From the WNIN Tri-State Public Media Center in downtown Evansville.

I'm David James and this is Two Main Street.

So here's today's menu.

We have crop circles, a strange formation, a totem depicting a Native Ameri the Tornado of 1925, and the leg and lore of Southwestern Indiana My guest is Charlie Kiesel, educator, freelance writer, phot He shares his passion for histor and research these days, hosting lectures at libraries in the Evansville a with his home base being the Princeton Library.

Charlie Kiesel continues his public speaking despite a nagging voice disorder called spasmodic dyspho which causes involuntary spasms in the muscles of the larynx.

This causes the voice to break w a strained or strangled sound.

So Charlie, welcome to Two Main Now before we dive into these to including some great unsolved mysteries, let's tackle spasmodic dysphonia.

When did you notice there was a with your speech Charlie?

Also probably about 15 years ago and it developed kind of slowly, like I had laryngitis and I'm about due for another Bo injection down at Vanderbilt do that every six months, so it's getting tight again.

Normally, I have a normal voice, anyway it took me about six year I decided to find out what was w I went up to Cleveland Clinic an had a guy up there 20 years expe PHD.

Took it 15 minutes to figur I have spasmodic dysphonia, they don't know what causes it, but it's a problem between the b and the vocal cord of the tensio and I get Botox injections in th and the muscles in the vocal cor for about five months I'll have voice and start feeling tight ag Sorta like getting a slow charli and it gets tighter and tighter, makes it harder to speak so that I ended up doing, I been going to Vanderbilt now.

Dr. Garrett very good, she got 400 patients from the Midwest and every Friday she has people going in every fi for the Botox injections, it's an interesting Well I know I had Beth Sweeney, a former TV news anchor, on my p and we talked about her struggle with spasmodic dysphonia.

She also goes to Vanderbilt and gets those Botox injections.

So I guess that's the place to g if you have to say.

Not to many people that do that, actually got 400 patients and I've met people there from Newburgh, Burnsville, in a little waiting room through about of size and it's interesti They don't do that now with covi but that's what they did we sit there and talk.

Some of them have terrible voice there are some people have to go every three weeks.

Really?

They inject one side and they can only do one of the at a time with that person because of choking on our own sa Oh, really?

I couldn't see going every three that's bad enough, every six months, but I appreciate it, you know.

Now what?

What is the Botox do?

It relaxes the muscles, you know a relax and for a while, about t you have a very breathy voice because it relaxes and then your voice comes back and you got a normal voice and it's changing a little bit.

I've been going down there about ten years, twelve and I went out of town about a y It was amazing, she gave me the I left the hospital driving home I had the voice I had 30 years a My voice was perfect.

Ain't that amazing.

For two days then it went back.

Oh, my gosh.

I know it.

First I got a very breathy voice I couldn't believe it.

I thought it was cured.

Sure but it came right back.

I could not believe it, but it never happened and all the in So you learn to live with it and manage it.

Well yes and it conditions.

You know I get on the phone, it' My noisy environment, it's worse It's something of a mystery.

Well, I you know you continue to your, your lectu I know in your, you have a reall a passion for the mysteries of southwester and now you've been researching, I know among many things, crop c of course, those little strange that appear overnight in farm fi Now, in June of 2006, I believe you stepped into a whe near the Huntingburg Airport.

So Charlie, what did you see there?

Well, I don't know how I heard a Travis McQueen.

What is his name?

The airport manager he was flying in the airport.

He saw the crop circle there rig where the airport and my wife an went up to see if we could find well we didn't know where to loo They already harvested the wheat said well let's go back the next day went up the next da there were scientist there, you know, investigating and they found out, well for one thing, 80% are manm Yeah, I understand most of them are hoaxes.

You know, but there are some strange prope and so we got up there and we talked to them, interview There was a doctor, PhD and came down from Michigan and Jeff Wilson he came in from He had a masters in general scie and they were after radiation checking and all.

So he came to the conclusion tha that one was likely not manmade and had radiation levels higher that were some changes in the wh So that one was declared possibly a real thing.

So if it's not manmade, who made You know, that's the problem.

That's the real problem.

Came up one of the best there is, I saw was some kind of electrica coming down from the sky and into the crop.

I don't know, I have no answers.

