<Narrator>: Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife, educational programs, and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the midlands at large.

Mcleod Farms in McBee, South Carolina family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance and Boone Hall Farms.

♪♪ Amanda: Welcome to Making It Grow.

We're coming to you from the South Carolina State Fair.

We are thrilled to be here and so glad you'll get to see a little bit of the fair.

We've tried to bring some things into make it seem fair like and my co-host Terasa Lott is here Teresa, thank you so much for being with us today and I see you have your handy microphone.

Terasa: I sure do.

It is always a pleasure to be a part of Making It Grow, and especially to be here with a live audience.

I'm looking forward to meeting some of them in just a little while and seeing if our panel can answer their questions.

Amanda: Well, I think we have a good panel to do that.

We have Dr. John Nelson, who was my field botany professor.

And we had such a good time with that class.

Dr. John: That was great.

That was one of the best classes that it was able to be a part of.

Amanda: But then, of course, Dr. John was at the USC Herbarium, which is The AC Moore Herbarium That's a wonderful herbarium that's still going on under your wonderful replacement.

Dr. John: My and my former student, Herrick Brown, is doing a great job.

<He sure is.> And I think and I bet that Herrick wants everybody to come around and visit the Herbarium.

Amanda: Whoa, you can go up there?

Dr. John: Oh, sure, you can call him first.

At this number: 803-777-8175.

Amanda: The only problem is you have to park.

Dr. John: Well, this is this week.

Spring Break.

Amanda: Anyway, it's not by the time you see this.

But um, anyway, it's worth the walk.

How about that?

Yeah.

A little bit.

Yeah, really?

Yes.

<Ride your bike.> Okay.

And Vicky Bertagnolli is a horticulture agent in Aiken, and then Vicky, you now help people HGIC?

<I do.> So why don't you tell people?

What HGIC?

Yes.

Vicky: so the Home and Garden Information Center.

It's a web site, where there's over 950 publications on there that has to do with home gardening, has to do with with health with food safety, but it goes beyond that.

So there's nine staff members there where we answer emails and phone calls.

Monday through Friday 8:00 AM to 4:30 PM every day.

Amanda: Okay, so if somebody wants to email you, what do they put?

Vicky: They can email us at "hgic@clemson.edu".

Amanda: Okay, and can they say call me back?

Vicky: they can, they can leave their number.

And we can call them back.

We just have to make sure that they know that we're gonna call them back.

Amanda: Okay, well, great.

All right.

Thank you, helping so many people in the state of South Carolina.

So many people are moving here and they don't know how to do anything.

And Adam Gore, who is a turf specialist, and he is in Sumter now, and so Adam has to tell them about they can't have what they wanted, what they had back home, sometimes.

Adam: It is a daily question of how can I take my northern grasses and bring them down here and somehow I have to let them down gently of it's not going to work that way.

But besides that, I do cover all consumer horticulture as well.

So I do dabble outside grass occasionally Somewhat.

Amanda: Will you do you?

I mean you said you like going out and seeing people and unfortunately sometimes you have to give them some bad diagnosis.

Adam: you know, everything in horticulture is give and take sometimes you make people really happy and other times you have to comfort them when you know, some things have to go.

Amanda: Yep when they have to cut something down.

Oh, goodness gracious.

Okay.

Well, Adam, thank you for coming and being with us today.

And I think you went out and did some shopping for us.

And we said, well, let's have some fair food.

Adam: Yeah.

Okay.

Dr. John and I, we got to walk around a little bit and we we've, I wouldn't say we argued but we had a very deep discussion of how do we explain why half the food is gone by the time we get back to the table?

Dr. John these french fries.

I mean, it was, it was a tough job.

Dr. John: It ended up being pretty messy.

Amanda: Well, one of the things we were thinking is a lot of the things that y'all have here are new world foods.

We thought that'd be kind of fun to talk about.

So why don't you start off with what you got down there.

Adam: So obviously we have not only the state fair classic but the fall Halloween classic.

We have the candied apple covered in peanuts, so actually get three different plant relations.

Obviously we have the the apple itself.

Can you pull of course I'm sorry.

So we have the apple with the rosacea a's and then we have the caramel you on pass and then we have a caramel which caramel comes from sugar, which oh, sugar cane.

Okay.

And then most interesting to myself being a native South Carolinian are the peanuts.

<Yeah.> Because boiled peanuts are South Carolina state snack food.

Vicky: In South Carolina we official state snack food.

Adam: We have a state official everything.

<Yes, we do.> So we're actually responsible.

