Announcer: Confronting tough conversations for a positive outcome.

That's coming up.

Maybe if you can broaden and open that up of another world, that there's a whole world out there, it's possible that you can get people to think in a different way.

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[music] Hello and welcome.

Today's topic is Difficult Dialogue.

We're introducing you to stories that involve delicate conversations that happen to change the world.

[opening theme music] Whitney: Bishop T.D.

Jakes is known for his messages.

As a filmmaker, bishop, and author, his calling is speaking and he knows how to get people to listen.

I knew when I was eight years old, my mother was carrying me in the car to speak for her sorority.

She was a Delta and she was a public speaker.

And I was sitting in the back seat of the car, and I said, "Right now, I'm going to hear you speak and they called me Mrs. Jake's son."

I said, "The time is going to come, "you're going to come hear me speak, and they're going to call you Tom Jake's mother."

And that's all I knew.

I didn't know I would be a preacher.

I didn't know what kind of platform it was.

But I knew I was going to speak.

Whitney: In his new book, "Don't Drop the Mic," T.D.

Jakes encourages and teaches others how to effectively communicate so they can use their own voice to make a difference.

Drop the mic means you did it really good.

I wanted to switch it and say, don't the drop the mic because words are powerful, and they are either tools or weapons.

It depends on who wields them and how they use them.

Well, let's go into that; communicating effectively because that's something that's, in this day and age, we are so quick, we see a lot of people just taking to their fingers, their social media, in the sense of like they just lash out.

But in your book, are you telling people to actually not only stay hold of their platform and speak their truth, but also like anchor it in more?

I'm saying, let's get out of our bubble without being forced out of our bubble.

All of us have a platform, and all of us have a microphone.

It may not be a literal mic, it's influence.

But if you're going to really affect the culture, you have to be able to go into the broader audience and communicate effectively with people that are very different from yourself.

Bring people around you who are different from you and have conversations.

Some of the best dinner parties I've ever been to in my life were filled with people who were absolutely different.

Sitting around the table with a rabbi, and a catholic priest, and an agnostic, and an atheist, and we're all having dinner together.

We're all having this amazing conversation.

What's amazing about it is how different we are.

What's boring is a table full of people who agree about everything and think the same about everything.

Who wants to eat with them?

How do we go about loving and caring for people that are completely different than us?

Talk to the person who's cleaning your house.

Talk to the person who's checking you out at the check-out counter.

Meet people that you normally avoid meeting and have a conversation with them.

And talk to them like they're a real person.

And you'll find out, hey, they're not as different as I thought.

They love their kids like I love my kids.

They want their kids to have a better life like I want to have a better life.

And ask them.

Rather than to come to them as a teacher, come as a student, and ask them-- this is one of my favorite questions-- "What is it like to be you?"

Whitney: Bishop T.D.

Jakes talks a lot about acceptance, and that has people tuning in.

He encourages people to follow in his footsteps, to create a dialogue and not a lecture.

People can tell when you love them.

And when you love everybody, they can feel it.

You can't change people you won't talk to.

That's why I say, don't drop the mic.

We talk about what's wrong with them.

You can't change people like that.

You have to talk to people about what's right with them and what they can be and what they can do.

And that way, you can move them toward being the best version of themselves they can be as we are all trying to be and none of us are finished with that.

[chanting] Stop Asian hate!

Stop Asian hate!

Whitney: Conversations that must be had.

That's what Shifa Zhong is facilitating after recent hate crimes against our Asian American communities.

This difficult time has him and others stepping up and speaking out.

Welcome to the show, Shifa.

Thank you for having me, Whitney.

We've been seeing these headlines play out on our Asian American communities with hate crimes.

What do you think is going on behind all this?

Yeah.

I think for the most of the people who are not Asian Americans, they don't really know what's happening to us, right?

And I can tell you that right now everything that you are seeing on the headlines, this is not something new.

We are experiencing everything that you see on the headline since the start of the pandemic.

Why has it escalated during the pandemic?

Because this is what we see on the news during that time, and then we, Asian Americans, are being the scapegoat of this incident.

So why is it so important to speak up about this?

Yeah.

Because I've been seeing your videos, I've been watching what you've been doing, and you've been very vocal about what is like to be you.

Yeah.

I think, to answer your question, is I can provide you with a cultural context.

Most of the Asian culture growing up is that we don't really challenge the authority.

