- Funding for Working Capital is provided by the Friends of KTWU, Raymond C and Marguerite Gibson Foundation and Kansas Department of Commerce.

Every month is small business month for us here at Working Capital.

'cause we love showing small business owners, but may especially is small business month.

And today we're here with something that I think is kind of a cool story.

Someone who moved away to some place that is kind of my second home and in most people's green places, but they had an opportunity to come back to Topeka and start something new.

So stick around, we'll see if going down the rabbit hole is a great idea.

- Came home to visit family and friends over Christmas and I was here for about 10 days and I found out that this place was up for sale and people kept joking, oh, you should buy it, you should buy it.

Because when I moved to Colorado, I either wanted to open or buy a business of my own there.

- Today on Working Capital, we are at down the rabbit hole with Jennifer Wilson.

Thank you for being on Working Capital.

So thank you.

First off, let, let, where does your career path come from to get you to this point?

And then we're gonna talk about you kind of going away to someplace.

That's another home way for home for me.

So what, what did you do before owning your own bar and grill?

- I worked for attorneys for 26 years.

- So - You I managed a law firm for 20 years.

- So you're around business quite a bit.

Yeah.

So you know the ins and outs, the right contracts.

I mean, you're not going in blind to a business thinking No, no.

I just go there, open up and, and and, and go.

So right on that note, you left for Colorado for Estes Park.

A small town, kind of a small town to me, a small town Kansas field, but nestled in the mountains.

What lured you back from that?

What was the draw when this is something you hadn't done before.

Sorry guys.

But you'll see my A DHD come out sometime in the show.

As you know, I met Jennifer 20 2007 or so at Community Theater.

So as we talk about community and who you meet and, and how you treat everyone well and it kind of comes back around.

That's how I met Jennifer.

So anyways, es just park this opportunity comes up.

How, what was the lure?

- I came home to visit family and friends over Christmas and I was here for about 10 days and I found out that this place was up for sale and people kept joking, oh, you should buy it, you should buy it.

Because when I moved to Colorado, I either wanted to open or buy a business of my own there.

- Yeah.

- I said, when, you know, when the attorney that I was working for retired and we closed the law office, I said, I'm never working for someone else again.

Not that, you know, my bosses have been great.

But - Yeah, - I, I wanted to work for myself and I wanted to to my, it's like a second career later in my life.

And, but I wanted it to be what I wanted it to be and where I wanted it to be.

So I threw caution to the wind.

My kids are grown, my job was ending and I moved to Colorado and I didn't really have a plan other than I'll wing it when I get there and find something or build something.

And then I came home to visit family and friends over Christmas and found out about this and then I was like, well, the price is right.

Let me go look at it.

I'd been out here a few times before and I, I just, I had a feeling that this was, it, - It fit, - It did.

And I woke serendipity - Woke up.

- Absolutely.

It was very ser serendipitous.

I woke up the next morning, I didn't make any decisions that day.

I woke up the next morning and I sat bolt up right at four 30 in the morning and I said, I'm gonna do it.

And I just knew.

And so that was January 2nd.

I moved back here from Colorado, January 31st.

I had my liquor license by mid-February and we opened, I took over March 1st, but I I it was closed until March 4th.

So we could have a few days to make it mine to redecorate a little bit and to, to make it the rabbit hole.

- Sounds like a big lack of sleep.

- It was because - You just like to get stuff done is what I'm, I'm hearing here.

- Yes.

- So all those licensing and, and all that, how hectic was that or coming from the law field?

Did it just, did it work out okay because you knew the ins and out, you knew you had to wait so long.

It's, you know, it's, a lot of people probably go into it and they think I'm gonna open on this date and then, oh, two weeks beforehand I forgot my liquor license.

- Yeah, no.

How can I - Fast track that?

- No, I knew all of the pitfalls with that and I knew a lot of, I understood all of the legal speak really.

And all of the contracts and all of the documents that you have to fill out.

It really is a lot of that you go through for licensing, for liquor licensing and there's a background check and there's all these forms you have to show where all of your money is coming from.

So they, you, anytime that there's a liquor license involved, no one else except for the person holding the license Yeah.

Can profit off the sale of liquor.

Yep.

And so they have to make sure that no one else is any way involved in this that's not listed on your paperwork.

