Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife, educational programs and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the Midlands at large.

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This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

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♪ opening music ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ <Amanda> Good evening and welcome to Making It Grow.

We are so glad that you could join us tonight.

I'm Amanda McNulty, a Clemson Extension agent, horticulture agent.

And I'm here with my co-host, a dear friend, Terasa Lott.

And Terasa, I say it's like continuing education because we have wonderful guests who tell us all kinds of fascinating things.

<Terasa> You are correct.

I love being a part of Making It Grow, especially for that ability to gather new information and hopefully be able to use it.

You know that we require our master gardeners to obtain continuing education as well so that they can stay current and fresh, up to date and provide that information to the public.

<Amanda> And actually overseeing that is a state project is your day job, I call it.

<Terasa> It is.

Yes.

<Amanda> Well, we're so glad that you can make room for us.

We sure do appreciate it.

<Terasa> Thank you.

<Amanda> Okay.

And Rob Last, you're, a commercial horticulture agent for Clemson in Lexington.

And Lexington is known for one very southern crop, I believe.

<Rob> Leafy greens and collards Yes, Amanda.

<Amanda> Yes.

Yes.

And, you know, because people used to eat out of their gardens and make their own, have their own food.

So let's talk about how incredible those things are.

<Rob> Absolutely.

Whenever you're looking at home produced food, you can harvest it at the absolute peak of freshness and utilize it really quickly.

So you're going to get the benefit of those vitamins and minerals from that home produced produce.

On a commercial scale, we do our level best to try and make sure that things are kept fresh and produced correctly to enable you guys to go and buy quality materials, quality, nutritious foods from the grocery stores.

<Amanda> They are real good for you.

<Rob> Oh, yes, <Amanda> They really are.

And do you eat yours with artichoke pickle?

<Rob> I don't, Amanda, but this - this sounds really intriguing.

(laughing) <Amanda> You're the curator at the A.C. Moore Herbarium.

So can you talk about what we call Jerusalem artichokes, please?

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

So it's not a not an artichoke at all, which would be sort of an unopened flower of a thistle.

<Amanda> Yeah.

That's with... <Dr.

Herrick> Right!

Yeah.

So this would actually be part of the subterranean root system.

It's actually a tuber that's formed by a species of sunflower called Helianthus tuberosus.

<Amanda> Oh.

Anyway, it's just fabulous and my children - Well, Lizza Brazil's boyfriend, Casey you know, he's born in California.

He'd never had it.

So he came here and they have it shipped out to them, now they like it so much.

So you have a treat in store for you?

<Rob> I'm looking forward to it, Amanda.

<Amanda> And Herrick I think you all provide curbside service down at the herbarium sometime.

<Dr.

Herrick> Indeed, we do.

So occasionally some folks have a mystery plant... <Amanda> It's hard to talk down, park down there.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah, there's not much parking, that's for sure.

And so if you have a mystery plant that you think is too bulky to mail to us or don't want to send us a digital image, you can just coordinate with us.

We'll meet you by the road and pick up the sample and make a specimen of it, help you identify it.

<Amanda> Now, John said it would be nice if you brought some homemade jelly or some cookies.

I guess you don't mind that aspect.

<Dr.

Herrick> It's not required, but we would certainly welcome it.

(laughing) <Amanda> Okay.

But we have two really great segments for you with Sal's Old Timey Feed and Seed, and actually, I got some artichoke relish while I was there Terasa, because that's one of the things that she provides, and then Terasa, you did something for us.

<Terasa> I did.

I am excited to share a restoration project in the Columbia area with Gills Creek Watershed Association.

<Amanda> And when I was little, you know, my brother, we kept snakes in the house and we would get the corn snakes, which are very docile and take them down to Gills Creek, which back then I think it was not considered sanitary, and we thought, it was fun for a little bit.

Then we pick them up and then we'd go to swim a little bit more.

So but Gills' Creek is a major and very important waterway in that.

So it's wonderful that it's just getting cleaner and cleaner and cleaner for little children, the snakes or anybody else.

<Terasa> You have the best stories, I swear.

<Amanda> Well, it was fun.

We had a real good time doing it, and we were barefooted and all that kind of stuff.

Well, Terasa, our wonderful people at home sometimes send you things to share, and we so appreciate Gardens of the Week.

<Terasa> Thank you.

It has become so much fun.

I look forward to receiving the photographs and they come in all sorts of ways.

Generally you'll see that we say Call for Gardens of the Week on our Facebook page, but I also get emails, as well.

So let's take our virtual field trip.

Today, we begin outside the borders of South Carolina in Matthew's North Carolina.

Emma Jo McGee shared a colorful planting that she says has a lot of bee activity, and it just so happens that Emma Jo is a Mecklenburg County master gardener, volunteer.

<Amanda> Cool.

<Terasa> From Florence.

Deborah F Moses sent in the detailed artwork of one of the Orb Weavers.

It's hard to capture a good photograph of a spider web, but Deborah did a great job.

From Susan Crow, a magnificent sunset scene at Hopsewee Plantation.

Betty Young shared a patch of old fashioned garden mums.

From Batesburg- Leesville, Mae Fox has lightning rod plants that were grown from the seeds provided by Dr. John Nelson, and her daughter sent them in for us to see currently flowering.

And then we wrap up with Barbara S. Gibson, who sent us a bottlebrush buckeye, whose fall leaves are a beautiful golden yellow.

Thanks to everyone for sharing your photos.

We enjoy them.

There were - there is always more submissions than we can show on air, so you're welcome to visit our Facebook page and just look in the comments and you'll see all the photos there.

<Amanda> Well, that's just wonderful.

That was so much fun.

Thank you.

From the seeds that John mailed to people.

I don't know if they even had to send a self addressed - <Terasa> I think that was the only requirement.

<Amanda> Yeah, because stamps are - The post office does a wonderful job, but you do have to pay everybody to carry all that mail around.