But it's a curious thing to stud It's interesting, you know, you don't know what you will fin Well, I understand that a lot of circles started appearing in Eng in rural England and they like, several of them t and that's been kind of like the I guess for crop circles for yea You don't hear anything much any in the United States, but Englan always had them there are a lot circle makers there.

Okay.

And even they, some of them report seeing balls of light in the fie while they're making them and th something about the underground aquifers there that they think maybe it tracks the electrical v that's the best we can come up w Some people UFOs, but you know.

That's right.

Way off the chart.

Well, you know, this area, there's a place in southern Knox County called Lucky Point.

I had a guest on and he's written a novel called Bug Light Room" where he talks about an alien invasion in the Hoosier National Forest, which I thought was an interesti But then again, I started researching about this and there's a place called Lucky where folks have been seeing some strange sightings there for years.

I think one report of a kind of an animal mutilation up there Strange lights, strange sounds, even some law enforcement officials have notic some strange sightings there.

So are you familiar with Lucky P Well, heard what you heard, you my wife and I went up there and about seven years ago chose to go there.

You know, there's a man up there collected all the data, all the I can't get access to them, but they're out there and we drove out to Lucky Point and it was kind of, we talked to some people out the Like you said, they seen the lights and other t they didn't have anything else t but even Bigfoot, that was suppo That's right, yeah Bigfoot sight and I took a picture.

Well, several while we were up t and off in the distance.

I got home and looked at the pho hmmm I wonder if that's bigfoot it wasn't daytime and I got to l matter of fact went up the next day to make sure it was a bigfoot.

Well, it was still there, so ended up being a black dark bush, that looked like a bigfoot from far a distance.

So I was interested.

But now Lucky Point is, is it of the White River?

Is that right?

Kind of east of Vincennes and the Monroe City area.

Okay.

And I understand it was called L because the Native Americans up there was a good hunting ground.

Yeah.

I guess then the animals would c and they'd wait for them and har There was an area that was easier to trave and the Indians learned that there here comes the deer and whatever was up there to hunt crossing that good spot.

So, yeah.

Now Brian Spangler, he's a Knox County historian.

He was with the Knox County Libr for years.

I talked to him about Lucky Poin and we shared some great stories That's one of those other myster that we really don't know what h That got me started Skinwalker R Have you heard about that?

Oh yeah, on the Skinwalker Ranch I've found a good program I stayed up to late last night it was on the History Channel, on streaming on the computer and it's very interesting , a bunch of scientists out ther and that got my attention too, a Now we're talking to Charlie Kie He's an educator, photographer, has an interest in astronomy, a lot going on in Charlie's worl Now let's learn more about Charl Are you a native of Gibson Count Charlie?

Yeah, my whole life.

Actually, I did live in northern Vanderbur County for a while, first couple Well that's pretty close.

Yeah, that's pretty close to the line.

But anyway also, you know my whole life in Gibson What's your family do?

My dad was he worked at Whirlpoo He grew up on a farm and he saw the 1925 Tornado.

He was walking home about a mile of Haubstadt and he looked up there and he saw it walking home.

He never did find out what was a funnel or, you know, what he saw, but he saw that in 1925.

That's what got me interested.

Walking home from school?

Yeah, he was walking about a mil had a little, little farm west of Haubstadt and he saw whi he walked home from school.

Wow.

Off towards, probably towards Owensville, so pretty fa but he saw it.

Now we're going to talk about th Tornado a little bit later.

Now, where did you go to school, Uh, Haubstadt High School.

30 people in my class.

30 people Small class.

Now, what was that?

Was it the elites?

Yeah, Haubstadt Elites.

Now what did that nickname mean?

I have no idea.

But yeah, had quite a class.

Had two people in that class became fighter pilots.

Really?

One of them served, well I guess they both served in So there's a lot of teachers cam of the class and a lot of good p Now, where did you go to college Oakland City College at the time I graduated in 68' and started teaching at Vincenne that same year, so been a teacher about 50 years Thirty-nine in a junior high all elementary science and socia and ten years at Oakland City Un as an adjunct history instructor Now, what school did you teach i Vincennes?

What school?

Taught up there five years at Saint John the Bap At that time I've run into a lot of my old st I don't recognize them.

Oh, sure.

But somewhow they still remember You remember your teachers of course.

Yeah.

I guess I look close enough, but what I used to.

But yeah, I'm run into a number there.

That's nice.

But you don't know who you're ta Sure.

Yeah.

