[MUSIC] HELLO.

I AM BONNIE ERBE.

WELCOME TO "TO THE CONTRARY", A WEEKLY DISCUSSION OF NEWS AND SOCIAL TRENDS FROM DIVERSE PERSPECTIVES.

WHAT A WEEK IT WAS NEWS WISE ON ISSUES CONCERNING SEXUAL HARASSMENT AND ASSAULT AS NEW YORK GOVERNOR ANDREW CUOMO, ALONG TEMPSTAR OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, RESIGNED HIS POSITION AS GOVERNOR.

THIS AFTER THE RELEASE OF A REPORT BY HIS STATED ATTORNEY GENERAL DOCUMENTING 11 WOMEN'S ACCOUNTS OF SEXUAL ASSAULT AND HARASSMENT BY GOVERNOR CUOMO.

THE ORGANIZATION FORMED TO FILE LAWSUITS AGAINST ALLEGED SEXUAL PREDATORS WAS ALSO DRAGGED INTO THE STORY THIS WEEK.

TIMES UP BOARD MEMBER, A PROMINENT PROGRESS IVER WOMEN'S RIGHTS LAWYER, ROBERTA KAPLAN, RESIGNED REPORTS LOT AS WELL.

IT WAS RECORDED IN THE NEW YORK ATTORNEY GENERAL'S PROBE THAT SHE AND TINA CHEN, THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION'S EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE WHITE HOUSE COUNCIL ON WOMEN AND GIRLS, ADVISED CUOMO ON THE LETTER HE WANTED TO RELEASE DEFENDING HIMSELF AGAINST THOSE ALLEGATIONS.

WITH US TO DISCUSS HER REPORTING ON THIS IMPORTANT STORY IS REBECCA KEEGAN, SENIOR EDITOR OF THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER.

REBECCA, WELCOME.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

SOME OF YOUR ARTICLES ARE JUST AMAZING ABOUT WHAT WOMEN WERE DOING TO WOMEN WHEN THE WOMEN AT TIMES UP WERE SUPPOSED TO BE HELPING SEXUAL ASSAULT VICTIMS.

LET'S START WITH ROBERTA KAPLAN, PLEASE, AND THEN I WILL ASK YOU MORE.

>> Rebecca Keegan: OKAY.

ROBERTA KAPLAN, IT WAS REVEALED IN THE NEW YORK STATE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S REPORT ABOUT ANDREW CUOMO IS ALLEGED TO HAVE PROVIDED SOME COUNSEL OR SOME ADVICE TO CUOMO ON HOW TO HANDLE THE PR FALLOUT FROM THESE ALLEGATIONS.

THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WAS REALLY UPSETTING TO MANY WOMEN WHO ARE SEXUAL ASSAULT OR SEXUAL HARASSMENT SURVIVORS.

A GROUP OF THEM, INCLUDING SOME TIMES OF CLIENTS, PENNED AN OPEN LETTER TO THE ORGANIZATION BECAUSE THEY WERE SO UPSET BY IT.

>> Bonnie Erbe: AND WHAT DID IT SAY?

>> Rebecca Keegan: THE GROUP SAID THAT THEY FEEL THAT TIMES UP HAS CHOSEN PROXIMITY TO POWER OVER SUPPORTING VICTIMS.

THEY FEEL THAT TIMES UP RELATIONSHIP WITH BOTH CUOMO, WHICH THE ORGANIZATION HAD FORGED OF THE COURSE OF SOME LEGISLATION, CLOUDED HIS JUDGMENT WHEN IT CAME TO TALKING TO HIM ABOUT THE SEXUAL HARASSMENT ALLEGATIONS.

>> Bonnie Erbe: HOW DEEP IN THE ORGANIZATION DO YOU BELIEVE SIDING WITH THE WRONG SIDE, IF THAT IS THE SHORT WAY TO PUT IT, WHICH IS WHAT SOME OF THESE WOMEN WERE APPARENTLY DOING, HOW DEEP DO YOU THINK IT GOES?

I MEAN, KAPLAN WAS ON THE BOARD.E HAVE TRIED TO GET INTERVIEWS WITH WOMEN.

WE HAVE INTERVIEWED MANY TIMES THAT HAVE BEEN ON THE PANEL WHO ARE WITH TIME'S UP.