All, right.

Okay.

Well, Terasa, can we try to help one of our viewers, please?

<Terasa> We can try to help Anthony in Lexington.

And so you were talking about edible foods.

This is an edible question.

Anthony said some of our onions appear stained and he sent a photograph.

He said there's no odor.

The onions feel firm and it doesn't seem to be progressing.

Do you have any suggestions?

<Amanda> Oh, so I guess these were in the pantry or something, maybe.

Is that kind of what we think?

<Terasa> It didn't come with any additional information.

Just the photograph in that little description.

So I would assume that the onions were stored somewhere, a dry storage, like a pantry, a drawer.

<Amanda> Well, Rob, I mean, onions aren't real expensive, but you don't want to throw things away if you don't have to.

What's going on?

<Rob> That's correct.

It sounds like it could be a post-harvest fungal disease called black rot.

<Amanda> Black rot.

<Rob> Yes.

So it's very common that you find black rot on onions.

It's more common where the onions are grown in very dry conditions.

So out in California.

<Amanda> Come on.

<Rob> Now, what happens is the fungus requires 6 to 12 hours of free moisture.

So in our humid environments, that's going to provide free moisture on the surface of the bulb, allowing fungal pathogen to attack and generate that sort of black discoloration on the onion ball.

One of the ways we can manage it is to keep our onions in a very dry environment, and a temperature below 59 Fahrenheit will tend to help prolong that shelf life.

It's difficult to achieve.

(Amanda laughs) The other option is to use our, use our produce as quickly as we possibly can and keep it as fresh as possible.

<Amanda> Well, in the wintertime in my kitchen, where we don't know central heat, I could probably find a place for that, but anyway.

Well, the ones that he has, could he just cut and take the first couple of layers off the onion?

You see how deep the rot is actually going on?

Yes.

Remove that material and you should be okay.

<Amanda> Okay.

So he can have... <Rob> They tend not to produce anything that's going to be too nauseous <Amanda> Okay.

<Rob> So it really is just a discoloration.

<Amanda> Okay.

Well, that was good to know.

Thank you so much.

<Rob> My pleasure.

<Amanda> All right, Terasa.

<Terasa> Well, it's always exciting when we have botanists on the show.

And one question I've been thinking about is fall color, especially how some years we seem to have particularly vibrant colors, and then the other years it seems more drab or dull.

So maybe Dr. Herrick Brown could help us out with that.

<Amanda> Okay.

Well, I think some of it is cool, but you need some rain and then cool, cool nights or something <Dr.

Herrick> Cooler temperatures.

Generally, the adaptation that plants have to drop their leaves is actually sort of a stress induced reaction.

So deciduous trees tend to prepare for winter and drier conditions and that's one of the reasons they drop them.

But getting to that fall color aspect of it, those colors are always there throughout the season.

It's just that- <Amanda> The green covers them up.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah, there's so much green there.

You don't see it.

<Amanda> It's just so exciting to talk about.

>> Yeah, yeah.

<Amanda> Green.

<Amanda> So but it's obviously got a lot of valuable nutrients in it for the plant, and so the plant recycles those by breaking down the chlorophyll, bringing it back into its system and the less valuable pigments are left behind.

<Amanda> They break it down and bring it back in for next year.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

<Amanda> Wow!

Goodness.

Well, you're like me, I think you stop on the side of the road sometimes.

Do you have any examples of fall color for us?

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

We've got a couple of cool things here.

You might see this if you're traveling interstates or back roads through parts of the Sandhills, and sometimes you get a real treat with this one.

This is a plant that is in our area, at least, it's dioecious, meaning you'll have males and female plants.

Of course, the female plants are the only ones that produce fruit, but they both produce a nice fall color, and this is our native persimmon, Diospyros virginiana <Amanda> And it's in the ebonac- <Dr.

Herrick> Ebenaceae.

Yeah.

It gives us real dark woods.

<Amanda> It used to be used, I think, in the piano keys, the black keys.

And I think it's fun because I'm not like y'all.

I'm not real good at identifying things, but usually the leaves will have black spots on them.

Then I remember Ebony But it has a cool fruit.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah, very cool fruit.

And as you know, as the seasons progressed and those fall leaves fall to the ground, the female trees will be left sort of bare with these orange fruits dangling for a little bit.

It almost looks perfect in time for our fall seasons, like Halloween or Thanksgiving, that sort of thing.

It looks almost like a bunch of little orange pumpkins hanging off these branches on the side of the road.

<Amanda>-if I ate one of those I would make a face that looked like Halloween.

<Dr.

Herrick> Usually.

I thought the rule of thumb was that you want to wait until the first frost, or when these things are so ripe, they just fall to the ground.

<Amanda> I've heard when they fall to the ground.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

Because otherwise they will make you pucker.

<Amanda> But in Asia they have persimmons and what do you?

So they have- they self fertile.

I mean you don't have to have male ones and female ones.

<Dr.

Herrick> Right.

<Amanda> And these can get softer, but some of them are non astringent, and you can actually.

Oh, they're just wonderful.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

<Amanda> And so, Rob, we have a hard time growing apples <Rob> Absolutely <Amanda> in a lot of the state?

<Rob> Yeah.

<Amanda> And I just think people should grow these non-astringent Asian pers-.

<Rob> They make a really nice addition to the landscape, plus being edible as well and absolutely full of vitamins and minerals.

So really good for you.

<Amanda> Well, they sure taste good.

That I think, that's kind of fun.

And they don't seem to have big seeds in them, and I wonder why that is.

<Dr.

Herrick> You know, I don't know.

They have multiple seeds per fruit.

<Amanda> Oh, so they're just not... <Dr.

Herrick> Not a pit fruit.

<Amanda> Okay.

So it's not like an apple.

Exactly.

But it sure is crispy like an apple.

