<Narrator> Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife, educational programs and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the Midlands at large.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina.

Family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance and Boone Hall Farms.

♪ opening music ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ <Amanda> Good evening, and welcome to Making It Grow We're so happy you can join us tonight.

I'm Amanda McNulty.

I'm a Clemson horticulture agent and Terasa Lott, it's been a long time since I graduated, and there's new stuff that comes out all the time, and when we have new people, I learn something every week.

It's just marvelous.

>> It's lots of fun, you know, and it wasn't, too recently that I graduated either.

I started adding up the years.

I thought, wow, time flies by.

<Amanda> I was a non traditional student.

So that makes a difference too, and of course, Terasa Lott you are the co-host and we would not be able to do programs without you at all.

<Terasa> You are too kind.

<Amanda> You do things on Facebook.

You do social media.

You are, because you're a social smiling gal, but also you have a day job.

<Terasa> I do.

Making It Grow is just a small part of my job responsibilities.

My main role is to serve as the Master Gardener Coordinator, and our master gardeners are a huge benefit to Clemson Extension.

We train them and then they generously volunteer their time to go out in their communities and give talks, host Ask a Master Gardener clinics where people can just ask them anything about advice or problems that they're having.

You'll often see them at festivals and events.

So we really are lucky to have them.

<Amanda> Often in larger counties they put on programs every year.

<Terasa> They do.

<Amanda> They are so much fun to go to.

<Terasa> Very well attended, I must say.

<Amanda> I went to the one in Lexington recently.

They sent us home with two dozen cookies each.

Those people up there just make cookies for weeks before that program, and they said take all these cookies home.

I think I ate about four cookies on the drive home.

(laughing) <Terasa> You had to replenish.

You used up so much energy.

<Amanda> There you go.

Yeah.

Christopher Burt, you are the hort agent down in Berkeley, Charleston, and Dorchester, some of the biggest counties we've got, and it's just little you.

Do you use the Master Gardeners?

Do they help you?

<Christopher> So yes, they aren't large counties, though I don't have as many as some but I have a wonderful group of master gardeners that are very helpful in helping me kind of service the entire Tri County area.

<Amanda> When you teach the Master Gardener program do you, like take it from county to county so that people don't have to travel so much.

How do you, how do you do it?

Do you teach just once.

<Christopher> So ideally, it would be nice to do it in every county but Charleston being the biggest, that's the largest group that we're going to have.

So we tend to centrally locate it in Charleston, but I also tend to have classes throughout the Tri County.

So, the past couple of classes, I've had to kind of make it one location but recently we're going to start getting into some of the gardens, some of the other locations, as well.

So we'll kind of travel around the Tri-County area together.

<Amanda> You have a lot of beautiful places there.

<Christopher> Yes we do.

<Amanda> Yes, you do.

Okay, and Philip Carnley, you were - I met you in Sumter, but I'm so happy now that you are back over close to where I am all the time, because you are the commercial horticulture agent for Orangeburg and Calhoun.

<Phillip> Yes, ma'am.

It's two fabulous counties to be in right now with all the horticultural crops being grown.

<Amanda>...and so you see people branching out into new things and what's driving that do you think?

<Phillip> Well, I think the market really, Amanda.

Right now we're seeing a demand for vegetables, locally grown specifically in Calhoun and Orangeburg, and we ship all over the United States, because we luckily have some very large processing facilities here in South Carolina that enable us to ship our goods across the country.

<Amanda>...and, you know, the South Carolina Department of Agriculture is always trying to encourage us to to buy certified South Carolina produce, and I just think it makes so much sense because, first of all, I mean, if it's available, and we have such a long growing season it is available, and then you have a smaller footprint.

It hasn't been trucked in all the way from Timbuktu, and it's got to be fresher often.

<Phillip> It really is.

It's amazing how often you see these little roadside stands and markets pop up all across the Midlands, and as, and in the coastal plains, as well, and if you can, and have the ability, I highly recommend supporting locally grown.

<Amanda> Yeah, it's fun, and then when you go to the people it's so nice.

<Phillip> The backstories are what sells produce.

<Amanda> Yeah.

I think so too.

Well, thank you for being with us today.

We appreciate it.

<Phillip> My pleasure.

<Amanda> Austin Jenkins, you are a professor over at USC Sumter, and you've had, you know, I'm always saying oh, he just teaches biology or something but you've kind of tailored the program there to what people are interested in now, and made it not just so focused on traditional, you know, textbook things, but relating it to where we live and what we should be concerned with.

<Dr Austin> Yeah, well, It's been a good fortune, largely passed on by Rudy Mancke, who, you know, taught a few years at USC Columbia and developed a course called natural history of South Carolina, and now I have the privilege of teaching that at USC Sumter.

So, it involves geology, flora and fauna of our state, a good mix and something that everybody is interacting with whether they realize it or not.

<Amanda> Yeah.

Well, and also, I think, you know, there are stresses on the environment now, and the more that we understand how it all interacts, I think the better stewards we can be.

<Dr Austin> I think so.

Yeah, It's, as Rudy Mancke would say, It's a part of us, we're not separate from it, and I think by Extension, it seems to me the students that I witnessed, the more that they understand nature, the more they understand themselves, and that's always a healthy thing for anyone, <Amanda> Yeah.

Self reflection, and I think you'll be interested to know that we're going to have a segment during this show.

That's taught by Tim Lee.

<Dr Austin> Oh, fantastic.

He's an excellent naturalists.

<Amanda> Isn't he just... <Dr Austin> Yes.

<Amanda> He's lots of lots of fun, too.