So, but I started all of this process in Colorado on January 4th.

Yeah.

I went back to Estes Park on the second, or the third actually came back or started all my applications on Monday the fourth.

And then was packing my house, figuring out logistics of my move, trying to figure out logistics of where I'm moving here, all the while doing, doing all the licensing paperwork and all the, the financial paperwork to get this up and running.

So by the end of January, I moved back January 31st.

I've been here since February 1st every day watching the bartenders and you know, just learning this, seeing the flow specific business.

- Yeah.

- And because it is - A little turnkey.

- It is.

- So no matter if you, no matter if you totally switched the theme, you're gonna have some recurring clientele that because it's community and they're used to coming to this spot.

- Right, right.

- So yeah, you gotta kind of figure out how to make it your own without disrupting the flow, but also bringing in new customers and clients and, and how you wanna make it your own.

- Right.

- So with wanting to start a bar, when you went to Colorado though, did you already start with a business plan?

Because 'cause - To me, no, I really was winging it.

You're, you're just kind of waiting for an opportunity.

I knew I wanted to be in Colorado and I was waiting for the right opportunity to fall in my lap - Because they seem like, while, while it's the same idea in both places, just knowing ESS Park enough, if you guys don't, it's kind of a finite space.

Nothing else new can get built there.

Edge of Rocky Mountain National Park.

So a lot of it, very small local population, but, but very fervent in, in supporting local establishments.

But Right.

You're dealing mostly with vacation traffic and making sure you're this spot for vacationers coming in, whereas here, right.

Probably per square foot, the dollar and investments so much better.

But you are building a community here because you need those people that live here to always come in.

Unfortunately, Topeka, hopefully soon we'll get more people just stopping in off the highway and that'll help also.

'cause you are right near the governor's mansion, right?

Trails.

You kind of have a good spot being near everything but not quite where all the traffic is.

So - Right - Back to here.

- Okay, - You get here, you're seeing that flow.

How do you decide, how did you decide on your name and how'd you decide where to make little changes to start with?

Because we're still in this infancy, - Right?

- So where did you start at?

- I knew that there's a, there was a lot of, I call it, there's a lot of real estate in there that could be making money that wasn't, and that there was a lot of dead space, a lot of storage space, a lot of space not being used.

Well, - You could see customers kind of just pocketed in spots.

So a lot of just, - Yeah.

And the way that the whole thing was set up before the flow was kind of weird.

And so I set it up.

You'll see when we go in, I set it up to where the pool tables have their own side and, and they're not, you know, getting in other people's way or other people getting in their way.

Yeah.

Which is frustrating for everyone.

Yeah.

And then the, the games over here on this wall, and then the dartboards, they all have their own area too.

And then there's a little bit of a, it almost looks like a dance floor, but it's, it's a different kind of floor where we can have like trivia or our karaoke people set up there.

And so it's a little bit of a, a mini stage and then you've got the whole dining area for the rest of the bar and then you've got the bar itself.

So it's, it's almost like it's several little businesses in one, but it, it flows.

- Yeah.

- Yeah.

- Had you seen that kind of setup in other businesses?

I mean, what, what were some of your, your places you went to, you just decided that's, that helped work or like you say you just watched the flow of the traffic.

- Yeah, no, this was a hundred percent decisions I made on the fly here.

Just literally living here 18 to 20 hours a day.

Yeah.

Every day.

Yeah.

And just watching the way that things are and what could be different and where, where more seats can go and where more games can go, where more entertainment things can go.

And, and again, how it can all be separate but yet together at the same time.

- And once, where'd the name come from?

I mean, it's great for branding from what I've seen already from the get go, even with, with theme nights and all, there's a lot of play on that.

Yeah.

And the whimsical of it.

So - Yeah.

- Why, why that?

- So I, my, one of my best friends came up with the name for me.

She asked me, what would you name a bar?

And I was like, well, I don't even know, I'm, I haven't even gotten that far yet.

And she thought for a second and she goes, I know how about the rabbit hole?

And I was like, that's perfect because I also have a DHD and I am known for going down rabbit holes all.

And I will say that all the time.

I'm like, yeah.

Or I'll be gone from a conversation and I'll come back and be like, sorry, I was gone.

