we do have one video.

This is not from bones or no bones, though.

We have a video that went viral in Super Viral on Facebook.

Many years ago when I worked at Barkbox of Noodle, getting his belly scratched with a back scratcher, and it went very viral in Thailand and it got 46 million views in Thailand.

I mean, Noodle, that's what we're saying.

I don't know what the government knows about him, but it's not.

But some Noodle did have something going on.

But as far as bones or no bones videos, we had one that got 14 million views, 14 million views on showered, and it's horrifying.

I mean, to me, it's such a modern, interesting story and you're such a kind.

You know, you have this obviously kind soul.

We're going to talk about the books coming up here because they're really beautiful.

And thank you.

There's a lot of, I think, a lot of bad kids books, and there's I kids books, and then there's these books and they're so beautiful.

So we will talk about that, because I love the message that you're sending and, and what you're trying to do with this.

But viral flame fame is fleeting.

And so what would you say was the I want to kind of take your temperature and sort of the best and worst of this, because most of us will never understand what you were dealing with, which was something really cute and fun that blew up into something with tens of millions of views.

Angry brides who are coming after you and you know, celebrities calling out your name and Noodle.

So we can't really comprehend this.

What was the best part of it?

The the best, the best part of it was just the immediate community that I got.

I am I am a I'm a very introverted person, but when I like to be social, I like to be social.

And being able to go out and like, walk around town with Noodle and have people like, recognize us and, and come up and say hi to him like he was always he always had this really big personality.

But there was something that I really loved so much about seeing the authenticity of what we were building on.

Social, because you can read nice comments all you want and that's great.

It's so nice.

We had something nice happened, but when people would come up to us and they I'll never forget, there was one time where this woman said she came up to us to say that I needed to tell you, like, my mom's been having a really hard time.

And she's been, you know, she's everyone's stuck in the house, and she's been really she's been, you know, not doing very well.

But she saw the other day that Noodle had a bounce day.

And so she said she wanted to go on a walk.

And it was that kind of thing where I was just like, this is really again, we are in lockdown.

This is an 80 year old woman in New York City.

And because my geriatric pug was ready for breakfast in the morning, we posted this really fun video.

She wanted to do something that she probably hadn't done in in a few days, or maybe a few weeks, and that was all because of this little dog.

So those like and that because that was wholesome, right?

Like I was able to bask in like the numbers and all that and be like, what is this?

I look at Noodle all the time to be like, what did you do?

Like, right, there's the vanity coolness of viral fame.

But like, if you put your phone down, it's gets very quiet very quickly, which I think is something that a lot of people who are always thinking about viral fame think about, like if if I was out with my dog, a lot of times we would get recognized.

But if the moment you put your phone down and you're not looking to Instagram and TikTok like, these are like, I have a full time job and I've always had this full time job throughout this.

Like, you are just a regular person at the mercy of an algorithm.

I did I answer your question or am I just talking?

No.

You absolutely.

I, I, I think you're sharing with me some of the truly lovely real stories.

Oh, right.

And the bad stuff.

Oh, well, we can get to the bad stuff in a minute.

I want to say like, those stories, though, are awesome because they're they're real.

Like, you can't you can't sort of plan for them or create them in the lab.

Kids who kids who have trouble, you know, every kid has trouble communicating their feelings.

But especially kids that I've heard from who have, you know, issues with communication and are taking a while to develop certain comms skills.

Knowing that I another example I have is this there is a little a little girl in a classroom and she would just one of she was, you know, nonverbal and she just a lot of people didn't know how to interact with her.

And she wasn't ready to communicate her feelings.

And 6 or 7 years old, like, I'm 35 and it takes me a long time to want to communicate my feelings.

But she loved Noodle, and people couldn't ask her how you're doing today, but they could ask if she was having a bones day or a no bones day, and if she was having a bones day, they knew, okay, we can maybe include her in some more stuff or at least we know we have permission to ask to do stuff like that.

And it made her so much more comfortable.

And again, I'm just sitting on my couch looking at this dog being like, what did you do?

Yeah.

It's wild.

What did you do?

