Making It Grow is brought to you in part by the South Carolina Department of Agriculture.

Certified South Carolina Grown helps consumers identify, find and buy South Carolina products.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 22 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by International Paper, and the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance.

♪ opening music ♪ <Amanda> Well, good evening, and welcome to Making It Grow.

We're so glad that you can join us tonight.

I'm Amanda McNulty.

I'm a Clemson Extension agent.

And our show is a collaboration between SCETV and Clemson University.

The wonderful thing about being in Extension is continuing education.

I get it when I come here, because I have all these smart people answering all these questions.

I get to learn from them every week.

We also this week are excited to tell you that a little bit later in the show.

We're going to talk about carnivals, country winery, and Barbara Smith daffodils.

Oh my goodness, what fun.

But right now Teresa Lott.

Thank you so much.

Terasa's day job is overseeing Master Gardener programs and all that kind of business.

But, you are so kind to us and always putting pictures on Facebook and getting questions for us.

We'd be lost without you >> Well, thank you.

I enjoy being here.

...it really is a team effort.

So there are lots of people behind the scenes that maybe aren't on the show, but are helping to answer questions and put content on Facebook.

So, it's not just me.

<Amanda> I know that we do appreciate it.

Everybody does that.

Drew Jeffers, you're up there in Spartanburg as a hort agent and you have a really exciting program that y'all had been developing, I think some of our panelists here, tonight and helped you.

>> Yes, it's called the South Carolina Certified Landscape Professional program.

It's an online course that a team of about 10 agents, myself, Jackie and Teresa were included on that one.

...we spent almost a year and a half developing it.

It is designed to give you a basic horticulture education kind of like a mini associate's degree, mini hort degree, basically designed to either compliment a degree or to give someone a landscape or kind of some basic knowledge to either train employees or they have an employee that want to invest in but maybe they don't have the resources to go to a community college.

They can send them this 10 week online course.

>> Is it self paced?

>> It's very self paced.

We offer it spring and fall.

So even though there's a time slot that we offer, it is self paced.

Once they log in, they can do it in two weeks.

So, they can do it in 10 weeks.

So we allow it.

So we've had about 100 and almost 150 folks go through already.

So the benefits the homeowners, is you can actually look up, if you google South Carolina certified landscape professional, you can actually go on our website and pull up the certified landscapers that are in your area.

And so, and also there's a re-education component with this.

So they have to get re-education hours to maintain their certification.

So, what happens is, every five years, they have to have 20 hours.

So, this is the landscapers it's good for them, because they can show their customers, "Hey, look, I go above and beyond.

There's actually a competition I didn't know about between landscapers now who can have the most hours.

And so it's a really cool, cool thing to watch.

And we're getting a lot of good response to this.

We're hoping the public's going to start asking for, if they're landscape's started by landscape professional.

<Amanda> Well, I am so proud and so many people now are deciding Jackie that it's they don't want to do all that themselves.

And I'm so this way.

You just don't have somebody who has a truck and a crew.

You know that they've been shown the correct way to do things.

So, the money that you pay, you're so much more likely to have good results.

>> Definitely.

It's an investment in your landscape.

Plants are expensive and you want to take care of, you know what you've already invested in.

<Amanda> Okay, well, and so to find out, you can either go to what website?

<Drew Jeffers> You can google South Carolina certified landscape professional.

It comes right up.

It's on our extension webpage.

You can also call the Spartanburg office or any in your local Extension offices.

<Amanda> Thank you so much.

And thank thanks to everybody who participated in doing that.

Jackie Jordan, you are an agent with a couple of counties of responsibility.

I'll let you name them, >> Richland, Kershaw and Fairfield.

<Amanda> Okay, and Fairfield has somebody who grows blueberries apparently, you and that person have a long standing relationship.

Somebody has great, great blueberries.

But you also are very interested in turf grass and think that's kind of fun.

We don't have a lot of women in the turf grass industry, but you're not interested in pushing a lawn mower.

>> No.

No.

At my house, the boys do that.

<Amanda> Okay.

Nice thing about him but a couple of sons.

Yeah, yeah.

Well, anyway, I'm sure we'll have some questions.

And thanks for being with us today.

Back for I think this is your third visit, but they've been spaced over a long time.

The first time you were hear, I think you were still a student at Clemson?

>> I was.

<Amanda> Casey Cooper.

Your family has a nursery that's been, I think that your grandfather started it.

>> My grandfather started about 60 years ago just rooting and grafting, chameleons and azaleas as a hobby and went from there.

So.

<Amanda> ...where are y'all now?

<Casey Cooper> We're at 8244 Parklane road.

And, you know, one of the biggest nurseries in Columbia trees, shrubs, annual flowers.

So, we got everything.

<Amanda> I think our friend John Long, who we did a wonderful I thought segment on at Columbia College is a frequent visitor.

<<Casey> Oh yeah.

He is.

John's great.

So, he's got the college.

If you're in Columbia, you need to go see Columbia College because he's got it.

He's got it looking good.

<Amanda> I don't see how one person gets so much done.

>> Yeah, me neither.

He's busy.

>> Yeah.

Okay.

Well, thanks so much for joining us.

<Casey> Yes, ma'am.

>> Alrighty.

Terasa, we usually start off with...gardens of the week people who have at least one pretty area in their yard.

that they've been able to keep looking great.

So let's let's see what we come up with this week.

<Terasa> Sure, it might be pretty or interesting or unusual.

I'd say unusual describes Annette Barrett who is growing - It's common name is called pumpkin on a stick, but it's not actually a pumpkin at all.

It's in the nightshade family.

So, more like an eggplant on a stick.

Deidre Kennedy shared her native flower bed.

