>> NEXT, TO MTV, THE FIRST EVER 24-HOUR CABLE NETWORK DEDICATED SOLELY TO MUSIC VIDEOS.

NOW IT WAS LAUNCHED IN THE '80s.

IT'S BROUGHT HIT SONGS TO THE LIVING ROOMS OF AUDIENCES RIGHT ACROSS THE GLOBE, REVOLUTIONIZING MUSIC ENTERTAINMENT.

NOW UNDER PARAMOUNT, AND COMPETING AGAINST ONLINE STREAMING PLATFORMS, MTV IS SHUTTING DOWN ITS EUROPEAN MUSIC CHANNELS BY THE END OF THE YEAR, BRINGING THAT CHAPTER OF POP CULTURE TO A CLOSE.

TOM FRESTON IS A CO-FOUNDER OF THE ONCE BELOVED CHANNEL VIDEO, AND FORMER CEO OF VIACOM.

AND HIS NEW MEMOIR, "UNPLUGGED" REFLECTS ON THE BIRTH OF MTV AND HIS CAREER.

HERE HE IS WITH WALTER ISAACSON.

>> THANK YOU, PAULA.

AND TOM PRESTON, WELCOME TO THE SHOW.

>> GREAT TO BE HERE, WALTER.

NICE TO SEE YOU.

>> YOU KNOW, I'M GOING CUT RIGHT TO THE CHASE.

IT'S JUST AN AMAZING SCENE IN THIS BUCK "UNPLUGGED. "

I THINK YOU KNOW WHICH ONE IT IS.

IT'S IN A SAUNA, AND IT SORT OF SETS THE WHOLE TONE FOR THE BOOK.

TELL ME ABOUT THAT SCENE.

>> WELL, I HAD GONE TO STAAD AT THE INVITATION OF DAVID BOWIE.

WE WERE RECRUITING ROCK STARS TO BE IN OUR "I WANT MY MTV" CAMPAIGN.

THIS WAS EARLY ON IN OUR EXISTENCE, PROBABLY 1983.

AND WE WERE DOING THIS CAMPAIGN TO TRY AND GET OUR FANS TO DEMAND THEIR MTV SO CABLE OPERATORS WOULD CARRY US.

SO WE HAD RECRUITED MICK JAGGER AND PETE TOWNSHEND AND MY ASSIGNMENT WAS TO GET DAVID BOWIE.

AND I CALLED HIS MANAGER, AND SHE SAID, WELL, DAVID IS SKIING IN STAAD.

AND IF YOU WANT TO COME OVER HERE, HE'LL DO IT.

SO GOT ON A PLANE WITH A 35 MILLIMETER CREW.

WE FLEW TO ZURICH.

TOOK A TRAIN TO STAAD.

WE WENT OUT ON THE SLOPES AND DAVID WAS THERE LOOKING GREAT.

HE WAS IN HIS "LET'S DANCE" PHASE.

HE FIGURED OUT WHAT HE WANTED TO DO.

HE WAS GOING TO SKI DOWN THE HILL AND DO A SWOOSH AND SAY "I WANT MY MTV".

>> I WANT MY MTV.

>> SO WE DID A FEW RUNS, AND IT REALLY WENT SMOOTHLY.

HE IS QUITE GOOD AT THAT.

WE WOULD THEN TAKE IT BACK AND POST PRODUCE IT AND PUT THE LOGO THERE.

HE SAID WHY DON'T YOU COME TAKE A SAUNA WITH ME AT THE PALACE HOTEL, WHICH WAS THE GRAND DAME IN GASTAAD.

I TOLD MY CREW, SEE LOSERS LATER.

I'M GOING TAKE A SAUNA AT THE PALACE HOTEL WITH DAVID BOWIE.

WHEN I SHOW UP, WE HAVE A TOWEL AROUND ME, AND WE BOTH WALK INTO THE SEAN.

THAT IT'S REALLY STEAMY.

IT'S THERE IS ONE OTHER GUY IN THERE.

