Narrator: Presentation of Idaho Reports on Idaho Public Television is made possible through the generous support of the Laura Moore Cunningham Foundation, committed to fulfilling the Moore and Bettis family legacy of building the great state of Idaho.

By the Friends of Idaho Public Television and by the Corporation for Public Broadcasting.

Melissa Davlin: When we call 911, we expect dispatch to answer and first responders to arrive in a timely manner.

But what happens when sheriff's offices can't hire enough people to fill those basic roles?

It's our last show of the season and it's a good one.

I'm Melissa Davlin, Idaho Reports starts now.

Hello and welcome to Idaho Reports.

This week, Canyon County Sheriff Kieran Donahue joins us to discuss challenges sheriffs are facing in recruiting and retaining deputies and how that affects public safety.

Then, Senator Ben Adams, Representative Julie Yamamoto, and House Minority Leader Ilana Rubel join me to discuss what lawmakers are working on in coming months.

But first, let's get you caught up on the week.

On Thursday, the US Supreme Court released an opinion in favor of an Idaho couple who built a home on wetlands in Priest Lake without a permit.

In a decision with far reaching consequences on how the Environmental Protection Agency can regulate water in the United States, the majority ruled that wetlands require a continuous surface connection between the wetland and another federally regulated body of water to fall under the scope of the Clean Water Act.

In other words, it limits the type of water bodies the federal agency can regulate.

Idaho Congressmen Mike Simpson and Russ Fulcher praised the ruling with Fulcher calling it a powerful affirmation of property rights.

And Simpson saying, quote, This decision is a victory for Idaho and the many property owners, farmers and ranchers who are left to deal with the very real consequences of regulatory uncertainty.

We have much more online on the ruling.

Find the link to our coverage at IdahoReports.org Earlier this month, former Clark County Sheriff John Clements sued Clark County and its commissioners under the Fair Labor Standards Act, alleging he was the only officer in the county to cover law enforcement duties 24 hours a day, seven days a week for three months after his only two deputies resigned.

Clements alleges the county refused to hire a new deputy or let him contract with other agencies for help while a new hire received training and that the employee shortage caused him to collapse twice on the job due to exhaustion and resulted in hospitalization.

The Post Register reports that Clark County has long struggled with employment issues.

The county has not yet filed a response to the lawsuit.

Idaho Reports has reached out for comment and has not yet heard back from Clark County.

On Friday, I sat down with Canyon County Sheriff Kieran Donahue to discuss hiring issues county sheriffs are facing and some potential solutions to those problems.

Sheriff Donahue, thanks so much for joining us.

Through your role in the Sheriffs Association, were you aware of the issues that Clark County was facing, recruiting and retaining deputies?

Sheriff Kieran Donahue: Yeah, it's pretty well known, it's common knowledge really, especially our rural communities, rural counties.

So as as a board member for that or Sheriff Association, of course, that information does come to me as well as the other board members, maybe a little bit more than others.

And the fact is it's it's real detrimental to of course that community in that that jurisdiction.

And you see other sheriffs stepping in to assist as much as they can.

But at the same time, they have their jurisdiction to to operate and to take care of.

And then when you look at the jail situations, you know, there's literally no jail at this time in terms of accommodating.

So you had to move those people to to another jurisdiction.

Melissa Davlin: So which also takes hours away from the deputies work day.

Sheriff Donahue: Absolutely.

And, of course, you know, everybody's crowded, right?

Everybody has limitations.

And so you're pushing off into another jurisdiction.

And again, thank God those Sheriff’s are such great colleagues.

But it does.

It does.

There's a strain and the strain with whether it's Idaho State Police or whether it's Jefferson County, Bonneville County, who's taking that overflow, and then, of course, trying to put manpower out there to make sure the citizens are safe.

Again, it's it's a real strain on their counties, but they are good neighbors.

Melissa Davlin: And the issues, recruiting and retaining deputies, that's not unique to Clark County.

Sheriff Donahue: Not at all.