Muhly grass - I love the texture of Muhly grass - is the subject of Karen Tebrich.

Mary Zucker shared her photo of it looks like mixed zinnias and cosmos.

And we wrap up with Cindy Burress Davidson, who shared a pumpkin which is a tribute to Amanda that she decorated at the South Carolina State Fair and I think she did a great job including the flower.

She said she had a new appreciation for how difficult it must be for you to create your hat.

<Amanda> It it is a challenge at times.

I often said If I'd known that I had to wake up in the middle of the night and say what in the dickins am I going to put on my head tomorrow, I never would have started doing it.

<Terasa> But you are well known for your hats.

>> One time we were ...off with the crew shooting a segment and stopped in someplace to get a drink and go to the bathroom and these 2 highway patrolmen was sitting there and I walked back to the bathroom, they went, "Where's your hat?"

[laughs] Which I thought was kind of funny.

Alrighty, Well, should we start with trying to help some people with problems?

<Terasa> We should.

That's what we are here to do.

So, Suzanne in Greenville has a question about her viburnum.

She says it's been struggling for the past four years, brown spots all over it.

The foliage grows, but it rarely blooms.

And she said she thinned it out to try to get some air and light.

She wants to know if she should just replace it or should she keep trying?

<Amanda> Oh, goodness, I'm sorry.

She sounds like she's certainly a good steward.

She's trying it and giving it - Maybe opening up was a good idea.

But Drew, what do you think needs to be done here to try to really get to the root of the problem?

>>Well, it looks like you got a couple of different things going on based on the pictures.

It looks like there's some...possibly some surface spore leaf spot, which is a fungally spot going on.

I don't think that will be causing the lack of flowering, but it's probably adding it's probably taking advantage of the stress.

If you want to clean that up, you can probably use something like a horticultural oil or insecticidal soap or soap or something like that.

Or you can even use something more powerful like copper fungicide, copper fungicide, you can get just about anywhere at any independent garden centers...just about anywhere.

That's usually a pretty good place to start.

<Amanda> Do you need to worry about temperature restrictions or anything?

>> You do need to spray that in the evenings, because copper can if you...leave it too wet and it gets too hot, you can get a little bit of burning.

So you kind of want to wait until the evening since, just - It's funny...you don't want - you want to spray the coat, but you don't want to spray it to the point of where it's dripping off.

<Amanda> Oh, okay.

>> So, it's a little bit tricky.

But the other issue I know we noticed in the picture is that it's probably planted a little bit too deep.

So, what I would probably do is recommend that you go in there and rake out and see if you can find the root flare.

That might be what you're seeing is some light and moisture hanging around the trunk and that may be causing some stress and causing it not to flower.

You also might want to do a soil test just to kind of make sure everything's in balance.

Sometimes we have Ph issues and nutrients aren't flowing up, you can tend to get inconsistent flowering.

<Amanda> Describe to people, please if you would, what a root flare is and why planting a little higher than low is so critically important.

<Drew> So what it is, if you've ever got in nature and you see especially with trees but it's true with shrubs as well, you want to look for the root flare, and it flares out straight.

It's comes down.

It flares up like an elephant's butt - <Amanda> ...so the trunk or the stem - starts flaring out.

<Drew> It starts flaring out and meets the soil line.

That's important for oxygen exchange, and it's also - and you want to keep that above the ground because (if) too much moisture gets built up around there, you'll get a lot of basil rot.

...a lot of times that rot, those symptoms of that rot will not show up for a good five to 10 years.

So, a landscaper plants it in the ground or you plant in the ground, you say it was planted, You say, "Hey, I planted it, "you know, and it looks fine for a few years, and all of a sudden it comes along and dies.

That's typically what we see.

<Amanda> Drew, also, if I'm not mistaken, can it sometimes cause encircling roots that are going to strangle the plant, girdle the plant <Drew> It can also cause girdling roots.

So that's very important when we talk about proper planning.

In fact, on the HGIC website, Clemson HGIC, we have a fact sheet, kind of a good reminder on all the particulars you need to make sure you're doing.

I had a football coach one time tell me, he said do all the little things right.

And...the big things kind of take care of themselves.

This is one of those cases.

So when you're planting that, tree or shrub, making sure that you're, you know, teasing those roots, untangling them, making sure the root flare's exposed and it's above ground, doing all those little things right, make it a lot easier in the long run.

>> if there are some encircling we should go ahead Jackie, if I'm not mistaken, and cut those and get them out of the way.

...I know y'all do a lot of installation if you put too much, if you amend a hole too much and make it real different from the surrounding soil, especially with too much organic matter, that's going to decompose and then the plant is going to end up settling.

>> Oh, yeah, and a lot of times if you're in just straight compost, it's almost like the plant thinks it's in a pot.

It's just going to - it's not going to send out deep roots and you know, get a good root system and just have a small...

It almost treats itself like it's planted in a pot.

<Amanda> Well, and it also means it's holding all that water.

It's kind of sitting in a bowl of oatmeal, >> Then they root rot and then you got a lot of other problems.

<Amanda> So, sometimes a lot less is a lot better.

<Casey> Yeah.

Don't overdo it.

>> Don't overdo it.

Yeah, but it is important to find that root flare.

Okay.

And Jackie, remind people of when they use a pesticide, they just don't go out there and go glug, glug, glug.

<Jackie Jordan> No, you definitely want to apply it as directed.

A lot of items need to sit on the leaf.

...you know, a little is good, a lot is better.

But you can actually but, over spring remove, move a lot of that product off the leaf surface.

So usually it's a light mist, is what's needed.

<Amanda> Sometimes, there are protective clothing restrictions.

<Jackie> Oh, yeah.

You want to, you can't go out there and flip flops and a tank top.

No.