South Carolina is responsible about four and a half percent of the nation's peanut production.

Producing around 280 million pounds of peanuts each year.

Amanda: Wow.

That's a lot of peanuts.

Adam: Top ten in the country.

Amanda: These are delicious, so when I was little, it seems like they were red when they dipped in but this is caramel.

This is delicious caramel.

Dr. John: Which is basically sugar.

Adam: Makes it all the better.

Amanda: Apples, John, apples that we go to North Carolina to get a lot because tardeo apples tell us about trying to go apples in most of the state.

Adam: So apples and a lot of fruit trees in general, and plants and thing.

But specifically in this situation, apple, a lot of them have a certain amount of chilling hours required for bud production.

And essentially, chilling hours selling with some are are what they sound like it's amount of time spent below is 40 degrees and stuff like that.

Dr. John: More like a chill out.

Adam: Right.

So because Southland were more of a temperate climate, we don't get the cold required for quality apple production, or for most of the variety of apples.

Amanda: they have like a little internal thermometer that actually keeps track of all that I think.

<Yes, yes, they do.> So the apples that we have up in North Carolina and a few places in South Carolina, Where did they come from?

Dr. John: Well, the genus malleus.

Contains all the apples of the world.

And apples are are widespread around the northern hemisphere as native species species.

Now the cultivated apple that we you know, that's on this stick.

These are their ancestral forms where, as I recall from economic botany, western Asia and Europe, okay, and then of course, we do have our native apple that grows here in South Carolina, the crab apples, which was a native species, Amanda: And I don't know if y'all have seen native crab apples, they are the most beautiful things in the world.

They have very delicate little pink flowers on them.

They smell great.

Yeah.

And then they and that doesn't get to be real big.

It's not a great big tree and I see them I've stopped on the side of the superhighway and cut them sometimes because the flowers are so pretty.

And then they do have little crab apples.

And um, you could do things with those.

Dr. John: And while they're good wildlife food.

Amanda: Yes they are.

Unfortunately, mine usually get cedar apple rust because I've got a beautiful cedar tree.

So cedar apple rust is when it decides to be itself.

It's real weird looking.

Vicky tell us.

Vicky: That looks like you'll see the fruit and depending on what stage you see it at it may have little white things growing out of it or it looks like it has, like tentacles growing out of it.

What the heck is that?

And it's it's an infection of either cedar apple rust or west or quick tap will relist there's a whole complex.

Yeah, yeah.

And it's one of the things where they've got host between cedar trees and apple trees and you know, it doesn't yes, it can be one miles away.

It doesn't even have to be close to it, it could be miles away, and it can be infected.

Amanda: And I think that up in north Carolina where they grow apples, they have cut a lot of the cedar trees down because that's a source of infection.

But um, but cedar trees are one of the most wonderful trees for wildlife.

And it's a shame that now they're always trying to bring something else in what's the one that they brought in that everybody planted, and then it got all these terrible infections in it.

Vicky: Leyland cypress.

So we've got a great fact sheet on Leyland cypress alternatives on the home and garden information.

Dr. John: we had to get rid of ours in the old house.

Amanda: Did you?

Dr. John has just moved from a place with a yard because he no longer has any pets.

So you've moved to an apartment, condo, condo all along, but you're downtown and you take lots of walks want you oh, yeah.

Okay, so we've got this.

So we have the peanut on it, which we go in South Carolina, we used to go them a lot in Virginia.

And all of a sudden, we started going down here did they just plant them too much, and the soil got pathogens in it or what happened Adam?

Adam: You can see when you plant the same crop year after year, you can see some disease development occur.

But specifically in South Carolina, it's finding alternative crops for previous stakeholders and the communities have failed.

So areas where tobacco production used to be big now we see it in peanuts and soybeans.

Okay, so it's just finding new ways to use fields are no longer producing.

Amanda: what used to be a pretty important crop.

<Right.> But now everybody's quit smoking, fortunately.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay.

So then Vicky, you've got in front of you, some?

Adam: Fried mushrooms?

Amanda: Is that what that is?

Fried mushrooms if you didn't hear?

Vicky: yeah, fried mushrooms, or, I mean, there's, there's lots of cultivated ones.

Well, there's not lots, there's a handful of cultivated ones.

But this is one of those things where we don't recommend that you forage for these.

And you have to be either trained, or like a mycologist to actually do these correctly and eat them out of the wild.

So we never ever recommend that you eat them out of the wild.

Amanda: Now, those are shantou morrell, which one is pretty easy to say.

