Yeah.

Due to the significant roles played by Colorado's black communities, the Aaron Harbor Sho is honoring Black History Month with a selectio of a variety of past programs.

As is the case with all of his shows.

These programs were recorded with each guest and Aaron together in studio or side by side on location.

These shows were recorded over a span of two decades.

You also can view them at Bitly, slash, Aaron, hyphen, PBS and Harbor TV.com.

The eclectic sample of the past guests selected for this special series include the following.

Former Denver Mayor Wellington Webb.

The Reverend Jesse Jackson world musician Taj Mahal, media magnate Byron Allen, civil rights icon Joh Lewis, and general Colin Powell.

We hope you enjoy the series and the celebration of these inspirational icons who happen to be black.

The following program features Wellington Webb, who was Denver's first black mayor.

He is the only mayor in U.S. history to serve as president of the U.S. Conference of Mayors, the National Conference of Democratic Mayors, and the National Conference of Black Mayors.

Among his many accomplishments, Mayor Webb oversaw the vast majority of the $4 billion construction of Denver International Airport.

He also added an historical record of more than 2000 acres of new Denver parks and open space for Denver citizens to enjoy.

I'm honored to introduce my guest today, former Mayor Wellington Webb.

I've been honored to know Mayor Webb for a long time.

I'm not going to say how long, and I asked him to join me t talk not only about his tenure as mayor, but also to share his visio for the city of Denver's future and to tell us what his advice would be for the next mayor of Denver.

Mr. mayor, thanks for being here.

It's good to be here.

Always good to see you.

When you look back, when you first took office, because we were about to have a new mayor taking office.

What?

What surprised you the most when you first took office?

I had been city auditor.

Prior to being mayor.

So I knew where most of th issues that needed to come up, where they were going to b in three in particular, Denver General Hospital had a $38 million deficit that, need to be paid off.

We were building an airport with no leases.

There was one lease sign that was with Continental Airlines.

They were in bankruptcy.

The largest airline that, had, 67% of the business o the airport was United Airlines.

And I needed to get them signed.

And then the normal issue of hiring staff, hiring cabinet, picking a security team, determining who's going to be doing what, and to make sure that the people that were hired share your values.

You can't have an administration where people have different values than you do.

It's like, doesn't work.

Chemistry is not right.

And I was very pleased that we were able to do that.

When we announced for mayor, we were at 7% in the polls in December 1990.

And, so to me, many of the people that are the most special, those people that were with me when I was at 7% and everybody said I couldn't win, and the only person I knew who thought I could win was the woman that told me that, it was okay, me running for mayor when the woman I said, I put red rocks and I said, I thin I want to be mayor that one day.

And she said, I know you will, and we'll do it together.

We could tell things were shifting because befor all we had was Fords and Chevy's that people honking for us.

And then when it switched over to to, Mercedes and BMW as I said, the election's over.

My second year as mayor.

The Klu Klux Klan decides they're going to protest the King holiday in Denver.

And I'm like, why the hell you pick Denver?

First time I'm I'm for the first black mayor in the city.

And now I got to deal with the Klan.

And then then the issue became, do I allow the Klan to speak or do I not allow the Klan to speak?

Most of the students at CU came down and said, you can't let him speak, you black.

You can't let them do that.

And I said, well, we can't deny them freedom of speech.

You don't have to go up to the Capitol to hear them call you a nigger.

You can do that at home.

But what we need to do is to make sure that, we give them the same rights and benefits, which as this is a democracy, and that's what we do.

And, ACLU made that ruling in in a case of Klan speaking in, Skokie, Illinois, the second one.

And I said again, why is this all happening on my watch?

Columbus Day, I'm like, well, why do I have to deal with Columbus Day?

Well, Colorado was the first state in the countr to pass a Columbus Day holiday.

And so on one side, I go progressives and liberals here.

Then I got members of the Italian community here and they're about to meet and, you know, I had to deal wit Russell Means telling me he's, you know, Indian off the reservation.

I said, no, you're not.

You born and raised in Los Angeles.

I know exactly where you come from.

And then I got to deal with this.

When the Italian community put this one kid, 19 years old, u to be the leader of the group.

And I said, look, young man I'm gonna give you a suggestion.

If you come around that corner and they're more Indians tha they are Italians, you call me because I do not want you to look like George Custer.

I will take police time, and I will make sure you get up to the, get up to the state capitol, which is what we did, because I was prepared to arrest both Indians and Italians that particular day.

A comical story is that, Stephen Wolfra United Airlines called because he's United Airlines, and he said that, he wanted to come to Denver.

And I said, well, that's great.

I've been looking forward to meeting you and looking forward to you coming to Denver.

