>> FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS PROVIDED BY   VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

>> Lou: THIS WEEK ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS, WALKING THE  FINE LINE.

U.S. ATTORNEY ALEXANDER  UBALLEZ IS TRYING TO EXPLAIN HOW HE IS TRYING TO ENSURE  PUBLIC TRUST WITHOUT SPOILING HIS INVESTIGATION  INTO ALLEGATIONS OF CORRUPTION WITHIN THE  ALBUQUERQUE POLICE DEPARTMENT'S DWI UNIT.

>> Uballez: THERE IS AN INTEREST FOR THE PUBLIC TO  KNOW BROADLY WHAT THEIR JUSTICE DEPARTMENT IS DOING,  KNOW THAT WE ARE DOING THE JOB AND NOT ASLEEP AT THE  WHEEL AND KNOW THAT IT IS FUNCTIONING CORRECTLY.

>> Lou: AND BRINGING BACK THE PACK.

THE OUR LAND TEAM TAGS ALONG WITH FEDERAL AND STATE  BIOLOGISTS AND VETERINARIANS DURING THE U.S.

FISH AND  WILDLIFE SERVICES ANNUAL MEXICAN WOLF COUNT.

NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS STARTS NOW.

THANKS FOR JOINING US THIS WEEK.

I AM SENIOR PRODUCER LOU DIVIZIO.

A JURY HAS FOUND HANNAH GUTIERREZ REED GUILTY OF  INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER IN THE SHOOTING DEATH OF  CINEMATOGRAPHER HALYNA HUTCHINS.

THE VERDICT FOR THE RUST FILM SET ARMORER CAME DOWN  WEDNESDAY AFTER JUST FEW HOURS OF DELIBERATION.

WE'LL HAVE MORE DETAILS COMING UP AT THE END OF THE  SHOW.

AT THE BOTTOM OF THE HOUR,  OUR LANDS' LAURA PASKUS TAKES US TO APACHE CHEEK TO  GIVE US THE LATEST NUMBERS ON MEXICAN WOLVES AND SHOWS  EXACTLY HOW BIOLOGISTS COLLECT THE INFORMATION THEY  NEED TO PROTECT AND MONITOR THE ENDANGERED SPECIES.

AS THE LARGEST WILDFIRE IN TEXAS HISTORY CONTINUES TO  BURN, WE HAVE AN UPDATE ON NEW MEXICO'S LARGEST EVER  FIRE AND THE PEOPLE IMPACTED.

IN 2022, THE HERMIT'S PEAK CALF CANYON FIRE INCINERATED  NEARLY 350,000 ACRES IN NORTHERN NEW MEXICO.

AND PEOPLE WHO LIVED ON THAT LAND ARE STILL WAITING FOR  FEDERAL ASSISTANCE.

IN A LITTLE OVER 15 MINUTES JOURNALIST PATRICK LOHMANN  FROM SOURCE NEW MEXICO SPEAKS WITH TWO OF THE  SURVIVORS TO CHECK IN ON THE SUPPORT THEY HAVE RECEIVED  AND WHAT THEY ARE STILL WAITING ON.

BUT WE BEGIN TONIGHT WITH THE FIRST OF A TWO-PART  CONVERSATION YOU'LL ONLY SEE ON NMPBS BETWEEN EXECUTIVE  PRODUCER JEFF PROCTOR AND ALEXANDER UBALLEZ, U.S.  ATTORNEY FOR THE DISTRICT OF NEW MEXICO.

THE BROAD FRAME OF THIS DISCUSSION IS THE ONGOING  FEDERAL INVESTIGATION INTO AN ALLEGED SCHEME THAT SAW  ALBUQUERQUE POLICE OFFICERS WORKING YOU ILLEGALLY WITH  AT LEAST ONE LOCAL ATTORNEY AND HIS PARALEGAL TO MAKE  DWI CASES GO AWAY.

UBALLEZ IS OVERSEEING THE  INVESTIGATION WHICH CRASHED INTO PUBLIC VIEW ON  JANUARY 18.

THAT IS WHEN FBI AGENTS  RAIDED THE HOMES AND OFFICES OF THAT ATTORNEY AND HIS  PARALEGAL AND EXECUTED MORE SEARCH WARRANTS AT THE HOMES  OF SOME OF THOSE COPS.

TO RECAP SOME OF THE FALLOUT  SO FAR, TWO OFFICERS HAVE RESIGNED, SEVERAL OTHERS ARE  ON LEAVE AND BERNALILLO COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY,  SAM BREGMAN, HAS DISMISSED 200 DWI CASES AND COUNTING.

U.S. ATTORNEY UBALLEZ TOOK THE UNUSUAL STEP IN JANUARY  OF CONFIRMING THE INVESTIGATION IN LETTERS TO  BREGMAN AND POLICE CHIEF HERALD MEDINA, BUT HE HAS  NOT SPOKEN PUBLICLY ABOUT IT UNTIL NOW.

HE KEPT MOST OF THE DETAILS OF THE INVESTIGATION CLOSE  TO THE VEST BUT SPENT NEARLY HALF AN HOUR WITH JEFF  TALKING ABOUT PROCESS, THE PUBLIC'S RIGHT TO KNOW AND  MORE.

PART ONE OF THEIR  CONVERSATION BEGINS WITH ONE OF JEFF'S LEAST FAVORITE  PHRASES IN THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE.

>> Jeff: ALEX, THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING ME TODAY  AND WELCOME BACK TO NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS.

>> Uballez: THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Jeff: I WOULD LIKE TO START WITH A PHRASE THAT I  HAVE HEARD ENTIRELY TOO MANY TIMES IN THE COURSE OF DOING  JOURNALISM FOR 20 YEARS.

THE PHRASE IS, WE CAN  NEITHER CONFIRM NOR DENY THE  EXISTENCE OF AN INVESTIGATION.

SO THAT IS SORT OF THE DEFAULT SETTING FOR THE U.S.  ATTORNEY'S OFFICE.

WHY IS THAT?

>> Uballez: THERE IS A NUMBER OF EQUITIES THAT WE  PROTECT, YOU KNOW, IN JUSTICE.

WE ARE ENTRUSTED AS PROSECUTORS BUT ESPECIALLY  DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE PROSECUTORS WITH THIS HUGE  POWER, RIGHT?

EVEN TO KNOW THAT YOU ARE  BEING ACCUSED OR SOMEBODY IS BEING ACCUSED OF A CRIME,  RIGHT, HAS A HUGE IMPACT ON THEIR LIFE, ON THE PEOPLE  AROUND THEM.

SO, TO PROTECT THE RIGHTS OF  PEOPLE, WE HAVE TO ALWAYS BALANCE A NUMBER OF THINGS  WHEN WE APPROACH ANY CASE, RIGHT.

SO THE ANSWER YOU HAVE RECEIVED, YOU HAVE DOUBTLESS  RECEIVED IN YEARS OF SPEAKING WITH US ABOUT  EITHER INVESTIGATIONS YOU EXPECT ARE ONGOING OR CASES  EVEN THAT MIGHT BE PENDING, YET WE ARE NOT GOING TO GIVE  YOU ANYTHING ON IT UNTIL IT IS SENTENCED.

WE PROTECT A NUMBER OF EQUITIES HERE IN THE  DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE.

THE FIRST, OF COURSE, IS A  PERSON'S RIGHT TO A FAIR TRIAL.

RIGHT.

SO, IF WE START GETTING OUT  IN THE PUBLIC AND TALKING ABOUT THINGS WE HAVEN'T  PROVEN IN COURT THEN THAT PERSON'S JURY POOL IS  HEARING THESE THINGS AND THAT ONLY MAKES IT MORE  DIFFICULT FOR US TO PICK THE JURY IN THE FIRST PLACE, BUT  IT MAKES IT MORE DIFFICULT FOR PERSON TO HAVE A FAIR  JURY, RIGHT, SOMEONE WHO IS GOING TO HEAR THE FACTS FOR  THE FIRST TIME, FROM THE PARTIES, IN A SITUATION  WHERE A JUDGE IS OVERSEEING AND DETERMINING WHAT IS  LEGAL TO COME IN AND WHAT IS WAS NOT.

WE WANT UNTAINTED JURIES.

THE SECOND PART IS PEOPLES'  RIGHT TO PRIVACY, RIGHT.

SO IF YOU HAVE A TARGET OF A  FEDERAL INVESTIGATION, I AM NOT GOING TO TELL OTHER  PEOPLE BECAUSE THAT COULD AFFECT YOUR JOB, YOUR  MARRIAGE, IT COULD AFFECT YOUR FRIENDS.

AND SO THIS IS A THING THAT IF RELEASED PUBLICLY, HAS A  HUGE AND DELETERIOUS EFFECT ON YOUR RIGHT AS A  DEFENDANT.

YOU BALANCE THESE AGAINST A  COUPLE OTHER INTERESTS INCLUDING OUR RIGHTS, YOU  KNOW, OUR INTERESTS, OUR JOBS WHICH IS CHARGED WITH  PUBLIC SAFETY.

SO WE HAVE TO BALANCE THE  SAFETY OF THE PUBLIC, THE NEEDS OF THE PUBLIC IN  SECURING THEIR SAFETY AGAINST WHATEVER CRIME OR  ALLEGATION IT IS.

FINALLY, THERE IS THE  INTERESTS THAT YOU PROTECT HERE, WHICH IS THE INTEREST  OF THE PUBLIC TO KNOW, TO KNOW BROADLY WHAT THEIR  JUSTICE DEPARTMENT IS DOING, KNOW THAT WE ARE DOING THE  JOB AND NOT ASLEEP AT THE WHEEL AND KNOW THAT IT IS  FUNCTIONING CORRECTLY.

AND SO WE HAVE THE FOUR  AREAS THAT WE HAVE TO PROTECT IN EVERY SINGLE  CASE.

THE CLEAREST LINE THAT WE  FOUND TO DRAW HERE IS THE ONE OF INDICTMENTS, RIGHT.

WHEN WE HAVE TAKEN IT TO A GRAND JURY OR WE HAVE TAKEN  A COMPLAINT TO A JUDGE AND THAT PERSON OR THAT GRAND  JURY HAS SAID, WE ARE FINDING BY PROBABLE CAUSE  THAT THESE OFFENSES HAPPENED,  THAT STOP GAP HAS BEEN CROSSED IN THE SYSTEM AND  THEREFORE WE ARE FORMALLY ACCUSING PEOPLE.

WE TAKE OUR RESPONSIBILITIES IN ADVANCE OF THIS CHARGING  DECISION VERY, VERY SERIOUSLY.

THERE IS A LOT THAT WE DO IN ADVANCE OF CHARGES BEING  BROUGHT AGAINST SOMEONE BECAUSE WE KNOW THE IMPACT  IT HAS ON PEOPLES' LIVES.

