ALARMING NUMBER OF NEAR-MISS COLLISIONS BETWEEN AIRPLANES, A PROBLEM THAT'S MORE COMMON THAN PREVIOUSLY UNDERSTOOD, ACCORDING TO A RECENT INVESTIGATION BY "THE NEW YORK TIMES."

IN A REVIEW OF FAA REPORTS AND A NASA DATABASE, "THE TIMES" FOUND THERE WERE AT LEAST 46 CLOSE CALLS INVOLVING COMMERCIAL FLIGHTS IN JULY.

AND RUNWAY INCURSIONS THAT COULD LEAD TO ACCIDENTS ARE 25% HIGHER THAN A DECADE AGO.

TO HELP BREAK DOWN WHAT'S BEHIND THIS AND WHAT CAN BE DONE, I'M JOINED BY OUR AVIATION CORRESPONDENT MILES O'BRIEN.

MILES, IS ALWAYS GREAT TO SEE YOU.

WHAT DOES THE FAA MEAN BY NEAR MISS HER CLOSE CALLS?

MILES: WELL, THERE'S A BUBBLE AROUND EVERY AIRCRAFT, GEOFF, AND THE BUBBLE'S SIZE VARIES DEPENDING ON WHERE THAT AIRCRAFT CAN BE.

IT CAN BE ANYWHERE BETWEEN 3000 AND 6000 FEET, DISTANCE BETWEEN TWO AIRCRAFT, THAT ARE ARRIVING AND DEPARTING AT AN AIRPORT, AND ANY TIME YOU GET INSIDE THE BUBBLE, THAT IS TECHNICALLY CONSIDERED AN INCURSION AND SOMETHING THAT SHOULD BE REPORTED.

THERE ARE DEGREES OF SEVERITY WITHIN THAT.

YOU CAN IMAGINE SOMETHING WITHIN 6000 V, WHICH IS MORE THAN A MILE.

IF IT IS JUST INSIDE THE BUBBLE MIGHT NOT BE A BIG A DEAL, BUT IF IT GETS MORE CLOSE THAN THAT, THE ATTENTION LEVEL GOES UP, AS IT SHOULD.

GEOFF: WHAT WOULD ACCOUNT FOR THE APPARENT UPTAKE IN THESE EVENTS?

WHAT IS THE FAA SAYING ABOUT THAT?

MILES: WELL, STATISTICALLY THE FAA SAYS IT DOES NOT BEAR ITSELF OUT.

IF YOU LEVEL OF THESE STATISTICS, BASED ON THE NUMBER OF ARRIVALS AND DEPARTURES, OVER ONE MILLION ARRIVALS AND DEPARTURES, THERE HAVE BEEN 31 INCURSIONS THIS PARTICULAR YEAR.

NOW THAT ACTUALLY IS ON A LITTLE BIT OF A DECLINE FROM THE PEAK RIGHT AFTER COVID, IT WAS 34 PER MILLION.

HAVING SAID THAT, THERE HAS BEEN A FLURRY OF ACTIVITY, WHICH HAS A LOT OF PEOPLE, THE AVIATION WORLD, AND LITTLE WORRIED.

THE LIGHT IS FLASHING YELLOW, MAYBE READ, AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT SOME OF THE ISSUES HERE, AT THE PART OF IT IS THE FLYING PUBLIC IS BACK WITH A VENGEANCE, AND THE AIRLINE INDUSTRY, AFTER THE PANDEMIC, LOST A LOT OF PEOPLE BOTH IN CONTROL TOWERS AND AN COCKPIT AND HAS NOT BEEN ABLE TO RESPOND QUICKLY ENOUGH TO THIS SURGE IN AIR TRAVEL.

GEOFF: YOU MENTIONED THE SHORTAGE OF AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS.

I REMEMBER REPORTING ON THAT DECADE AGO.

WHY IS THIS SO PERSISTENT, AND WHY IS IT HAPPENING NOW?

MILES: IT HAS GOTTEN WORSE DURING THE PANDEMIC FOR SURE, AND IT HAS BEEN A PERSISTENT PROBLEM, STAFFING THESE AIR TRAFFIC CONTROL TOWERS AND FACILITIES.