Now your, when you were adjunct teacher at Oakland City Universi what history classes did you tea Mostly freshmen classes.

World history, US History that was basically it.

Yeah, for ten years.

Now, also, have you always been nerd Charlie?

Well, I don't know how I got int but it's kind of like Peter Toth We'll talk about him maybe later Oh, the sculptor?

Yes.

He came over here as an immigrant from Hungary.

When the Russians came, the comm came in and took his dad's farm and he did the same thing I did, about my age.

And well, John F Kennedy, you kn not what the country can do for but what you can do for your cou So I thought, well, I can't be p so maybe I'll try to being a tea So that's how.

Now Peter Toth, of course he did all these Native American sculpt We're going to talk about that to a little bit later.

So we're kind of getting ahead of ourselves.

We're going to stick with Gibson right now.

Of course, Gibson County, a lot of history Definitely a lot of history.

I know I've done some research on the Lyle Station area.

Of course, that was the African-American co They had a, had quite a communit They had even had a railroad dep Of course amazing.

Active school, businesses, and now they have that great museum there at Lyle and you got to check it out.

Now, your home base right now is the Princeton Library.

So tell me about the Princeton Library, Charlie.

Well, that's it, I got a semi re job, a part time work at the lib and they've got a $4.5 million r it's a beautiful library.

They've got a computer lab room, they've got rooms that are very that you can rent and have whate you want, birthday parties or wh You can make three rooms or you in the dividers and get a big hu They've got a lunch preparation area with icebox and So it's very nice, uh, a lot of activities going on and one of them is my programs t you know, about three times a mo I do the same one hour program.

Uh, powerpoint program on whatever topic I choose.

That's what's nice.

Yeah.

So you pick out, you pick your o That's nice.

And you try to pick the more the kind of the more bizarre uns Sometimes I stumble into them, you know, and I like that stuff, Oh, sure.

There's no answer, you know, it's just interesting and you don't know what you'll f when you do the research.

So you get a lot of feedback fro the people that come to these le Um, yeah, one of them I told about Toth, that was one of my p about all the sculptures he done around the world, around the cou about 75 of them or 74.

And she got very interested, she went up to Vincennes and got a picture of that one.

Then we're going to make a trip so she looked up the statue in I So she was very enthused about h People were amazed that he could with a hammer and chisel.

I know it, it is amazing and ama Of course, genealogy is a is a big thing at all libraries the People are have a great interest now in their in their family tre Have you been able to trace your tree?

Charlie Kiesel?

I didn't really do much.

My aunt, my dad's sister, she wa and she really got in checking out the family history.

So I don't have to do anything.

She did all of it.

Did all the background work for I got it at home, but I couldn't tell you much.

You know, I've got a copy of it.

So is your family been in this in Southwestern Indiana a long t Uh, that I'm not sure of.

Some of them came from Germany in the backgro uh, I'm not really.

Been a farming community?

A farm It was a farming group and I use my cousin's and when they were a my first cousins, they were spea German at home, you know, pretty Uh, you know, not too long ago.

Well, now we've talked about Cha diagnosis of spasmodic dysphonia voice disorder.

That hasn't stopped him though, from making the lecture circuit on a wide range of topics from crop circles to historic st So let's talk about the deadlies tornado rampage in U.S. history.

It tore through the Tri-State in March of 1925.

The twister first touched down in southeastern Missouri.

It raced through southern Illino crossing the Wabash River, final dissipating near Petersburg, Indiana, 219 mile path covering three states, 13 c with a total death toll of 695.

I think that's still a record for a single tornado.

At one point, the storm traveled at a speed of 73 miles per hour.

The tornado lasted about three and a half hours with an average path of destruct three quarters of a mile.

Charlie, some incredible devasta You told me of that your, your f who was a youngster at the time, coming home from school when he saw something in the air Yeah, his farm, he grew up a farm and that was about a mile and a half west of and he had to walk to school.

So he was walking home out in th looked up and he saw the tornado I never did get the idea of how much he saw.

It was a way off in the distance it was wide or what, but he remembered that.

So that's how I got interested in the Tri-State tornado.

I still have this vision of The Oz now.

Yeah, I mean, he was way away fr Probably, I don't know, three miles from i two or three miles, but he remem Was there damage to his home?

No, it was on beyond west.

Reall He lucked out.

You know, it was way beyond hid, but he could see it in the dista and that's how I got started.

