♪♪ Issues related to the transgender community are among the most contested areas of political debate in America today.

Activist Alexis Sanchez of the Sacramento LGBT Center joins us to share her story and her perspective.

Alexis, can you briefly share your own personal journey of recognizing and embracing your identity?

Hi there.

Thank you so much for having me.

Um, I'm happy to share a little bit of my own journey with my own identity and how it kind of leads into the work that I do now.

So, um, I am transgender.

I, um- I can remember being three, four years old and just not feeling- Um, you know, everyone said "You're a boy," and that just never quite felt right.

I was telling my family, I was telling my parents, um, that I was a girl, you know, as... as early as I had the words to kind of, um, put it into words and communicate that to them.

Um, uh, that- I kind of- You know, my family told me that that's not something that we really do.

So, I hid that portion of myself for, uh, quite a few decades, um, and tried my best to, you know, live my life as a cisgender, heterosexual man.

And, um, I tried really hard to be someone who I wasn't for a really long time, um, and it led me to a lot of challenges with substance use and a lot of challenges just within my life.

And, um, when I was 28, I got to a point where I just was like, I...

I...

I can't do this anymore.

I can't keep pretending to be someone that I'm not.

Um, it's leading to a life that, like, feels empty, is really unfulfilling.

It feels like I'm lying to everyone constantly.

So, I came out to myself first and foremost and decided that I was going to take that journey and take that step into transitioning.

So, it's been about nine years now, um, since I came out and started fully living authentically as myself- Alexis.

I...

I...

I'm sure that, uh, in that process, there were lots of experiences that you had in terms of... of sharing, um, the... the journey and the change that, uh, you were moving through.

Can you share with us- because I've had conversations with a... a... a number of folks- what was that like for you, with those who are closest to you in your life?

Yeah, um, that process and the coming out process was, um, full of ups and downs.

Um, my mom loves me through and through and supports me.

Um, you know, I think she was just finally happy that I was happy and I think, especially, in that prior to coming out, I was struggling with substance use, and gender dysphoria was a big part of why I used substances the way I did.

And she- For her, it's like, if this is what it takes for you to get sober, I really don't care.

I just want you to be happy, to be safe and be OK. And my mom has been one of the biggest sources of support throughout my life, but especially within my transition.

Um, but the same can't be said for, kind of, other, uh, facets of my friends and family.

I've had friends that I had since high- since prior to high school that just- I came out to them and they never talked to me again.

Um, I have family members that rejected, uh, both myself and my mom just, kind of, outright and don't speak to either of us anymore.

I think the frustrating part for myself, especially, was prior to coming out, I was a person who, for all intents and purposes, was miserable and caused a lot of harm and chaos within, like, my friend and family circles.

Um, and they- And the folks that rejected me were more accepting of this person who was causing harm that was cisgender than a person that was happy, healthy, um, contributing to her community, but happens to be transgender.

Uh, and I think, for... for me, that was one of the more... more hurtful parts of coming out and losing those portions of my family.

But, um, there have been the real gems and those individuals that have stayed with me, um, that I'm still friends with or that are still, uh, family members that show up to our Christmas, Thanksgiving, um, function.

And I've built a whole new community of... of really wonderful, vibrant people since I've come out.

Um, so, I think that's been, kind of, the silver lining.

If... if I might go a little bit further- In speaking, if anyone is joining us who has a family member or a loved one that is experiencing the same things that you've experienced and... and they're earlier on, on their own journey, what advice would you give or what is it that... that they need to know in order to be in a place of support or a place of understan- greater understanding for their particular loved one or family member?

Yeah, that's a really great question.

I think, first and foremost, compassion and understanding that coming out and deciding to transition, I think in any- um, especially now, but even through- you know, throughout, uh, the last 20, 30 years, it's not a decision that anyone takes lightly.

Um, I think for transgender people, um, you... you decide to make this- to kind of make this decision knowing that it could cost you friends, family, career and everything that you've kind of built.

So, that knowing that it might keep you from kind of attaining goals in the future, um, but trans people still choose to transition in light of those things.

So, it's not a decision that anyone, any transgender person, kind of, takes lightly, takes on a whim.

It's something that takes a lot of soul searching, and most trans people come to a place where they, um, much like myself, were very, very unhappy and leading a life that was not their own.

Um, so, a person, a fam- friend or family member has gone through a lot to even get to the place where they feel safe and comfortable, kind of, sharing this with you, the friend or family member.

Um, I think them coming out to you is a testament to say that they feel safe, um, around you, um, because there are individuals that, you know, I, myself, didn't come out to because I just chose to never speak with again, because I did not feel safe around those individuals.