So those were like, you know, that's where you have the viral content and then you have that sort of like, this is much bigger than numbers on TikTok.

And then I would say the, the bad parts about it.

And this is where I have a unique experience, because this has been my job my whole life, ever since I graduated, I studied marketing communications, which could mean anything.

Sure.

And then I worked at an agency, a social agency, right out of college in 2013 where like, this was new.

So I have a lot of experience that, again, the viral content thing just happens.

The only advice I can ever give any brand is the outrage thing.

But I had a lot of ideas of like, I knew how to handle certain things after they happened.

And we have representation.

We had a lot of help, but I think the, the most difficult part about this or the worst part about this was, A lot of, a lot of people are very comfortable being loud and wrong and they people love to look for fights.

They're people just like to look for fights for any reason on social media.

And it was really hard sometimes to try and navigate some of that, like for example, when I would make decisions about Noodles health, or I would do things that like, again, I understand he's of a dog that people love to see in the mornings, and he's this little viral sensation, but like, he is my 14 year old dog.

And no, we haven't posted a video in a week because he's he's sleeping like the dog is.

He's old and he's sleeping.

He's always going to be my dog first.

Like I was so happy for him to start, you know, earning his own money.

Oh my gosh, he had to have a $7,000 surgery on his butt one time.

I was so happy for him to start earning his own money, but the rule was that he never kept a roof over my head like that was never.

That was not in the contract that we made.

So if he ever really if you need to take it easy, I would take that very seriously.

And it would rub a lot of people the wrong way.

And again, it's they're trolls on social media like people just look for it.

But it's really hard not it's transparently it's very hard not to let that get to you sometimes, especially when you're making decisions for another creature's well-being.

Yeah, I imagine and, you know, it's interesting you talk about going a week where you're you're looking up for his welfare.

People don't know what's going on in your life privately, and they feel entitled to tell you that you owe them a video or something like that.

I've talked to, people who do a lot of have been very successful with content.

On Facebook, for example, I've been a little surprised how much money is out there in social media.

I'm naive Jonathan.

I'm a naive person.

But one of the things that, somebody explained to me was he said like, look when you end up kind of going viral or semi viral and then you build these audiences that are bigger than you thought during the thing that whatever it is that got you there is probably pretty organic.

And it took off for whatever reason, but it took off.

But then you feel the pull of like, well, now that it has taken off, should I be posting three times a day?

Should I post five times a day when I make more money?

If I did this kind of thing differently or and it starts to twist what you're doing, which started off as organic.

Yeah.

And now it's become something else.

Did you feel that at all?

I didn't I didn't, I didn't, I didn't I always again, this is where my experience really helped with just working with brands and working with influencers and watching people do it incorrectly over and over and over again.

I knew, for example, one thing that I it was less about that I knew exactly what to do as much as I knew what not to do.

For example, we got offered a tons of money to do branded bones or no bones days like it's bones day.

And the reason would be because of this product or because of this.

Something like incredibly hard sell.

No real nuance.

They just knew these videos got big numbers, they wanted their product there, and it was a lot of money.

Right?

So much money.

It's that much money.

So much money that I get why the kids don't want to be doctors anymore.

But I knew I knew that I had to say no to that because I couldn't.

I would not poison the well.

We could do branded content, but bones or no bones or something.

People took very seriously and I took it seriously.

And this was this was the thing.

Yes, to your point.

Like it was an organic thing and it got really popular.

And there are certain I think there are certain, kinds of content where that lends itself very well.

And, you know, if we ever got, you know, if, if, if the company that made prednisone ever wanted to sponsor us, I could, we could have some bone stays because of prednisone because that's true.

But there was like we needed to keep that organic and fun, because then when we did put up a post of doing a branded content or a piece of content or so, we got to talk about, you know, we're having Noodles, ideal bones day at a five star hotel, and it's just him sitting in a little custom bathrobe being fed cubes of cheese.

I'm like, this works like, this is great for him.

This is a this is a good post to do, but it's it's hard.

It's easy to lose sight of it.

Sometimes I think when people make it their full time job, I think when people make it their full time job and that's that's a really it's a very smart move for a lot of people.