Oh, well, I mean, of course, the Gibson County wasn't spared from the damage from this tornad and I know you've posted some pictures too, of some of the devastation.

I know Owensville took a hit, of Griffin, Indiana took a major hi Princeton also had some damage.

Yeah, mostly out of southend of Princeton and I t total was 45 people died.

Really Because the tornado, so it ended a little bit towards Peter You know, it lifted up after it Princeton.

But, you know, there were 45 people killed in the Princeton a And I, I did some research there were winds.

They estimate winds exceeded 300 miles per hour.

Yeah.

That's just unbelievable.

Yeah it might have been up to.

Well, some times I'd have three funnels coming ou so that could have caused damage maybe up to three miles.

Oh, yeah.

When all of them were there toge but basically a mile and a half it's the most deadly in our coun It still holds the record for Longest path on the ground.

Yeah, that's just incredible.

It is in the world believe it or it's the second deadliest in the They have tornadoes in Banglades and from what I understand, there were about 1,200 people ki during one of those tornados, no warning, you know, crowded co Sure, oh yeah.

About 1,200 people, but in the U States, that's by far the most d Of course, in 1925, there were no early warnings like we have n Now we, we get several days in a that we know a system is approac and to be prepared and have a plan and action.

But did I tell you about Lincoln not Lincoln, but Lindbergh?

No yeah, what's the Charles Lindbergh connection to that?

Just gotten, he just gotten out school down in Texas and was back in St. Louis and I think he joined the National G But just did you know, what he could find to Well, the newspapers back then were very competitive and they wanted to get people in to get pictures in Murphysboro and I think it was the Chicago T got him to fly the glass plates.

You know, they've had negatives then were glass plates.

They had the photographer down t rushed him down and they had a L pick to take them to Chicago to have them developed.

Pictures of the damage?

Of the damage and he picked him There was a guy waiting for him or was supposed to and he picked the plates, a big stack of them and hopped in his plane.

I bet you it was pretty cold, you know, open airplane.

And headed to Chicago he had bod when they got up there, make sure the plates didn't get Well, it turns out when the guy that developed them said there wasn't thing on any o some other newspaper apparently got in there caused a so they didn't get the pictures.

That was interesting.

So but of course, Charles Lindbe went on to become an internation Maybe that's why he took his fli International hero, flying the s of Saint Louis, crossing the Atl Charles Lindbergh, though, had some of his other moments that he probably like to have fo in his career.

That was interestingly, also had a, I think it was the Hearst new Anyways, someone got a plane to fly over area of Murphysboro and the Jackson County, Missouri, no Illinois.

They had a DVD that you could bu that shows the flight, course he's going on 90 miles an hour, you can't see So there is video of the damage and there was, don't want interr there to much, but there was als where there was a school, got sent up to the Murphysboro a A DeSoto school, I think it was.

It might have been that too.

But anyway, they had a lot of pr with the plaster.

You know when a building came do some of the kids couldn't hear because the plaster got in their Oh my gosh.

and then the water almost like, getting a plaster cast of your e Yeah, there were 234 deaths in Murphysboro, Illinois.

I think that was that was the ki of the epicenter for the fatalit Yeah.

And there were 33 deaths at this DeSoto School.

So just an incredible tragedy in the mid 1920s.

Wow now, now to a totally different topic We talked about Peter Wolf Toth "The Whispering Giants".

This is his tribute to the Nativ Americans.

Wooden sculptures created, like you said, a hammer and a ch and get in and out of wood.

And there's one in Vincennes carved out of black oak.

It's a depiction of Tecumseh and that's quite, a quite an ach and it's right here in our backy You know, he is quite an interesting perso I've talked to him a number of t and he'll talk to anybody, you k because we've been used to touring the country.

He was just an outgoing person.

But the one in Vincennes was about 23 feet tall and it's a hammer and chisel to get those out of the logs that are donated or how, you kno it doesn't cut down trees.

And, you know, they have some that were availab it's a 98, 90% of them are done with hammer and chisel and then it takes sander and kind of smooths everything o You know, after he gets done wit the chisel, leave it a little bi So and then he's done some, one of the logs he got about 40,000 pounds some of these were very big, you know, carvings; Almost unbel So that is what I missed in my o in Vincennes without looking at that statue.

I just stumbled onto it.

One is older then George Roger Clark Memorial They said," You just missed him.

Well, shoot, I'll call him.

