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I'm David Nasar.

When we talk about a public health emergency, a public health crisis, we often refer to something like Covid or SARS or a lead poisoned community, for example, some kind of health epidemic, even a reference to homelessness, also a tragic epidemic.

It's not often that we list financial instability as a public health emergency.

However, that could all change if my next guests have their way because they believe financial instability is one of the greatest threats to our existence today.

And joining me now to discuss all of this is a great panel of guests.

Vince Schaub is the CEO of National Financial Educators Council or Nafisi, as it's known.

Charles Fisher has been involved with anything and everything in the world of entertainment and finance, and now campaigns and community issues related to financial instability.

Susan Doughty developed the first responders finance program at University of Texas Tyler, and she's going to explain all of that.

And doctor Olive, okay.

Or Anthony is a former MD and now a financial coach, is here to help further our discussion about financial instability.

And I guess all have great stories.

Believe me.

First, though, to the issues.

And thank you all for being here.

Vince.

Let's begin with you sort of a several part question.

I've got so much to ask you.

I know you've been working like crazy to try and have the US sort of officially declare financial instability.

Really a public health emergency.

Certainly.

That's an ambitious goal.

So why exactly are you doing that?

And then secondly, how do you go about getting a sort of declaration as a legislative.

Is that the activism route?

And then with all that said, what the heck is Nafisi in your company?

The floor is yours, Vince know.

Thanks again for having us.

And really, the reason we founded this campaign is there's a direct relationship between people's health and their financial status.

This is well documented.

If we look at people in the lower socioeconomic status, there's a much higher risk of severe health problems.

Things like diabetes, obesity, heart disease, which is the leading killer of this country.

And that is just part of it right there.

Skipping preventative care, skipping medication oftentimes because they can't afford it.

Now our objective is first to mobilize advocates toward the solution.

And we're taking a top down approach for addressing this with the Health and Human Service Department, which is responsible for declaring a public health emergency on a federal level.

We're also reaching out to each state in 16 of the poorest communities, because a patchy or public health emergency can be declared on a local and state level as well.

Now, this is really important because our ultimate goal of this is proactive.

We want to ensure every child receives a comprehensive financial education, because when you look at financial instability and when problems start, it's in their early financial decisions.

Things like getting into credit card debt, buying a car that's too expensive, student loan debt, credit issues, all these things start early.

They delay savings and causing extended periods of financial instability that directly impacts their health.

We see financial education as preventative health care.

From what I read about your organization, you're kind of trying to teach the world that, as you just mentioned, we we must all be financially literate.

And I know you're concerned that there's sort of a lack of anything significant in the schools to teach kids the financial world, I guess you can say.

So what is this education component, Vince, with all that, you know, really we feel every child deserves a financial education.

They deserve the right to know how to earn money and manage your money as it directly impacts their health and well-being.

The status of financial education across this country is poor at best.

We have.

The average child receives less than 25 hours of financial education in their entire academic career.

Think about that.

That's like one a little more than one day of financial education after 12 years of education.

Worse than that, the state to do mandate financial literacy education failed to meet even the minimum education standards when compared to core subjects under taught.

And now, since our inception back 19 years ago, we've been active in the advocacy space.

I've been personally active, very much so in the legislative side of things, and my frustration has grown quite a bit because there's many barriers that are stopping legislation from being truly beneficial to our kids.

Things like college admission standards, standardized testing, and powerful forces that do not want this adopted in our school system.

So there's major challenges.

And as my frustration grew, I started to explore major reforms in our education system.

And the as I looked at that, the biggest change happened during the Covid era.

Now, I'm not advocating they did a good job or anything like that, but what I was impressed with was how quickly forces were mobilized, how quickly teachers, schools, school administrators adopted this new reality and over a course of it seemed like a couple days.

But it was a couple of weeks, made massive changes.

And we're trying to leverage this tool, this public health emergency tool that caused the biggest change in our education system since modern education, to ensure our children receive a financial education so they know how to earn money, how to manage money and its subject matter.

The benefits 100% of our youth in a very meaningful way.

I want our kids to gain the skills so they can live a secure and healthy life.

Speaking of that, Charles Fisher, take just a few seconds.

You've got an amazing resume.

Talk about your background, because certainly your resume parlays into what you're doing today.

I know you're involved with several campaigns, obviously trying to help solve all the street violence, which we have a lot of throughout the nation these days.

We're witnessing all that unfold.

There's the opioid, the drug crisis all throughout our nation, cities, other community issues obviously, you advocate for.

So talk about your background just for a few seconds, but then more importantly, how money is really sort of at the crux of all this and how being financially literate can potentially be the solution.