So mosses and lichens can be fascinating and fun, because Tim Lee can make anything fun, and so, you're going to enjoy that segment when we bring it to you tonight.

Well, Terasa do we have gardens of the week?

<Terasa> We sure do.

This is our time to sort of take a virtual field trip around the state.

See what you're doing in your yards or gardens or maybe you've captured a memory of a beautiful place in South Carolina.

We have so many of them that that's not hard to do.

Today we begin with Amy Spagnuolo, who shared a hydrangea with ginger lily foliage in the background.

From Marie Johnston, a patch of yellow prickly pear cactus flowering in Lugoff.

Agatha King sent us a cheerful flower bed in Powdersville.

From Linda Mungia, pink yarrow is the subject of her photo, and she was having a conversation with someone on our Facebook page who admired the yard.

She said that all, everything in the picture came from one plant that had been installed over 20 years ago.

So it is a plant that will spread, and then we wrap up with Lew Brabham who shared a close up of a vibrant orange hibiscus, coming to us from Charleston.

So thank you, everyone who shared their photographs.

I encourage you when you see us make a call for gardens of the week, just post your photos in the comments on our Facebook page.

Alternatively, you are welcome to send them to my email Teresa T-E-R-A-S-A @clemson.edu.

<Amanda> Teresa, at our old, old house meaning my new house is old too, but the old, old house.

We didn't have a dryer and once or twice.

I've just put Edward's pants over the porch railing because, you know, old houses have porches that go all the way around, and they fell off and landed on a prickly pear cactus and I thought that I'd washed them a couple of times Honestly, when he put I mean those little tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny prickles on the prickly pear cactus.

He was a very unhappy person when he put those britches on and we did have to throw them away.

<Terasa> Yikes.

One of the dangers of drying your clothes outside, I suppose, but I do love kind of the crispness that they have if you put them out on the line to dry.

<Amanda> Yeah, I know.

Yeah, and they smell good too.

Okay, well, let's see.

Do you have a question?

We can try to get our panel our team of experts to help someone with?

<Terasa> Of course our first question today comes in from James Island, Grace said I've had hydrangeas for years, but this year they aren't flowering.

Any ideas why?

<Amanda> Oh, goodness gracious.

There's nothing more beautiful than when hydrangeas do flower, but this is something we kind of hear from people frequently.

What can you do to help us?

<Christopher> So yes, hydrangeas are an interesting group of plants, mostly because people have very little kind of understanding of how to prune them how to care for them, and so of course, in front of me, I've got hydrangea macrophylla, which is the Bigleaf hydrangea or the French hydrangea.

This is the hydrangea that most people are familiar with.

Most of the time they grow the Mophead hydrangeas, which are going to have the large dome shaped or corn shaped flowers.

Most of those flowers being sterile.

There is of course, the lacecap hydrangea that is going to have the center being fertile flowers, whereas the sterile ones are on the outside.

The reason why I mentioned this specifically is because Hydrangea macrophylla of course is going to produce these flowers on last year's growth most of the time, and so unfortunately, if you prune too late in the season or too early in the year, or we have a significant frost, which unfortunately last December was a little bit rough, especially along the coast, for a lot of plants that just aren't used to it.

A lot of that flower buds that have already been set unfortunately might have been knocked away, then.

so it's always good to keep in mind hydrangeas, of course those flower beds aren't going to be set, really by the time they're dormant, and so be aware of that don't prune after that... <Amanda> Don't be so tidy with them.

<Christopher> Exactly allow them to kind of grow a little bit more wild.

There are of course newer cultivars, like the Endless Summer Series and a few other ones.

<Amanda> That can bloom on new wood?

<Christopher> They bloom on both.

So those can probably still re-bloom, but most of our standard ones especially the older cultivars are just going to bloom on old <Amanda> Now, how about the Annabelle, because I've heard you can just practically mow it down, and I think it's a native <Christopher> So yes, so Annabelle is the hydrangea arborescens, I believe.

That one's is native-ish.

It's native to the East Coast.

That is a beautiful one that is going to bloom generally on new wood, and so that one of course is going to be able to be pruned really in early spring, but it can also be pruned really any time of year.

That one actually if you prune it severely, you can really encourage bigger flowers, but if you don't prune it, you can allow for those flowers to be a little bit smaller, but you get a few more of them.

So you can kind of treat it however you want, but that's kind of the nice thing about the smooth hydrangea.

That one as well as the panicle hydrangea which is the group that can handle more sun.

Those generally can also be pruned kind of any time of the year because they've produced on new wood.

<Amanda> Okay, okay.

Well, and if you have this type.. the lacecaps, I guess those actual sexual flowers can be beneficial to insects, perhaps.

<Christopher> They can.

They're not necessarily.

Yeah, it's kind of like our chameleons.

They're pretty.

Insects are going to visit them, but it's not necessarily the most overly beneficial.

So you don't necessarily need to grow only the lacecap versus the mop head.

The big thing, of course, is having a diversity of plants so that way, this is not the only plant they're relying on.

<Amanda> Okay, so hydrangeas, just the main thing to know is if you've got the old fashioned type, do not go out there and decide, oh, you know, it's a pretty day I'm going to go prune everything back and get ready for spring because you'd be pruning off things that are the flowers, which is the main reason, because they're not so great looking otherwise necessarily so.

<Christopher> So unfortunately, this year, you might not get any, but next year, if you leave it alone, it should be okay.

<Amanda> Okay, thank you so much.

Okay, Teresa.

<Terasa> Let's try to help Don in St. Matthews, who said the branches of my crape myrtle are covered in tiny white bumps.

What is this and what do I do?

<Amanda> Uhh, goodness, there's some unfortunate news for crape myrtle people, Phillip.

