>> From WXXI News.

This is Connections.

I'm Evan Dawson.

Our connection this hour was made on September 11th, 2021, 20 years after the terrorist attacks on America.

A new memorial was dedicated at Gary Bykerk Memorial Park in Greece.

We're talking about the War on Terror memorial honoring residents of Monroe County and surrounding counties who lost their lives in military conflicts that date back to 1983.

Those conflicts include Beirut, the Gulf War, United Shield in Somalia, Operation Enduring Freedom in Afghanistan, Operation Iraqi Freedom.

I wonder, have you ever been to the War on Terror memorial?

Did you even know it exists?

The veterans who helped create that memorial have been finding that there is not nearly enough awareness, not even in the veteran community.

They've got bigger goals for it.

They want to expand what currently exists there.

They want people to show up for community cleanup events.

But all of that can't really happen without more understanding and awareness.

And this hour, we're having a conversation about war memorials, what the public knows, what we remember, what the memorials represent, and more with our guests this hour.

And the chair of the Monroe County War on Terror memorial is Amy Folwell, who is with us here.

Welcome.

Thank you for making time for us.

>> Thank you for having me.

>> And Charles Belfield is back with us.

Chaz is a veteran of Operation Enduring Freedom and president of the Flower City Warriors Warriors veteran hockey team.

Welcome back.

Thanks for being here.

>> Good to be back.

>> And by the way, Amy, I don't want to overlook your service as well.

You want to tell us about your service?

>> No.

Absolutely.

So I'm a marine combat veteran, served from 2005 to 2011.

>> And we'll talk a little bit later this hour about how both of you viewed the state of the VA and health systems, because that's been, you know, pertinent for a lot of people in the veterans community.

But let me just start more immediately.

There are some things still coming up soon, even including cleanup days.

But, Amy, I was reading for the program.

It's like, well, cleanup, where a War on Terror memorial.

You said you even talked to veterans who were not aware, and it kind of breaks your heart.

Chaz has got his hand up there.

>> Yeah, well, the story here.

>> When I met Chaz in a bar, actually, we were at a local event, and he had no idea himself that the memorial existed.

And I find that a lot within the community.

it is a fairly new memorial, obviously.

you know, it's only four years old.

having the Vietnam Memorial right next to it.

you would think that as you walk through it, you would kind of just continue because it's adjacent to it.

But people kind of stop right at the learning center.

and then, you know, walk back to the bollards.

They don't kind of continue on to the path.

so obviously our goal is to get people to Highland Park, which is formerly known as it, it was changed to the Gary Bykerk Memorial Park.

So they can actually see it.

>> And Chaz, for you you know, finding out that this thing existed, was that a surprise?

I mean, you're a pretty knowledgeable guy.

Was that a surprise for you?

>> it definitely was.

I have a distant relation, Brian Schram, whose name is on it.

And Theodore Glendy, if you use the Henrietta post office, you know that the post office in his name for him, he was in first at 503rd Parachute Infantry.

I was in second Batt.

And, you know, I had no idea that we had a memorial for either of those for either of servicemen in our community.

so, yeah, once Amy could make herself heard over the loud and not really that good music in the.

>> Bar.

>> I was like, we have that.

He's like, yes, we'll we'll help out in any way we can.

>> So how long ago was this, by.

>> The way?

This was January.

>> Yeah.

So, so still within this year.

So the memorial had already existed for three years.

so it got dedicated, as we said, on the 20th anniversary 2021, what is unfinished there?

What do you want to see happen there now?

>> Yeah.

So the memorial itself is finished.

All 34 names are on the memorial.

and now that the actual war is done, we're obviously pulled out.

And the war on terror is completed.

we have three empty pillars.

And so our goal now is to add some educational context.

So if you've been to the Vietnam Memorial in the Learning Center, you will see a map of Vietnam.

And in that you will see kind of you know, little pins to show the locations of where our men were.

And so our goal in our thought process was to actually create maps of Beirut and Afghanistan and some more educational contexts, you know, maybe kind of the cities in that.

And this will kind of be drawn out in the next, you know, couple of years.

But that way it will show you as you get into our memorial, not only the names and the dates, but actually where they were and where they laid their lives.

And so the future generations can go and they can actually see it physically.

>> And you marked the beginning, 1983.

>> Correct.

>> You know, I think probably some people in the lay public would think, well, wouldn't it be 9/11 or would it be 93 and the World Trade Center, like what would be what would be a starting event and tell people why 1983.

>> So 1983 was the bombing of the marine barracks of Beirut, Lebanon.

So we lost three Marines here in Rochester.

So for our county, we include those three, and that is when we include the war on terror.

>> Chad, does that make sense to you as sort of an outline of dates?

>> Absolutely.

It does.

>> So I think that for the general public, too, it's easy to think of conflicts like Vietnam, a World War, Korea, the war on terror is in the minds of the public might be more nebulous.

So they just heard you say, Amy, now that it's over in your mind I guess officially.

So first of all, why do you say it's it's over?

I mean, some people might say, well, look there's still terror concerns around the world, and we could have future conflicts.

Why would you put, like, a dividing line there?

>> Well, for us in that memorial, specifically the like Operation Enduring Freedom is over.

So, you know, the next God forbid, we have one loss.

There would be a new memorial constructed for them because that operation is over.