We don't really speak up when we are in a difficult situation, right?

What my dad told me was, "Do not speak up.

"Just take the hit.

"Whatever the people give to you, just take it and then just go," right?

So we kind of-- And my culture is that we've been trained to have this kind of thinking.

From what they know, they don't really speak the language, they don't really know about American culture, right?

So this is one way to be silenced.

And then I'm learning from my friends, and I learned that there's something not right.

Why every time something that happened to us, we need to be silent.

If we keep being silent, the problem is not going to be solved, right?

So, in order for us to at least have a fighting chance, this is a perfect time for us to speak up.

So when you're at these protests, is it mainly your generation that's rallying together?

Yeah.

That's a really good question.

That's what I thought in the beginning.

And then it turns out when I was at the protest in Chicago Chinatown, I see all these Asian grandmas and grandpas, they're holding signs in Chinese.

But the first thing we need to start this movement is to get the young people together and then the elderly will follow because they understand.

What can I do to help end this type of hate?

I'm all about the action steps.

What are the things that we can do?

Right now, obviously, you see so much awareness.

We already achieved our first step.

So, what's the second step?

The second step, to me, is the solution.

So, right now I am actively pushing this initiative called Chicago Love Chinatown.

So, this is a way for the people who are not from the community so they can find this place to learn more about Chinatown.

Because what's happening in Chinatown or the Asian community in Chicago right now is not something new.

It's kind of just this reckoning of we're all in this together.

Yes, we are facing so many different problems.

This is Asian American's problem, it's not the only problem, right?

So we have other problem in the United States.

But at the same time, we are talking about it, we are actually doing something about it instead of, oh, okay, this is the hate crimes happening to the Asian Americans.

We're not ending there.

We're actually talking about it.

Yeah.

We're talking about and then now you and I are sitting together, we are talking about solutions.

What are the things that we can do?

I think this is really important to tackle this problem.

Awesome, thank you so much for coming on.

Of course.

Thank you again for having me.

I think this is a platform to amplify our Asian American voice.

[theme music] And, from a movie to a Podcast, meet the hosts of What the Deaf!

who have developed a platform to answer tough questions.

Whitney: Carly and Sarah are the creators of What The Deaf?!

Podcast where they discuss and share their experiences living in a hearing world.

There's so many things that we wanted people to take away from, but really that there's so many different kinds of deaf within our community.

There's not one right way to be deaf.

And with that and our upbringing and our stories and our identities, we really give the audience a case of the different types of beautiful, deaf people and their journeys through life, and navigating a world that is so unknown to many people.

So we want to take away that we're just like you guys.

We go through our struggles, our obstacles, our journeys, we just happen to be deaf.

Whitney: What The Deaf?!

isn't just for those who are hard of hearing.

It is also a space for those of able hearing to ask questions and to break down their assumptions.

Because of those assumptions or what they have, their thoughts and their ideas of what a deaf person should be it makes them scared to ask questions or just-- they just proceed without assumption without letting me explain what it's like to be deaf.

Because I'm the one that's deaf at the end of the day.

You have no idea.

So go ahead and ask instead of having that fear set in and stop you from asking people those questions.

This starts the dialogue with a hearing audience about what it's like to be deaf, and how there's really no right or wrong way to be deaf in this world.

And, you know, what it's like to live in a world that is based on auditory skills and how we lack that and how I navigate through my life.

So I think it's amazing to have that dialogue with the audience and educate them that I'm just a human being at the end of the day.

Again, we're just two deaf women in this beautiful world that has so many wonderful deaf people, and I think we're starting to make that impact but there's always more we can do.

There's always things that we want to make a difference in the world with different platforms to make a larger impact to fill more gaps that need to be filled.

But having this open dialogue with our Podcast and with our dialogue with our friends, we're starting to realize what other gaps are missing and how we are so motivated to continue that dialogue to fill in those gaps.

Whitney: This topic is not difficult for them.

It is what they love, and what they feel inspired to do.

As a deaf person, it's a full-time job.

It's a lifetime job where I'm always going to be constantly educating people, and it happens to be my passion anyway.

So I always desire for more and there's always room for improvement.

The Podcast fills some gaps, but there's some other gaps I want to continue filling for the rest of my life too.

Our next guest encompasses today's topic.

She facilitates difficult dialogue in extremely dangerous situations.

Welcome to the show, Bianca.

Thank you for having me.