<Phillip> Oh, yes.

Unfortunately for crape myrtles especially in the St. Matthews and Orangeburg area, there has been an outbreak recently of a particular kind of invasive scale called crape myrtle bark scale and it is exceptionally tenacious.

What initially happens is you don't see the infestation the first year.

Then over a period of time the scale population builds up and you get these white covered branches.

It looks almost like a white fuzz.

Then your bark turns jet black from sooty mold from the honey dew that they suck from the sap of the tree, and it can cause death and decline of crape myrtles when the populations get high enough, and it's such a tenacious pest, because control measures are very difficult.

It is very resistant to certain insecticides, but you can get control through early scouting in the spring, usually April or March, yes, with two sided sticky tape to check for crawlers, or the nymph stage which is, comes out in early spring, and that's how you would monitor.

Once you start to see those you would treat with a pyrethroid.

Something like Bifenthrin, or Cypermethrin, or something similar to that... to target those crawlers, you're not going to get anything from the adults with that, because they're covered with a nice waxy coating.

They are an armored type scale.

So you're targeting the juveniles, which are mobile.

The adults are sedentary or stationary.

They pick a spot and usually it's in the crutches where the branch is attached to the trunk... and then, and then after you've used your first application with the pyrethroid, you can control them with insect growth regulators, as well as insecticidal drenches with either Imidacloprid or Dinotefuran or Safari would be the trade name, and it's usually it'll usually take a year to two to get complete control or eradication.

<Amanda> When you think of the prevalence which crape myrtles are planted across the state, this is absolutely devastating.

It's not a native species and, but it does.

- It just is such an important tree in the landscape.

<Phillip> You see it so often and it feels such a great niche that you - it's but it is time to start looking for a different plant.

It's very disheartening to hear that and the scale is very easily transmitted.

<Amanda> It just blows... >> The crawlers can blow in the wind, especially if the wind is harsh enough, and here lately in South Carolina we've had - <Amanda> We've happy to have, you know, some gusty days.

<Christopher> Oh, absolutely.

<Terasa> If I'm not mistaken, they'll often cluster in pruning cuts.

So it's a good, another good reason to promote proper pruning and not over pruning or murdering our crape myrtles.

<Phillip> Any stress that you can reduce from a crape myrtle is a plus: insect, scale insects, mites, aphids.

They all ...point in on that stress, and the hormones that are released by those stress points.

So the less stress the better.

<Terasa> Really, we could generalize that to all plants, right, that the happier we can keep our plants, the better they will perform.

<Amanda> Well, you know, we talked about how pine trees and some of those things get off when they're damaged, or under stress, they give off smells, which we don't smell, but the insects that are out there do smell them, and they come in and go to them.

I mean, It's just, we... - you know, my dog can smell wonderfully, and I think that insects can probably smell even better than my dogs, and we just don't, you know, we don't want to think of, we don't think of plants as being that active, but they do.

I mean, they're just like us they, you know, they, they're living creatures that respond to insults and to happiness.

Okay, well, Austin are we going to talk about something happy or...?

<Dr Austin> Yes, I'll put a happy spin on this, and, you know, talking about keeping plants happy, and here's a plant or two that can keep itself happy.

Isn't that nice, right?

<Amanda> Yeah.

>> We all have the power to do that to some extent, I think.

<Amanda> I think do it in kind of a harsh environment.

>> Yes.

So I'm from the Sandhills, which is that stretch of land about 30 miles wide that kind of runs through Aiken up to Chesterfield, Marlboro counties, Highway 1 cuts, to kind of Highway 1, the scenic Sandhills highway, is my name for it, but everything that lives there is on a high dry you know ridge oftentimes where water does fall, but it percolates very quickly away from the roots.

So you just have to either live with less, or find some kind of adaptation to get by, and so, the scrub oaks you often hear that term scrub oak and you see these left and right of the highway when you're driving down.

There's four different types of scrub oaks.

Okay, and so here's one.

This is called Black Jack oak, and these are all only about the story or too high.

They're not tall oaks, you're living with less, right.

<Amanda> Hold it real still.

<Dr Austin> So, this is...Black Jack oak, and I didn't know what that meant, you know, but apparently a Black Jack is a leather pouch that mobsters would fill with lead, and this is how they would sometimes handle some of their business, and it had this shape, and so that's how Black Jack oak got its name, but there's that characteristic, kind of 1, 2, 3 lobes that come off of it, and it just is living in the Sandhills, and then along came this other one that really sort of has a bluish... <Amanda> It does <Dr Austin> tint to it, and so it became known as Blue Jack oak.

Okay.

These two that I've held so far with, and this next one that I'll grab, are all kind of little down slope of the last one that I'll hold.

So these are a little closer to the water table.

Here is - many people will be familiar with the Post oak, <Amanda> Yeah.

<Dr Austin> Well, this is a Post oak that decided to live with less, and so this is often called Dwarf Post oak or shrub... <Amanda> I've seen Post oaks with large leaves.

<Dr Austin> Yes, yes, and often they do.

So this is a slightly different species, and you get full sun in the Sandhills.

I mean, leaves are great, right.

You want to absorb sunlight, but you you also lose moisture through those things.

So make them a little bit smaller in that case, and you can get away with life like you didn't, you know, before, and then what really is fancy, I think, is this one, the Turkey oak, and with common names of anything, you have to really kind of use your imagination, but somebody decided that if you look hard enough, you'll find a leaf, such as this one that looks a little bit like a turkey track in the sand, and this one is famous for - I'm in the high dry, sunny sand hill, so instead of using my leaves, like everybody else does, I turn them like this, I reduce the surface area that is exposed to the sunlight and thereby I lose less water.