<Amanda> Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Take pesticides, even the ones that are not as strong powered.

Treat them as what they are.

<Drew> It's kind of like with anything else that's dangerous.

You want to treat everything with respect.

And when you don't show it respect, that's when bad things can happen.

<Amanda> Okay.

Alright.

Well, we hope that she will have improvements, and thanks for trying to help with that.

All right, Ms. Terasa, Let's try another one.

<Terasa> Let's move to Irmo this comes in from Andy.

Andy says there's something going on with the lower half of my palm.

What is it and what can I do?

<Amanda> Oh, well, Jackie?

<Jackie> Well, it sounds like he's got bud rot.

That is an issue where you'll get an infection in there, bacteria, and it'll ooze out and it'll actually stink.

<Amanda> Ill!

>> Yeah.

really, like you said, this comes from improper planting.

<Casey> Yeah, a lot of times, we mostly see it from improper planting, and, you know, especially in a clay soil like Irmo that's going to hold that moisture more than a than a sandy soil.

If they're planted too deep, you can almost guarantee you know, within a year or two that they're going to, they're going to get soft and they'll start smelling and rot happening.

<Amanda> ...you know, we think of it as our state tree, but it's not a tree.

It's more like a grass.

<Casey> Right.

>>...so, I think, like with warm season turf grasses, we always say fall's the best time to plant, but I've been told that really since this is not like a- this is more of a - is more...like a grass and it's kind of dormant in the winter and you want to get good root growth and fast root growth.

<Casey> Right.

>> Do y'all usually wait, till you think it's best to do it as we're getting into the warmer weather rather than - <Casey> Palmettos we usually say you know, spring through fall is the best route, to avoid winter.

Okay, so you know, put them in, in the spring, then, roots can get established in the fall.

So you know, and we have a real wet winter like we've had recently.

Yeah, you know, they're more prone to getting that rot, especially if they're not installed correctly, and they're planted too deep.

So, yeah, usually, palm spring in summer, whereas, most trees, everybody would do in the fall.

<Amanda> ...Drew, my brother got on the landscape committee with a bunch of women who went to the beach just to play bridge, I think, because they were looking out of their window, and complaining to the grounds crew at this condominium place, that there were some brown, half brown leaves on the palmetto and they were cutting and only leaving the green leaves.

But I mean, a leaf a palmetto leaf that's half brown is still half green.

<Drew> Yeah, I'm not the best at palmettos or palms, but from what I understand, yes any kind of leaf color on there is better than nothing.

So, you want to leave as much material on there as you can.

I like to let things happen naturally.

So, let it fall off.

And it's a lot easier to clean up, as opposed to calling a crew out there.

<Terasa> Okay, if that petiole is still green, then it's still alive.

Yeah, <Jackie> There's actually a trick with the clock.

If you look at the horizon, and you look between nine o'clock and three o'clock, you really don't want to cut prawns that are above that, because if you cut too much up, yeah, then you can cut, you can create what's called penciling, where the trunk actually thins out because it's not getting as much of the nutrients and much energy in it.

So leave them until they're completely brown and way below the horizon.

<Amanda> Okay.

Okay.

All right.

So where they used to tell us to keep our hands when we drive, right.

>> Right.

>> They used to say, Now, I think they were confused.

But with palms, it's easy.

Okay.

If it's yeah.

Thanks.

Thank you so much.

All right.

So we've done that.

We've got the palms out of the way and now I think, Mike and palms for another thing about them is when they are in flower, boy, they are covered with pollinators.

It's really fun to see.

But I think you've got some pollinator plants for us.

<Casey> I do.

<Amanda> Let's talk about them.

<Casey> Alrighty.

This first one right here this is your Lomandra breeze grass.

It's a nice evergreen grass that's gotten really popular.

Have a little yellow bloom and springtime around April, May, good for pollinators and it's great because it's a clumping non-running evergreen grass.

>> That's nice.

>> It'll get some good size to it like three by three.

You see it used coastally A lot.

But it's cold hardy to about 10 degrees.

So you know, anywhere Columbia really on south is okay.

Likes well drained soils.

So if you got clay, you know, you definitely want to mend soil to make sure you got good drainage.

<Amanda> Now John Long had several of these when we went and visited with him at Columbia College, and they come in a variety of mature sizes, I believe.

<Casey> Oh, they do.

Yeah, so there's Lomandra.

There's Katrinas So, different blade widths, different mature heights.

There's a platinum, which is variegated, which is a little less cold hardy It's kind of so, so in Columbia, you know, 15 degrees is cut off.

<Amanda> ...full sun, >> full sun to part shade.

<Amanda> Okay, so a very versatile plant.

>> Yeah.

>> Okay.

Alrighty Well, let's see what else we got down here.

>> Oops.

<Casey> Alrighty.

So, next this is - It's still got some blooms hanging on?

This is the pugster butterfly bush.

It's a compact two by two growing butterfly bush.

<Amanda> Boy, that's pretty different.

<Casey> It is and they get real nice and bushy.

They're evergreen, <Amanda> Instead of just sprawl, sprawl, sprawl.

>> Yeah, they actually... end up growing in a round ball shape.

In Columbia.

I've got them in our yard.

I've noticed they're evergreen.

So that's another bonus.

And they bloom non-stop pretty much May through end of October, and they're highly fragrant - butterflies, hummingbirds, all that love them.

>> Goodness gracious.

>> They're really good smelling.

And they come in about five different colors.

>>I was going to ask you if they came in different colors.

Okay, well, let's see if we could get that one down.

...then this one, I think you're going to pull over.

Terasa had talked about the texture of Muhly grass and boy, this is something else.

>> She mentioned the Muhly.

Most people see the pink Muhly grass around.