Charles.

when I started in 1978, 1.2 million kids dropped out of school and is 1.2 million today.

So there's been no progress.

One thing that we realize is that poverty for us is the root cause.

We've seen important disadvantaged communities, how they've been affected by poverty.

And we felt that in order to really solve gun and gang violence, something to abuse mental health, obesity, in order to solve those problems, we need to address poverty, which is the root cause.

And the only way to address poverty is through finance to live in entrepreneurship.

The problem is there's no school teaching by nature in entrepreneurship.

So we had to get together and do it ourself.

So in working with the people shark, Daymond John and with your family here with the David in 2020, the community service, we created a financial literacy and entrepreneurship program called the Little Name and moniker.

Right.

And that Money club teaches young people about financial literacy, entrepreneurship, about creating, about how to go out there and create financial independence and generational wealth.

And that's the antidote right now.

If we want to stop gun violence, if we want to stop substance abuse, if we want to do something to help, we got to hit poverty, poverty and lack of financial literacy is a public health crisis.

And so we realized that after 47 years, and by working with the hip hop's youth council and working with schools and housing developments around the country, we've been able to do the research we need maybe see people grow and develop.

But we learned a lot, and working with a guy like David Job and Sean Dean goes a long way because he understands mining dealers and entrepreneurship.

Being here in the school, when you get a chance to to to educate these kids during the day and after school, this as well, and to see how they gravitate toward financial literacy, entrepreneurship.

We know we have a and so yes, this is a public health crisis.

Susan Doherty, you developed.

Well, it's really a unique education program.

It's at UT Tyler, the Tyler campus.

It's known if I'm not mistaken, as the first responders finance program.

So you kind of, I guess you could say, created this all based on comments, collaboration, just talking to folks from a diverse group of people.

I like the term is heroes in our society.

You know, the first responders, the police, the cops, the paramedics, nurses, what have you.

I guess they all agree that money was a root cause of most of the issues plaguing us today.

So talk about that.

I know people say money is the root of all evil.

In this case, money could be the root of all good.

I'm guessing we're certainly hoping that is the case.

So we're playing with the vocabulary there.

And taking liberty with first responder finance.

We are redefining it for anyone who is working with individuals, families or communities in financial distress.

And so before we launch the program, we didn't launch it from the classroom.

We really launched it from a listening standpoint.

We talked to our social workers, our teachers, our law enforcement personnel, our health care professionals, and each of them told us that the individuals and families and communities that they saw were dealing with financial distress.

That wasn't a surprise to us.

What came as a surprise was that those in the helping professions were facing a lot of the same financial stressors that the communities they served were, were facing.

So credit card debt and, you know, student loan debt and insufficient savings and just the financial stress from living paycheck to paycheck in those helping professions turned out to be a big deal.

So what we are doing at the undergraduate and then also professional development and community levels is we are teaching those who are in the helping professions.

We are providing them with practical tools, get budgeting and saving and credit management and asset protection to not only help them become financially stable, but to put them in the positions where they can share with their clients financial wellness.

And so we're seeing a multiplier effect that is very positive as these first responders are able to go into the community and spread the word.

It's interesting you mentioned financial wellness.

So doctor Olive funk on Tuesday you worked in the health care industry for years.

I'm going to sort of bloviating for just a bit.

Give me a moment.

Because I want to hear your story and from you.

But it's really a broken health care system in massive disrepair.

Let's be honest.

It's not because of doctors like you who are dedicated, had conviction, really believed in it.

But, you know, there's a lot of burnout.

What doctors are having trouble.

The medical industry is horrendous these days.

I've done tons and tons of stories on this.

Ask any patient, they'll tell you the same thing.

It's the insane costs.

You go to a doctor, you can't afford it.

The insurance problems.

You know, folks, you can't even pay the monthly premiums.

I mean, the insurance premiums are disgusting.

Let's be honest.

That's what it is.

You've got to wait months, doctor, just to get a visit with a a general doctor, let alone the specialists.

And you got to wait months more sometimes for the tests, the MRI, the Cat scan, what have you.

And then, you know, you wait all these months and then you're at the doctor's office, a doctor, they see you for two minutes.

Some people tell me, well, I've been brushed under the rug.

So what I'm saying here is many folks are really neglecting our health care system.

So with all that said, and you're one of the good people in the business, believe me.

But the obvious question how does financial stability, how does money bridge all this used to be in the old days.

Back in the day we said, I still say today health is wealth, right?

If you're in good health, you can achieve wealth no matter what.

But I guess some of you were saying, well, it's and it's kind of wealth is health.

What do you say, doctor?

physician with more than 40 years practicing, retired family physician, I've had my share of this, and I've seen a lot.