Does that make sense?

So you kind of just instead of shrinking your leaves, or putting on some kind of sunscreen, you just turn them, so you have less that is exposed.

Turkey oak roots are pretty fancy, and what they do, they can actually... do what's called - the botanists call it hydraulic lift.

So really droughty situations, you know, the important roots is the gardeners will know where those feeder roots, the tiny fine roots, of the upper topsoil.

They're grabbing your nutrients and all this, and you got to keep those healthy and happy.

Well, sometimes you run out of water all the way in the Sandhill.

So the deeper roots of the Turkey oak will pump water from deep within the soil, exert it, secret it out into the moisture into the soil, for the fine roots to absorb nutrients.

So that's what I'm talking about how this keeps itself happy.

It waters itself.

I don't know many plants that water themselves, but the Turkey oak waters itself.

It keeps those fine roots alive through the hard times, and I love that story, and it's one of the ones that makes me grateful for the Scrub oaks.

<Amanda> Now, can they turn their leaf somewhat during the daytime?

Is that - <Dr Austin> They can and there's a number of trees that will do this.

So I keep a Redbud tree in my garden and I use it as a shade tree, which means it's exposed to full sun, and during the day, it'll slowly tip its leaves to have less of those leaves.

<Amanda> Redbuds would prefer to be kind of - <Dr Austin> They like in the shade.

Yeah, yeah, I'm kind of forcing mine, but it's what I want, but it's managed to survive.

So a number of them will change.

Plants can move.

<Amanda> Isn't that something.

So, say that, what kind of lift?

<Dr Austin> Hydraulic lift.

<Amanda> Hydraulic lift.

<Dr Austin> It just means you take water from deep layers and bring it up to the top soil.

<Amanda> That's just one of the loveliest, most wonderful adaptations I've ever heard of.

Thank you so very much, and, you know, when you see them, you're just so glad that something's growing there.

<Dr Austin> Yep, yep.

They fill a spot that is usually unfilled.

and not a lot of plants can do that.

Longleaf pine will be another one that can that can perform that fancy trick, and in doing so, by the way, there's plants that have figured out, "Oh, "Turkey oak is going to do this.

Maybe I can go live "near it, and take a little bit."

<Amanda> Yeah, <Dr Austin> from what it's doing, so you'll see that sometimes too.

<Amanda> Picking your neighbor.

>> That's right.

<Amanda> All right.

Well, we've talked about what fun Tim Lee is, and I think you're going to enjoy watching this wonderful time when he came to visit us and talked about moths and lichen.

<Amanda> Well, you're going to be liking today's program a lot, because I'm speaking with Tim Lee, who is a naturalist with the Parks, Recreation, and Tourism department in the upstate, and we're going to talk about lichens and mosses.

They seem so similar sometimes, but they're, and they are similar some but they're also pretty different, and you came and spent the night in Sumter last night, so we could get started early, and you took a walk down the street, you could have gotten almost everything you needed just wandering around downtown.

<Tim> Right, almost everything that you see on the table right now, they are examples of right on Main Street.

There were we'll talk about this in a bit.

but they are lichens that are called crustose lichens, which are literally crusty if you would, and they were growing on the bark of the trees.

We had some foliose lichens, big bushy ones, if you would.

Moss is growing between the bricks on the sidewalk and growing on the sides of some of the old structures, but interestingly enough, even some of the new building structures had mosses growing on them as well.

<Amanda> It's crazy, and one thing that I really love about this is that they are such diversity in where we find them, and some of them I mean, like I think of mosses as being in real, you know, on the north sides of trees and things like that, but some of the lichens and mosses grow in the same areas and some grow in very diverse areas.

Often you find them together though.

<Tim> Yeah, absolutely.

Well, what we have in front of us right here on the right is one that people commonly know as reindeer moss.

It's actually a lichen, and just beside it is pin cushion moss.

So this is a moss, and this is a lichen, but they were growing right beside each other on very sandy soil, and just at first glance, you might think they're the same thing, same sort of organism.

One of the great things about both of these is they can grow in very harsh conditions.

They're called extremophiles like extreme conditions that can be very dry, and in some cases, even very warm.

In this case, this the lichen and in this case on this moss, both of these, which is true of all lichens and mosses, they don't... have a root system, which is different from a lot of plants that we think of when without a root system.

You don't need to put your feet down in the soil so to speak.

You're getting your water and your nutrients from the air around you.

So, in this case, very extreme conditions, very dry, very warm conditions, but you got both a lichen and a moss growing beside each other.

<Amanda> Well, let's start with lichens because so many people call the Extension office and they say, lichens are killing my plants, and what we generally say, our statement is well lichens, are completely self sufficient.

They don't take any nutrients from your plants.

They just want a way to be in the atmosphere, to get up in the sunlight, and occasionally, they'll grow on plants that aren't growing very quickly if a plant is slowed down a lot, but also, sometimes some plants just have a great surface for lichens to grow on.

So, how does a lichen make its business?

(laughter) <Tim> Well, lichens are really like an ecosystem.

It's everything kind of all packaged in there together.

So you have a mycobiont, which means it's a fungus, and you have a photobiont.

So, it's the one that photosynthesizes, and that could be either an algae or an alga.

It could be a cyanobacteria, which is a blue green alga, if you would, and that's the one that actually makes the food if you will, and then it provides the food.

The lichen, or the fungal component actually provides the structure, <Amanda> Aha, <Time> Okay.

Now, both of those, both the algal and the fungus, in some cases, is a sign of it.

They could live on their own, but there are places that they can live, that they would not be able to by living together in playing different roles.

So, in other words, the algae in here would not be able to survive in those dry conditions without that fungus helping to capture that moisture to help keep it wet.

<Amanda> Okay, and then the moss, although it looks like this is a great big thing that's all one plant, it doesn't have a vascular system.

It doesn't have any roots, and so it has to...these are really tiny little things, and they have to...move nutrients and water, just by almost osmosis.

<Tim> Right.

Exactly.

>> As if we were kind of holding hands.

<Tim> Yes.

>> And I was...this part of my hand was, and then your...I'm passing nutrients and water on to the next door neighbor <Tim> to the next door neighbor.

Exactly.

This is hundreds of individual plants inside of here.

So you want to think of this going into a small scale like a little forest, but hundreds of individual moss plants that look like little trees.

That particular growth form is called an acrocarp, and those are the ones that sort of stand up.

By the fact that they're all grouped close together, the moisture that's available within there allows them to be able to move that water easily across...the leaf.

It's not really a leaf though, Amanda.

It's a leaf like structure.

It's only one cell thick, which is also why it's able to be able to bring that water in versus having to go through multiple layers.

It's just keeping that one cell, or that one layer of cells with the moisture content and any other nutrients that are coming in via the atmosphere.

<Amanda> Did lichens come first, probably?

<Tim> That's a good question.

Most of the research indicates that mosses have been around for a little over 400 million years.

Okay.

Now if you go back and you take the algal component, the photobiont, algae's been around much longer.

So if you take one component of that, yes, the algal had been around way longer than than the moss has.

Of course, the moss is a true plant.

Even though it doesn't have a vascular system, so we call it a non-vascular plant.

Whereas the lichen itself, we group them or classify them as fungi, but there are many, many different things all in that, in that component, one unit.

It's like a whole ecosystem in there.

<Amanda> ...Then they have different ways of reproducing.

<Tim> Yes, >>...completely.

<Tim> The moss is going to produce a spore, and when that spore comes out of a little capsule, and you can see some of the capsules, right over there.

Yeah, there you go.

Little round structures like little balls.

Those little capsules contain the spores <Amanda> The male and female gametes.

<Tim> Everything's all packaged together.

Yes.

Think of it almost like a seed.

<Amanda> Oh.

<Tim> Okay.

Not exactly, but almost like a seed.

That's going to go.

It's going to land and when it lands, it's not going to grow into something that looks like a moss.

It's going to look more like an algal mat, a green algal mat.

Within there is when your actual gametes are going to form.

So, we call it the gametophyte.

The phyte is plant gamete, the plant that has the gamete.

<Amanda>It's complicated.

<Tim> It's kind of complicated.

So, it's two steps to get to that.

<Amanda> But the one thing is that they must have water to move those gametes so that they can get together, I believe.

<Tim> Exactly <Amanda> Kind of like sperm.

<Tim> Yeah, exactly.

Mosses are sometimes known as the amphibians of the plant world.

While they can live on land, they have to have that water for sexual reproduction to take place.

Lichen is a little different.

Within lichens you have reproduction taking place both asexually, which means a piece of this could break off, and if it has all the components, the mycobiont, the photobiont, then you can have a whole new plant growing.

<Amanda> I think you found this that had broken off a rock, and it was on the ground, and so here we have, ...it's okay, now.

It's a whole 'nother blanket.

<Tim> Yeah and it's now in a whole different location.

Yeah, exactly.

<Amanda> Down here in Sumter.

<Tim> Yeah, and what you see on the lichen, the reproductive component, you see most easily is going to be that like on this plant right here, you can see there's a little cup if you would, right, there <Amanda> I sure can.

<Tim> That's the reproductive structure of the fungus itself, and that's going to contain sometimes, but not always, kind of like a spore.

That's, but it's got everything all together, and by that, I mean, it has the genetic material to grow the fungus, the algal, and in some cases, they even have yeast growing within them as well.

So, that lands in the right conditions.

<Amanda> Bingo!

<Tim> Bingo!

You got a new plant.

<Amanda> ...It's just stunning that they've come together, they benefit each other.

They, the algal certainly couldn't live without this under some of the harsh conditions.

What a - I mean, they grow on tombstones.

<Tim> That's right.

They do.

They do.

They grow on tombstones, <Amanda> and but they also grow on trees, and limbs, and rocks, and just an incredible variety of places.

<Tim> Anywhere you look, almost, you can find a lichen growing.

There's some data out there that indicates that as much as 7%, as much as 7% of the Earth's surface is covered with lichens.

So, they're growing everywhere, almost.

<Amanda> Then they are indicators, really, of often clean air.

So explain that to us.

<Tim> As we were talking about earlier with the moss and the lichen, a lot of their moisture, a lot of their water content, as well as a lot of the nutrients are coming in from the air surrounding them.

<Amanda> They don't have any roots.

>> They don't have any roots.

So whatever else might be in that air, or that water can also be taken up by the plant.

So, the overall health of that plant in the case of the moss, or the overall health of the lichen can be indicative of what's happening in the air around them.

Now, that's not true of all lichens, and there are some lichens that...I mentioned they're extremophiles.

So, they will grow in conditions where the air quality is very low.

While there are other species similar to this one right here, which looks kind of dried up right now because...it's been in a envelope since the 1980s.

So, the photobiont in there is no longer viable.

<Amanda> So, it's herbarium specimen.

<Tim> Herbarium specimen, exactly.

The common name for this is lung lichen, and it's very sensitive to changes in the air quality.

<Amanda> When I was with you taking a course recently, I believe we were in - was it Sassafras Mountain?

<Tim> We were at the base of Sassafras Mountain, yes.

<Amanda> ...went down to a place.

I mean it, just, you could just feel like it was healthy.

and I believe we saw that there.

There was high moisture, but also you'd say that the air quality there is just fabulous.

<Tim> Exactly, and of course at that point being Sassafras Mountain, we were right along the edge of the Blue Ridge escarpment, and all of that warm moisture coming in from the Gulf hits those mountains rises and cools, resulting in over 80 inches, in some places 100 inches of rain.

So, we were in a temperate rainforest that day.

<Amanda> Well, why don't we go through - you've brought such a wonderful collection and talk about some of the different mosses and lichens that you brought.

<Tim> Sure, absolutely.

One of the ones I want to start out with is this one over here.

This came off the streets of Sumter, South Carolina.

Very small, but it's one of the ones that is very closely related to this particular one.

It's one of the pin cushion, because they typically grow in a round pattern, and they're puffed up like a pin cushion <Amanda> So, this is a moss.

<Tim> This is a moss, and this is a moss.

Both pin cushion mosses.

They once again are a collection of hundreds of individual mosses all growing together.

Kind of like in that little moss forest, if you would.

So, really interesting in there.

Another moss that we have.

It's growing very, very close to the bark.

It's growing in a lateral horizontal fashion as it grows out, and if you compare it to this one you can see how it's growing in a long line.

It branches many, many times.

So sometimes it's referred to as carpet moss.

<Amanda> Oh, <Tim> because it lays flat.

>> Yes.

<Tim> Another common name for it is the fern moss, because of all the branching, of course.

The ferns are <Amanda> - Ferns are so ferny.

<Tim> Yeah, so ferny.

They're very feathery.

So the fern moss or the carpet mosses are sometimes referred to as.

<Amanda> Now does this have a lichen growing with it?

<Tim> It does.

Side by side.

Exactly.

There actually is a lichen here that actually contains a green algal, but there's a blue green photobiont over here.

So the blue greens are going to give you that dark color lichen if you would.

<Amanda> There's another moss about that people have heard of a lot and perhaps even used, but not in this form.

<Tim> Right.

I mentioned to you earlier, there were different forms of mosses and we talked about the one that was standing tall and one that laid kind of flat down.

This is another group of them.

They're known as the Sphagnum mosses.

Sphagnum mosses look to me like an upside down string mop.

I don't know if you know the book, "The Lorax," like a Truffula tree if you would, and one of the reasons that this plant has been used historically in gardening, is that up to 90% of the cells in this organism are dead.

They just hold water.

So, if you would, the majority of this is water.

You can see it this dripping out from the middle of my hand on here.

<Amanda> So people like to use that to enrich their soils, and if we walk to Swan Lake, and there are certain places on the far across the street, not in the main part of the garden, where you can actually see that growing down near the cypress swamp.

<Tim> Yes, it grows in wetland areas.

It will not survive in dry conditions.

Some mosses will do well in drier conditions, but others have to almost a saturated in order to be able to...survive.

<Amanda> Well, let's move on to the lichens, because I don't think that's often the case with them.

<Tim> No lichens can dry out, almost completely... and in that case, what you will see is you will see a very light grayish color like this, light green, and then when it gets wet, it will darken up because that protective layer on the outside of this particular plant or particular lichen that outside layer is protecting that photobiont in there, and this one is known as usnea, and a lot of people see this and particularly if you're on the coast or come to the mountains, you'd think it's Spanish moss, but it's not interestingly enough, Spanish moss is named after this.

This species is usneoides.

<Amanda> Looks like usnea... <Tim> looks like usnea, exactly.

This is usnea, and a lot of times people will see this growing on their trees high up the fruticose lichens, the highly branch ones have the ability to capture more moisture.

...So they are going to grow higher in your trees, and this is the one that a lot of people see growing is this usnea, or they will see some of the other fruticose lichens high up and their trees, and they think there's something wrong as we talked about earlier.

There's one more thing I'd like to tell you about the reindeer lichen.

Some people call it reindeer moss.

We don't have reindeer caribou in our area, but in the areas where they are caribou up to 90% of their diet is this particular lichen and so without that lichen, the caribou would not be able to continue to exist.

Very important.

<Amanda> ...I've heard that there's some concern that since they have to get everything from the atmosphere, that sometimes this has a good bit of radioactive material in it.

They're kind of were studying that to see if it's have any effect on those on those mammals that use that as their diet.

<Tim> Exactly.

Black deer, black tailed deer, which we don't have either, as well as caribou, they're looking to see what the radioactivity levels are within their, within their bodies, so.

<Amanda> Well, this is the kind of thing I love to go out in my yard and find.

I just think that's just the most beautiful thing in the world.

<Tim> ...This was one laying on the ground.

You're going to see these high in the trees once again because of that high branching of the fruticose that you have, and I mentioned about the reindeer lichen, but if we move across the table all the way over there, that little clump that's seen right there.

Can you point to that to me, Amanda?

Come back a little bit right there.

There you go... Yeah, if you look closely at that, you'll notice there's a little depression in the middle there.

<Amanda> Oh, there certainly is, and it's soft inside.

<Tim> Yeah, and a little feather.

It looks like a lichen or a moss sitting there.

It's actually a ruby throated hummingbird nest, and what the hummingbird will do is gather lichens and put them all on the outside of the nest to camouflage it, so when a predator sees it, they think it's just lichen on the tree.

<Amanda> Yeah, because not many things like to eat lichen.

<Tim> That's correct.

So they're only a food source in this case, but also are playing an important role in helping to hide those little birds as they are developing.

<Amanda> I love textured tree bark, but also I like some of the trees that have real smooth barks, because they'll just be home to all kinds of lichens, and I think that's what we have here.

<Tim> That's exactly what you have there.

That's an American Beach, a little small branch off of that.

We had do some pruning on that.

There are seven to nine, depending on who you ask seven to nine different types of crustose lichen growing there together.

Now they'll grow together, but they'll bump right up to each other, and they will sort of put this little line and they won't let the other one grow within there, and one more thing I'd like to mention about that is these little black squiggly lines in here, they almost look like someone had done some writing.

That's how we know which genuses this is.

This is Graphis, and there are many different species of Graphis, but they all have the same thing in common that the reproductive structures are lined up, and they turn and twist like letters.

<Amanda> It is fun to scratch the surface.

<Tim> Yes.

>> And if people want to do more than that, there are resources you can look at, and just go out and start taking walks, and look at what you see on your walks and on your trees, and don't be alarmed when you see these things.

And...then also, the Master Naturalist course, is one that you would reach out to Clemson Extension to find out about and there are often programs through that.

That's how I got to take this, And...then some of our state parks have interpretive rangers like you, and so you don't... have to travel around the world.

I mean, look at this, <Tim> Right here.

<Amanda> All right here, and we have some great resources, and I want to thank you for coming and sharing your knowledge with us today.

<Tim> Thank you so much, Amanda.

I appreciate it.

<Amanda> Mosses and lichens are everywhere, and so you can just start looking at tree trunks and places like that.

It's just a wonderful way to see the world on a smaller scale, but to realize how important that smaller scale is to our overall ecology.

Thanks Tim, and he's promised he's going to come back and do something else with us.

Well, Terasa, I don't know what happened to my invitation to the coronation, but um.

<Terasa> Oh, mine didn't show up either.

So don't feel bad.

<Amanda> Okay, but, you know, they were those funny hats.

What are they called?

<Terasa> Fascinators, I believe.

<Amanda> I don't know if anyone had one like this, but this is... <Terasa> That's pretty unique.

<Amanda> This is my fascinator and it has purple asparagus, which are just the cat's meow.

I mean, I'm not going to kid you.

This is the best thing.

Oh, tender and tasty, and um, when we cook asparagus, we've started putting sesame oil on them.

I've started butter, but also with this, I have smilax which is, let's see.

Help me find an end on the smilax.

<Dr Austin> There you go.

(laughing) <Amanda> Thank you.

Yeah, and smilax is called wild asparagus, and we go out and collect them... ...and they're free, and they are just wonderful, and it's so much fun because when they've got this little tendrils on them and you have them on a plate, everybody's just like and you have, so you reach and delicately you know, pull one out and just have so much fun.

If you haven't collected smilax it's just the best thing in the world is lots and lots of fun, but um, asparagus, you know, South Carolina, we used to be the asparagus capital, and Edward's grandfather had a couple of 100 acres of it <Terasa> Wow.

<Amanda> Yeah, and Mama said they would say, "Oh, Lord, do we have to have asparagus again?"

and then nowadays, of course, you know, it's like, oh, gosh, you know, take your paycheck and get some of these beautiful, wonderful things, because the people who grow them go to a lot of trouble to grow outstanding asparagus.

Yep.

So anyway, so I didn't get to go to the party, but I've had a good time eating asparagus.

Anyway.

All righty.

Well, um, let's see, Terasa, have we got some more questions we can help people with?

>> We sure do.

This particular Extension client has apparently taken our advice and had a soil test, but needs a little bit of help.

Bailey from Charleston said, I just got my solar test back.

I know I need to apply lime, but what is CEC?

Also, can I test my soil in the future with an at home kit?

It isn't always easy to get to my local Extension office.

<Amanda> Goodness.

Christopher, can you help us with this, and can you mail them if you need to?

<Christopher> So yeah, one of the first things I want to address.

So obviously, home kits, I generally recommend avoiding, not necessarily because they're not going to give you results, those results just not may not be very accurate, and so you have to keep in mind, there's a lot of factors that go into soil testing and all that.

The best thing to do.

It's not an overly expensive process, if you can't get it to the office, Charleston County, specifically has drop boxes around the county, but you can always mail it, you can buy the mailers, I think they're 10 or 12 bucks, and you can just mail it directly to the lab.

There's a lot of different ways you can do it.

I'm glad to hear that their soil testing regularly, but for the most part, avoid the home tests.

They're generally just not very accurate.

<Amanda>...but because your soil type is so important as to what you do, because usually, one of the most you know people just don't realize how important liming is, but a sandy soil will change its mind a lot easier, I think, than an organic soil.

Is that a nice, easy way to put it?

<Christopher> Yeah, so CEC Cation Exchange Capacity can sometimes be a little bit confusing, but really simply put, it is essentially the measurement of how well the soil's able to hold on to the nutrients that we, the plants need and also exchange those nutrients and allow plants to retake them back up, and so having a higher Cation Exchange Capacity can generally mean your soil is going to hold on to things much better.

Sandy soils generally have a very low Cation Exchange Capacity, whereas clay and high organic matter level soils good, they just like have much higher.

So that ability to change can vary with that, and so if you're liming, unfortunately, it's going to be more based on not just the Cation Exchange Capacity, but also it's going to be based on your buffer pH, which is also on that soil test.

Hence the reason why again, getting it done at the lab, the good news is the lab usually tells you how much to put out.

So they kind of did all the calculations for you, whereas those are good numbers to have as far as understanding your soil, but it's not necessary to figure out how much <Amanda> Okay, and if you do a soil test, and you've got questions, you can call your local office, and if your agent isn't there, I believe that the fine people at HGIC are more than willing to help you, aren't they?

<Christopher> Absolutely.