It's it's it's wide, widespread, especially especially across the rural counties, but really counties like ours.

I mean, we're the second largest county in the state and everybody has the same problem.

And that's that's not just that just doesn't happen yesterday.

That's been happening for some time.

And so there's lots of factors that enter into that.

And it's how we are addressing that as as a law enforcement profession.

You know, we're meeting today with the Idaho Criminal Justice Commission to talk about that issue.

So it's very widespread and it's something that we absolutely have to address because the profession needs people to come in.

The profession also needs people to stay in that profession.

And, you know, we have very hard and harsh background, you know, evaluations.

And so really less than 1% of the people that apply even get in.

It’s cause, and that's appropriate, right?

We're going to really scrutinize who we let into this profession because they have to be the right people.

There's always that bad actor that gets by.

We know that nationwide, but and even in our own state.

But the fact is so, so few people getting in, that means they’re a quality recruit, and now we want to keep those people.

But first we got to get them in the door.

And if there's not enough money or if there's no housing or many other factors, we're not even going to get them in the door.

Melissa Davlin: You know, and these are issues that affect urban and well, as urban as Idaho gets.

The big counties in Idaho and the rural counties.

But but let's focus on the rural counties for just a second.

What is the what are the challenges that are unique to places like Clark or Owyhee County or Camas County?

Sheriff Donahue: Well, they're rural, number one.

We all love to go visit them.

So we have a lot of people that go out into those areas again on as a as kind of a transient population to go recreate and so on and so forth.

But the real problem is the financial side of it.

Those counties typically do not have the revenue base that a large urban area does, like Canyon County or Ada County or somewhere like that, Bonneville County.

So the resources in terms of financial management are very, very thin.

And so the challenge really becomes how do we how do they whether you're the board of county commissioners or a city council, how do you budget the money appropriately to take care of public safety?

Because public safety has to be the core foundation of any government.

Any government doesn't matter how large or how small.

And so what happens is people say, well, we've got to take care of this.

We got all this going on and the law enforcement suffers, and so they pay lower wages.

And unfortunately, you get what you pay for a lot of times.

And I don't mean that derogatorily, but you do.

So somebody that may not have made the cut in my agency may go work for someone over there and they're going to take them on because they're desperate to get those personnel personnel in there.

That's a detriment from a litigation and liability standpoint, a risk management standpoint.

So I think one of the biggest things is finances.

You.

This is a very dangerous profession.

And we ask a lot of those people.

You mentioned, you know, like Clark County or Camas County or even Custer County, places like that, that your response time is really far and wide to get to where you need to be.

And they have good people.

I'm not I'm not saying that they don't, they have good people, but, the problem is how much are you paying?

Those people have families.

You have the consumer price index.

You have inflation that you deal with that needs to continually, the wages have to reflect that, and they often often don't reflect that.

Then you look at housing, there's another challenge of your rural community.

Where are these people going to live?

What how are they going to afford housing when you have retirees and other people who own secondary homes buy up those properties and inflate that market value, and then you're paying a deputy this incredibly low wage and they simply can't afford to live there.

They simply can't.

Melissa Davlin: AirBNB’s too.

Sheriff Donahue: And AirBNB’s.

Melissa Davlin: The vacation rentals that are an income generator for the people who own them.

But put even more pressure on that housing market.

Sheriff Donahue: They really do.

And so the challenges are extreme for rural counties.

Again, go back to the fact that the revenue base just isn't there, the tax base isn't there.

Melissa Davlin: Now, let's talk a little bit about that, because when we're talking about, you know, some of these rural counties are huge percentages of the land in those counties are owned by the federal government.

And so if we're talking about Custer County, they do get income from the federal government, payment in lieu of taxes.

It's not as much as they would be making if they were taxing.

Sheriff Donahue: Yeah, you're right.

You're right.

Melissa Davlin: And so so what are county commissioners supposed to do when they're worried about rising property taxes, which is something that we have heard over and over again?