So, the fact that a friend, family or loved one is coming out to you, you know, it... it's a testament to the trust that you've built with that individual.

And I think that's something that, like, we can take with a lot of pride to say, like, "Oh, I am a safe person for this person to talk to."

And then, finally, just finding compassion.

Right?

There are... there are experiences and questions that that trans person will be exploring and going through that, um, a person who's not trans can never really understand.

And that... that's OK, right?

We can still be supportive of individuals, even though we don't fully understand their experiences.

Um, similar to, um, a friend going through a health issue with something that I've never struggled with, um, I'll never know the challenges that that person has, um, but I can still be there as a supportive individual and just kind of lend an ear, um, and be there as, you know, kind of support, um, that's active listening and, um, chiming in and giving what I can, where I can.

Mmhmm.

I was speaking to a father recently whose own child had gone through their own transition and he said to me, "Scott, what you have to understand is that, um, this is not something that anyone chooses on a lark, and that if someone is willing to take this sort of step, particularly in the uncertain climate that we live in today, a parent has to take it seriously."

Um, he also said, though, that, you know, he had his own, uh, journey that he had to make as well.

Do you have any advice on that front at all because of the fact that, to be frank with you, not to be offensive, but for... for those who, um, come from a different tradition and have never had to deal with this, in terms of, um, how it is that they view themselves, it's a bit of a- it can be a bit of a struggle.

Any... any thoughts on that?

Yeah.

I think there are- I think parents of transgender children go through their own grieving period, right?

And I think there are- Um, at the Sacramento LGBT Community Center and within other community centers, um, there are oftentimes groups for parents, um, whose children have come out as trans, so that they can find community.

Because when a child is born, um, we, um, you know, we have a lot of dreams and aspirations for what that child will look like.

Right?

Um, someone holds their newborn and they are dreaming of the first day of school, and maybe they'll play sports, and hopefully they'll find someone they love and get married.

Um, and I'll- Um, you know, parents tend to, um, have, like, a lot of hopes, dreams and aspirations for a child.

And when that child comes out as transgender, um, some of those dreams and aspirations might fall away.

They might feel, um- They might feel, uh, like they're no longer accessible.

They may feel, um- And a parent might also go through a process of feeling like they don't really... they don't really know what to do or what to say or what to- uh, or how to support- right?

- especially if they've grown up in an environment where they've never met another transgender person before, where they've never, um, you know, seen, like, the LGBTQ+ community, as a whole, and are unsure of how to navigate it.

So, that is a challenging place for a parent, um, to be in.

The advice that I give, generally, with that is to find other parents that are going through it and are supportive of their youth.

Right?

I think, um, looking to local LGBT centers or looking to, um- Oftentimes, uh, you know, like, mental health providers, if a person, um, is undergoing- If- Sometimes, if they're going, like, to family therapy or group therapy, they can sometimes find other avenues of support, um, to kind of help them process the feelings that come up with a child being trans and allowing that parent to be available and to be... to be able to be a parent- right?

- and a loved one and a guiding force in that trans child's life.

Okay.

Let... let... let's talk about... the broader society for a second.

With your work with the center, how would you describe the current state of, uh, transgender rights and representation in society today?

Yeah, um, the current state.

So, at the Sacramento LGBT Center, I handle a lot of our, um- I do all of our governmental, um, affairs and public policy.

So, I'm very steeped in this world and I'm constantly looking at the state of transgender rights.

Um, I think within the last 20 years, we've seen significant, uh- we've seen growth by leaps and bounds, in terms of protections for transgender individuals.

20 years ago, there weren't nondiscrimination clauses, and a person could be fired from their job, denied housing, denied access to, like, a restaurant or services based on their trans iden... identity.

And now, there are protections either at the state and- or federal level that, um, you know, say that, like, you can't deny a person, um, basic hou... housing, health care or a job just based on their transgender status- similar to race, similar to, um, any of the, um, other protected classes.

So, we've seen a lot of growth within the last 20 years, um, but there's still a lot of work to be done.

And within the last two to three years, there's been, um, a big pushback against transgender rights that have made, um- that have started to erode some of those protections in other states, erode some of the protections at the federal level and have started to push back and make forward process- uh, progress really, really challenging for some of the different, uh, policy interventions that, um, legislators are seeking to pass, uh, this year, especially.

I was in a committee hearing yesterday for a bill, um, which had, uh, you know- This is a bill which normally would have flown through the legislature a year ago and now is just, uh, met with significant opposition.

I think there were 30, 40 individuals in the chamber for this, um, hearing in the middle of the day on a weekday to kind of speak against the bill.

Um, and there was- Well, what... what was the bill about?

What was the bill about?