BUT EVEN THEN YOU'LL SEE, IN  OUR PRESS RELEASES AND IN OUR DISCUSSION AND ANSWERING  OF QUESTIONS EVEN AFTER CHARGING, WE KEEP VERY  CLOSELY TO JUST THE THINGS THAT WE HAVE SAID IN COURT  AND ON THE RECORD, BECAUSE WHEN WE SAY THINGS IN COURT  AND ON THE RECORD, WE ARE RESPONSIBLE, WE ARE HELD TO  ACCOUNT FOR THE VERACITY OF THOSE STATEMENTS IN FRONT OF  A JUDGE.

THE SAME CAN'T BE SAID TO BE TRUE ABOUT STATEMENTS IN  PUBLIC FROM PUBLIC OFFICIALS AND POLITICIANS, FROM LAW  ENFORCEMENT, BUT IT CAN BE SAID TO BE TRUE WHEN WE ARE  OFFERING TESTIMONY IN COURTS.

WE ARE OFFERING  EVIDENCE IN COURTS, WHEN A COURT HAS DEEMED IT  ADMISSIBLE.

SO FOR THAT REASON, EVEN  THEN AFTER WE CHARGED SOMEBODY, WE ARE STILL VERY  CAUTIOUS ABOUT COMMENTING ON A CASE UNTIL FINALLY WE HAVE  CONVICTED, WE HAVE SENTENCED.

AND THAT IS WHEN WE GIVE THE PRESS CONFERENCE AND WE DO  INTERVIEWS AND THAT IS WHEN THE PUBLIC GETS TO KNOW A  WHOLE LOT MORE ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED THAN FROM THE  INITIAL INDICTMENT OR COMPLAINT.

>> Jeff: I APPRECIATE THE  EXPLANATION.

I THINK THERE IS A  POSSIBILITY THAT THE NEXT TIME I RECEIVE THAT RESPONSE  FROM YOUR OFFICE, I WILL BE A TINY BIT LESS IRRITATED.

DOES THAT POLICY -- DOES THAT PRESENT ANY CHALLENGES  FOR YOU AS A FEDERAL PROSECUTOR?

>> Uballez: SURE, IT DOES.

SO THERE IS -- WE ARE  BALANCING THESE THINGS, RIGHT.

SO THE FACT THAT WE WANT TO PROTECT THE PERSON'S RIGHT  TO A JURY, WE WANT TO PROTECT THEIR PRIVACY  DOESN'T ERASE THE FACT THAT WE KNOW THE PUBLIC NEEDS TO  BE PROTECTED, FIRST AND FOREMOST, AND THEY NEED TO  BE INFORMED ABOUT WHAT WE ARE DOING, THAT THEY CAN  TRUST THAT WE ARE DOING IT, THAT IT WILL COME TO A JUST  RESULT AND SO IT IS A CONSTANT BALANCE.

>> Jeff: GOT YOU.

SO IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE,  THIS ONGOING INVESTIGATION INTO POSSIBLE MISCONDUCT BY  ALBUQUERQUE POLICE OFFICERS AND OTHERS, YOU DECIDED TO  GO A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT ROUTE.

YOU WROTE LETTERS TO THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND TO THE  POLICE CHIEF IN WHICH YOU DID CONFIRM THE EXISTENCE OF  THIS INVESTIGATION.

I WOULD LOVE TO HAVE A  LITTLE BEHIND THE SCENES ON WHAT LED YOU TO MAKE THAT  DECISION, WHAT SORT OF FACTORS WENT INTO, YOU KNOW,  SORT OF DETOURING FROM THE USUAL POLICY?

>> Uballez: ANY POLICY, OUR POLICY ON DISCUSSING CASES  HAS EXCEPTIONS.

THIS IS HOW LAWYERS OPERATE  WITHIN THE REALM OF EXEMPTIONS AND SO THERE IS A  COUPLE THAT APPLY TO US WHEN WE ARE DEALING WITH CASES OF  THIS AMOUNT OF INTEREST FROM THE PUBLIC OR INTEREST TO  THE PUBLIC.

THE U.S. ATTORNEY IN ANY  GIVEN DISTRICT OR THE ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL  IN MAIN JUSTICE HAVE THE ABILITY TO FIND EXCEPTIONS.

SO THEY CAN LOOK AT A CASE OR AN INVESTIGATION AND SAY,  THERE ARE REASONS WHY WE SHOULD CONFIRM THAT FEDERAL  LAW ENFORCEMENT IS DOING THEIR JOB HERE, OR THERE ARE  REASONS WHY WE SHOULD RELEASE INFORMATION THAT HAS  TO DO WITH PROTECTING PUBLIC SAFETY.

SO, IN A CASE, FOR EXAMPLE, WHERE PEOPLE SEE A BUNCH OF  FOLKS WEARING FBI IN BRIGHT YELLOW ON THE BACK OF THEIR  JACKETS GO INTO A HOUSE, BUT THERE IS NO OTHER  EXPLANATION FOR WHY OR WHEN OR HOW, THERE IS OFTEN A  PUBLIC INTEREST IN KNOWING THIS IS ACTUALLY LAW  ENFORCEMENT.

THEY ARE ACTUALLY AUTHORIZED  TO DO THIS AND THIS IS PART OF SOMETHING THAT IS  HAPPENING AND WE CAN TRUST THAT THERE IS A PROCESS HERE  AND NOT JUST ROGUE PEOPLE WHO BOUGHT JACKETS.

SO, WHEN WE DISCUSS CASES AND THIS ONE WITH THE  INVESTIGATION YOU ARE REFERRING TO, WE CONFIRMED  EARLY ON FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT ACTIVITY AT  VARIOUS LOCATIONS AS WE WERE ASKED BY THE PUBLIC BECAUSE  WE FELT THAT IT MET THAT REQUIREMENT.

IT MET THAT NEED, WHICH IS PEOPLE ARE SEEING FEDERAL  LAW ENFORCEMENT ACTIVITY HAPPEN AND THEY DON'T KNOW  WHAT IS HAPPENING.

SO FOR US THAT SMALL BIT OF  CONFIRMATION ALLOWS US TO TELL THE PUBLIC, DON'T  WORRY, THIS IS AUTHORIZED.

WE PUT THOUGHT INTO IT AND  WE ARE WORKING ON IT.

>> Jeff: SORT OF AN  AUTHENTICITY STAND, IF YOU WILL.

I WANT TO TALK ABOUT A WORD THAT YOU USED IN THOSE TWO  LETTERS I JUST REFERENCED TO THE DA AND THE CHIEF.

YOU NODDED TOWARD THE TENSION BETWEEN THE PUBLIC'S  UNDERSTANDABLE DESIRE FOR INFORMATION ABOUT SOMETHING  LIKE THIS AND THE SECRECY NEEDS THAT YOU JUST SORT OF  DESCRIBED.

LET'S PULL OUT A LITTLE BIT  FROM THIS INVESTIGATION AND TALK BROADLY HOW DO YOU  BALANCE THOSE TWO PRINCIPLES?

WHAT GOES INTO  THAT?

>> Uballez: A   LOT GOES INTO IT.

EVERYTHING THAT WE DO IN OUR JOB IS A CAREFUL BALANCE OF  THE VARIOUS NEEDS THAT WE PROTECT.

IT IS REALLY UNIQUE BEING ESPECIALLY A FEDERAL  PROSECUTOR OR BEING A PROSECUTOR.

AMONG ALL LAWYERS, OUR JOB IS VERY DIFFERENT.

IT IS DISTINCT IN THAT MOST LAWYERS, THEY TAKE A CASE OR  CLIENT AND THAT IS AN INTEREST THAT THEY  REPRESENT.

THEY ARE BEING HIRED TO  EXERCISE THAT PERSON'S INTEREST AT THE EXPENSE OF  ALL OTHERS.

THAT IS NEVER OURS.

IN EVERYTHING THAT WE DO, WE ARE THINKING ABOUT ALL OF  OUR CLIENTS FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, THAT  IS THE UNITED STATES.

RIGHT.

FOR US WHAT THAT MEANS WHEN WE WALK INTO A COURTROOM,  THE EQUITIES THAT WE PROTECT ARE NOT THE GOVERNMENT'S AS  OFTEN THE COURTS LIKE TO REFER TO US.

EQUITIES INCLUDES NOT JUST THE PEOPLE ON THE STREETS  AND THE MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITIES,  BUT THE JURORS THEMSELVES, THE DEFENDANT HIMSELF, HIS  ATTORNEY, THE JUDGE, ALL OF THEIR INTERESTS AS MEMBERS  OF OUR COMMUNITY ARE BALANCED TOGETHER.

SO, AS A FEDERAL PROSECUTOR WE DEAL DAILY WITH THE  BALANCE BETWEEN DIFFERENT INTERESTS FOR DIFFERENT  PEOPLE.

WHAT IS BEST FOR THE  COMMUNITY AND PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE VERSUS WHAT IS  BEST FOR AN INVESTIGATION AND, MOST IMPORTANTLY, WHAT  PROTECTS THE RIGHTS OF THE TARGET OR DEFENDANT AS WELL?

RIGHT?

BECAUSE UNTIL A PERSON IS  ACCUSED PUBLICLY, THE PERSON IS CONSIDERED INNOCENT.

RIGHT.

SHOULD WALK FREE FROM ANY  PUBLIC ASPERSIONS OF WHAT THEY MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE  DONE.

SO WHEN WE DO OUR JOB, WE  TRY VERY, VERY HARD TO MAINTAIN THAT PROTECTION,  NOT JUST OF THE PUBLIC AND SAFETY CONCERNS BUT OF THE  DEFENDANT'S TOO, AND THEIR INTERESTS IN PRIVACY, THEIR  INTEREST IN WALKING FREE, UNTIL A GRAND JURY OR A  JUDGE HAS SAID THERE IS PROBABLE CAUSE TO SAY YOU  DID THIS THING.

>> Jeff: OF COURSE, THE  INNOCENCE PRESUMPTION STILL ATTACHES AT THAT POINT EVEN  AFTER INDICTMENT.

>> Uballez: ABSOLUTELY.

>> Jeff: SO, IT HAS BEEN SEVEN WEEKS NOW SINCE WHAT  YOU JUST MENTIONED A MOMENT AGO, SINCE YOU ALL KICKED  SOME DOORS IN AND EXECUTED SOME SEARCH WARRANTS.

I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE TO HEAR YOU SAY WHAT  CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THIS INVESTIGATION AT THIS STAGE  IN THE PROCEEDINGS?

WHAT IS THE FULL EXTENT OF  WHAT YOU CAN SAY?

>> Uballez: WELL, JEFF, I  CAN'T CONFIRM OR DENY -- WE OBVIOUSLY CONFIRMED THE  INVESTIGATION IS UNDERWAY.

WE HAVE CONFIRMED LOCATIONS  IN RESPONSE TO THE PUBLIC AND MEDIA INQUIRIES WHERE  FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT ACTION OCCURRED.

AND FROM THE LETTERS THAT WE ISSUED TO BOTH THE DISTRICT  ATTORNEY AND THE CHIEF OF POLICE, WE HAVE CONFIRMED  THAT THEY KNEW ABOUT THE INVESTIGATION BUT WERE NOT  READ INTO ITS FULL EXTENT.