And, And aren't they pretty?

<Dr.

Herrick> Very cool.

<Amanda> Yeah.

Okay.

Well, do we have some more leaves?

Yeah, it looks like we've got something in.

Well, let's see.

This is winged sumac.

This is something that you'll see on the side of the road as well.

And you can see it gets some real bright red colors.

<Amanda> It's pretty.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

And usually when you see this, you'll see it in, like, patches.

It tends to be what we call a clonal plant.

So it'll tend to spread by rhizomes.

So usually where there's one, there's a whole bunch and it'll make a nice kind of big pop of red color in the fall.

<Amanda> And it's got a, a fruit.

Or seed pod?

<Dr.

Herrick> It's another one.

Yeah.

So it has this kind of complex flower stalk with a bunch of little tiny little fruits on it that all have these what we'd call glandular hairs.

<Amanda> Uggh <Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

And if you touch them, they're real sticky, but you can actually break off that whole stalk and soak it in some ice water.

And in a few minutes, you'll have really nice tasting pink lemonade.

<Amanda> Come on.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

<Amanda> Well, I'm going to stop on the way home.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

Go for it.

<Amanda> That's just wonderful!

And it's called winged, I think, because- Tell us about why it's called winged, Herrick.

<Dr.

Herrick> So what we're looking at here is a what we'd call a compound leaf.

It's got multiple parts to it.

And these little parts along the rachis, which is this... <Amanda> You call it stem?

<Dr.

Herrick> -stem of the leaf that extends through the whole structure, has these little dilated or flattened parts that look almost like a small leaf in between it.

And that's the wing.

<Amanda> The wing.

Okay, well, that's really pink lemonade.

I can't wait.

Terasa, I'd bet you tried it.

<Terasa> I haven't.

but I was just talking to someone recently about how the sumacs are so pretty in the fall, but I don't really see them planted kind of ornamentally, and I wish that they would be included more in the home landscape.

Great wildlife value as well.

So the native bees, honey bees provides nesting material places for insects that utilize I mean, just I love it.

<Amanda> I think the one in the upstate, down here, I like to say things are drying, but the seed pod or whatever, the the fruit seed here doesn't stay real pretty, but the one in the upstate I think stays upright and it's more showy.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

You might be a smooth sumac, a little bit larger cousin of this one.

<Amanda> Yeah.

Okay.

Well, what else have we got?

I think this is... <Dr.

Herrick> Oh, yeah, this is gorgeous.

So this is sassafras.

<Amanda> Oh!

<Dr.

Herrick> And you can recognize it pretty easily because it'll always have three different shapes to the leaves.

And this one has a lot that have sort of these three lobes on it.

When I was growing up, I was always told that there was one that looked like a mitten, one that looked like a glove, and the other one looked like <Amanda> just a regular leaf.

<Dr.

Herrick> A sock puppet.

I don't know.

(laughing) <Dr.

Herrick> So anyway, variable shapes to the leaves, gorgeous red color.

You can also recognize it because the stem tends to be bright green.

So it's a real good contrast.

<Amanda> Wow!

>> Yeah.

Something else to enjoy about it.

<Dr.

Herrick> Right.

And I think historically the root system of this was used to make root beer.

<Amanda> Or you could make something out of it.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

<Amanda> I think now my aunt used to give it to us at Halloween, but I think now they said there's something in it.

But I've seen one commercially offered that apparently they've taken whatever, you're not supposed to drink a lot of it out of it, but, and it's pretty tasty.

And you know, I never see big ones.

<Dr.

Herrick> This is another species that, in my experience tends to be clonal so, I usually see it in small patches and the largest I've ever seen is probably about 20 feet or so and only a few inches in diameter.

But I hear there's some larger ones that have been recorded.

<Amanda>Terasa, I think you were looking something up for us.

Did you come up with something that can get bigger?

<Terasa> I did.

The largest one was in Kentucky and unfortunately I don't... <Amanda> In Oconee County, you said there was one, And I think I wrote what you told me.

Do you remember what you said about it?

<Terasa> I do not, but that so but it's a good opportunity to talk about state champions and national champion trees.

So within the state, they'll log large specimens of trees and call it the state champion.

And then there's also a national process as well.

And you can look up both online.

It's kind of pretty interesting.

I don't know.

I did a whole presentation once about state state champion trees for Arbor Day.

<Amanda> Okay, well, you should start- Maybe you could do that as a Tree of the Week for a while but you, I think you told me I wrote it down, the one in South Carolina is 49 feet tall, and 70 inches around.

That's pretty big.

<Dr.

Herrick> That's remarkable.

<Terasa> That sounds right.

<Dr.

Herrick>I can see why that qualified for a champion.

<Terasa> Since we were talking, I was able to pull up.

This was from a PBS lesson plan, I believe.

The world's largest sassafras tree is apparently in Owensboro, Kentucky, and is about 60 feet tall, over 23 feet in circumference and believed to be 250 to 300 years old.

<Amanda> Goodness.

<Dr.

Herrick> Wow.

<Amanda> So, Herrick, maybe we can talk to some foresters and try to find out why we don't, other reasons besides the fact that you said they tend to be clonal, why we don't have bigger ones sitting around.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

Yeah.

Interesting.

<Amanda> Anyway, they sure are pretty.

Okay, and then one of my favorite things in the fall, and this isn't a great example of it.

(laughs) <Dr.

Herrick> This looks like one leaflet, from one of our hickory species and the hickory tree is again, this is, this would be a part of a compound leaf.

You might have 5 to 7 of these on a single leaf, but you can kind of see, it's a little pass it's prime, but usually when they first start turning, it's just this gorgeous yellow golden color.

<Amanda> Whew!

<Dr.

Herrick> And when you walk underneath the trees, after all the leaves have fallen, you get that beautiful hickory smell like smoked foods.

