
Volker condemns Trump's comments on protecting NATO allies
Clip: 2/12/2024 | 5m 56sVideo has Closed Captions
Former Amb. Volker condemns Trump's comments on not protecting NATO allies
At a campaign event, Donald Trump claimed he told a NATO member that he would withhold U.S. help and encourage Russia “to do whatever the hell they want'' to countries that are “delinquent.” European leaders condemned the comments as reckless and dangerous. Amna Nawaz discussed the implications with Kurt Volker, the U.S. special envoy to Ukraine during the Trump administration.
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Volker condemns Trump's comments on protecting NATO allies
Clip: 2/12/2024 | 5m 56sVideo has Closed Captions
At a campaign event, Donald Trump claimed he told a NATO member that he would withhold U.S. help and encourage Russia “to do whatever the hell they want'' to countries that are “delinquent.” European leaders condemned the comments as reckless and dangerous. Amna Nawaz discussed the implications with Kurt Volker, the U.S. special envoy to Ukraine during the Trump administration.
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Learn Moreabout PBS online sponsorshipAMNA NAWAZ: European leaders have widely condemned## those comments by Mr. Trump# as reckless and dangerous.
And in a meeting focused on Ukraine today,# Germany, France, and Poland express solidarity## with one another, saying Europe must be# ready to defend itself and its allies.
For more on the implications# for the U.S. and the world,## we turn now to Kurt Volker.
He was U.S. ambassador# to NATO during the George W. Bush administration## and U.S. special representative for Ukraine# negotiations during the Trump administration.
Ambassador Volker, welcome, sir.# Thank you so much for joining us.
KURT VOLKER, Former U.S. Special Representative# for Ukraine: Thank you for having me.
AMNA NAWAZ: I want to begin with your reaction#.. saying he would encourage Russia to attack# a NATO ally if they didn't pay their dues.
What did you think when you heard that?
KURT VOLKER: It's really an outrageous comment.
I mean, if you look at what Russia is doing to# Ukraine right now, killings, bombing cities,## civilians, civilian deaths, torture, rape as# a weapon of war, you shouldn't wish this on## anybody.
And to say that we would encourage Putin# to attack one of our allies is really too much.
Now, to be clear, what President Trump# was doing, he was at a campaign rally,## and he was bragging about having said# this in the past.
It wasn't a comment## about the future.
But even so, it is# nothing to brag about.
It is not the## kind of leadership that America# should be showing in the world.
And I would add that NATO was created to# prevent war.
NATO was created so that,## by banding together and countries# pledging to defend each other,## we would dissuade anybody from attacking.
And here# we have a suggestion that someone should attack.## That's exactly the opposite of what we should# be trying to do.
We don't want to see a war.
AMNA NAWAZ: What do you believe# that the U.S. relationship with## NATO would look like under# another Trump presidency?
KURT VOLKER: Well, it's hard to know,# because President Trump says a lot of things.
Remember, during the first -- President# Trump's first term as president, he had## a lot of warm words for Vladimir# Putin, and, at the same time,## he threw the Russian Consulate out of San# Francisco.
He provided arms for Ukraine.## He rounded up and arrested and deported# a lot of Russian intelligence officers.
So there are things that were done under the# Trump administration that were sound policy,## even though the rhetoric coming from the# president sometimes is in the opposite direction.
AMNA NAWAZ: Do you believe# that he would try to pull## the U.S. out of the alliance, as he said he would?
KURT VOLKER: I don't know.
The most recent thing he said, that I heard#.. in kind of a dormant position.
I don't# know what that means.
NATO is a defensive## alliance and is, by definition, almost# in a dormant position until attacked.
But the point is that, if attacked, there# needs to be a certain and substantial response,## so that it serves its role of deterring such an# attack.
And I think that he would be unlikely to## try to pull the U.S. out of NATO.
And even# if he tried, I think it would be unlikely## to be successful, because there would be# substantial resistance within the Senate.
And it would certainly go to the courts to see# whether he even had the authority to do that.
AMNA NAWAZ: Ambassador, I want to put to# you a statement from Trump senior adviser## Jason Miller in response to some of the# coverage around Mr. Trump's comments.
He said this in part.
He said: "Democrat and# media pearl-clutches seem to have forgotten## that we had four years of peace and prosperity# under President Trump, but Europe saw death and## destruction under Obama/Biden and now more# death and destruction under Biden.
When## you don't pay your defense spending, you# can't be surprised that you get more war."
Ambassador, his claim is basically that, because# President Trump publicly pressured people to## increase their defense spending, the world# was safer.
What do you make of that argument?
KURT VOLKER: Well, there are several things## that are wrapped up there and I# think we have to..
The first thing is that he's absolutely# right.
European allies do need to spend## more on defense.
Every U.S. president that I# have worked with ever since Reagan has said## European allies need to do more on defense.# President Trump was more direct about it,## more forceful about it, and allies did# spend more on defense under his watch,## but they have spent even more under President# Biden, and it's not because of Biden.
It's because of Putin.
Putin is -- has# launched a war in Europe the likes of## which we have not seen since World War II, and# this has caused European allies to genuinely## fear for their security and to begin doing much# more for defense than they had been.
Poland is## going to spend 4 percent of GDP on defense this# year, 40 billion euros, Estonia also 4 percent.
These countries are ramping up their# defense spending because of what they## see happening in Europe, and that's# why it's so important that the U.S.,## as the leader of NATO, be supporting and# encouraging that and sending a message to## any aggressor that there would be# a collective response if attacked.
AMNA NAWAZ: Before we go, I need to ask you,# Ambassador, about the immigration piece of## Mr. Trump's plans that my colleague# Laura Barron-Lopez just reported on.
The idea that a U.S. president# says he would deploy red state## National Guard troops to go into blue# states to remove undocumented migrants,## what's your reaction to that?
What would# be the impact of something like that?
KURT VOLKER: Well, let's first say I don't think# that this is something that's actually possible.
The governors and the National Guards of the# states where this would take place would not## want this.
They would resist it.
I can't# see states going to put their militias up## against each other.
This would be a civil# war.
I really don't see this happening.
AMNA NAWAZ: That is former U.S. Ambassador# to NATO Kurt Volker joining us tonight.
Ambassador, thank you so much# for your time.
Appreciate it.
KURT VOLKER: Thank you.
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