[soft music] - Hello, I'm Nido Qubein.

Welcome to "Side by Side".

My guest today can tell us why downtowns are the heart and soul of any city.

He's the president of the North Carolina Downtown Development Association.

And since 2015, he has helped steer the downtown transformation of Greensboro, North Carolina, the third largest city in our state.

Today, we'll talk about leadership and innovation and the importance of downtowns everywhere with Zack Matheny.

- [Narrator 1] Funding for "Side by Side", with Nido Qubein is made possible by?

- [Narrator 2] Here's to those that rise and shine, to friendly faces doing more than their part.

And to those who still enjoy the little things.

You make it feel like home.

Ashley HomeStore, this is home.

- [Narrator 3] For over 60 years, the everyday leaders at the Budd Group have been committed to providing smart, customized facility solutions to our clients and caring for the communities we serve.

[soft music] - [Narrator 4] Coca-Cola consolidated is honored to make and serve 300 brands and flavors locally.

Thanks to our teammates.

We are Coca-Cola Consolidated, your local bottler.

[upbeat music] ♪ - Zack, welcome to "Side by Side".

I am fascinated by how the downtowns of so many cities have been transformed that young people who left those cities seem to want to come back and live downtown.

What are the ingredients that make a downtown great?

I mean, you are the president of the North Carolina Downtown Development Association.

You're on the board of the International Downtown Development Association.

You have guided the city of Greensboro in wonderful ways over the last few years, making downtown a more thriving place.

Tell us, please, the secret of making a downtown, a successful place.

- You know, it's a collaborative effect.

It really is.

And there are so many components that go into a downtown or an urban development zone, but honestly the energy, the excitement, the access to so many assets that you can walk to, whether retail or restaurant or residential, and in some cases perform an art center or baseball stadiums.

I mean, there's so much to do that people are attracted to that.

- But that takes capital.

That takes leadership, capital.

I assume it takes some governmental encouragement.

What are those components?

- That's the collaboration.

It is truly in any urban setting, a public private partnership.

There's no question.

Where there may be parking infrastructure or we got baseball stadiums or we just did in Greensboro, a $95 million Stephen Tanger performing arts center that has been a absolute Mecca of foot traffic and people coming in bringing Broadway shows, it's phenomenal.

- And that feeds into restaurants and everything else that people wanna sort of enjoy come downtown.

But you and I remember the time when everybody wanted to go live in the suburbs, what is it about now I wanna come back and live in a very urban environment?

I look at the city like Charlotte or Raleigh or Durham or Asheville or Winston or Greensboro or High Point.

This is happening everywhere.

- It's also happening in smaller places like Wilson or Fayetteville or Concord, Canapolis, throughout the state of North Carolina.

Where there's been an investment of community and you can't really do an investment in community in the suburbs.

There may be retail strip centers, but not to the magnitude of what you can have in a downtown urban environment.

And you're seeing it throughout the state of North Carolina.

And quite frankly, as you mentioned earlier, internationally as well.

- I remember when you and I used to go to, let's say, street shopping centers or downtown to shop.

And then malls became the thing.

Every city built a big mall, and now we're going away from malls to more individualized, more accessible kind of merchant places and sites.

Is this a cyclical thing, Zack?

- That's a great point.

'Cause when I think about the downtowns, I think about the '50s and the '60s.

The cars lined up, all the shopping was in there.

And then you went to the closed in malls that have struggled so much.

And then it went to the open air malls like we have in Greenboro, like I know Raleigh has as well and most communities have.

And so it's swinging back to that, the history, the culture of what is a downtown.

I would tell you that I don't think it's as cyclical as it has been in the past and here's why.

When we hold events, when we're building that social capital, it's easier to do it in a urban environment, such as a downtown.

You're not gonna have too many parades or events or music festivals in a suburban location.

And so having that, building that culture, that energy that happens in a downtown environment and I think it's here to stay for quite some time.

- Even in smaller areas, smaller cities?

- We are seeing it, it's been fascinating.

'Cause the state of North Carolina is unique in a lot of ways.

One is the significance between rural and urban.

So it's not just suburban and urban, it's rural.

When you have towns like Mount Airy that are getting their first brewery.

And so you're seeing towns like Mount Airy, Eden, Reedsville and so, like I mentioned Canapolis and Concord, they're seeing a resurgence in their center city.

And so it's fascinating, not only in the Raleigh, Charlotte, Greensboro perspective, but in the more rural aspects as well.

- Is it because more people are moving to a city and therefore they're demanding social places and sort of an activation of all the needs they have for social existence and communication?

Or is it that the people who are living there change their mindset or their appetite for it?

I'm not quite sure.

Or is it both?

It's a combination of many things.