<Amanda> Oh, yeah, like cooking out on the grill.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

So it's a really neat, neat tree.

<Amanda> And then for wildlife, you get the nuts.

<Dr.

Herrick> Wildlife.

Yep.

<Amanda> Yes, cause we can't... Well, I mean that I can't eat them.

I used try to smash them and I did just smash.

<Dr.

Herrick> It's a lot of work.

<Amanda> But I'm sure some things get in them and find them very, very nourishing.

>> Yeah.

At my parents house they have a few in their driveway and it's always a bit of a hazard to travel when the squirrels are denuding the branches of the fruits.

(Amanda laughs) <Amanda> Oh cause they <Dr.

Herrick> They just drop them and...Yeah!

<Amanda> And we don't often think of oaks as being.

But I think this is a beautiful color.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah, this is a pretty nice one.

This is a species that we might see more frequently in bottomland riverine systems, and this is called overcup oak, which also has a really interesting acorn, as well.

But a nice kind of like light tan color to the upper surface of the leaf.

And then on the underside, it's just pretty dramatic.

You have this.

<Amanda> Whew.

<Dr.

Herrick> Contrasting light color with really dark venetian.

<Amanda> That is handsome.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

So it stands out and you can see this, you know, from several feet away.

<Amanda> Sure.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

And then, Rob, I guess you have been in the United States long enough to know that the dogwoods traditionally were one of the things that we thought were just so beautiful.

<Rob> Absolutely.

<Amanda> And then they seem to be declining.

And I think it's probably just I mean, in some places there some diseases.

But I think just overall, things just don't seem to be going well with them.

<Rob> I think some of it is also that we tend to plant them in the wrong place.

We assume that dogwoods are going to want full sun and they're actually part of the understory canopy and woodlands anyway, so they need that little bit more shade.

<Amanda> And as things get hotter and more stressful, that makes it worse if you're standing out in the full sun.

<Rob> Absolutely.

<Amanda> And also, when they're an understory tree, they can have such a beautiful loose aspect to them.

And in the sun they look kind of like a lollipop.

It's not that I don't like lollipops, but I'm sure you enjoyed seeing those when you first got here.

And it's still nice to see them in this right place.

<Rob> Absolutely.

The right plants in the right place can look really good.

And I do like to see the dogwoods in their native woodlands as well, just as that understory canopy tree.

<Amanda> We're going to Sal's Ol' Timey Feed and Seed and we just had a wonderful time visiting and learning about things from Sal.

♪ guitar music ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ (tractor engine) <Amanda> I'm in Columbia talking to Sally Sharp at Sal's Ol' Timey Feed and Seed.

<Sallie> Yes.

Hi.

How you doing?

<Amanda> I'm good.

but they're really isn't anything old timey about what goes on out here.

There's a lot of people learning stuff.

Interestingly, I think this is family property.

>> Yes, we're the eighth generation, my niece and nephews going to be the ninth generation on the property.

<Amanda> Isn't that fun?

and one thing is you said, when y'all were growing up, y'all grew a lot of your own food, and so you kind of want people to know that that's something they can do.

<Sallie> Yes.

and you don't have to have a large acreage to do it.

We grow a lot of stuff in pots and containers.

Yes, raised beds.

<Amanda> and this potato tower is the craziest thing.

I mean, you've got...you seem to love potatoes, and you got them growing everywhere.

but you improvise with anything you come across.

<Sallie> We do.

Nothing is trash around here.

If we can plant something in it, It stays around.

(laughing) <Amanda> And when the Irish potatoes finish, then you go in and plant sweet potatoes, I think, don't you?

<Sallie> Um, yeah, so Irish potatoes are cool weather crops where sweet potatoes are hot, hot, hot.

<Amanda> Yeah, they're not.

<Sallie> No, it loves July, August, when we're dying of heatstroke.

They're growing big time.

<Amanda> And everybody loves to grow tomatoes, and you said you've done well, with containers in there.

You've got some tips for people.

<Sallie> Yes, the main thing is to feed it, feed it feed it.

A lot of people plant and then don't ever come back and fertilize with anything.

We use organic fertilizers, and then we also have a way that we make our own fertilizer.

<Amanda> and then you said a lot of people say oh, I want heirlooms, but it's not good to only plant an heirloom because they're a little picky.

<Sallie> Yes, heirlooms have a tell people a plus, plus taste but you don't get as much off of them.

The hybrids are very prolific, and we've got some that I would give an A to as far as taste wise.

<Amanda> You like which one?

I think... <Sallie> The Amelia.

It does really good around here.

It's very, very prolific, and I think everybody knows around July, August, your tomatoes are going to start kind of peering out.

It's a good time to replant at that point, but your Amelia tomato is going to have about 55 to 60 tomatoes on one bush, and then it's gone peter out then, but then it's time to replant.

<Amanda> There you go, and then you do have high tunnels and explain to people what a high tunnel is.

<Sallie> So a high tunnel is for extending the season.

So it's for being able to start early, and then have your crops go in later.

So we had peppers, tomatoes, moringa trees, all growing in there until that real deep freeze that we had in December, which is not very usual here.

<Amanda> And...because you don't provide any supplemental heat, it just stays warmer because it's covered?

<Sallie> It - well, during the night time is going to be the exact same temperature as outside, but the ground temperature stays warm, and that's important.

Now we did put some propane heaters in there last year, when it got really cold for a few hours, and we had to time it because you know propane is expensive.

So I would be up like at 12 in the morning when the temperature started going down and set it and then come back down about you know, three or four hours later and cut it back off, <Amanda> You'd think a farmer could sleep at night.

<Sallie> No, not at all.

It's a 24/7 <Amanda> And you've got it on a slope, I think for a purpose.

<Sallie> Yes.

Two things, that way we can collect the rainwater off of it.