NOBODY WAS TO TALK ABOUT IT.

WHAT ARE THEY RUNNING AWAY FROM?

>> Rebecca Keegan: WELL, IT'S COMPLICATED.

TIME'S UP WAS NOT CREATED LIKE SO MANY NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS.

IT WAS NOT CREATED AS A SORT OF GRASSROOTS ORGANIZATION.T WAS CREATED IN HOLLYWOOD AGENCIES.

BECAUSE OF THAT, THIS ORGANIZATION HAS EXTRAORDINARY RESOURCES AND PROXIMITY TO POWER, WHICH MANY WOMEN FELT WOULD BE A GREAT THING THAT COULD BE USED ON BEHALF OF SURVIVORS AND VICTIMS.

AND IN SOME WAYS IT HAS.

THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF WOMEN WHO HAVE GOTTEN HELP FROM THE TIME'S UP LEGAL DEFENSE FUND.

BUT AT THE SAME TIME THAT THE GROUP HAS THESE RELATIONSHIPS WITH POWERFUL PEOPLE, IT FINDS ITSELF IN WHAT YOU MIGHT CONSIDER COMPROMISING POSITIONS.

THERE ARE A FEW EXAMPLES OF THAT THAT PREDATE THE CONTROVERSY OVER CUOMO.

ONE IS THAT THE ORGANIZATION HAS A VERY CLOSE RELATIONSHIP WITH OPRAH WINFREY.

WHEN SHE BACKED AWAY FROM A DOCUMENTARY ABOUT RUSSELL SIMMONS' ACCUSERS, MANY SURVIVORS AND VICTIMS FELT THAT TIME'S UP SIDED WITH OPRAH WINFREY OVER THE RUSSELL SIMMONS' ACCUSERS.

THERE WAS ALSO A CASE WHERE A GROUP WHO WERE MEMBERS OF TIME'S UP HEALTHCARE, DOCTORS AND NURSES, LEFT TIME'S UP BECAUSE THEY WERE UPSET WITH THE WAY THE ORGANIZATION HANDLED AN ALLEGATION AGAINST A KEY LEADER AT TIME'S UP.

>> Bonnie Erbe: OPRAH WINFREY, WHICH SHE OF THUNDER?

IS SHE A FUNDER OF TIME'S UP?

SHE'S A VERY WELL-KNOWN BENEFACTOR OF MANY -- >> Rebecca Keegan: ABSOLUTELY.

SHE WAS A HUGE FIGURE FOR TIME'S UP, PARTICULARLY IN THE EARLY DAYS.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU REMEMBER AT THE GOLDEN GLOBES IN 2018, WHICH IS WHEN THE ORGANIZATION ANNOUNCED ITSELF.

IT'S WHEN MANY ACTRESSES ARRIVED WEARING BLACK AND WITH SORT OF IMPORTANT ACTIVISTS ON THEIR ARM INSTEAD OF YOUR USUAL DATES.

OPERA GAVE A VERY, VERY POWERFUL SPEECH AT THE GOLDEN GLOBES IN WHICH SHE TALKED ABOUT TIME'S UP, AND MONEY BEGIN POURING INTO THE ORGANIZATION.

SHE'S PROBABLY THE MOST IMPORTANT MOUTHPIECE.

AND SO, WHEN SHE FOUND HERSELF IN THIS, YOU COULD CALL IT A DILEMMA WITH REGARD TO THE TREATMENT OF THE VICTIMS IN THE SIMMONS CASE, MANY, MANY WOMEN'S GROUPS SIGNED AN OPEN LETTER SUPPORTING THE VICTIMS WHO WERE IN THIS DOCUMENTARY CALLED ON THE RECORD.

TIME'S UP INITIALLY OPTED NOT TO AND SEEMED TO SIDE IN THIS SORT OF DISPUTE, AND THAT REALLY UPSET A LOT OF VICTIMS AND SURVIVORS.

>> Bonnie Erbe: TIME'S UP WAS OBVIOUSLY FINANCIALLY VERY SUCCESSFUL IN TERMS OF FUNDRAISING AND SUPPORTING VERY EXPENSIVE LAWSUITS BY ACCUSERS AGAINST POWERFUL ALLEGED ABUSERS.