This one's called White Cloud Muhly grass.

So, something a little different and you know if you want to use a white instead of a pink, and it seems like it gets a little bit bigger than the pink, but great grass and pollinator friendly for the, you know, late bees and butterflies still hanging around.

<Amanda> and once established, really easy to grow... <Casey> really easy.

That's why you see it planted on interstate exit ramps a lot, you know, very easy low maintenance.

<Amanda> and although I know some people cut them back if you're in a situation like on interstate ramps and things like when you can't, the top will die back and it will come back.

<Casey> It will.

Yeah.

<Amanda> So, you don't feel like you have to <Casey> You don't have to, and it will just look a little better if you do, but you don't have to if you don't have the time, it will be fine.

>>Yeah, well, a lot of us don't have the time.

>> Exactly.

>> Okay.

Well, these were just wonderful.

Thank you so much.

>>No problem.

>>Alrighty.

Teresa came and talked to us about a place that she found that was called the Cartersville Country Winery, and she went over there with the crew and I think they had a mighty good time.

♪ upbeat music ♪ ♪ ♪ <Terasa Lott> Muscadine grapes are native to the south east and the heart of the operation at Cartersville Country Winery.

I'm speaking with Carlos Norton, the wine master at the vineyard.

Carlos, thanks for having us out today to learn more about the process.

>> Yes, glad to have you.

This is definitely a work in progress.

<Terasa> Now, as I understand it, there's quite a long history here.

<Carlos> We started 12 years ago, Tom, which is like my adopted dad calls me and says I want to grow grapes and make wine.

And there was nothing here and we started off hand planting the first acre and now we have a team.

<Terasa> That is incredible.

Quite a growth over time.

Yes.

Now the process - Obviously, if you're producing wine, we're starting with Muscadine grapes.

And we grow the grapes and then harvest.

What is that process like?

<Carlos> It...takes four years to produce an acre of grapes to produce grapes <Terasa> Four years!

So, there's a lot of investment right there at the beginning.

<Carlos> Yes, and we started growing a great variety of Carlos grape.

And then we expanded from a Carlos to a Summit and a Noble, which is a red grape.

<Terasa> So you go three varieties, now?

<Carlos> Three varieties of grapes.

Over the years, we've had, we used to handpick.

Now, we actually have a harvester, which is a 1972 Chisholm-ryder harvester.

As you've seen today, he can go down a row in about four minutes.

We have several employees working there, the help or helpers, <Terasa> That harvesting process is phenomenal.

It's something I had never seen before.

...it appears to me that the harvester is shaking, and that's what releases the grapes?

<Carlos> Correct.

Yes.

It has fingers on the inside that actually shakes the grapes.

And the ones just ready to come off will come off, and then they conveyor up to the top, which then goes to the side tractor that actually carries the beings.

<Terasa> So people are working together to make sure that this whole thing comes together and the grapes end up where they need to go?

<Carlos> Correct.

<Terasa> Now after we're finished harvesting, what's the next step in the process?

<Carlos> They'll transport the grapes from the field to the winery, and I will dump them into a big auger.

The auger actually goes from the auger to the crusher.

<Terasa> After the grapes are crushed, what happens next?

<Carlos> It is - once they go from the crusher, they'll go from the crusher to the press, then the press will actually press all the juice from the pulp, the holes, everything we can get juice from.

And once we go from there, it'll go into a fermentation tank.

<Terasa> Okay, so there's a lot of waste that's removed during that pressing process.

<Carlos> Yes.

<Terasa> What do you do with all of that?

<Carlos> it goes to like my chicken farmers to feed the chickens, just whatever it takes to help.

So it don't all go to waste.

<Terasa> Great!

...then you've got that nice clean juice.

<Carlos> Mm hmm.

<Terasa> Now, take us along, what's the next step?

<Carlos> Alright, it goes from the press to a fermentation tank.

It'll stay in my fermentation tank for seven days for the primary fermentation, and then we'll rack it which is moving the juice to cleaner juice to smaller containers, and then they'll stay for 30 days or so and then they'll be stabilized into wine.

<Terasa> Now once it's stabilized, can it sit indefinitely?

<Carlos> Not indefinitely, but it can sit for years.

Once it's there?

Once we go from where it's just sitting and we get ready to make a wine or bottle of wine?

We'll put it in a cold stabilization for like two weeks.

It really chills the wine and makes all the sediment go to the bottom.

And once it goes to the bottom, we'll filter it from the filter process, it goes straight into a tank ready for bottling <Terasa> ...and bottling, that's really the final step.

>> Yes.

>> How does that work?

It seems a little complicated.

>> We have two machines.

We have a manual, six bottle filler, and we have a automatic two bottle filler.

We, it's just a process of filling the bottles and capping.

We use a screw type cap that's pressed on by air and then an automatic labeler.

And then it goes from - <Terasa> So, we fill it.

We cap it, we label it <Carlos> ...then it's ready for stores.

<Terasa> That is incredible, in front, but a lot of that is a very manual process.

>> Yes.

So once it's bottled someone is hand putting that packing it into cases.

>> Yes.

>> And then putting those on a pallet.

<Carlos> Yes, taping it up, putting it on a pallet.

Ready...for the wine deliveries to go up?

<Terasa> So where does the wine get delivered?

>> All over South Carolina.

That's fantastic.

I am just blown away, especially that I just recently discovered that you've been here and you've been here for a number of years.

You make a few different varieties, some reds, some whites and then some fruit wines.

<Carlos> Our wine started off with our whites, our Moonlight Imagination.

It's our first one that ever come out, which is a sweet Muscadine.

It's used from a colorless grape.

Our reds are Lynches River Red.

It's made from a nobles grape, which is also a sweet.