Dr. John: oh, I'm not sure.

I think the best ones.

They're usually best ones come from Publix.

Vicky: Usually button mushrooms.

Yeah.

<Okay.

Well, those are delicious.

Yeah.> And then there's some that are used as meat alternatives.

There are some that tastes like seafood.

And so there's a lot of ways to use mushrooms.

And folks in their heads, a lot of times they won't eat them because they think they're slimy.

And they're not always like that.

It depends on how you prepare them.

It depends on what you're putting them in.

It depends on which one you're using, how you're cooking it, things like that.

And they can, they can really add a depth to your they do.

And I encourage people to try them in different ways.

Amanda: Edward made okra and tomatoes for supper last night.

And we had some mushrooms in a minute.

It's really easy to bring mushrooms home and then they get in the back of the fridge.

Right?

And then you find it and... Vicky: Then you forget about it.

Yeah, they're not so great.

And I get a soft brown right.

Amanda: But um, and so I put put them in there.

And I was I was looking at it when I was eating.

I had some today for lunch.

And I said well, what is this in here and then some mushrooms, but it's just as you said it gave it a depth because as good as okra tomatoes are... Vicky: It just gives it a little bit different dimension something extra.

I like the texture of them whenever you add them to a dish so... Dr. John: okay, how do you know we're talking about mushrooms, the fungi?

What are an important biological group that is not only its biology, but the economics of fungi.

Lots of food items, but also lots of disease causing organisms.

Now these don't cause diseases unless you eat too many.

And it's really interesting to know if you look at the evolution of fungi, these things are actually more closely related to animals than they are to plants currently.

Oh, yeah.

Okay.

And there's some other structural differences that they share more commonly with animals, animal cells and plants.

Vicky: oh, that's interesting.

We get phone calls about mushrooms and lawns, mushrooms on trees, you know, is this bad?

You know, can we eat it?

Things like that.

Like I said never ever recommend that you eat them.

But typically, whenever you see something like that mushrooms are doing a job.

Yes, they're they're recycling organic matter.

If they're out in the lawn, they're just they're doing that's what they do, it's where they live.

Adam: I mean, right now is the time of year when at least in the lawn situation you're going to start to see a lot of in pop up.

Because we do have when we have cold fronts come in at drops our humidity levels down, so it dries or ground out just a little bit.

So when we started getting rainfall come through, it pops the humidity back up.

And that sudden change of humidity and temperature causes the creation of what we see as mushrooms.

But most are actually just for fruiting parts of the mushroom itself.

So right now is the time of year.

If you're going to have mushrooms in your yard, you're going to see them.

Dr. John: This is sort of like the mushroom body to sort of the tip of the iceberg.

Because most of the mushroom is actually in strand form underneath the Amanda: ground, and can be widespread.

I mean, these arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi, I think can be miles long.

Is that right?

Yeah, yeah.

And then here we go.

And everybody loves the french fries at the fair.

And John, I think this is the potato.

A lot of people think it's from Ireland, because of the great tragedy that happened there.

But tell them where potatoes are really from?

Dr. John: well, I'll be happy to Amanda as a taste a few of these.

Amanda: Well, that will help you to figure out where they are from.

Dr. John: I think these are french fries.

Amanda: These actually came from the midway at the state fair.

Dr. John: Right outside.

So potato, the Irish the name Irish potato.

Unfortunately, Irish potato is something of a misnomer.

Because although they're grown in Ireland, they're certainly not from Ireland.

So they're actually from the Andes of South America.

So it's a new world species.

Amanda: And kind of a colder thing.

I mean, you think the Andes are really up there, and it's chilly.

It's not a tropical plant.

It's not like a sweet potato.

Dr. John: no, no.

No, they like it.

It's a temperate to cold kinda.

Anyway, the solanum tuberosum is the name of this tuber, okay.

And they wild form or were were just like gnarly, little potatoes that didn't amount to much.

But the natives of the Andes would cultivate these things for so long that they were able to select larger and larger and more nutritious ones.

And those are the ones that were discovered by Europeans that went back to Europe.

And that's how come they took off in Europe so well, and they're all over Europe as a as an important crop.

And that sort of answers the question of where do they where do they come from, they ended up all over the place, including Ireland.

But that's not where they're originally from.

Amanda: Isn't that something to think that came from the Andes, you know, just seems like it'd be so cold up there.

I've never been there.

But anyway, Dr. John: In fact, we're talking about a lot of these food crops here in North America, there are very few native species that are actually originated in North America that we really pay a lot of attention to.