RIGHT.

THAT IS BECAUSE WHEN WE ARE PROTECTING AN ONGOING HIGH  LEVEL INVESTIGATION, THERE ARE OFTEN PARTNERS WE WORK  WITH BUT WE DON'T SHARE EVERYTHING WITH THEM.

SO, AS YOU IDENTIFIED, WE ARE GOING TO LET THEM KNOW  AS MUCH AS WE CAN FOR THEM TO FULFILL THEIR OWN DUTIES.

SO, IN THE LETTER TO THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY, WE  ACKNOWLEDGED THAT EVERY PROSECUTOR HAS A  RESPONSIBILITY, A CONSTITUTIONAL ONE, UNDER  BRADY AND GIGLEO, TO PROTECT THE PROCESS BY IDENTIFYING  CERTAIN WHAT WE CALL GIGOLO CONDUCT.

WHEN WE RUN UP AGAINST THESE OTHER RESPONSIBILITIES, WE  SHARE WHAT JUSTICE DEMANDS.

BUT ON THE OTHER SIDE OF IT  WE KEEP AS MUCH IN HOUSE AS WE CAN, UNTIL WE ARE READY  TO LEVEL AN INDICTMENT.

>> Jeff: FOR PEOPLE WHO  DON'T KNOW WHAT GIGLEO MATERIAL IS, WE ARE  ESSENTIALLY TALKING ABOUT INFORMATION THAT COULD  IMPACT A WITNESS' CREDIBILITY IN COURT, RIGHT?

>> Uballez: THAT IS CORRECT.

THERE IS A BROADER  CONSTITUTIONAL PROTECTION CALLED BRADY SO EXCULPATORY  INFORMATION, A SUBSET OF WHAT BRADY -- THE  CONSTITUTIONAL REQUIREMENT FOR BRADY IS OBVIOUSLY IF WE  HAVE SOMETHING THAT SAYS THE PERSON WE ARE THINKING DID  SOMETHING DID NOT DO IT, THEN WE HAVE TO DISCLOSE  THAT EVIDENCE.

A SUBSET OF THAT IS GIGLEO,  AS YOU IDENTIFIED, WHICH IS IF WE HAVE INFORMATION THAT  CAN BE USED TO CROSS-EXAMINE, TO IMPUGN THE  CREDIBILITY OF ONE OF OUR WITNESSES, WE SHOULD  DISCLOSE THAT TOO.

SO, WHEN WE RUN UP INTO  THESE CONSTITUTIONAL REQUIREMENTS OR PROTECTIONS,  AGAIN, WE PROTECT THE DEFENDANT TOO.

SO, THAT IS WHERE WE WORK WITH THE DA.

THIS IS WHERE WE ARE SORT OF WORKING IN A SIMILAR BUT  ALTERNATE TRACK WITH THE CHIEF OF POLICE.

THE LETTERS SHOW THAT WHILE THEY WERE AWARE OF  INVESTIGATIONS, THEY ARE NOT AWARE OF THE FULL SCALE.

>> Jeff: I WANT TO ASK ANOTHER QUESTION SORT OF  RELATED TO BALANCING.

THE LAW ENFORCEMENT  COMMUNITY IN NEW MEXICO IS RELATIVELY SMALL, RELATIVELY  TIGHT KNIT.

OBVIOUSLY YOUR OFFICE AND THE FBI CONDUCTS  JOINT OPERATIONS WITH APD, THE COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE  AND THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S OFFICE ALL THE TIME.

HOW WOULD YOU RESPOND TO PUBLIC CONCERNS ABOUT THE  POSSIBILITY OF ONE OF YOUR INVESTIGATIONS BEING  CONTAMINATED OR COMPROMISED BECAUSE OF THESE  RELATIONSHIPS THAT CAN DEVELOP?

>> Uballez: YEAH, THERE IS ALWAYS CONCERN.

INFORMATION CAN LEAK.

AS A LAW ENFORCEMENT  INVESTIGATOR, THERE IS ALWAYS A CONCERN THAT  INFORMATION CAN LEAK BEFORE YOU WANT IT TO.

THIS IS WHY FOR STEP 1 WE WORK IN SORT OF INSULATED  CIRCLES.

WHEN WE ARE WORKING CASES WE  DECONFLICT, IT IS CALLED, WHICH MAKES SURE NO OTHER  LAW ENFORCEMENT IS WORKING ON A SIMILAR CASE AGAINST A  SIMILAR PERSON.

BUT WE ALSO WALL OFF AS IS  IDENTIFIED IN THESE LETTERS AND TO THE DA AND THE CHIEF,  NONESSENTIAL LAW ENFORCEMENT COMPONENTS FROM WHAT WE ARE  DOING.

SO, WHILE THERE IS ALWAYS A  WORRY THAT THINGS COULD BE LEAKED, WE ALSO OPERATE IN A  WORLD WHERE WE HAVE TO TRUST EACH OTHER TO MOVE FORWARD.

RIGHT.

SO, FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT  IS A TIGHT KNIT COMMUNITY HERE.

WE WORK ALL THE TIME  AND CONSTANTLY AND ALSO WITH LOCAL PARTNERS TO FACE THE  MANY CHALLENGES WE HAVE HERE IN NEW MEXICO.

AND SO IT IS A TIGHT ROPE TO WALK BUT YOU HAVE TO  UNDERSTAND YOU HAVE GOT TO TAKE SOME RISKS IF YOU WANT  TO GET THE RIGHT CASES AND THE RIGHT PEOPLE.

SO, WE BALANCE THOSE RISKS.

WE MANAGE AND MITIGATE  POSSIBILITY OF DISCLOSURE BEFORE WE WANT A THING TO BE  DISCLOSED.

AND WE TRUST.

WE RELY ON EACH OTHER DAY IN AND DATE OUR.

OUR FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT PARTNERS, YOU KNOW, PUT  THEIR LIVES IN EACH OTHER'S HANDS AND SO IT IS WITH THIS  TRUST THAT WE GO FORWARD ON THESE KIND OF  INVESTIGATIONS.

>> Jeff: THERE IS A LITTLE  BIT OF A NEEDLE TO THREAD IN A CASE LIKE THIS.

OBVIOUSLY THE NATURE OF THE FEDERAL INQUIRY HERE IS A  CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION WHOSE STAKES, OF COURSE, ARE  SOMEONE'S FREEDOM AT THE END OF THE DAY.

ON A PARALLEL TRACK YOU HAVE AN ADMINISTRATIVE  INVESTIGATION THAT THE POLICE DEPARTMENT ITSELF IS  CONDUCTING, THE CONSEQUENCES OF WHICH COULD BE SOMEONE'S  JOB.

FOR EXAMPLE, WHEN A POLICE  OFFICER IS INTERVIEWED IN AN INTERNAL AFFAIRS  INVESTIGATION HE IS READ WHAT IS CALLED A GARRITY  WARNING WHICH IS ESSENTIALLY HIM SAYING, I AM GIVING UP  MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHTS HERE.

I AM GOING TO TALK TO YOU AND ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS.

YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO USE ANY OF THAT IN YOUR CRIMINAL  PROCEEDING.

HOW DO YOU MAKE SURE,  BROADLY SPEAKING AGAIN, NOT JUST IN THIS INVESTIGATION,  HOW DO YOU MAKE SURE THOSE TWO THINGS STAY SEPARATE?

>> Uballez: SO, WE HAVE A LOT OF -- WE INVEST A LOT  INTO PROTECTING OUR INVESTIGATIONS BOTH FROM  BEING LEAKED OR PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE, BUT ALSO LEGALLY,  RIGHT?

SO LIKE IT IS OUR JOB TO  PRESENT THE CASE AND WIN IT.

SO, IF WE PRESENT A CASE BUT  THERE ARE CONSTITUTIONAL PROBLEMS WITH IT, WE HAVE  NOT DONE OUR JOB, WHICH MEANS THERE ARE MANY STOP  GAPS THAT WE PUT IN PLACE TO ENSURE THAT WE ARE ADVANCING  A LEGALLY DEFENSIBLE CASE.

IN SOME CASES THAT WILL MEAN  WE HAVE FILTER TEAMS WHO ARE ENTIRELY A SEPARATE TEAM OF  BOTH AGENTS AND AOSA'S.

A FILTER TEAM WORKS IN A  SITUATION WHERE THERE MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT THE  PROSECUTING TEAM SHOULDN'T HAVE.

RIGHT, SO, WE WILL OFTEN USE FILTER TEAMS TO TAKE A FIRST  READ OF WHATEVER IT IS THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT.

AND THE FILTER TEAM CAN PASS ON NON-TAINTED EVIDENCE TO  THE PROSECUTION TEAM TO GO FORWARD WITH.

SO IT IS ESSENTIALLY DOUBLING THE RESOURCES WE  INVEST IN ANY CASE BUT WE DO IT, AGAIN, TO PROTECT THE  INTEGRITY OF THAT CASE AND ITS PRESENTATION TO THE  JURY.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS GOING  TO HAPPEN IN COURT.

I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, WHAT  THE PARTIES ARE GOING TO MOVE FOR.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE COURT IS GOING TO FIND, BUT I DO  THINK THAT FOR ANY POLICE DEPARTMENT, ESPECIALLY OURS,  A FUNCTIONING INTERNAL AFFAIRS DEPARTMENT IS  CRITICAL TO THE ADMINISTRATION OF THAT  DEPARTMENT.

AND, SO, I WOULD GUESS THAT  A FUNCTIONING INTERNAL AFFAIRS DEPARTMENT IS WHAT  THE CITY WILL RECEIVE AFTER THIS INVESTIGATION.

>> Lou: JUST OVER NEW MEXICO'S EASTERN BORDER  RESIDENTS IN TEXAS THIS WEEK REACHED AN UNWELCOME  LANDMARK, THE STATE'S LARGEST EVER WILDFIRE.

FOR THIS WEEK'S SHOW WE WANTED TO CHECK IN ON WHERE  THINGS STAND AS RESIDENTS OF NORTHERN NEW MEXICO TRY TO  RECOVER FROM THE HERMIT PEAK CALF CANYON FIRE, WHICH SET  THE GRIM MILESTONE OF THE LARGEST EVER FOR OUR STATE  IN 2022.

TO DO THAT WE PARTNERED UP  WITH PATRICK LOHMANN OF SOURCE NEW MEXICO WHO HAS  WRITTEN DOZENS OF STORIES ABOUT THE HERMIT'S PEAK CALF  CANYON.

YOU PROBABLY KNOW THAT THE  FIRE BEGAN AS A PAIR OF BOTCHED PRESCRIBED BURNS ON  FEDERAL FOREST SERVICE LAND IN SAN MIGUEL COUNTY.

PATRICK SPENT ALL OF LAST YEAR IN THE BURN SCAR  PARTNERING WITH PROPUBLICA TO TRY TO ANSWER A SINGLE  QUESTION IN THE WILDFIRE'S AFTERMATH.