And, how soon can you come?

Because we need to talk about a lease in order to build a new airport.

And he said a couple of months.

And so I said, well, where are you going to land your aircraft this weekend?

And he said, I' going to land him at Stapleton.

I said, but you don't have any gates at Stapleton.

The state's at gate a Stapleton are owned by the city.

And you don't have a contract with the city.

And then I hear this pause on the fil and he says, you can't do that.

And I said, man, I'm too new to know what I can't do yet.

So now you can take a chance on not coming here and me shutting you gates down, or you can take a chance.

And I think he had read.

I also, locked up the Broncos training facilit when they didn't pay the taxes.

They thought I was bluffing, too.

So we met at strings and, after two dinners, we agreed that, they would sign a contract, which they did on.

The bad part was it had a baggage system included in it that didn't work.

But we needed to have them on board.

And so they did agree, because they were 67% of traffic.

So that was probably one of the biggest issues we had to deal with.

It was also the biggest change order $65 million to gut the terminal in order to put the baggage system in.

In 1991, airport opened late, as you know, didn't open till February 28th, 1995.

I think, that baggage syste ate one of my bags, by the way.

Probably did or or sent it to Wyoming.

What?

That same difference.

So when I go over to meet John Hickenlooper and Helen, kind of a pass the torch.

And I always had this thing about women not getting the respect that she deserved as first lady of Denver, when we could give it to everybody else.

And I always said they didn't do it because she was black.

So we go over and they take this photo, and the next morning I pick up the Denver Post.

There's a picture.

Helen John Hickenlooper, me.

And that was it.

And so I called the post and said, you don't have to explain this to my wife because this is unacceptable.

I can't explain it.

I enjoy campaigning, I mean, I thrive on that.

To me, that's better than you and I hookin up, playing basketball at the Y.

So I'm knocking on a door and Harvey Park is all white.

Gentleman comes to the door.

He opens the door and locks the screen in gray column and sits with me and he says, oh, this is not good.

This is not good.

And I said, hello, I'm Wellington Webb I'm running for mayor of Denver, and I'd love to have you support, and I'd be willing to bet you've not met anyone else running for mayor.

And then he unlocked a screen and he looked back.

He said, hey, man, that colored fellow we're voting for is on the porch.

So call it says he called you.

Could I say I don't care what he call me?

He said he's voting right.

And he told his wife how she's voting too.

So we will correct the terminology later.

But is it Denver Post and Rocky Mountain News?

Neither paper endorsed me and we won anyway.

One of the things you and I have talked about in the past is leadership.

And I've.

I'd like your thought about how leadership has changed compared to when you were in office and today, how how what do you have to do or what does somebody have to do today to be a good leader?

Or is there no difference?

No, I think there's always a difference.

I think leadership starts with integrity and character.

People either have it or they don't.

And most people know who has it and who doesn't.

People that, you know, slip around, track cuts, side deals and, You'd be surprised how many deals I've been offered.

Those people that stand up and know who their constituency is.

To me, those are the real heroe that show the most leadership.

They don' have a specific interest group.

What they have is what's best for Denver.

You do what you do.

You know you're the commander in chief.

You're the one that's in front.

You're the one that has to make the decisions, and you're the one that has to make decisions.

In many cases, tell your friends, know and understand that every political person that comes up and says that they're your best friend or not their business associate, they're not your best friend.

To me, your best friend is somebody you invite over to your house when the diapers are dirty, your mother in law is there, and then you can go in and watch TV and have a beer.

Otherwise you're not.

You're not your friend.

I do want to say one thing, about Wilmer Webb.

I mean, she has been one o the most extraordinary leaders.

Whether black, female or not, in this, in this city, in this community, broke so many barriers.

Her legacy as a state legislator is historic.

And, I just would like to see everybody give her a round of applause for, What would some of your advice be to the next mayor?

Define who you are to the public as a whole, and also define who you are to yourself.

Don't fall into the Ted Kennedy issue when they said, why are you running for president?

And he stumbled for 25 minutes trying to figure out why he's running for president, and know what you want to achieve and what you want to accomplish when you get there.

And it has to be more than a slogan.

The city terminated one employee, Hispanic senior.

I going to terminate him during Christmas week.

Now, to me, that's a role government can use common sense to say if we're going to do it, we're not going to do it during Christmas week, you know that.

And then you wonder why city employees don't want to work for you, because you don't have the common sense and common decency to give people a break, because most people are hard up trying to make ends meet.

And, to be terminated during Christmas holidays.

To me, is is sinful.

Is there anything that comes to mind that would you would recommend that the next mayor do that's really no different.