Yeah.

Um, so, the bill is looking at, kind of, um, foster care, um, and resource family approval and just kind of says that, um, it- that support of a child who is transgender is something that should be looked at in the resource family approval process.

Um, and this bill is important because, um, a lot- about upwards of 40% of youth experiencing homelessness- so, um, people under 18 who are homeless- are LGBTQ+.

And a big reason for this is because when youth come out to unsupportive families, oftentimes, they're asked to leave their household.

Some of those youth can find- um, can go live with friends or can go find family members that they can live with, but that's not the case for all individuals.

And this is really prevalent within foster youth, where foster youth will sometimes, um, you know, be adopted at the age of four, come out as transgender, come out as LGBTQ+, um, to their family at 14, 15 and then be asked to live- to leave the household and fall back into homelessness and be, um, put back into, kind of, like, the foster care system.

So, this bill hopes to, like, just put some more safeguards against that in place, um, but it saw a significant misinformation campaign around the contents of the bill, um, which caused- [Scott] Well, let's... let's go a little bit further on that one, because it would seem that there is a lot of highly charged, uh, debate- and... and just, uh, the intensity of the discussions is, um, noteworthy across- given all of the issues that people can potentially have differences of opinion on.

On this one, though, you're talking about, um, consideration of... of, um, transgender issues as part of the range of things that... that are looked at.

That sounds like a piece of a... of a bigger conversation, which would love to have your thoughts on this, and that is... is that, for folks who, um, uh, are- I would assume that you would say are pushing, um, uh, negative legislation or negative policies against the trans community and... and the broader community, uh, in LGBTQIA, they make the point that they feel that the state is intervening on family relationships, family decision making and that it's a, uh, unacceptable intrusion of the government in making decisions on their loved ones and, in particular, children.

At the same time, I hear what you're saying in terms of what the considerations are, but respond directly to the... to the people who take the position that a... a lot of the legislation that has been put forward in recent history and that are the policy positions of the community, um, are a inappropriate intervention of government into what should be private decisions within the family.

Yeah.

Um, so, I think to speak to some cases, specifically, that kind of, um, illustrate this point that you're getting at, that which is, um, uh, one of the big touchpoints has been access to gender affirming care for transgender teenagers, right?

And I think that is where, uh, the bulk of the anti-trans legislation has focused on this year, um, with bans on gender affirming care being passed in, I think, 20... 20 plus states this year.

Um, and some proponents of the bill have said that that is, um, maybe government overreach.

But I would push back and say that these bills, themselves, um, actually constitute government overreach and, um, intervening in decisions of families.

Right?

Because, um, a youth- a... a... a... a child who comes out as transgender to their parents cannot go and seek gender affirming care without the consent of their parents.

Right?

Like, youth cannot consent to care.

Um, so, the parents and the child make that decision together to seek medical care.

And that is a decision that they make with their doctor after being informed of the risks, after being informed of kind of, like, the pros, cons.

Now, these bills have come and those represent state intervention, saying that, no, this family that has come to this decision between the child, the family and the doctor, they... they cannot access this care that, you know, they decided was best for them.

Um, sometimes, with these bills, I see a little bit of hypocrisy, because if we were talking about, um, vaccines and access to vaccines, um, oftentimes, the proponents of these bills would go the complete other way, um, with these things.

So, when- Yesterday, when I was in that hearing for the bill, um, what it- what a lot of the arguments boiled down to, for the opposition, was "We do not believe that transgender people should exist.

We do not believe that, uh, gender dysphoria is real.

We do not believe, um, and therefore, we don't think that anyone should have access to it."

And that is kind of the narrative that has been pushed.

That is the place that a lot of these anti-LGBTQ+ bills, um, uh, the place that they operate from, right?

Like, when you're trying to deny medical care to individuals, when you're trying to deny, um, access to public bathrooms and public spaces, when you're trying to deny, um, access to participation in sports and other team activities, you're basically saying, "We don't want you to exist in the public square."

And I would argue that that is a bigger state intervention, because it requires... it requires, um, you know, a body saying like, "No, you cannot exist in public."

Well, actually, let... let's go back.

You mentioned the... the... the sports issue, and that's one that gets a lot of visibility.

Give us- Share with us the- a... a perspective on that, because, um, many, uh, say, well, OK, um, a person, for instance, who is born male and transitions still comes with a competitive advantage in competing in sports with someone who was born biologically female, in terms of strength, speed, all that sort of thing- in some cases, OK?

In some cases.

But that there is an unfair advantage that's being conferred by that participation, how do you respond to that?

Yeah, um, so, the sports issue is one that, um, hits really close to home.

Sports have been really important, um, to me for a really long time.