The rainwater is a pure water so it doesn't put any heavy metals into when you grow your crops, and also that way we're...letting the land do what it wants to do and the water still runs off exactly the same and we're not having to just go in and tear up the property.

<Amanda> And you have the funniest thing, these bottles and bottles sitting up there full of weeds.

What the heck is going on?

<Sallie> Yes, so that's how we make our own fertilizer.

So if you think about it, a plant is a chemical reaction.

It's bringing all the calcium now nitrogen, phosphorus, heavy minerals, all the minerals back out of the ground.

So if you're pulling up your weeds, you're pulling all that stuff up.

So instead of throwing it away, we put it in some water and add a little yeast to it, and let it sit for three days and just feed it back to the plants.

And it works amazing.

You ought to see what we can grow.

You've seen it.

<Amanda> Yeah, it was really fun, but that was just crazy.

<Sallie> It was a little stinky, but it works.

(laughs) <Amanda> It was a little smelly.

And down in that area, you have some perennial crops, I think.

<Sallie> Yes, we do.

So we have sunchokes.

Sunchokes.

Not too many people know about it, but it's a native plant.

It's a type of sunflower, but their good for the roots, and as you can see, they're really starting to bloom right now when the bees need that extra nectar where everything else is kind of stopping due to the weather change.

<Amanda> And I call them artichokes, because we make artichoke pickle.

<Sallie> You do.

Yes.

It's really good.

Now it's super important to harvest them at the right time.

So you want the tops to completely die.

Normally, that's the end of December.

You need to have a heavy frost.

If it gets - if they die back and then it gets hot again.

You don't want to eat them, because they will.

<Amanda> They'll give you gas.

<Sallie> Yes.

They'll give you gas.

(laughs) <Amanda> Weeds grow fast, but I think you've got a tree that maybe grows faster than the weeds.

<Sallie> Yeah.

So we had the moringa tree around here It's a real neat tropical tree and it has everything on it necessary...for life.

And when once it gets really hot, it can potentially grow six inches in 24 hours.

<Amanda> What do you mean it has everything on it?

<Sallie> So it's got calcium, It's got a complete all the amino acids.

It's got vitamin A, vitamin D, It's got everything in it.

<Amanda> So how do people prepare it or use it?

<Sallie> You can eat it raw?

You can dry it, you can make a tea out of it.

It's a really cool plant.

<Amanda> Gosh, more things to learn at Sal's <Sallie> Yes, exactly.

always learning.

<Amanda> You've got a compost pile, and I think that your nephew is in charge of kind of keeping that going.

<Sallie> He is.

He's chief in charge of manure.

Yes.

So he goes into the pasture with the tractor.

Cleans it up, brings it down here, and then Colton turns it as needed.

He's a big help around here.

<Amanda>And a little kid driving that tractor so expertly.

<Sallie> Yes, he's been doing it for a long time.

<Amanda> And then you, he turns to compost and it ends up just being a wonderful addition that you can use to top grass and all kinds of things.

<Sallie> Yeah.

So I tell people when your compost starts turning nice and black, that is fantastic.

That's a perfect home for your plants.

<Amanda> And then you've got animals here because education, you want people to see that there are animals and so what have you got that produces compost?

<Sallie> So we've got meals, and we've got donkeys and we also have a really old horse.

(laughs) <Amanda> And um, you said some people think that donkeys are just can take care of themselves, but I think they need some special care sometimes <Sallie> They do.

A lot of people think they can just get a donkey and put out in the pasture but they need their hooves cleaned.

They need proper grooming.

They got to stay at a good weight.

It's real easy to get them to fat, and that causes a lot of problem.

Okay.

<Amanda> And then mules...are just, are they stubborn?

<Sallie> Well, they aren't stubborn, but they're very, very smart.

So people tell.

There's a phrase that says you've got to treat a mule the way you're supposed to treat a horse.

So they will not let you be lazy on training.

(laughing) <Amanda> And that also, we've got these incredible birds.

<Sallie> Yes.

So one of the biggest things we do on the farm are white dove releases, and the white dogs are actually homing pigeons.

There's some people that think when you let the doves go, they just die, and that's it.

These birds are trained to come home upon release.

<Amanda> and...so you put different colored bands on them, according to how many times they've come back.

You've got some that are wearing the band, because they come back 50 times <Sallie> I do.

so once they come back about 50 times, from 10 to 15 miles or more, they'd get a white band.

That's pretty cool.

<Sallie> Yes.

<Amanda> And so a lot of people like to come and take advantage of that opportunity, because funerals or weddings and things like that they weren't happy to happen.

<Sallie> Exactly.

<Amanda> Lift your spirits <Sallie> Yes, and they're an ancient animal.

From the dawn of time, just about people been letting them go as messenger pigeons.

So yes, they're very amazing.

<Amanda> Then we have fresh eggs available here, and I think you've got a bunch of chickens.

<Sallie> We've got a lot of chickens and a one of the most interesting chickens we have are the Indian jungle fowl It's pretty much a wild chicken, just about the first chicken that was ever around.

<Amanda> And inside the store, you offer a lot of seeds, heirloom seeds and things like that.

<Sallie> We do.

So, we have a lot of different seeds, we have a cold room where we keep them down at 40 degrees.

So you can always know your seeds are nice and fresh and you can produce some great crops with them.

<Amanda> And people, since you're involved in education, sometimes you have classes out here, and then also you if people want to do this, you make a box that people can subscribe to, and they get it every month or two with thinks they can plant.

<Sallie> Yeah, so a lot of people don't know in South Carolina, is you can grow year round.

So there's something all the time to grow in South Carolina.

So that box has gotten the directions, online helps, and the seeds, bulbs and different things that you can plant within that month.

<Amanda> That's so much fun, because then a family and since you've told us, we can do so many things in containers, a family has a way to start getting their children excited about the land and understanding everything.