WHEN THE GOVERNMENT MAKES A MISTAKE, WHAT WILL IT DO TO  MAKE THINGS RIGHT FOR THOSE IT HARMED?

PATRICK INVITED TWO GUESTS, BOTH FEATURED IN RECENT  PIECES FROM SOURCE AND PROPUBLICA WHO ARE RELUCTANT  EXPERTS IN THAT QUESTION.

BOTH SUFFERED LOSSES IN THE  WILDFIRE OR THE FLOODS THAT FOLLOWED.

BOTH ARE TRYING TO FILE CLAIMS FOR WHAT THEY ARE  OWED FROM A FOUR BILLION DOLLAR COMPENSATION FUND AND  BOTH HAVE BECOME DEFACTO LEADERS IN THEIR COMMUNITIES  TO HELP THEIR NEIGHBORS FIND A WAY FORWARD.

KAYT PECK WRITES A WEEKLY COLUMN ABOUT THE RECOVERY  FOR THE LAS VEGAS OPTIC AND YOLANDA CRUZ MODERATES A  PRIVATE FACEBOOK PAGE THAT HAS BECOME A VITAL RESOURCE  FOR THOSE STILL TRYING TO REBUILD.

NOW, YOU WILL NOTICE DURING PATRICK'S TWO-PART  DISCUSSION, OR SET WILL LOOK A LITTLE DIFFERENT.

THE IMAGES YOU WILL SEE IN THE MONITORS COME COURTESY  OF PHOTO JOURNALIST ADRIA MALCOLM.

SHE HAS BEEN DOCUMENTING THE HERMIT'S PEAK CALF CANYON  FIRE AND AFTERMATH WITH PATRICK AND OTHER REPORTERS  FOR OVER A YEAR.

NOW, I'LL THROW THINGS OVER  TO PATRICK AS HE ASKS HIS PAIR OF GUESTS STILL  RECOVERING FROM THE FIRE WHAT THEY HAVE LIVED THROUGH  AND WHAT ADVICE THEY HAVE FOR OUR TEXAS NEIGHBORS AS  THEY PREPARE FOR A LONG AND PAINFUL RECOVERY.

>> Lohmann: THANK YOU BOTH FOR COMING DOWN TO TALK TO  US.

WELCOME TO NEW MEXICO  IN FOCUS.

I WAS HOPING WE COULD START  WITH YOU BOTH SHARING YOUR EXPERIENCES OF THE FIRE AND  FLOODS AND TELLING US WHERE THINGS STAND FOR YOU NOW.

YOLANDA, YOU HAD LOSSES IN YOUR FIRE AND YOU ARE ALSO  HELPING YOUR PARENTS NAVIGATE THE FEMA  BUREAUCRACY.

WHAT DID THE FIRE TAKE FROM  YOU AND HOW CLOSE ARE YOU TO BEING ABLE TO BE FULLY  COMPENSATED?

>> Cruz: THE FIRE CROSSED  OUR COMPLETE ACREAGE.

WE HAVE 10 ACRES IN SAN  MIGUEL COUNTY AND WE WERE ABLE TO WATCH THAT ON THE  SATELLITE MAPS, NOT IN REALTIME, BUT THE HEAT MAP  SHOWED THE FIRE CROSSING THE ENTIRETY OF OUR PROPERTY.

WE WERE REALLY UNSURE WHAT WE WOULD COME BACK TO AND  WHEN WE RETURNED, ALL OF THE GROUND WAS BLACK.

SOME OF THE TREES WERE COMPLETELY GONE, CLOSER TO  THE HOUSE, UP ABOVE, ABOUT PROBABLY 40 TO 50 FEET FROM  THE HOUSE WAS A HIGH SEVERITY BURN AND I THINK IT  WAS MIRACULOUS THAT IT DID NOT TAKE OUR HOME.

BUT BECAUSE AS THE SPARKS FLY WE LOST MANY HOMES ON  THAT PRIVATE ROAD THAT WE LIVE ON, EVEN WHERE THE  TREES WERE NOT AS DAMAGED.

SO, BEFORE WE LEFT, WE HAD  ABOUT EIGHT HOURS OF NOTICE THAT WE WERE GOING TO  EVACUATE.

WE WET DOWN OUR HOME.

WE WET OUR DECKS, WE RAKED.

AND I THINK THAT IS WHAT  HELPED SAVE IT BECAUSE THE FIRE WENT RIGHT UP TO THAT  POINT ON THE GROUND.

BESIDES THE TREES, WE  LOST -- WE HAD DAMAGES TO OUR WELL, DAMAGES TO OUR  SEPTIC SYSTEM, TO OUR WATER STORAGE SYSTEM.

WE LOST EQUIPMENT, OUR WOOD SPLITTER.

WE LOST SOME VEHICLES THAT WE WERE UNABLE TO TAKE OUT.

A LOT OF TOOLS AND DIFFERENT EQUIPMENT AND A CARPORT  GARAGE THAT WE HAD THERE.

SO, YOU KNOW, OF COURSE,  FENCING.

ALL OF THOSE THINGS.

MY GRANDDAUGHTER ALSO HAD A LITTLE PLAY AREA FROM WHEN  SHE WAS YOUNGER.

A LOT OF THOSE THINGS WERE  COMPLETELY GONE.

THERE WAS ONE LITTLE  PLAYHOUSE AND I THOUGHT, SOMETHING IS MISSING THERE.

AND I WENT TO CHECK, THERE WAS NOT EVEN A PILE OF  ASHES, NOTHING.

IT WAS JUST GONE, JUST  DISINTEGRATED.

IT WAS REALLY SURPRISING TO  SEE THE DAMAGES AND WE WERE ONE OF THE LUCKY ONES.

THE FLOODING CAME THROUGH AND THAT DAMAGED THE CULVERT  OVER THE ARROYO WHERE OUR ROAD CROSSES TO GET HOME AND  THE WATER JUST COMES FROM EVERWHERE NOW WHEN IT RAINS.

BEFORE, YOU COULD SEE LIKE, YOU KNOW, THE TRICKLES, THE  STREAMS THAT GET CREATED WHEN THERE IS SOME WATER.

WE ARE FORTUNATE AGAIN THAT THE MOUNTAIN ABOVE IS NOT  VERY HIGH SO ALTHOUGH THERE IS A LOT OF WATER AND WE  HAVE HAD TO PROTECT OUR HOME, THERE IS NOT THE  AMOUNT OF WATER THAT I HAVE SEEN IN OTHER PLACES.

>> Lohmann: AND KAYT, CAN YOU TELL ME HOW REBUILDING  IS GOING?

>> Peck: NOT.

I HAVE FOUND I WAS A VAGABOND FOR ABOUT A YEAR,  DIFFERENT, LIKE MY HOUSE WAS TOTALLY LEVELED.

THE FOUNDATION WAS STILL SORT OF STANDING BUT THE  REST WAS A BBQ PIT.

THAT WAS MY HOME OF 18  YEARS.

LUCKILY, I GOT AN EARLY  PHONE CALL.

I WAS RETIRED FROM THE FIRE  DEPARTMENT AND EMS SO I GOT A PHONE CALL, A LITTLE HEADS  UP, ON EVACUATION.

I WAS ABLE TO GET MY HORSE  OUT, MY ANIMALS OUT, AND A FEW LITTLE THINGS.

SO IT TOOK MY HOME OF 18 YEARS AND ALL THE  MEMORABILIA OF A LIFETIME, WHICH IS PRETTY PRECIOUS.

AND I TELL PEOPLE, AND I HONESTLY FEEL THIS WAY, IN A  LOT OF WAYS THE WOMAN I WAS, DIED WITH THAT FIRE.

BUT YOU GO ON.

AND I AM WAITING TO FIND OUT  WHAT FEMA IS GOING TO DO BEFORE I CAN REBUILD.

I WAS ONE OF THE LUCKY ONES.

I HAD INSURANCE.

SO I WASN'T DESTITUTE.

I ALSO HAD A LOT OF GOOD  FRIENDS THAT OPENED THEIR HOMES TO ME.

I WENT TO HELP A FRIEND BRIEFLY IN TEXAS WITH A  BUSINESS AND WHILE I WAS THERE, THE PEOPLE I WAS  STAYING WITH GOT EVACUATED.

SO I GOT STUCK IN TEXAS FOR  FOUR-AND-A-HALF MONTHS LIVING IN A TRAVEL TRAILER.

FINALLY GOT THE TRAILER BACK.

LIVED THROUGH THE  WINTER IN A TRAVEL TRAILER.

I DO NOT INTEND TO DO THAT  AGAIN.

THAT IS AN INTERESTING  DEVELOPMENT.

BUT, YOU KNOW, I FOUND AND  PURCHASED AN OLDER SINGLE WIDE.

SO I HAVE A DECENT PLACE TO LIVE UNTIL I CAN REBUILD.

A LOT OF FOLKS DON'T HAVE THOSE BENEFITS.

SO, I AM GRATEFUL FOR THAT.

I ALSO LOST -- IT IS THE  INTANGIBLES.

YOU KNOW, I MEAN, IT IS -- I  DID A POEM RIGHT AFTER THE FIRE CALLED "MEMORIES DON'T  BURN" BECAUSE WHAT HAS HELPED ME THROUGH IS TO KNOW  THAT THE OBJECTS DID NOT MATTER FOR THEMSELVES.

THEY MATTERED BECAUSE OF THE MEMORIES.

AND YOU CAN PUT A MATCH TO IT BUT YOU DON'T BURN A  MEMORY.

SO, LIFE GOES ON.

IT IS STILL PRECIOUS.

BUT PEOPLE LIKE YOLANDA, THE  PEOPLE, I MEAN, REALLY, AFTER THE FIRE, I LOST SO  MUCH, BUT WHAT I GAINED WAS KNOWING THE TRUE HEARTS OF  THE PEOPLE OF THE COMMUNITY.

AND HOW THEY COME THROUGH  FOR EACH OTHER.

>> Lohmann: THAT IS  BEAUTIFUL.

AND I WANT TO STAY WITH YOU.

YOU JUST CAME BACK FROM FRITCH, TEXAS, WHERE YOU  DELIVERED SUPPLIES TO THOSE BEING EVACUATED.

>> Peck: YES.

>> Lohmann: WHAT DID YOU  BRING?

>> Peck: WELL, WE CALLED IN  ADVANCE.

I CALLED THE EDITOR OF THE  NEWSPAPER THERE AND THE LIST THEY GAVE US FOR WHAT THEY  NEEDED, NEAR AS I CAN TELL, IT WAS EQUIPMENT, PRIMARILY  EQUIPMENT THAT THE CREWS NEEDED GOING THROUGH THE  HOUSES THAT HAD BURNED.

WE DID A FEW THINGS, FOOD,  THAT SORT OF THING, BUT WE DID OUR BEST TO MEET THE  WISH LIST THAT WE GOT.

WHICH WAS LIKE ALUMINUM  SHOVELS AND RAKES AND CONTRACTOR BAGS, THINGS LIKE  THAT.