HE'S UP ON A SHELF BASICALLY UP IN THE BACK.

AND IT TURNS OUT IT'S PAUL McCARTNEY.

>> WAIT.

HERE IS WITHIN REASON I ASK YOU TO TELL THAT STORY, BECAUSE IN NORMAL HANDS, THIS WOULD BE PLACE DROPPING, GSTAAD, AND PAUL McCARTNEY AND NAME- DROPPING AND EVERYTHING ELSE.

BUT ONE OF THE THINGS YOU SAY IN THE BOOK, BY HITCHHIKING AROUND AND BEING AN ADVENTURE, YOU LEARNED A SENSE OF HUMILITY.

AND THERE IS A SELF- DEPRECATING QUALITY IN THE BOOK THAT MAKES ALL THESE FAMOUS NAMES AND PLACES BECOME FUNNY AS OPPOSED TO ARROGANT OR NAME-DROPPING.

>> WHETHER IT BE ARROGANT OR NAME-DROPPING, THOSE WERE THE TWO GUYS OF THE WHOLE SORT OF ROCK 'N ROLL PANTHEON THAT I WAS THE MOST INTIMIDATED BY.

NORMALLY I WASN'T THAT STAR-STRUCK.

BUT I SAT IN THE SAUNA, AND WE KIND OF --THEY WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT MTV, BECAUSE NEITHER OF THEM HAD REALLY SEEN IT.

WE TALKED ABOUT THIS AND THAT AND THREW SOME WATER ON THE ROCKS.

AND FOR A HALF HOUR, LITTLE TOM FROM MY HOME IN CONNECTICUT WAS IN THERE WITH THESE TWO HUGE STARS.

THEY COULDN'T HAVE BEEN NICER.

IT WAS A GREAT EXPERIENCE.

AND PROBABLY ONE OF MY GREATEST STORIES OF ALL MY YEARS THERE.

>> SO, WAIT, LET'S GET FROM CONNECTICUT.

SUBURBAN KID, GROWING UP IN A VERY CONVENTIONAL THING.

HOW ALL OF THE SUDDEN FORGET ABOUT GETTING TO GSTAAD.

HOW ALL OF THE SUDDEN YOU WERE HITCHHIKING AROUND THE WORLD AND DOING ALL THESE ADVENTURES.

WHERE DID THAT RISK GENE COME FROM?

>> WELL, ONE THAT HAS SORT OF A PENT-UP DESIRE TO TRAVEL.

MY DAD NEVER WANTED TO GO ANYWHERE.

SO WE WENT NOWHERE AS A KID.

I WENT OFF TO COLLEGE.

IN THOSE DAYS YOU COULD HITCHHIKE.

I FOUND THIS FREEDOM ON THE ROAD.

AND ALSO, I HAD FALLEN IN LOVE WITH THE LITERATURE OF THE BEATS WHERE EXPERIENCE WAS THE THING AND YOU COULD TRAVEL AND GET OUT ON THE ROAD.

IT'S THE GREAT CLASSROOM.

AND I GRADUALLY BUILT UP CONFIDENCE TO KIND OF GO ANYWHERE.

I WAS WORKING IN AN AD AGENCY.

AND THEY WERE GOING TO ASSIGN ME TO CHARMIN TOILET PAPER, OF ALL THINGS.

I HAD A MOMENT.

I SAID MAN, I CAN'T DO THIS.

BUT THEN THIS GIRL CALLED ME FROM PARIS I KNEW, AN OLD GIRLFRIEND.

SHE SAID FORGET IT.

YOU CAN'T SELL TOILET PAPER.

COME WITH ME, I'M GOING TO CROSS THE SAHARA.

AND THAT SOUNDED LIKE A GOOD IDEA.

I QUIT MY JOB.

I WAS ON A PLANE A WEEK LATER.

>> AND YOU SAY YOU GOT OFF THE FERRY IN TANGIER.

AS SOON AS I DISEMBARKED, I WAS HIT WITH A HIGH I WOULD CHASE THE REST OF MY LIFE, THE PECULIAR JOY OF DISORIENTATION.