But one person comes to mind, and I want to highlight that because you talked about, you know, the issue of financial stability.

You talked about folks that can afford health care and things like that.

So one person really comes to mind for me.

I remember one of my patients I may have what can you name the early 50s?

She came to me with complications from diabetes, and when I asked her why she had not been following up with her care, she looked at me with tears in my eyes and said, doc, I had to choose between buy my insulin and pay my rent.

I had to stretch my medications as long as I called that moment talk with me.

And it's been almost 20 years, and I still remember that patient as if it was yesterday, because she had the tears in her eyes.

And I realized that it wasn't that she didn't understand her condition or motivated to take care of herself.

Because sometimes as doctors, we think patients are just not compliant.

But that experience really stuck out to me because I realized that she understood her condition.

She also was motivated to take good care of herself, but actual problem was a financial instability that stood in the way.

And what that did was it resulted in multiple visits to the emergency rooms for her costing the health care system so much money.

And I saw that story play over and over and over again.

Patients skipping preventive visits, delaying prescriptions, showing up in e r because they couldn't afford the ongoing care.

And that that that was really what led me to understand that there's really a correlation between money and health.

And what I understand now as a financial wellness coach and educator is our financial health and physical health.

I really deeply intertwined, just like you talked about.

And financial instability is just it just doesn't strain the pocket or a wallet, but it actually fuels a lot of the stress that people have.

It drives the poor lifestyle choices that people have, and it forces people to actually delay or avoid the care overall.

And what this does is really leads to bad outcomes for patients and really higher costs for the health care system that we're dealing with.

So I do believe that we as financial educator and coaches, we can then empower our patients, and clients to manage their money wisely, just like we doctors teach clients to measure their blood pressure and check their blood pressure, whereas health care mean financial professionals.

Now can't teach a client, to be able to manage their money wisely.

And what that does is really create the conditions where they have better health outcomes, and really live a healthier life.

So I do believe very strongly as a financial educator and a coach.

Now, the health club, to have healthier communities, when you must view financial literacy as a public health strategy.

Because financial stability isn't just about wealth, it's really about wellness.

And when we're talking of wellness, we're not just talking of financial wellness, we're talking of overall wellness.

And I believe that if people can afford the care themselves, everybody wins at the end of the day and we can save the health care system a lot of money.

So with all that said, panel, back to you, Vince Howe, then, now that we've established, obviously why financial stability is so vitally important, as if we didn't know that.

But there are ways to get there more directly, what are the next steps, Vince, to sort of making all this happen where we are all aware, we all have access, we all are engaged to find out what is the best way to learn about all this financial stability and how we do not fall victim.

How we don't get into this victimhood mentality, I believe, is the way you stated in some of the stuff I was reading about you.

don't think, all the guests did a great job of relating money issues with really personal impact, right?

So it's more than just numbers.

What's in your bank account?

There's a serious consequences to this, and we're fully committed to making changes.

I think the best approach and approach we're taking, there's multiple solutions, but the approach we're taking is very proactive.

If we can help kids avoid financial problems early on, especially with those early financial decisions, that helps them avoid the challenges of overcoming.

Imagine starting a 100 yard meter sprint, you know, 20 yards back it would be you'd have a very tough time catching up.

And that's where our kids are starting today.

But through delivering a comprehensive financial education from elementary school integrated into their core subject matter at the high school level all four years where it's preparing them for near term life events.

So we have they leave with a resume to get a job, know how to interview, have a budget for moving out on their own, have a plan for education, skill development, and then continued into their college years, especially their undergraduate years when they're serving the majority of students.

I think we as a nation would have a very preventative and proactive strategy to addressing this financial instability epidemic.

And the unique thing with this is with most public health emergencies, their focus is getting back to the status quo.

If we look at a natural disaster or Covid or any other public health emergency, it's getting back to a baseline where people are okay.

The unique thing with this, I believe, is that we if we take a long term approach, we're actually advancing well above where we're at currently.

We've never taught financial education at a level in this country that would make a meaningful difference in our kids lives, and this will be the first time we would do it.

And it impacts really every core area of their life.

As Charles said with his his group, the hip hop, some of the council, they're impacting communities on that level, on the community level.

Doctor Old Funk mentioned really great ideas about how it's impacting a person's individual.

Right.

And Susan mentioned great things about how she's empowering health care providers to spread this message.

And besides schools, I think there's multiple ways we can do it.

It takes community to be community members like these to really make a lasting difference.

I want to throw something out to the panel.

I hope I say it in sort of a non clumsy way.

My heart is in the right place.

This could possibly help a lot of things, some societal ills.

