This is Vermont edition.

I'm Mikayla LeFrak.

The signs are all out there.

Stick season is almost upon us.

The skies are gray, the wind is blowing, and the leaves are dropping.

And the mums are abundant.

Despite the changing seasons, the gardeners among us are still very busy.

Troubleshooting garden fail from the summer, prepping beds for the winter and bringing potted plants indoors.

Today is one of my favorite days of the year.

It is Vermont Edition's annual fall gardening show with Charlie Narduzzi.

Hey, Charlie.

Hi, McKayla.

Charlie's the host of all things gardening on Vermont Public.

He's a gardening consultant and a repository of more knowledge about plants than anybody else I know.

Very happy to be here with you, Charlie.

It's great to be here and it is not just me and you here today.

Who else?

Oh, there's a lot of people looking at us.

We are broadcasting in front of a live audience at Vermont Public, Colchester Studios.

Can everyone say hello?

To our lovely audience members have submitted their gardening questions ahead of today's show, which I will ask throughout the hour.

But for those of you who are listening at home or in your car, you can submit questions too.

You can call in as usual at (800)639-2211, or send us an email to Vermon Edition at Vermont public.org.

Charlie, we should start with the weather.

I feel like that's a nice way to ease on in.

Everyone, lots to talk about.

Everyone.

Let's talk about the weather.

And this year, the story of this summer's weather was drought.

How did your garden fare through the drought?

Well, it was a tale of two stories.

We had the early season, you remember back go back, May, when it rained every weekend.

When it rains every weekend.

So you couldn't do anything out.

Fun?

Yes.

So we had all that rain, lots of rain, lots of moisture.

And then it just the spigot turned off.

And that happened in August, September, October, well into October.

It's starting to change a little bit again.

So because of that, there's a lot of stress on plants and especially lilacs.

I already told the audience here about how many people thought their lilac died this summer.

You pull the audience, and then you publicly shamed me for killing my lilacs.

Well, I did it, but I think I did.

I didn't do it publicly.

I just did it before we started recording.

Okay, but talk to us about the lilacs.

There.

There.

Some of them are in trouble.

Yeah.

So lilacs are a good example.

So because of all of the moisture that we had early in a cool weather that was very conducive to a lot of fungal diseases like the.

What was the one you mentioned?

Lilac leaf blight.

Very good.

The lilac leaf flight is one of those diseases that cause all the spots in the browning and the blackening of all those leaves.

Then the double whammy was that the rain stopped, it got hot, and then the stress of all the heat and the drought cause those black leaves to shrivel.

And then what would you going to do after that?

You just going to drop?

Yeah.

So a lot of people lost their leaves early on their lilacs, and it looked like the tree was dead or the shrubs were dead, but a good way to check because lilacs are really tough plants, and it's hard to kill them from just one season of not great weather.

So one thing you can do is check the leaf buds so check the leaf blades on the stems and at the end of the stems, if you have green leaf buds there, then it's good chance that your plant is going to come back next year.

And not only that it's going to flower.

Yeah.

And if you don't have the leaf buds don't give up either.

Just nick the bark on the branch a little bit.

And if you see green under there green is usually a good sign in the gardening world.

That means that plant will probably come back.

So I think they will survive and come back.

But that's a good symbolic representation of what happened this summer.

For a lot of plants.

They got really stressed.

They dropped their leaves, maybe didn't produce as many flowers or as many fruits and vegetables as normal.

But in the end we still get something from our garden.

Well, we can not count on a lot in gardening.

Things are always different, but one thing we can count on is change.

And it seems like, these extreme weather events or shifts from very wet to very dry are becoming more and more frequent.

And Beth in Bethel wrote us an email wondering how to prepare their plants in the future, particularly trees and shrubs for dry seasons.

How can we support our trees and shrubs when it's really dry?

How much should we be watering them?

What do you think?

Yeah.

So it's especially important for young trees and shrubs.

So we were faced with that.

We live in Forsberg and we have a well.

And so with a well of course you don't really know how much water you've got at any point in time.

And we had a lot of trees and shrubs on our yard.

So which ones were we going to water?

It was one of those lifeboat situations.

Who's going to stay in the boat and who's not going to stay in the boat?

Well, it wasn't as drastic.

I mean, never to go boating with you.

It wasn't as drastic as that.

But what we decided to do come August, September is that anything we planted this year, this spring and summer, that's where the water went.

Because those are the plant that would be most susceptible to the drought, whereas plants that are well established, they'll get by.

Okay.

And it's especially true if you have plants that are native plants.

They're going to be much more adapted to these changes than any of the exotic plants that you might bring in.

We always seem to have a theme emerge when we have you on.

Oftentimes it's about some specific blight or bug or pest, but this time our theme is bulb anxiety.

We got a lot of questions from our audience, from folks emailing, from my own husband, very anxious about when to plant bulbs, garlic bulbs in particular.

We also got a question from an audience member, Nixie, in South Burlington, who's wondering if now is already too late for garlic and how to enrich the soil for spring, to make sure that that garlic does well throughout those cold months.

This is something new for me.

I have not heard of this syndrome, the garlic bulb anxiety.

And yet it's rampant.

It's very.

The GBA is a yes or no.

Yeah.

So, with garlic, one of the things you have to know about them is that they're a really easy bulb to grow, as long as they have certain conditions, they have to have well-drained soil, and you want to make sure you plant them kind of later, because it was so hot, because it was so dry.

I've been telling people not to plant their garlic when they normally would, which would be mid-October when they're planting their flowering bulbs this spring.

Flowering bulbs.

So now as we're getting to the end of October and we're starting to see some rain and cooler temperatures, now is a good time to do it.

In fact, this weekend, if you and your husband want to plant garlic, it would be a good time to do it.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, exactly.

Okay, great.

We also got a question from Barb about, specific types of garlic that do well in Vermont.

Do you have any suggestions?

I know it's fun to, like kind of experiment every year.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, there's lots of different varieties.

There's mainly three different types.

So there's hard neck varieties, which are the ones who make those scapes, by the way, make great pesto if you ever want to have a real garlicky pesto.

Yeah, there's sonic varieties where you can, braid those, those have the some more supple leaves to them.

And then there's elephant garlic, which is kind of cool because it's not really a garlic.