>> Okay.

do you think the public gets less connected to something like a war on terror just because it's it's over a span of four plus decades, it's a lot of different locations.

It's sometimes singular events, sometimes it's longer campaigns.

Do you think the public has a hard time thinking of it as a singular idea of war?

>> No, I don't think so.

If I'm going to be honest, I think the problem here is the location.

if you were to go to Buffalo, their memorials are all in one location.

they're all right there at the riverbank, and they're all together, and it's not anybody's fault.

our memorials are all in different locations.

We have some at Charlotte Beach.

We have some in some in Henrietta, some in Greece.

And so I think it's just a matter of getting people to know where they all are, to see them all.

>> Okay.

And by the way, so locate people.

I want to drive to the war on Terror memorial today.

I'm going where?

Amy?

>> You're going to Highland Park, which is now Gary Baker Park.

>> Gary Baker park who passed away a few years ago now, correct?

Yeah.

Was always an amazing conversation.

an amazing person in this community.

chance for you.

Do you think the public connects a little less directly to the war on terror?

Do you think people can still connect to it in the same way that they would think about a world war?

Vietnam, et cetera.?

>> I think it's possible.

through more education and just more this is how it affected us here.

you know, you and I have discussed before about how you know, there is no more draft.

and, you know, that's a good thing.

You know, the public doesn't have to sacrifice as much when we go into a declared state of war, assuming that it is a declared state of war, since the process by which that's happens has become kind of not what we put on paper.

but I can understand why people might have a little bit of a more difficult time with a war that was declared on, you know, kind of a concept more as on a nation state, if that makes sense.

>> Yeah, I think that's exactly it.

I think people think about nation state wars.

They think about invasions of territory from one nation state to another.

and maybe my concern in this case would be overlooking it or treating it as less than or something different than those kind of conflicts.

But it sounds like you think just what?

That's I guess that's why you're here today, trying to educate the public.

and so if you do, you want people to be part of cleanup days.

What's coming up here, Amy, that you want people.

>> To know?

Yeah.

So.

>> we have Saturday, October 25th is our cleanup day, right at the memorial.

We do the Vietnam Memorial and the war on terror.

8 a.m.

we have coffee, donuts.

we just ask the community to come out and give us a, you know, 3 or 4 hours of your time and help us clean it up.

>> Whether you're a veteran or not.

>> Correct.

>> You can be a community member.

No.

Veteran?

no military affiliation.

>> That's eight days from now.

Correct.

Starting what time?

>> 8 a.m.

Bright and.

>> Early at 8 a.m.

Bright and early.

That's not even that early.

If you're a veteran.

>> That's right.

>> That's that's probably lunchtime.

you'll be there for that.

Yes.

>> So when you're in an Army platoon, you want to keep the medic happy.

When you're on a hockey team, you want to keep the goalie happy.

And our goalie is getting married that day.

>> Oh, man.

>> So, yeah.

>> And what is this team that you're on?

>> The Flower City Warriors?

>> If you're watching on YouTube, he's got the gear, he's got the swag that.

>> The.

>> I think the last.

>> Time I was here, there was no cameras.

>> Yeah.

This is a big change.

>> Yeah.

we're going to talk more about Flower City Warriors coming up here.

you know, I'm, I think connected to some of what our guests are saying about the public awareness of these kind of conflicts.

I, I think I was watching Ken Burns recently.

He was on the interview circuit because he's got a a forthcoming, I think, a doc series on the Revolutionary War.

And he pointed to a, a letter that John Adams wrote to Abigail Adams, May 12th, 1780.

And I, I think it connects here in certain ways.

I'm going to read that now, he says.

John Adams wrote to Abigail Adams, I must study politics and war so that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy.

My sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history, naval architecture, navigation, commerce and agriculture in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry and porcelain.

End quote.

What he's really saying there is he knew he was at a time of great peril for the country.

There was no guarantee.

There was there was no there was no guarantee that whatever project they were undergoing was going to survive.

But he could see a future where there wasn't a draft, there wasn't every generation called in to mandatory service because there was constant conflict.

And he viewed that as a desirable goal for his descendants.

And in, in, obviously, in ways that it's not a straight line.

But you can argue that that has been achieved.

I think the cost of that is that I think the the further in history you get away from existential conflict, the less appreciative a citizenry becomes of what it costs to create the country or to to fight for the values and ideals that underline that project.

And, you know, maybe you get more jaundiced, you get more cynical.

You know, you I don't know.

And and then you view war in a I'm not this is not me sort of beating the drum to support every war.

And someone's going to call and say, this is just a war mongering.

It's not everyone.

The citizenry should evaluate the decisions of the leaders.

Chad certainly does.

He's not afraid to do that.

We all have to do that.

but I'm concerned that the further you get in history, the more people feel disconnected from military service, history of the country, what it took to preserve and secure the rights that are here, I don't know.

I mean, do you feel that way, Chad?

Do you think that we lose a sense of existential threat over time?

>> so kind of a analogy to that.

I was when I was stationed in Vicenza, Italy.

I back in 2012, Hautboy that was when The Dark Knight Rises came out, and I saw that in the post movie theater.

And there's that scene with the initial fight between Batman and Bane and the line that has always stuck with me is peace has cost you strength.

Victory has defeated you when he's.

And I think he just kind of articulated that pretty well.

>> Peace has cost you strength.

>> Yes.