They need to know the history of the city, and they need to know the history of the city and the people that have served.

For example, we've been Stapleton, you know, the Klan helped get him in office.

But while he was in office, he also bought Red rocks.

I don't think we want to give it back just because he was in the Klan.

I think we probably ought to keep Red rocks and the amphitheater.

And so but we have to understand the history so that we don't take cheap shots at folks because of this or, or or or that, so we got to know the history.

So I'll only give you one on the Park Hill golf course, which I was.

I was shocked when I saw it.

Somebody said, well, blac people couldn't go to the park.

A golf course.

I'm like, when Bill Roberts black when Tyrone Holt black Lucius asked black Ed Garner school board black.

They all playing golf out there.

So that just falls on the face of planting both feet in mid-air and can't come down.

That doesn't make sense.

So I'm not.

So I'm not.

So what I'm saying is that if you're going to take an example to make a point, you got to make sure you've checked the history ou so that the history is accurate.

You can't say black people never use Park Hill Golf Course because they did.

And many of them were elected leaders from this neighborhood and from this community.

I'd be really interested in you take on the issues of the day.

Let me tell you what I think is a more important question.

The more important question is the person you select do they have the temperament?

Do they have the ability to have a sense of humor?

Do they have the ability to get smart people around?

Who do they have the ability to, do the research necessary before making snap judgments?

Do they have the ability to stand up to powerful people and say, no, we're going to do it this way and not that way?

What I hear the most is every mayor for every generation is going to have issues.

Normally public safety is going to be one.

So now we have one.

Refugees, homelessness.

But I thin there are other issues as well.

I mentioned city employees.

I think that all of these issues, each generation has to deal with those issues as they come up.

To me, the most important part is do yo put the right person in office?

They can handle all of those issues, and can they be able the team around them that can handle those issues?

Can you walk the city today, given the given the size of the city, the growth of the city.

Who, me?

Are you talking about other candidates?

I would never question your ability.

You're about to answer Kyle Clarke question.

Yeah, I can I just saw, I don't think I've ever been offended that much, Mr. mayor.

It's with this.

Publi financing has given opportunity for a lot of people to get involved in the race that under ordinary circumstances, couldn't compet because they couldn't afford it.

Because when I was running it was $3,000 a pop to get in.

Now, you know, you can $50 and you get enough contributions.

But I think the other part that I think many candidates are finding out even that is difficult to get, and being elected is even more difficult.

I think me being mayor is the greatest job in the world, and I think it's also the most difficult.

I think, you know, Congress is easy.

They sit up, they talk a lot, and then they pass stuff down to local government, governors mainly concerned b what goes on in their territory.

They more like the Navy.

If you are, if you want arm, if you want mayors, their soldiers, those are the people you see in the grocery store.

Those are the people that spends the expensive gas when they gas up the car, just like you.

And if you don't like what they're doing, you can also see them.

It King Soopers, Whole Foods are or, Safeway or wherever they, they can't escape.

They can't fly to DC and make a pronouncement and be gone for 4 or 5 days.

And I'm going to go back t I mean, a relatively new issue is, concerns about the fact that the Denver, because we are such an attractive city, welcoming city, you know, has had a number of refugees and immigrants come here.

Is there anything the next mayor, should do to address that?

You next mayor obviousl is going to have to have a plan to deal with that whole refugee population, but they also have to have a plan to deal with the homeless, because, as you know, many homeless peopl do not want to go into shelters and don't want to go into whether it's the Coliseum or anywhere else.

I know those are going to be tough decisions.

And I think the other issue, the mayor's going to also have to be thick skinned.

They can't be someone that's going to wimp out first time 40 or 50 peopl getting upset with them or angry with them.

They're going to have to stick with their plan and work their plan to make it make it safe.

As you know, Abraham Lincoln brought just about everyone that ran against him for president in the cabinet so he could get the best of the best.

No, I have biases against certain institutions.

I think Harvard and Yale is okay.

Don't want too many of them because then they thin they are smarter than everybody.

So I want people from MSU.

I want people from Adams State.

I want people from Colorado College.

I take a couple of Harvard and a couple of Yale, but I don't want them dominating the cabinet.

I want people that are local that live here and that, walk the dog.

I had the kids in the stroller or going across the street to play ball.

The big issue I had.

People were complaining that they could not sit in their front yard because gang members were driving down the street, shooting at each other.

If you remember, Broderick Bell got shot 35th and threw about 35th light near Smith's School.

Ignacio Prado got hit with a bullet in the forehead while his parents took him to the zoo.

And so people concerned about what are we going to do about that?

I don't think you ought to be charging people to pick up trash, and especially people are fixed income, and that is seniors.