SO DO YOU THINK IT'S POSSIBLE -- I MEAN, YOU COVER HOLLYWOOD, SO YOU KNOW ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIPS, THE DEALS BETWEEN AGENTS AND ACTORS, BOTH MALE AND FEMALE, ETC., NON-BINARY.

IS IT POSSIBLE TO RAISE A LOT OF MONEY WITHOUT, I WOULD NOT SAY SLEEPING WITH THE ENEMY, BUT SIDING WITH THE ENEMY SOMETIMES?

>> Rebecca Keegan: THAT'S REALLY THE CORE QUESTION THAT SURVIVORS HAVE ABOUT TIME'S UP.

SOME OF THE MOST IMPORTANT EARLY DONORS ARE COMPANIES THAT FOUND THEMSELVES AT THE CENTER OF SOME HARASSMENT SCANDALS.

FOR INSTANCE, CBS, CIA, THE MAJOR HOLLYWOOD AGENCY, THIS WAS THE AGENCY THAT HAD SET UP THE MEETING WITH A YOUNG PALTROW AND HARVEY WEINSTEIN AND CIA SORT OF INCUBATED TIME'S UP.

SO NCAA AND ALL THE OTHER AGENCIES WERE AWARE OF THE MAJOR GENDER PAY DISPARITIES BETWEEN WHAT MALE AND FEMALE ACTORS MAKE.

SO SOME OUTSIDERS HAVE ASKED THEMSELVES, HOW CAN THESE COMPANIES AND THESE PEOPLE WHO WERE AT THE CENTER OF CREATING THE CURRENT PROBLEMS IN HOLLYWOOD BE THE ARCHITECTS OF FIXING THEM?

THERE'S ANOTHER MORE GENEROUS WAY TO LOOK AT IT, WHICH IS PEOPLE REALIZED THAT THE SITUATION WAS WRONG AND NEEDED TO BE CHANGED.

THERE ARE SOME VERY WELL-INTENTIONED PEOPLE AT SOME OF THOSE COMPANIES.

A GROUP OF FEMALE AGENTS WERE HORRIFIED BY WHAT WAS GOING ON AT THEIR COMPANIES.

AND TIME'S UP WAS A WAY FOR THEM TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT, BUT THERE IS THIS WAY THE ORGANIZATION WAS FOUNDED, AND I THINK THE CUOMO SCANDAL SORT OF POINTS TO THAT EXACT ISSUE.

>> Bonnie Erbe: TELL ME ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE DONORS LIKE CIA AND THEN THERE WAS ALSO ON THE PART OF SOME PEOPLE WITHIN TIME'S UP OF SELF ENRICHMENT IN A WAY, RIGHT?

>> Rebecca Keegan: YEAH.

I MEAN, TIME'S UP IS A COMPLICATED ORGANIZATION.

IT HAS MANY PARTS.

THERE'S THE TIME'S UP LEGAL DEFENSE FUND, WHICH IS A TOTALLY SEPARATE ORGANIZATION FROM THE TIME'S UP THAT DOES POLITICAL LOBBYINGND ONE OF THE CHALLENGES FOR ME AS A REPORTER COVERING THEM HAS BEEN GETTING MORE TRANSPARENCY INTO THEIR FINANCES, INTO HOUTHI, YOU KNOW, SORT OF DIFFERENT LEADERS IN DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE ORGANIZATION, HOW THEY WORK, HOW THEIR STAFF WORKS.

IT'S ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT THE SURVIVORS WHO SIGNED THIS OPEN LETTER HAVE RAISED THIS SORT OF LACK OF TRANSPARENCY AT TIME'S UP.

YOU KNOW, IT IS A NONPROFIT, SO IT DOES NEED TO FILE PAPERWORK WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO EXPLAIN SOME OF THESE THINGS.

IT'S BEEN SLOWER TO DO THAT THAN YOU WOULD THINK FOR AN ORGANIZATION WITH SUCH DEEP POCKETS AND WITH SUCH SORT OF EDUCATED , POWERFUL, WHERE PEOPLE WHO TOOK PART IN ITS FOUNDING.

>> Bonnie Erbe: MAUREEN DOWD HAD AN INTERESTING COLUMN IN THE NEW YORK TIMES IN RESPONSE TO TIME'S UP'S PROBLEMS.

AND SHE REFERRED BACK TO THE 18TH CENTURY BRITISH NOVELIST WHO WROTE A NOVEL ABOUT AN ABUSER WHO WAS A RICH MAN, HEADED A HOUSEHOLD FULL OF WOMEN SERVANTS.