If I were to swivel my chair, you would see my marathon medals right behind me.

Um, so, I think participation in sports is something that is really important to many people.

Um, it is a place where, uh, youth can oftentimes find community, they can find an outlet, they can find space to just kind of be themselves.

Right?

Um, I think the push back- So, much like the push back on gender affirming care, um, it ignores the guidelines that have been set by major medical associations, um, when it comes to transgender participation in sports.

There were already pretty robust guidelines that existed by, um, most athletic bodies, whether that be the NCAA, whether that be, um, kind of the bodies that oversee high school level sports.

Um, they already had guidelines that said if a person was born male, they have to be on hormone replacement therapy for X, Y, Z, um, their, uh, testosterone would have to be within this range.

These guidelines already existed and have existed for probably close to a decade.

Um, for those who- And... and I think the guidelines do a really good job.

They sometimes fall short.

There are intersex individuals- so, people who are born with, um, chromosomes or hormonal, um, uh, characteristics that don't neatly fall within the two biological sexes- that oftentimes, you know, have a lot of challenges when it comes to team- finding and participating in team sports.

But to speak again, specifically, to transgender individuals, um, I- So, when talking about this, I'll oftentimes bring up Michael Phelps, um, who had double jointed, um, double jointed joints.

Right?

He had double jointed elbows, I believe, and knees that allowed them to kind of flex in a way that gave him a competitive... a competitive advantage against his other competitors.

But we choose to say nothing about those things when it happens in- kind of, with cisgender, heterosexual athletes, when it happens with, um, you know, uh, folks who are not transgender, um, but instead kind of zero in on certain cases, um, and oftentimes, zero in on cases that, you know, are made up, quite frankly.

Isn't there- But isn't there a difference between Michael Phelps- I mean, whatever it was that... that sort of accidental circumstance that led to whatever it was that he had, in terms of joints and all that, rather than something that was essentially, um, uh, transitioned or added kind of after... after birth, so to speak?

Right?

The change, in terms of transitioning, is something that took place, uh, after one comes into the world.

Right?

And so, he had no agency in... in what it was that he was born with or brought to the table.

Isn't that a little bit of a difference?

That... that's fair.

That... that is a fair point.

Um- I think, ultimately, um, when it comes to trans sports, uh, I want to come back to the point that I was, uh, I was just about to make, um, which was last year, the state of Utah passed a ban on transgender participation in sports, and specifically transgender women.

Um, transgender men are never... never really included in the conversation around, uh, transgender, uh, sports and participation in sports.

Um, so, last year, when Utah passed their- passed a bill preventing transgender, um, transgender women participating in sports, the governor of Utah vetoed the bill.

He said, "I looked over athletics at every level within the state of Utah, and there was one transgender girl in the whole state of Utah participating in athletics.

And this bill feels like it is there to spite that one person in particular."

Um, so, I think we... we can fall into, um, kind of, uh, scenarios and imaginary scenarios and say like, "Yeah, well, what about this one person who chooses to transition and has a competitive advantage?"

which erases the struggles of transgender people who are, you know, actively just trying to live their life and maybe play on a soccer team, maybe do some swimming as part of their extracurriculars, as a way to kind of like, you know, have some fun.

Um, I think there is a lot of focus on competitive level sports because it is a- there's a space where you need to have nuance in this conversation, much like we're having right now.

Right?

Like, is there a difference between, uh, Michael Phelps, who was born, um, with, you know, double jointed elbows, abnormally tall, and all these competitive advantages and a difference between a transgender athlete who went through a male puberty, which makes her a little taller than the average woman, but now is on hormones?

There is nuance to be had in that discussion.

Um, so, I think it's an easy place for people who are trying to legislate against transgender people to come to.

All right.

Well, uh, very much appreciate you coming on the show, Alexis.

And if there is any last thing in just a very few seconds that you want all of us to know.

Yeah, I...

I think the big thing is transgender people have, uh, an unemployment rate, uh, three times higher than the national- than, you know, the cisgender, uh, population, higher rates of housing insecurity.

Um, transgender people are on the margins, and I think we can do much more as a society to support them and support each other in this time when transgender rights are under attack.

If folks want- [Scott] And I think we're- Unfortunately, we're out of time and I think we're going to have to leave it there.

[Alexis] Okay, thank you.

[Scott] Thank you so much.

All right.

[Alexis] Thanks.

[Scott] And that's our show.

Thanks to our guest and thanks to you for joining Studio Sacramento.

I'm Scott Syphax.

See you next time right here on KVIE.

♪♪ All episodes of Studio Sacramento, along with other KVIE programs, are available to watch online at kvie.org/video.