>> Lohmann: I NEED TO JUST  REMIND PEOPLE, THAT IS THE SMOKE HOUSE CREEK FIRE THAT  STARTED FEBRUARY 26 AND HAS ALREADY BURNED --  >> Peck: A MILLION ACRES.

>> Lohmann: YEAH, THE BIGGEST  FIRE IN TEXAS HISTORY.

WHAT COMPELLED YOU TO HELP THOSE PEOPLE?

>> Peck: I GREW UP ON A RANCH IN THE TEXAS PANHANDLE.

SO, IT IS THE OLD STOMPING  GROUNDS.

AND I JUST WANTED TO -- PEOPLE  HELPED ME.

I WANTED TO HELP PEOPLE.

SO, I VOLUNTEERED TO MAKE THE TRIP JUST TO TAKE WHAT WE COULD.

>> Lohmann: YOLANDA, SPEAKING WITH TEXAS, TEXAS POWER COMPANY  SAID TODAY IT BELIEVES THAT ITS FACILITIES HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN IGNITION FOR THAT FIRE.

NOW, POWER COMPANY IS DIFFERENT  FROM A GOVERNMENT ENTITY AND NO TWO DISASTERS ARE EXACTLY THE  SAME.

BUT IF THAT COMPANY IS DEEMED  LIABLE, SOMEONE WILL HAVE TO MAKE CHOICES ABOUT HOW TO  COMPENSATE SURVIVORS OF THIS FIRE.

I AM JUST WONDERING WHAT LESSONS COULD THE OVERSEERS OF WHOEVER  RUNS THAT FUND IN TEXAS LEARN FROM WHAT FEMA DID HERE WITH  THIS COMPENSATION FUND.

>> Cruz: FEMA IS REALLY THE  WRONG ORGANIZATION OR AGENCY TO HANDLE THESE FUNDS.

THERE HAVE BEEN FIRES STARTED BY POWER COMPANIES IN OTHER STATES, SUCH AS CALIFORNIA.

AND THEY DID NOT HAVE FEMA  OVERSEEING THAT FUND DISTRIBUTION.

SO THEY NEED TO MODEL THAT PROCESS INSTEAD OF LOOKING FOR A GOVERNMENT ORGANIZATION.

WE KNOW THAT GOVERNMENT RUNS  VERY SLOWLY AND IT SEEMS AS IF FEMA IS RUNNING EVEN SLOWER THAN MOST GOVERNMENT ORGANIZATIONS.

>> Lohmann: THEY HAVE RECENTLY PROMISED TO MOVE MORE QUICKLY.

THEY HAVE BROUGHT IN MORE CLAIMS ADJUSTORS.

IS THERE ANYTHING ABOUT THE WAY  THE FUND COULD BE STRUCTURED, DO YOU HAVE ANY THOUGHTS ABOUT  SOMETHING THAT FEMA DID RIGHT OR DID WRONG THAT MIGHT GO BETTER  IN TEXAS WHEN WE GET TO THAT POINT, WHICH COULD BE YEARS, OF  COURSE?

>> Cruz: FIRST OFF, I WANT TO  SAY THAT THEY HAVE A LOT OF LOCAL PEOPLE WORKING FOR FEMA  AND VERY GOOD PEOPLE.

A LOT OF GOOD FRIENDS WORK  THERE.

AND THEY HAVE GOOD HEARTS AND  THEY KNOW THE COMMUNITIES BUT THEY ARE NOT THE ONES MAKING THE DECISIONS.

AND, SO, WHEN YOU HAVE PEOPLE  MAKING DECISIONS ABOUT WHAT TO COMPENSATE AND HOW TO COMPENSATE AND THEY DON'T KNOW THE AREA, THEN THEY ARE NOT MAKING GOOD  DECISIONS.

AND SO FEMA IS SAYING, WE HAVE  NEVER DONE SOMETHING LIKE THIS BEFORE.

WE HAVE NEVER COMPENSATED FOR EVERYTHING BEFORE.

IT TOOK THEM SO LONG TO COME UP WITH THE FINAL RULES AND EVEN  THOUGH THEY HAVE THE FINAL RULES IN PLACE, THEY ARE STILL MAKING  CHANGES.

SO, THOSE WITH COMPLEX CASES,  LIKE THOSE WHO LOST MORE THAN MAYBE TREES OR HAVE MORE THAN  SMOKE DAMAGE, ARE STILL WAITING FOR COMPENSATION.

WHILE PEOPLE WHO HAD LESS DAMAGES, ESPECIALLY RIGHT NOW  FEMA JUST ANNOUNCED A FEW WEEKS AGO THEY WOULD BE COVERING SMOKE DAMAGE FOR PEOPLE IN LAS VEGAS, SAY.

AND THAT IS NOT IN THE FOOTPRINT OF THE FIRE.

WHILE I AM GLAD THEY ARE ACKNOWLEDGING THERE ARE MORE  DAMAGES, THOSE CLAIMS ARE ABLE TO BE PAID OUT MORE QUICKLY  BECAUSE THEY ARE SIMPLER CLAIMS ADJUSTED ON THE SQUARE FOOTAGE  OF A HOME.

WHEN PEOPLE IN LAS VEGAS ARE  GETTING PAID QUICKLY AND PEOPLE WHO LOST HOMES LIKE KAYT HAVE  STILL NOT SEEN A DOLLAR, THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH THE  PROCESS.

>> Lohmann: YEAH.

WELL, I UNDERSTAND THAT TODAY A SMALL GROUP OF ADVOCATES AND  FIRE SURVIVORS ARE IN WASHINGTON DC SEEKING MEETINGS WITH  CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION TO ASK FOR SOME CHANGES.

YOU DECIDED TO JOIN US INSTEAD OF GOING WITH THEM SO THANK YOU  FOR THAT.

IF YOU DID HAVE A CHANCE TO SIT DOWN WITH SENATOR BEN RAY LUJAN, FOR EXAMPLE, WHAT IS THE MOST URGENT PROBLEM YOU WOULD ASK HIM TO FIX?

>> Cruz: I THINK ONE OF THE MOST URGENT PROBLEMS IS, OF COURSE, AGAIN, THOSE WHO WERE MOST  DEEPLY IMPACTED SHOULD BE PRIORITIZED.

SECOND, WHEN ANGELA GLADWELL WAS THE DIRECTOR, SHE AGAIN DOES NOT KNOW THE STATE.

AND THE COMMUNITY HAS BEEN  ASKING SINCE WE KNEW THAT FEMA WAS GOING TO ADMINISTER THE  FUNDS FOR A LOCAL ADMINISTRATOR TO COME ON AND WORK WITH  COMMUNITIES.

THAT HAS NOT HAPPENED.

AND THAT IS WHAT IS BEING ASKED AGAIN.

I KNOW THAT -- I DON'T KNOW THAT WOULD BE HAPPENING.

THEY DID OPEN UP THE POSITION AND SO I THINK THAT WAS OPEN FOR SEVEN DAYS.

>> Lohmann: SO WE WILL TALK  ABOUT THAT SHORTLY.

I JUST WANTED TO GIVE YOU A  CHANCE, KAYT.

WHAT IS THE MOST URGENT PROBLEM  YOU THINK CONGRESS OR THE CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION COULD  FIX?

>> Peck: TWO LEVELS.

NO.

1, I DON'T BUY -- I WORKED IN THE NAVY.

I DON'T BUY THE RED TAPE EXCUSE.

AND THAT IS WHAT WE KEEP  GETTING.

AND THEY ARE SLOW AT ALLOCATING  FUNDS.

ALSO, LIKE THE RECENT CHECK --  THEY FINALLY CAME UP WITH A CHECKLIST OF WHAT YOU HAD TO  HAVE, WHICH IS UNREASONABLE.

EXPECTING IF YOU WANT  COMPENSATION FOR YOUR EXPENSES WHEN YOU EVACUATED AND THEY WANT GAS RECEIPTS FROM TWO YEARS AGO.

AT THE RECENT TOWN HALL MEETING  THERE WAS ONE GENTLEMAN WHO HAD PERSONAL PROPERTY DAMAGES BUT  ALSO HAD HIS BUSINESS AND HE SAID HE HAD TURNED IN TAX FORMS, FEDERAL TAX FORMS, LEGAL DOCUMENTS, SHOWING THE BUSINESS  LOSSES.

FEMA WANTED THREE YEARS OF CHECK STUBS.

I WOULD SAY, AT BOTH LEVELS, BOTH LOCALLY, WHAT THEY ARE  DOING AT THE CLAIMS OFFICE RIGHT NOW AND IN GENERAL, I THINK THE  DISASTER RESPONSE SYSTEM IS BROKEN.

AND NEEDS TO BE TOTALLY REEVALUATED.

THERE IS, I JUST FOUND OUT ABOUT FROM THE UP ECHELON OF THE  ADMINISTRATION, I DON'T KNOW IF IT IS WITHIN FEMA OR ABOVE THAT, BUT THERE IS A NEW PENDING INTERIM FINAL RULE FOR HOW THEY  HANDLE INDIVIDUAL ASSISTANCE.

WHEN I READ THE EXECUTIVE  SUMMARY OF THAT, BASICALLY, I THINK IT SAID THAT THEY NEED TO  GET AWAY FROM THE ASSUMPTION THAT PEOPLE WHO HAVE HAD A  DISASTER ARE TRYING TO DEFRAUD THE GOVERNMENT.

AND THEREFORE MUST PROVIDE WHATEVER DOCUMENTATION THAT IS  REQUIRED OF THEM.

AND IT HAS BEEN RATHER ARBITRARY FROM CASE TO CASE.

YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE THAT TO PROVE THAT THEY  DESERVE TO BE HELPED.

IT NEEDS TO BE REVERSED WHERE IF FEMA TURNS DOWN SOMEONE WHO HAS REQUESTED HELP, THEY NEED TO  GIVE VERIFIABLE REASONS WHY THEY DON'T PROVIDE THAT HELP.

I MEAN, IT IS FLAWED IN ITS VERY ESSENCE.

AND I AM HOPING THAT THIS INDICATES -- I DON'T KNOW THAT  WE'LL SEE IT.

THERE IS 180-DAY RESPONSE  PERIOD, THE PUBLIC CAN RESPOND TO THE INTERIM FINAL RULE, SO I  DON'T KNOW THAT WE'LL SEE THE BENEFIT, OR IF WE DO IT MAY BE  BELATEDLY, BUT -- WE HAVE SPOKEN OUT AS A PEOPLE LARGELY.

I AM HOPING THAT, YES, THAT HELPS US, BUT EVEN MORE SO,  THERE IS GOING TO BE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE WITH CLIMATE CHANGE IT IS GOING TO CONTINUE TO BE A PROBLEM.

AND IF WE CAN RAISE OUR VOICES A LITTLE BIT AND IT HELPS TO  RECTIFY THAT THEN WE WILL RAISE OUR VOICES AND HELP TO RECTIFY  THAT.

>> Lohmann: THANK YOU BOTH FOR  SHARING.