AND THE CHIEF MADE WERE THE CHIEF HOUSEKEEPER ACTUALLY HELD A YOUNG TEENAGE GIRL DOWN IN BED SO HE COULD RAPE HER.

IN HER COLUMN WAS ALL ABOUT HOW WOMEN HAVE THE -- FREQUENTLY BEEN THE BEARDS, IF YOU WILL, OF ABUSING MEN WHILE THEY ARE ABUSING OTHER WOMEN.

AND THAT WAS CERTAINLY THE CASE WITH HARVEY WEINSTEIN AND SOME OF HIS AIDES WHO HELPED HIM PROCURE, YOU KNOW, SOLO MEETINGS AND HOTEL ROOMS WITH SOME REALLY BIG NAME FEMALE HOLLYWOOD PEOPLE.

TELL ME WHAT YOU KNOW ABOUT THE HISTORY OF WOMEN AND WHAT YOU SEE IN HOLLYWOOD ABOUT WOMEN, YOU KNOW, TO STANDBY MEN AS THEY WATCH THEM ABUSE WOMEN, SEXUAL ASSAULT AND SEXUAL HARASSMENT?

>> Rebecca Keegan: WELL, FOR A LONG TIME IN HOLLYWOOD, THERE WAS RARELY ROOM FOR MORE THAN 11 MINUTE ROOM, ONE FEMALE EXECUTIVE, ONE FEMALE AGENT AND I THINK THAT THERE WAS A CULTURE, THE IMAGE OF SOME WOMEN LOOKING FOR THEMSELVES.

IT WAS AN OLD WOMAN WHO DID THAT, BUT SOME MEN FELT IT NECESSARY TO BE VERY TOUGH, LOOK OUT FOR THEIR OWN INTERESTS IN THEIR OWN INTERESTS ONLY.

I DO THINK THE INDUSTRY HAS EVOLVED OUT OF THAT.

BUT THERE'S A WHOLE GENERATION OF PEOPLE WHO WORKED AROUND HARVEY WEINSTEIN AND THE GENERATION OF WOMEN WHO ARE NOW POWERFUL LAWYERS, POWERFUL EXECUTIVES, PEOPLE KIND OF AT THE PEAKS OF THEIR CAREERS.

AND THEY GREW UP IN THAT.

AND I THINK THAT HAS AFFECTED THE WAY SOME OF THEM HAVE LOOKED AT THESE ISSUES.

>> Bonnie Erbe: DO YOU KNOW ANYTHING SPECIFICALLY ABOUT WHAT KAPLAN WAS ADVISING THE IN TERMS OF PUBLIC RELATIONS?

>> Rebecca Keegan: WELL, WHAT'S IN THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S REPORT, WHICH SAYS THAT IN AID TO CUOMO SHOWED KAPLAN A LETTER THAT THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE WAS PLANNING TO DISTRIBUTE, WHICH IMPUGNS ONE OF THE WOMEN WHO WAS BRINGING A SEXUAL HARASSMENT ALLEGATIONS.

AND ACCORDING TO THE STATE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S REPORT, KAPLAN AND TINA CHEN GAVE THE ADVICE THAT THE LETTER WOULD BE OKAY TO RUN WITH TAKING OUT SOME PORTION OF IT WHICH REFERS TO THE WOMAN'S RELATIONSHIPS WITH OTHER MEN.

TIME'S UP DISPUTED THAT HAS DISPUTED THAT VERSION OF EVENTS.

THEY SAY THEY THEY DIDN'T ADVISE ON THE LETTER, BUT IT'S QUITE SPECIFICALLY LAID OUT AND ATTRIBUTED TO A SPECIFIC AID IN THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S REPORT.

>> Bonnie Erbe: TIME'S UP HAS ISSUED A STATEMENT SAYING ESSENTIALLY THAT THE ORGANIZATION HAS COME CLEAN.

BUT DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT, OR ARE THERE OTHER WOMEN WHO NEED TO LEAVE OR WHO AS YOU HAVE REPORTED THE STORY, OTHER INKLINGS OF OTHER WOMEN INVOLVED IN THINGS THAT ARE UNACCEPTABLE AND WILL HAVE TO LEAVE THE ORGANIZATION, OR IS IT JUST KAPLAN?