We have drier wines and in some sweeter wines.

But Muscadine are naturally sweet.

<Terasa> That's quite a variety.

Now Muscadine or wines are naturally sweet, but you can control the sweetness by how much sugar is added?

<Carlos> Yes, well, you know, once you go through the fermentation process of adding yeast to sugar, the yeast burns all the sugar, which turns it into alcohol.

Then you have a dry wine.

So, you back sweeten the sugar to make the grape taste fluffy.

Add a little bit more sugar to make it sweeter, a little less sugar to make it drier.

That's how we come up with our Moonlight Imaginations, our two whites and our two reds.

Our fruit wines instead of using sugar to back sweeten it, use a concentrate, which is a fruity concentrate.

I already have the wine.

I'm just changing the flavor of the wine itself and it works.

<Terasa> So all of the fruit wines essentially have the same base and when you just change the flavor palate based on whatever.

<Carlos> Correct.

>> Okay, fascinating.

Not only is this an operating winery, but the property has more to offer.

<Carlos> Yes, we have.

We have weddings out here.

We have a wedding venue.

We have a building for smaller parties.

We have overnight accommodations, Airbnb, ...we have people who just come out and want to walk through the grapes.

<Terasa> I can understand why.

It's very peaceful out here.

<Carlos> Very peaceful.

<Terasa> Maybe not during harvesting times - You know, you got a little bit dirty already this morning, just in the process.

It has been incredibly fascinating, learning how we go from grapes in the field, to wine in a bottle.

I really appreciate the time you've spent with us.

And I'm sure others would like to know a little bit more.

What's the best way for people to find out about Cartersville Country Winery?

<Carlos> We have a Facebook page, of course we have a website, Cartersville Country Winery.

I mean they're welcome just to check us out.

Come out here and look.

Ask questions, whatever they would like to do.

<Terasa> a fascinating story about something that is certified South Carolina grown.

♪ <Amanda> Terasa, that looks like you had a good time over there.

<Terasa> Oh, we sure did.

But I did not realize that, there are a lot of steps from harvesting to the bottle of wine that you might enjoy with a meal.

<Amanda> Yeah and they seem like very nice people.

>> So much fun and just so down to earth.

>> I'm glad you had such a good time.

Well, I'm one of our recent shows.

I forgot to do a hat so I'm going to make ...maybe do two tonight.

This one interestingly, I was out working my yard I have a good mini cabbage palms, the sable minor and they set seeds and so I cut some of them off and decide to make a hat out of them, because if I leave them some of them will come up then I'll have to pull them up.

And then...my husband's poor Bromeliads had been a source of I've been cutting them back and cutting them back and cutting them back to get a little bit of color mixed in with it.

But Teresa, I think you've got a spotlight garden for us, where somebody had more than one nice picture to send.

<Terasa> Yes, today we are going to take a look at the yard of Donna and Tommy Dowling in Greenville.

We begin with a lovely view looking down the stairs and it looks like there are a lot of stairs.

But Donna and Tommy have strategically used pots as accents to add pops of color in different places and while their yard is shady, it is by no means boring.

You can see different shades of green as well as many different textures.

And we finish up with toad lilies and they're pretty exotic looking with their almost orchid like flowers.

Many thanks to Donna and Tommy for sharing a little bit of yard, with all of us.

<Amanda> Okay, well, we thank them too.

Have you got another question for us now?

<Terasa> Oh, you know, we always have questions.

This one comes in from Nick in Sumter.

He says I'm worried about my Longleaf pine.

There seem to be lots of brown needles.

<Amanda> Aha!

Well, surprisingly, or coincidentally, we were over visiting with T.J. Savereno at the Pee Dee Rec and he's got a lot of studies going on there ... and that was a question he gets a lot.

So, why don't we let him give us the answer.

>> Sounds good.

<Amanda> T.J. these are evergreen, long leaf pines, but although it's the tree itself is evergreen, the leaves which the needles are, don't last forever.

No.

And a lot of times people get worried when they start seeing all these yellow needles on their trees.

What's happening here?

<T.J.> Well, yeah, we get a lot of calls this time of year and into the fall, October, people saying that there's something wrong with their long leaf trees, and that we need to come out and take a look at it and let them know what's going on.

and it's just a normal process.

While the tree itself is evergreen or the species is evergreen.

Not every needle on the tree stays evergreen, they don't live forever, unfortunately, but or maybe fortunately for the people who like the pine straw, that falls on the ground.

Right.

The Rake for the raking.

But these needles last only about two years, two growing seasons, and then they will turn brown and fall off the tree.

You can see this part, portion of the branch here is this year's growth.

There's no brown needles there.

It's only back here, which was last year's growth, where these needles have served their purpose they've done their photosynthesis and everything and they're ready to be replaced by new needles and they tend to drop.

Now, sometimes this happens earlier, it's when we really get the calls, in a bad drought year, these needles may start to turn as early as July.

Sometimes earlier has happened.

But in those years people really get concerned because they're not used to seeing them turn brown.

But the thing to look at is you notice the browning is happening back here toward the base of where all the needles are.

Okay, the important thing is that this part of the branch is green and healthy.

>> Yeah.

>> Now, if you see widespread browning of the tips of the branches, then you may have some type of disease issue or some other stressor factor that is taking its toll on the tree and then we'd be glad to come out and take a look at it.

See what's going on.

<Amanda> All right.

But ...this is real important because long leafs are fire dependent.

So, this is what burns.

Those of us who love to use this beautiful long leaf pine straw, it's a good thing it does fall off the tree.

>> Well, the same thing that makes it so good for landscaping is what makes it so pyrogenic is that it's got a lot of resin in the needles, as opposed to like using loblolly pine straw.