So I called him up and we had a nice, long conversa Matter of fact, I think he was i in trying to get people to go do to the Amazon.

He wants to draw, he wants to ca in the middle of the Amazon.

A statue of an angel holding a c Really?

And he was trying to get people to go with him.

Oh, my gosh.

There's no way I could do that, it's a very nice town, two milli right along the Amazon, you know in the middle of the Amazon Rain And that would be a interesting but I think it might take him two or three months.

There's no way I could go down t for two or three months, but looks like it's a very safe Two million people, you wouldn't think of that.

But, I think he was trying to get me to go with him and I said "No, thanks, I can't Now, he has statues of Native Am I believe in every state also in He has in Canada and he did one Stephen, in his home country.

He's a Hungarian native.

Yeah.

Maybe that's why he got interest in Native Americans.

Cause he was, you know, native H and he left there when the communists came and took over his farm.

So they escaped and came to Amer He was in Akron, Ohio for a whil Uh, went to college, did a little bit of psychology and he learned most of art from watching him, but busy all the t Mm hmm.

Of course, when the his native land was tak Of course, maybe I guess he can relate to the Native America losing their land too.

He was kind of a historian, he a knew about that before he left H Mm hmm.

And now Tecumseh, of course, the in Vincennes, a charismatic figu definitely a poet, of course, a He negotiated with William Henry Harrison in Vincennes, revered figure, also in Canada.

I believe they have many statues to Tecumseh as well, because he fought on the side with the British in, in 1812 to protect Indian, Indian lands.

So but a very interesting guy.

And there's a, there's a poem.

And if you don't mind, I'm going can I read this poem?

I think this inspired Peter Toth to do this this statue.

And this is written by Tecumseh it it's called, "Live Your Life" And here are a few stanzas from and it just really is amazing.

Okay, I'll read this.

"So live your life that the fear can never enter your heart.

Trouble no one about their relig respect others in their view, and demand that they respect you Love your life, perfect your life, beautify all things in your life.

Seek to make your life long and purpose in the service of your p Prepare a noble death song for the day you go over the grea The words of Tecumseh, "The Great Shawnee Chief".

Yeah, very nice.

Mm hmm.

Now, during the war of 1812, we mentioned Tecumseh and his followers did join the B to fight the United States and he was killed in the Battle in Canada in 1813.

Wow!

Quite a story.

So did you do much research on T Uh, I did most of it on Toth.

And learned about Tecumseh.

That's where, that's where I sta you know, of him.

So Toth is amazing with the stuf he's done and he's very much in the honori the Indian culture.

Uh, many of his statues in the e governors of the state would com and be there at the dedication.

He was, you know, big name in the eighties.

I didn't know about him, but I found out a lot about him.

He's got a book called "Indian G he got several and it's very wel He travel the country in a winne and he got to meet a lot of peop Sure.

He did those statues for nothing ; didn't charge anything.

Some of them today, there's one in North Carolina.

Uh, worth about $1,000,000, estimated value.

And some of the others are a qua million dollars appraised value, if you could find anybody to buy You know, its kind of like stamp you know, or artwork.

But his artwork is worth some mo Now, does he ,you said he had statues in ever Do you know where the statue is in Kentucky?

They got one in Paducah.

He asked around and repair a lot because of damage from wind and But Paducah had a statue that he Okay.

In Illinois?

you know where in Illinois?

That I don't know.

We'll have to research that.

Yea I mean, there's it's hard to kee you know.

I mean, you could make a tour of all the states look for Peter Yeah.

Excuse there we go.

It was amazing too, I didn't kno I never heard the name Toth befo Yeah T-O-T-H right?

Yeah!

And there was a yard sale at Ft.

Branch, it was a citywide yard s And I didn't have many people threw my stuff out on the drivew real quickly, but I had a couple walk up of all names, Toth you know, I never heard that nam around here before.

And he chose my driveway to come I thought that was a nice coinci Now, before we forget, who is Do She is a artist; her and her husband in V Indiana.

He's got watercolors and he also charcoal ; I think she did, too.

And they, Park Service in Vincennes, is giving those out about Tecums I might take that over to the Tecumseh High School, junior high school around Lynnvi To see if they got that.

But I thought was a very good ar and he has got about 11,000 wate in that kind of drawing he's put in Vincennes Community Found Give it to them and he's not in very good health and his wife died a couple of ye But that's how I got interested you know.