>> Rebecca Keegan: I DON'T KNOW.

I MEAN, ROBERTA KAPLAN IS A MAJOR FIGURE IN TIME'S UP.

SHE WAS PART OF ITS FOUNDING, SHE IS A PROMINENT PROGRESSIVE LAWYER WHO HAD PLAYED A ROLE IN THE SAME-SEX MARRIAGE LEGALIZATION.

AND FOR MANY PEOPLE, SHE WAS A REALLY IMPORTANT ADVOCATE AND IS A REALLY IMPORTANT ADVOCATE FOR WOMEN.

HER STEPPING AWAY FROM THE ORGANIZATION IS A BIG DEAL, AND IT SIGNALS I THINK THAT TIME'S UP IS STARTING TO HEAR THE CRITICS WHO HAVE PROBLEMS WITH ITS RELATIONSHIPS WITH POWERFUL PEOPLE.

KAPLAN SAID IN HER RESIGNATION LETTER THAT SHE HAD BEGUN TO FEEL THAT HER ROLE AS A WORKING ATTORNEY WAS INCOMPATIBLE WITH BEING ON TIME'S UP'S BOARD.

SO THAT IS A MAJOR STATEMENT THAT TIME'S UP IS MAKING, SAYING WE ARE TAKING YOU SERIOUSLY, CRITICS.

THEY ALSO TALKED IN THEIR STATEMENT ABOUT GREATER TRANSPARENCY OF THE ORGANIZATION.

WHAT EXACTLY THAT MEANS I THINK IS TO BE SEEN.

WE WILL HAVE TO SEE IN THE COMING MONTHS HOW EXACTLY THE ORGANIZATION CHANGES, HOW MUCH MORE IT SHARES ABOUT ITS INNER WORKINGS, WHICH HAVE BEEN A LITTLE BIT DIFFICULT TO PARSE.

>> Bonnie Erbe: NOW, WHEN CHEN AND KAPLAN CONSULTED ON THIS LETTER, DID THE CUOMO ORGANIZATION MAKE A DONATION TO TIME'S UP?

WAS THERE PAYMENT TO THE TWO WOMEN INDIVIDUALLY?

AND WHAT IS KAPLAN, WHO IS AS YOU SAY A PROGRESSIVE LAWYER, OBVIOUSLY WENT TO LAW SCHOOL, STUDIED LEGAL ETHICS -- I AM A LAWYER, ALTHOUGH I NEVER PRACTICE, BUT I WENT TO LAW SCHOOL AND PASSED THE BAR.

I WOULD KNOW BETTER THAN TO CONSULT ON A LETTER LIKE THAT WHILE BEING ON THE BOARD OF, YOU KNOW, THE MAJOR ORGANIZATION THAT WAS FORMED TO FIGHT SEXUAL HARASSMENT AND SEXUAL ASSAULT.

>> Rebecca Keegan: NO ALLEGATION OF A SORT OF FINANCIAL PREQUEL -- QUID PRO QUO, ALTHOUGH KAPLAN'S FIRM REPRESENTS ONE OF CUOMO'S AIDES.

SO THERE IS THAT RELATIONSHIP THAT EXISTS.

I THINK THE ISSUE THAT LED THEM TO SORT OF WANT TO TALK TO CUOMO, HEAR HIM OUT, HELP HIM IF THAT WAS APPROPRIATE, WAS THIS RELATIONSHIP THEY'D HAD WITH HIM IN PASSING THIS 2019 LEGISLATION.

I MEAN, THIS IS WHERE IT GETS TRICKY.

BECAUSE THEY HAD A CLOSE RELATIONSHIP WITH CUOMO, THEY WERE ABLE TO PARTICIPATE IN PASSING WHAT A LOT OF PEOPLE CONSIDER VERY IMPORTANT LEGISLATION FOR WOMEN.

EXTENDED THE STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS FOR RAPE IN NEW YORK STATE.

AND SO, YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE'S NOT -- THEY ARE GETTING MONEY FROM THIS RELATIONSHIP, BUT IN THEIR MINDS, PROBABLY, THIS RELATIONSHIP IS IMPORTANT TO WOMEN AND IN THE LARGER SENSE.