Long leaf has a lot more resin in the needles and it lasts a lot longer, retains its color a lot longer, <Amanda> A lot prettier, <T.J.> ...those resins also burn very well.

So that's, that's one of the adaptations that the longleaf has made to make sure that there's plenty of fire around it.

<Amanda> Isn't it just amazing.

I mean, from pine tree to pine tree, how very, very different they are.

>> Yes, <Amanda> Yeah.

Just like people.

>> Exactly.

<Amanda> Yeah.

Thanks, T.J. >> You're welcome.

<Amanda> I really want to thank T.J. and we've got some other information where he talked about longleaf pines that I think you'll enjoy seeing coming up in the future.

So I said since I forgot I had one, we got to make two.

So this one is Daphne and it's a labor I'd really hate to cut my Daphne because it goes so slow but for those of you who were at fans, I did cut my Daphne for you.

...then I put some of the bloom of Fatsia.

I just love Fatsia blooms when they come at such #*opp times of the year.

And then they get even stranger when they start setting ...the seeds on them.

It's a great plant to use.

At any rate, let's see, Teresa, I think you've got something for us.

<Terasa> We do from Woodruff.

Bob says I planted crimson clover and buckwheat as a cover crop, when should I plow them under?

<Amanda> Alright, well, this is - a lot of people are using cover crops, and sometimes they just terminate them in the new way of doing agriculture but do they need to be plowed under or just cut?

What are you thinking?

>>So there's a couple of different options you have.

Yeah, it's ... really, I hate to use the phrase making a comeback, but it's becoming more and more popular with gardeners in their vegetable gardens because they're being more aware of that they need to start adding organic matter back to their soil.

So really, and truly, when you grow the cover crop, like clover, and buckwheat.

You want to wait until at least when it flowers, but you can also wait until the next the following spring.

So let's say you plant it this ... fall, you can then wait until the following spring, you can either plow it under or you can actually in some cases, like I've done this with tomatoes, you can cut it way back, yes.

And you can actually grow the tomatoes inside the clover.

So you got a living mulch essentially.

Now, that's a challenge.

It's hard to do that from seed.

So, if you're going to...do that, do it with plants.

So there's that option too, but you also can certainly till it up and plow it under to help incorporate that organic matter in your soil.

<Amanda> Okay and I'd like to tell people that Buzz Kloot at the Arnold School of Public Health at the University of South Carolina is a real expert on cover crops as they're now being used, and if you look up Buzz Kloot K-L-O-O-T, he has a series of videos he's doing with farmers and ranchers and people all over the country, tremendous improvements to soil quality and content when you...take that route.

So, I think we have some plants to look at.

<Casey> We do.

>> What have we got now?

<Casey> So now, this is some fall blooming stuff.

This right here is your - one of your encore azaleas.

<Amanda> This is so much smaller than when the first ones that came out.

<Casey> Yep.

So this is one called chiffon which is dwarf.

It's two and a half wide by two and a half tall plants.

Good low growing, three times a year bloomer.

To me, it seems like the encores bloom heavier in the fall than in the spring for some reason.

So just great.

You know, evergreen plant and get blooms 3 times a year so not many plants can compete on how many blooms you get in a single year.

<Amanda> And I've always found that Azaleas do not want to be in full afternoon sun, >> They don't prefer it, you really got a baby if you have them in that.

So they you know, they'd like a little break at some point in the day for say, you know, morning sun would be best but >> Yeah.

>> Yeah, you know <Amanda> ...that is perfectly beautiful.

And that's also a very pretty color.

>> I got that pink and white.

Alrighty.

And then I know they mentioned Toad Lily earlier.

So here's one of your toad lilies.

>> How about that.

This is the time of year they bloom.

Low growing great shade to partial shade plant.

The rabbits and deer don't mess with them, which is another bonus because a lot of you know low growing blooming perennials are tender and you know the deer and rabbits get them all but they won't mess with these.

They can take some kind of moist soils, you know places where it might be a little low line.

And again some shade and shade you know, kind of shady wet areas where you can't get other things to grow, Toad lilies are good for you.

<Amanda> Now, is the foliage evergreen.

<Casey> Most of South Carolina is going to be evergreen except in the upstate.

You know Upstate is going to die down, come back up.

So, perennial no matter where in the state.

<Amanda> A lovely, lovely flower, isn't it.

<Casey> It is very, very interesting flower.

And then this right here is your snow and summer Asiatic Jasmine.

Not nearly as aggressive as the green Asiatic <Amanda> Thank the Lord, because it can be a little bit of a handle.

<Casey> I got sick of planting flowers by my mailbox every year, so I just made the whole bed this and the older it gets the more color it gets to the leaves.

So it looks like there's flowers blooming out my mailbox.

You know all year long.

Very easy to maintain.

It can go in sun, part shade if you put in heavy shade, it kind of loses color.

So, it's best to use you know, >> So just the...the color is at its peak, when?

<Casey> Color lasts usually spring and summer, spring in late summer to fall because most of the color comes on the new growth.

>> I see.

>>...so usually spring involves when you get the most color out of it.

A lot of people use it in containers.

Riverbanks Zoo has it in some containers and it's all >> cascading, beautiful.

>> It's all the way to the ground.

And it won't take over a pot as bad as the old kind.

<Amanda> That - it is a pretty aggressive plant.

Well, I must say.

It makes me rethink this plant, because I've found it to be so aggressive, but I think this is really quite lovely.

>> It is.

>> Okay.

Thank you so much.

Alrighty.

Barbara Smith, honestly, just so many wonderful things.

She's one of the experts at HGIC.

She takes pictures at the Botanical Gardens every week, and has a wonderful yard as well.

I don't know when she finds time to do it all.