It's more related to leeks and it's a big bulb, but it doesn't have a real strong garlic flavor.

So if you want something a little milder, you can do that.

As far as varieties, there are many varieties within all of those.

And there are places that specialize just in growing garlic where you can get different varieties and try them out.

We normally grow the hard neck varieties because I like the scapes.

And what we do is, we save the best bulbs after we harvest them in July usually, and then the biggest bulbs we save those, the ones that don't have any blemishes.

And then this time of year, we'll plant those cloves from those bulbs in the ground.

And what that does is that you start selecting for size.

So if you want bigger bulbs, just keep putting in bigger and bigger cloves every year.

And before you know it, you've got the size of the pumpkin.

Now you don't get that big, but they will be bigger and they have bigger cloves, which are a little easier to to cook with and process.

Okay.

Well, if you have questions about planting your bulbs or have a case of garlic bulb anxiety, give us a call at 806 392211.

Charlie, you just mentioned flower bulbs like daffodils and tulips.

I haven't planted mine yet.

Should I have?

Do I need to, like, leave now and go do that?

You've been very smart this year, McKayla.

I know sometimes a little bit of laziness helps.

Thank you so much.

It's good to be distracted.

And it's like I was saying it's probably better this year that you plant a little bit later.

It's been so warm.

It's been so happy Valley.

The problem with the flowering bulbs as well as the garlic, if you put them in too soon, they'll start growing and you don't want them to start growing this time of year, obviously.

So that's why you want to wait till the soil really cools down.

Usually below 50 degrees would be ideal, but you don't want to wait too far because then we all of a sudden get winter and so they want to have at least 4 to 6 weeks in the ground where the roots will get established, whether it be garlic or tulips or daffodils or any of those, fall bulbs, fall planted bulbs.

So, yes, you can do those.

And there's fun ways to plant those.

You can certainly plant them in drifts.

That would be a nice thing to do.

You can plant them, you know, first among your perennials, I think.

Do me in groups that way.

Or you can do a fun thing called layering.

And layering is great if you have a small yard, not a lot of space, and you want to have a big splash of color and a lot of different bulbs, so you dig a hole about a foot deep, you backfill it to about eight inches, and then you put big bulbs in the bottom of it.

So like daffodils and hyacinths and bulbs that are a good size, you cover those over with soil.

Then you do medium sized bulbs on top of those like tulips and alliums cover that with soil.

And then you put sorry, I'm Italian.

I'm going to a lot of this going on.

And on top of that, you put, the crocuses, the sellers, the kind of boxes, all the small bulbs.

You cover that with soil and just leave it there.

And next spring they'll come up in succession and depending upon the varieties, you grow.

And it'll be a just a beautiful color variation.

And they know how to grow around each other.

They know how to grow around each year.

Yes they do.

They're very smart.

These bulbs.

But what a great.

And then you came from it's like from them.

And then you'll have to dig the one big hole.

Then you just dig one hole and it's great if you only have a small area, you want to have a big splash and for a longer period of time, because if you do like a an early tulip with a late daffodil, then it will extend the flowering season.

So that's a fun thing to do.

But there are some problems with bulbs and I know we have questions about them.

Yes those five letter words volley oh yes.

Yeah.

Let's talk voles.

You want to talk voles.

Yeah.

Let's talk balls okay.

Anyone have problems with bulbs in the audience.

Oh yeah.

It's mice.

Any of the rodents, the voles, the mice, the chipmunks.

You can squirrels sometimes.

So they.

I'm not sure what it is, but I've been gettin a lot of questions about them.

It might be because it was so dry, and they're really looking for food and they're looking for moisture, but they've been attacking lots of different plants and not just bulbs, but a lot of other plants.

Yeah.

So the first thing is to recognize if you have a mole problem or a vole problem.

Bulbs, moles and voles.

Yeah.

See that one?

That's great radio.

We're beginning right now.

So the difference between the vole and the mole is not just what they look like, because they look kind of funny.

Voles will dig underneath the soil and you'll know that you have moles.

They say moles old.

I mean, I'm losing track myself.

You know, you have a mole if you have piles of soil on the entrance and the exit holes, and they usually tunneled down.

So you see the ground is raised, but you don't really see the tunneled itself, the voles with a V, they will be on the surface of the soil.

So often when the snow melts in the spring, you see all these tracks that are on your lawn.

That's all.

Vole activity.

And they don't leave piles of soil.

Now, the moles are actually okay because they eat things like earthworms and Asian jumping worms, actually.

So you want to impor a lot of moles into your yard?

They'll, they'll eat those kinds of things, beetles and stuff like that.

Where the voles are the herbivores, they're the ones who want to eat the roots, your plants or your bulbs and that kind of thing.

So if you have the vole, vole mice problem, then there's a couple o things to do in your planting.

So first of all, you can get bulbs that they don't like.

So they love tulips, they love crocuses.

They love hyacinths But they don't like daffodils.

They don't like alliums, they don't like cellars and they don't like fritillary areas.

Say that with a little roll.

Who would like a flick?

That letter sounds like something you'd order in a restaurant, isn't it?

I'll have a side of fritillary, please.

Fritillary is our crown imperial.

It's beautiful bulb and it stands up really tall.

But what it does is exudes a chemical through its bulb roots into the soil that the rodents don't like.

Okay, so what you can do is plant those instead.

If you're really your heart is set on growing tulips, for example, you can mix and match.

So you dig a hole and you put some tulip in some areas, some daffodils, some other ones that they don't like.

And so when the mice sort of all go in there and they start munching, chances are they're going to munch on something they don't like and go somewhere else.

I know vole hole a no vole hole with a mole.

Okay.

We need to stop ourselves.

I, we have a vole related question from a listener named Paris who's in Saxon server.

They sent in a voice message.

So let's take a listen to that.

Now I have a four year old asparagus patch, and I was really looking forwar to this being the first season that I could really collect the asparagus.

Unfortunately, voles had gotten into there and really wreaked havoc with what there was.

I had mulched really nicel with leaves and hay last year, and was told that it was the mulch that really attracted the voles, so now I am confuse as to whether or not to mulch, because I know they lik to be mulched, and if I mulch, what do I do to keep the voles from getting in there?

I have a suggestion don't plant asparagus because, as you explained last time during our spring gardening show, asparagus is so needy, it takes years to grow.