WHAT'S COMPLICATED IS WHEN WE FIND OURSELVES BEING ASKED TO HELP CUOMO WHEN HE'S FACING ALLEGATIONS.

>> Bonnie Erbe: RIGHT, OF COURSE.

AND PARTICULARLY BEFORE HE GOT IN THIS MUCH TROUBLE, THOSE CONSULTATIONS OCCURRED BEFORE IT GOT -- THE REPORT WAS RELEASED, WHICH IS JUST RECENTLY.

AND IT MADE -- WELL, I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY THEY SAW IN THE LETTER THAT HE WAS REFUTING PRETTY SERIOUS ALLEGATIONS AND I GUESS THEY KNEW THAT THE ATTORNEY GENERAL OF NEW YORK WAS GOING TO BE ISSUING THIS REPORT ON IT.

YOU KNOW, DO YOU THINK THEY SHOULD HAVE DRAWN THE LINE?

>> Rebecca Keegan: YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW.

I'M AN EXPERT ON LEGAL ETHICS.

I JUST COVER THIS ORGANIZATION AS A REPORTER.

AND WHAT I KNOW IS THAT THE WOMEN WHO HAVE BEEN COMING TO TIME'S UP WITH PIECES OF SEXUAL HARASSMENT IN THE WORKPLACE, CASES OF SEXUAL ASSAULT, THEY FEEL THEY DREW THE LINE.

THEY FEEL THAT THIS WAS NOT AN APPROPRIATE USE OF THE ORGANIZATIONS RESOURCES, EXPERTISE, AND MANY ARE FRUSTRATED BECAUSE THEY'VE GOT ACES THAT TIME'S UP IS, AND THEIR OPINIONS, IS SLOW TO TAKE ACTION.

THEY FEEL THAT BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT FAMOUS OR PROMINENT, THEY HAVE NOT GOTTEN SERIOUS TREATMENT FROM TIME'S UP.

SO WHEN THEY SEE GOVERNOR CUOMO, WHO IS ALLEGED TO HAVE'S HARRASSED I THINK IT'S 11, AT THIS POINT, WHEN THEY SEE THAT TIME'S UP HAS THE TIME FOR HIM AND NOT FOR THEM, THAT'S WHERE THESE PEOPLE FEEL THE ORGANIZATION IS REALLY CROSSING A LINE.

>> Bonnie Erbe: WHAT'S THE FUTURE FOR TIME'S UP?

I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH MONEY, WHAT THEIR BUDGET IS ANNUALLY.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH THEY HAVE IN THE BANK OR HOW MUCH THEY HAVE IN PROMISED DONATIONS, BUT WILL THEY BE ABLE FINANCIALLY TO WITHSTAND THIS TIDAL WAVE OF BAD PUBLICITY?

>> Rebecca Keegan: THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.

I HONESTLY DON'T KNOW.

I DON'T KNOW HOW THIS WILL AFFECT FUTURE DONATIONS TO THE GROUP.

THE TIME'S UP LEGAL DEFENSE FUND HAS AN ENORMOUS RESERVE OF MONEY AND, YOU KNOW, IN THE TENS OF MILLIONS.

BUT THE OTHER PART OF THE ORGANIZATION, WHICH IS THE PART THAT DOES THE LOBBYING, DOES NOT HAVE AS MUCH MONEY AND THEY ARE CONSTANTLY SENDING OUT FUNDRAISING APPEALS.

SO WE WILL BEING AT THE CENTER OF THIS SEX SCANDAL AFFECT THEIR ABILITY TO RAISE MONEY?

YOU KNOW, FOR A LOT OF PROMINENT AND WEALTHY PEOPLE IN HOLLYWOOD, GIVING A DONATION, A BIG DONATION TO TIME'S UP, WAS OH WAY TO SAY THAT YOU WERE ON THE SIDE OF GOOD WHEN IT CAME TO GENDER ISSUES.

AND NOW I THINK THAT IS LESS CLEAR.

AND SO, PEOPLE WHO HAVE DONATED MORE THAN $500,000, SO PEOPLE LIKE MERYL STREEP, STEVEN SPIELBERG, REESE WITHERSPOON, WILL THEY SAY, WELL, THERE ARE THESE OTHER ORGANIZATIONS THAT DO GOOD THINGS FOR WOMEN, MAYBE I WILL PUT MY MONEY THERE.