Right?

You.

You got to take that leap.

You've got to take that leap.

And I've never taken that leap.

I'm always have been very scared to do that because I've kept my job the whole time.

I just think that what you're saying, I hope, any future influencers are hearing, I hope kids are hearing.

I hope all of us are hearing because there has been no prescription for navigating the social media age or navigating social media fame.

From what I can see as an outsider, I'm really impressed with what you have done.

Thank you.

You know, and I think about, you know, here's an interesting parallel.

So I was watching an interview with her and oh my gosh, you know, the looks mixer.

Yeah.

He talked about how he wants to be streaming everything because whenever he's not streaming, he's not earning.

He talks about how he doesn't really go to things for fun unless he can stream them.

So he can turn them into a business opportunity.

And I'm going like, do you even know who you are?

As like, is there a person to totally identity?

Max.

Yeah, I mean, I have lost whatever selfie you have.

It's it's a wild culture.

Like it's a whole there's and that's something that's where I sort of sit here and I'm like, okay, so this is what happens when you grow up in like the next generation kind of takes over, like navigating culture.

I don't know how I know social media, but there's so many new platforms and things like streaming, I couldn't imagine the the amount of talk about vulnerability sharing post.

I could not imagine that kind of exposure to people and putting yourself up under that kind of scrutiny.

But they're making so much money.

Yeah, they're making so much money.

And there's I think that's sort of one of those big picture like, take a step back and think how and why.

Like what is the actual what is the service that they're providing?

What is the value that these streamers are providing.

And I think as we sort of as social media progresses, like, you know, we're going to have to even think about, like leveraging the name social media and thinking like, well, that's not what this is.

Algorithmic media, exactly what I hear.

Or antisocial media also.

Good.

Yeah.

And that well, even that idea of like, people are so comfortable commenting on streamers post, but they can't hold a conversation in person.

Yeah, absolutely.

Or they it's it's completely changing the way that we interact with each other in the way that we expect.

Like one of the things that I also think has really helped with my journey in particular, is I knew that there couldn't be a real bit like if you watch any of my videos, like it's just me, because it has to be.

It has to be easy.

It can't not be fun because it's it's social media is not fun a lot of the times.

But like it can't.

Not sharing your dog and making these fun videos, especially knowing the platform you has.

It can't not be fun.

So any anytime I think people take it really seriously or again, they think I need to be earning instead of thinking I need to be providing value.

You have truly lost the plot.

I want to believe that the audience figures that out eventually.

I know, but I don't, I don't I mean, like, I, I think they do.

I think people are pretty savvy.

People are pretty good at figuring out what feels authentic.

Yeah, those who get tired of it, like there will be a shiny day.

Another shiny thing.

And like, streaming sure is the shiny thing right now.

And I, a little bright for me, perhaps, but it's definitely like, this is a really I think it's an important cultural thing to kind of look at and again, think like, what is what is this level of connection that we're now trying to make with people?

And what am I getting from and thinking about what are these people that are going that are going viral and, and why?

And it goes back to outrage a lot of times.

Again, these people just goes back to outrage.

They're streaming themselves in stores, they're streaming in silos, getting kicked out of clubs like it's working, it's formulaic, and they're much smarter than I think they lead on, even if they beat their faces with hammers.

I think you're and by the way, if you're going to like beat their face with hammers.

Yeah, that's like a prescription from a killer on how to looks Max.

Because yeah, your cheekbones heal higher.

And apparently that's a, a higher cheekbone is some sort of a maximum beauty.

I don't know, Evan.

You haven't been.

You're telling me that you're not.

Looks, Maxine, you're not banging your face with a hammer.

This is more.

You're not doing this.

Well, this is all on my man.

It's all real.

Well, there's a couple of videos I can find.

Stuff.

I'm sure there's.

I'm sure there's something out there for it.

There is a part of me, though, that thinks that he's.

That this is sort of just like the modern day snake oil salesman.

And if history does repeat itself and we're just too stupid not to recognize it.

Unfortunately, like that, there is a bit of a small the no bones, the small, nihilistic side of the no bones guy is like more power to you, more power to that cell Hammer's.