So you get into conversations with gang members in order to bring peace.

Correct.

Why do you do that?

Because I-- well, I'm an anti-violence activist.

But the main reason is, I know that there's a better way because I used to be that person.

I changed my life around, and I don't want anyone to go through what I went through.

And worse, I don't want to see anyone dead or doing life in prison.

So take us back to what you have been through.

So, my past life includes 36 years addicted to heroin, living on the streets.

I was in a gang, I became a criminal.

I ultimately spent 12 years in the state penitentiary in the state of Illinois.

I was a career criminal.

And 11 years ago, well, actually almost, on May 10th, 2010, was the last time I get high and the last time I get arrested.

And I changed my life around and have truly dedicated my life to the streets and helping at-risk youth and high-risk young adults involved in high-risk street activity.

Most people, when they change their life around, it's hard sometimes to acknowledge where you have been and then go back there to help others.

What made you want to get back into exactly where you were but on the other side?

Yeah.

I feel very comfortable there and it's what I know.

I spent the majority of my adult life doing that like kicking it on the blocks and doing criminal activity, what have you.

But now, when I go back in, I'm in a different role.

And then I have street credibility, and I have a reputation of like, I'm not the police, I'm not the social worker, the mother.

And young guys, some of them, I know their older family members from back in my day.

So, I am respected and then just the fact that I once was involved in that life, that message is received easier.

Well, that's what I was going to ask is, you're not with the police.

No.

So, how do they know that?

Why do they trust you?

Because they know-- Street knows the street.

How close have you been to being shot?

Oh, well, in my past life I was shot.

But now in my new life, the past 11 years, many times I've had to duck behind cars because I'm in dangerous communities on the streets, on the corners with guys who are involved in violence and involved in gang activity, and a drive-by shooting can happen at any time.

That's what I was thinking is, here you are facilitating these conversations, and at any point you know your life is at risk.

Yes.

I've been on the scene.

There was one incident in uptown where me and another colleague stopped to get something to eat.

And then I saw some of the guys hanging on the corner across the street.

And I go, "Hey, let's just walk over there and talk to them."

So we went over there to talk to them, you know, to see what's up.

And then also even though you're acting like, cool and you're talking, you're feeling the pulse also.

Is something boiling or whatever?

Anyway, within three minutes, I kid you not, all of a sudden some guys ran from caddy corner and started shooting and the guy literally next to me got shot.

Oh.

And it was quite the scene.

And what are the conversations you're having?

Are you trying to get them off the streets?

First of all, you're bonding, and you have the relationship with young people.

And they trust you.

Like, I'm not-- Look, I don't want to know anything.

Don't tell me anything you did.

I'm just trying to help you.

What do you need?

What could I help you with, right?

And it may be sometimes, there are some guys that are really out there that they're not trying to hear that.

So you kind of have to undercover trick them in a way, kind of like.

So I am often known to, over the years, say, "Hey, I'm going to come pick you up."

And then I'm like, "We're going to go downtown, and I'm going to take you guys to lunch."

And I kid you not, a lot of these guys live within that block that they're from.

And, you know, so like with violence, there's so many layers.

Like, there's just-- I mean, they're just kind of stuck, you know?

And maybe, if you can broaden and open up of another world, there's a whole world out there, it's possible that you can get people to think in a different way, more open.

But I'm not going lie, this is not for the faint of heart because it's a lot of heartache.

And over the years, I had to learn because you lose guys and they get killed.

And it really hurts because I am so close with them.

And then I get that call, that dreaded call, so-and-so just got killed.

I get calls in the middle of the night like as if I'm the mother.

And on the opposite side of that, the difficult dialogue that you are doing, is it worth it?

I think it is because if it's worth saving one life, I sleep good at night.

And regardless, when I go to sleep at night, I know in my heart that I did everything I could that day to make a difference in somebody's life.

Even if it's just as much a smile at a stranger.

You know what's interesting is, you are really putting yourself out there in ways that a lot of us don't quite understand.

So to all of our viewers that are watching right now, I have to say, you're enlightening us in a different world we didn't even know, and facilitating conversations that we might not even be able to have.

Right.

That you don't even know that are even happening.

-Yeah.

-Yeah.

Thank you so much for coming on.

Thank you, Whitney.

I'm totally honored.

Thank you so much.

Leaving on a high note with a musician whose difficult dialogue is changing the world.