And it's kind of like you, you always need to stay prepared to a certain extent, because it could happen again.

Whether it's with a nation state or with, you know, 19 hijackers on planes and, you know, it's it's important that we know what came before and how to react to it again, I guess.

>> What do you think, Amy.

>> Yeah, it's like not being complacent.

The more complacent you get.

I mean, they always told us that, you know, just don't be complacent because then if you are, you know, the attack could always come.

>> So complacency kills.

>> Yep.

>> There's been a couple of books in recent years.

Ross Douthat I think David French has written a lot about the concern about what they would call decadence and decadence in this case, is is a society that gets sort of comfortable in peacetime.

And is therefore in some ways unprepared when crisis hits.

So that crisis could manifest in a lot of different ways.

But, you know, I mean, Amy, do you think we're we're raising kids to think that, like, war is part of the past, or do you think people are growing up to understand that there may there's always going to be a need to be serviced and there may there may be future conflicts that we can't foresee.

>> as a mom to two boys I have always taught my children that there will always be conflicts and that you need to be prepared for that as a generation and as a society.

I think that we are on the path to always also teaching them that same ideology.

So I, I would agree that we are on that path.

>> Okay.

What do you see there, Chaz?

>> my nieces aren't old enough for me to start teaching them those lessons yet, but I mean, it's trying to figure out how to phrase this.

Well we've had two kind of high profile conflicts happening in other parts of the world that people have been very aware of over the course of the past two years.

and obviously, the United States is positioned in such a manner that realistically, we have a natural buffer on both sides where if we were to be attacked by another nation state, it's either we're either going to have a lot of advance notice or it's going to be coming from one of two directions.

So, I mean, I, I would hope that people are becoming more aware of the fact that it could happen.

You know, even if it's not exactly analogous to Russia, Ukraine Israel, Hamas.

But, you know, you I only know what's in my own head, frankly.

>> So, yeah, I, I, I was just reading this morning about a, a new film coming out.

Hu.

What's the name of the new film about the nuclear strike on the United States?

It's a brand new film.

Kathryn Bigelow's film.

This is good radio.

I'm forgetting the names of.

It's like forgetting a band name.

You know, when you've had one too many in a bar and just kills the conversation.

There's a new film about a nuclear strike on Chicago, and Idris Elba plays the American president, and it is the attacker is not named intentionally.

The writers of the film said they didn't want to make this about, is it?

House of dynamite?

they didn't want to make it about the United States against Russia, the States, whatever they wanted to make it amorphous because of the nature of the film is to depict how fast things can change when you think that you have everything figured out and you don't always know the source, but the world can change in half an hour, and it's pretty dark.

but it's it's for a purpose.

And if you think about the 1980s, when everyone was thinking about nuclear war, there was a made for TV movie that was one of the most watched films of all time.

Ronald Reagan, even clearly was affected by it and said so in his personal notes.

Now, my my guess is Kathryn Bigelow's film is probably going to get kind of a box office dud.

People are gonna be like, who wants to see a film about that?

>> Well, she made The Hurt Locker, so that's kind of on her.

I mean.

>> Are you not a fan of The Hurt Locker?

>> No.

>> Okay, see, I don't.

Okay.

All right, well, we're not going to get into criticism of films.

but it's more the concept.

I think a lot of people would say like, well, why would I want to?

I think in the 80s, everyone was thinking about it and now it's like, I think people are thinking about it less as a possibility, which is ironic to me given what Chaz and Amy have been saying.

We are not in an era, mostly.

Obviously we're not.

This is not true everywhere, but we're not in an era where the United States is war.

Conflicts are just us being invaded or nation state, nation state.

It's more amorphous than that.

And that's the very notion of what nuclear war could look like in the future.

And yet I think we're thinking about it.

Or maybe you do.

Do you think about nuclear war?

You try not to.

>> well, it's my understanding that either I'm going to be out of it pretty quickly or it's going to be a long, drawn out thing.

So yeah, I don't think about it a whole lot.

But again, that could just be because, you know, my war was not against a country that had that capability.

You know, the next one could be.

>> Well, and I used to watch every season of 24 when it was on.

There was always a mole, by the way, in the government, 2024 ended up having every season had sort of a similar structure, but part of the structure there, Amy, was that what could attack us might not be a nuclear possessing nation state, but someone who gets a suitcase and someone who seeks to do harm.

Do you think about stuff like that?

Do you think about that for.

>> Your kids?

>> Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, my oldest is a senior in high school.

and although I know he's not entering the military you know, I've, I've often thought when he travels you know, we're a family that travels all the time.

So we wanted to go to Europe a couple years ago, and we canceled our trip just because of kind of, you know, being scared of the the what could be.

And but, yeah, I often think about, you know, that.

And then when it happened and you know, it came out and, you know, those countries over there kind of started and, you know, we saw what had unfolded.

my perception changed.

And here we are now.

>> Amy Folwell is chair of the Monroe County War on Terror memorial at Gary Kirk Memorial Park.

If you want to see it and if you want to go to the cleanup day, it's cleanup for I think, Chaz said.

It's also the Vietnam Memorial.

Correct.

Has a has a cleanup.

So it's next Saturday starting at 8 a.m.

They're going to go to around noon.

And they would love for the public to be there.

So you could see the memorial that a lot of people didn't know existed.

It opened four years ago on the 20th anniversary of the 9/11 attacks.