I'm back now I was down a rabbit hole and I say this all the time, but it was so perfect for me, like so individual to me, but also, even if you don't know me and don't know that about me, it's just a cool name for a bar.

- Yeah.

You know, well you think of all the convers conversations that happen here, you know, everyone's going down rabbit holes, you know?

Yeah.

Everyone's sharing their experiences and Absolutely.

I think it's a great name.

So, so once you get the name being a small business startup, how do you, how do you get your, your graphics, even your Facebook presence, your online, I think, have you used any AI yet?

Is that Yeah.

Is that part of it at least?

Yeah, for, for the start.

- Yeah.

It's a large part.

It's dominant, - Which I, you know, I, I'm not, I've never been a total proponent for AI except we've had some people on, so when it's used correctly.

So to me a small business start is a perfect spot.

And down the road you have that theme.

You may meet someone who walks through the door who's like, I do graphics, you know, and you may meet someone then who helps you down the road.

But to get off the ground, that is one of the best uses for it as opposed to, you know, just making cat videos that are, that are driving it.

Right.

So, but it has helped you make a, a great brand, like I say, quickly through, through every outlet quickly and something, you know, I came from an advertising world.

Yes.

Yes.

Where before even getting to the point you're at, just, just the look of it.

I mean, that would've been costly.

Yeah.

Even paying a, a graphic designer, you know, freelance, that would've been Oh, easy.

A grand just to come up with kind of a rabbit Yeah.

For that.

So - What, it saved me tens of thousands of dollars.

- So is it just you or do you have people helping you also with those kind of, that kind of program?

- It is a hundred percent me.

The, the online presence is a hundred percent me.

The management of this place, everything, the running of it management.

I sleep about four hours every night.

That's what I'm 20 like really 18 to 20 hours a day is pretty average for me.

16 has been my shortest day so far.

And I had two of those.

- Well as you can see, we both went down a rabbit hole.

We both got away with it.

And they're telling me I'm a little over on time for this segment.

Oh, are, are we.

So stick around.

You're watching Working Capital - Every year.

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- Welcome back.

Small business month.

And I think it's so cool because being a a female business owner, to me this is a realm where traditionally probably male dominated.

So it's cool to see someone strike out on their own and do it in such a - Kick - Butt way from the get go.

I mean, like you're still I'm sure filling out some road bumps at all, so.

- Sure.

- Speaking of small business and community, are there any other small businesses you utilize in Topeka to help you run your business?

- Yes.

I, all of my food actually is, is bought through a local company and specifically me, my meat, I've just switched.

I'm, I'm going to a locally sourced fresh, never frozen only, I don't know, it makes a difference.

- So like, like frozen beef and, and just So who are you using for that?

- Leonard's.

- Leonard's.

Okay.

So, and they are, I mean there is, there's a few other local businesses use their meat and there are, as any of us know these days, we, especially those that grow up in the fast food wars, I mean fresh is always better than frozen.

So it's nice seeing that local connection because I also think they source their meat locally also from different stocky yards.

And also that's my understanding connection.

What about liquor?

Is that through a national distributor or how do you, how do - You work on that?

No, I buy all of my liquor through Jack's, which is down there at 17th and Fair Lawn.

That's my designated liquor store to buy through.

And then obviously the beer and all that comes from Strath Man and Crown and, and Standard Beverage.

Yeah.

But as far as my liquor store is Jack's locally here.

- How, how easy or hard has it been to formulate those new relationships with those kind of businesses here in town?

- Really easy.

They, they've all been doing this for so long.

This was brand new to me.

Yeah.

So I came in going, blah, I don't know what I'm doing here.

But they, they've all taken me aside and said, kind of helped - Hold your hand at - Least to their - Side of it.

- Yeah.

This is what, this is what we do, this is how we do it.

This is, you know, what we did for the prior owner.

We can tailor it however you want.

But they've all been really great to work with and I couldn't have done it without 'em.

It - Kinda seems like they treat their clients as family also.

Is it?

- Yeah.

That, that the standard beverage rep has literally held my hand throughout the first three weeks of this process and physically was in here helping me get things put together during the cleanup process and all of that be, and the redecorating before we got it open.

So they've really gone above and beyond.

- So you're getting new, new sources of for meat.

So you're already upping the quality of what you already started with, which I think is cool.