So our children.

But you're raising one, aren't you?

Yeah, but they can give you years of joy, just like kids can do sometimes.

Pets.

Definitely.

Definitely dogs.

Yeah.

Get a dog instead of a dog.

There you go.

So, Yes.

I'm not so sure about the whole idea of mulch being a problem.

I mean, I think it's probably there in there because of the mulch has kept the soil moist, and they like that and they can easily tunnel in.

So if you do have voles like that, that are going after the roots of plants, like your asparagus, for example, or some of the other perennials that you have in there, then you want to try to create a situation that's not going to be so great.

So maybe in this case, removing the mulch might be a good idea, opening up the area so that the voles have to really run across a lawn or an open area so that they can't, like, hide, because there are a lo of predators of voles and mice and owls and hawks and things of that nature.

So you want to make it a little harder for them to get there, and then you can go on a little beach expedition, go to the ocean, collect shells, seashells, oyster shells, clamshells, bring them back home, grind them up so they're really sharp little shards on them, and sprinkle those out through that whole area.

Because of the sharpness of those, these are little ground dwelling rodents.

They're not going to want to cross over those.

So that would be one thing you can do.

Another thing you can do is to use castor oil.

Castor oil, not the stuff that you get in the grocery store, but the horticultural grade castor oil, comes with a spray and a pellet.

You can spray that in the area, and the smell of it is a very pungent smell.

The smell of it is really bad.

So that they don't like it in those kind of take off.

So that's another thing you can do to repel any of those kinds of voles or mice.

Anything that rodent family.

Well if you need advice on how to repel voles, mice, other critters in your garden, give us a call at (800)639-2211.

It's our annual fall gardening show with Charlie Narduzzi, the host of all things gardening.

Let's go through some more questions from our lovely audience.

Yeah, Charlie, we got one from Ken in Grand Isle who is wondering what to do before winter to prepare their beds for spring.

How do we make those beds all cozy?

So these, I assume, are beds, like, vegetable beds, flower beds, that kind of thing.

Yes.

Annuals, right?

Yep.

They grew, lettuce, cucumbers, tomatoes, yellow squash in these two, four by eight raised beds.

Perfect.

Yeah.

So I'm a big proponent of no dig gardening, which means you don't dig turn or till the soil to break up that biological network that's there.

But another tenant of no dig gardening is to make sure the soil is always protected, either growing something on it or having mulch on it.

So I would say going into the winter, make sure you put some kind of mulch on it.

It could be leaves that you have excess.

Do you want to put on it could be hay or straw.

If you live in an area where hay is really inexpensive and easy to get, that would work.

I wouldn't do woody things like wood chips and stuff, because a lot of these annual vegetables and flowers want to have a soil that has nitrogen more accessible than it would be in a wood chip.

But I'd make sure it was covered and stayed covered all season.

Then in the spring, you come back and just put a layer of compost over whatever's left and plant right through it.

You don't have to turn it till it dig it, do anything.

Pretty much write a book about that or something.

Yeah.

Did I happen to mention I have a book?

Ken also had a question that I share.

Ken, thank you for asking this about, how many plants is too many to have in a raised bed of about this size?

Again, they said they have two four by eight raised beds for vegetables and are planning trying to plant lots of different things lettuce, cucumbers, tomatoes, yellow squash, zucchini and don't want to overcrowd.

Yeah, it depends on the plant.

You know, obviously a zucchini is much bigger than a lettuce plant.

So, you really have to kind of look at it as individuals.

The best way to get around that, to get the most maximum production, is to do succession planting.

And I'm not joking this time.

I do have a new book coming out in February called The Continuous Vegetable Garden.

And here's the plug.

I didn't know that this is what really excited.

Yeah, I'll get you one.

Great.

Okay.

Thanks.

The continuou vegetable garden I talk about.

This is one of the things I talk about how you can do succession planting in your garden.

So, for example, in the spring, you start with cool season plants like peas and lettuce and radishes, stuff like that.

When they're done, you have to be ruthless about this.

When they're look like they're kind of fading and not doing so well, then you pull them out, or at least cut them back.

If you're no dig gardener, and then you plant your summer crop of beans, for example, or squashes or cucumbers when they're done.

Come August, September, you go back to a cool season thing like kale and spinach and maybe even some more radishes.

That way you can get multiple crops in that one bed, and you enter crop plants too, which is another aspect.

It's in there.

So you put plants together that can be compatible.

So our peas every year we plant lettuces and greens around them because they like the nitrogen that the peas produce.

And they are not competing with each other or in asparagus bed you can put strawberries underneath them and the strawberries grow all around them.

They enjoy having the shade from the asparagus there in the roots are in the top layer.

The soil and the asparagu roots are in the bottom layer.

And so so they don't compete.

I will not plant asparagus.

I won't do it.

I know you're telling me sweet strawberries are really great.

And if you plant them with the asparagus, you.

So anyway, there are ways to do it where you don't have to worry so much about the spacing your plants, and you'll be able to get maybe 2 or 3 crops.

I do this with beans.

I plant beans three times a year.

I plant in May, I plant them in June, I plant them in late July.

And I just finished eating our last beans.

And this is October.

Wow.

Pretty cool That's very cool.

Yeah.

Let's take a caller here.

We have Laura in Vergennes, Sweden, on the line.

Laura, go ahead.

Oh.

Hey there.

Okay, so here is my question.

It's about a blackberry bush that has gone crazy.

So.

Oh, no, I live right in the historic district and I managed to plant the blackberry bush right next to the sidewalk not thinking about it.

And now it's attacking my neighbors.

It's going up on my porch.

It has amazing blackberries.

It like two inch blackberries.

Everyone's alway commenting on it and eating it but it's hurting people.

Yeah ten yeah.

It's I'm serious.

And we have conversations about this BlackBerry bush all the time.

My partner's really reluctant to cut it down or cut it back or move it because he says, I can't.

He says, I'm trying to really hurt it.

So my question is, can I cut it, move it, help me out.

Does it have a name?

No, but it would be something like Seymour.

Okay, Seymour, I really hope us helps.

Seymour.

Okay, well, poor Seymour has gotten, involved.

Gotten himself into an incident, you might say, growing a little too vigorously, messing around with the neighbors.

We told them not to play with the neighbors and did it anyway.