All right, so let's get back to the dogs.

We're going to take the only break of the hour.

And here's what we're going to do.

I really appreciate Jonathan Graziano indulging these questions because I've been so fascinated watching his story.

He's a Rochester in 2009 Brighton grad oh nine so fine.

Oh nine so fine.

Brighton High School graduate was living in New York City.

If you're just joining us back in 2021, and, you know, sort of in that pandemic, you know, late pandemic times and he and his dog Noodle go viral with their bones or no bones.

They post tens of millions of views.

I mean, daily, weekly.

It was really incredible.

And so now, you know, Noodle passed away in 2022.

We're meeting Milton the pug.

Milton is the star of a new book called Milton Makes a Move.

And Jonathan has got three different books about the dogs that are children's books.

They're really, really beautiful.

And we're going to come back.

We're going to talk about what he's doing next on this little tour team.

I should say, oh, if you're watching on YouTube, there's Milton there.

I was wondering where he was.

He's you got him there.

There he is.

He's right next to me.

Oh.

Hey, bud.

So.

Yes, he's he's, I lubricant maxing this morning.

Yeah.

You're welcome.

And then I thought he was going to grunt maxing earlier.

Does he do, like a little grunt?

Okay, well, we can't talk about this until we start streaming because he needs to be earning if we're going to talk.

Oh, yeah.

Listen, you got to be earning do, we're going to come back and team.

What I didn't do is I didn't write down the upcoming events that he's got.

If someone can kick me a list here because Jonathan has got public events coming up.

Yeah, we'll talk about that and much more with Jonathan Graziano and Milton next.

Coming up in our second Our Connection Summer sessions is taking all of us on a tour of the Finger Lakes this week.

A different location every day to explore, and we start the tour this week in Canandaigua.

Why do some locals say that Canandaigua really has a three part identity?

What are those three parts?

Obviously the lake, but we're going to go beyond that as we go to Canandaigua next.

Our.

Support for your public radio station comes from our members and from Mary Carey Ola Center supporting residents to become active members of the community, from developing life skills to gaining independence.

Mary Carey Ola Center Transforming Lives of People with disabilities more online at Mary Carey, ola.org.

You got to get on the news YouTube channel watching connections today because Jonathan Graziano has Milton on his lap.

Now there's Milton the pug.

Milton is that you get ten years old.

Yes, ten years old now.

And you are someone.

So you got Noodle when he was eight.

Eight years old?

Yeah, eight years old.

Seven.

He's like seven and a half when I go.

Okay.

And.

And you got Milton when he was.

How old?

Well, I adopted Milton two years ago, and he was four, and we learned very quickly that was it.

Right?

Oh, so we took him to the vet and we were like, maybe he's like 7 or 8.

And we went to we decided on seven and eight, and then he went to go get like a dental.

And we did like a real deep look and we decided on ten.

Okay.

So yeah, he's ish.

Time passes differently for pug.

Sometimes I see, well you have to hold him for too long.

We just wanted people to say Milton's going to walk around the studio artistically noble, which is great.

He's really mobile, so he's got somewhere to go.

Tell me about the value in your mind of adopting senior animals.

I was once told, and I don't remember.

It was such an off the cuff comment, but I loved it.

Was someone just said, I like older dogs because they come preprogramed and there's something really fun about that.

Obviously there are many dogs that have to be rehabilitated in so many ways through so many different traumas.

But for the most part, if you find it, especially pugs like my experience with pugs, a lot of times it's because a family member has passed away or they need to find a new home because someone has moved in.

They can't, you know, they can't have a dog in their house or or apartment or whatever it might be.

Every dog needs a home, wherever they come from, at any age, every dog needs a home.

But there are a lot of dogs that are in like, genuine need of a home.

And that's always older dogs because they obviously they, you know, sometimes will require more medical care.

They eventually will obviously require medical care, but there is absolutely nothing like taking in a dog that needed somewhere else to go, especially with like Noodle, for example.

It was an owner surrender because she had she just she needed to get out of a of a bad situation and she couldn't take Noodle with her.