And Donna, did she contact Peter Toth then?

She was the one who was instrumental in getting him to come to Vincen Yes, he did.

Well, that's great.

That's a gre Now, we've talked about Charlie' struggle with the voice disorder spasmodic dysphonia, crop circles, the Tornado of 1925, and the whispering giant sculptu Hungarian born artist Peter Wolf Toth, whose black oak carving of is now on display in Vincennes.

Where in Vincennes, Charlie?

I've got a river walk up there; It's pretty close to The Old Fre within a block of that and they've got a river walk tha at the George Rogers Clark Bridg to the east and at the end of th they got the statue.

So that's where you can check it out for u If you go all the way in on Hard you can miss it just go all through town.

Okay, good.

Now we look back to the 1925, to the tornado.

Now there's a marker, I believe in Griffin, Indiana, that names all the victims of the tornado t Yeah!

They got a stone there and they got an area, kind made remembrance of that happening.

They got a little gazebo like and they got a huge panorama on the main street that shows, you know, what the d So it's kind of a nice memorial to the people that died.

Yeah that, that is.

Now, let's go to Chimney Pier Hi Now, where's that at?

Okay.

Oh, close to St Thomas and where Yeah, where is St. Thomas?

It's about eight miles south of Vincennes, about a mile west There's a parish, Catholic paris and I stumbled onto that while I was looking at some curious, about something else.

And there was a page in the 1905 Newspaper.

1905!

1905.

Sun commercial?

It was.

Other commercial or what Close to that, you know.

Or The You know, they changed the names a few times, but anyway I found and almost a whole page intervie two people that lived in the St. Thomas area and they talked abou kind of a chimney rock kind info Like, kind of like jug rock, you know, unusual formations.

Yeah.

This is at Chimney Pier or just like a chimney, it was o of a hill, Chimney Pier Hills.

It was on the north end of that last hidden figure a people in the area have past that story down, it was no longer there.

Indians according to that newspaper article, it made steps so that you could climb up to th and use it as an observation are Mhmmm.

There are all kinds of rumors ab being found there.

There was something called, bull because of flat rock, supposed to have holes in it that maybe it was poured into to make bullets.

I can't imagine Indians being too interested in bullets, they probably would rather have bow and arrows.

But anyway, I don't know if that what was used for, but it was a about five times as big as this and I didn't see any holes in it But there was the case or jug ro at the bottom of jug rock, it's got a bunch of holes in it.

And what they are though used to marble size quartz crystals that would fall out whenever the sandstone eroded.

So thought that might have been what was that bullet rock had not been used to make bullet but they did find some lead in t so the lead would have come probably from the glaciers carry So I don't know about that part, but anyway it looks like if you stand in the backyard of Saint Thomas Church and look out towards the hills, that's would be standing on the brow of the hill So the rock is no longer there?

It's no longer there.

It disappeared the guy gave the interview said it just disappear He didn't know how.

Well how large a rock was it to It was a chimney, kind of like a Right.

Best I can figure it was about 3 feet tall, maybe six, eight feet And the story goes, I found in t books, of course, you can always go all out either said it was blown up exploded to use stone to make a Okay.

But and that to me, I'm not much of a scientist, but to sandstone that has eroded away would be very good, you kno permeable water can't soak throu as well as some other sandstone.

Then I found by accident I was looking for Indian mounds and I came across one about thre east of Chimney Pier.

I stop and talk to the guy and h ,"No that's not an Indian mound" They built a well cistern out of sandstone.

So it got me thinking.

Is that where the sandstone ende to make that well, that cistern?

And what, what they did is they started on a flat surface, they put the sandstone down, then they built around the sands like brick and they kept going up and then they piled dirt against So you kind of build it up as yo ridden over it.

You didn't have to get in it to You could build it from the outs and then just build the dirt up So end up with a mound with a cistern built into it.

And in the spring they would pum into it from the river using a w And then in the summer, well, th there was an archer there after the Civil War, sometime between the Civil War i that's what the owner told me they built this and in the summe they would use that same windmil to pump water out into the field during the dry season.

You know, a lot of places up there irrigat and they will pump water out of that cistern and use it t So that may solve the mystery of the missing rock we all know.

Well, it was blown up apparently and it was all kinds, not much on it, I contacted the Geological Socie a different university nobody knew anything about it.

W But the people locally knew the you know, because it had been pa That's great.