So you can go check that out and be part of the cleanup.

They would love to see you there.

Amy.

Do you find when people do discover that exists, are you connecting with more vets from the war on terror from different conflicts through this memorial?

>> I wouldn't say I'm connecting with them from different conflicts.

I'm finding that I'm connecting with more civilians.

and through different agencies and different businesses.

>> And in what ways then, like when you say civilians, more so than veterans.

>> Yeah.

Because I mean, different conflicts we have, like the Vietnam veterans, I really kind of know because I sit on the board for that.

and then, like, our generation will go so those are really the only two, you know, generations.

So I meet more civilians that are walking through the park and will, you know, contact me than I really do.

Veterans that are going there.

>> do you think, Chaz, these memorials can create a sense of community that didn't previously exist?

>> I would like to think so.

I mean we had a fair amount of people show up to the last cleanup.

it wasn't much of a cleanup because it was pouring rain.

>> It was pouring.

>> Oh, my God, I just felt awful.

I'm.

I'm rake in and, you know, trying to help people get this place squared away.

And it's just like it's not working at all.

And the Lilac Festival was the next week, so.

But yeah, I mean, I would like to think that it can, you know, like a shared what's the word I'm looking for?

Kind of like a history, I guess, in terms of, hey, these are the people who made a difference in our community, whether they did it in our community or halfway across the world.

I'd like to think we could get to that point.

>> All right, so next Saturday, the 25th is the cleanup day.

I also want to talk to both of our guests a little bit about before we talk about warriors and some other things in the community.

I, you know, was getting ready for this program.

It's my first time meeting Amy in person.

And read a little bit about your story, because our colleagues in the local media have covered your story quite a bit this year.

It's been a very busy year for you.

>> It has.

>> so I want to go back a little bit to what what happened earlier this year.

I think your collapsed lung was this year.

>> It was.

>> What happened?

>> so I was outside shoveling and thought I pulled a muscle and ended up having a collapsed lung.

went to the VA and was taken over to Highland.

And then strong and had my collapsed lung surgery at strong.

>> And reading a little bit about your own story, that doesn't appear to just be sort of a randomized event in your life.

What does that connect to?

>> the burn pits in Iraq is what I'm obviously going to connect it to.

I'm a healthy you know, 38-year-old who's never smoked never done anything like that.

And so the doctors had actually said a collapsed lung would be a middle, a middle aged like, tall gentleman, Caucasian.

so it was kind of random.

>> So for people who don't know what a burn pit is, you want to explain a little bit about that?

>> Yeah, sure.

>> So when you're over in Iraq and you're exposed to the toxicity you know, we're actually standing there and burning the chars and you know, the literally feces or urine, whatever else that we want to throw in the burn pits or whatever else is in the burn pits, if you will.

>> There's something called wag bags.

>> Correct.

>> Wag is waste alleviating gel, right?

>> Yep.

They were green Frost.

Did you have wag bags?

>> no, we didn't have those.

the any of the cops?

I was posted at I at least not that I had to handle.

I mean, I can't speak for everything that was happening on FOBs or combat outposts where I was, but it this was this wasn't done as much when I was downrange.

>> Your service was, you said 12, 2012.

>> Yes.

>> Yours, 2007.

We're talking about 2007 here.

So has the practice changed on that now?

It sounds like it has.

>> It may have.

>> Yeah.

I.

>> I, I'm, I think it does I mean I haven't been downrange in a while obviously, but with the amount of attention it's getting, I would have to imagine that it's been.

>> Yeah.

So people like Amy, who you end up years later with a collapsed lung, likely because of toxins that you were breathing in during the burning of these wag bags and being near these burn pits.

You're not the only one.

But I wonder,, does the VA system does the health insurance system say, yep, we have enough evidence we can connect that you're covered, you're good.

you're shaking your head negative.

>> It was found on service related.

>> On the system said that your collapsed lung at the age of 38.

>> Was not.

>> Service was not related to service.

Even though in 2007.

>> Correct.

>> It was not service related.

Because while I was in service, I never went to medical to say that my lung hurts or that I was having breathing issues, or that I had asthma.

>> So you.

>> Had to have some kind of documentation that at the time that bothered you.

>> Correct.

>> But what if it didn't bother you at the time?

>> Well, then that's the issue.

>> There are people who.

work on the cleanup pile at nine over who died pretty quickly, and there are people who years later had problems.

And I think the system said the same thing, like, well, you know, you might have worked on on the pile, but you didn't have a problem at the time.

So I don't think we can connect your lung issues to your breathing issues, your disease to that same thing for you.

>> Right.

>> So what do you do about that?

>> Well.

>> We appealed it and it's in the appeals process.

And I'm confident that it will be approved.

But this is the system that we fight.

>> Appealed against too, by the way.

Like I mean, like who is the one telling you that you are not approved.

>> Just the regional VA office.

>> The Veterans Administration of the United States.

>> Correct?

>> I not nearly a collapsed lung.

I want to make this very clear.

Okay.

But I had kind of a similar situation this past year.

We're very fortunate on the team to have one of our board members whose day job is the VSO for Ontario County.

So he knows a lot of the tricks he has.

He handles a lot of claims for the team.

I filed claims for one condition that I thought was going to be very difficult for me to service, connect, and I filed a claim for tinnitus because my ears are ringing right now.