But she gave us a beautiful view of her yard and the many daffodils that she had.

Today, I'm speaking with my good friend Barbara Smith.

I wish I could be there in her beautiful yard in Pendleton, but this is the next best thing.

Barbara is of course, a horticulturist with the Home and Garden Information Center.

And Barbara remind people of what you've managed to do on crooked trail.

>> Well, as I've spoken to you before, Amanda, I'm a plant geek.

Cut me I bleed green.

I've told you that before.

Today we're going to be talking about my daffodils, which are some of my favorite flowers.

>> They are evident in old gardens, because they are so persistent.

Let's talk a little bit about the scientific name and...the common name and the multitude of different types that exist, please.

>> People get daffodils and the term daffodil, and Narcissus confused.

And so to make it very simple.

daffodils are the common names for these beautiful flowers.

And then Narcissus is the genus part of the scientific name for these flowers.

It's interchangeable.

You'll see them called both both are correct.

But it's a very simple explanation, the difference between it.

The interesting thing about daffodils is that most of them are native to the Mediterranean, but some were brought here from China and Asia.

They don't know if the early colonists brought them with him when they emigrated to America.

But the first recorded history of daffodils being brought to the United States or shipped to the United States was in 1740 when Peter Collinson sent 40 varieties to John Bartram in Philadelphia.

<Amanda> Whoo, that's a lot, and I think it's fun to talk about the way Narcissus, the name comes apparently there was a Greek god, who, if he wasn't handsome, he sure thought he was.

And he stared at his image on the water to such an extent that they said, Oh, we're just going to turn you into a flower.

>> I love that story.

I do.

>> And they are beautiful.

But Barbara, there are so many different types.

And so from teeny tiny ones to great big yellow ones to white ones.

So, talk a little bit about how the community of daffodil lovers has kind of divided them up if you would, >> American Daffodil Society really writes them in about 11 different groups.

One group, the first one that I love so much are the bulbocodiums, and they look exactly like old hoop petticoats and they're called hoop daffodils and you usually see them in whites and yellows, but just something not for everybody.

It's a very interesting, unusual if you want something rather bizarre in your garden to plant <Amanda> and then Barbara few would just go through some of the others for us and give us an example of one or two please.

<Barbara> The Cyclamineus have a reflex petal that pulls back in very small cups on them.

A lot of blooms on the stem.

A couple of good examples are Tete a Tete and jet fire.

The doubles are multi petaled.

just beautiful ones.

Candy Princess, Golden Ducat, Tahiti, White Lion, Erlicheer are good examples.

The Jonquilla are the ones very petite.

They have small cups, several flowers per stem and extremely fragrant.

If you get a bouquet of these in your house you will smell them all over the house.

Pipit is one of my favorites because it's a tiny little yellow flower with around the flush base of the cup is white, so it's lovely.

Blushing lady is another one that has a pink cup with yellow petals.

The large cups, these are the giants of the Daffodil world.

Dinner plate, Ice follies is probably one of the best ones that you can plant if you want it to multiply and come back year after year after year.

Fortissimo, I love some of the names that they have.

They named one after Slim Whitman.

Bella Vista, Flower record, Poeticus is one of my daughter's favorites.

It's large white petals has a small flat cup and the interesting thing about it, is that the cup is yellow but it's ringed either with red or green.

And two of those are Acetata and Pheasant's Eye.

The small cups, large petals with the small cup.

Barrett Browning is one Lorikeet is another one.

It's really nice.

The Tazenetta or the - have clusters of two to 20 dainty flowers, short cups and a very intense fragrance.

Cheerfulness, this is the category, your paper whites that a lot of people are familiar with fall into.

And also the Geranium is a white with a little orange cup.

The Triandrus have two more flowers per stem.

They do have the reflex petals that bend back and small cups but they point down instead of pointing up and very fragrant.

Thalia is a beautiful, pure white one.

Katie Heath is another lovely one, and then the big trumpet cups.

The cup stems out beyond the petals, Chromocolor, Dutch Master, one called Las Vegas, that is really a pretty one.

Mt.

Hood is one of my favorites because it's a pure white, and Spellbinder is also a beautiful one.

It's sort of a lemon yellow that's kind of shot through with some white.

<Amanda> And then I think Barbara some of the ones that were some of the first ones that used to collect from family members fall into the split corona category, is that correct?

<Barbara> A few of them do.

The ones that I really collected from the old family ones were, more of the really old fashioned types, but with the split corona they're very fancy.

It looks like you took a pair of scissors and split the corona in little pieces.

They're pressed back against the petals.

Cassata, Orangery and Slice of Life are some examples of that.

Now in my own garden, when I first started out and didn't have a lot of funds to buy plants, I collected a lot of daffodils from my great grandmother's ruins of her garden.

Her name was Vicie Jennings Holloway in Chappells.

And I found the old fashioned jonquils that we love.

The Campernelli Eyes which are just beautiful, tiny little yellow flowers bloom prolifically.

Some of the Leucojums which are really not true narcissus, but the Summer Snowflake or Snow Drops that they're called, but my garden is full of those.

I've talked before about floral genealogy.

So this is a very important part of my floral genealogy by having flowers from her garden.

<Amanda> One thing I think that this indicates is that they don't require a whole amount of care, a huge amount of care to continue to be beautiful.

So talk a little bit about the care, the fertilization, and the important things to make sure that they come back every year, Barbara.

<Barbara Smith> Daffodils or Narcissus, are normally planted in October, November.

I have planted them some as late as December if I want to delay my bloom time with them.

You'll see them for sale in September.

Don't plant them then, it's a little too hot.

Keep them in a cool place.

When you do choose your planting site, they'll grow anywhere from full sun to part shade but won't bloom well if they're in deep shade.