And I think we're Adam and I were talking about that earlier, as we were wandering around out there, that corn and cranberries are native to North America,<How about sunflowers?> And that's they are native they're not I wouldn't think that that's an important food crop except that it is fun.

And the oil is oil is very, but as far as staple.

Somebody's gonna say well, cranberries, you know, you think about Thanksgiving.

Amanda: Well, we got Adam, you were out shopping.

So what is this one?

Adam: So that is an elephant year.

Okay.

So, taking a little bit of a different approach with this one, you know, we always talking about, you know, the actual crop itself, but for me, the name elephant ear brought to mind something that we always tried to preach, or at least I always tried to preach is that, you know, I always tell folks, your landscape should reflect the person who you know, what are you interested in?

And you know, your landscape should reflect it.

However, yes, sometimes our interests may outgrow us.

So in this case, elephant ear reminds me of the plant we commonly call elephant ear.

Yes, which is a very interesting plant, it can add a lot of different colors and textures to the landscape.

However, these plants can become... Amanda: You almost take the turn your back on it, so yes, it will definitely take over Adam: And become... Vicky: Although they're called enthusiastic enthusiasts, as they're called enthusiastic.

Adam: That sounds like a very polite way of saying nearly invasive.

Dr. John: Especially if they're in wet environments.

Yes, including some of the impoundments we have in this state.

Oh, elephant ears are going to be terrific weeds.

<Exactly.> Amanda: Oh goodness.

So be cautious.

Be cautious.

Okay.

Well, I'm happy that you weren't cautious.

And that you did bring that because that was delicious.

Adam: We'll go hit him up after the show.

Amanda: that'll be fun um well that was fun um, Vicki you you certainly are keeping a close lid on your appetite we'll go out there afterwards and have some real fun.

<I'm gone get it while it's hot.> Okay okay and now we're gonna have a montage of 30 years gosh that's a long time of Making It Grow lots of fun.

♪[up beat fun tune]♪ Rowland: Good Evening and Welcome to Making It Grow.

A common sense approach to gardening in South Carolina.

I'm Rowland Alston with the Clemson Extension Service.

♪ [fun tune continues]♪ Tony Melton welcome county extension agent of Florence and Darlington County.

Well hello from the great Pee Dee.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ On the other end of our air conditioned studios, of WRJA we have Debbie Hayes.

Better known throughout the south now is Webby Debbie good evening Debbie.

Good evening.

Quite a few people on the chat room asking some really great questions.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ Next to Kevin is Amanda McNulty who is the extension agent for Sumter.

Amanda: Well I am delighted to be here.

Thank you for asking me.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ We're having a pretty good time here in Sumter.

Next to me is... ♪[fun tune continues]♪ Andy Rollins county extension agent in Kershaw county.

Andy brand new set.

What do you think about it?

♪[fun tune continues]♪ And we'd love you to chat with us.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ Now it's hot but it's no hotter than if you had a manicure.

Yeah I have one every week.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ But it's also got a secret ingredient .Share it with me.

I'm not gone tell a soul.

Now okay, since it's you I'm gone tell you.

The secret ingredient is love.

You put love in it.

You'll get love back.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ Rowland: Happy gardening everyone.

Crowd: Happy gardening.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ Since the Last time, I look at you and tell you two things.

God bless all of you.

And happy gardening everyone.

Amanda: Hello, gardeners.

I'm Amanda McNulty of Clemson Extension and thank you so much for joining us tonight for SCETV's own gardening show.

Direct from downtown Sumter, Making It Grow.

♪[fun tune continues]♪ ♪[fun tune continues]♪ ♪[fun tune continues]♪ [applause] Sean did a wonderful job putting that together.

I think some of them are so old you weren't even y'all weren't even born.

When we were doing them way back then.

But it's a lot of fun to watch.

It really was fun.

Seeing it, seeing how young we weren't had all that kind of fun stuff.

Anyway.

Well, Terasa, I think you have some questions from the audience.

Now.

Terasa: I sure do.

Questions are an integral part of our show in today's extra special because we get to have live people asking questions.

First up is Diane from Columbia.

Diane, how can our panel help you today?

Diane: I need to kill ants.

Fire ants.

I don't have a problem with they're easy to kill.

You see a big mound of stuff out there gone.

But I have those little ants everywhere.

And I've tried everything I could find and nothing gets rid of them.

Terasa: oh goodness, sometimes critters can be pests, but I bet our panel can offer some insight.

Well, Vicki, you're Amanda: Well, Vicky, you're our aunt girl.

So she says the fire ants which are the ones that are so to me.

Terrible because gosh, when they get on you it's just awful.

But apparently she'd like to control these little ones.

So she could go out and lie on the grass and look at the beautiful clouds.

Vicky: yeah, um, so a lot of people want to manage ants.

And Dr. Tim Davis for his PhD work in 2009 did a survey of the ants of South Carolina, he found at least 121 different species.

And I think it's like 38 different genera, we think species diversity is closer to 200 250 species.

So what we have to think about is if those ants are not biting, stinging coming in the house causing some kind of annoyance or causing a problem, that we really can't manage them, because there's part of the ecosystem, they're doing a job.

And what happens is, is if you remove one species of ants, there could be some that are considered more pestiferous move into that empty niche.

And so you kind of have to weigh it out, what are they doing?

What if you know what kind of problem are they causing, but in reality, it's not going to be something where you can get rid of all of them, obliterate them, and for them forever be gone, because they have an ecological job.

And if you remove them, another species is going to move in, Amanda: And the fire ant is the red imported, fire it so it's not one of the native ones.

So it's perfectly fine to keep to manage those.

But perhaps, rather than worry about them so much, just get a lounge chair that you can lay on if you want to Vicky: Maybe one of those things where you have to adjust where you're hanging out.

And it it, you're not going to be able to get rid of them forever, it's not going to be where I'm going to be able to tell you how to manage them and you'd be satisfied.

Amanda: okay, all right.

Well, you know, here we are, we're part of the natural world and we lord knows is under enough trouble already.

So we actually do need to adjust our thinking sometimes.

Well Terasa, I bet somebody else has a question.

Let's try to help them.

Terasa: Indeed, Regina from Columbia has a question.

Regina, what would you like to ask the panel?

Regina: I would like to know a lot more about rose rosette disease, how does it present?

What does the rose look like if it is infected?

And what are the best practices to ensure that other roses are not infected?

Amanda: Ah, well, Adam, how can we help her?

Adam: Well, the first thing to understand about rose is everything wants to kill it.

You know, it's whether it's an insect or disease, everything goes after it.

So the first thing to understand about rose rosette is that it is a virus that is spread most time by airafied mites.

And just like Kansas sing saying Dust In The Wind, that's how these mites are spread, just spread throughout.

So there's really no good way to prevent it.

Amanda: And a virus if I understand it, if you get a virus, it's systemic, isn't it?

I mean, it's not like you have a little bit you know, you got a boo boo, and you know, it got infected, and you can put an antibiotic or something on it.

But I don't think there's something like that for a virus.

Adam: no, unfortunately, when you see the symptoms, which most of time they present as a heavy expression of spines, and the ones that are very pliable, your foliage is almost like an explosion of red tissue.

Amanda: Everybody's making a face because it really is real, Vicky: real strapped, the weeds are strapped.

Adam: look like.

And at that point, there is no you know, cut a little bit at that point, you were treating it like civil war surgery where we just removed completely and hope it doesn't spread.

Amanda: So you need to dig it up where it is, and you don't put it in your compost, you need to dispose of it in the municipal trash, right?

Because it could still be a source of infection.

Is that right?

Adam: Yes.

Because I mean, the mites that have spread the virus to that section, unless you're completely removing it and bagging it up, you know, don't just walk by all your other roses with it, you know, bag it up and completely remove it because otherwise, the source of...

The vector, I think is the technical term for it.

The next point to remove.

Dr. John: I guess if you live out in the country, you could burn them up.

Adam: And what I mean with them being so light, you do have to worry about them just moving with the... Amanda: I don't want people burning things up in the country.

There's too much air pollution.

<We won't burn.> Thank you.

Thank you.

I mean, that's just the truth.

That's how I feel about it.

Yeah, our neighbors used to burn stuff in their yard and set up our smoke alarm one time.

<So that's a lot of smoke.> That was a lot of smoke, you know, our house.

It's not very, you know, the windows don't fit very well and all that kind of stuff.

So anyway, I'm so sorry.

Um Terasa?

Terasa: From West Columbia, our loyal viewer, Sherry is here Sherry, how can we be of assistance to you?

Sherry: I'm wanting to plant some greens and collards but I want to plant some that I'll get the most most stuff by cut.

And what do I need to put in my garden?

I've never done a soil test which I know I need to do but what I want to put now?

Amanda: So you want to grow greens, lettuces and cabbages.. <Right now?> Amanda: I guess it's time for mustard greens and collard greens and all those wonderful, wonderful, wonderful things.

Vicky: Yeah, so she said she's never done a soil test before.

So that is always a great place to start and all is an excellent time to do a soil test.

<And because you don't have to wait 25 years to get the results.> Because if you do it in the spring, that's when everybody's submitting them.

And so you know.

there's hard work I mean, they do get backed up.

Yeah, so there's a great fact sheet on the home and garden information center.

There's also a video that shows you how to collect samples.

And then if you go to the office and get a bag, there's directions on the back of the bag, we got directions everywhere, but it's super easy.

The soil test is going, the results that you get back are going to tell you your nutrient levels and the ph because all of those are important so that you can get your plants to grow right.

Okay, but that's one of the best places to start.

Amanda: Okay, Adam, so when can you put out these plants.

Adam: So we're actually starting to because we've had what I would consider a little bit of an earlier fall.

And knowing that we're actually almost past the time for prime planting.

You we were still in there for I believe you said mustard and whatnot.

But I like to have collars in the ground by mid September.

So we're starting to get a little bit behind.

So if you haven't gotten them in the ground by now, it's a little bit of a risk of that you may see some cold damage, a little bit of excess of cold damage.

Amanda: A lot of times you can plant things twice if you wait a while is there a second planting for for greens?

Adam: So HGIC actually has a really great fact sheet called planting a garden that separates all the crops that we typically see in the state and separates based off and whether you live in upstate South Carolina or lower state, South Carolina.

And with each crop, some of them do have two different planting dates.

Okay, likely the second time would be very crop dependent, but you're probably looking at the end of February, beginning of March or some of these.

Amanda: That gives her plenty of time to get ready.

Exactly, yeah.

Yeah.

And um, and she can get some pepper vinegar to put on or some artichoke pickle, which is always very delicious.

All right.

Well, Terasa?

Terasa: Also joining us from Columbia is Dot.

And Dot, what would you like to ask the panel?

Dot: Hi, Terasa.

This tree is in my friend's backyard.

And I was wondering if we could get some help identifying it.

And maybe some thoughts for it's care?

Terasa: Well, it's a good thing.

We have our mystery doctor on the panel today, I believe he's had a chance to look at the photo, can you offer any insight?

Dr. John: I can offer I guess it would be an insight, because I saw the pictures.

So it's an insight.

I think that it would be a some sort of a cultivated cherry, a ornamental cherry tree and to be kind of hard to absolutely pin it down.

And of course, they are not blooming now.

So it'd be nice to be able to see the flowers, but bring it by in the spring and we'll figure it out.

Amanda: Okay, And the nice thing about those is they don't produce fruit.

So you know, sometimes you don't want to have something that produces fruit in the yard because then it's going to draw yellow jackets and things like that, which nobody wants.

And so sometimes it's nice to have something that doesn't make a big fruit that drops all around.

Dr. John: Right.

And a lot of the cherries that you can see they're trying to make little teeny fruits, but they fall off while they're still little and green.

Amanda: Okay, not gonna mess up the lawn, or anything.

John, I think you brought a mystery plant.

And it sure looks weird to me.

Dr. John: Well, I have a little bit here, but I have a little bit more right here.

Um, yeah.

So this is what I was going to show everybody.

And it's real interesting.

Oh, moved to a condo downtown.

And I took a walk the other day, walking towards Five Points here in Columbia.

And I found tons of this stuff grown right on the side of the sidewalk.

And it is a coolest little thing.

And and I know what it is.

Amanda: So hold it real still so yeah, and I'm gonna put some of these fruits if that's what they are.

<They are> Dr. John: fruits.

They're like, I don't know what they look like.

They look like cucumbers.

Or to me they look like little eggs hanging off of the hanging off of the plant.

Is this a vine?

It's sort of a vine.

It's a weed.

And it's not native, okay.

Unfortunately, it is kind of a weed.

But people might start seeing this now in their yards, as with all these other crazy weeds that are showing up, but it is in the tomato family.

Not in the cucumber family.

And it makes these little fruits that look like well, basically miniature eggplants and they don't think you're gonna, eat them so don't taste them.

MIXED: know, don't be tasting, waiting and waiting.

Dr. John: The innards are pretty much like a miniature tomato, one of those oblong looking tomatoes, or Italian tomatoes, or an eggplant, but it's kind of gooshie inside.

Amanda: this is a really good, it's got little seeds in it.

Dr. John: Yeah, and these things it to me, of course, I'm kind of weird tomato seeds, but it's a lot of meat considering they're sort of and it does make these are the fruits now it does make flowers, and the flowers are tiny little flowers look like lily of the valley flowers.

