[music plays] [no dialogue] [music plays] >>Lori Banks: Production of Being Well is made possible in part by: Sarah Bush Lincoln Health System, supporting healthy lifestyles.

Eating a heart healthy diet, staying active, managing stress, and regular checkups are ways of reducing your health risks.

Proper health is important to all at Sarah Bush Lincoln Health System.

Information available at sarahbush.org.

Dr. Ruben Boyajian, located at 904 Medical Park Drive in Effingham, specializing in breast care, surgical oncology, as well as general and laparoscopic surgery.

More information online, or at 347-2255.

>>Singing Voices: Rediscover Paris.

>>Lori Banks: Our patient care and investments in medical technology show our ongoing commitment to the communities of East Central Illinois.

Paris Community Hospital Family Medical Center.

HSHS St. Anthony's Memorial Hospital, delivering healthcare close to home.

From advanced surgical techniques and testing, to convenient care for your family, HSHS St. Anthony's makes a difference each and every day.

St. Anthony's, where you come first.

Thanks for joining us for this edition of Being Well.

I'm Lori Banks, and today we're talking about teen and parent communication.

And if you've got a teenager, you know that sometimes that can be a challenge.

And to help us sort of navigate through that process, Dr. Angela Yoder from Eastern Illinois University joins us today.

Thanks for coming back.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Thank you for having me.

>>Lori Banks: Well the last time we had you on the show, you were talking about child-parent communication.

We said we need another show on teenager and parent communication because it's so different.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: They require their own show.

>>Lori Banks: Yeah, tell us real quick a little bit about your background and what you teach here at Eastern.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: I'm a licensed psychologist, and I've taught at Eastern since 2006.

And I love working with children and teens, and that's been most of my professional experience, with children.

>>Lori Banks: We should mention you're in the Department of Counseling and Student development, too.

So, is it common for parents and children to have this great relationship, and then all of a sudden it just starts to go downhill as the child gets older?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: It certainly changes.

Research hasn't really shown that huge time of storm and stress that we once thought would always happen with teens.

And in fact, some teens go through their adolescent period and don't have a lot of storm and stress.

And for those parents, that's a more delightful experience.

But certainly some teens have developmental task and behaviors that make it very difficult for parents and teens to navigate.

>>Lori Banks: What are some of the things that parents start to see as cues or clues that their child is becoming a teenager?

Behaviorally those changes, what are the things that they see?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well behaviorally that is one thing.

Oftentimes the first thing they notice are physical changes, and really even physically they have what we call kind of big paws and feet.

And their hands and feet do grow at an accelerated rate, and it often makes them a little clumsy, which contributes to some of that social awkwardness or embarrassment, which kind of leads us into different behaviors.

So, sometimes kids will tend to prefer spending more time with their peers.

And in fact, we know that part of the brain, that reward circuitry is lit up oftentimes when they're with their peers.

So, they find that more rewarding, and that's normal.

So, we often see that.

Working to establish one's identity, some arguing, things like that.

>>Lori Banks: What are some of the common areas that seem to butt heads between parents and teenagers?

Are there certain themes that seem to be an area?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well certainly even teens will acknowledge that parents have to have some amount of control, and that they have to be parents and set consequences.

It's usually those personal issues that tend to create the most fireworks.

>>Lori Banks: Let's talk a little bit about, you know, in a teenager's brain and how they think and process.

Just like when you were here with the children show, we tend to think oh, they're just smaller adults.

But their brain does not work the way ours does.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Absolutely.

>>Lori Banks: What's going on in the teenager's brain developmentally?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well first of all, some exciting research has shown that the teen brain continues to develop up until early to mid-20s.

So, in particular one of the areas that we see that's different and changing a lot is the prefrontal cortex.

And that's kind of like the CEO of our brains.

It's right behind our forehead and helps us to problem solve, to engage in rational thinking.

It controls a little bit of impulsivity.

So, certainly that is still developing.

And you're right, oftentimes we do think about little kids walking at a certain age, talking at a certain age.

With teenagers, they still have developmental tasks that they're growing and learning, and we need to keep that in mind.

>>Lori Banks: So, is the way that teenagers reason or think about problems still different than the way adults do?

Are they less rational?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Definitely.

Yeah, definitely.

And some of us can reflect back on some of our own choices and think, "What was I thinking?"

And that really is due to some of that prefrontal cortex still pruning, there's still myelinization that's happening in the brain.

And so, that's certainly the case.

>>Lori Banks: What are some things that parents need to start maybe changing the ways in which they communicate with their teen?

You know, this worked great when they were a child, and now this methodology is no longer effective.