My name is Gaelynn Lea, and I'm a musician and a public speaker and a disability rights advocate from Duluth, Minnesota.

I do a lot of speaking about disability awareness and just some of the barriers that people with disabilities still face in our society.

But I always end that talk with like, reframing disability to be a form of diversity because I think there's a lot of negatives, stigma, or stereotypes or just negative energy around the concept of disability, when, in fact, it's a very natural part of the human experience, and it effects one in four Americans.

And it's not something we need to pity but we have to support it.

Make sure people have the resources they need and then we can celebrate it as form of diversity.

Whitney: Gaelynn's voice is becoming known for advocacy.

Yet, she's also using it to perform and speak around the world.

♪ Don't tell me we've got time ♪ Gaelynn: In 2016, I won NPR Music's Tiny Desk Contest and that kind of launched the opportunity to tour nationally and internationally.

The NPR Music Tiny Desk Contest is an annual contest where people who are not signed to a label can submit an original song that they wrote in the form of a YouTube video, and it has to be recorded in front of a desk so that they know that you make it for that contest.

I submitted my song, Someday We'll Linger in the Sun-- [music] ♪ And I love you ♪ [music] As a touring artist, I didn't realize-- I always thought it was like, my hometown isn't the most accessible when it comes to venues, and then I started finding the same issues all over the country and, in fact, in other countries too.

And so we're not going to see as many disabled artists if there are so many barriers to entry.

Most venues don't have ramps to the stage.

A lot of places don't have accessible bathrooms.

Or they're just not actively looking to include disabled people even on that level.

And so making the arts more welcoming and, in fact, inclusive of disability, I think, would change culture ultimately.

You know, we understand what we're able to see and learn about, and if you don't have disabled people represented in the arts, it's harder to move that discussion forward because it feels like it's not really a part of our society, and it is.

Whitney: Gaelynn stresses the importance of changing the way we discuss disability.

Talking about disability in the media is a really important piece of the discussion because there's, you know, a few really negative, I think, things that come out of representing disability without really being authentic about it.

The first is the idea of, her life is really difficult and somehow she still managed to make this art.

So there was one newspaper article that I did an interview for.

It went great, I thought.

And when the article came out, the first line was, "It didn't look like "she'd be able to do much with her life until she found music."

That just doesn't represent anything that I said during the entire interview.

But I think there's another narrative that I want to change, which is the inspiration like if they can do it, I can do it kind of thing.

Because even that idea that seems like it's in a more positive light, stories that are designed only to inspire non-disabled audiences are ultimately coming from this place of, their disability is an obstacle.

And I'm not saying that people with disabilities never feel that their disability has presented obstacles.

But if we only talk about disability as an obstacle rather than like just a way of existing in the world, we're never going to move to a place of actual equality.

And so, even subtle things.

I've turned down a lot of pieces because the sole angle is, how did you overcome your disability to learn how to play?

And it's like, well, I don't see it that way.

And so we're just not on the same page.

And I'm hoping that that changes the more-- I'm not the only one saying this kind of thing.

So, I want to see that change because if people realize that we don't talk about other forms of diversity as overcoming-- You know, you don't overcome your race, you don't overcome your gender.

I see disability as another extension of diversity in that way.

Today, we met so many people who are using their voices to create change.

We all have a story, and today's guests are amazing examples of using that to better the world.

Remember, your story matters.

[music] Announcer: The Whitney Reynolds Show is made possible by O'Connor Law Firm.

When it comes to your injuries, we take it personally.

Sciton because results matter.

Theraderm Clinical Skin Care: committed to developing skincare products designed to restore skin health and promote natural beauty.

Happy to Meat You: Prime.

Fresh.

Fast.

Leigh Marcus: Stop looking, start finding.

Children's Learning Place.

Ballroom Baths & Home Design.

Pedalheads.

UFC Gym Wrigleyville.

My Buddy's Chicago.

Brendon Studzinkski with State Farm.

Goldfish Swim School.

Ella's Bubbles.

The Kid's Table.

Hi-Five Sports Chicago.

The Metropolitan Chicago.

Fresh Dental.

Kevin Kelly with Jameson Sotheby's International Realty.

Mitchell Black.

Jewelry & Coin Mart of Schaumburg.

CI Med Spa.

Love Your Melon.

Deluxe Cleaning Services.

STI Moving & Storage.

Tutu School Chicago.

And by other sponsors.

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