That's great.

Now, you're an advocate, avid photographer.

You take shots of wildlife and of course the heavens and you really get excited when a comet slicing through the nigh especially the Hale-Bopp comet.

You know, I got interested in th I heard stories about, about 191 about the comet, Halley's Comet and I always want to see that; I hope could see one in my lifet Well, two years in a row or two Hale-Bopp and Hyakutake, beautiful, long tails beautiful.

And Hale-Bopp, I could go out there probably about four or five months, but e it was a little different, start just like a little fuzzy star.

It's gets different every night I would get up every evening or when it was out there.

Whether it was good, I'll go out there and take pictu Spent $230, I think, having film developed.

So I spent a lot of money.

And you have a special device on your camera?

Well, the best one I took, most of them were 15 second expo And I had a equatorial mount took the telescope part of and built my own mount to put my camera on.

Then I bought a $110 electric gear machine that would turn.

Okay.

Turn the camera as evening moved you know, the stars, they get bl because earth is rotating and I got a five minute exposure and that was a pretty good one.

I had, it was a beautiful comet.

I got it on Facebook, not on Fac I got on YouTube.

I got 10,000 people look at the little video I made, you know, I took a picture and turn them into a video.

Well, that was interesting.

I love that comet.

And it was a nice answer to my p You know, I got to say two beautiful comet Now, you're what, late wife Jan.

I know she shared a lot of your with you.

You know where she was a spark t She really got things going fore She liked to do everything skydiving, you know all that and we went up to Lucky Point togeth She was already sick already.

And so we just had fun doing all this stuff.

What did she do for a living?

Oh, she was a teacher.

She graduated from UE, taught at Had a chemistry biology degree, got a real estate brokers license really liked tha because she loves people.

And I actually put a book togeth she wrote a little thing about h and she had things, some were strange, really strang I mean, we always have lights go off in the parking lot, but that could be your head headlights doing that.

But she wrote all the stuff down and one time she worked a summer retirement job as a greeter at Wal-Mart.

You couldn't find a better greet she loved, beautiful smile.

And anyway, one day she's out th and she looked out the door.

She thought she was somebody com that she knew, they came in It was the person she thought it It wasn't a minute later that pe in that she'd been thinking abou She had unusual things like that So she liked the maybe the paranormal as well?

Well, it's interesting.

You know, she was interested in that.

Yeah So we're going to talk now about Charlie Keisel's bucket li What do you still want to do, Ch What are you still interested in?

I don't know.

Whatever comes around?

My soul and inspiration is gone, find something about stumble on It's interesting, I watched.

I told you earlier I watched Ski on the History Channel, that may solved a lot of problem they can figure out what's going I mean, you know something, peop Oh, I told you about might old s Did you see that picture of the Big ball out the car window?

No.

Anyway, I'll see where I can find that.

But anyway, I saw something goin crop circles or whatever it may be only natural, but we d what causes certain things.

Like people, you know, seeing balls of light and that kind of thing and my wi was one of things we participated in together and you can make of it what you You know, we were driving down Highway, Highway 41 south of Dar And about we're Old Ft., Old 57, used to come in and we looked up and my wife say 12 noon".

Clouds, medium high clouds, you know, it was cloudy, but not Really bright outside.

She looked up the road and said, That plane is going to hit us."

It looked like the landing light on a plane and kept coming towards us.

It's going to hit us.

And the next thing I knew I was watching my driving I was 60 mile an hour, watched my driv Next thing I knew, Iooked out the window, there was a beautiful blue white ball of light and it was swirling on a surface like you put oil and water that was swirling on that surfac I don't know what it was, had no In broad daylight.

Yes, it was noon and it was traveling with me or I couldn't have seen the deta so why it traveled to the car unless it was magnetic, it didn't do anything to the eng didn't do anything to the radio, it was right outside my car wind Well, how long do the last?

I don't know, ten seconds at the But my wife, she was more worried about it hi Sure.

She must of followed it all the way in and it kind of di But it's over here on my side.

I looked out the window.

There it was and it was blue, white, beautiful blue, white col And it maybe be on my flash driv I gave you.

I might be on there, but it, there was a guy passed me.

I was nothing on the news so me are the only ones who saw it.

And that happens a lot of times you know, different cases.

But guy who passed me in a picku and you know I looked over him I like, "Do you see that?"

He was just going down the road.

Oh, my gosh.