Sheriff Donahue: Yeah.

Melissa Davlin: But but they also need to pay for public safety.

Sheriff Donahue: I'll say it again.

The core of any government has to be public safety.

That's the foundational rock that we build on, because if this, if society's not safe, everything else goes to the wayside.

Custer County is a great example.

When when the Thompson Creek Mine was in full force, you had a lot of, you had good economic value up there.

You had a lot of good tax coming that kind of replaced some of the other mining aspect that’s gone away.

They replaced some of the logging that had gone away.

That, those, whether you agree with logging or mining or cattle, the fact is that was that was a revenue base that they could a tax that they could pull from.

And it was a good use of of the our as you say the federal lands.

Right.

There's but when that goes away you have very, very limited industry in a place like that.

So where's that tax going to come from?

And when that and when that tax is so limited.

You're right, those county commissioners.

How do we appropriate the funding to take care of, that’s, even just the highways or the streets or the the everything else, they're responsible for.

Melissa Davlin: Basic infrastructure.

Sheriff Donahue: Basic infrastructure.

Melissa Davlin: Bare Bones, right.

Sheriff Donahue: And then yet we don't have enough to pay law enforcement.

We don't have enough to build a jail to accommodate those who are arrested, who need to go to be held accountable to protect society.

It doesn't matter if you're a small county or a small jail in a very large rural county or a large county jail like mine.

There’s people who need be held accountable and and like us or like them, those people then are back on the streets and the victimization can continue.

I mean, that's just one aspect of it.

It's extreme challenging.

But I the burden is really upon in terms of counties.

The burden is upon the board of county commissioners.

That's that's the job you signed up for.

And it's a very difficult job, not a job that I would want.

I wouldn't want to be a commissioner, but I but so I know the challenges that they have.

You've got to focus on public safety.

So you've got to find the dollars.

And then sometimes you have to cut other things to make sure those dollars are there because you had to have qualified law enforcement with the tools, the equipment that they have to have, you know, like Custer County You know, you're going from Stanley to Mackay, right?

I mean, that's a long response time.

Melissa Davlin: Especially in the winter.

Sheriff Donahue: Right, if you don't have enough officers on the street or on the on the force, that's a long commute to get to that emerging situation or emergency situation.

Melissa Davlin: We've talked a lot about rural counties, but how about Idaho's larger counties, You know, your own county.

You mentioned you have had issues recruiting deputies.

Sheriff Donahue: We are we have had and I can tell you, I can come here today and tell you that we are in the best place we've ever been probably in our history of our county.

And what the what swung that pendulum, we like everyone else, we were having a hard time recruit.

And again, there's a lot of factors, political factors and things that happened for the last, let's say, five or six years that really affected law enforcement.

Good and bad.

Right?

And the bad actors really affected law enforcement in a negative fashion.

And even in our own town.

Melissa Davlin: You’re talking about reputation and public trust.

Sheriff Donahue: The image, the public trust.

When you look at the, again, even Canyon County has that, right?

And so you have to you have to weed those bad actors out.

But in the meantime, society is like, hey, you know, we're really tired of this.

Forgetting that there's just bad actors in every box.

And so we saw that same thing.

But it wasn't so much the bad actors reputation, it was the the wages.

The inconsistency of the wages that we were paying.

Because, again, we're dependent upon those who set the budget, not myself.

And so we can only pay so much.

We were seeing people with 10, 12, 15 years walk out the door.

We've put literally a couple of million dollars into that person by that time when you look at benefits and salaries and training and expertise and going to Nampa, going to Meridian, going to Ada County, going to Boise.

And it’s it was just ridiculous.

It was like we were the training ground because we're a very highly skilled organization.

Melissa Davlin: The farm team.

Sheriff Donahue: Right?

We were the farm team.

It's like but the taxpayer was taking the brunt of it because it's their money.

And so we when I brought in my new chief deputy, they they really started digging even deeper.

They took the deepest dive we've ever taken.