North Carolina and our state certainly saw an increase in population moving to the state of North Carolina.

We've had significant business announcements.

We have more professionals move into the state of North Carolina.

And there's also folks that have graduated from college that are now, and you familiar with this, that students that are graduating are picking where they wanna live and the jobs come to them.

And in the state of North Carolina, we're very blessed that we have numerous cities that saved and preserved their historic fabric.

There's order buildings with the exposed- - For example as them- - Exactly.

- Exceptional job with that.

- Exactly, and so students are seeing that.

And then the other aspect is in particular, in a state of North Carolina that folks, and I'm the epitome of this choose where they wanna live and get involved.

And when they get involved, they're hooked in, they are committed to that community and building that sense of community is something that makes you wholesome in that.

And you're gonna stay.

- Yes, no question about it.

That's very, very true.

What role do universities play in downtown development?

- We in Greensboro are working with our local universities, of course in particular, you could say North Carolina A&T, the largest HBCU in the country is less than a mile from downtown.

And they just built 120 million engineering building.

So we are working with the chancellor there, we're working with of the students.

We committed at downtown Greensboro to fund an autonomous vehicle project, so that we can build a connection between the campuses and downtown.

Because any downtown, no matter where you are in the world, you want to retain that intellectual capital of those educated students for job and talent growth.

And so universities are a magnificent partner in that.

- Well, I mean, I think about the city of Charlotte, University of North Carolina in Charlotte is not downtown.

It's not one mile from downtown.

And they've been able to build rail that takes you from the campus right into uptown Charlotte.

That's a significant, magical, innovative idea that involved government, local government, state government, and that involved university leadership to make that happen.

They wanted those students to go from campus uptown, to go to restaurants, to go to games, to do all of that.

- You're working individually from each different community.

In our case, we don't have the tax base in which to build that rail.

So what can we do and what would be the future of transportation?

What is the future of mobility?

And it is autonomous.

You're seeing it internationally now.

- I'm scared of it.

I mean, I see videos of trucks, 18 wheelers being driven by no one, it's God and the engine in that truck.

And so I think, I agree with you on that.

I have to ask you a question.

It's a sensitive question, Zack, and I don't mean it in any negative way.

I just mean it in a realistic way.

With downtown development it appears, and I have no empirical evidence to share with you, but you know it better than I, that crime rises when people come downtwon, when they go to bars, when they gather in large crowds, when the crowds come from all kinds of backgrounds, am I right, am I wrong?

And if I'm right, how does a person like you, who runs the downtown development of the city of Greensboro third largest in the state deal with that?

- First of all, I never rarely disagree with anything Dr. Qubein says.

I can tell you that what you're seeing is in a lot of different communities as the population of the center cities rises.

Criminals don't wanna be around that increased population or activity because they don't wanna get caught.

And so the more you build up your downtown, or the more you build up your urban center, the less likely you are to have that criminal activity.

There's a international issue that we have, and that is seeking to help those that are in need, whether it's for shelter or for mental illness.

And that's not an easy one to solve.

- And it's a big problems, Zack.

- It's a big problem- - In every community.

- For those that need the help.

And that is something we struggle with.

Again, having served on or serving on an international board, it is something that comes up.

And I remember being in one of my first meetings and this gentleman with a wonderful accent such as yourself, was from South Africa.

And he was asking the question of how can we help those in need?

And then the other part he asked was how do we solve the ever ending parking issue in downtowns?

And I'm sitting there thinking we in downtown Greensboro have the same issues that Cape Town, South Africa has.

- Isn't that interesting?

The world is flat, isn't it?

I mean, globally, we're all alike.

- We are.

- We have fears and needs and goals and aspirations.

We all wanna live in thriving communities.

We all wanna have businesses come to our community, great jobs, have economic impact that universities and others bring forth.

In North Carolina, we've been very, very fortunate.

I mean, Raleigh and Charlotte, and now the triad, Greensboro, High Point, Winston-Salem have made some very significant announcements.

Tell me, how does a community prepare for a company like Supersonic or the Toyota battery coming to the Triad with thousands of jobs?

How do we prepare for that?

Housing, transportation, parking, et cetera.

- As I've said recently, that's an overnight 10 years success.

You had to start planning on that 10, 12 years ago and we did.

We were very fortunate working with PTP on discussing the mega site, which is the airport, the mega site, which is where Toyota is landing.

And I remember presenting to a group of business leaders talking about the three prong stool and the third being our urban job growth, our urban investment.

I will tell you that housing is the one thing that I think most communities don't prepare for because it's the chicken or the egg.

- It's risk.

- It's risk.

- It's risk.

- The developer has to take the risk and the banks have to take the risk in the development.