What are some things that they can do to work on their relationship with their teen and better communicate with them?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Yeah, well one of the things that will help I think is for parents to remember that their relationship with their teen is just that: it's a relationship.

And so, that relationship needs to be nurtured and maintained.

And there needs to be positive occurrences in the relationship, recognition of good behavior as well as consequences for not so good behavior.

>>Lori Banks: You had talked about, you know, alternative forms of communication.

You often hear, you know, teens it's maybe not like, "Oh I want to sit on the couch and talk to Mom and Dad" the way they did when they were a little kid.

You've got to be maybe a little more creative with that.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Absolutely.

So, teens often find that face to face discussion can be a little bit threatening for them.

And to create a little bit more distance and safety, engaging in play activities together like playing basketball, shooting some hoops, going for a drive, removes some of the intensity because you don't look at each other when you, well hopefully you're not looking at each other when you drive.

You know, cooking together, doing things together while they're talking can be useful.

>>Lori Banks: Alright, in talking to some of the staff people here at the station who have teens now or have had teens in the past, two things came up.

And it's setting boundaries and independence.

So, talk about boundaries for teenagers, because they're growing.

They want to be able to go out and explore, and do things without as much supervision.

How should parents attack boundaries?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Absolutely, well it's a scary time for parents because as kids age, the risk for their poor behavior, they get higher and they get more intense.

And that's scary for parent, understandably so.

So, parents need to keep in mind that, you know, they want to have a nice balance between kids are wanting a lot of responsibility, or I'm sorry, they're wanting a lot of freedom.

But with that freedom comes a sense of responsibility.

So, each child is very unique, and the parent really needs to continually monitor whether or not what they're doing is working with the child.

So, in other words they grant some small amount of freedom, and then kind of check and monitor how the teen is able to handle that.

So, some parents feel like it's either one or the other, but really this is a delicate balance all the way into adulthood, as you're continually monitoring what each personal child can handle.

>>Lori Banks: And in your private practice years, did you find that when you talked to teenagers they really wanted boundaries, even though they say they don't?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Absolutely, boundaries help us to feel safe.

And we don't want to live in a world where literally anything goes, because that makes us feel unsafe.

And most teens will recognize in their calmer, more rational moments that parents need to have a sense of control over them.

In fact, the research thankfully supports that that balance of responsiveness, and being warm and loving, and understanding and empathic of the child's feelings balanced with high demanding-ness is really one of the things that's most helpful for teens.

>>Lori Banks: I think along with boundaries comes independence.

You know, they're getting a driver's license, and maybe getting a job and getting their own money, which is great.

So, how do you balance independence with still wanting to have some control over what's going on?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: I think, you know, sitting down with teens not in the moment, right?

So, working proactively and talking about family values as a family: what do we value and how will that inform the decisions that we're going to make.

Listen to your child, allow them to have some input.

That doesn't mean you need to go with their plan, but it does require that you allow their voice to be heard.

And that's an important thing.

And again the continual monitoring helps you to know what you need to tweak.

Really the responsibility for choosing and problem solving should be gradual, and it should start very young.

So, even young kids we tend to give them a little bit of disrespect, not allow them to choose their clothing and things like that.

There are some issues that parents can examine and think, you know, if the child chooses the outcome that I don't like, what are the consequences for their longterm health.

And if there really are none, then let the child choose that.

If it is something that threatens their personal safety, that violates a family value, then that is the time to step in.

>>Lori Banks: That's what I was going to bring about.

When is talking about what we value in our family, what's important, that should be an ongoing conversation.

That doesn't start when they're teenagers.

It starts from the time they're small, and it carries on through.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Absolutely, and really because that prefrontal cortex is still developing, teens tend to be more impulsive.

And so, they make decisions that in the moment, they may not make if they are feeling more rational and calm.

So, therefore kind of talking about situations that might come up.

What do you do if a drunk friend wants to get behind the wheel?

How do you handle that?

And making yourself open and approachable.

Not a friend, but an open and approachable parent that can tolerate hearing about some of the things that teens are doing.

>>Lori Banks: We had this conversation yesterday in the office about, you know, how do you as a parent be open and approachable, but knowing that your child may talk about things that inside you're just, you really don't want to hear but you need to.

And then you kind of have to listen and not be horrified at the same time.

How do you balance that?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well remember that time is on your side, and this too shall pass.

Having patience and knowing that your child will eventually grow into an adult, that's the idea, and that you're here to help them practice some of those problem solving skills, help them practice utilizing family values to make decisions.