Because, you know, if you're shooting an unsuppressed weapon without with ear pro, the best way is to use both.

And they army only gives suppressors to the cool guys.

They give ear pro to everybody else.

So my ears are ringing right now.

The only thing that's stopping them from ringing is the fact that we're having a conversation.

and the the VA says that my tinnitus has nothing to do with my service.

So we're appealing that as well.

But it is it is frustrating when that happens.

Yeah.

>> I, I'm laughing because I just find it absurd.

do your ears ring all the time?

>> Yes.

I need a white noise machine to sleep.

>> All the time.

So.

So what do you do next?

What's the status for you, Chaz?

>> I'm in appeal as well.

I can pull up the VA app.

Well, no.

I turned off my phone because they told us to turn off our phones.

>> No.

That's okay.

>> Yeah.

No, it's the VA does have an app, and it does kind of give you a rundown of everything that's currently happening.

You know, a proof of service card.

what status of any current claims that you have is your current disability level payment information, so on and so forth.

So I've been in appeals since September 2nd.

because Kyle called me up basically when he got the paperwork across his desk and he's like, yeah, don't worry, I'm going to appeal this because not only is it ridiculous, but they didn't actually do the claim.

Right.

So this will be very easy for us to, you know, handle.

But it's on someone else's timeline now basically.

>> Have you both had out of pocket expenses while you're waiting to try to get reimbursed by the system?

Or has it been reasonable to deal with.

>> I haven't, but.

>> Okay.

Amy.

>> No, I've actually had a very, good VA experience here in Rochester.

>> Good.

>> I haven't experienced anything bad.

My healthcare has been good.

My providers are excellent.

in fact, when I had my collapsed lung my primary care was out of the world.

Phenomenal.

So I don't have anything negative to say about VA.

>> Okay, how about the folks who denied the claim, though?

>> I mean, but you have to understand where they're coming from, though.

I mean, with all of the fraud and the VA health care system we can't knock them.

They're doing their job.

>> Right.

So this is.

>> A fair point, though.

Is there a lot of fraud?

100% in the system?

>> Yeah, 100%.

I mean, there was just an article that came out out of Philadelphia.

There was an auditor who I think it was like $86,000 out of I don't know, 3 or 5 years that he had approved for veterans.

So, you know, you can argue not all capes were or not all heroes wear capes.

Or you can argue the, you know, the fact that, you know, he just slid out and did his job.

But, you know, they're doing a job and we have to, you know, kind of work that system and be patient.

So I'm just being patient.

We'll see what happens.

>> Okay.

So the level of care you've had is, has been.

>> Good 100% okay.

>> And as long as this ends up getting covered, you're going to be satisfied.

>> Yes.

>> And you expect that eventually it will get covered.

>> It will.

Yeah.

>> Okay.

>> I go right here to to Nick's office there, and my vsos wonderful.

Scott's good to me, so.

>> Okay.

>> I'll be good.

>> Okay.

Chaz, what about you?

Has your level of care been good?

>> Yeah.

Same boat.

they've always been very good.

I mean, the the main thing is, of course, as we discussed the last time I was on the program, the process by which you get in the claim system is, you know, you don't know it until somebody explains it to you.

And you know, I, I actually thought initially I could just go to the VA and say, hey, you know, my, my ears ring and I can't sleep without a white noise machine.

And that would, you know, kick start the process that does not kick start the process at all.

I needed to go over to my as we discussed my initial claim for my back was with Nick and the Monroe County guys as well.

and even that was a process, you know, as we talked about, that was initially denied and we had to appeal it.

and then obviously going through the same thing with tinnitus right now.

>> Okay.

But you expect eventually this will get taken care of.

>> I do, yeah.

>> Okay.

how do you view the level of overall service, care, et cetera.

at the VA?

Been a lot of talk this year, obviously, about possible cuts, the set, the shutdown aside.

But any possible cuts how are how are you assessing what the VA is doing with the federal government doing.

And if you do anything different?

Chaz.

>> I have a master's degree in engineering management, which had a fair amount of focus on Lean Six Sigma and you know, all that stuff.

So my, my gut instinct is always make it smaller, make it more efficient.

And, you know, cuts are actually for the better.

So I do kind of approach things from that perspective, as you well know.

but and that's my personal perspective to my with regard to your point, I would say what's what's what we're doing right now, it's not working for a lot of people.

So doing the same thing is not is not the same is not the right answer either, in my opinion.

So it could be that cuts are the wrong answer, but it could also be that they're the right answer.

And at least we're trying something different.

>> Okay, Amy.

>> Yeah, I think I think when the cuts first happened, I think a lot of people thought we were cutting from the top and we were cutting, you know, main providers and therapists, and that wasn't what was happening.

cuts are going to happen and they're needed.

And and what's happening and what has happened isn't effective.

And so let's fix it and let's make our VA better for our vets.

And if that means we have to cut a couple people, that means we have to cut a couple people.

>> Okay.

when we come back from our only break of the hour, I do want to talk a little bit more about warriors and other things happening in our community.

I want to ask our guests what they think the veterans community does need, because I, I hope their health care needs get met.

Well, I mean, they're getting met.

I just hope you don't have a huge bill.

You know, I mean, it can be a shock.

My twin brother broke his leg in two places and was handed a bill for $110,000.

And, you know, that's a terrifying thing.

This wasn't any time recently.