And it was like one of those radical acts of love things.

And there was such sincere joy in.

And not everyone gets that story.

But when I would see him, like, sound asleep on a couch, like truly ruining my beautiful West End couch, just ruining it with whatever was coming out of his face, there was there was a moment where I would just be so grateful, obviously, that I'd love that he was comfortable and happy.

But I would sit here and I'd be like, this is this is probably what you wanted.

This is probably what she hoped for.

Obviously she wants him with her, and there are plenty of families and who I and, you know, people who get sick, who I know want to keep their dogs.

But knowing that you're kind of stepping in, it's you can kind of bask in that.

The next best thing to keeping that animal for that owner is knowing that that animal's love exactly is knowing that that animal has children.

Fox.

Incredible.

So.

So you lost Noodle in 2022?

Yes I did and, I don't know how quickly did the first.

So the first book was they accepted.

They went nuts with that one.

That is not how quickly books come out.

Noodle and the no bones, really No Bones Today, which is a New York Times bestseller from Jonathan Grassi, and I'm holding it here now.

So this children's book came out when it came out in, June of 2020, 2023, 2023.

Yeah.

Okay.

And there's this beautiful picture of I know back there, he's look at him, my wretched king.

He really did take a great and perfect facial symmetry.

Perfect facial snatch Noodle.

You Noodle at me okay.

Yeah.

He was it looks.

Max.

Yeah.

It's exactly that's think that he that's the thing.

He he couldn't have been here before.

Clavicle.

Earthrise.

There would not have been room for both of them.

So I'm.

I'm sorry for your loss.

I mean, you I mean, there's we've all lost pets, and it's.

It tears your heart out.

But Noodle is immortalized now in this book.

And the Noodle on the no bones day.

Yeah.

Someone called you and said we got this idea.

Let's turn it into a book.

That's kind of what happened.

Yeah, that's kind of what happened.

And.

And it happened like that.

Yeah.

That's not how it happens.

That's not.

And that's typically.

No, I get asked all the time and I'm always like, this is a really privileged answer.

Like, oh, I would love to publish your book.

How did you do it?

Yeah.

Like, well, first create like a viral sensation with tens of millions of followers.

So seven years before you want your book to come out, find the old dog sitting on the Ikea back.

Yeah.

Answer these three riddles.

Sorry I was being funny.

What was the question?

Well, I mean, how it came together.

Oh, this book comes.

Oh, my gosh, it was, So these the series goes viral.

And one of the things that I really appreciated about anatomy pat myself on the back, but again, I had representation.

I had a lot of help.

We were very picky about what we said yes to, because I know that social media is people get very popular on social media, and people can make a lot of money really fast on social media.

But I, as someone who still has, like I have a pretty, I wanted really badly to make sure that we were only doing good stuff for lack of like, a more sophisticated way of phrasing.

I didn't want to make a book that I knew was going to sell.

We were going to sell this book.

I knew we were going to sell this book.

It was super Noodle was super popular.

People were asking for it like we people were in the comments saying, this would make an amazing children's book.

So I was like, okay, if there's, you know, I grew up in America, if you're telling me there's demand before supply, we're looking good.

But we had a few publishers just agree, and we had a few publishers reach out to us.

And thankfully, I had a lot of help from my representation through the dog agency.

Her name is Lonnie Edwards.

She was like, I got this.

And, we worked with we end up working with Simon and Schuster, and the big thing was that they were ready to go with an insane timeline and turn this book around.

We started in January, and it was out by June.

And so that was the original.

And then Noodle Conquers Comfy Mountain Noodle conquers company.

Now to follow up to follow up.

Yes it is came out when November of 2024.

And now we get Milton.

And so I'm going to show the new book.

It's called Milton Makes a Move here.

Now, Milton's real life story is one of, you know, whether you want to or not conquering something that might be scary and new.

Yeah.

Do you want to describe the real life story behind the theme here?

Sure.

So, the story Milton makes a move is as as you said, it's a story of Milton coming to live with me.

And he's a rescue from Korea.

So, he is through the pug rescue of Korea, which is, they operate out of New York, Los Angeles and Korea, obviously.

But what they do is they're an organization that will find dogs, pugs.

And then I think there's, like, organizes it like the blank rescue of Korea.

They sort of have a fringe orgs.

They'll find these dogs, whether they're reported wandering the streets or from hoarding situations.

You know, not unlike they will find in the United States.

They'll take them in, they'll rehabilitate them.

But then rehoming.

Excuse me?

Rehoming pets is an easier thing to do in the United States.

There's a there's more of a culture to my understanding of adoption and rescue, senior rescue, things like that.

So they fly them over the United States.

And Milton was my foster mother, was my fifth little foster dog.

And, he was I found him he was again another he was about 30 pounds.

He was big, adorable, devastating and adorable.

And now he's a solid 24.3.

We did really good with him.

He is the ideal male body.

I know you can tell.

But I got him.

He was this skittish, scared, not so little dog.

And I just watched him come out of his shell.

And the thing is, he just started to.

It's what I love about fostering an advocate, fostering so much.

Is it especially after pet loss is it's such a great way to find the next perfect, the perfect animal for you, because you can have these little dogs for temporary amount of time and see if it's a good fit.

And you really can't say, you know, I love this dog, but he needs a yard, or I love this dog, but he's got, you know, so much energy or or he needs, some kind of accommodation.

Milton showed up and just.

I was like, I work from home and I'm in New York City, and I. You don't have too much space.

And he was like, awesome.

Where's the couch?

Leave me.

Here come the mountain.

That's the thing.

We wrote the second book, new The Safer Place, was asleep.

Remember I told you he was ruining my West Elm couch?

That's where he slept on the back of the cushion.

It's sleep on the back cushion.

And that's where Milton wanted to sleep one of the first nights.

And I was like, okay, all right.

And he just ended up sticking with me.

And I got to write this really amazing story about how he, the bravery that it takes for a little, a little dog to be able to go through something like that, all that change and generally coming across continents without any without saying yes to it.

Like even if you're a kid and you know, the joy and the hope is obviously the kids can relate to this, but the idea that even they had the opportunity to maybe understand what was happening first, I mean, I think it's so relatable for kids because as any kid gets older, they'll inevitably might be a first day of school, might be, you know, taking on a challenge or going out for a team or whatever it is.

Yeah, go on after school, play all things and all kinds a lot, and even writing it as obvious and as an adult.

And I just don't think, you know, I hope a lot of the parents reading this to take stock and give themselves a lot of credit for the bravery that they show every day.

I just had a, two dear friends have a their first son on Tuesday, and I, I just can't stop thinking about how brave they're being, like, they're ready and they're so excited.

But that idea of like this is scary thing that you did not you have no idea what's going to happen to your life.

Now.

We have a hope for what it's going to be, but ultimately you don't know.

And that's scary.

And that's change.

And there's a there's a message that I hope everyone can take away.

From this book.

I might need this book.

I have a 14 year old and a one year old really?

Yes.

I might need that would be.

I mean, I, you know, anyone can take the hope and especially with.

And I always have to shout at the illustrations.

Dan Tevis is our illustrator.

I always think that I do I, I, I'm always so proud of the story that we write, but the way that he brings all of this to life with, just the way, the way that he is able to tell this story through these visuals is really remarkable.

Amen.

He draws the most expressive eyes.

It's why I picked him, why I picked him.

I saw Noodle when he showed me his blood.

Amazing.

And so events coming up, you can meet Jonathan Graziano, you can meet Milton.

Yes.

Milton will be at these events coming up for Milton makes a move this coming Saturday, at 11:00 am at Barnes and Noble at Eastview Mall.

Yep.

Okay.

And then, next Monday.

Next Monday set is 17, the 17th.

That's it.

Feels like it's a Monday.

I did the same thing an hour ago.

The same exact thing.

August 17th, at the Genesee, at the Field of Dreams at, Genesee, Genesee country.

It's.

So it's this.

So this one, the 17th is at Geneseo.

The school.

Oh, yeah.

This one's at the school.

And then we are doing the Genesee Country Museum.

The 2727.

Yeah, yeah.

And then the 23rd we're going to be.

It's the 23rd, right.

Yep.

The 23rd are going to do siren in the C 10 a.m.

at the same time in in the sea.

And we have all that information is I've posted about it.

But it's also if you go to the Simon and Schuster website, it's got all the links to our, our local events that we're going to be doing.

And Milton's going to come and we've got a little, will sign books, but I've got a little, paw print stamp.

So we do Potter Griff autographs as well.

It's adorable.

So cute.

Would you advise people to to do pet fostering if they've never done that?

Absolutely, absolutely.

I could not advocate it.

You get to you get to test you get to you either get to test drive your new best friend, or you get to help someone else's new best friend on their transition as they find that home, there is no and you free up a space for a rescue.

It's.

I always like to look for situations where I feel like everybody wins something, and this is one of those I could not advocate for fostering, where there are so many great, organizations in the area that do that, I have.

I got my cat, one of my cats from grasp.

Snort rescue operates out of here.

You've obviously got Lollipop Farm, you've got Verona Street.

There are amazing, amazing organizations I could not recommend fostering more.

Well, now you've got Milton, who's ten ish.

And for people who have asked you, well, why don't you just start the bones and no bones thing again?

What's the, explanation for why you're not doing that?

He just.

There is the old pug.

People will know.

And I think anyone with a dog really knows that.

Like, this was just not a thing you can like.

It was fun because it was just Noodle.

It was Noodles.

Personality.

I'll try.

Bones are no bones with Milton.

And he'll be like, what are you doing?

What's this?

Noodle was a singular.

Noodle was a singular talent.

Right?

And I love the idea of being able to find something like that where I can maybe, Bill, you know, we we still post and we share a lot of stuff, and we bring a lot of joy, but, like, you know, sometimes you just.

You can't fake it.

And Noodle was the real deal.

And that bones in your bones was such a specific time of our lives.

And time of the internet.

And it was such a moment of community.

And not for nothing.

Milton has a lot more bones than Noodle ever did.

He's got a lot more bones than Noodle ever did, because we've we've we're buying all those joint supplements from Noodles.

Dowry is what we're doing.

Yeah.

He's got those goods.

How many, how many bones?

Days versus no bones days did Noodle tend to have?

It was I think somebody did.

There is like.

No like the stats on there's a Reddit thread.

There's a Reddit thread for sure.

Somebody did the stats.

I'm so glad that these betting apps weren't out.

Like, oh my gosh, seriously, I well, now I'm actually I take that back.

I could have made a million.

Oh, you could have just taken a game to the whole thing.

Yeah, I could have gained the whole like like the Trump administration seemed to be gaming everything that they can game.

I could have game.

The whole thing could.

Nine you could have I could have musk to this.

I don't think that.

I mean, I think you really didn't maximize oh my God I'm actually I as like someone who's like very proud of the things that I've done.

I'm still proud of myself, but knowing that I could have just, knowing that I could have just call seed my way into.

You could have invented Chelsea if it didn't exist by then.

Just five years ago, I know.

Oh my gosh.

All right, Milton.

So we got a brand store, so.

But was it more.

There were more.

No bones, days and bones.

There was many more.

No bones than there were than there were bones days.

And I will say again, the bones days really picked up after we started the prednisone.

But he was always a dog who was when he was.

And I loved more than anything.

I just love knowing that he always felt like he had a soft place to land, right?

That's what it boils down to, is like, if this dog was like scared or uncomfortable, if you watch his videos, it's really remarkable how he just flops down and he just goes back to sleep.

But there were a lot more no bone stays than bone stays.

But like we say in the book, they are all good days.

I mean, I hope that the joy that you brought made your life a little more doable financially.

First thing I did was pay off my student loans.

Okay.

Thank you, Big Daddy Noodle.

The saying.

Yeah, I mean, that's the honest answer is, oh, I am a I am a millennial who found himself in love of small flush of money.

The first thing I did was pay off my student loans.

There you go.

How much more money do you think you could have made if you just decided?

I'm going for everything, every offer that comes in, we're going to do.

We're going to endorse.

We're going to do product placement.

Oh, we could have we could have at that time, just like off that we could have made half $1 million.

Oh my goodness.

We turned down a lot of money to not brand bonds or no bonds.

By we, I mean I it was Noodle.

Noodle didn't make the choice.

I made the choice.

I made the choice I took.

I tried to be, I tried, I listened to my moral compass.

And I didn't bet on this.

He wasn't my little.

He wasn't my little secretariat.

I didn't bet on this, and I now I'm listening.

The children's book is great.

Don't get me wrong.

I'm so proud of it.

I could have made millions if I bet on this good name.

Okay, you got to really let that part go.

I gotta let it go tonight.

You know, in all seriousness, it's wild.

There really was like.

It's where brands where people weren't making TV in the same way.

People weren't making online content the same way.

Everyone was watching social media, and there were brands that were huge companies that had money to throw at anywhere.

There were eyeballs and bones.

You know, bones consistently got millions of views for about two months, and that's a really, really long amount of time to be the shiny new thing.

So yeah, transparently, we we walked away from a lot of money.

I'm going to close with kind of a strange question because you're in a very different sort of kind of fame than someone like Lizzo.

But I read an article about Lizzo recently and, you know, I mean, I just, I and I read the Compare Contrast essay that someone wrote about us getting.

You thought it was funny for a second.

Oh, my.

But no, like, let's listen.

Like, I mean, I was like a fan of what, you know, the sort of the the big hits from Lizzo that I knew.

Who among us hasn't blamed it on the Jews?

Okay.

So I, I haven't heard Lizzo in a number of years.

I wouldn't have been able to guess like when was it was I like 2020 or 2018 I don't know what is time.

Yeah.

But there's an interesting piece about how it is hard to follow up on fame sometimes and sometimes the internet and sometimes the world is cruel.

The culture can be cruel.

You get famous for one lightning strike and then the expectation is like, duplicate it, whatever.

So I need to bring this up because, you know, Lizzo has gone through, it's a very different thing.

But yeah.

Do you feel any pressure, given that you've had that lightning strike of tens of millions, or do you think, you know what?

I'm sort of glad to be on the other side of that.

And I like my life.

It's a it's a little bit of both.

It's a little bit of both because I, I still have a lot of plans for what I want to do with this audience, with this community that I have.

There are things that I really hope to build that like, are young Jonathan, this is a dream come true kind of thing.

I there's new, you know, types of media I want to start creating.

So in that vein, it's very it's very different when you don't have all of those eyes on you.

It's obviously when you are someone who has a lot of the spotlight, you get a lot of the opportunities, and that's that just makes everything easier, right?

When you can sit there and I'd wake up and you'd have, you'd have.

I had a I had a meeting with my agent every single week and they'd go, here are the ten brands that have proposals for you.

Yay or nay.

And it was like that was a luxury.

And again, I had a job the whole time and full time job the whole time.

Because social is so finicky and you can I never think that I never it's so hard to put all of your eggs in that one basket because you do.

It comes in, it goes so quickly.

So I put I have a lot of ambition still for what I want, but it's so much I feel like it's it's less that I feel good being on the other side of it.

As far as it would be.

I would I would love to continue to be able to drive the same kind of attention, especially like trying to drive promo for a book.

You're sitting here and you're like, okay, well, like, how do we I want to strategize around this, like things just don't come any more the way that they used to.

Like, I could post anything and people would get it.

But it really is.

We created something really positive and definitely have.

Yeah, it's it's just a really, it's less about a bad thing and it's more just about being grateful for the things that we did do in our show notes.

We're going to post links to the books and what Jonathan's doing now.

It is great to meet you in person.

It's great to meet Milton, this beautiful pug.

There he is.

If you're watching on YouTube.

He's been all around the studio at his studio now.

Yeah.

And you can meet Milton.

The next event they have is Saturday, 11 a.m., Barnes and Noble at Eastview Mall.

And then a bunch of events to come.

Thank you very much.

Good luck to you.

Thank you so much for having us.

I am really so grateful to have been here.

Thank you so much.

And Milton makes a move.

The children's book out now.

More connections coming up.

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