And if you give it enough time during the conversation without jumping in and saying you should do this, which will often activate the child's defenses, make them angry and turn it into an argument.

If you give it a little bit more time, what you sometimes find is that the child makes the exact same decision that you would recommend, and they do it on their own.

And so, they've had some good practice, and then you can positively reinforce that type of thinking and let them know how proud you are of them.

But working proactively helps kind of prime their thinking for when those occurrences do happen.

>>Lori Banks: So, do you think if your child, your teenager knows, if you set it out there that says, you know, whatever you tells me I'm going to listen, I'm going to try to not be judgmental, is that helpful in getting your teen to open up about things, because mom or dad is just going to listen first and maybe react later?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: It is, it is.

I think letting the teen know that you're going to try to suspend judgement, and then actually trying to do that.

I think that that is, you know, it's a little bit more difficult than it sounds, because usually a parent's fear is activated and they start using a lot of questions, which makes the teen feel interrogated.

So, remember the child is sitting in front of you, they're in no danger now.

Slow things down.

Use empathic listening, let them know that you see their point of view, and take the pace down slower to see how much the teen will share with you and see if they can work through it on your own.

>>Lori Banks: What about actual times to communicate?

Whose terms should it be on?

Should it be you call, you know, Angie in the room and say, "I need to talk to you."

Is it better that the parent initiates that, or should the parent kind of wait for the child to initiate it?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well in any kind of relationship there's reciprocity.

And so, there's give and take.

And so, it shouldn't be completely imbalanced on one side or the other.

But parents do need to be aware in their continual monitoring that we talked about, in terms of when the teen tends to be more talkative.

So, for example, there's a lot of good research that shows that kids are more active at night.

And most of us parents, we're exhausted at night, so we don't necessarily feel like talking.

So, it may be something that you can schedule ahead of time for a weekend that's going to be some special time that you're going to have together to talk.

But I think if your teen approaches you and you're busy, you could ask for a separate time or if this is an okay time for you, turn the TV off, turn the smart phone off and really focus on them.

>>Lori Banks: One of our staff people shared a great story of how she has two daughters, and they're really close and age.

And she used kind of actually later at night, sometimes after they would come home from being out they would sit and talk, no TV on.

And they would open up, you know.

And she said that not being judgmental and horrified was difficult, but those girls knew that and then they were more likely to open up.

So, I thought that was a great approach.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Absolutely, I think, you know, one of the tips I would give is to show a friendly curiosity.

You know, sometimes you find yourself kind of wanting to recoil, like what?

Where were you, what was happening?

But to lean forward and say, "Oh you know, tell me more about that," and to be curious and ask question about their culture, their music, what's new.

>>Lori Banks: What about for a child or a teenager that becomes non-communicative, sort of hides away in their room?

Should we automatically assume the worst?

I mean, you hear stories of students, or of, you know, bad things that are happening because the child sort of pulled away from the family.

Mom or dad, they could never get them to talk.

What do you do?

That's a scary time.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: It is.

Yeah, I think any time a teen becomes completely non-communicative, I would be concerned and to seek help from a licensed therapist, someone with experience working with teens, because not all therapists are created equal in terms of being able to tolerate some of the behaviors that teens exhibit.

>>Lori Banks: Well what point would that become a concern?

Like after a week or a month, or...?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well I think one of the things that you want to look at is are they communicating in different ways, because it is normal for a teen to need more private time than they did when they were a child.

Some of that is from the ability to take into account differing perspectives and what we think of as formal operational thought.

So, teens are now able to see things from other people's perspective, but they're not really adept at it yet.

So, there's a lot of practicing and a lot of brooding that goes on, where they're thinking about things.

And so, they need more quiet time.

My concern would be if there's only quiet time and they're not communicating at all.

It could be that they've withdrawn from you because they're upset about something and the relationship needs repaired, and they're doing fine at school.

So, good communication.

My husband and I like to think about people being on our team, right?

People that are helping us raise this child into a responsible citizen, and communicating with those other folks.

>>Lori Banks: What about the advent of texting, social media?

I mean, that is something that you and I did not have.

The internet wasn't invented when I was a teenager.

Well it was, but no one knew what it was.

[laughing] We didn't have computers then.

But now you have social media, you know, all these different things that I don't even know what they do or what they are.

That proposes a whole other challenge for parents.

And how do they keep up with all these different things like Snapchat and, you know...?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: You know, it's interesting.

When I was working with teens early on in my career, I was running an intensive outpatient group, but I wasn't doing very well with them.

Part of it was that I didn't really understand their culture, and when I would ask them about their own life they shut down and withdrew.