So part of this, you did label it bar and grill, so I, I think a lot of it is you wanted to bring flavors and menus.

So have you decided to switch up that menu and, and what are some of your signature items and, - Well, I'll tell you, originally we were gonna cut it down to almost nothing.

Just normal, regular bar food because this was gonna be a big undertaking both sides bar and and restaurant.

But there was, I went through during my first month here in February before I took over, I was interviewing the regulars, asking them, what do you like here?

What do you like about the way things are now?

You know, including the food.

Yeah.

What do you like, what are your favorites?

And I got a really good sense of what everyone wants to see, stay on the menu and things that they didn't really care.

And my menu is now bigger than it was before.

So, 'cause I wanted to add some new things.

I and my kitchen staff has come up with some new thing that we have a Cuban sandwich.

There's not very many people in town that have that.

There's a few Yeah, we understand.

But people come in from all over, around outside of town.

We have had people coming from Holton for our Cuban because they love it so much.

- I've worked at a cafe during college.

How, how do you, how do you handle expanding a menu?

I mean, are you making sure certain items are being able to be used across the board - Here and there?

Absolute, absolutely.

Absolutely.

That was the whole thing.

It was like, if we're going to expand then we're going to make sure that we have things that can be used in more the smallest - Amount of ingredients.

But for the - Most, - The widest range - Is the widest production of, of meals.

- What's your favorite thing on the menu?

- My favorite thing on the menu is the shrimp Poe.

Boy, it's really, really good.

I - Don't hear a - Lot of David County.

It's a ade sauce by one of our cooks and it's really good.

And I do have a couple people that come in specifically for that too.

And they bring new friends every time they come.

They're like, you have to try this.

- Well, I like how you started, you know, you did ask the clients that were still here.

I shouldn't even call 'em clients.

I mean the friends, the community, the community building.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

How have, how have you seen new people come in and, and how has that reception with the ones that have been here, is it, is it like cheers?

Is it already becoming like cheers?

Like everyone knows your name.

- Yes.

- They're happy to see everybody that walks through the door.

- Yes.

You know, for me it was, it was harder.

I am one person coming in to learn all of the regulars.

They already know each other.

Yeah.

And I'm one person, so I walk in, you're the newbie.

They're like, oh, it's, it's Jennifer.

She's here.

And I'm like, you're here again.

I'm like, what was your name again?

What was your name again?

You know?

Yeah.

It took me a while to, to learn everybody's names, but I, I made sure I sat down going back to the whole community thing.

I do, I do want this to be a community.

Yeah.

And I want it to be a friendly neighborhood bar and grill.

And I want there to be more emphasis on the food than there has been in the past in this location.

Yeah.

'cause it's a restaurant too and we really are trying to make it kind of a restaurant destination.

There's - Not a lot right here, - So there's not, there's you've got the Mexican restaurant Jorge, down the, down the road.

Yeah.

And it's a great - One too.

- So.

Oh, it's so good.

You - Can almost build clients off of each other.

- Absolutely.

- On that note, have you been able to look into signage off the highway?

You know, 'cause you're right next to the governor's trails and, and the governor's mansion and I did that, that food on this exit.

So - It's so, so funny that you asked that because randomly one day outta the blue, I was like, I wonder how people get those things, those signs on the highway, like exit whatever food, and it's got your logo on it.

I'm like, I wonder how that happens.

So I do a little Googling and I look into that and I figure it out and I figure out the company that, that takes care of that for the state who you have to go through.

And I put in an application and I'm on the waiting list now, but I'm looking to be right, right outside of this exit on I 70 from from family - Waiting list.

Is that six months or is that - Like six years?

They didn't tell me - Six years.

You may have it.

- They didn't tell me.

I didn't ask that to more administrations won't get back at you.

There's no answer whatsoever.

So.

- Well that's good that you on the list and as you know, - At least I'm trying - At some place you have to be, you know, you're, you're coming from all those contracts, at least you're you day.

So, and let's talk a little bit about the specials and the nights and the stuff you do.

And I mean, there's pool tournaments, karaoke, I mean, how are you deciding on your mix of events here?

- Well, and how - Much do you do and how much do you say let's not do anything on this night because we do have, you have open nights.

How do you find your balance?

- Well, when I came into this, they already have someone for karaoke on Friday nights and it's always very busy and you know, if it's not, if it's not broken, I'm not gonna try to fix it.