Oh, I mean, that's you can take for what it's worth to you.

But it happened.

I don't know why or how, it may just been a mental thing Jan and me and whatever that lig and might have been a plasma or electrical thing, had no clue That's why I can kind of underst who see things and nobody believ you know, because I've seen it.

Well, yeah, you talk to people and they have these incredible stories and people kind of, well I don't know.

But to them, I mean, it happened.

It's real.

It's a it's a memory and something happened.

You don't know what happened?.

Don't know if it was psychologic Somewhat of a crop circle expert the Netherlands.

I consider that story I just tol and she thought well you know reaching a higher level of consc I don't know.

I can't claim nothing for anythi So is there any place you want t any bizarre site or are you?

I may go back to Lucky Point, there's suppose to have a museum.

Kerry Dean, I think he used to be a meteorol at an Evansville station somewhe Kerry Dean.

Mm hmm.

I've heard that name, yeah.

Yeah, been years ago, but he supposedly has, It was a It was a, not a crop circle, but a UFO investigating group and he's got a lot of reports of gave him in that area.

There's suppose to have on file So I'd like to get a hold of those, but they got a Blue Jean Community Center or foundation, I've calle and I can't get a hold of them.

Maybe they disappeared, but anyway I may go back up there so So now you continue your, your lecture series.

I know Princeton Library.

You do a lot there.

So what are some of your lecture Well, I've got a whole list: Pet some of our vacations we went up to New England, old history places like Lexingto and Concord, that kind of thing.

I do that one.

What else was done here?

Peter Toth, I really got into th and the one in Vincennes, I may do these other places.

The one in Vincennes, I had 30 people at two separate One at the Knox County Library.

One at the Perry Center where I used to teach and I had 15 people come to each Some of them live out in that ar because I had heard it from thei or grandparents.

So that was interesting to have that many people show up So I don't, what else do I got o Oh, owls, eagles and harriers.

Those pictures of, all the, I never knew there were owls aro As you go photograph, I found that out last year.

And you've seen bald eagles arou haven't you?

There's a lot of them around the Duke Energy Power Plant, but there's another one up there that is kind of controv Jefferson Davis's boulder.

Have you heard that?

Jefferson Davis's.

Boulder.

Boulder.

Yeah, okay, supposedly Zachary's Taylor's daughter and Jefferson Davis fel And remember Zachary Taylor, he became president of the North and Jefferson Davis president of the South, that was Mhmmm.

There were a lot of rumors that they used to at a certain location, you know, maybe out in the woods or something out of stone or a h And that would kind of be the re point to meet with each other.

And that pretty well been debunk that rock got kicked around all of Vincennes.

It was out Fort Knox too, it's been in people's yards and had the connections with it.

It is now at the old French hous it actually at one time they thought it was a meteor, bu it was a boulder made of granite It came down with the glaciers, which is unusual, in itself to find one of those, you know.

But anyway, supposedly they rendezvous at that location And so what was Jack, Zachary Ta Daughter.

Daughter and Jefferson Davis's?

Well those two.

Yeah.

Yeah, Jefferson Davis had.

What were they doing in the Vinc area?

Well, Fort.

Knox.

Well, that's not the problem.

She was born there.

Her middle name was Knox.

Sara Knox Taylor.

Okay.

Then her dad got transfer way up north in Wisconsin and Jefferson Davis ended up in Loui but they still wanted to meet, according to the article I read in the newspaper article and all articles talked about, it was to She was too young for them to have a relationship at that t So, found out this article was w a prominent banker in Vincennes It was published in Fort Lauderdale by a reputable reporter and they apparently rendezvous in Vi She apparently maybe had some friends there when she was and babysat for her and that's how they would meet.

And that was their rendezvous at this rock?

Yeah.

That was the story.

Okay.

Well, that's another one o It was not a very comfortable looking rock but, yeah, they could of just sit there and But it's, nobody knows where it' Yeah, it's at the old French hou Most of the historians in Vincen they don't think it happened.

You know, but I found that an interesting Well, Charlie, this has been a l exploring all these, these maybe myths, who knows if they're true or not, but what So keep doing what you've been d bringing us stories that educate and delight us and asking us for more and more.

Charlie Kiesel, thanks for being Okay, thank you for inviting me.

I'm David James and this is Two Main Street, presented by Jeffre of Berger Wealth Services at Baird Private Wealth Management.