WE'LL RETURN TO THIS GROUP IN  JUST A MOMENT TO DISCUSS WHO COULD TAKE OVER THE CLAIMS  OFFICE AND HOW THEY CAN BE SUCCESSFUL.

BUT, THAT'S ALL FOR NOW.

>> Oakleaf: FOR MY PART,  I'M JUST TRYING TO GET THAT DART INTO THE WOLF WITH TALL  TREES AROUND, HELICOPTER MOVING, WOLF MOVING, WIND  MOVING, THE WHOLE WORLD MOVING.

JUST TRYING TO GET THE DOT  ON THE WOLF.

>> Lou: LAURA'S PIECE IS  COMING UP IN ABOUT 15 MINUTES.

RIGHT NOW, LET’S GET BACK TO THE TABLE WHERE JOURNALIST  PATRICK LOHMANN IS SPEAKING WITH TWO SURVIVORS OF THE  HERMITS PEAK/CALF CANYON FIRE.

THAT'S KAYT PECK AND YOLANDA CRUZ.

THEY WATCHED MORE THAN 500 SQUARE MILES OF THE  LANDSCAPE THEY LOVE GO UP IN FLAMES AFTER THE FEDERAL  GOVERNMENT BLEW TWO PRESCRIBED BURNS IN 2022,  LEADING TO THE LARGEST WILDFIRE IN NEW MEXICO  HISTORY.

AS OF MARCH 6TH, FEMA HAD  PAID ABOUT 11-PERCENT OF A NEARLY $4-BILLION FUND TO  COMPENSATE VICTIMS.

THAT NUMBER IS CONTINUING TO  RISE, AND FEMA NOTES THAT THOSE PAYOUTS ACCOUNT FOR  68-PERCENT OF ALL CLAIMS SUBMITTED WITH  DOCUMENTATION.

BUT ATTORNEYS REPRESENTING  MORE THAN 1,000 CLAIMANTS HAVE FILED AT LEAST 14  SEPARATE LAWSUITS AGAINST FEMA.

THEY ALLEGE THE AGENCY HAS MISSED LEGAL DEADLINES TO  PROVIDE PAYMENT OFFERS AND THAT IT’S REFUSING TO PAY  FOR INTANGIBLE LOSSES AND EMOTIONAL HARMS THOSE  NORTHERN NEW MEXICO COMMUNITIES SUFFERED, THEY  SAY IN VIOLATION OF FEDERAL LAW.

FEMA IS CHALLENGING THAT CONTENTION IN COURT.

MEANWHILE, ON THE GROUND, COMMUNITY GROUPS ARE CALLING  ON THE AGENCY TO REPLACE THE CLAIMS OFFICE DIRECTOR WITH  SOMEONE WHO UNDERSTANDS NEW MEXICO BETTER.

HERE'S PAT WITH YOLANDA AND KAYT FOR PART TWO OF THEIR  CONVERSATION.

>> Lohmann: THANKS, LOU.

KAYT, FEMA ANNOUNCED IN MID JANUARY IT WAS  'CONSOLIDATING' ITS DISASTER RESPONSE ACROSS NEW MEXICO,  AND AS A PART OF THAT, REASSIGNING THE FORMER  DIRECTOR OF THE CLAIMS OFFICE.

WHO DO YOU HOPE TAKES OVER THE SO-CALLED JOINT RECOVERY  OFFICE?

>> Peck: FROM EVERYTHING  THAT I HAVE SEEN, SIMILAR CASES USUALLY HAVE GONE  THROUGH THE COURTS BECAUSE IT'S AN ELECTRIC COMPANY OR  SOMETHING LIKE THAT, AND THERE HAS BEEN A REQUEST  FROM THE VERY BEGINNING AFTER THE LEGISLATURE PASSED  THESE FUNDS TO USE A RETIRED JUDGE, SOMEONE WHO IS  ACCUSTOMED TO HOW YOU DISTRIBUTE MONEY  COMPENSATING PEOPLE FOR DAMAGES.

AND I KNOW THERE HAVE BEEN GROUPS THAT HAVE SUBMITTED  LISTS OF QUALIFIED RETIRED JUDGES HERE WITHIN THE  STATE.

I ALSO THINK THAT -- WE PUT  IN A REQUEST DURING THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD TO  HAVE LOCAL PEOPLE REPRESENTED, AND THEY HAVE  HIRED LOCAL PEOPLE, BUT AS YOLANDA POINTED OUT, THEY'RE  NOT IN DECISION-MAKING POSITIONS.

MY HOPE WOULD BE THAT THEY SELECT A RETIRED JUDGE WHO  IS EXPERIENCED IN THIS SORT OF THING.

I KNOW -- I DID A LITTLE READING ABOUT HOW THE PG&E  IN CALIFORNIA, THAT HUGE FIRE WHEN THE ELECTRIC  COMPANY TOOK RESPONSIBILITY FOR IT, THE TIME-LINE.

ONCE IT WAS ADJUDICATED AND THEN PUT INTO PLACE, IT WENT  FAIRLY QUICKLY.

IT WAS A VERY GOOD SYSTEM.

BUT IT WAS DONE BECAUSE IT WAS HEADED BY A RETIRED  JUDGE WHO KNOWS THE SYSTEM.

SO I DON'T KNOW WHY FEMA  FELT LIKE THEY NEEDED TO -- YOU KNOW, THEY'VE KIND OF, I  THINK, LARGELY ORGANIZED THEIR RESPONSE AGAINST WHAT  THEY'VE USED WITH THE STAFFORD ACT, THE WAY FEMA  NORMALLY DISTRIBUTES OR WORKS WITH, YOU KNOW, A  DISASTER AFTER A BIG FIRE, DISTRIBUTING STAFFORD ACT  FUNDS.

BUT AGAIN, THAT MEANS THAT  IN THIS CASE, EVEN THOUGH IT WAS THE FAULT OF THE FEDERAL  GOVERNMENT, THAT SAME THINKING OF PEOPLE HAVE TO  PROVE THAT THEY DESERVE IT BASED ON WHATEVER FEMA WANTS  TO DEMAND, THAT'S BEEN IN PLACE.

THAT WAS INAPPROPRIATE.

THAT WAS ENTIRELY  INAPPROPRIATE.

IT CONTINUES TO BE, AND A  LOT OF PEOPLE SUFFER BECAUSE OF IT.

>> Lohmann: JUST GIVEN WHAT YOU WERE SAYING ABOUT WHAT  YOU SEE AS THE CULTURE OF FEMA, ABOUT MAKING PEOPLE  PROVE THEIR LOSES, DO YOU THINK ONE PERSON, EVEN IF IT  IS A FORMER JUDGE FROM NEW MEXICO WHO KNOWS NEW MEXICO  LAW AND CULTURE, CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE DIRECTION  OF THE OFFICE?

DO YOU THINK IT CAN REALLY  BE ONE PERSON?

>> Peck: I THINK IT CAN.

I DON'T THINK THAT -- BECAUSE WE'RE SO FAR ALONG  IN THE PROCESS, I DON'T KNOW THAT IT COULD BE A TOTAL  SOLUTION.

BUT YOU KNOW WHAT,  ANYTHING'S BETTER THAN WHAT WE'VE EXPERIENCED,  ESPECIALLY FOR THOSE WHO WERE DEVASTATED.

PEOPLE WHO ARE LIVING WITH FAMILY OR LIVING IN  TRAILERS.

THE LONG RANGE PLANNING  GROUP, I REMEMBER AT ONE TIME I WAS ON THAT COMMITTEE  FOR A WHILE, AND I LEFT AFTER ONE SPECIFIC CASE THAT  STILL TROUBLES ME.

IT WAS BEING FEMA ADVISED.

IT WASN'T A FEMA COMMITTEE, BUT IT WAS BEING FEMA  ADVISED.

AND I SAW THE PAPERWORK,  FEMA WANTING TO USE SOME OF THE SAME CRITERIA TO  DETERMINE IF PEOPLE GET HELP AS IF IT WERE ACTUALLY FEMA  MONEY.

AND THERE WAS A GENTLEMAN  THAT NEEDED $500 TO BUILD AN OUTHOUSE BECAUSE HIS FAMILY  WAS LIVING IN TENTS.

MY RESPONSE WAS, GIVE HIM  THE MONEY.

FORGET ALL THE PAPERWORK  THEY WANTED, THIS MAN -- THEY'RE LIVING IN TENTS.

GIVE HIM THE MONEY.

AND THAT WAS EASY TO PROVE.

YOU COULD LOOK.

THAT'S A 30-MINUTE DRIVE AND  A LOOK TO SEE, OKAY, THEY NEED IT, GIVE THEM THE  MONEY.

SO I DON'T KNOW IF I  ANSWERED IT.

YES, I THINK IT WOULD MAKE A  DIFFERENCE.

I DON'T THINK IT'LL BE A  TOTAL SOLUTION.

>> Lohmann: THANK YOU.

YOLANDA, I UNDERSTAND YOU HAD SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THE  WAY THE CLAIMS OFFICE ADVERTISED THE NEW DIRECTOR  OF THIS OFFICE.

WHAT ABOUT THE PROCESS SET  OFF ALARM BELLS FOR YOU?

>> Cruz: WHAT SET OFF ALARM  BELLS WAS THAT IT WAS ONLY ADVERTISED FOR SEVEN DAYS.

YOU KNOW, USUALLY WHEN THERE'S A JOB OWNING, PEOPLE  REALLY NEED TO GET THAT OUT WIDELY.

THERE'S ALSO A NEED TO LOOK AT YOUR RESUMÉ AND UPDATE  IT, AND KIND OF TAILOR IT TO THE POSITION THAT'S OPEN AND  YOUR LETTER OF INTEREST.

AND SO TO ME, SEVEN DAYS IS  VERY MINIMAL TIME FOR THAT.

I KNOW THAT THERE IS NO  STANDARD TIME, BUT IT IS VERY MINIMAL.

>> Lohmann: YEAH, AND WE'VE REACHED OUT TO FEMA AND JUST  FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, THEY SAID THAT THIS WAS AN  EMERGENT POSITION THAT NEEDED TO BE HIRED QUICKLY  AND THAT THEY SHARED IT WIDELY WITH STATE OFFICIALS  ON THEIR FACEBOOK PAGE.

I WANTED TO ASK YOU ABOUT  FACEBOOK.

YOU'RE THE MODERATOR OF A  FACEBOOK GROUP THAT HAS ABOUT 13,000 MEMBERS, LAST I  CHECKED, MAYBE MORE.

MANY OF THEM ARE SURVIVORS.

I JUST WAS HOPING YOU COULD KIND OF TAKE THE PULSE OF  THAT GROUP, THAT COMMUNITY, FOR A MINUTE AND TELL ME  WHAT CHANGES YOU'RE SEEING, YOU KNOW, OVER THE LONG  COURSE OF THIS DISASTER.

LIKE, WHAT HAS CHANGED?

AND ULTIMATELY, ARE PEOPLE GETTING MORE FRUSTRATED?

LESS FRUSTRATED?

WHAT WOULD YOU SAY ABOUT THE  LONG VIEW?