<Sallie> Exactly, because children will eat what they grow, and what you grow is so much more tasty than what you get in the store, because it's...you're planting it within the season without a lot of heavy chemicals on it.

Yeah, so yes, <Amanda> And you have school groups come sometime, and we got to see a darling little batch of them, and you give them little things because you want them to learn that there's a place for everything in nature.

So these children, that some of the things you'd like for them to protect, and not be scared of.

<Sallie> So, on the farm, you're liable to see bats if you're here at night.

You might come across a snake, frogs and all these animals are beneficial.

A lot of people try to kill them, but we need to live in harmony with them and learn about them and we stress the importance of the kids not touching the animals.

Don't touch wild animals, but respect them and don't kill them.

So I'm hoping that they're going to spread the word and more people will start protecting the environment.

<Amanda> Well Sal, I think you're one person who's trying to make the world a better place.

<Sallie> Thank you.

<Amanda> I really do.

And if people want to find out more about you.

Do you have a website or what's the best way to find out?

<Sallie> Yeah, so Sal's local seed.com You can sign up for our newsletter and find out when to grow and different classes we have.

We have homesteading classes, all kinds of different things.

<Amanda> Well, I want to thank you for letting us come today.

<Sallie> Oh, thank you so much.

It's been a delight.

♪ ♪ >> What a delightful time.

And now you know more about artichokes that we grow in South Carolina that we were talking about earlier, earlier to make that wonderful artichoke relish.

Well, hats, hats, hats, of course, my dear friend Ann Nolte when I called her, she said, oh, there's not much in the garden.

Well, there was lots of stuff in the garden.

Then I stopped on the side of the road and got this purple one.

Is that the one I'm touching?

And, you know, I used to always think that was ageratum or whatever.

But Herrick, I think actually this is some kind of native blue mist or something.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

I always thought it was ageratum too, but, no the scientific name is Conoclinium coelestinum.

<Amanda> That's a big name.

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

Yeah.

And my students have learned it.

So anyone can learn it now, but it's a gorgeous one that's blooming right about now.

And you see it on the side of the road and it is pretty hardy.

It's one that I would like to see more in you know, home landscapes.

<Amanda> Is this a native or one that's been introduced to... <Dr.

Herrick> I've considered it native.

Don't hold me to that.

<Amanda> And where I see it, Terasa even if it's in a dry area, it seems to kind of be at the bottom of the ditch.

Is that kind of what you've heard about it maybe?

<Terasa> Yes.

Yes.

And it is known for spreading.

And so sometimes people are not always appreciative of that in their home landscape.

So I, too, I just plan for it.

If you'd like to be intentional where you include it.

<Amanda> Okay and anyway.

Then the white aster they're just- Are there are a lot of fall white asters?

<Dr.

Herrick> This is the big time for anything in the Sunflower family in our area.

Usually the fall is when all of them come out and so you'll see whites and blues.

<Amanda> Some of them have a little blue tinge to them.

Don't they?

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah yeah.

Sometimes the little center will be a slightly different color.

<Amanda> And then this thing, which is just everywhere and you said is this I call it dog fennel, but is this an aster, too?

<Dr.

Herrick> It's in the Sunflower family.

>> It is?

<Dr.

Herrick> Yeah.

>> Okay.

>> And then Goldenrod, also <Dr.

Herrick> Goldenrod also.

So and you would see the dog fennel and goldenrods growing in the same sort of open, lots of times power line rights of ways or cleared roadsides and sometimes where the feet are wet for some time of the year, that's where these things will show up.

<Amanda> Anyway, I guess somebody enjoys visiting them, don't you suppose, Terasa?

<Terasa> I would imagine so.

And just as you're holding it there, I'm thinking what nice filler it could be in an arrangement, don't you think?

It's got a nice texture.

(Amanda laughs) <Amanda> I hadn't thought about that.

<Terasa> Just because it grows on the side of the road doesn't mean we can't appreciate it.

<Rob> It's definitely got that feathery appearance.

<Amanda>...when you just see a mass of it hanging over and I'm sure you see plenty of it out on your travels.

Yeah, but you're right, Terasa.

It would work just fine for that.

<Terasa> I don't know how well it holds up, but... <Amanda> Well, it only needs to hold up for a day, as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah.

Okay.

Oh, fall.

Glorious fall.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Do you all have fall in England?

<Rob> Yes, absolutely.

I mean, we tend to refer to it more as autumn and fall, but yeah, we do.

when we were growing up, I remember watching the changes of the leaves and the change of the seasons.

<Amanda> What are some of, what are some of the trees that are known for their beautiful fall color there?

<Rob> Certainly the oaks and ash would really be the most striking.

Yeah.

On some of the native English, English maples, as well.

<Amanda> Wow, okay!

Thanks so much.

We forgot about that.

I read maples are pretty too, aren't they?

<Dr.

Herrick> Absolutely.

<Amanda> Yeah.

All right.

Well, Terasa.

<Terasa> Well, we've been talking about fall, and one of the things we associate with fall are cooler temperatures.

So this is a perfect question from Anna in Cayce.

Anna would like us to explain the difference between frost and freeze.

<Amanda> My goodness.

Well, sometimes we say that you want to eat your collards after the first frost, but I think they're good any time, but how would you just differentiate?

<Rob> Okay, so this is what I'm trying to train myself with as well.

<Amanda> Okay.

<Rob> So a frost is a short term event.

Usually characterized by that white rind, that you see.

So a frost can happen, a temperature when air temperatures are 36 or below.

So, not necessarily freezing air temperatures <Amanda> I thought it had to be 32.

<Rob> And what's happening as air cools it can't hold as much moisture so you get that condensation in the spring and summer time we'd see that as dew as we lose temperature out of the ground, that was when it freezes and can cause a frost.

<Amanda> How about that?

So...the air can that makes perfect sense because it can hold less moisture and so it's going to drop it on the ground.

And so in the summer it's dew, which would, yeah.