DURING THE PANDEMIC, A LOT OF CONTROLLER TRAINING, WELL, IT WAS PRETTY MUCH ELIMINATED BECAUSE OF, YOU KNOW, DISTANCE, SPACING REQUIREMENTS, DUE TO THE PANDEMIC.

AND ANY GIVEN TIME, 20% OF CONTROLLERS ARE TRAINING FOR EITHER TO GET STARTED OR GET A NEW POSITION.

SO THAT CAUSED A HUGE TRAINING BACKLOG ONCE THE PANDEMIC WAS OVER.

THEN YOU HAD SEVERAL CONTROLLERS WHO HAD BEEN, YOU KNOW, TAKING EARLY RETIREMENT, BECAUSE OF THE REDUCED STAFFING INSIDE THESE FACILITIES.

THEY ARE WORKING LONG HOURS, THEY ARE WORKING OVERTIME HOURS, THEIR WORKING STRANGE SHIFTS, AND TO SAY THIS IS A STRESSFUL JOB IS A BIT OF AN UNDERSTATEMENT.

SO THE FAA IS TRYING TO HIRE, BUT, AGAIN, THEY ARE BEHIND THE POWER CURVE HERE, HIRING 1500, 1600 CONTROLLERS, IT WILL BE FOUR OR FIVE YEARS BEFORE THEY ARE UP TO SPEED.

GEOFF: THERE'S ALSO A PILOT SHORTAGE, TOO, RIGHT?

MILES: YES.

THERE'S A LOT OF REASONS FOR THIS.

AFTER THE LAST FATAL AIRLINE CRASH IN THE U.S., WHICH WAS IN 2000 9 -- THAT IS A REMARKABLE 14-YEAR SAFETY RECORD BY THE WAY, GEOFF.

IT'S WORTH POINTING OUT.

CONGRESS INCREASE THE NUMBER OF HOURS REQUIRED FOR PILOTS TO FLY COMMERCIALLY TO 1500, AND THAT HAS, YOU KNOW, RAISED THE BAR FOR YOUNG PILOTS TO GET IN THE GAME.

THE MILITARY IS PRODUCING FEWER PILOTS FOR THE AIRLINES.

THE AIRLINES KIND OF GOT FREE TRAINING OVER THE YEARS.

THE AIRLINES ARE TRYING TO RESPOND BY TRAINING MORE YOUNG PEOPLE THEMSELVES, BUT ALSO, DURING THE PANDEMIC, A LOT OF PILOTS TOOK EARLY RETIREMENT, SO THERE'S A BIG GAP RIGHT NOW, AND IT TAKES A LONG TIME TO FILL THOSE COCKPITS WITH FULLY QUALIFIED PILOTS.

GEOFF: WHAT ABOUT TECHNOLOGY?

THE FAA IS OFTEN ACCUSED OF BEING SLOW TO ADOPT AND INCORPORATE NEW TECHNOLOGIES.

IS THAT PART OF THIS AS WELL?

MILES: IT IS.

TO THEIR CREDIT, THERE ARE TECHNOLOGIES OUT THERE THAT ARE REALLY IMPORTANT, INCLUDING COLLISION AVOIDANCE SYSTEMS ON BOARD AIRCRAFT, WHICH HELPS SAVE THE DAY AS A LAST RESORT.

BUT NOT THE END OF THE DAY, THIS IS A SYSTEM THAT IS BUILT AROUND SPINNING RADARS, KIND OF 1950'S TECHNOLOGY, AND THAT IS ACTUALLY THAT SEPARATION BUBBLE, THOSE SEPARATION BUBBLES I WAS TELLING YOU ABOUT.

YOU COULD REDUCE THEM IF YOU HAD A MORE ADVANCED ATHEISTS -- A MORE INSTANTANEOUS SYSTEM.

AS A PILOT, ONE OF MY BIGGEST COMPLAINT AS WE RELY TOO MUCH ON TALKING ON THE RADIO'S, VHS RADIOS.

- - VHF RADIOS.

MISCOMMUNICATION CAN LEAD TO PROBLEMS.

GEOFF: AVIATION CORRESPONDENT MILES O'BRIEN, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

MILES: YOU ARE WELCOME, GEOFF.

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