>> Cruz: SO THERE WAS A LOT  OF ANGER AT THE BEGINNING, WHICH WAS UNDERSTANDABLE,  BECAUSE THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT SHOULD HAVE KNOWN  BETTER.

EVERYONE WHO LIVES IN THE  AREA KNOWS YOU DON'T LIGHT FIRES ON WINDY DAYS, YOU  DON'T LIGHT FIRES IN DRY CONDITIONS.

AND SO THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF ANGER OVER THE COURSE OF THE  FIRE.

AND WHEN FEMA FIRST CAME IN,  THE MOST THAT THEY WERE KIND OF -- WELL, NOT THE MOST.

BUT AT FIRST, WHAT THEY WERE HELPING WITH WAS ABOUT $500.

SOMETIMES IT WAS A LITTLE OVER THAT IF THEY COULD SEE  THAT THERE WAS SOMETHING MORE THAT NEEDED TO HAPPEN.

BUT $500 TO SOMEBODY WHO'S HAD SUBSTANTIAL DAMAGES IS  NOTHING.

AND WHEN YOU'RE HEARING FROM  ELECTED OFFICIALS, FROM THE PRESIDENT DOWN, DON'T WORRY,  THE GOVERNMENT WILL TAKE CARE OF THIS, YOU'LL BE  FULLY COMPENSATED, THAT'S WHAT THE EXPECTATION WAS.

AND EVEN PEOPLE WHO WERE DONATING TO THE SURVIVORS  THOUGHT, OH, THERE'S NOT A NEED NOW BECAUSE THE  GOVERNMENT IS DOING THIS.

AND SO THERE WAS A LOT OF  RE-EDUCATION THAT NEEDED TO HAPPEN TO SAY, THE  GOVERNMENT IS NOT TAKING CARE OF THIS RIGHT NOW.

THERE IS A LONG TIME BEFORE WE'LL SEE ANYTHING.

NOW THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE WITHDRAWN THEIR  CLAIMS FROM FEMA BECAUSE THEY'RE BEING ALMOST  AUDITED, RIGHT, WHEN YOU'RE ASKED TO BRING IN RECEIPTS  THAT YOU MAY NOT HAVE, TAX RETURNS FROM THREE YEARS.

IF YOU DON'T HAVE RECEIPTS, YOU'RE ASKED TO BRING IN  BANK STATEMENTS AND CREDIT CARD BILLS, AND IT JUST IS  REALLY TRAUMATIC FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE EXPERIENCED SO MUCH  TRAUMA ALREADY, TO BE FELT LIKE YOU'RE BEING CALLED A  LIAR AND A THIEF AND A CHEAT EACH TIME THAT YOU'RE  INTERACTING WITH THE OFFICE.

AND AGAIN, THIS IS THE  POLICIES THAT THEY'VE ENACTED.

AND SO THERE'S A LOT OF ANGER.

THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO HAVE JUST THROWN IN THE TOWEL,  AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

I THINK THAT PEOPLE WHO CAN AFFORD TO WAIT IT OUT WILL  WAIT IT OUT, AND THOSE THAT CAN'T WILL PROBABLY LEAVE  THE COUNTY.

WE'VE BEEN LOSING POPULATION  NOW FOR OVER TEN YEARS.

AND MANY PEOPLE ARE DEEPLY  ROOTED IN THE COMMUNITIES AND IT'S TOUGH.

IT'S TOUGH TO BE THERE WITH SO MUCH DESTRUCTION, BUT  IT'S EVEN WORSE WHEN YOU'RE NOT GETTING THE HELP THAT  WAS PROMISED.

>> Lohmann: SPEAKING OF,  KAYT, YOU RECENTLY ATTENDED -- YOU HAVE ANOTHER FUNERAL  FOR A FIRE SURVIVOR, RAY HERRERA, WHO DIED BEFORE  BEING ABLE TO RETURN HOME.

I SPOKE TO HIM A FEW TIMES  MYSELF, AND I KNOW HE WAS GETTING VERY FRUSTRATED.

LIKE HE ONCE TOLD ME: 'FEMA WOULDN'T KNOW HOW TO POUR  WATER OUT OF A BOOT EVEN WITH INSTRUCTIONS WRITTEN ON  THE HEEL.'

>> Peck:   THAT'S RAY.

>> Lohmann: DID YOU HEAR  THAT ONE?

>> Peck: NO, BUT THAT  SOUNDS LIKE RAY.

>> Lohmann: SO THIS IS THE  SECOND FUNERAL YOU'VE PERSONALLY ATTENDED, MAYBE  MORE, OF SOMEONE WHO WAS ACTIVELY TRYING TO REBUILD  WHO WAS UNABLE TO MOVE BACK HOME.

WHAT HAS THIS PROLONGED RECOVERY DONE TO THE  COMMUNITY YOU LOVE?

>> Peck: IT'S SHOWN THE  DEPTH OF THE HURT.

IT'S SHOWN THAT THE PEOPLE,  NO MATTER WHAT THE SITUATION IS, IN GENERAL THE PEOPLE  MAKE GOOD DECISIONS.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I  HAVE BEEN FRUSTRATED HEARING FROM FEMA, AND I DON'T PUT  UP WITH IT ANYMORE, IS THE CONDESCENDING ATTITUDE  TOWARDS THE PEOPLE.

PEOPLE IN MORA AND SAN  MIGUEL COUNTY, AND THAT LITTLE PIECE OF TAOS THAT  BURNED, THEY ARE NOT STUPID PEOPLE, BUT THEY'RE BEING  TREATED LIKE THEY ARE.

BUT I THINK I WANT TO POINT  OUT, IT'S DISHEARTENING.

YOU KNOW, A LOT OF THE  SERVICES THAT ARE PROVIDED ARE MENTAL HEALTH THAT COME  THROUGH.

BUT I WANT TO POINT  SOMETHING OUT, BECAUSE OUR COMMUNITY HAS NOT WAITED FOR  FEMA TO GET OFF ITS POSTERIOR.

THERE ARE THINGS HAPPENING.

THERE'S A GROUP CALLED  NEIGHBORS HELPING NEIGHBORS.

I REMEMBER THE DAY IT  FORMED.

IT WAS IN THAT SHELTER THE  FIRST NIGHT AFTER THE BIG EVACUATIONS, AND IT WAS  CHAOS.

PEOPLE WERE BRINGING STUFF  IN, PEOPLE WERE COMING IN, IT WAS CHAOS.

I SAW A GROUP OF MAYBE FIVE WOMEN STAND IN A CIRCLE,  TALK ABOUT WHAT WAS NEEDED, AND WITHIN AN HOUR THEY  CREATED ORDER.

THAT'S THE LOCAL PEOPLE WITH  NO PREPARATION WHATSOEVER.

AND THEN THAT ORGANIZATION,  IT BECAME NEIGHBORS HELPING NEIGHBORS, WHICH CONTINUES  TO THIS DAY TO SERVE THE PEOPLE.

THEY NOW ARE ADVOCATES.

YOU KNOW, THERE'S  PHILANTHROPIC FUNDS THAT HAVEN'T BEEN WIDELY  DISBURSED YET.

BUT BECAUSE OF NEIGHBORS  HELPING NEIGHBORS CREATING AN ADVOCACY PROGRAM, NOW  PEOPLE ARE GETTING -- I GOT SOME HELP FROM THEM TO PUT  IN A SLAB SO I CAN TAKE A TRAVEL TRAILER OUT TO MY  PROPERTY.

SO PEOPLE CAN GO TO  NEIGHBORS HELPING NEIGHBORS AND YOU'RE GOING TO GET HELP  QUICKLY.

THEY STILL MAKE THE CASE FOR  IT.

THEY HAVE TO SHOW THAT THIS  IS WHAT IS NEEDED AND WHY, BUT IT'S HAPPENING.

I KNOW -- I WORK WITH A GROUP CALLED COLLABORATIVE  VISIONS IN MORA COUNTY WHICH IS TRYING TO WORK ON  CREATING LONG-TERM SOLUTIONS.

THERE'S AN INNOVATIVE PROJECT THAT STARTED CALLED  PLAZA NUEVA, AND AMONGST OTHER THINGS, IT'S GOING TO  EVENTUALLY REPLACE THE PLAZA THAT MORA LOST IN 1847 IN  THE SECOND BATTLE OF MORA.

THE LOCAL PEOPLE, WE DON'T  NEED FEMA TO TELL US WHAT TO DO, WE NEED FEMA TO DISBURSE  MONEY THAT HAS BEEN DESIGNATED BY THE  LEGISLATURE, BY THE PRESIDENT, TO HELP PEOPLE,  TO HELP PEOPLE REGAIN THEIR LIVES AGAIN.

THEY DON'T NEED TO BE TELLING US WHAT TO DO.

>> Lohmann: THANK YOU.

WELL, I JUST WAS HOPING THAT  WE COULD END THIS WITH YOU BOTH TAKING ABOUT A MINUTE  TO DESCRIBE IF YOU EVER ALLOWED YOURSELF A VISION OF  A FULLY COMPENSATED, A FULLY RESTORED COMMUNITY, JUST  WHAT YOU PICTURE WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT A COMMUNITY  THAT'S FULLY COMPENSATED FOR THIS TERRIBLE MISTAKE.

WE CAN START WITH YOU, KAYT.

>> Peck: THESE PEOPLE, THE  NORTEÑOS, THE PEOPLE, WHATEVER HISPANIC,  INDIGENOUS, ANGLO, THERE IS A LONG HISTORY OF BEING  RESILIENT.

WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE THE SAME, BUT I DO BELIEVE  FIRMLY THAT THE PEOPLE OF THIS COMMUNITY, BECAUSE OF  THEIR GRIT, THEIR DETERMINATION, THEIR  INTELLIGENCE, WE'RE GOING TO BUILD BACK.

I DID SOME CONSULTING IN PUERTO RICO, AND I LOVED  THEIR SLOGAN: BUILD BACK BETTER.

AND I THINK THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME PEOPLE THAT HAVE TO  GIVE UP, THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME PEOPLE WHO AREN'T GOING  TO LIVE TO SEE IT, BUT WE'RE GOING TO BUILD BACK BETTER.

WITH -- WELL, IT BETTER BE WITH FEMA, AND IT BETTER BE  WITH THE FUNDS THAT HAVE BEEN DESIGNATED TO HELP.

BUT WE'LL BE BACK.

>> Lohmann: GLAD TO HEAR  IT.

YOLANDA, DO YOU WANT TO  SHARE YOUR VISION FOR WHAT IT CAN LOOK LIKE?

>> Cruz: THE BEAUTY OF THE AREA WILL ALWAYS BE SCARRED  BY THIS FIRE, BUT THE BEAUTY ALSO EXISTS IN THE PEOPLE  WHO ARE THERE.

AND THERE ARE SO MANY  EFFORTS, INCLUDING OUR LOCAL COLLEGES AND DIFFERENT  COMMUNITY GROUPS, AS.KAYT MENTIONED, THAT ARE LOOKING  AT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

YOU KNOW, HOW DO WE CHANGE  THINGS, HOW DO WE BRING IN MORE SKILLS.