So we, we still have that same person and they pack, it's, it's usually standing room only in here all night, Friday night.

Wow.

They really pack 'em in.

So we don't need to add anything extra for Friday.

No for Friday.

You know, and I, I love them, they do a great job.

But when I opened the bar, we were mid, mid session for the pool leagues and we do have a team out of here one night of the week that's, that's their home base is out of here.

But that's really it.

No one had really, they had two pool tables before and now we have three.

But that everyone wants these diamond tables too.

And I don't know anything about anything other than the fact that I know what the pool players want.

I do know a lot of big sure that they're gonna get what they need.

- Do use those.

So I think - That's a - Huge draw for anyone as you're trying to, if that is something you really wanna focus on.

- Build.

Well and I made half of the room.

- Yeah.

- Like you say, it's dedicated to billiards - And it's kinda nice 'cause so, you know, granted sometimes it, it, if you happen to get a table next to the place you're playing, it's, it's always good 'cause they, but if you're eating and you don't like sticks coming there, if you're trying to make a good shot, you don't wanna hit someone's grandma.

So.

Exactly.

It's nice kind of keeping a section for that.

- So yes.

So yeah, so we've got these with these nice tables and now we've got people falling over themselves to come in and, and play outta here.

So the next session that starts, I think they're signing up now and it starts in May and they will, we'll have pool leagues here Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday night.

We have karaoke Friday night we'll have pool league Saturday afternoon pool tournaments every Saturday night and Sunday will be our day of rest.

- But you'll still be open.

- Oh, absolutely.

- So - You absolutely, your - Day of rest is just not having some huge event.

- Yeah, we'll have, we'll still have our breakfast buffet with the mimosas and all of that.

Well there's not - A lot of breakfast buffets in town.

So you guys - Do have - That.

- Yeah, on Sunday morning we have a breakfast buffet.

Tell me about - That.

What, what all's on that usually?

- So it's, it's $18, but that includes your first drink.

You can get a Bloody Mary, a mimosa, a Irish coffee, well drink whatever.

If you don't wanna do, if you just want a soda or a water, it's gonna be cheaper just to buy the buffet and, and the drink.

So it's 15 if you don't wanna drink.

And 18, if you do, it's all you can eat.

We change it up.

We have, you know, different kinds of sausage.

We'll have bacon, we'll have sometimes biscuits and gravy.

Sometimes we'll have waffles, sometimes pancakes.

So we try to change it up every week a little bit.

- I mean, it, it sounds good anytime of the year, but I'm just thinking of chiefs games coming around the quarter and stuff, so that sounds like heck yeah.

A great way to start off your, your NFL Sundays, especially in this town.

Yeah.

And you do have this outdoor space too.

So any plans for this in the future?

What do you see out - Here here?

Well it really was a lot.

It was a hodgepodge of furniture mismatched, most of it broken.

And so I came in and it's, I've done very minimally just tried to, to clean it up a little bit, make it match and get some new things in here, refurbish some of the old things and just give it some cohesiveness.

Right now I keep joking and telling all of, all of the customers, I don't have patio money this year, you know?

Right.

I, I have patio money this year's let's that next year.

Next year the patio's getting fancy, but I don't have patio money this year.

There's only so much you can do and you don't wanna try to take on too much because - No, you can't overinvest also you can't because you're already overinvesting your time.

I - Am.

- So you, you don't want to, you wanna manage your stress, it's gonna be there.

Right.

But make it manageable.

Right.

So I am glad you found this to come back to that you went down the rabbit hole.

Thank you.

I think Topeka may be a little better for it.

'cause I mean you are building something cool here and it's, I love seeing a first time business owner, so thank you.

Well thank Jennifer for being on the show and well thank you.

Welcome back to Topeka and I hope you all can enjoy going down the rabbit hole as well.

So if you'd enjoyed this episode or you wanna see this again or view any of the past episodes, visit www.watch.kw.org.

Thanks for watching Working Capital, we'll see you next time.

Funding for Working Capital is provided by the Friends of KTW Raymond C and Marguerite Gibson Foundation and Kansas Department of Commerce.

To catch up on previous episodes of Working Capital, scan the QR code with your phone or go to www.watch.kw.org.