And specifically I'm referring to the word racism.

It seems that we hear so much about, well, he's a racist.

She's a racist.

This person is black, this person is white, this person Jewish, this person is Muslim.

I mean, the list goes on and on.

There's no shortage of, someone telling another person he or she is racist.

However, it occurs to me in listening to all of you, possibly the difference isn't being black or white, or Jewish or Muslim or Asian or Latino or whatever the case may be.

The common denominator, the common color is green.

That seems to be the common denominator.

I can tell all of you, I've lived all of the United States.

I've lived in very, very poor white areas.

I've lived near black communities.

I've lived in urban, upscale communities because that's where the work took me, whatever the case may be.

And it seemed that if you have money in this country, you're okay no matter what color you are.

And so it seems to me that just by default, for no other reason, maybe this could help the racism argument.

Not to say there's not racism in the United States.

We get all that.

Not to minimize that, but to add to the conversation that maybe it's not about black or white, maybe it's about green.

And to you, Charles, what is your opinion?

That and I hope I didn't say that in a very clumsy way.

No.

Oh, well, poverty have no color.

There's there's a lot of people in red states that are living in poverty.

In New York City.

And so we have to address poverty and financial illiteracy, financial education, entrepreneurship is a way to do it.

We just completed a three year pilot, huge success.

So the which our family.

Damon.

John, I ought to finish.

We're about to go on the road with the tour.

We're going to be taking our program to poor and disadvantaged communities all over America, starting here in New York, because poverty needs an end to do.

The antidote is finally to literacy.

So we can approach the mayor, the governor, surgeon general, RFK junior, whoever, and get them to understand that gun violence is a public health crisis with the lack of financial literacy, is just as bad.

If we can feed families, take care of food insecurities.

Deal with academic failure.

If the lights are off, he can't read.

That's poverty, right?

If there's an eviction, that's poverty.

Can't go to school.

You don't have to close poverty sneakers.

If we address poverty, we can solve all the social ills that we have.

So now that this problem is complete, we're going to take this on the road.

And we want governors and mayors to declare the lack of financial literacy a public health crisis.

My kid, not to go on a road.

And we know that's the antidote.

And we want to think that your network, the shining a light on the dark and it's going to be a road well traveled.

I know, Susan, your opinion about all of that green being the overriding color in the United States.

If you got green, it seems like now you're a little bit better off.

Obviously.

What we're trying to accomplish is to, see that the tide rise for everyone.

We are all better off when any of us are better off.

And I think that what we're trying to do is to break down silos and not the silos that you're talking about, where we're thinking about university silos, where, our disciplines are often kept so separate, but financial wellness and and what we're doing here at UT Tyler is we are breaking down those barriers between, you know, College of Medicine and Arts and sciences and business and engineering.

We are we are bringing students in all majors and all professions who are seeing the potential for their own lives and for the people in their communities, in, in all of their helping ways.

Doctor, you get the final word on this.

Why is this financial literacy of such vital importance for all of us?

Dallas is green.

Green is green for everybody respective of our race.

And I do believe very strongly that when people are financially empowered, a lot of the ills that we have around, really, most most of them would disappear.

A lot of some of the things that we have, people that just want to be able to survive, they want to be able to put food on the table.

They want to be able to live healthy life.

They want to be able to afford medical care or for just the basic necessities of life.

And that green doesn't really mind.

I mean, it doesn't matter who is holding that green.

Green is green.

You're going to buy the same thing everywhere.

So I do believe that, you know, if we empower everybody in respect of one race, that we belong to all the social struggles or whatever, a lot of the ills that we're dealing with, whether it's drug use, whether it's, alcohol use, I mean, there's so many ills, whether it's gun violence, whether it's, truancy in schools, whether it's poor health.

I mean, there's just so many things that we can I do believe very strongly that can be resolved just by getting people financially empowered, not just getting them the money.

A lot of people know how to end money, but not everybody knows how to keep and grow that money.

That's part of financial literacy.

So when, when when folks go to colleges, whether it's civil medical school, I'm always telling people and health care professionals, doctors included veteran to end money, but we're not trained how to keep the money.

So, so it's important that, you know, we're not just introducing it very early in, in elementary schools.

I do believe I'm one of those that believe that you need to introduce this even in elementary school.

We don't need to wait until the medical school.

So the end that we introduce it, people get financially, literate.

They can manage money.

So when they start earning money, they know how to keep the money and grow the money.

So, yes, I believe very strongly, in our financial literacy.

That's why I'm doing it now.

So.

Yeah.

Well, thank you all so much.

Vince Schaub, Charles Fisher, Susan Doty and Doctor Orange Hyundai.

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