Probably ripping up the sidewalk and virgins as he's growing.

As you know, blackberries are brambles, so they're very aggressive.

Plants will spread all over the place.

So you have to be careful where you put them.

And I think, Seymour, he may not like it, but I think it would be better for everyone involved that he move.

Yeah, I think so.

So the time to be moving, Seymour, would not be now, because Seymour is getting ready for winter.

He's kind of getting sleepy.

Sleeps a lot this time.

Days, long nights, that kind of thing.

But early spring, late winter, early spring.

As soon as you start seeing some signs of life from Seymour, I would dig him up.

And you don't have to dig the whole thing up, because Seymour probably has a lot of tentacles all over the place.

So all you need to do is get some of those little baby plants or offshoots.

From there, move them to a better place.

There's a better place for you, Seymour.

Probably an area where you can put some edging around it.

Or we grow ours in a lawn area, so I'm always mowing around it.

So any baby Seymour that are sprouting up end up getting cut down.

And so it stays in that area.

So I think that would be the best plan of action is to move Seymour to a better spot.

Laura, best of luck.

Today is our fall gardening show with Charlie Narduzzi, the host of all things gardening.

Today's show is being recorded in front of a live audience at Vermont Public Colchester Studios.

We do another round of applause.

There they are.

If you have questions about how to get your garden beds or your yard ready for the winter, or maybe thinking about how to move plants inside, you can give us a call, tell us about it at 806 392211.

All right.

We got we have so many questions for you.

Okay I want to start with one thing we haven't talked about very much before I think, which is ginger.

We got a question from Heidi who says that she got a suggestion from you, Charlie, to plant a few pieces of sproute organic ginger root this year.

In early April.

They potted them indoors, transplanted them into the ground in late May.

They had great soil, ample heat, watered regularly, and when they harvested them in early October, the roots were gorgeous, smooth skin, 6 to 7 time the size of the starter piece.

But the flavor was very mild without that normal ginger spiciness that many of us love so much.

So Heidi's wondering what happened.

Do they need to sit and cure?

Are there other environmental factor that affect the ginger flavor?

And they also say, at any rate, no matter what happens, the experiment was a lot of fun and they plan to do it again.

Oh, good.

Well, you'r listening to that guy Charlie.

No.

Does anyone.

Yes.

You can grow ginger.

And I've grown ginger that way.

The thing is, ginger needs a long season.

It's a tropical plant, and we just don't have a long enough warm enough summer to really get to that point where that ginger has that develops that brown skin, and then more of the spiciness that you would get and you normally think of with ginger.

So what you usually get is what I call on maybe I'm not sure it's a technical term called baby ginger.

And the ginger has very light colored, flesh like colored skin to it.

Maybe a little pink.

It's very attractive, actually, but it just doesn't have as much spiciness.

So I think the only thing that she could probably try to do is maybe started even earlier next year to get a bigger plant and then put it underneath, like a grow tunnel or a little hoop house or something, that that's going to really concentrate a lot of heat, think tropical and you think it's going to keep it warm longer into the season.

The longer the season, the more likely it is to develop the brown skin and the spiciness.

I like this experiment.

I really want to try it.

I'm going to try it.

Yeah, yeah, it sounds great.

Cool.

All right.

We have a call from Diane in Sheldon.

Diane.

Go ahead.

What's your question?

Yes.

My question is I had a really tough battle about the squash box this year.

What can I do to prevent this from coming back in?

It's a little hard to hear you, Diane, but I think you said your question was around potato bugs and squash bugs.

Any prevention techniques, Charlie?

Okay, well, for the squash, I would try to remove the squash from wherever you grew it.

You know, cut it down at the ground level and remove the plants, clean up the garden a little bit, killing some weeds and stuff, because those are all place where the squash beetles will.

Or squash bugs will overwinter.

And then next year, a little tip you can do is do some companion planting with your squash.

So grow nasturtiums so you get the vining nasturtiums.

Put them in earlier though.

So gro maybe as a transplant indoors, then put them out there a couple weeks, even a month earlier than you would planting squash.

Planted squash a little later.

What you're trying to do is create a big mass of nasturtiums.

That's going to create an aroma so that the squash bugs literally can't find the squash plants.

That's kind of what happens.

Yeah, the squash bugs come in looking to lay their eggs in the squash plants because they can't find it, because the pheromones are flying all over the place, you know, like a teenager.

So they end up not laying eggs on the squash plant, and you don't have to worry about it so much.

So that's one possibility.

Another thing you can try that I've done is grow them on a straw bale, straw bale, gardening where you grow things in straw bales because they're elevated and you trellis them up a fence, which is another thing you can do with, winter squash.

Especially smaller winter squashes, you know, like the, the little buttercups.

The baby buttercups, I think they call them a better butternut.

Because they're up there.

You're going to get less likelihood of getting the squash bugs, finding the plants to lay the eggs.

So trying to be preventive with it is probably the best thing.

Well, I'm glad we're talking about squash.

Right now because it's squash season.

Pumpkin season.

We grew pumpkins for the first time this year.

It was so fun.

We got one really good one and one that we sort of lost to that powdery mildew.

We stuff.

It also got to our squash leaves.

Do you have any suggestions for how to keep that away?

Yeah, well, Mr.

Sims, do it.

I know they look nice, but they won't do anything.

So the powdery mildew is one of those diseases.

It's just there in the environment.

Yeah.

And depending upon the weather conditions, you get more of it or less of it, and you especially get more of it towards the end of the season because you get cooler nights and warm days.

So you have that do forming on the leaves, which is perfect for the fungus to get going.

So, some of the best things you can do for that is to try to grow things a little bit earlier so that you can get your pumpkins kind of beyond that, time where the, the powdery mildew become problematic.

You can I thin there might be some varieties.

I'd have to look into it, but some varieties that are going to be more resistant to powdery mildew, that's another idea.

You can do that as well.

And not to worry too much about it, you can actually remove a lot of those leaves that are getting really powdery on them.

And your plant may look a little scraggly, but it's going to be fine because those pumpkins will continue to grow and they'll continue to mature.

All right, let's let's keep talking pests and let's do the let's, we always have to address jumping worms.

Yes we do.

I hate them so much.

Just the thought is horrible to me.

But y'all keep writing it about, So let's do it.

Keep talking about.

So Bethan in West Chesterfield, New Hampshire, wants to know if she can use their compost to nurture soil even if there are jumping worms in the pile.

And Bobby in Colchester, who's here in the audience with us, is wondering if using nematodes would help with jumping worms?

Or do you just move, go north.

Everyone's going north.

Hudson Bay looks pretty good right now.

So, Yeah.

Jumping.

I'll do a quick one on one about the jumping worms.

So they're an invasive earthworm from Asia, Japan, East Asia, that area.

And they've been in and they've gotten into our soil.

And the thing about the jumping worm, as opposed to the European earthworm, which is also, not a native plant, a native plant, a native insect, that came with the colonists after the last ice age we go had no earthworms in the soil.

Anyway, when these Asian jumping worms got here, what they d better than the European worms is that they reproduce faster.

They reproduce asexually.

And if they do have eggs, the eggs are are brown and small in the soil, s you never really can see them.

And even though the adults die in the in the fall, the cocoon which has a larva in it that over winters and so and then again the cocoon is it's brown.

You can't really see it.

So and they have a voracious appetite and they love to eat all kinds of organic materials.

And they're a big problem, especially in forests.

So you're getting incidents in forests where you see a lot of mature trees and then no understory, nothing on the ground anymore because the Asian jumping worms have come in and eaten all the, the roots and, the little plants and all the organic matter that's in the forest.

So it is a problem for sure, and definitely.

And for us, it can be a problem in your garden, too, if you have a lot of them.

Now to first of all, find out if you have them.

You can take, groun mustard seed, you know, ground mustard seed mix up with water and pour that on a bed.

And what that does is it irritates them when they come up to the surface of the soil.

And, and you can see them slithering like snakes.

They're called snake worms too.

They literally do jump.

I grab some from our garden, put them in a plastic pail and watch them jump up and down.

It's really kind of cute, actually.

Anyway, they're they're they could be a lot of them.

They're barely and definitely has them.

So she has them.

She knows she has them.

So whether she should use the compost in the garden or not, I would say it's alway better to have healthy plants.

So go ahead and do it.

Because if you have them in your compost, chances ar they're already in the garden.

So that's what's going on as far as controlling for them.

That's another thing people, wonder about certain foods.

So the nematodes, they're doing experiments.

So the places where a lot of experimentation is happening is University of Wisconsin, Cornell University and UVM.

Joseph Gaurav, is doing some work on these two.

They're experimenting with beneficial nematodes with biochar, diatomaceous earth.

And then there's this fungal, organism called Bavaria, that supposedly will attack the worms.

All of this is experimental.

At this point, there's no real definitive proof that it's going to kill th worms and kill just the worms.

You know, the thing the concern is it might kill the earthworms, too.

The European worms that are out there.

So the best thing to do is to when you ever you bring plants into your yard, whether it be from a garden center, nursery, friends, plant, swap, whatever it is, take the plant out of the pot, take all that potting soil or whatever soil is in.

Put it in a black plastic bag.

Wash that pot really well, wash off all the soil from your plant and then repot it into a new pot with fresh potting soil and then all that soil that you put in that bag, put it out in the driveway.

Because if you can heat up the soil to 10 or 105 degrees for three days, that will kill not only the adults, but also the eggs and the cocoons.

So that's something you could do with your compost.

Yeah.

If she has not too much compost.

I mean, if you have yards and yards of it, it's hard.

But if you only have a yard or two of compost, you might want to spread it out on a tarp, on a driveway or in a real hot, warm place and let it bake.

Put some clear plastic over.

Let it bake.

It's polarization.

What it's called, and that could kill them that that might be a way to kill them.

806 392211 is our number.

If you have questions about gardening for Charlie Narduzzi.

All right.

Little more on pests and then we'll we'll leave them be.

We got a question from an audience member named Emily in Willis Stem, who has a question about slugs and beer.

Emily says that slugs love their garlic patch.

They tried beer, but it takes a lot of beer and reapplied.

Is there more efficient?

A more efficient slug stopper?

I wonder this too.

We also do the like beer in a little container.

They try to kill the slugs, but I like beer and I don't like giving it to the slugs and beer and slugs drin a lot of beer, they really do.

They really have a big capacity.

It's amazing.

Yeah, yeah.

So.

But it does work.

And the slugs always will tell you it's the yeast that they're interested in, not the alcohol.

Okay.

Yeah, right.

Can I give them just yeast?

You probably could.

And try that.

I've never tried that, but that would be an interesting idea.

Okay, okay.

So anyway, the slug trap does work.

As you can see.

You do have to have a good sized bowl of it and make sure, of course, the level of the beer is low enough so that the slugs have to stretch over the lip of the bowl into there to drink.

And as they're drinking, the little tipsy and the.

And, I'm floating with smiles on their faces in their, you do have to watch ou if you have dogs, for example.

Or little kids they might go sample the beer.

Or in one case, in our house, we had a raccoon fight over the beer one night.

The middle of the night.

Barbara.

Yeah.

Know back and forth.

We look out the window and they're they probably semi tipsy themselves.

And they're fighting over the beer.

So that's kind of decided we won't do that anymore.

So as far as getting rid of slugs and snails, though, there's a couple things you can do.

There are baits out there.

Excuse me.

One, it has iron phosphate in it.

It's called sluggo.

And that i a naturally occurring mineral.

And it has beet attractant in it for the slugs.

So they eat the pellets and that kills them.

It's supposedly fairly safe.

I haven't seen too many things that say that it might harm other things.

In the in the yard or the garden, like birds and things of that nature.

So that's one thing you can do.

You can do the slug trap.

You can create an environment where you're going to bring in more of the predators of slugs.

And one of the fun ones to do is called a beetle bank.

The beetle bank.

Yeah.

That's not wher all the Beatles songs are.

Is.

And the beetle Bank or, beetle Bank is where you raise up the soil about 18in in a three foot diameter circle or square, and you grow bunchin native grasses, dropsy, grass, switchgrass, things of that nature.

Bluestem grasses.

And what they attract is this black beetle called the the ground beetle.

And you probably have seen it when you dig around in your garden.

That is a good guy.

That is a carnivorous beetle.

It eats earthworms.

It eats, little caterpillars, and it eats slugs.

So you create this beetle bank in the in your garden or in your yard.

They're going t hang out there during the day.

At night they go out into the garden on foraging missions, and they're eating the slugs and snails and all the things.

And then they go back and you have this beautiful ornamental grass to enjoy, too.

So there are some things to do to be proactive about slugs and snails.

Okay.

All right, Emily, we'll talk after this to, we have a caller on the line from Marlborough.

Carol and Carolyn, go ahead.

Hi.

I've grown sugar snap peas for years and have had great success.

And I've, you know, saved the seeds and grow them again the next year.

I soak the seeds before I plant, and the last couple of years.

And so last year was not a, a hot, dry summer.

This summer was.

So I don't think it's the weather.

I don't know what's happened, but my sugar snap peas, they don't always propagate.

And then if they do that many of them are really chewy and stringy.

What's happened?

I've tried different varieties.

I've tried, you know, the different companies that sell seeds in Vermont, the organic ones, etc.

and I, I can't I don't know what's going on.

Okay.

So as far as the germination goes, it sounds like you already soak the seeds in warm water overnight the night before you're planting.

Yeah.

And that doesn't seem to hasten it.

That doesn't happen.

You pardon.

That doesn't seem to hasten the German.

Yeah.

Like I had like I had it was interesting.

One variety propagated better than the other.

Variety was only like half came through.

And that was a brand new package of seeds.

And then, the, the seeds that came up were even chewy are the ones that didn't do as well becoming plants.

Those pods were tastier.

It's really a mixture of problems there.

Yeah.

Sounds like a bunch of things going on.

So as far as them germinating better, a lot of that is due to timing.

And it's really kind of hard with peas because you never know if.

Is it too late?

Is it too early?

I think most people maybe wait a little too late to plant their peas.

They can germinate in cool soil, especially if you have a raised bed.

If you have a raised bed and you get a couple nice warm, sunny days like in in April or so, you should be planting your peas.

Maybe even late March, depending upon where you are.

And Marlborough, southern Vermont.

So that might be a little warmer down there.

So you can maybe try to plant them at different times, stagger the plantings a little bit and see when it is that they germinating the best.

That would be one thing to do as far as the stringing is.

And that, I'm not quite sure what to say about that.

I've never had, snap peas do that, to us.

Only if I left them out on the vine too long.

So maybe try picking them a little earlier, with a snap in the pod.

And also, you don't really have to have a mature pea inside of it.

Try it a little bit earlier and see what that does.

That those are kind of my only suggestions for you.

Today is our annual fall gardening show with Charlie Narduzzi, the host of all things gardening.

We're joined for today's show by a live audience in Vermont public Colchester Studios.

You.

And we have our lovely callers with us as well, including David in Saint Albans.

David, what's your question for Charlie?

Well, I'm in the process of creating a bee butterfly pollinator field, at our house.

And, I was told by the ag department to, treat the field in the spring or early summer, with a chemical to kill everything and prepare the ground.

I thought it seemed like an oxymoron, but I had it done.

Now everything is growing back, and I really don't want to go back and put another application of, poison on my yard.

Someone suggested yesterday that I could use, vinegar and water mix with just a tad.

Just a dash of salt.

They said that would kill the grass that I've got growing.

And I just curious if Charlie have any ideas what I should do to before I throw my flower seeds in this fall?

Well, sounds like a very light salad dressing.

That's wha I was just going to say.

Yeah.

Add a little olive oil.

You're all set.

And that's about all that recipe is good for, you will not.

The vinegar will not be, harsh enough, especially if you dilute it with water to kill the grasses that you might have there.

I'm not sure how big an area you have, but if it's feasible, and maybe you can do it in stages, get a big tarp, big plastic tarp, lay it over that whole area.

Maybe, first of all, mow everything down as low as you possibly can.

And it can do with a tractor or a mower.

And then put the tarp down, put some stones and boards on it and just leave it there all winter long.

All spring long.

By next early summer, it should be die.

It should have been killed off enough.

Most of the things have died that are under there that you can go in and start planting your pollinator plants.

Maybe put some soil on top of it, some topsoil or some compost.

And so some seeds, wildflower mixed seeds, things like that.

You're still going to have some weeds coming through, so you might have to do som weeding the first year or two.

But if you're good and diligent about it, after a couple of years, the pollinator plants should, especially if they're native, they will, take over that whole area, so that you won't have to do so much maintenance on them.

And in the fall, once you have it established, late fall, you might want to mow that all down just to keep all those weeds from coming back.

Well, good luck, David.

Let us know how it goes.

Charlie, we got a lot of questions about overwintering plants, so I. I'm going to go through a couple of them, but maybe you can kind of start this big picture with, with how to do your tips for overwintering.

Elizabeth Ann Bolton has some questions about, overwintering tender perennials in their cellar.

I'm going to mispronounce all these guara.

GA GA GA salvia.

Black and blue.

I could pant this, plum bago kitty in Essex Junction wants to know how to overwinter dahlias.

Evan, who gardens at Star Farm in the new north end of Burlington, wants to know if he can overwinter rosemary outside of the pot.

And then Jane in Westminster West wants to overwinter lavender indoors, but it keeps dying.

That's a lot of different things.

Okay.

Big picture, big overwintering tips.

Okay.

So we'll we'll go through them.

I can do them pretty quickly.

So tender perennials.

So some of those plants you mentioned are perennials in our climate, the gore or gore, I think of Laura Gore.

Got it.

Okay.

Gaura, Aggie statue is a few of the other things in there will be perennials in a warmer climate, but not so much here.

Any of those plants like those?

You can overwinter them.

What you can do is, let them die back naturally.

Maybe cut them back especially if there are basis.

I think those are all or basis plants that she was talking about.

And then put the pot somewhere where it's going to stay cool and dark.

So something in th temperature range of 35 to 50.

Remember that range because that's what going to come back 35 to 50 35 to 50 I don't like quizzes okay.

How old are you.

Somewhere between 35 to 23.

Okay.

So anyway, find a place where you can put them.

They'll have that temperature range and it'll stay dry.

Okay.

And just pretty much leave them there.

They may or may not come back strongly, but they should survive.

That would be probably the easiest thing.

Now for dahlias.

Things that have tubers.

Dahlias.

Gladiolus, Canna lilies.

Any of those?

Once the frost is killed, the foliage, you cut it off at the ground level.

Leave a little stub because it'll be helpful for carrying it around when you're walking around with your dahlias.

Clump.

And pull it out of the ground.

And be careful pulling it out of the ground.

You know, cut a hole pretty wide because the tubers are all over the place down there and you don't want to slice them, dig it up, knock all the soil off, wash and off, you know, try to clean them up as much as possible.

And then at that point you want to put them in.

I put them in cardboard boxes.

You know, there's a lot of cardboard boxes in our society.

So we have a lot of those coming with all kinds of deliveries.

I put them in there.

If it's a big clump and it's a cardboard box, it's pretty well sealed.

I may poke some holes in it, too.

Then I get some moistened woodchips and throw them in there and bury it.

And then you put that in a basement or a shed or an unheated garage.

At what temperature?

Mikayla 35 to 50.

Very good.

35 to 50.

You did it well.

Bing bing bing bing.

Okay.

And, that would be how you would overwinter it.

The easy ones of those is the gladiolus.

Gladiolus.

You'll you'll pull out the plant, you'll see they're called corns instead of tubers.

Different botanical name or, horticultural name for it.

But you have the old, corm underneath the new corm.

So you just pop off the old corm.

They'll be old and shriveled and wrinkled and not very nice.

Pop it off, get rid of that, cut off the top, and then just put them in onion mesh bags you'd get when you go grocery shopping and just hang those in a room with what temperature?

Mikayla 35 to 50.

Got it.

Now.

All right.

So that was dahlias.

Tender perennials.

I forgot what the other ones were.

Lavender.

Lavender.

Right on.

Rosemary.

Rosemary will not overwinter outdoors unless you go to really great extents.

Like I'm talking insulation around the plant.

Just building a house will basically build a house for it.

But it does overwinter well indoor if you have it in a pot.

Okay.

So move it indoors in a pot again, like I was mentioning about, the Asian jumping worms and clearing all the soil, the potting soil off.

Do the same thing with any plants you bring in, because if they hav any insects and diseases, it's going to most likely be in the soil.

So get rid of all that soil, get rid of, wash the roots, repot it in a new pot or a pot that you cleaned.

Bring it in a sunny window.

This is tru for any kind of herb actually.

Keep it sunny and keep the the moisture on the soil kind of medium I would say, you know, let it dry out a little bit.

But most people, tend to let it dry out too much and then the dies.

So make sure you check it every couple of weeks or so just to give it a little bit of water.

And it should make it through the winter.

Okay.

But the lavender is best left outside unless it's, Spanish or French lavender.

They're a little pickier.

Of course they have.

They like warmer temperatures.

That's what it is.

They're from the Mediterranean whereas the sun do a great job with that overwintering speed around.

Cause I think you also answered a question.

They didn't ask you from Zoe, who, dug up some pepper plants to overwinter indoors and was wondering if you're supposed to wash them off, pot them with fresh soil to prevent it.

Yes.

And you say yes.

Yes, exactly.

And, Zoe, what you can also do with your pepper plant, cut it way back.

Way back to you have these little stems like maybe a couple leaves of stems and then wrap it all up, put it in a room that's between 50 and 60 degrees.

You don't have to have much light in there, but 50 or 60 degrees, that'll keep it dormant, bu it won't freeze it, obviously.

And then when it starts growing in a spring repot it, put it in the window and you'll have more peppers earlier than ever before because you have a mature plan that you've overwintered.

Wow.

All this information, by the way, is in that book continues vegetable garden.

I have a book that' a continuous vegetable garden.

Yeah, you should look for it.

February.

We are speaking with noted author and gardening expert Charley Narduzzi.

We have Susan in Whiting who's been waiting patiently on the line.

Susan, what is your question?

I have a couple questions about mulch.

Great.

Good.

I have I have a, source of feeder chips from rabbit hutches, so they're kind of pre fertilized, and I, but feeders, not the.

I've heard cedar is not the best for vegetable gardens.

Yes.

I also have a sheep.

I also have a sheep farmer neighbor who is given us bags of raw wool.

And she says that's good for mulch.

And I'm curious to hear what you think about that.

Wow.

Well, that's perfect, because that's the one thing I forgot to say about the slugs and snails.

They don't like raw wool.

So if you mulch your garden or mulch around plants like hostas, they love with raw wool from a sheep farm or wherever you can get it.

Jacket I don't know, they will not cross tha barrier because of the tannins and the scratching is of it.

So that's a good point.

As far as mulching your vegetable garden with that, or the cedar chips that have been pretreated with rabbit poo.

I would not do that.

A vegetable garden likes to have an organic material that can break down fast grass.

Think grass clippings, think hay or mulch, think chopped up leaves, things like that.

Woodchips are going to take a while to break down.

They're better used around perennials.

Fruit trees, regulatory shrubs, that kind of stuff.

So I would compost that rabbit poo, maybe compost it with the sheep wool.

I've never tried that.

But that possibility is fun.

It's an interesting mix, Yeah.

But let it break down and then use that in the vegetable garden.

Awesome.

Jump jumping worms in there.

Stir it up.

Yeah.

Add a little olive oil and and vinegar and you're all set.

Susie.

Good luck.

Thank you for calling in.

All right, we got a question from Jean Elizabeth and Rich, who wrote to us about their Brussels sprout plans, which have for two years in a row produced puny loose leaf sprouts instead of large, robust sprouts.

They sent us a photo, which, of course, our listeners cannot see, but our audience and Charlie, you can, this is either Gene, Elizabeth or Rich's finger pointing at these puny Brussels sprout leaves.

They say they've planted them in raised beds for several years, and after last year's disappointing crop, planted them in a different bed this year.

But same result.

Did we not water them enough?

Is it a pest that stunts the growth?

Not enough sun?

Here's another picture.

Those leaves are quite puny.

Yeah, they're quite puny.

Yeah.

The answer is be B. What was B again?

Water pest.

Pest pet.

We're back to the pest.

We're back to the past.

Can't get away from what happened.

That is a Swede midge.

Swede midge.

Image as it sounds like, is a small little insect, like an aphid.

And what it does in any of these, broccoli family plants.

Broccoli, cauliflower, kale, Brussel sprouts.

They get into the growth point, they feed in the growth point and they deform it.

And so what happens in a Brussels sprout is that the little ball forms a little Brussels sprout forms.

And then it explodes.

Well doesn't literally explode, but it looks like it explodes because it's been deformed.

The growth point has been deformed.

So the thing to do is one to rotate your crops.

So don't plant any of those broccoli broccoli family crops in the same bed for at least 3 to 4 years.

Try to move them in different places, and if you don't have that possibility, or in addition to that, you can do what I do which is I use this micro mesh Ro cover.

Micro mesh is kind o like a window screen material.

You can see through it, very lightweight.

It lasts a long time.

I cover any of these broccoli family plants because they don't need to be cross-pollinated.

There's no need for any kind of bugs to get in there to pollinate the flowers.

I cover them as soon as I plant them, and they stay covered right up until I just took the cover off maybe 3 or 4 weeks ago.

And what that does is it blocks the fly from landing.

Landing in the plant and laying the egg and the whole life cycle So that will work really well.

Okay.

All right.

Good luck.

I liked I like to be able to hold these up.

I felt like I was in like a courtroom drama.

If you look at exhibit there you will see Prosecutor.

What is it?

All right, I have a question for you about color.

Is this your personal.

This is my personal question.

I've asked enough of you people's questions.

We're going back to.

Right.

All okay, so, Charlie, I have a love hate relationship with mums.

I appreciate that you like your mom.

Yeah, my mother is lovely.

But mums, I don't know, maybe it's something about.

Just like the fact that they are, such a symbol of the end of the warm season.

They start to get a little repetitive, like everybody has that with the moms.

Get it?

Yeah.

By mums.

I get it.

I'm wondering if you are if there are other plants that could bring a little life to, your garden to outdoors, that you could get this time of year that aren't, many plants.

Great.

Because you're ready to get rid of the mums.

Just a little aside, before I launch into the many plants, there are some types of mums that are perennial.

Like Sheffield, pink is a variety.

They don't have that tight ball like shape.

To them that's done because they've been pinching them, pinching them repeatedly and that keeps dividing out the branches.

So you get more and more flowers and that's why it looks like that I do.

I have two mum plants that I do like.

They have worms away into my heart.

That are the keep flowering year over year.

This is like my third year with them.

If I was just going to say, like if you do get them to overwinter and some people can do that depending on where you are and the conditions and all that, you'll see that they don't grow that way naturally.

They grow more like an aster or something like that.

More of big open, floppy kind of thing.

More your kind of plant like it.

Yeah.

Like that.

And, you know, floppy flouncy, that kind of thing.

But there's a lot of other plants.

The systems are really nice this time of year.

Autumn Joy family of sedum is the tall sedum.

Those are nice I love those.

There's lots of asters out there that are really beautiful.

One of my favorites.

We can grow in the Champlain Valley.

Maybe not all of different parts of the state are the Montauk Daisy.

The Montauk daisy.

That's that white daisy.

You might see it around if you drive while you're googling it and everything.

Oh, yeah.

It's a white.

Lovely.

They're lovely.

Right.

And they flower this time of year.

Oh, really?

Yeah.

So if you if you're in a warmer part of the state in the southern part, down in Connecticut River Valley, Bennington, up in the Champlain Valley.

You can try those because there's Hardy to zone five, and those are more of the zone five areas.

So those kinds of plants are had a lot of color.

And always remember about foliage color, too.

There are shrubs, there are perennials that have beautifu foliage color all season long.

And you can really enjoy them because you start seeing the color contrast with nature with the reds and the yellows and the oranges of the maples and some of the other trees, contrasting beautifully with your Aguilas Burgundy colored foliage.

Oh, how lovely, lovely.

It's lovely.

How can we have some wine?

No, no.

Right.

Speaking of Charlie if you are always about to jet set off to somewhere beautiful Italy.

Elsewhere on a garden tour, do you have any upcoming trips?

Glad you asked.

Yeah.

Next year.

Okay.

Next year.

So next May will be going to the Chelsea Flower Show, which is.

Oh, see, there's some guidance from the audience.

It is on the bucket list for avid gardeners.

Yeah, it is these shows where the royals go.

They have a day just for the royals to go through the show, and then all the commoners can go after that.

Which one do you get to go to?

Do I look like a royal?

Oh.

Very nice.

I do have the name Charles.

Exactly.

There you go.

So we're going to go to the Chelsea Flower Show, and then while we're there that's towards the end of May, we'll be going to see gardens in the south of England, Sissinghurst and Great Dix there, and then down to Cornwall and Devon, see some private gardens too, that we always try to work in private gardens as well as public gardens, cultural things.

We might go to a Shakespearean play.

They've redone the Shakespearean theater in London in the round.

In the round.

Exactly like that.

And motion like that.

So we're doing that, and then in the fall, we're probably going to Portugal.

Wow.

And we'll be going to Lisbon and also the island of Madeira, which is know as the Hawaii of the Atlantic.

It's this volcanic island with beautiful, lush tropical flowers, great beaches, wineries, you name it.

Wow.

You never invite me anywhere.

You're so busy at such a life.

Those sound amazing.

Charlie, it has been such a joy talking with you today.

Thank you so muc for coming on Vermont Edition.

It really is one of my favorite days of the year.

Oh, great.

Thank you.

It's always good to be here and I'm so thankful to our audience as well for joining us.

If we didn't get to your question, you could corner Charlie after this.

We'll make up, stick around for a little bit.

We also have a fun gardening related activity coming up for folks who are here with us in Colchester.

That is all the time, though, that we have for today.

Be sure to tune in to all things gardening on Sunday mornings on Vermont Edition for more Charlie Narduzzi.

You can also follow us on Instagram where you can find videos of Charlie sharing some of his favorite seasonal gardening tips.

I've really been loving those, Charlie.

They're very fun.

Today's show is directe by Mary English and engineered by Peter English and Phil Ed first.

John Aarons is our managing producer and today's call screener.

Andrea Lauren and Daniella Ferro are our producers.

Very special thanks to Brian Stevenson, Mike Dunn, David Littlefield, Joey Palumbo, Amy Zielinski, Zoe McDonald, Kelly Deloria, and Carly Roush.

Our theme music is by Myra Flynn.

I'm Michaela LeFrak.

Thank you so much for listening and for being here with us in studio, and we'll catch up again soon.