EXPLAIN THAT ONE TO ME.

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN SAY IT'S A BIT OF CULTURE SHOCK.

I HAD NEVER REALLY BEEN ANYWHERE THAT SEEMED THAT UNUSUAL.

WHEN YOU'RE IN A PLACE WHERE YOU DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU ARE ESSENTIALLY, EVERYTHING SEEMS A LOT MORE VIVID AND ALIVE.

YOU HEAR THE CALL TO PRAYER AND YOU THINK YOU'RE IN SOME KIND OF TIME CAPSULE.

SO I LOVED THE FEELING OF BEING UNCOMFORTABLE.

AND THEN HAVING TO ADJUST TO THIS NEW ALTITUDE.

AND I WOULD SPEND A LOT OF MY LIFE IN PLACES IN WHAT WE USED TO CALL THE THIRD WORLD, TRAVELING AROUND.

AND BEING IN ENVIRONMENTS THAT WERE RADICALLY DIFFERENT FROM EVERYTHING I HAD GROWN UP AND BEEN AROUND, YOU KNOW, BEFOREHAND.

>> SO HOW DID MTV GET STARTED?

>> WELL, IT GOT STARTED WITH WARNER COMMUNICATIONS AND AMERICAN EXPRESS HAD A JOINT VENTURE CALLED WARNERAMICS.

AND CABLE TV WAS GETTING STARTED.

THE NOTION WAS RATHER THAN BEING A BROADCASTER, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE SPECIALIZED CHANNELS FOR NICHES FOR SPECIALIZED AUDIENCES.

WE WERE SORT OF THE TIP IN THE SPEAR THAT THAT GROUP AS CABLE WAS BEING LAID ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

IT WAS -- YOU KNOW, CABLE DIDN'T REALLY REACH THE BIG CITIES UNTIL YEARS LATER.

BUT IN THE EARLY '80 s, THAT'S WHEN THESE -- THESE BRANDS THAT WE KNOW TODAY LIKE ESPN AND MTV REALLY GOT FORMED AND STARTED.

IT WAS ALL VERY ENTREPRENEURIAL AND SEAT OF YOUR PANTS AND REALLY DONE ON A LOW COST.

>> MTV WAS NOT JUST A BUSINESS, IT WAS ACTUALLY A CULTURAL REVOLUTION.

IT JUST CHANGED THE WAY MUSIC WAS.

WHEN YOU HELPED FOUND IT AND THEN RAN IT, DID YOU SEE IT AS JUST ANOTHER CABLE BUSINESS ENTERPRISE, OR DID YOU SEE THERE WAS SOME SORT OF MISSION THERE?

>> OH, NO.

WE WERE ON A MISSION.

I MEAN, EVERYTHING WHO WORKED THERE, AND WE WORKED FOR VERY LITTLE MONEY, WE WERE ON A CRUSADE.

WE WANTED TO SWEEP THE NATION, AND ULTIMATELY THE WORLD WITH THIS NEW MUSICAL INVENTION THAT WE THOUGHT WAS IRRESISTIBLE.

WE BELIEVED IN THE POWER OF MUSIC.

MUSIC WAS A REAL POWERFUL FORCE AT THE TIME.

THERE HAD BEEN NOTHING LIKE THIS ON TELEVISION.

PEOPLE HAD NEVER SEEN MUSIC VIDEOS.

SO IT WAS A WHOLE NEW VISUAL VOCABULARY WE WERE THROWING AT PEOPLE.

AND IT'S HARD TO THINK TODAY HOW REVOLUTIONARY MTV WAS IN ITS EARLIER YEARS, BUT IT REALLY WAS UNLIKE ANYTHING PEOPLE HAD SEEN BEFORE ON TELEVISION.

SO PEOPLE WOULD SPEND UNTOLD HOURS WATCHING MTV.

IT REALLY CREATED --IT REALLY GENERATED A CREATIVE RENAISSANCE IN THE VIDEO BUSINESS, IN THE MUSIC BUSINESS, AND IT BECAME A REAL FORCE.

WE BECAME LIKE THE BIGGEST RADIO STATION IN THE NATION.

AND THEN WE DROVE IT INTERNATIONALLY.

WE BECAME THE WORLD'S FIRST REALLY INTERNATIONAL NETWORK.

CNN WAS INTERNATIONAL, BUT THEY WERE MOSTLY IN HOTELS.

WE ACTUALLY HAD 50 VERSIONS IN DIFFERENT LANGUAGES SET UP IN DIFFERENT COUNTRIES THAT REALLY WENT OUT TO PEOPLE'S HOMES.

>> I REMEMBER WHEN MTV WOULD JUST CREATE HITS.

SOMEBODY LIKE MYSELF SAY OKAY, THIS JUST CAME OUT.

I'M GOING GET IT.

NOWADAYS WITH SO MUCH NICHE MEDIA AND STREAMING AND EVERYTHING ELSE, HOW HAS THAT CHANGED THE WAY MUSIC HITS CAN BE CREATED?

>> IT MAKES IT REALLY DIFFICULT.

I MEAN, THERE IS MORE PEOPLE MAKING MUSIC THAT SEEMS LESS REMARKABLE.

THERE USED TO BE 40 RECORD COMPANIES.

NOW THERE IS TWO AND A HALF RECORD COMPANIES BASICALLY.

AND THERE IS NO MONO CULTURE.

THERE IS NO MASS OF MEDIUM.

TAYLOR SWIFT IS REALLY THE EXCEPTION TO THE CASE.

A COUPLE OF OTHERS THAT REALLY CROSS OVER TO DIFFERENT DEMOGRAPHICS.

IT'S HARD TO DISCOVER NEW MUSIC.

I MEAN, IF YOU'RE YOUNGER, YOU GET IT THROUGH WORD OF MOUTH.

BUT IF YOU'RE AN OLDER PERSON IN YOUR 30s, 40s, 50s, IT'S HARD TO REALLY KNOW WHERE NEW MUSIC IS COMING FROM.

PEOPLE TEND TO GO ON TO SPOOTIFY -- SPOTIFY AND LISTEN TO ARTISTS.

YOU DON'T GET EXPOSURE TO DIFFERENT TYPES OF MUSIC OTHER THAN THE TYPE YOU LISTENED TO IN THE FIRST PLACE.

>> ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS YOU HELPED START OF COURSE WAS COMEDY CENTRAL.

THAT LAUNCHED THE CAREERS OF SO MANY PEOPLE LIKE JON STEWART, STEPHEN COLBERT, JOHN OLIVER, JIMMY KIMMEL, BELMAR TOO.

ALL OF THEM BECAME IN SOME WAYS POLITICAL DEFINING NOT JUST HUMOR, BUT POLITICS TOO.

I THINK "SOUTH PARK" WAS PART OF THAT WHOLE THING.

>> "SOUTH PARK," YEAH.

>> IT'S PART NOW OF THE CULTURAL RESISTANCE, BOTH OF THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION AND OTHER THINGS.

ARE YOU SURPRISED THAT COMEDIANS HAVE EMERGED AS SORT OF THE RESISTANCE?

>> YES.

YOU KNOW, GOING BACK TO THE LATE '60s AND EARLY '70s WHEN THERE WAS RESISTANCE TO THE WAR AND TO RICHARD NIXON, IT WAS LARGELY MUSICIANS WHO KIND OF LED THE CHARGE AND CERTAIN CULTURAL FIGURES.

IT CERTAINLY WASN'T COMEDIANS.

COMEDIANS REALLY DIDN'T HAVE THIS TYPE OF EDGE.

RIGHT NOW YOU DON'T HEAR ANYTHING FROM MUSICIAN.

NO ONE IS STANDING UP AT THESE COMMITTEES.

THEY ARE THE FRONT LINE.

AND I REALLY GOT SAY, ALL OF THESE PEOPLE, THE LEADERS OF THIS NEW LINE OF RESISTANCE, THROW DAVE CHAPPELLE IN THERE ALSO, ALL GOT THEIR TV START ON COMEDY CENTRAL.

AMY SCHUMER IS ANOTHER ONE.

AND THEY HAVE A BIG IMPACT.

YOU SAW THE IMPACT THEY HAD IN THE CUT OF THE FOLLOWING THEY'VE BEEN ABLE TO ESTABLISH WHEN YOU SAW ABC DROPPED JIMMY KIMMEL AND HAD TO PUT IT BACK ON.

>> LET'S DRILL DOWN ON THAT.

ARE YOU WORRIED ABOUT THE PRESSURE?

ABC HAD TO DROP JIMMY KIMMEL, PARTLY BECAUSE THE ADMINISTRATION, SOME BLOWBACK ON POLITICS.

ARE YOU FEARFUL THAN WE'RE GETTING TO SUPPRESS THE TYPE OF FREE SPEECH THAT MAKES COMEDY SO IMPORTANT?

>> YES AND NO.

I MEAN, IN THIS JIMMY KIMMEL INSTANCE, I THINK IN THE CALCULUS OF DETERMINING --ABC DETERMINING WHAT TO DO, THEY LEFT OUT ONE COHORT, WHICH WAS THE AUDIENCE.

AND I JUST KNOW FROM EXPERIENCE FROM THE EARLY MTV DAYS, WHEN WE USED TO BE THROWN OFF CABLE SYSTEMS FOR ONE REASON OR ANOTHER, THE FANS WOULD ALWAYS DEMAND IT TO GET BACK.

SOMETIMES WE WOULD FAN THE FLAMES OF THEIR DISCONTENT.

BUT THEY'RE VERY POWERFUL.

AND YOU SAW IN THE CASE HERE, YOU KNOW, THEY CANCELED, I DON'T KNOW, A MILLION AND A HALF STREAMING SUBSCRIPTIONS FOR DISNEY.

THEY DID A LOT OF REPUTATIONAL AND ECONOMIC DAMAGE.

SO YOU CAN'T JUST --I DON'T THINK IT'S THAT EASY.

YES, YOU COULD SMOTHER IT IF YOU REALLY WANT TO BE RUTHLESS.

BUT THESE COMEDIANS, IT'S GOING TO BE HARD TO SUPPRESS THEM, UNLESS THEY START CARTING AWAY THESE PEOPLE AND SENDING THEM INTO EL SALVADOR.

I DON'T SEE THEY'RE GOING SHUT THEM UP.

>> THROUGHOUT THIS BOOK I WATCHED YOU REBEL AGAINST THE CORPORATE OVERLORD US YOU HAVE TO DEAL WITH AT MTV, VIACOM AND PARAMOUNT.

AND THEN AS IF THE GOOD LORD HAD A PERVERSE SENSE OF HUMOR, SUDDENLY YOU BECOME THE CEO.

WHAT WAS IT LIKE MOVING FROM BEING A REBELLIOUS DIVISION HEAD TO SOMEBODY WHO HAD TO BE A CEO?

>> IT WAS A CHANGE FOR ME, BECAUSE RUNNING MTV NETWORKS, EVERY ONE OF OUR NETWORKS WAS SORT OF OUT OF THE MAINSTREAM AND ON THE SIDELINES, AND SORT OF A RADICAL AND EXPERIMENTAL.

NOW I'M HAVING TO DEAL WITH CREATIVE PEOPLE AND ANIMATORS.

IT WAS A PLACE WHERE EVERYTHING I LOVE KIND OF CAME TOGETHER.

BUT WHEN I GOT ELEVATED TO CEO OF VIACOM, NOW ALL OF THE SUDDEN I'M DEALING WITH BANKER, I'M DEALING WITH WALL STREET, I'M DEALING WITH EARNING CALLS, A WHOLE BUNCH OF OTHER THINGS.

IT WAS A NECESSARY STEP.

YOU CAN'T STAY A CHILD FOREVER.

BUT, YOU KNOW, IT SEEMED TO BE SOMETHING THAT I LIKED MORE.

BUT I WAS ABLE TO KIND OF GET GOING AND GET IN THE GROOVE.

AND I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE A WAY TO KIND OF IMPROVE MY SKILL SET AND MOVE MY CAREER AHEAD.

BUT I ONLY HAD EIGHT MONTHS AT IT BEFORE I WAS CASHIER.

>> YOU SAID EVEN WHEN YOU TOOK OVER AS CEO OF VIACOM, YOU SAID "I KNEW I WAS GOING TO BE FIRED. ""

WHAT WAS THAT?

>> WELL, MYS BE, SUMNER REDSTONE, HE FIRED ALL MY PREDECESSORS.

HE WAS A VERY --HE ALWAYS WOULD DO IT ON HOLIDAY WEEKENDS.

THERE WAS A FRANK BIONDI, A REALLY COMPETENT GUY, DID A GREAT JOB.

BUT HE BEGAN TO GET A LITTLE MORE ATTENTION THAN SUMNER LIKED, SO HE WAS OUT.

HE WAS OUT ON A MEMORIAL, ON A FOURTH OF JULY WEEKEND.

AND THEN MEL CARMESON CAME IN.

HE GOT FIRED ON THE FOURTH OF JULY.

I GOT FIRED ON LABOR DAY.

SO I USED TO THINK IF YOU MADE IT THROUGH LABOR DAY, YOU PROBABLY HAD A WHOLE ANOTHER YEAR WITHOUT HAVING TO WORRY ABOUT BEING DUSTED.

>> IN SOME WAYS, SUMNER REDSTONE IS ALMOST A HUMOROUS VILLAIN IN THIS BOOK.

TELL ME ABOUT YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH SUMNER REDSTONE.

>> WELL, HE IS AN INTERESTING GUY.

I MEAN, HE CAME IN AT THE AGE 65 TO TAKE OVER VIACOM IN A VERY BIG BATTLE OF THE '80s TO KIND OF DISPOSE OF THE CURRENT MANAGEMENT AND BEGIN TO BUILD A HOLLYWOOD EMPIRE, WHICH HE DID DO.

HE WAS VERY SMART.

HE WAS VERY TENACIOUS.

HE WAS LAWYER WHO WASN'T AFRAID TO SUE ANYBODY.

HE MADE LAWSUITS LIKE A WHOLE NEW PROFIT CENTER.

HE'D BE SUING HALF OUR CUSTOMERS.

AND I GOT ALONG WITH HIM BECAUSE PRIMARILY, I HAD GONE TO SEE HIM BEFORE HE TOOK OVER THE COMPANY AND GAVE HIM A BILL OF GOODS ABOUT WHAT WE COULD BE IF WE JUST HAD THE RIGHT RESOURCES, WHICH HE PROVIDED US.

HE KIND OF LET US RUN WITH A PRETTY LIGHT HAND.

I THINK IT WAS 65, 70 QUARTERS IN A ROW WE DELIVERED.

SOY WAS NOT A PROBLEM TO HIM.

PEOPLE WHO WERE, WERE OUT PRETTY FAST.

AND HE HAD A SENSE OF HUMOR.

HE WASN'T LIKE --HE WASN'T LIKE THE WORST GUY TO BE AROUND, BUT HE COULD BE RUTHLESS WHEN HE WANTED TO.

BUT THERE ALWAYS SEEMED TO BE A THING, HE WANTED TO BE IN CHARGE.

SO HE WAS NOT GOING TO TAKE INTEREST ANYTHING.

AND HE WANTED TO FIRE TOM CRUISE.

THAT'S WHEN THINGS STARTED TO UNRAVEL BETWEEN ME AND HIM BECAUSE HE THOUGHT "MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE" DIDN'T DO AS WELL AS IT WAS BECAUSE HE WAS JUMPING UP AND DOWN ON OPRAH'S COUCH AND DESTROYING HIS REPUTATION, THAT PEOPLE HATED HIM.