<Rob> So that's why you can often come outside in the morning, the air temperature feels okay.

<Amanda> Yeah?

<Rob> And you'll have that little film of frost on, on vehicles or on the grass.

<Amanda> Yeah.

<Rob> So that would be frost.

<Amanda> Okay.

<Rob> A freeze is where the air temperature gets below 32 Fahrenheit.

<Amanda> Oh!

>> And usually for a prolonged period of time.

So hours rather than minutes.

<Amanda> Okay... <Rob> Okay?

Typically and you can have a freeze without a frost.

So very dry air will cool more quickly than moist air leading to the freeze event that becomes much more much more damaging potentially.

The freeze frost formation can actually act as a little bit of a degree of protection for plants, and if you look at the commercial world, we tend to use irrigation on soft fruits to create a thin layer of liquid water around that flower, to protect it, to keep it above freezing.

<Amanda> So do they have to have it keep going.

<Rob> Yes.

<Amanda> You don't just, you don't just get it wet and leave it.

You have to <Rob> You start when temperatures are about 40 degrees, depending on dew point as well, because the dew point will have an impact on it.

<Amanda> All right.

>> And what we do is pump water immediately as it starts to hit 40 degrees and carry on.

until you're out of that... <Amanda> So, all night long.

<Rob> Yes.

<Amanda> It's probably mostly... <Rob> Yes.

>> Really?

<Rob> Yeah.

>> Goodness.

<Amanda> So you've got to have overhead irrigation and do you?

Golly, that's a lot for people.

<Rob> That's a lot of water.

It works very well for soft fruit where the value of the crop can justify that.

We can also look at using floating row covers, blankets, In fact.

Now one thing to remember with those is make sure you keep them off the foliage and keep them tight.

<Amanda> Oh!

<Rob> Any wind movement won't disturb those road covers and can lead to that sort of beating and bruising effect to a lot of plant leaves, which can cause a lot of damage.

And obviously if you've got a blanket over the top, you may have that formation of very cold fabric that can cause.

more damage...<Amanda> So it needs to be elevated?

<Rob> Yes.

>> Yeah.

Okay.

Gosh, you know, I don't think we thank our growers enough for the huge efforts they make to give us all these beautiful fruits and vegetables.

<Rob> Absolutely.

>> Yeah.

Okay.

Well, Terasa?

<Terasa> I had the chance to visit Gills Creek Watershed Association in the Columbia area and learn about a project that they undertook to alleviate some flooding.

You'll remember back in 2015 there was major flooding.

It almost wiped a building off of its foundation.

And that really was kind of the tipping point for getting this project going.

So let's take a look.

♪ <Terasa> Throughout the state and across the country, you'll find groups of dedicated individuals who are working to conserve and protect our natural resources.

One example is the Gills Creek Watershed Association.

Today, we're learning more with their executive director, Bailey Slice Parker.

Bailey, thanks so much for taking a little bit of time to explain about the Gills Creek Watershed Association.

And before we get started, we really need to go back to the beginning.

What exactly is a watershed and specifically Gills Creek watershed?

>> I'm so glad you asked.

What is a watershed?

So simply put, we can think of a watershed as just a precipitation catchment where wherever it rains, the water all drains down into one single body of water.

<Terasa> And we all live in a watershed?

>> We do.

So a watershed can be as small as your backyard or even as large as the Mississippi River watershed, which covers like 40% of the contiguous United States.

<Terasa> What about Gills Creek Watershed?

Is it a relatively large area?

<Bailey> It is relatively large, especially since it's based on a creek.

So the Gills Creek watershed starts up around the Sesquicentennial State Park area just north of that, and goes all the way down through Forest Acres, through the city of Columbia, into the Congaree River.

So it covers a lot of area.

<Terasa> Now, we're at a very particular location.

This is a location of a restoration project, the Crowson Road Restoration Project.

What was the motivation behind this project?

<Bailey> So initially, this project was in our watershed management plan.

So the Gills Creek Watershed Association came up with a plan of priority projects and places that could use restoration and this was in that plan and had been for many years.

But the particular thing that changed was the flood of 2015.

<Terasa> Oh my goodness, such devastation in many places with that tremendous flooding.

And it really did have an impact in this local area.

But on the bright side of things, it has led to this improvement project.

<Bailey> Yes, it really made this a priority, not just for the community residents, but for the Gills Creek Watershed Association, City of Columbia and Richland County.

They really championed moving this project to the top of the list and putting the funding behind it that was needed to make it happen.

<Terasa> Fantastic.

So we know a little bit of the why.

Let's talk about the what.

So, you've shared some information with me.

I believe there's kind of five benefits or goals associated with this.

So we'll kind of run through those, starting with encouraging native vegetation.

<Bailey> Native plants are so important and for so many reasons.

The native plants that we used in this project were plants that would have evolved here in this space over millions of years.

So firstly, they're equipped to handle being inundated under flood or to handle times of drought, extreme heat, as we can see today.

<Terasa> Yes, I think we picked the hottest day of the year.

<Bailey> We certainly did.

But also they evolved with the insects and the wildlife that depend on them for food.

So they serve dual purposes.

<Terasa> You are right, lots of benefits.

And then another goal is going to be to stabilize the banks along the creek and the there is a pretty decent sized slope here, and without protection, it's going to wash into the creek.

<Bailey> So we use mechanical ways to stabilize and also the vegetation itself.

So nature based solutions are such an important aspect of this.

And one of those are the rocks that we're standing on.

So we incorporate rocks into the creek bank to slow water down and stop erosion, but we also use the plants themselves.

These native plants have roots that go deep into the ground.

The roots act as the rebar and they really stabilize the soil.

<Terasa> How would a good analogy like the rebar within human built structure.

<Bailey> Exactly.

They really serve same purpose.