THE FEMA CONTRACTS THAT WILL BE AWARDED TO HELP REBUILD,  A LOT OF THE SMALLER CONTRACTORS DON'T HAVE  WHAT'S NEEDED, THE LICENSING OR MAYBE THE INSURANCE OR  OTHER THINGS, BOOKKEEPERS, THINGS LIKE THAT THAT ARE  NEEDED, SO THEY'RE TRYING TO HELP NOW BUILD THAT  CAPACITY.

SO I BELIEVE THAT THE  COMMUNITY IS COMING TOGETHER AND WE'LL FIND WAYS TO BRING  MORE STRENGTH AND LOOK AT WHAT OPPORTUNITIES MAY  EXIST, AND JUST BE A STRONGER COMMUNITY BECAUSE  OF THAT.

>> Lohmann: ALL RIGHT.

WELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR ALL OF YOUR TIME AND YOUR  EXPERTISE.

IT'S BEEN INVALUABLE TO ME  AS I'VE REPORTED ON THIS ISSUE, AND YOU CAN EXPECT  I'LL CALL YOU BOTH AGAIN SOON.

SO THANK YOU.

>> Peck: THANK YOU,  PATRICK.

>> Cruz: THANK YOU.

>> Lou: FEMA HAS SET UP SEVERAL WAYS PEOPLE CAN GET  HELP WITH THEIR CLAIMS.

THOSE INCLUDE A HELPLINE.

THAT NUMBER IS LISTED ON YOUR SCREEN RIGHT NOW.

IT'S 505-995-7133.

THE AGENCY HAS ALSO OPENED  CLAIMS OFFICES IN SANTA FE, MORA, AND LAS VEGAS, NEW  MEXICO.

WE HAVE A LINK WITH THEIR  SPECIFIC LOCATIONS AND HOURS UNDER THIS STORY ON OUR  WEBSITE AND SOCIAL MEDIA PAGES.

IF YOU’D LIKE TO APPLY FOR FREE FLOOD INSURANCE, FEMA  SENT A REMINDER THIS WEEK LETTING PEOPLE KNOW THE  DEADLINE TO APPLY FOR THAT THROUGH THE CLAIMS OFFICE IS  APRIL 1st.

AS FOR PAT'S WORK WITH  PROPUBLICA’S BYARD DUNCAN, YOU CAN READ THEIR STORY  ABOUT YOLANDA AND OTHER FIRE SURVIVORS IN THIS WEEK’S  SANTA FE REPORTER.

THE PAPER FEATURES A SERIES  OF POIGNANT PORTRAITS BY PHOTOJOURNALIST ADRIA  MALCOLM, WHOSE IMAGES WERE FEATURED ON OUR SET DURING  PATRICK’S CONVERSATION WITH KAYT AND YOLANDA.

YOU’LL ALSO BE ABLE TO READ KAYT'S COLUMN ONLINE SOON AT  SOURCENM.COM.

NOW, HERE'S OUR LAND SENIOR  PRODUCER LAURA PASKUS.

>> Laura: A 1998 WOLF  REINTRODUCTION IN THE GILA NATIONAL FOREST BEGAN WHEN  SEVEN CAPTIVE-BRED MEXICAN WOLVES WERE RELEASED.

THIS WEEK, THE U.S.

FISH AND WILDLIFE SERVICE ANNOUNCED  THERE ARE NOW 257 MEXICAN WOLVES.

THAT'S 37 PACKS HERE IN NEW MEXICO AND 23 IN ARIZONA.

THEY ALSO SAID 138 PUPS WERE BORN LAST YEAR, AND 86 OF  THOSE SURVIVED IN THE WILD.

THE NUMBERS REPRESENT JUST A  SLIGHT BUMP FROM LAST YEAR'S COUNT, WHICH HAS ACTIVISTS  CALLING FOR CHANGES IN THE PROGRAM.

AND WHILE MOST NEW MEXICANS HAVE OPINIONS ABOUT WOLF  REINTRODUCTION ONE WAY OR THE OTHER, MOST PEOPLE WILL  NEVER SEE A WILD WOLF.

IN JANUARY, VIDEOGRAPHER  JOHN BRITT AND I JOINED BIOLOGISTS WHO USE DIFFERENT  TOOLS FOR THE COUNT, INCLUDING REMOTE CAMERAS AND  SCAT COLLECTION.

ON THIS DAY, WE WATCHED  HELICOPTER CREWS BRING ANIMALS THEY TRACKED BY  TELEMETRY AND THEN DARTED, TWO FEMALE WOLVES, ONE FROM  THE COTTONWOOD CANYON PACK AND FROM THE LEON PACK.

HERE'S A LOOK AT THAT DAY.

>> McGee: LAST YEAR, WE HAD  A GROWTH OF 25 PERCENT WITH AN END NUMBER OF 242  MINIMUM.

I'M EXPECTING A GROWTH AGAIN  THIS YEAR.

I'M NOT REALLY SURE HOW  MUCH.

THAT'S PART OF WHAT WE'RE  DOING RIGHT NOW, IS TRYING TO DETERMINE HOW MANY ARE  OUT THERE.

>> Greenleaf: WE GET IN THE  HELICOPTER, WE'RE GOING AFTER CERTAIN TARGET WOLVES,  AND I GUIDE THE HELICOPTER IN USING RADIO TELEMETRY,  TELL THEM WHAT OUR TARGET IS, AND IT KIND OF GOES OVER  TO THE PILOT AND TO THE DARTER AT THAT POINT.

>> Oakleaf: AND THEN THE PILOT IS TALKING BACK AND  FORTH.

ALLISON IS COMMUNICATING  HAZARDS.

WE'RE BOTH LOOKING AT THE  WOLF A LOT.

I'M ONLY LOOKING AT THE  WOLF.

SO IN ORDER TO AVOID TREES  AND STUFF, IF YOU DON'T HAVE ALLISON IN THERE, WE COULD  EASILY RUN INTO STUFF.

SO CREW COMMUNICATION IS  IMPORTANT.

AND THEN FOR MY PART, I'M  JUST TRYING TO GET THAT DART INTO THE WOLF WITH TALL  TREES AROUND, HELICOPTER MOVING, WOLF MOVING, WIND  MOVING, THE WHOLE WORLD MOVING.

JUST TRYING TO GET THE DOT ON THE WOLF AND GET IT  DARTED.

SO YOU MISS A LOT.

IT'S A HUMBLING EXPERIENCE.

BUT SOMETIMES YOU GET A SHOT  AND YOU FEEL GOOD FOR A LITTLE WHILE.

>> Dr. Dicks: THIS WAS A PUP THAT WAS DARTED IN THE  LEON PACK AREA.

WE HAD PLACED PUPS FROM  CAPTIVITY, FROM MANAGED CARE ZOO, INTO THE DEN IN THE  SPRINGTIME, WHICH I GOT TO HELP WITH.

SO IT'S ALWAYS FUN TO SEE THEM GROWN UP.

THIS PUP WAS ONE OF THE WILD-BORN PUPS, WHICH WE'RE  ALSO VERY PLEASED ABOUT, AND ESPECIALLY WITH THIS CASE,  BECAUSE THE MOTHER OF THIS WOLF WAS A FOSTER HERSELF  SHE WAS BORN IN A ZOO.

SO IT'S NICE TO SEE THEM BE  SUCCESSFUL.

>> THIS IS A YOUNG FEMALE.

NO, LEAVE THE DART.

DO EVERYTHING ELSE FIRST.

>> Dr. Dicks: GOT A BUNCH OF MEASUREMENTS, A LOT OF  DATA.

IT'S AN ENDANGERED SPECIES,  SO THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF DATA FROM HER THAT'S FROM  HER BODY, FROM HER BLOOD.

WE CHECK DISEASE TITERS, WE  CHECK GENETICS.

AND THEN OBVIOUSLY WE PLACE  A RADIO COLLAR, WHICH IS A REALLY SERIOUS PART OF WHAT  WE'RE DOING HERE, IS THE REASON WE'RE CAPTURING HER.

>> McGee: THE RED ON THE SHOULDERS IDENTIFIES THAT  THEY'RE BREEDING.

>> Dr. Dicks: I ALSO DO GO  AHEAD AND STILL GIVE VACCINES TO THESE ANIMALS,  THE SAME VACCINES YOUR DOG WOULD GET, RABIES AND  DISTEMPER PARVO.

AS A VETERINARIAN, IT'S  INDIVIDUAL ANIMAL HEALTH.

LIKE, I STILL HAVE TO CARE  ABOUT EACH INDIVIDUAL WOLF.

BUT WE DO LOOK AT THE  POPULATION, WE CALL THAT HERD HEALTH, AND SO I GET A  LOT OF INTERESTING VETERINARY MEDICINE THAT  WAY, TOO.

>> Lou: THANKS AGAIN TO  LAURA AND PHOTOJOURNALIST JOHN BRITT FOR THEIR WORK ON  THAT PIECE.

NOW, WE END TONIGHT WITH THE  VERDICT AGAINST ‘RUST’ FILM SET ARMORER HANNAH  GUTIERREZ-REED.

AFTER LESS THAN THREE HOURS  OF DELIBERATION, A SANTA FE COUNTY JURY FOUND HER GUILTY  OF INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER IN THE SHOOTING DEATH OF  CINEMATOGRAPHER HALYNA HUTCHINS.

THEY FOUND HER NOT GUILTY OF A LESSER CHARGE, TAMPERING  WITH EVIDENCE.

THE SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN’S  PHAEDRA HAYWOOD REPORTS JURORS HAD BEEN INSTRUCTED  THAT IF THEY FOUND GUTIERREZ-REED NOT GUILTY OF  AN INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER CHARGE, THEY HAD AN OPTION  OF FINDING HER GUILTY OF A LESSER CHARGE, NEGLIGENT USE  OF A FIREARM.

THAT’S A PETTY MISDEMEANOR  PUNISHABLE BY SIX MONTHS OF INCARCERATION.

BUT WITH THE GUILTY VERDICT ON INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER,  SHE NOW FACES UP TO 18 MONTHS IN PRISON AND HAS  BEEN ORDERED TO STAY IN JAIL AWAITING SENTENCING NEXT  MONTH.

THE STATE OFFICE OF THE  MEDICAL INVESTIGATOR RULED HUTCHINS' OCTOBER 2021 DEATH  AN ACCIDENT AFTER LIVE BULLETS APPEAR TO HAVE BEEN  MISTAKENLY MIXED WITH DUMMY ROUNDS ON THE SET.

THE MAN HOLDING THE GUN THAT KILLED HUTCHINS, ACTOR AND  PRODUCER ALEC BALDWIN, IS ALSO CHARGED WITH  INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER.

HIS TRIAL IS SET TO BEGIN IN  JULY.

THANKS FOR WATCHING.

WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

>> FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO  In FOCUS PROVIDED BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.