Good drainage: They do not like it if the soil stays soggy or wet.

And moderately fertile: The biggest mistake people make with daffodils as far as fertility goes is that they put too much fertilizer.

Too much nitrogen will cause the bulbs to produce a lot of foliage and very few flowers.

<Amanda> And Barbara, in the past when we've talked with people who do massive plantings like at Riverbanks where they have good soil fertility overall, they don't bother to put a little teaspoon or tablespoon of fertilizer in the bottom of each hole as sometimes the companies want you to do.

They want you to buy that fertilizer and often that is not necessary.

<Barbara> No, it's not, Amanda, and the biggest thing in educating people how to properly fertilize, first of all, they hear me say this over and over again: a soil test.

And I preach about not going out and over applying any phosphorus based fertilizers or bone meal without having the results of a soil test.

It's key.

Daffodils truly can be left alone.

If you do have to add a fertilizer then you would do something like a 5-10-10, if that, you know, but I don't fertilize mine.

Mine bloom well.

<Amanda> The problem that most people have with not having their daffodils come back is because they should be looking at something else instead of the foliage.

Once the flower dwindles, and you can cut the flower off if you want to, but that's a lot of work.

But they're going to have to replenish the bulb, and that means they've got to photosynthesize.

So tell us, I think you just need to look somewhere else, because the big mistake is people say, "Oh, I can't stand to see that foliage anymore."

<Barbara> Well, it yellows, you know, it starts senescing, and people look at the yellow foliage, and when you have a lot of daffodils, that's a lot of yellowing foliage that you don't want to look at.

The biggest mistake people make is that they cut it back immediately after it blooms.

Well, you're not going to have flowers or much less bulb size next year.

I've seen people bend them over with a rubber band, I've seen them braid them.

One thing is just ignore it.

The other thing is interplant your daffodils in your perennial and day lily beds.

And then as your perennials and day lilies emerge, they're hiding that foliage.

As soon as that foliage turns brown and totally dries up, you can just reach down with your hand and pick it up off the ground.

<Amanda> Okay, and then Barbara, you say that a good practice is to photograph where they bloomed in your yard so next year, you won't go out there and dig them up.

Is that correct?

<Barbara> Especially when you want to add.

You know, I add about several 100 bulbs to my garden every year in the fall.

And, of course, when you start adding that many, year after year, you tend to forget that I put them here or not, and the worst feeling in the world is when you put that shovel in the ground or I have a drill, but I have a bulb bit on the end of, and you hear it hit the bulbs.

So what I do is either while the daffodils are in bloom or after they finish blooming, I go around with my camera and photograph places in my yard that I want to add more to the next year.

One thing that I've had a lot of fun doing in my own garden is planting what I call daffodil rivers.

So pathways that I don't use normally, I will intensely plant with daffodils.

There, they bloom, you have this beautiful river, and then the foliage dies back and then you know, the other 10 months out of the year, you're back to your path again.

<Amanda> Barbara, I think you're planting this tradition of loving daffodils and narcissus in your own grandchildren, and I bet the day will come in the future when they'll be coming back to Crooked Trail Farms and saying, "Oh gosh, I remember doing this with my grandmother!"

and digging some up to take to their homes and continuing that tradition with their families.

<Barbara Smith> When my children, Caroline and Paul, were small, one of their greatest joys was for me to say to them, "Go pick an armload of daffodils and bring them in the house."

They love doing that.

They still, you know, have just wonderful memories.

And my granddaughter's birthday is in November.

So every November, I ship her a big box load of daffodil bulbs, and she plants them and we talk about them and learn the names.

<Amanda> How wonderful to start these traditions with families.

Thank you, Barbara, as always for sharing some of the highlights from your family's love of plants with us.

We want to thank Barbara for the many times that she has shared the beauty of her yard with us.

I can't wait 'til I can go up there and see it.

Well, Terasa, Thanksgiving is coming up and we are always telling people about HGIC to call with gardening questions, but they have some food experts too, don't they?

<Terasa> Yeah, so Adair Hoover is there and she can help, and there are a lot of fact sheets as well.

You know, you definitely want to make sure you're being safe because your Thanksgiving holiday won't be so much fun if someone gets sick.

So lots of information about how to properly thaw the turkey, make sure that it's cooked to the proper temperature, and make sure we're preventing those food borne illnesses.

<Amanda> Yep, yeah.

Anything y'all enjoy doing particularly in the fall?

<Jackie> I always like to garden, so you can plant bulbs, onions, garlic, and actually, Pal Smith always told me that Thanksgiving, right after Thanksgiving is the best time to plant your sugar snap peas.

So if you want your sugar snaps and your snow peas, put them in right after Thanksgiving, <Amanda> Okay.

Drew?

<Drew Jeffers>Fall is definitely the time I like to get some of my future plans for spring going, so I do a lot of planning, but I also do some time for some maintenance.

So one thing on my lawn is I make sure my lawnmower blades are good and sharp.

I make sure my tools are good and sharp, my printers are oiled and all, stuff like that, just general maintenance.

<Amanda> Okay, and I guess you're just working, working, working because fall is still a great time to plant.

<Casey> Yeah, great time to plant trees, your sasanquas are blooming.

<Amanda> Yeah.

<Casey> And you get to eat all the good stuff you've planted earlier in the spring... <Amanda>If you got it done.

>>If you got it done.

>> Well, I hope everybody did get it done, and we thank you all for being with us.

We'll see you next week.

Night Night.

♪ closing music ♪ ♪ Making It Grow is brought to you in part by the South Carolina Department of Agriculture.

Certified South Carolina Grown helps consumers identify, find and buy South Carolina products.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 22 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by International Paper, and the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance.