Welcome to Politically Speaking.

I'm Elizabeth Bennion, Professor of Political Science and Director of Community Engagement at Indiana University, South Bend, Indiana.

Republican Party Chairman Kyle Hupfer is here to talk about the future of politics in the state and the future of the party.

Thanks so much for being here, Chairman.

Yeah, thank you for having me.

Appreciate it.

I want to start by asking you about your thoughts on the Indiana General Assembly.

They just wrapped up their 2023 session.

In your view, how productive was this session?

Listen, I think, you know, it's always hard to measure, you know, the week after it ends.

You know, these these sessions, I think, actually get measured, you know, decades out as to how impactful they were.

But I think when we look, you know, we get into the future, we look back, this one's going to be very impactful to the state of Indiana.

You know, let's start with a first ever transformative investment in physical and mental health, something that is long overdue here in Indiana.

The governor championed it and the Republicans in the legislature supported putting together a budget items to fund health and every additional health initiative in every single county.

It's you know, it's up to the county to decide how they're going to implement and prove to the state that the impacts that they're making.

Beyond that, you know, another another session of record levels of funding for K-12 education, an additional I think it was 8%, 8% increases.

I mean, it's it's a big it was 1.8 billion, maybe additional dollars into K-12 education.

So huge investments continue there.

And we're seeing that in the classroom.

We're seeing teacher pay raise.

That was a goal of the governor several years ago to get to get teachers pay up.

Law enforcement across the state, the state law enforcement got a record level of increase in wages that will make that competitive and ensure that we have excellent public safety from the state police conservation officers.

And that's just tip of the iceberg.

Another another set of ready grants for regional development.

I mean, it's it's you know, the state of Indiana is doing really, really well.

Our tax collections continue to rise.

We've we've always maintained a surplus since Republican governors took over and with Mitch Daniels in 2005.

And and that will continue and that's fiscal and investment that's coming into this state, resulting in additional tax dollars is putting us in a position where we can reinvest in Hoosiers to ensure that that growth continues.

Now, you mentioned Governor Holcomb, and looking at the legislation passed and comparing it to his 2023 next level agenda, it seems like he got pretty much everything he asked for, maybe not all in the exact dollar amounts that he asked for, but almost everything he asked for got some level of funding.

How important that it is that for his legacy?

Well, I think it's huge.

You know, I mean, listen, he's had a you know, especially with COVID in the middle of it.

I mean, it's going to be a historic governorship just because of that.

And and, you know, guiding the state through.

But when you look at what's going on with the level of capital investment in the state and the support that the the Republicans in the legislature are giving him and supporting his 2023 agenda, a lot of that is because of the results we're seeing in economic development.

If you look back historically, I think the governor and the IEDC have run around $8 billion a year in capital investment, including setting a record last year and 2022 or in 2021 going into 2022.

In 2022, we did 22 billion, so almost three times our record.

That's the kind of ecosystem for economic investment that we've built in Indiana, a stable tax environment, great public school system, low cost of living.

This is a place.

And then you add in our infrastructure that's top in the country time and time again by rankings.

And when you have a place that is very attractive to invest.

And so we're seeing that.

And I'm not going to be surprised if 2023 beats 2022.

And so all of these pieces go into that, and the governor is very attuned to that from from his travels and his dealings with these businesses, that quality of life, quality of place, having a good workforce available to you when you when you locate here, having healthy employees, having trails and a great outdoors are things that people are looking for.

And so his 2023 agenda lines up great with that.

I think that's the Republicans in the legislature supported that.

And you know, the results will we'll see what those results are as it's implemented.

But certainly he was supported very strongly in the legislature this year.

It did see, of course, some tensions between the governor and some members of the legislature, especially Republicans in the House, surrounding some of the ideas about how to deal with the pandemic, as well as the dollar figure on some of his proposals and how much how large returns to give to folks.

You see that kind of disagreement within the party as a sign of trouble or a sign of health within the party?

Well, well, first of all, I mean, it only happens because of how strong the party is in Indiana, right?

I mean, we have supermajorities in the House and Senate.

We've delivered time and time again for Hoosiers across the state.

They trust us.

They trust our brand.

They continue to send us back time and time again.

So I think it is a sign of strength.

And listen, there's going to be debate and discussion during a legislative session.

I think that's healthy.

You know, COVID unique.

You know, we know a lot more today than we did then when decisions are made in the middle of COVID.

And so, you know, I think there's there's been learning that's that's come out of that.

But we're following best best practices and what could be done at the time.

But look, the results speak for themselves.

We didn't shut down as a state.

We continue to work.

We continue to build roads, we continue to put bridges in.

We continue to have economic investment in construction going on.

And it's it's showing by how quickly and how strongly we've rebounded coming out of COVID to again, I mean, we're clearly the envy of the Midwest, where we're the state that grew in the Midwest during the last ten years since the cycle.

And you know, when you look at all these these are states around us aren't getting these kind of investments that we're seeing.

And so you're going to have you're going to have debate, you're going to have discussion.

It's healthy for our party to do that.

And at the end of the day, we delivered another balanced budget, another surplus for Hoosiers and Hoosier taxpayer, another tax cut for Hoosiers on an accelerated basis.

And so we're continuing to deliver.

And the other thing that I think goes goes un-talked about, because it's not it's not always a quote unquote agenda item per say.

But another thing that I think that Republicans need to be touting more, which I like to talk about, is how much debt we've paid down during the governors.

I think we pay down another over $2 billion of debt in this budget on an accelerated basis, not just normal debt payments.

So I think, you know, if you just look at where our debt for the state was when the governor was elected to when he steps down at the end of 2024, I think it's going to probably be more than a 50% reduction because we're unlike states around us, we're funding our major infrastructure programs with cash.

We're not we're not going out and borrowing and bonding to build roads or to build a new lodge, a potato creek up in your neck of the woods where we're those are just being written checks, cash coming out.

And so all of that's being done while still maintaining a surplus and paying down debt.

So Democrats often say that the state should invest more in things like health and traditional public schools.

It sounds like you're recommending a very cautious approach where you can pay down debt, build the surplus, as well as increase spending on the items that you mentioned at the top of the hour here.

What do you have to say for Democrats who say, well, the state should be investing more in some of these programs to help people in the state who aren't doing as well?

Well, I would say they are that we are, as I said, you know, another record level of investment in K-through-12 education and basically a transformative first of its kind in this state approach to county health departments, increased funding.

They're substantial.

We saw during COVID that they needed help.

The governor recognized that our Department of Health recognize that our legislators have recognized that and putting significant investment there.

I would also point out to them that, you know, you don't know what happens tomorrow.

And so you do have to think, you know, where do things go?

You have to be smart.

You have to have a surplus.

And as that debt gets paid down, that's more dollars every year that can be spent in a biennial budget.

So it provides a lot of flexibility.

And we're putting dollars in people's pocketbooks.

We've cut taxes.

We've had record levels of tax refunds, you know, through the circuit breaker.

We've again, lowered taxes and so that we're putting money in Hoosier hands, they can then spend it as they need.

I think they can spend it better than the government can right now.

There are several bills that didn't make it through the legislative process.

One that perhaps got the most attention was were a few different bills that would have made school board races partisan.

Do you have any thoughts on that as party chair, Should school board races be partisan?

Should that be decided on a city by city basis?

What are your thoughts there?

You know, I think it I think that discussion around that's going to continue.

Listen, school boards are are getting a lot of attention and I think parents are, you know, COVID really alerted parents.

They a lot of parents didn't know what was going on in their school system.

But when they got to sit next to their child on a computer on a regular basis, they learned a lot.

And so parental engagement is is an all time high.

I think here in Indiana.

I think whether it's through school board races, whether they're partisan or non-partisan, parents are going to be much more active.

I think that, you know, I'm certainly not opposed to partisan elections.

I think it gives voters some additional information about who they're voting for.

These are these are very low information elections.

Historically, people people don't know much.

The candidates don't have very much money raised to let voters know who they are or what they're about.

And so, you know, having a party label next to their name at least gives voters some additional information about who these who these folks are and kind of what their general political philosophy is.

But we'll see where it goes.

Oh, you've been serving for as chairman for about six years.

I was wondering, what were the biggest surprises or challenges you faced, perhaps some that you didn't expect and what you've learned through this position, what I feel like I've learned a lot.

You know, I've certainly got to know the state a lot better.

I've traveled extensively before I was chair working with various candidates, but I've really got to know Hoosiers.

And so that's been the most pleasant experience, you know, really get to know all corners of the state what's going on, know our elected officials, you know, in any position like this, you're going to have kind of intraparty disputes.

So sometimes I get pulled into those and try to referee to the best of my ability.

But but we tend to leave it to the voters, like let candidates go out and sell their message to the voters and let the voters decide.

And, you know, it's worked for for a long time in this country.

And I think that's the best way to do it.

Well, one of the things you mentioned is letting voters decide.

Of course, when we first met, you were also chairing Governor Holcomb's reelection campaign with really high profile candidates like U.S.

Senator Mike Braun and Lieutenant Governor Suzanne Crouch, running for governor.

What role do you see yourself playing in the 2024 election cycle.

I think it remains to be seen.

You know, the state party will be neutral.

You know, our goal is as we've set out and we've accomplished now in a couple of election cycles, I mean, we really are the ground game post primaries.

So we're building up even while those primary candidates are out there running against each other.

We know one of them is going to win.

We're going to have a nominee.

And as we did in 2018 with Mike Braun, as we did in 2020 with Governor Holcomb, as we did in 2022, with Todd Young being the top of the ticket and then all the way down to local races, we're there with field staff to go out and talk to voters, recruit volunteers, make phone calls.

We do absentee ballot efforts.

We do sort of that overarching messaging for the party and let the candidate be the candidate.

And so it's important for the party to be neutral and be viewed as neutral.

So the so that when that winner comes out of the primary, they trust us.

So you may or may not weigh in at the primary, but once the primaries over, that party is 100% behind the GOP nominee, correct?

Yeah.

Now, how difficult is it to maintain party unity when candidates are trying to distinguish themselves in high profile races like open seat races for the US Senate and the governorship?

And what role, if any, does the party play in encouraging candidates to sort of moderate their messages, or is that just entirely up to the to the candidates?

I mean, we certainly I mean, I think if you look at our brand and our top of the ticket candidates, we we you know, and the governor has you know, is his pillar over everything is civility.

And so we certainly preach that.

We ask candidates to be respectful of that.

But, you know, it tends to go ideologically if you have candidates that are pretty much in alignment, you're trying to find some differences and distinctions and message those and talk to voters about those.

And so we understand that that they're going to need to contrast.

We just asked them to try to keep it as issue focused as possible and as as civil as you can.

But listen, politics, as you know, is is not always smooth.

And so our job is to make sure that that we're ready and that our our infrastructure is ready to welcome the winner and heal any any bruising that might have occurred during a primary so that we're aligned going into the general election which we've done very well at.

One of the things Political Scientist Tom Patterson recently said in a webinar, I observed was that he thinks that polarization at the national level is so strong, in part because the parties are so closely matched and so they are going to want to destroy the other party.

In a sense, they want to be a majority party, and many people in each party see each other as enemies.

Here in Indiana, the GOP has a very significant lead, both a supermajorities in the state House and state Senate, but also holding all of the statewide seats in your observe, Based on your observations, has this made more room for civility in the state of Indiana and more opportunities for working together between the, you know, across party lines?

Well, I always tell folks, go, go, look, you know, after a legislative session, go look and see how many bills have, you know, fairly unanimous support.

I mean, it's it's a lot of them.

I think that, you know, as you know, we have we have worked really hard to build a distinct brand, separate and distinct from, you know, what goes on in national elections here in Indiana.

And we've spent a lot of time and energy and dollars, quite honestly, working towards that.

And so I think that's something that as a party, we're going to have to continue to, if we want that, if we want to not just be lumped in with what's going on nationally, then you have to you have to fight for that and you have to approach things in a little bit different manner, certainly.

But the national level polarization, as you mentioned, has only gotten amplified and increased over the last decades.

I don't know if it's you know, people always say this is the worst it's ever been.

I always like to point out that political candidates used to shoot each other in duels.

So so are we are far from the worst that politics have ever been in this country.

But I'm proud and and appreciate the uniqueness that we have here in Indiana that we we do have a different brand.

And Hoosiers look at us, I think, and expect that from us.

And so I hope that certainly continues here.

And a lot of that is that we continue to deliver on what we commit to them.

And so far we've done a very good job of that.

And the flip side, what role, if any, do you think the state party should pay, should play in informing what happens at the national level in terms of the national Republican Party?

Well, three of us are members of the RNC, you know, so we're three of the 168 across the country.

You know, politics is, you know, if you just look overall, politics has generally in a, you know, kind of steady progression, move from party to candidate focused over time.

You know, if you if you go way back here in Indiana, I mean, parties were were everything right?

You had carrots and sticks.

You you got to hire and fire people for government jobs.

You were getting license plate dollars to support the party functions and all of that.

All that's gone.

The carrots and sticks are gone.

And so I think it went when some of that has happened.

One of it one of the things that's happened is that candidates, you know, become a much more focal point versus the party.

And they, you know, if you look at us across the country in comparison, I think we've done as good a job as anywhere of keeping the party relevant and important and engaged.

But it's very difficult on the national stage for a state party to influence what's going on with either the president or the Senate or the Congress.

You know, it's it's a different world out there.

You know, they don't they don't call it the swamp for no reason.

I mean, it's a it's a different world.

And so we tend to try to focus on our you know, on our state boundaries.

And in and if we can do well there, then then we're happy with that.

Speaking of state boundaries, one of the issues that keeps coming up every year, but not really making it through the finish line in any particular direction is legislation surrounding marijuana with neighboring states legalizing marijuana.

There are many Hoosiers who think for economic reasons.

If there's that, we should do the same.

Do you anticipate any changes or movement on that issue in 2024?

I doubt it.

I mean, I think that's going to be for changes to happen here is going to have to start at the federal government.

I mean, we just for we're rule followers here in Indiana.

And, you know, we recognize that this is an illegal substance under the federal statutes and have respect to that.

I think they'll still be some discussions around it.

I mean, those are going to continue.

You know, we are we are not a referendum state, thankfully.

You see a lot of the states that have marijuana have referendum and it's come in through referendum.

I, I will tell you, if you talk to elected officials there, it's not been a good thing for those states.

You have additional traffic issues.

I mean, it's it's you know, there are issues surrounding having a drug legalized, but there are certainly legislators who have varying feelings on that.

And so I can I expect that you'll continue to have discussions and debate in the legislature.

Now, the Indiana GOP has launched a diversity leadership class.

I wonder if you could provide a little bit of background on that program and why it's important for the party.

Sure.

I stood at our convention in 2016 and talked about that.

We you know, we needed to get younger and more diverse if we were going to have long term success here in Indiana.

And one of the ways that we're trying to impact that is our Diversity Leadership series have been been very impactful, not just for the class participants, but for our elected officials and leaders who have been able to come and interact with the class.

We had a great day this week for the Diversity series for four of our graduates over the first two years won primary elections.

And so we'll be on the ballot in November.

And so we are we are excited about that.

That wasn't even necessarily a goal of the series, but to see that kind of impact already is very positive, being very well received across the state.

It's it's as far as I know, one of one in the country.

But it's it's a it's a long approach.

I mean, we've you know, I've not been this isn't something that that is unique in Indiana.

I've I've observed for a long time or Lugar series for the Republican Party that is focused on leadership and growth of women in the party.

And it's had tremendous success.

But it takes it's taken time.

And as you grow those classes and alumni and more interactions and more more folks out in diverse communities see that they're welcome in the party and not only welcomed, but but but thriving in the party will continue to grow.

All right.

Well, unfortunately, that will have to be the last word for today, because we're out of time for this episode of Politically Speaking.

But I want to thank my guest, GOP Party Chairman, Kyle Hupfer for joining us.

This is Elizabeth Bennion reminding you that it takes all of us to make democracy work.

This WNIT.

Local production has been made possible in part by viewers like you.

Thank you.