And we we could show by empirical data, by the model that we built, this irrefutable, in the last two years we lost $3 million just in watching people walk out the door and then recruiting new ones and training.

And we we showed that with less than $1,000,000, we can change that.

And so the Board of County Commissioners in the last before they left office, they agreed with us.

They saw that they saw it and they we were able to bring all of our wages up for a gun toters, for commissioned officers, to where we're now at the top of that level.

And there's a few that still outpay us.

But that entry level, and I can tell you now that we are, with the people we have background today, and so in the last six, eight months, we are full.

We went from 25% down to 0%.

That's an amazing statistic.

Melissa Davlin: And it came down to pay.

Sheriff Donahue: It came it comes down to pay.

And then there's always the argument, well, it's not just about money.

No, it's not.

It's about culture.

It's about culture and money.

But as we explained, if you can't afford to put food on the table or pay your rent or your mortgage, then it doesn't matter what the culture is.

This could be the greatest place to work in the world, and I think ours is.

But you can't if you can't afford to work here, you're not going to work here anymore.

If you can't afford to put kids clothes on your kid's back and feed them, you're going to have to go somewhere else.

And that's what we were seeing, people leaving the profession, people who shouldn't be leaving this profession because we need them.

And so we have changed that, that course has been changed dramatically.

We're thrilled.

And what we're doing is we're sharing our model with anyone who wants it, any sheriff's office, any chief of police.

We're showing and we're really giving the credit where it's due to the board of County commissioners as well.

The last sitting board and the new sitting board who took it upon as well.

We're just seeing drastic difference and we're getting recruits, lateral recruits from numerous states.

They're fleeing their own states to come to Idaho.

But they're very qualified personnel.

And of course, we're still recruiting in our state as well.

So we've you have to take those steps as a management, as executive team.

You have to say we've got to dig deeper.

We've got to find the root of this problem.

And we found it and it was was the pay.

And we we didn’t just find it, because we knew it for a long time.

We proved it.

We put it through empirical data, through through analysis that's irrefutable.

And now we're seeing the benefit of that.

And I can tell you, I had deputies before we did this six, eight months ago, living in camp trailers, living in camp trailers, some across the river into Owyhee, because that's where they could afford to put a travel trailer because of the housing market in Canyon County and Treasure Valley.

Think of that.

And now go strap on that gun belt and that badge and you put in your 12 hour shift.

And don't worry about the fact that you're going to come home to a camp trailer every night with three kids.

Melissa Davlin: Well, Canyon County Sheriff Kieran Donahue, thank you so much for joining us.

Sheriff Donahue: You're welcome.

Thank you.

Melissa Davlin: Last week we discussed the surprise announcement from the University of Idaho that it intends to acquire the University of Phoenix.

Next week UI President Scott Green is scheduled to meet with lawmakers about the pending deal.

We'll have coverage of that meeting online.

But joining me to discuss that and other issues legislators are considering over the next few months are representative Julie Yamamoto, House Minority Leader Ilana Rubel, and Senator Ben Adams.

Representative Yamamoto, I want to start with you.

As chairman of the House Education Committee.

What are your thoughts on this planned acquisition?

Rep. Julie Yamamoto: I was I was surprised with everyone else.

But that's what happens when you have nondisclosure agreements.

And but this is what I do know is that I have enough confidence in President Green that he has done his due diligence and he has thought this through.

We've asked them to be creative.

He has been creative.

We ask him to think outside of the box.

He has done exactly that.

But it is a calculated risk.

There are a lot of questions.

They've had those questions answered.

Next week, we'll get our opportunity as legislators to ask and have those answered and then we'll move forward and and we want it to work.

Melissa Davlin: Senator Adams, you sit on the Senate Finance Committee.

What's your take on this planned acquisition?

Sen. Ben Adams: I look forward to hearing a lot from President Green.

You know, I think we all again, you know, we were left mostly well in the dark until this happened.

And so I think we're all just really excited to get more information.

Melissa Davlin: While we're on the topic of education.

What else is on your radar over the next few months?

Rep Yamamoto: Definitely the school funding formula.

And here's an exciting part of it, is that we have our superintendent of schools who is on board and eager to work with Representative Horman, who's our co-chair of JFAC, and Senator Den Hartog, all stakeholders at the table.

This funding formula is it's it's huge and it's Melissa Davlin: Confusing Rep Yamamoto: Confusing.

And I think that their their whole thought is how can we work together?

And we’ve been cobbling this thing together over many years.

How do we simplify and make it more workable, especially since we're going to stick with that ADA, Average Daily Attendance instead of enrollment.

Melissa Davlin: And for folks who aren't familiar, the, the public school funding formula is how the state determines how to dole out the state money to each of the individual schools and districts.

Rep Yamamoto: Right.

And they get even as they can, regardless of what size of the district.

Correct.

Melissa Davlin: Representative Rubel Public education and funding has been such a high priority for your caucus for so long.

What's your take on the reconfiguring of the public school funding formula?

Rep. Ilana Rubel: Yeah, I'm really concerned at what we're seeing now.

And I guess, you know, we could kind of see it coming because of what Representative Yamamoto just mentioned.

When when the $330 million was promised to be put into K-12 education following the work of Reclaim Idaho and the Quality Education Act and all that, I really kept grilling the governor's office and said, you know, promise me this is going to be truly new money and that there's not going to be a shell game here where we see $330 million put in here, but some more snuck out on the back end so that we're not really coming out $330 million ahead.

I don't blame the governor's office for this, but I think, unfortunately, this is kind of where we've ended up.

It's come out lately that now, in fact, there isn't really going to be $330 million new money put in.

It's going to end up being only $215 million new money put in because we're going to lose $115 million by virtue of going back to that average daily attendance.

I think it's really important going forward that we move permanently to an enrollment model.

Schools budget based on how many kids are enrolled in the school.

They don't get to pay a teacher less because a couple kids are home sick for the week.

You know, they have to make their plans based on who told them they're going to be there for the year and to dock the schools essentially pay based on who got sick, who didn't turn up whatever, who went on a longer vacation with their parents or something, really sticks the schools in a pickle.

And we're seeing it result in $150 million shortfall in education funding this year.

So I think that's got to get fixed for good and turn to an enrollment model.

Melissa Davlin: Senator Adams, From the Budget Committee perspective, what are your thoughts?

Sen Adams: I can't speak for the Budget Committee.

I can only speak for myself.

You know, the the discussion on whether we should do enrollment or attendance based is, I think it's still ongoing.

And a couple of years ago, I supported legislation that would make it permanent for enrollment.

So I don't think that's I think that's just something we have to work out between the governor's office and the legislature.

I mean, we the ballot initiative that talked about $330 million, you know, I already had my gripes about not all that money going where I wanted it to go into K-12.

But we also know that money itself is not the only definer of success in education.

That's pretty well established.

You can throw money at a lot of problems.

So I think it's going to I think we're changing the structure of the formula because the previous formula didn't work.

And sometimes change can be a little uncomfortable.

But it's where we have to go.

And so let's go.

Melissa Davlin: Representative Rubel, you know, education aside, what else is on your radar for the coming months?

Rep Rubel: Well, I remain very deeply concerned about the state of health care access in Idaho, which we were already a health care desert.

And then all of these abortion laws started going through and more and more and more laws to throw doctors in prison.

And I think we are going to be you know, we've been the fastest growing state, but I am really concerned about whether we're going to be able to maintain our status as an attractive destination and an attractive place for people to remain.

We have lost the state only had nine fetal maternal medical specialists for those very high risk pregnancies.

We've lost four of them in the last six months because of our abortion laws.

So that's 44% of our maternal medicine specialists gone.

I think it was, what, 73 out of the state's 115 OB-GYNs say they are actively planning to leave the state or retire early because of these laws.

This session, I think there was a total failure to fix anything and it's a huge problem.

Why would a doctor want to practice in a state where they face five years of prison for providing standard medical care, you know, and often saving women who are hemorrhaging miscarrying?

Our laws are so overreaching right now that it's it's a danger to women's lives and it's a danger to the availability of medicine in Idaho.

Melissa Davlin: This is a legislature that on the record has been anti-abortion and for several years, several decades.

Realistically, what are the fixes that you want to see that could make it past this legislature?

Rep Rubel: Well, if we say we value life, I think that should include women's lives.

And right now, the only exception written into Idaho law is where a woman's death is certain.

The standard is it must be necessary to prevent death.

There was a bill proposed that would have allowed abortion where necessary to avoid a high probability of death.

That was ruled out out of hand.

And that was very frustrating to me that women's lives were discounted so much that a high probability of death could not be addressed.

I think we need to have, at the very bare minimum, far, far more generous allowances for women's health and lives.

You know, if a woman's facing permanent paralysis, loss of a body organ, again, you know, 50% chance of death.

I think we absolutely need to be allowing abortions in those circumstances.

And right now, Idaho law as written, does not.

Melissa Davlin: And I do have to mention again that the legislature did not extend the maternal mortality review panel.

Rep Rubel: Which is very interesting that they didn't.

I think we are going to see more women dying under the current situation of our laws.

And I guess someone didn't want committees poking in and keeping track of how many women were going to be dying.

Melissa Davlin: Very, very briefly, Representative Yamamoto, before we move on, do you think that there are any versions of that proposal that would make it through your caucus?

Rep Yamamoto: I do.

And the reason I have some confidence is because I got to talk with Representative Brent Crane just earlier this week and Melissa Davlin: State Affairs chairman.

Rep Yamamoto: Yes.

And he he is not giving up on having the discussions.

And I thought that what was promising is that he's recognizing he's acknowledging that maybe we need to have more medical professionals in the room when we're talking about those things.

So the definitions of things are clearer and that the language is clear enough that those if they feel confident and if we have selected people who the medical community respects and can and trust, then when they can sign off on that legislation, I think we have a much better chance in our caucus of moving it through.

Melissa Davlin: Senator Adams, I know that there's a big bill that you have been working on.

Can you we have less than 2 minutes left.

Can you tell us about it?

Sen Adams: I’ll I'll try and squeeze it in here.

Okay.

So this piece of legislation is called Defend the Guard.

It's a national movement driven by veterans.

And the concept is that the National Guard is the state's militia and Article 1 section of 8 vests war powers war declaring powers into Congress.

But anyone who looks at how the system is running right now knows that the executive branch is is who really declares war.

And Congress uses the War Powers Act to just stamp and roll.

I don't think that you can create legislation or you can you can create a law, whether it's the War Powers Act or the Supremacy clause that allows the federal government to abdicate Congress itself, to abdicate its constitutional requirements.

You know, we have the National Guard has a handful of requirements that they that their mission is to repel invasion, suppress insurrection and enforce the laws of the union.

You can't do any of those in Syria.

You can't do any of those in Germany or Ukraine or anywhere except the United States.

Unless Congress has declared war and they can activate the guard.

We haven't done that since World War Two.

And this.

I'll just leave it at that, because this this piece of legislation is going to be coming in the Senate.

It's gained a lot of support and it is grassroots.

This is this is from the folks that have gone over there, have done this country's bidding, and have come back and said it didn't feel right.

It didn't feel just.

There was a process that was missing there.

Melissa Davlin: And we're going to have to leave it there, but we will continue to follow this issue.

All three of you, thank you so much for joining us.

And thank you for watching.

It's our final episode of the season, but as always, we'll continue to report online over the summer.

Presentation of Idaho Reports on Idaho Public Television is made possible through the generous support of the Laura Moore Cunningham Foundation, committed to fulfilling the Moore and Bettis family legacy of building the great state of Idaho.

By the Friends of Idaho Public Television and by the Corporation for Public Broadcasting.