And I heard the city say well, we've got special programs for seniors that well I think seniors ought to be able remain and have the dignity they have without signing up for a special program.

Every time somebody comes up with money.

We had a bad shooting for a man named Ishmael.

Mina.

Everybody thought the address snitched.

Gave us the address for 3421 I.

And I think it was 3412.

I pull it, Swat team goes in Pensacola can and he shot, killed.

Now the advice from city attorney's office.

Oh, that's.

Oh, you got to have a good city attorney.

That' probably the most important job in city government.

A city attorney that helps you.

Inform you about the la but doesn't try to make the law.

And the city attorney's advice to m was, don't say we made a mistake because then we have liability on the shooting.

My view is everybody know we made a mistake.

So what are we trying to hide?

I mean, we just need to get on TV, radio and say we made a mistake.

We need to sit dow with that man's family and see make some compensation for the loss of his life.

But we can't cover it up.

And I think that's one of the things with these settlements is that the department needs to know, in terms of those officers, how far they can go and how far they can.

And they're also programs like the Star program that that I know that need a Rudy Gonzales is let's see here.

And, I think Jeannie Ritter and others worked on to do to help de-emphasize, de-escalate some of that.

But I think those things have to it have to take place.

But again, it's getting people that you want on your team that have your values.

What's the challenge there in terms of identifying the kind of leadership you're saying is necessary?

And why haven't we done a better job of it?

Well, I don't want to criticize any of my predecessors.

It works for me is de mission, and I had a chemistry with the 12 of us.

If there was a shooting, I'd asked 12 people to 12 years I was mayor, six police officers, thre sheriffs and three firefighters.

I was on the street and every shooting that took place, and I think that when that happens, there's there's also a sense that, you know, what's going on within the department.

I mean, and they weren't always kind to me either.

Call me a Grinch because I didn't give them their pay raise.

And then when I first got elected mayor, all of you will find this interesting.

They ordered my car.

You know what color it was?

Take a guess.

I don't want bright red.

So I said not because I'm mayor.

I don't know if it was because America's.

I'm black.

They think I automatically like red.

So I went over to the police building, put a sign on the police union door.

I appreciate the ordering me a red navigator car.

I went to Manual High School.

The colors are red and blue and since they left off th blue, I'm sending the car back and get an appropriate color later on.

We've got nuggets, avalanche, downtown, Broncos downtown.

They better stay downtown a opposed to looking for the space and the Rockies to downtown.

Now we got to fill up businesses that people want to utilize and see how we can, maybe even work with banks to give loans to those businesses that want to move downtown and stay downtown.

I think that Rico needs to get a get credit for putting the airport north of the city, as opposed to what the business community wanted, was to put the airport south of the city.

And I don't thin he gets enough credit for that.

I think we did a good job in terms of managing it and getting it open, because we built 85% of the airport.

Clearly the needs of our kids in Denver are not being met by the Denver Public school system.

But what's you know, and I know how much you and Wilma care about kids.

The mayor has the mayor.

All mayors have to be an education mayor as well, even though there's no responsibility.

How do you do it for them to do that by the force of their will and the force of their personality?

And they work with the superintendent and they work with, whoever's chair of the school board and they say, this is, this is where we can work together.

A lot of people were pretty angry with me, including my wife.

When I said I was coming out against bussing, she's partly made it because she heard it on the radio before I told her.

So to me, it didn't make sense to be bussing people when we're trying to get people to stay in neighborhood schools.

And now, you know, we've got the kids on one side of town and empty school buildings on the other side of town, because I look at where my grandkids are going to school in, in, in green Valley and, in Green Valley and mine building out that way.

They need more school buildings.

Now, we've got empty school buildings going south, but the mayor has to be an integral part.

I'm not even sure if it might not be good to have a liaison from the mayor's cabinet, to be a education officer, to work with the school board and the superintendent.

If we're going to send our kids to college and for them to ge an education, they need to have that education in a diverse environment.

Now, the good news is, see, you did something I didn't think they had the guts to do.

And that's hiring Dan Sanders.

Diane, because Coach Prime is, given his personality, you have people all across America coming to see you now and and matter of fact, with that taking place, I think that maybe the ethnic count for minority students at CU in Boulder will increase.

Based on footbal and not based upon the academics they were supposed to be but I think it will filter down.

I'd like to thank my guest, Wellington Webb, for joining me today and for being so generous with his time.

You can se all of our programing on PBS 12 as well as online 24 over seven.

Thanks for watching.

We'll see you next time.

Next.

Year.

Next.

Year.

I'm Erin, host of the Aaron Harbor show.

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