And that has since been handled.

But bills can explode.

I, I'm sure they're going to be fine, because I am sure any system that sees tinnitus or a collapsed lung from someone who was, you know, dealing with burn piles is is pretty easily connected dots here.

But I also take our guests point that there is a lot of fraud in the system and that they want a system that is going to police the fraud, too.

So we're talking about a lot of different issues.

I know that our guests would love to see you come out to the memorials, the Vietnam Memorial and the War on Terror memorial.

If that is not a memorial you've been to, that's a great chance to do that.

And maybe we'll put a little map and a link in our show notes so people know where to find that, because Amy's point earlier this hour is an important one.

Some communities have all their war memorials together, and some are spread out all over the place, like Rochester.

So the war memorial or the War on Terror memorial has existed since 2021.

It's only four years old, and they want more people to know about it.

Amy is the chair of the Monroe County War on Terror memorial.

Charles Belfield is here.

Chaz's veteran of Operation Enduring Freedom, and he's president of the Flower City Warriors Veterans hockey team, will come right back with them next on Connections.

I'm Evan Dawson Monday on the next Connections, we start a series of conversations with candidates for town supervisor positions, and we've got the candidates together.

Kind of a rare opportunity these days.

We start on Monday in Trenton, where the candidates are Kieran Hanna and Jen Townsend.

They'll sit down and talk about issues facing their town, and I think you're going to be surprised at how universal these themes are.

Talk with you Monday.

>> Support for your public radio station comes from our members and from Mary Cariola, center, proud supporter of Connections with Evan Dawson, believing an informed and engaged community is a connected one.

Mary Cariola.org.

>> This is Connections.

a listener sends me a note saying that one of the reasons that people may feel less connected to a War on Terror memorial is because there have been controversies about some of the conflicts and points me to a previous conversation we had on this program.

After the pullout of Afghanistan and sort of the disaster that unfolded there and how the chaos and frankly, how a lot of service members who've come on this program have told us that that was hard to watch.

not only the loss of life, but the ending a mission that a lot of service members devoted years to and felt very strongly about.

But they also understood that in American politics, for years, it was very popular to say we were getting out of Afghanistan sort of, no matter the party.

So this listener is saying that some of those conflicts don't line up so snugly as well.

Vietnam, of course, was controversial.

Of course.

I mean, my father wouldn't talk about it for decades after his service because of what he experienced when he was home or the division in his own family, family members who wouldn't go.

And he felt that they should.

So maybe, you know, maybe a conflict is always controversial.

But, Chaz, do you think some of the nature of some of the war on terror conflicts affects the way the public sees it?

>> I mean, I definitely remember being even in elementary school and knowing that it was there was a lack of popularity about these Operation Iraqi Freedom possibly extending to Operation Enduring Freedom, especially since probably there were a fair amount of people who didn't distinguish between the two.

I can definitely see the emailers point.

but.

You know, it's just take the opportunity to kind of look at this stuff.

So either you understand what's necessary sometimes, or maybe so that you understand the full aspects of what happens when somebody gets deployed downrange and the cost of that.

>> And yeah, I think that's well said.

Amy.

>> Yeah.

I think most definitely.

You know, I held a little vigil at the Brighton Park at the pullout of Afghanistan, and I can specifically remember what that looked like.

And, you know, being the chair of this and understanding the community's perspective about that.

I get it.

But on the flip side, I look at the Gold Star families and my whole mission and the mission of the people on this committee is to remember the 34 and to keep their legacies alive.

And there are so many people on the Vietnam Memorial who, like even myself, I'm guilty of like, I don't know their names and I don't ever want these 34 to just be a name on a wall like, you know, Staff Sergeant Allen, his daughter, works at Mission Barbecue.

Jason Hasenauer, his daughter just went to college.

Like, that's the whole point.

>> I feel like I.

>> Covered that story.

It feels like yesterday.

>> Right?

And so these are people within our own community that are still here.

And so if people within our community could just remember that they're still here, like it was not that long ago and go there and just pull a name and do a Google search, and it's not about the war, it's about the sacrifice that they did and then about the families and those Gold Star families.

Most of them are still here.

>> the haze and our story.

I remember covering and frankly, in the aughts, there were a lot of stories like that.

there was a lot of loss.

And every story you would meet different families, and you feel like the whole community felt the loss.

But to Amy's point, I mean, it's 2025.

I didn't you know, I'm not thinking every day about those things.

But yeah, those kids would be in college.

I mean, like the family they have needs and they've lost someone.

It's the reason that my uncle wrote a book called Backtracking in Brown Water.

He went back to Vietnam and Cambodia 40 years after serving in the brown water Navy, because he wanted to number one, he wanted to kind of retrace his route and see what was there.

40 years later.

But then he went all across North America tracking down the families of the service members who served around him, who he saw die.

And he wanted to know 40 years later, what has that loss meant for your family?

And it was not an easy book for him to write.

you know, and I'm recommending it because it's my uncle, but it's a great book.

and the The power of the loss the years later, it's it's easy to forget people.

It was easy for him to see that people felt sort of forgotten and left behind.

>> Yeah.

>> and which is probably a similar story that unfortunately, you've probably heard before, too.

Amy.

>> Yeah, absolutely.

>> I mean, I feel like, you know, we have Memorial Day and then we have Veterans Day, and they're two very different days.