Amanda: if you have to get your hand lens out or something.

Dr. John: Oh, they're not quite that small.

But they're, they're small.

Okay.

And it's not you don't see flowers on it now.

But you see these fruits.

And it is, like I said, it's in the tomato family.

And the name of it is lily of the valley vine.

Which is a pretty silly.

Amanda: and the tomato family is the one that the potatoes are in, right tomatoes and peppers and peppers.

And so Adam, it's good to note, you have to sometimes pay attention to the families, because aren't we supposed to rotate in our garden?

And if you say, well, I'm not planting tomatoes, I'm planting green peppers there.

You really aren't rotating.

Is that correct?

Adam: That's correct.

So just like we're talking about why do we rotate in agronomic fields the same way why you would should rotate even in just your raised beds.

It used to be thought of you rotate between roots, shoots and fruits.

So that's wherever part of the plant you eat you if you ate your fruit, then the next year you would plant something for the next season, you would plant some that you ate leaves or roots of.

But now it's actually figured out that we rotate plant family.

So you would like to rotate your malvaceaes like your okras and your fam... fabaceae.

So all your lagunitas and beans and whatnot.

So we rotate our plant families instead.

Amanda: So we do need to you don't have to take field botany, but you have to pay attention to all that stuff.

Dr. John: You do have to take field botany.

Yes.

Amanda: If you can get in it took me three years to get in.

Yeah, I'm sure you have purposely doing that.

Not letting me take the class anyway.

Well Terasa, I think we've got someone else we'll try to help.

Terasa: I do a special guest.

This is Susan, who's now in Spartanburg.

But Susan's been a friend of the show and a friend of mine for quite some time back when she was living in Myrtle Beach.

Thank you for joining us.

How can our panel help you today?

Susan: Thank you.

And I want to know about oak leaf hydrangea, is it time to cut it back and how far?

Terasa: Pruning we always get lots of pruning questions.

Amanda: and hydrangea is not every 100 is the same hydrangea.

If I'm not mistaken, Vicki, you help us figure this one out.

Vicky: yeah.

Oak leaf.

Hydrangea is one of our native hydrangeas.

And it's, it gives off this beautiful beautiful fall color.

But she can get very large.

The tags often say six to eight feet.

We've seen them if they're happy 12 to 15 feet.

Amanda: they are the exfoliating bark everything about him.

Vicky: It's one of those where it's got it's got the bark, it's got the foliage, it's got the flowers and the flowers.

It's and so they make really nice for like winter cut flower arrangements.

Absolutely gorgeous.

I don't like to prune stuff.

I am one of those people that whenever I read the plant tag, you know, plants can't read the tags.

But whenever I read the plant tag, and if they're particularly happy I add maybe 20 25% to it.

And I try to set the size.

I don't have to ever prune it okay.

Um I mean, I'm just that's just the way I am.

I don't actually know the the timing timing for that.

Adam: So is dependent on whether they prove where they were pruning, it's dependent if a flower comes off of old wood or new wood, so with a lot of hydrangeas and again, just like Vicki you can get a lot of variation.

A lot of hydrangeas that pruning now maybe a little bit early you know once we let harden off once we get into winter, because I believe oak leaves are they'd like to flower on new wood if I'm not mistaken.

Dr. John might correct me on this one.

But I believe it... Dr. John: Yeah, and of course a lot of times plants get a little bit confused and they don't know which way to go.

Vicky: Depending on the weather.

Yeah.

Adam: So right now might be a tad bit early might want to wait for it to harden off a little bit more.

Amanda: All righty.

Well, I hope that was helpful.

Well Terasa?

Terasa: Also a special friend to have Anita or Hens, from the chat room back in the day, how can we help you?

Anita: I like to do container gardening.

My question is, do I need to completely dump each container for the next coming year?

Or can I mix organics and other stuff back into the dirt?

And it's already still in the planter?

Amanda: Well, you know, we've talked about the fact that you need to rotate and avoid build up diseases or pathogens in the soil.

Vicky, what's your take on this?

Vicky: So I think it depends on if the plant was healthy the entire time, I think it depends on is, was the mix that you're using, is it completely used up.

And it may be one of those things where, you know, it might behoove you, if it's in a smaller container, like a five gallon bucket, just to go ahead and renovate and use new clean soil that you know, doesn't have anything in it doesn't have any weed seeds doesn't have any pathogens in it, just for the health of the plant.

Now, that's not realistic.