And so housing is a catch up component and we're seeing that now in the Triad, but hopefully that'll take care of itself over the next few years.

- You're very fortunate.

People like Roy Carol, who's willing to put literally hundreds of millions of dollars in projects, all kinds of projects, highly diversified projects that add to the fabric and fiber of a community.

How does a guy who graduates from North Carolina State University, majoring in textile management, you, end up in downtown development?

- Passion.

I can tell you, it was funny one time, many, many years ago, I had a friend that was living in another city in the state of North Carolina that's a rather large city.

And they were talking about what a wonderful city this is and how all this stuff they could do.

And I sat there and I'm like, but you're sitting on your sofa watching reality television, and you're not doing it.

I'll sit out and show you how great the Triad is.

And so I got involved and- - You got involved in nonprofits.

- I got involved with nonprofits.

I got involved with our baseball stadium in downtown Greensboro, that's where I really cut my teeth with Jim Melvin, Donald Moore, and the folks there.

And I got involved and I got addicted to changing our city in a positive manner.

And it was such a revelation that I ran for city council and I got elected, served four terms.

But I knew my passion was downtown.

I wanted to focus on, because that's where you bring everybody downtown.

That is everyone's downtown.

And neighborhoods are neighborhoods, but it's everybody's downtown.

- What was your first job outta college?

- I worked for Cole Mills in textile- - So it was in textile.

You can honestly say I used my college education at least for a while.

- I did.

And I actually ran an office for Cole Mills in Los Angeles.

So I moved across the country, but I missed the Triad.

I missed North Carolina, it's a great state.

- Zack, talk to me about the city in which you reside, Greensboro, North Carolina, the city that you've helped develop the downtown.

And tell me about the one or two or three most cumbersome challenges that you deal with.

And talk to me about a failure you've had.

- I can think of numerous failures and that's okay.

Those are I call learning opportunities.

The challenges that we have are when you're trying, if you think about it, I'm the glue that tries to hold it together between the public sector and the private sector.

And we had a challenge with 100 million development and a 28 million development, and then trying to get the city to figure out a 30 million development so that the 100 million and the 28 million could go forward.

- As in parking debt, you mean?

- As in parking structure.

And there's a lot of egos involved in that.

There's a lot of capital, not only financial capital, but emotional capital.

And so getting that over the hump and I put on my mission, my goals for every year is to get public private partnerships over the finish line.

That's not an easy thing.

Failures or something that has been challenging to me is I probably take a little different approach maintaining myself in a work life balance.

I'm doing better.

- And that's true for everybody, right?

We all aspire for that.

- Yeah, 'cause the failures, the things you didn't get across the finish line, there's running opportunities.

Maybe didn't have the right attitude going into the meeting or I didn't do something, but when it comes down to it, my personal struggle, having lost my wife a couple of years ago.

- And bringing up three kids.

- And bringing and raising three kids.

And then molding a community, not only in downtown Greensboro, but in the Triad and in the state of North Carolina as the head of North Carolina downtown and on an international scale was maintaining that balance has always been a challenge.

- Well, in your job, in you're position your surely you get criticism.

with social media now, anybody can say anything anonymously, if they so chose.

How do you deal with that?

- I don't really read it.

- You don't read it?

- I don't, honestly- - But you hear about it.

- I hear about it.

- There's some people out there disagree with what you're doing.

- Certainly.

- Yeah.

- But I would say that 85 to 90% agree with it.

And what I think about and focus is every day, and my son gave me this for Christmas this year.

I used to tell him every day I drove him to school, I said, be the best you can today.

Be the best you can today.

If you think about it like that, my making the right decision for people today, and that's what keeps you motivated.

That's what keeps me motivated.

And so, you're gonna have people throw stones, just stay positive.

- Usually that's all they do.

They don't wanna be involved in what you're doing.

They just wanna sit on the sideline and critique.

When we look at North Carolina, you're the president of the North Carolina Downtown Development Association, you know about every downtown in the state and what they've had to do and what they're doing at the moment.

They consider like Charlotte or Raleigh or the Triad, we think in the Triad as Greensboro, High Point, Winston, Salem.

Or the North Carolina corridors, PTP refers to it going all the way to Fayetteville, working together to attract people to the state, to make the state a wonderful place in which to live, raise a family, work, and hopefully prosper.

Which of those cities have done something remarkable in your view and why do you qualify it as such?

- Honestly, that's a great question.

Because many in the Triad and I've heard this recently, they don't wanna lose anything to Charlotte.

Charlotte's been this, we were bigger than Charlotte at one point.

But honestly I take positive things out of every community I visit.

You know, Charlotte, their leadership when they move the Coliseum from out at the airport to downtown, the baseball stadium from Fort Mill to downtown.

The public art that is in downtown Charlotte or uptown Charlotte- - So much of it is philanthropy, Zack.

- Philanthropy.

- So much of it.

- But it's pulling the pieces together to make somebody want to donate their hard earned dollars, to put a piece of public art.

And so you look at Charlotte and the leadership.

I have many friends down there.

We're actually getting ready to take a retreat to Charlotte.

'Cause you gotta learn.

Raleigh, the convention center that they built, turning Fayetteville Street Mall blocked off to an open road.

It got an award for the best street in the country.

So I literally take things from all over.

Greenville, South Carolina, the mayor, Knox White in Greenville is a good friend.

And we visit each other multiple times a year.

You take something from everybody.

- And High Point, High Point is a city of 113,000 people.

And High Point has done an amazing job in the last three, four years in terms of building a baseball stadium, in terms of doing so many things that are attracting people.

Some even from Charlotte.

You've got a lot of young people who leave and go to a bigger city, but then they get married.

They have a family.

They wanna go back to the roots and start all over again.

That's why I asked if it's a cyclical thing, because you see all of that movement happening all the time.

What is it, besides the political arena in which you have interest, what lies ahead for Zack Matheny and the downtown development, whether it's in Greensboro or across North Carolina, or in involvement with the world, with the global international downtown development association?

- I would say much like you.

You want to leave the world a better place because you were here to make an impact.

And it was funny, I've got a nine year old daughter and an 11 year old son and a 20 year old.

And I was driving my kids to school this morning, listening to the conversation.

My son, we got stuck at every red light.

And he was like, "Dad, do we have bad luck?"

And I'm like, "No, son, we just gotta practice patience."

And so the way to school is practice patience.

And so it's what you can leave for others to hopefully benefit from.

And in particular, my children, and as long as I make my children happy, I can make the rest of the community mostly happy.

And I that's what I'll keep fighting for.

- Zack, we talked about universities, let's talk about public school system for a moment.

You hear a lot of criticism about public school systems.

You hear a lot of familial feedback and input about whether the schools are doing this, or they're not doing that.

How is Gilford County dealing with school system?

And what are the challenges and what is the hope that lies ahead?

- We're getting ready to go through a transition.

We're gonna have a new superintendent.

And I couldn't imagine a job where my job is to educate, transfer, feed and educate 86,000 people.

- Who speak scores of languages, come from many, many backgrounds.

- And you've got the ultra poor and the Uber wealthy and you're trying to fit all that in.

I can tell you that from a community perspective, there's a lot of eyes on it.

And we understand the importance of that public schooling and making it done in the right perspective.

And so with new leadership comes new change.

I would imagine nothing against any previous superintendents, I think they've done a job.

But it's a difficult position, it really is.

- Your children are how old?

- Nine, 11, and 20.

- Wow.

And you're raising 'em by yourself, Zack?

- Well, as somebody once told me, life is a team sport.

And so my mom, when my wife was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, my mom moved to Greensboro and lives not very far from me at all.

And I've had my family help.

My daughter will be making Valentine's Day cookies this afternoon with my sister-in-law.

Life's a team sport.

- What did this adversity in your life teach you?

- It put life in perspective.

What really is important?

Is it keeping up with other people?

Is it keeping up with other communities?

How do you see the value in your relationships?

My relationships with my children, my relationships with my family, my relationships with my friends.

And I will tell you most importantly, my relationship with God.

'Cause if it wasn't for prayer, we couldn't have gotten through it.

And every night when we say that prayer, that mommy and God are watching over us, it's authentic, it's genuine and it helps get my family through it.

- God, family, country.

Fundamental values that enrich one's heart and directs one's mind and feeds one soul.

We all have that need in our life somehow some way.

Well, I congratulations for being president of the North Carolina Downtown Development Association, for being on the board of the International Downtown Development Association, for educating us about what it takes to build successful and sustainable downtown.

And I wish for you great things in all you do.

Thank you for being with me today on "Side by Side".

- Thank you for having me.

[upbeat music] - [Narrator 1] Funding for "Side by Side" with Nido Qubein is made possible by.

- [Narrator 2] Here's to those that rise and shine.

To friendly faces, doing more than their part.

And to those who still enjoy the little things.

You make it feel like home.

Ashley HomeStore, this is home.

- [Narrator 3] For over 60 years, the everyday leaders at the Budd Group have been committed to providing smart, customized facility solutions to our clients and caring for the communities we serve.

[soft music] - [Narrator 4] Coca-Cola Consolidated is honored to make and serve 300 brands and flavors locally.

Thanks to our teammates.

We are Coca-Cola Consolidated, your local bottler.

[upbeat music]