But then we have 364 other days a year.

And the general community isn't going to remember them.

Those other days, but their families certainly are.

And so, again, you know, people go there on Lilac Fest or, you know, Gay Pride Fest or any other festival that's at that park, but get out there just more than that, or take the time during the day to, you know, reflect and remember.

Because without them, where would this country be and what would we be doing?

And that's kind of the whole point of getting the awareness out there.

>> Yeah.

And, you know, again, I'm thinking about those interviews.

I've seen Ken Burns do this month as he gets ready to launch his newest doc series.

You know, he's very passionate and patriotic about this country and what it means.

And he points out that the 1776 sort of miracle was that this was a different kind of project, that the notion of authoritarianism was the standard of the world.

The people were not meant to be free.

Even back in Britain.

They viewed it as mob rule.

They went, you're going to go with mob rule.

That's going to be your system.

Mob rule.

No, you need a few smart.

You know, well-educated people who come from a long lineage of decision makers who are going to have the power.

You're crazy to have.

Mob rule is what they thought it was a revolutionary idea in more ways than one.

And it has taken a lot to protect it.

I understand how some people feel about the imperfections of this country, but the idea is pretty damn amazing.

And what we've had to do to protect that has involved a lot of loss.

And for people who have felt forgotten, I mean, I am not a veteran.

I have veterans in my family.

My father couldn't talk about it for years, did not feel respected after his service, you know, had a real hard time with that.

so I just appreciate Chaz's point two.

However you feel about individual conflicts, there's a difference between the conflict, the mission, and the individuals, and I don't know that we always make that distinction, I guess.

So what would you like to see in the future of the War on Terror memorial?

I mean, I think I was reading that you're looking for.

volunteers in in your generation.

especially.

So why did you note in your own generation?

>> because when you see Vietnam veterans, go and do their own cleanup and get down on their hands and knees and gather in solidarity, and then you can't gather four of your own generation.

It really it breaks my heart, you know, because the truth is, is that if we can't gather and we can't keep this memorial going, where does it go?

It goes to the county.

And that's really the truth.

And so the Vietnam vets are, you know, they're fading away.

And it's going to be our generation's responsibility to take this over.

And so if we can't come together, then it becomes their responsibility.

>> So how do people get involved?

>> So you get involved.

We have Facebook.

We have a website.

we have a phone number.

We have an email address.

It's all posted online.

You reach out, you contact us.

We have meetings there once a quarter, for five minutes.

And I understand we have lives, we all work, we have young kids, we have jobs.

time is of essence.

Like it's important and it's valuable.

But this is also critical.

And it doesn't take a lot.

It really doesn't.

>> What's the.

>> Website?

>> oh.

Memorial.

>> W o memorial.com.

and before we talk wars, anything you want to add on that point?

What people can do?

>> I just to kind of extend on Amy's point, you're also seeing that issue with the VFW and the American Legion.

You know, they're they're starting to run out of members as well.

And you're not seeing global war on terror veterans kind of pick up in the same way.

there's a, you know, in my post and at the post where we started brainstorming this idea, there's a fair amount of young members, but most of them are definitely Vietnam era.

So, I mean, if you are a veteran out there and you're looking for that sense of tribe, you know, whether it's the Legion, the VFW, I mean, you'd be a Sons of Legion qualifier as well.

Evan whether it's, you know, the Flower City Warriors hockey team the music program that you had on a few months ago those are all great people to just, you know, not only do it to help the veteran community, but do it to help yourselves as well.

>> I think the Chazz's point, one of the reasons that people feel disconnected is not because they don't want to be part of things they often don't know.

I mean, it's the same way that people react to Amy when they find out, wait, there's a War on Terror memorial.

Now, you know, even veterans may not know that.

So to that extent, let's talk a little bit about what the Warriors are.

What do you want people to know?

I mean, you guys got a lot of players already, don't you?

>> We just hit 53 do players over the course.

>> I mean, how do you even get ice time?

>> That's tricky.

youth, you know, youth, kids.

Get off my lawn.

Taking up all the ice.

but no, it's funny.

the last time I was on the program I get a phone call from as I'm signing out downstairs.

Biloxi, Mississippi.

And I know I just mispronounced Biloxi, I do.

>> I think it's.

>> Biloxi.

>> Isn't it?

I do it to mess with a friend of mine who was stationed there.

Okay, I'm literally pick up the phone.

I was like, hey, I'm listening to WXXI right now.

You're talking about a veteran hockey team.

Can I join?

guys, our top scorer now?

FCC regulations prevent me from saying his nickname on air, but.

yeah, I mean, it's it's been a good couple years.

we we're having another game at military Appreciation Night with the Amerks.

This time, we're bringing down the Fort Drum mountaineers for the rubber match.

We lost to them in March.

Beat them in September.

So we'll see who wins.

>> When is that?

>> That is January 24th.

fourth against the Cleveland Monsters.

I better not see you wearing the wrong jersey at the rink.

>> As a Clevelander.

Come on, man, used to be the old Cleveland Barons back in the day.

>> Yes.

Who merged with the Minnesota North Stars?

They're the last team in NHL history to merge with another team.

>> Always something to make us Clevelanders feel less than.

So that's coming up in January.

But if you want to learn more about what warriors are and how to get involved, do you still have any room for people?

>> Yes, we do, and we obviously we've we're very proud that now we've got both a rookie team and a novice plus team.