So not only the Extension agents or your local Extension agents always glad to answer questions about soil testing, but also the Home and Garden Information Center.

They have toll free numbers that you are able to call, and of course they can answer any of those questions, as well.

<Amanda> ...and I believe they can pull your test up so that you don't have to send them a copy or worry about all that.

You just tell them your name and the numbers and they can see what you're seeing, and then they'll help you through every step of it.

<Christopher> Oh, absolutely.

<Terasa> Christopher mentioned about telling you how much and so sometimes people are kind of overwhelmed when they see the soil report and like CEC and buffer pH, and there's graphs of nutrient values, but what I try to encourage people to do is to focus on the comments.

So the comments are sometimes written in tiny print, but that's really what tells you exactly what you need to do.

Apply this much lime and at what rate to apply it, but of course we have great resources at the local office and that HGIC to help navigate the process if needed.

<Amanda> Okay, thank you so much.

That's good, good news.

and, I think you had some, you had your readers with you, and so when you need sometimes you may need to readers.

(laughing) Okay, Terasa, what's next?

<Terasa> Let's see if we can help Alex in Columbia, who said some of my vegetables are looking rough and have stopped producing.

Should I just pull them up?

<Amanda> Well, what do you think Phillip?

<Phillip> Well, it really depends on the vegetables.

Right now, okra and a lot of the solanaceous crops, so peppers, eggplants, tomatoes, things of that nature are kind of slowing down with this hot weather that we're getting.

So you can use a method of pruning called retuning, which is kind of different.

What it is, you cut the stem, the main stem of the of the vegetable plant, in this case, six to 12 inches above the ground and what that forces that plant to do is resprout or send out lateral branches, <Amanda> Okay.

>> Usually, it's between four and six, and that will encourage A, not only new growth, but root development as well as flower development, so you set more fruit.

<Amanda> Okay.

>> It's very common with okra, especially in the heat of the summer.

Okra being in the same family as cotton.

It really does appreciate the heat, but at the same time, <Amanda> - and it gets so tall, I can't even reach it <Phillip> It does, and if you are a shorter person, it does help to retune so that way you can control the height.

<Amanda> Thank you.

That's a lot of fun.

Well, Austin, we've got a little bit of time left, what can we talk about?

<Dr.

Austin> Sure.

Well, and I was thinking about what Philip was just saying, and you know, some I'm a bit of a lazy gardener, which means I didn't get rid of some of my winter crops one year, broccoli, kale, collards, and all those came up with a beautiful spike of yellow flowers, and I was just blown away by the number of pollinators.

<Amanda> I know.

They do love that.

<Dr.

Austin> If you can let them go, if you have the room, let the pollinators do their thing.

One of the relatives of pollinators - this guy doesn't do a whole lot of pollination, but I see him a good bit, incidentally at gas stations.

What else do you do when you're pumping gas?

I like to look for insects because the lights, you know, overnight, have attracted a lot of these things, and this is one of the more famous silk moths.

It's a polyphemus moth, and as an adult, it doesn't feed or drink nectar or pollinate.

It's mostly interested in reproduction, and lives about a week or two as an adult.

The larvae though, are what are so incredibly robust, and sometimes you'll see a branch you know from a tree that's completely defoliated, and when I see that I stop and I look for a big hungry caterpillar, and it's often, this guy.

Later on once it's, you know, all full and happy, it's going to form a pupa case, and wrap a little silken chamber around that, you know, cocoon, and so this is the cocoon of this, and the one of the fun things to do is go around in wintertime, and so in winter, <Amanda>...because all the leaves are off.

<Dr.

Austin> Yeah, the leaves have fallen down.

So if there's something that's still up there, it's usually a nice little mystery that you can try to uncover, and it's often the cocoon of a polyphemus moth.

If you have a screen porch or something where you can keep it outside, so you don't trick it into hatching early, you can kind of you know, bring one of these in once in a while and let it hatch, but the cocoons remain and they become great little chambers, even for little developing insects, spiders living in there, little baby green ...so they're home, even after the adult moth has hatched out of there, so... <Amanda> Polyphemus <Dr.

Austin> Polyphemus moth.

<Amanda> Now, since it was a moth, and it doesn't have bright - this one doesn't have very bright colors, this is about what it looks like?

<Dr.

Austin> Yeah, and so that's right, and so the moths that are often nighttime animals, and so they're going to use, you know, chemicals.

You don't have the vision of the daylight and everything.

So a big, wide antennae on this individual and that usually means it's a male.

So he's, listening or seeking out the chemicals that the female is, pumping out of her abdomen there, and so yeah, it's usually about chemical communication in the moths at night.

<Amanda> How about that!

- and then as you just can show us the little eggs they hold there, is just a little welcome mat for somebody else who needs a home.

<Dr.

Austin> That's right.

Everybody is making use of everything in the natural world and big eye spots, you don't often see those on this guy unless you disturb it right.

So you're not seeing with those they are just kind of telling you to stay away.

I saw one of these one time in a museum, it was turned upside down, like so.

They put it right beside the head of a bard owl.

You'd be surprised how strikingly similar that looks, and so that's enough to startle a potential predator away.

<Amanda> Fun, fun, fun.

All right.

Well, I hope you all have enjoyed the program.

Our guest as much as I have.

I've learned so much tonight, Terasa.

It's really been delightful, <Terasa>...fascinating.

<Amanda> It really is.

We just, - it's just wonderful to get to come and remind ourselves of what a glorious world we live in and what we need to do to look after it.

Thank you all for being with us, and thank you all.

I hope you'll join us next week.

Night.

Night.

♪ closing music ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ music ends ♪ <Narrator> Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

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This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

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