And I created a game called "Educating Angie," where I gave them prizes for teaching me something about teen culture that I didn't know.

And they absolutely loved it.

So, teens will oftentimes talk with you about things that other kids at school are doing, trends that are happening, apps that are out there, because they really do enjoy being an expert and teaching you something.

Because, it's very different than how things have been.

And so, you might just show an interest in music, what are people listening to, oh that's interesting.

You don't necessarily have to turn it into a game like I did, but teens will educate you about what's happening.

The other thing is to develop relationships with the children's parents that your teen is hanging out with, and being able to communicate with them can be really helpful.

Two heads are often better than one.

>>Lori Banks: So, what should you do if you find out, you know, your teenager is being bullied online?

I mean, is that something-- Well I guess every child is different, whether they're going to say something to you or not.

But that, you know, how do you get through that as a parent?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: I think one of the pieces of advice I would give is not to tell the child just to ignore it.

I think that that was kind of the wisdom when we were growing up, and we now know that that's not very useful.

And some of the newer research has kind of focused on bystanders and having bystanders step in.

The other thing you can do individually with your child is to kind of help them deconstruct why those things happen and what might be behind a bully's words.

Because, bullying is not just detrimental to the victim.

It's also detrimental to the bully.

So, again if you have those relationships with other parents, if you can believe the best in the other parent, that they're doing the best they can, and to contact them under that premise.

These are some things I'm concerned about.

I'm worried both of our kids are hurting.

What can we do to help with this?

I think that can be a useful thing for parents to do, as well.

And also I think, don't forget that the school often has policies on bullying, and a good school counselor can often help you with this, as well.

>>Lori Banks: Angie, what should we do if you come across, maybe it's a bullying message on your child's phone?

How do you bring that up to them?

Because, you know, it may be seen as you're invading their privacy, this may be something they didn't want you to know about.

How do you bring that up?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well I think kids should know that you are monitoring ahead of time so it's not a surprise that you found out.

And I think you should approach them with an open mind, not accusing them or not overdramatizing it, being kind of matter of fact.

And choose a time when the teen is calm and has had plenty of sleep, and can deal with that challenge.

And I would confront it directly.

>>Lori Banks: Alright, what about how much-- You had talked about this earlier, but how much privacy?

You had said teenagers need more privacy.

How much do they need?

What's the line between letting them, you know, hang out in their room all the time, and you being just in their space all the time?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well that's going to be different for every child.

In fact, the American Academy of Pediatricians is coming out with new guidelines for screen time, and they're supposed to be out in the fall.

And so, we have to recognize that social media, technology, it's a part of our world and that teens, that's one way that they communicate.

So, you have to allow some of that, but it has to be balanced and individualized for that particular child.

>>Lori Banks: Okay, we've got about five minutes left.

And I know you've got some great advice for sort of parent communication do's and don'ts.

Let's talk about the don'ts first.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Yeah, I would say don't take it personally.

I think it's, and that's really much easier said than done.

>>Lori Banks: Especially when they say, "I hate you, Mom!"

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Yeah, know that that, remind yourself that that part of their brain that governs impulses and rational thinking is still developing.

And so, they're much more liable to say something that they don't mean in the heat of the moment, and we need to forgive them for that.

It doesn't mean that we don't set consequences, but that we set those consequences without a lot of emotionality.

>>Lori Banks: So, don't take it personally.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Yes, also not listening.

I think sometimes parents immediately get worried and they start asking a lot of questions.

It's important to know your teen's perspective and to be able to communicate that you understand their feelings, as well.

>>Lori Banks: Alright, what else?

Oh, I know you've got those written down, so feel free to-- >>Dr.

Angela Yoder: I would say don't forget to reward positive behavior.

sometimes the relationship gets off-balance and we focus more on what we're worried about, what we're scared about, and we forget about all those great things the teen is doing well.

So, even orchestrating an intentional conversation that you have with a spouse, or a co-parent or another adult that the child overhears you complimenting them can be really useful.

Mmhmm, another thing is parenting based off of one's own mood.

And that-- >>Lori Banks: You've had a bad day.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Yes, and I can relate to that, that you know, it's kind of the straw that broke the camel's back and we react rather than respond.

And so, we need to, you know, learn how to walk away.

And remember that time is on your side, to consult with other parents, people that we trust, and dole out positive consequences that will help them become better adults.

No "when I was your age" speeches.

So, kids feel things very deeply at this age, and also they're developmental task of kind of returning to egocentrism.

They have what's called an imaginary audience, where they do feel like everyone is looking at them and judging them.

And also the personal fable, where they feel like they're, you know, there's no way they could be understood fully by another human being.

Those things are very real for them.

So, trying to talk that out of the team is kind of like telling a toddler there's no monsters under the bed.

It's just part of their development that we have to accept, and know that that's normal.

>>Lori Banks: Alright, is that the list of don'ts?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Yes!

Well one more, I guess.

Failing to apologize.

So, we're all human beings.

>>Lori Banks: We all mess up sometimes.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: We're all going to mess up.

And our children learn how to do things from their family unit.

And one social skill that they need to learn is how to apologize appropriately.

So, some parents fear that if they admit a mistake, it will make them look incompetent in their child's eyes.

On the contrary, it can be a really important learning moment.

Don't be afraid to go offer your child an apology.

It doesn't mean that you are necessarily wrong, but perhaps you-- >>Lori Banks: The context was wrong, or if your mood, your bad day at work carried over to them, yeah.

Apology goes a long way with people.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Absolutely, absolutely.

>>Lori Banks: Alright, so what do we have on the do list?

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: The do list is to use active listening.

So, do paraphrase, use paraphrasing where you let the child know that you heard them.

So, it sounds like you had a really rough day today at school, instead of jumping into a bunch of questions, which can actually backfire and make people feel defensive.

Number two would be consider alternate forms of communication, which we had talked about.

you know, hopping in the car to go get an ice cream or shooting some hoops can be useful, rather than you know, sitting and having direct eye contact.

Yeah, that can be hard for them.

Third would be to be a thermostat, not a thermometer.

So, you know in your house when it gets hot, the thermostat responds, and it will turn up the air conditioner so that it cools things down, where a thermometer, the mercury goes up as the temperature goes up.

And sometimes our altercations with teens can get like that.

The child gets angry, we get angry.

They yell, then we yell.

And what you want to do is be a thermostat instead, and to be responsive.

And again to remember that you don't have to decide what to do right now.

If you're in doubt, always do the next thing that will preserve your relationship with your child.

That doesn't necessarily mean to give in.

It just means to avoid saying detrimental things that can cause pain, for sometimes years, and damage the relationship.

Fourth would be, be a parent and monitor what they're ready for.

So, natural and logical consequences are best, when we can have those.

And if not, think about the child's currency.

So, for some kids, you know, taking away their car is not as big of a deal as taking away their phone.

So, keep that in mind.

Another piece of advice would be to offer 30 minutes of special time together that's completely uninterrupted.

No siblings, no spouse, no boyfriend or girlfriend, but just the two of you.

And it's just 30 minutes.

Doing something together that yo both enjoy.

So, give them a list of three things and use all those active listening skills during that time.

And then lastly, I would say seek help if necessary.

There's lots of great licensed therapists out there with experience working with teens and families.

And teens will often be defensive if you say, "I'm taking you to counseling."

What you need to say is, "We're going to go get some help as a family so that we can get along better."

>>Lori Banks: And sometimes that outside third party can be really helpful because, you know, they have no connection to you in the past or the present, and they can shed some light on what's going on.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: That's right, it provides some neutral ground where everybody's on a little bit better behavior.

And it's a concentrated time where you can work on things, and then you can walk away and take a little bit of time until you come back the next time.

>>Lori Banks: Angela, we're all out of time.

Thanks so much for coming by the show and giving us some great advice and things to think about, especially for those people watching who may be going through a challenging time with their teenager.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Well thank you.

I come with a lot of humility.

Parenting teens is not for the faint of heart.

But be patient, it will get better.

>>Lori Banks: This too shall pass.

Thanks for joining us.

>>Dr.

Angela Yoder: Thank you.

>>Lori Banks: Production of Being Well is made possible in part by: Sarah Bush Lincoln Health System, supporting healthy lifestyles.

Eating a heart healthy diet, staying active, managing stress, and regular checkups are ways of reducing your health risks.

Proper health is important to all at Sarah Bush Lincoln Health System.

Information available at sarahbush.org.

Dr. Ruben Boyajian, located at 904 Medical Park Drive in Effingham, specializing in breast care, surgical oncology, as well as general and laparoscopic surgery.

More information online, or at 347-2255.

>>Singing Voices: Rediscover Paris.

>>Lori Banks: Our patient care and investments in medical technology show our ongoing commitment to the communities of East Central Illinois.

Paris Community Hospital Family Medical Center.

HSHS St. Anthony's Memorial Hospital, delivering healthcare close to home.

From advanced surgical techniques and testing, to convenient care for your family, HSHS St. Anthony's makes a difference each and every day.

St. Anthony's, where you come first.

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