And you know, we've got we fill in other you know, roster slots as necessary.

Kind of depends on the event, whether it's just, you know, weekly beer league or we're going down to Johnstown, the rink where they film slapshot to play in their Veterans Day tournament.

this upcoming November.

we also have a event against Flour City Special hockey.

As I mentioned last time on the program, Warrior hockey is a disabled discipline of USA hockey for disabled veterans.

Special hockey is a disabled discipline of USA hockey for those with developmental disabilities.

So we're doing our second annual scrimmage against them on November 9th at Scottsville Ice Arena.

there's plenty of opportunities to get involved, play, learn hockey.

We do weekly skates with Steve Langdon, the Amerks alumni and computer core.

Every Sunday, Jenny Ice Arena from 4 to 5. lots of information.

you can go to Flower City Warriors.

That's o w not o u that gets you to another team entirely.

Greg sedgewick's team who for some strange reason hasn't you know, signed up with us yet.

I keep trying to get him, but I know he's been on this program, so if he's listening now, Flower City Warriors.com.

>> Flower f o w e r. Yes.

Now, I'm kind of a serious note here.

I mean, you're pretty competitive, right?

Competitive person.

>> A little bit.

>> I mean.

>> Does an outlook like this do you find in general I want to broad brush the category of veterans, but do you find that you need to have something that is sort of high adrenaline competitive?

That is an outlet for you?

>> It definitely helps.

I know when we got back from Afghanistan our leadership was pushing that a lot.

You know, obviously being stationed in Italy, the Alps were literally a stone's throw away.

So there was a lot of snowboarding and skiing base stuff that was kind of in that vein.

you know, I know there were some skydiving opportunities, although we were an airborne unit.

So we were sort of skydiving all the time.

but it, I would say it definitely, for me at least, it is helpful to have that.

But, you know, again, there's other there's tons of veteran opportunities out there that aren't necessarily the kickstart my heart kind of thing.

you know, Elizabeth from Compeer sends out an email every week with a lot of things that are happening in the community, you know, follow the Veterans Outreach Center socials.

They're promoting stuff.

There's stuff out there.

And whether it's you needs to be a collision sport like hockey, or you just want to sit down and learn a new instrument with the Rock Veterans Music program.

You know, there's something out there for you.

>> Do you find out, do you find, Amy, that you have needed anything to kind of get your juices going, post post 27 to 2007?

>> yeah.

Rochester is very rich with services.

here.

And you just kind of have to find them.

But once you find them, they're everywhere.

you know, he mentioned the VOC and Compeer sunny Mike has services and activities.

Soldier on one soldier on, and has stuff as well.

>> What was the other?

it was you, sunny Mike.

And there was one other one that got the donations from the Greece Legion concert.

Was it it was the horse therapy one.

Right.

before the last call.

so.

>> the candidate will.

Lacrosse.

>> Yes.

Shoot out for.

>> Soldiers.

>> Shoot out for soldiers.

So if you like lacrosse there are another good one.

>> There's a local team Ruby chapter as well.

Correct.

>> Okay.

And before we go.

>> Plethora of things.

There's a lot.

>> You can.

>> Do if you're.

>> Gonna do the hockey thing.

Do you?

You said there's a novice team.

I mean, like, if if you can barely skate, can you still.

>> Do it?

>> You can absolutely do that.

Like I said, Jenny ice arena 4 to 5 on Sundays.

you can go to our website and check the outlook calendar that's on there to confirm that it's happening that weekend.

But we have gear for you.

We have people who will help you, you know, try to work on your skating ability, whether it's you can't skate at all or you need to learn how to skate backwards or stop, or you want to run some drills with some of the alumni and co-chair, captain Frank.

All those guys.

>> All right.

And our last minute here before we go one more time, I want Amy, who's the chair of the Monroe County War on Terror memorial, to tell listeners who've never heard of the Monroe County War on Terror memorial what it is, where to find it, and what's going on.

Eight days from now.

You got about a minute.

>> Eight days from now, we have the cleanup at the Memorial Highland Park that, you know, it's now the Gary Bykerk Memorial Park.

Come out 8 a.m.

Saturday the 25th.

we have donuts, coffee.

give us a hand cleaning it up.

November 1st to the 30th.

across the street at untamed New.

Trish, we have a fundraiser all month long.

Grab a drink.

we're going to be doing a donation fundraiser there.

the Veterans Day parade, November 8th.

We're looking for spectators specifically to watch the parade in honor our veterans.

that's what we've got going on.

You can find some more information on our website, as well as social media.

More specifically, we're just looking for exposure.

Exposure will bring in everything else.

So that's what we say.

>> Well, thanks for making time.

Amy Folwell.

Cha cha cha cha.

I was thinking of cha pits.

Oh my goodness gracious.

That got in my head.

Continued.

Good luck to your health here.

>> Thank you.

>> Chair of the Monroe County War on Terror Memorial.

Thank you for your service.

Thanks for being here.

>> Thank you.

>> Cha Belfield.

Same.

cha is president of the Flower City Warriors veteran hockey team.

And now you know how to try to get some ice time.

Elbows up.

>> Go, Amerks.

Go, Warriors.

>> Thanks for being here, Ches.

And from all of us at Connections.

Thanks for listening.

Thanks for watching.

We're back with you next week on member supported public radio.

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