>> Bonnie Erbe: SURE.

THAT WOULD BE A NATURAL REACTION.

WHAT IMPACT -- AND I WILL CONFUSING HERE, MIX THINGS UP HERE ARE A LITTLE BIT, BUT THE #METOO MOVEMENT HAD ON THE CASTING COUCH CULTURE IN HOLLYWOOD, IF YOU WILL?

DO MALE DIRECTORS STILL FEEL THAT THEY CAN DEMAND SEX OR AT LEAST TRY FOR IT IN A ONE-ON-ONE MEETING IN A HOTEL ROOM WITH AN ACTRESS, ACTOR, FEMALE ACTOR?

>> Rebecca Keegan: WELL, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME MAJOR CHANGES SPARKED BY THE WEINSTEIN REVELATIONS.

AMONG THEM IS THE FACT THAT PEOPLE ARE NO LONGER HOLDING MEETINGS IN HOTEL ROOMS, WHICH WAS REGULAR PRACTICE IN HOLLYWOOD, NOT ONLY FOR PEOPLE LIKE WEINSTEIN WANTED TO USE THEM FOR NEFARIOUS PURPOSES, BUT FOR PEOPLE WHO FOUND IT CONVENIENT.

BUT THERE'S AN AWARENESS NOW THAT THAT IS NOT A WORKPLACE ENVIRONMENT, AND NOT A PLACE FOR ONE ON ONE MEETINGS IN HOLLYWOOD.

SO THAT PRACTICE IS REALLY WANING.

AND CERTAINLY VERY PROMINENT PEOPLE, THEY ARE FINDING THAT IT IS JUST TOO DANGEROUS FOR THEM TO DO IT BECAUSE OF THE PERCEPTION.

THEY NEVER HAD AN INTENTION OF COMING ONTO SOMEONE OR NOT, WANT TO BE PUT IN A POSITION WHERE THEY COULD BE ACCUSED OF THAT.

SO THE HOTEL ROOM MEANINGS ARE GOING WAY.

ANOTHER THING THAT'S CHANGED IS THAT ARE WHAT ARE CALLED INTIMATELY SEE COORDINATORS ONSET SNOW.

AND THEIR JOB IS TO SORT OF HELP MANAGE NUDE SCENES, LOVE SCENES, SITUATIONS WHERE PEOPLE MAY HAVE HAD TROUBLE PROTECTING THEIR BOUNDARIES ON A SET.

THESE INTIMACY COORDINATORS ARE NOW IN REGULAR PRACTICE ON HOLLYWOOD SETS AND THEY TALK WITH THE ACTORS AND THE DIRECTOR ABOUT HOW THESE SCENES ARE GOING TO WORK.

SO THERE ARE SOME CONCRETE THINGS THAT HAVE CHANGED.

I DO HEAR PROBABLY ONCE OR TWICE A MONTH FROM PEOPLE WITH STORIES OF HARASSMENT OR ASSAULT AT THEIR HOLLYWOOD WORKPLACES.

OFTENTIMES NOW IT'S SMALLER VENUES.

IT'S A DOCUMENTARY SHOOT AROUND THE WORLD, IT'S A SHORT FILM SHOOT, IT'S PEOPLE WHO ARE SORT OF OUTSIDE THAT BIG KIND OF NEXUS OF POWER THAT WEINSTEIN WAS A PART OF.

SO IT'S STILL HAPPENING.

I THINK IT'S HAPPENING LESS AS FAR AS I CAN TELL.

>> Bonnie Erbe: SO YOU THINK THEY DEFINITELY HAVE HAD AN IMPACT ON THE FEELING BY MEN IN HOLLYWOOD TO -- THAT WOMEN WERE JUST FAIR GAME IF THEY WANTED EMPLOYMENT.

BUT IT'S STILL GOING ON, KIND OF LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE TALK ABOUT WAGE LAWS AND HOW, YOU KNOW, AND THE FREEDOM TO WORK FROM HOME FROM OTHERS, WHICH IS GREAT IF YOU'RE WORKING REMOTELY FOR A BIG COMPANY AND MAKING GOOD MONEY.

BUT IF YOU'RE A WAITRESS IN LOUISIANA MAKING, I THINK THE MINIMUM WAGE THERE IS MAYBE FIVE DOLLARS AN HOUR, IT'S -- YOU KNOW, JUST DOES NOT APPLY.