HE WENT OUT AND TOLD "THE WALL STREET JOURNAL" AND SAID I'M GOING TO FIRE TOM CRUISE.

TOM CRUISE DOESN'T REALLY WORK FOR YOU.

THAT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU CAN ACTUALLY DO.

>> SUMNER REDSTONE'S DAUGHTER, SHARI REDSTONE SOLD YOUR OLD COMPANY PARAMOUNT AND SETTLED LAWSUITS WITH DONALD TRUMP IN ORDER TO GET IT THROUGH.

TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK OF THE WAY SHE HANDLED THAT.

>> WELL, I WAS NOT A FAN.

SHE REALLY BENT THE KNEE AND ALMOST STARTED A TREND THAT WE SAW AFFECT A LOT OF OTHER MEDIA CONSOLIDATIONS AND THINGS.

I THINK SHE FELT THE DRUMBEAT OF THIS THING COMING WHICH IF SHE DIDN'T CLOSE THIS DEAL BY OCTOBER 1st, SHE WOULD HAVE TO PAY THE ELLISONS, DAVID ELLISON AND HIS FATHER $400 MILLION KILL FEE, WHICH IS A LOT OF MONEY, WHICH WOULD HAVE PUT AN ALREADY SUFFERING PARAMOUNT INTO A MORE OF A DEATH SPIRAL.

AND THE ONLY WAY SHE WAS GOING TO GET IT DONE AND PASS THE FTC, FCC WAS TO BE NICE TO DONALD TRUMP.

AND THAT'S WHAT SHE DID.

AND IN THE PROCESS, COMPROMISED WHAT HAD BEEN ONE OF THE GREAT TELEVISION NEWS ORGANIZATIONS THAT THE COUNTRY HAD EVER SEEN.

SO IT WAS A -- A DISAPPOINTMENT, BIG DISAPPOINTMENT TO THE PEOPLE WHO WORKED THERE.

>> LOOKING AT TODAY'S CULTURAL LANDSCAPE WITH STREAMING WARS, ALGORITHM- DRIVEN CONTENT, THIS --WE DON'T HAVE SHARED CULTURAL THINGS LIKE MTV CREATING A HIT ON ANY GIVEN WEEK.

WHAT IS THAT GOING TO DO TO STORYTELLING AND CREATIVITY?

>> WELL, GOOD STORYTELLING, IF YOU'RE A GOOD STORYTELLER, YOU CAN STILL HAVE A HIT.

I MEAN, WE SEE THAT NOW.

THERE ARE HITS ON THESE VARIES STREAMING SERVICES.

THE PROBLEM IS AS A CONSUMER, THERE ARE SO MANY MORE CHOICES THAN THERE EVER USED TO BE.

IF YOU HAVE A HIT, WHICH IS REALLY THE RARE THING, WORD WILL GET AROUND AND MORE AND MORE PEOPLE WILL WATCH IT.

BUT IT'S HARDER TO HAVE A HIT RECORD.

IT'S HARDER TO HAVE A HIT TV SHOW.

AND IT'S NOT AS IF PEOPLE AREN'T LOOKING, BUT THE ATTENTION SPANS ARE SHORT.

SOCIAL MEDIA IS A BIGGER FACTOR.

YOU KNOW, PEOPLE KEEP SAYING HOW INTERESTING TIKTOK IS.

AND IF YOU EVER SPEND ANY TIME ON TIKTOK, MAYBE THIS IS TALKING LIKE AN OLD PERSON, THERE DOESN'T SEEM TO BE A LOT TO ENGAGE THERE OTHER THAN THAT QUICK SENSATIONALISM AND MOVING ALONG.

IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING GOOD AND YOU'RE IN THE MOOD, PEOPLE WILL SIT DOWN AND WATCH A LONG MOVIE OR SPEND 50 HOURS GOING THROUGH EPISODIC TELEVISION SERIES.

>> TOM FRESTON, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

>> IT'S GOOD, WALTER.

NICE TO TALK TO YOU.

THANK YOU.

>