<Terasa> And as you mentioned, even though there are kind of five overarching goals, we're getting multiple benefits from the different things that have been implemented.

So these rock structures are also slowing down the water and that less velocity means less chance it's going to move that soil down into the creek.

Now, along with that storm water runoff, we see bacteria levels that become a problem.

In fact, bacteria pollution is the number one reason that our streams are impaired in South Carolina.

So what are we doing here to work on that?

<Bailey> So here we have slowed the water down somewhat.

So in these particular rock shoots, we have these steps where the water hits each individual step and slows down.

But probably what the viewers can't see is that there are gaps and there are smaller rocks incorporated into the back sides of these steps.

As the water flows down, it is allowed to infiltrate into the soil where our soil, microbes and fungus and native plants can actually filter that water.

So it adds to the groundwater as pure, cleaner water as opposed to just going immediately into the creek and becoming potentially flood water and also polluted with bacteria.

<Terasa> So we're helping helping those natural processes to occur, even though this is a man-made structure and slowing that water down, allowing it time to infiltrate, which is also going to have a benefit with reducing some flooding because we're not having that go directly into this creek where it could cause that water level to rise.

<Bailey> Yes, As you as we talked earlier, we are in a developed urbanized spot.

So everywhere around us is covered in pavement and impervious surfaces.

<Terasa> That's a fancy term.

We might need to talk a little bit about.

<Bailey> Non-Porous So porous surfaces allow the water to infiltrate, allow it to seep in.

The impervious surfaces, just wash the water right off.

So it immediately goes right to the creek.

If the creek rises, we have a flood.

<Terasa> Yes.

And that can be dangerous.

<Bailey> Absolutely.

<Terasa> Very dangerous for us.

So there are so many motivating factors that lead to a project like this that we also need to mention.

We want to encourage aquatic habitat.

>> Yeah.

<Terasa> So there are things that you have done to- There are some rock vein structures, I believe, that are kind of going to agitate that water, providing necessary oxygen for critters that live in the creek.

The rock veins agitate the water, so increase the oxygen level, but they also slow the water down and just having a little spot to hide behind for those macroscopic or microscopic little creatures just increases the diversity of the wildlife and the biology in our creek.

<Terasa> And even though we might not see things today, this creek is a corridor along which various forms of wildlife might travel, and why is that important?

Especially in our urbanized areas?

<Bailey> So we have so much space that's built up and urbanized and humans are taking up as much space as possible.

But within that urban space, we have the forest acres, the lakes, Arcadia lakes upstream of Phil's Creek, and then downstream of Gills Creek we have Congaree River and eventually Congaree National Park.

So the wildlife that could call these larger green spaces home can use Gills Creek Corridor as a way to travel safely without impacting humans or being impacted usually by humans in these spaces.

<Terasa> Now this project is it's relatively small scale in the grand scheme of things but would be large scale for an individual citizen, but I understand you, There are actions people can take like your Watershed Champion program.

<Bailey> Yeah, it can be overwhelming when you think about so many problems all at once.

So the best solution is to take small steps on an individual scale to make things better.

So we created our Watershed Champion program to show people exactly how to do that.

So for you and me, maybe we have already incorporated these healthy watershed aspects into our yards ourselves, the native plants, the impervious surfaces, maybe having a rain garden, and also providing food habitat and shelter for wildlife.

So the application to become a certified wildlife champion walks you through those steps and whenever you are certified, you can apply and get a sign that you hang in your yard and show your neighbors and your friends exactly what you're doing in your yard to help create a healthier watershed, and maybe they would be inspired to do the same.

<Terasa> Fantastic.

It really is, it can be overwhelming.

But there are so many things just an individual person can do and then collectively their efforts really make a difference.

Thank you so much for giving us just a little glimpse of the Gills Creek Watershed Association.

It's been enlightening, learning about your endeavors, and I wish you the best of luck as you continue through the future.

<Bailey> Thank you, Terasa.

It was an honor to speak with you.

♪ <Terasa> Human activities can have a negative impact on the way our environment functions.

However, it was so inspiring to visit with Bailey at Gills Creek Watershed Association and learn about the improvements being made to restore that original functionality.

<Amanda> Thank you, Terasa.

And you know, I pick up plastic in the grocery store parking lot because I hear that everything goes towards the ocean eventually.

And so, you know, we had that wonderful thing that Katie did, Altman did on the sea turtles getting plastic.

<Terasa> Oh, that's right.

>> And everybody should be involved in litter prevention.

And, you know, we can pick things up.

It doesn't have to be a person whose role in life professionally is collecting litter.

I mean, we can just bend over.

It's good for you.

<Terasa> Absolutely.

And those small actions collectively make a large impact.

<Amanda> Well, we hope so.

Rob, if it's going to be cold in your yard, if there's going to be a cold, you know, real bad frost coming, freeze coming, is there something you should do if you had some semi tender shrubs or something?

<Rob> Absolutely, Amanda.

You could certainly look at using natural woven fabrics like a sheep, for example, that's going to allow airflow through without causing that increase in humidity.

Just make sure that you keep the material very tight and away from the foliage.

>> Okay.

<Rob> If you look at the raw horticultural fleeces.

<Amanda> Don't put a tarp over it.

<Rob> Oh, no.

No, I wouldn't do plastic.

<Amanda> Okay.

<Rob> There are horticultural fleeces available.

That are weighted on the actual weight per square inch per square inch, I believe it is.

And typically about an ounce white fleece would be very effective at keeping most of our plants.

<Amanda> If it gets real sunny in the morning when it's real sunny when the temperature goes up, you want to take it off?

<Rob> Absolutely, yes.

Yeah.

<Amanda> Oh, goodness.

Well, thanks for that.

And thank you all for being with us.

We sure hope you'll come and join us next time.

Night, night.

♪ closing music ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife, educational programs and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the Midlands at large.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina.

Family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance and Boone Hall Farms.