SO SAME THING HERE: SMALLER COMPANIES STILL HAVE A LOT OF THAT KIND OF CORRUPTION GOING ON?

>> Rebecca Keegan: I MEAN, THERE'S VERY MUCH A CASTE SYSTEM IN HOLLYWOOD.

AND, YOU KNOW, AT BIG STUDIOS LIKE DISNEY AND NETFLIX, THEIR PROCEDURES IN PLACE TO TRY TO PREVENT THESE THINGS FROM HAPPENING.

BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF SMALL, INDEPENDENT COMPANIES.

THEY DON'T HAVE HUMAN RESOURCES DEPARTMENTS, THEY DON'T HAVE A LOT OF SORT OF INFRASTRUCTURE IN PLACE THAT HAS BEEN CREATED TO HELP PROTECT PEOPLE IN THE WORKPLACE.ND THOSE ARE THE SETTINGS INCREASINGLY WHERE I AM HEARING ABOUT THESE PROBLEMS.

THEY ARE ALSO LESS POWERFUL WOMEN WHO ARE EXPERIENCING THEM.

SO IT'S NOT GWYNETH PALTROW AND ANGELINA JOLIE, IT IS A DIRECTORS ASSISTANT ON A TEENY TINY TV SHOW, YOU KNOW, IT'S A PRODUCTION ASSISTANT, IT'S A WOMAN WITH A LOT LESS POWER AND AN ENVIRONMENT WHERE SHE'S GOING TO HAVE A MUCH HARDER TIME SORT OF GETTING RESULTS OR GETTING HELP.

>> Bonnie Erbe: WHEN YOU RAISE THE ISSUE OF PUTTING PROCEDURES IN PLACE TO PREVENT THESE KINDS OF THINGS, AND OF COURSE WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE CASTING COUCH, YOU DON'T USUALLY THINK OF WHATEVER WAS GOING ON IN FRONT OF THE CAMERAS, BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE FAIRLY -- NOT THAT ABUSES COULD NOT HAPPENED, AND OF COURSE THEY DID, BUT YOU THINK MORE ABOUT PRIVATE MEETINGS, NOT IN A SCENE WHEN YOU ARE ON A SHOOT, BUT IT'S ONLY'S OFFICE, AT A HOTEL, AT THE HOUSE, , BUT IT'S ONLY'S OFFICE, AT A HOTEL, AT THE HOUSE, ETC.

SOMEBODY TOLD ME YEARS AGO AFTER ANDREW CUOMO, WITHIN THE FIRST YEAR AFTER HE WAS ELECTED, AND THIS IS A PERSON IS PRETTY HIGH UP IN NEW YORK STATE GOVERNMENT, THAT HE ALWAYS DEMANDED THAT A STAFFER BE WITH HIM IN THE ROOM ANY TIME HE WAS MEETING WITH A WOMAN BECAUSE HE ALWAYS WANTED SOMEBODY THERE IN CASE THERE WERE EVER ALLEGATIONS, SOMEBODY THERE COULD SAY, NO, I WAS AT THE MEETING AND THAT NEVER HAPPENED.

SO WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT PUTTING -- AND THEN, YOU KNOW, YEARS LATER, THIS COMES OUT.

>> Rebecca Keegan: I GUESS IT REALLY MATTERS IS IN THE ROOM AND WHETHER THEY HAVE THE POWER TO SPEAK UP TO THE CUOMO FIGURE FOR THE POWERFUL DIRECTOR OF WHOEVER IT IS, IF THEY DEPEND ON THAT PERSON FOR A PAYCHECK, IT MAY BE HARD FOR THEM TO EXPRESS THEIR CONCERN.

>> Bonnie Erbe: RIGHT.

WELL, AGAIN, THANK YOU SO MUCH, REBECCA KEEGAN, FOR YOUR TIME.

YOU ARE OF COURSE A SENIOR EDITOR AT THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE INFORMATION AND YOU ARE COVERING THE PROBLEMS WITH THE TIME'S UP MOVEMENT AND OTHER WOMEN IN POWER ISSUES IN HOLLYWOOD.

THANK YOU AGAIN.

IT'S BEEN EXTREMELY INFORMATIVE.

I AM BONNIE ERBE.

THAT'S IT FOR THIS EDITION.

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