If you're using like a big raised bed, or, you know, in your garden in the ground.

That's, that's not realistic.

But, you know, using clean soil, there's something to be said.

Amanda: And also some people think, oh, let me add, you know, half of it should be you know, compost.

And but that's just way too much.

way too Vicky: Way too much organic matter.

And you can actually get a nutrient toxicity that way.

Amanda: It's just not going to drain and it's not that aeration.

Yeah, I mean, so you need to don't think a little a little bit's good, but a lot sometimes isn't the best.

Vicky: We usually, we usually tell folks no more than about 20% organic matter.

And that's the way that we that we go.

Amanda: And then Tony used to tell me that if you got potting soil that was had been sitting around someplace forever, and ever, the things that made it easier to wet sometimes had had deteriorated Adam does that make any sense to you?

Adam: So what we can see, at least in my experience, when things do start deteriorate, the release of humates, humates and humic acids can actually have, and we're gonna have all of our SATs, 1600 point words, hydrophobic action.

So when you start to water, all of these substances, as they break down, these humic acids can start to repel water.

So you may see, especially if you haven't moved the soil, you can start to constrict.

So when you water, your water will actually go on the outside of your pot instead of going through.

So what I've found in those situations is you actually have to go and take a pin or whatnot and actually punch holes in your soil just to get some drainage occurring.

Amanda: Well, maybe you could use chopsticks that you brought on from the when you had an Asian and Asian meal that might be easier than using your very nice pen that you got at the South Carolina State Fair.

Goodness gracious.

Well, Terasa.

Terasa: Well, now we have Tom who is a Lakeland's, Master Gardener and you may recognize him he has been a panelist but today he has a question.

Tom: I work with a number of master gardeners in the city of greenwood and growing an edible garden in one of the city gardens.

And we grow this star of David okra, this is a very mature pod.

You wouldn't eat this necessarily, but we're growing them so that we can allow them to produce seeds for next year.

I discovered as some of the seed pods were beginning to open there were insects on the insides of them.

And I thought that I knew what they were I asked Vicky before the show started.

And I think she might have a different answer for me.

Amanda: Well, Vicky our entomology expert.

Vicky: So I disagree with Tom that it's a stinkbug but he's in the right he's in the right order.

Okay, so this looks to be one of the scentless plant bugs.

And we see those a lot on sometimes I call them seed bugs, but appropriately, there's scentless plant bugs, and we see them on a lot of seeds.

We see them on milkweed we see them apparently on okra, and they're feeding on that seed pod.

And then the seeds in the pod, the seeds in the pod.

Amanda: So what does he needs?

He wants to get some seeds for next year.

Vicky: It's gonna be one of those things where he's gonna have to share some of them with the insects, okay.

And that's the way it's gonna be.

All right.

Amanda: I think that's a very nice idea.

Okay, Dr. John: It's good they're not bedbugs.

Vicky: They are not bedbugs.

Amanda: Um, John, I was...

I ride from St. Matthews to Sumter.

It's just yellow, yellow, yellow, yellow, yellow on the side of the road.

And we've just got a little bit of time left to talk.

So what's going on at the side of the road, Dr. John: So she brought all this in, and I think she wants to talk about the yellow stuff.

And of course, this is golden rod.

And it doesn't make people sneeze doesn't make people sneeze.

But what's more interesting, to me, at least, is not goldenrod.

But this one, I liked that when <I just found it yesterday.> This one's called golden aster.

Oh, and it's not really an aster, technically, but it's related to the aster group.

And it's a native species.

So this one is called Chrysopsis Mariana, and some people might say it's the Maryland golden aster.

Amanda: okay.

But golden asked, and it seems to have the, the leaf down at the base had a clump of leaves at the base.

And then Dr. John: And then when it during the summer when the flowering stems comes up, come up, they'll be smaller than the ones that were down below.

<Okay, okay.> Amanda: Well, I just thought it was a beautiful little thing, and I ran into a lot of it.

It's nice.

There's certain parts of the roadway.

I can't stop because the international paper trucks are going by and there's no shoulder of the road.

But I do try to stop and it's just wonderful to be able to stop on the side of the road.

<Common.> Oh, goodness, Terasa, thank you so much for coming and helping us out today.

We really appreciate everything you do for us.

And next time.

We'll have some gardens of the week.

Terasa: It was great fun today.

I got to take the field trip.

Amanda: And I want to thank all of y'all for coming and we can say Good Night.

See you next week.

[applause] ♪♪ <Narrator>: Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown harvested or raised right here in the palmetto state.

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